Q&A New to Sheik? Look here to learn how to get started/Need help with Sheik? Ask your questions here.

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fair to bouncing fish never works, like ever

i just bounce under them
what do
A common mistake people make is not activating the bouncing fish hit early. When just doing down b, the hit takes a little while to come out. When you press a or b again after doing down b, the hit comes out faster.
 
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boneflesh

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i've been playing sheik for a while now, and in my experience, it is quite hard to land fair. i feel like it is too predictable since you also have to take into account the amount of time it takes to jump, which gives your opponent enough time to react and shield. only times i can really land it is when my opponent goes for a really laggy move. how do you guys land fair? do you just spam tomahawks? do you just use nair instead?
 

Glitchy_

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Hi, I'm thinking about picking up Sheik and I have 3 questions:
1. Does she benefit from bidou?
2. Is there a chart with frame advantages on hit/ on shield?
3. I can't find a Discussion with "must watch" videos... I'm not sure if there is nothing like this or I'm just blind.
 
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Hi, I'm thinking about picking up Sheik and I have 3 questions:
1. Does she benefit from bidou?
2. Is there a chart with frame advantages on hit/ on shield?
3. I can't find a Discussion with "must watch" videos... I'm not sure if there is nothing like this or I'm just blind.
1. You could argue that all characters do, but I know of no sheiks that use bidou. VoiD has said he doesn't think it's too good for sheik, because you can do almost everything it allows for without it.
2. No, but you can always go on KuroganeHammer and use the calculator.
3. There is not. There did used to be, but it's incredibly outdated. As a quick list of must watch stuff, tournament videos of VoiD and Mr. R as they're the two best Sheiks, and Deku Tree's youtube channel.
 

Glitchy_

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1. You could argue that all characters do, but I know of no sheiks that use bidou. VoiD has said he doesn't think it's too good for sheik, because you can do almost everything it allows for without it.
2. No, but you can always go on KuroganeHammer and use the calculator.
3. There is not. There did used to be, but it's incredibly outdated. As a quick list of must watch stuff, tournament videos of VoiD and Mr. R as they're the two best Sheiks, and Deku Tree's youtube channel.
1. You can also do anything you could do with the Attack/ Smash stick while gaining easier access to advanced stuff which helps since Sheik needs those tilts for 50/50s or kills.
2. Thanks!
3. I watched many of the videos even before thinking about picking her up but the Neutral Game one really impressed me and led to me coming here.
Is she really as good in neutral as Esam states in his recent tierlist?
 

Mittenkiss

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I feel like I'm in a rut. I'm not sure what to practice anymore.
How should I practice? What should I practice?
How viable is training mode to practice in?
 
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I feel like I'm in a rut. I'm not sure what to practice anymore.
How should I practice? What should I practice?
How viable is training mode to practice in?
Training mode is just good for practicing tech skill. If you are not sure of what to improve on, just write up your gameplan and improve on it in as many ways as possible. Common areas that can be improved on are any of your fundamentals and methods of getting around specific tools in specific matchups.
 

Glitchy_

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Can the C-bounce be performed without the Smash-Stick?
I use Bidou and I can't get it done somehow...
 

jacksonTown

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What buttons do most people use for fair string combos? Like, rising fair then fast fall into rising fair, etc. I think Void said he uses claw grip, is this necessary? I can sometimes get it with tap jump but don't know if this is a technique that would not be worth investing time into.
 
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What buttons do most people use for fair string combos? Like, rising fair then fast fall into rising fair, etc. I think Void said he uses claw grip, is this necessary? I can sometimes get it with tap jump but don't know if this is a technique that would not be worth investing time into.
Getting Fair out instantly is most easily done by just quickly sliding your finger from X to A to buffer Fair during the initial jump animation. All other variations of Fair are best done with C set to tilts so you have as much control over aerial momentum as possible.
 

Glitchy_

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I'm not completely sure if this is the right place to ask this but how do I know a combo is a true combo if there's nobody to help me test it?
I often hear Sheik mains say things like "It might look like a true combo on the combo-meter in training mode, but it's not.".
On the other had, I often hear Marth players say: "It might nit look like a true combo, but it's completely inescapeable!".

How do I know what combos are true??
 
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I'm not completely sure if this is the right place to ask this but how do I know a combo is a true combo if there's nobody to help me test it?
I often hear Sheik mains say things like "It might look like a true combo on the combo-meter in training mode, but it's not.".
On the other had, I often hear Marth players say: "It might nit look like a true combo, but it's completely inescapeable!".

How do I know what combos are true??
If you can't test it on a real person you don't really know. The training mode counter is a load of crap, though. Don't trust it.
 

Glitchy_

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What are Sheik's best and worst stages?
I think Sheik can play on most stages because of her mobility, but here are a few thoughts:

Good Stages:
Smashville - Platform
Town and city - Low ceiling
Duck Hunt - You can camp.
Dream Land: - Low ceiling

Not that good stages:
Battlefield - Platforms don't help you as much as they help other characters
Lylat - tilting stage makes your needle camping game worse
 

sjb.dario

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I think Sheik can play on most stages because of her mobility, but here are a few thoughts:

Good Stages:
Smashville - Platform
Town and city - Low ceiling
Duck Hunt - You can camp.
Dream Land: - Low ceiling

Not that good stages:
Battlefield - Platforms don't help you as much as they help other characters
Lylat - tilting stage makes your needle camping game worse
Yeah, I think there is no arguing that Sheik does well in all stages. But it's helpful to know what stages she doesn't get much benefit from. Anyways, thanks for the info!
 

Glitchy_

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Yeah, I think there is no arguing that Sheik does well in all stages. But it's helpful to know what stages she doesn't get much benefit from. Anyways, thanks for the info!
I think they are quite match up dependant.

You don't wanna pick Battlefield vs Characters with amazing Up-Airs/ ladder combos.
You sometimes may want to pick Lylat because players don't know how to fight on it or their Characters have a bad recovery.
You don't want to pick Town and City vs Characters with a strong Up-Throw or an op Up-Smash.
 
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Would anyone be able to tell me how to cross-up an opponent's DI with upair? What you have to do, maybe what it looks like? Thanks!
 

madluk

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hey people, getting back into the game after almost a year and trying to pick up sheik. I've been poking around just on YT and through twitter looking at some of the combos she can do, and I'm perfectly fine with racking up damage through like the perfect pivot fTilt strings and whatnot, but I've been having some trouble with FH instant needles > DJ Fair > Bouncing Fish and just plain old Needles > Bouncing Fish.

Seeing as this is one of sheiks major kill confirms (from what I can tell), if there are any resources and someone could direct me to them, like percents it works at or just "how to do it" or whatnot that would be great.
 

Glitchy_

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hey people, getting back into the game after almost a year and trying to pick up sheik. I've been poking around just on YT and through twitter looking at some of the combos she can do, and I'm perfectly fine with racking up damage through like the perfect pivot fTilt strings and whatnot, but I've been having some trouble with FH instant needles > DJ Fair > Bouncing Fish and just plain old Needles > Bouncing Fish.

Seeing as this is one of sheiks major kill confirms (from what I can tell), if there are any resources and someone could direct me to them, like percents it works at or just "how to do it" or whatnot that would be great.
Set one of your shoulder buttons to Jump or Special.
 

Krysco

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Thinking of picking up Sheik since I like how many options she always has at any given time and she's one of very few characters in Sm4sh that has a projectile that has to be respected at all times, kinda like Falco laser in Melee and Brawl. I see on the first post there's a list of some of her bnb combos which helps and I even see on this page that there's some discussion on if bidou is useful for her or not and what her best and worst stages are. Could probably just look around here to find a whole bunch of Sheik info (though I have to keep in mind of whenever 1.1.5 came out since that patch nerfed Sheik iirc) but I'll ask some questions anyways:

1. I know bidou was already brought up but I'll ask specifics. How important is it for Sheik to have access to retreating bairs or fairs? I ask since that's one of few things that's made more difficult with bidou since you can't keep your left stick drifting one way and have your right stick perform aerials for you since it's mapped to special. I know spacing with fair is pretty important (pretty sure it's still safe on shield if spaced properly?)

2. There's no Smash scene in my city and I can't drive out to the nearest scene yet and my one friend who's into Smash isn't too into Sm4sh so I'm pretty much stuck with training mode, fighting ai, For Glory and finding people online like either on here or discord or anther's ladder to fight. What would be the best? Some of those options have input lag which I can imagine can really mess with Sheik while others don't allow fighting people which behave differently from ai. I'm pretty much accepting that whenever I do get around to going to tournaments that I'll be meh but I'd at least like to have a basic understanding of Sheik before I ever even think of trying to use her at a tournament.

3. Gonna look around when I have some free time so I might just find the answer to this myself (I know I saw it mentioned on the first page) but with it being one of the biggest things going against Sheik, what are her consistent means of taking stocks? Most I'm aware of is aerial needles -> bouncing fish, uthrow -> uair or vanish 50/50? Or maybe it's just waiting out to see if they airdodge or not and going for one of those 2 moves? And also ftilt -> uair I believe? Might be dtilt rather than ftilt.
 

Glitchy_

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Thinking of picking up Sheik since I like how many options she always has at any given time and she's one of very few characters in Sm4sh that has a projectile that has to be respected at all times, kinda like Falco laser in Melee and Brawl. I see on the first post there's a list of some of her bnb combos which helps and I even see on this page that there's some discussion on if bidou is useful for her or not and what her best and worst stages are. Could probably just look around here to find a whole bunch of Sheik info (though I have to keep in mind of whenever 1.1.5 came out since that patch nerfed Sheik iirc) but I'll ask some questions anyways:

1. I know bidou was already brought up but I'll ask specifics. How important is it for Sheik to have access to retreating bairs or fairs? I ask since that's one of few things that's made more difficult with bidou since you can't keep your left stick drifting one way and have your right stick perform aerials for you since it's mapped to special. I know spacing with fair is pretty important (pretty sure it's still safe on shield if spaced properly?)

2. There's no Smash scene in my city and I can't drive out to the nearest scene yet and my one friend who's into Smash isn't too into Sm4sh so I'm pretty much stuck with training mode, fighting ai, For Glory and finding people online like either on here or discord or anther's ladder to fight. What would be the best? Some of those options have input lag which I can imagine can really mess with Sheik while others don't allow fighting people which behave differently from ai. I'm pretty much accepting that whenever I do get around to going to tournaments that I'll be meh but I'd at least like to have a basic understanding of Sheik before I ever even think of trying to use her at a tournament.

3. Gonna look around when I have some free time so I might just find the answer to this myself (I know I saw it mentioned on the first page) but with it being one of the biggest things going against Sheik, what are her consistent means of taking stocks? Most I'm aware of is aerial needles -> bouncing fish, uthrow -> uair or vanish 50/50? Or maybe it's just waiting out to see if they airdodge or not and going for one of those 2 moves? And also ftilt -> uair I believe? Might be dtilt rather than ftilt.
1. I think with enought practice you can get the Retreating areals down... I use bidou and it's pretty easy. The bigger problem, and the reason why i think Attack-Stick is better for her, is that you won't be able to C-bounce.
Aditionally you won't be able to do super quick PP-Ftilts which gets rid of one of your main combos.
2. Go to tournaments -> find people to play frienlies with -> practice Sheik
3. _FH Needles -> BF
_Weak Nair -> BF
_Up throw -> 50/50 (doesn't work on all chars)
_EDGEGUARDING
 

Krysco

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1. I think with enought practice you can get the Retreating areals down... I use bidou and it's pretty easy. The bigger problem, and the reason why i think Attack-Stick is better for her, is that you won't be able to C-bounce.
Aditionally you won't be able to do super quick PP-Ftilts which gets rid of one of your main combos.
2. Go to tournaments -> find people to play frienlies with -> practice Sheik
3. _FH Needles -> BF
_Weak Nair -> BF
_Up throw -> 50/50 (doesn't work on all chars)
_EDGEGUARDING
Ah, that's true with the c-bouncing. Completely forgot about it. As for the pp-ftilts, I've actually found them pretty easy to do with bidou. Like if you want to pp right and ftilt then it'd be :GCR:->:GCCL:->:GCA: since the c-stick is only read as an input for a single frame. I can't go to tournaments atm since there's none in my city and I can't drive yet but my cousin and I have debated trying to host our own tournaments. We believe there's someone who works for/with Panda Gaming and the Sm4sh competitive scene who lives in our city but we've had no luck contacting the person. Glad I was at least aware of some of Sheik's common kill setups. There a list of characters the uthrow 50/50 works on?
 

Glitchy_

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Ah, that's true with the c-bouncing. Completely forgot about it. As for the pp-ftilts, I've actually found them pretty easy to do with bidou. Like if you want to pp right and ftilt then it'd be :GCR:->:GCCL:->:GCA: since the c-stick is only read as an input for a single frame. I can't go to tournaments atm since there's none in my city and I can't drive yet but my cousin and I have debated trying to host our own tournaments. We believe there's someone who works for/with Panda Gaming and the Sm4sh competitive scene who lives in our city but we've had no luck contacting the person. Glad I was at least aware of some of Sheik's common kill setups. There a list of characters the uthrow 50/50 works on?
1. It' super easy to do but it's slower since you have to wait a little bit for the attack not to be a smash.
3. https://smashboards.com/threads/sheik-upthrow-upair-50-50-percentages-and-guide.445349/

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Question: How can I make Nair safe on shield?
I see all those top players using it without getting punished... But i get punished every time.
It doesn't even seem to matter if I do a Landing one, come down with a weak Nair, do a SH Nair and hit their shield on my way up... How can I make this safe?
 
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Hello all. I'm a Sheik main from Brawl who currently mains Ryu. I'm looking for a secondary to cover Ryu's bad MU's. I was wondering if I can get thoughts on the following MU's: Rosaluma and Samus. Any help would be greatly appreciated!
 

Glitchy_

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Hello all. I'm a Sheik main from Brawl who currently mains Ryu. I'm looking for a secondary to cover Ryu's bad MU's. I was wondering if I can get thoughts on the following MU's: Rosaluma and Samus. Any help would be greatly appreciated!
Sheik is a hard char... It's usually not recommendet having a 2. char besides her... let alone using her as a secondary.

If you want someone for those MUs, I'd suggest cloud or learning how to deal with them with Ryu
 

Megamang

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Hello all. I'm a Sheik main from Brawl who currently mains Ryu. I'm looking for a secondary to cover Ryu's bad MU's. I was wondering if I can get thoughts on the following MU's: Rosaluma and Samus. Any help would be greatly appreciated!
Rosaluma is considered one of shiek's hardest MUs. It is pretty close to even because shiek is awesome, and you can gimp her.... but if you want to steamroll Rosa, there are better choices. Its a hard MU, and shiek's problems are very much exasperated by a luma being on the field.

Shiek is a fine pick against Samus.
 
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