New Smash Bros for WiiU

[---]

Kinda random question, but since I'm not part of the backroom and therefore not eligible anyway, can someone tell me when Toise's roster bet thing ends? Just curious.

I believe it ends on May 4th. And don't worry, anyone can enter, it's just easier to keep track of if you're in the backrooms.

 

[N3ON]

I believe it ends on May 4th. And don't worry, anyone can enter, it's just easier to keep track of if you're in the backrooms.

Oh ok, thanks for the info. I actually might enter then. I guess I finally have to make a roster for myself.

 

[SmashChu]

1) I think I can see where you're coming from here, but I think Smash 4 will be the first game since the original to introduce a new second-party franchise to the game. Nintendo seems to have quite a bit of influence over Camelot, with every game they've made since 1999 being on Nintendo platform and many of them being on Mario sports games. I could also easily see Sakurai push for Saki's inclusion as a playable character given how much he seems to like him. So I still feel as both have decent shots at getting in. But I think if neither get it and we got Shulk instead (along with Little Mac and Mii), it'd be more due to preference by Nintendo to stick with 1st party new series newcomers than any licensing issues (which I only see coming up in the Pokemon franchise and third-party characters).

And isn't the Pokemon Company/Game Freaks very controlling of their property? I'd imagine they were one of the most independent second-parties for Nintendo due to how enormously successful Pokemon is.

Maybe, but anything is possible if we are going with that assumption. If we look back, it's more likely that they'd go with a Nintendo owned property over one that ins't. No reason to see them change. They didn't change for Brawl and didn't add Issac or Starfy back then.

2) A lot of people do like Xenoblade that is for sure, but I wouldn't call Xenoblade a "very popular" game yet as it has yet to sell a million and probably won't. At best I see it achieving cult status a la Earthbound. Shulk being popular in Japan for requests is a decent point, thought.He said "no" to Urban Champion. Whenever or not this keeps Little Mac out remains to be seen, but he has said nothing about Little Mac getting in or not.

Sales really don't matter, but
Xenoblade's sales are probably the same or better than any of the Mother games
Xenoblade's sales are probably more than any Starfy game or Sin and Punishment

Also, Shulk is just as popular as any of those characters.

 

[Berserker.]

Does anyone know the opinion or thoughts of the japanese SSB fans regarding Shulk?

 

[Johnknight1]

All I can say is, Melee2.0 dreamers.. there's always SSB5 >.>

Either Smash Wii U or Smash 3DS will be Smash 5, herpa derpa!

Awesome dude! :D I was a defender too haha. If I was anywhere else I ran out of breath fast. That and I would be falling over and running into players even more than usual. Especially when kids would get filled with testosterone, I think some kids forgot what type of "football" they're playing.

Nah, I just don't feel pain that much in my legs. I've always had Strong legs.

And actually, I played every position, but mostly I played midfielder, until I became goalie. Then, I never wanted to play any other position. I got to friggen mug people and block people out from goals. I loved intimidating shooters in between the pipes. I did the same thing in baseball as a pitcher with my palm ball!

He will be in the game.

He will be..........

No. Nathan Drake will not make it in favor of some random Crash Bandicoot character!

 

[Berserker.]

No. Nathan Drake will not make it in favor of some random Crash Bandicoot character!

Noooooooo

It just doesn't work because it is either generic or is a forced unique idea. :/

I'd rather wait for Sakurai's thoughts regarding Toad. Hopefully, if Sakurai makes Toad into a playable character, the moveset will not be "forced" or generic.

Oh god. I want to post a wall of text regarding the whole generic toad thing. OH WELL :|
[collapse=WARNING]One final point that I'd like to address is the argument that Toad is an unoriginal, un-unique (is that a word???) character that lacks moveset potential. I find this laughably false.

First of all, Toad is probably one of the most unique Mario characters not represented in Smash. I can't even fathom how Bowser Jr. supporters can use this argument against Toad when Bowser Jr. is basically a mini Bowser. What other major character in the Mario universe resembles Toad? Toad looks like the other Toads? What about Yoshi? You can call the one and only green Yoshi "Yoshi". The same for Toad. You can call the one and only Toad "Toad". Plus, like Yoshi, he's one among the other species.

Toad is NOT generic. He's from a generic race but THE TOAD (Toad) is not generic. He's the one that started the whole concept of how a Toad should look like. You know, it's like some guy in the city looked unique and cool so you copied his style. That's what Shigeru did. He made multiple toads (and yoshis) and there! It became a species.

Toad is unique. More unique than Paper Mario and Jr. Paper Mario is simply a paper form of mario. Bowser Jr. is obviously a mini bowser or baby bowser clone. Toad does not resemble to anyone other than his fellow species of course. Paper Mario and Jr. is unique. Their abilities are extremely unique-- I don't know about Jr. though. He does exactly what Bowser does except he has that paint brush but that's the only thing that does not make him a full clone. He rides a clown car, he shoots fire balls and he does that spinny shell attack. Paper Mario is extremely unique. The character is not unique since it's just Mario but what he does is unique. Toad on the other hand is unique in both ways. Like I said, he does not resemble to any main or major mario character. He also has unique abilities such as running up walls, super human strength for a small guy, super speed and using spores and mushrooms as a weapon and defense. All of the 3 are unique in their own way. There's nothing wrong with adding Paper Mario or Bowser Jr. I wouldn't even mind if there were 6 characters in the Mario series. After all, the more, the merrier.

Second, let's talk about Toad's playstyle and moveset potential. Being a small character, Toad is known for being very quick, but he is also known for seeming to have superhuman strength as seen in Super Mario Bros. 2. Being a small and quick yet strong character is something not seen often, and could present a unique play-style. Now what about his moveset?

Many moves from the games he has been playable in can be looked at in determining this. Notice that in the three games where he appears as a playable protagonist (Super Mario Bros. 2, Wario's Woods, and New Super Mario Bros. Wii), the gameplay involves lifting things and throwing/dropping them. This is one obvious ability that Toad could acquire; lifting and throwing characters. The charged high-jump from Super Mario Bros. 2 is another possibility for a move, a move that would probably be utilized as an Up-B recovery move. In Wario's Woods, Toad is given bombs to throw, another possible move. He could also use the new power-ups found in New Super Mario Bros. Wii as an assortment of abilities, not to mention abilities found in Mario spin-off titles. And don't forget that there are many moves that could be designed specially for Toad without making him seem out of character. With this in mind, plus the fact that there are many different elements throughout the Mario series from which he could borrow his moves, you can't deny that Toad does indeed have moveset potential.

Toad's moveset could be comprised of items and mushrooms with melee attacks. Why is it that people do not allow Toad to use items when Mario, Luigi and Diddy use items? Fire Flower? Banana? Why can't Toad use an Ice flower or the propeller cap? Some people think Toad has nothing new to bring but mushrooms. That is a useless statement. Just like Kirby and Pikachu, he's fast and strong but he has low jumps. He channels his power through mushrooms. There are hardly any characters that use a mushroom as a power. So you're saying Ridley will offer nothing but Tail whipping action?


Adding to what has been said, Toad can also use the new abilities from NSMB Wii.[/collapse]
Fat essay is fat

 

[Johnknight1]

Noooooooo

YES!!! YES!!! YES!!! YES!!! YES!!! YES!!! YES!!! YES!!! YES!!! YES!!! YES!!! YES!!! YES!!! YES!!! YES! YES! YESSS!!!

Fire Emblem, on the other hand, ends up being brought up due to certain events, such as revelations within Awakening.
That, and there is no opposition against the Fire Emblem characters; just debates on which ones will make it.

Not just who we think will make it, but why, how they will make it, what they will bring to smash 4, and who we think should make it.

I've been moving out of my dorm all day, seems we jumped 20 pages, what did I miss? I did see the new Sakurai interview though, pretty much confirms no major news coming from E3 for the games.

In other words, pretty much what I expected (regarding E3), including Sakurai taking over over the world one dorm at a time.

 

[Berserker.]

NOOOOOOOOOOOOOOO

The clip sucks because it was from the prequels :\. Honestly, I thought episode 3 was actually quite decent

 

[Verde Coeden Scalesworth]

So generic Toad gets a generic moveset... yeah I don't like the idea.

Exactly. That's why I want a unique moveset for him. Something like berzerker did. It could be less complicated, but the point still stands.

It just doesn't work because it is either generic or is a forced unique idea. :/

Forced doesn't bother me as long as it makes sense or can be justified easily enough.

If it's utterly stupid... yeah.

Likewise, R.O.B. was fine with a generic moveset because of who he is. Main Toad is not. The Main Toad deserves an awesome moveset because of who he is. Not a meh one. I mean, I'd give a meh one to say... Duck Hunt Dog, but him? Hell no. I actually think he should be in Smash... after Dr. Mario, Paper Mario, and Bowser Jr., of course. IMO.

 

[Holder of the Heel]

That quote mostly just said meaningless things (or incorrect things about Paper Mario or Bowser Jr. not having as much potential). Having strength or speed has nothing to do with the moveset, granted yes it is unique in the sense of stats, but that isn't what we are talking about.

Of course, he references items being his scapegoat, and justifies it by saying Mario, Luigi, and Diddy do so. The thing is though, the fire balls of the mario brothers are more iconic to them and they have games where they do that without items, as for the cape, iconic again, and is only one item. Diddy with bananas can hardly count, considering he is a money that collects bananas... and he is a monkey. XP Any items put onto Toad are quite irrespective of him and none are associated with him other than in the sense that they are in the same games.

He did suggest two things that aren't involving items, like grabbing enemies and doing a super jump, but Donkey Kong and Dedede do those things respectively.

I know I am being harsh, but he said these things as if they are so obvious and good. It really isn't, and I can list over 10 characters who face none of the problems he has without even kicking roster spots from other likable candidates like Toad most likely would.

Edit: Just so everyone knows, I don't really hate Toad, I just find him vastly inferior to Paper Mario, and even compared to separate franchise potential newcomers. So that is the source of my cruelty, if he got in and had the problems I am mentioning, I wouldn't be bothered really. Just debating the theories and such. ^^

 

[Lukingordex]

lol.......

 

[Johnknight1]

NOOOOOOOOOOOOOOO
The clip sucks because it was from the prequels :\. Honestly, I thought episode 3 was actually quite decent

Episode III was decent, but it had some terrible parts.
Also, this was my reaction to finding out Mewtwo wasn't in Brawl. It better not happen again.

I doubt he is going to consider over 200 potential newcomers for SSB4 as he needs to narrow down what should be in and what shouldn't be.

I've stated this before, but here I go again. The Smash Bros. (roster-centered) developers select a ton of characters they would like to see in the game (that they could get in the game). They grab nearly everyone they can that they think would work. They then narrow it down a bit, removing the characters they feel won't work or aren't fit for the series. They make some move set ideas for each characters. They then cut the characters that are the least intriguing. Then, the basic art direction and pre-game play rough drafts begin. Some more characters are cut. Then the actual game development begins. Some characters that don't work are cut. Then comes further development and the rough draft form of the multiplayer. A few characters then might be cut. Then comes character testing. Some characters don't work. They're cut. Some potential new characters work but don't "fit." They're cut. Then returning characters are added, and subsequently tweaked on. Judging by how some potential new characters work, they might be cut (or altered).

This process continues like this. At least, that is my theory. I also think that in rare instances (such as clones), characters that have been "cut" from consideration can be reconsidered and then added again to the roster.

 

[Berserker.]

That quote mostly just said meaningless things (or incorrect things about Paper Mario or Bowser Jr. not having as much potential). Having strength or speed has nothing to do with the moveset, granted yes it is unique in the sense of stats, but that isn't what we are talking about.

What was so incorrect about Jr.? He literally is a mini bowser clone.

And Paper Mario IS basically Mario. They even call Paper Mario "Mario". I said that the character is not unique but his ABILITIES are.

Having strength or speed has something to do with the moveset. It can be applied to the standard attacks or throws. Something like that

He did suggest two things that aren't involving items, like grabbing enemies and doing a super jump, but Donkey Kong and Dedede do those things respectively.

Mushroom summoning from sports mix

I know I am being harsh, but he said these things as if they are so obvious and good. It really isn't, and I can list over 10 characters who face none of the problems he has without even kicking roster spots from other likable candidates like Toad most likely would.

You aren't being harsh

You're just saying your opinion. Ya know.

-----

Edit : I would be fine with anyone. But I really want Toad above all of the possible Mario candidates.

Edit 2 : The thing is, Toad is unique and he has the potential to be unique too. Toad's standards can be based off his superhuman strength and speed. His specials can be composed of his power over spores (SSBB/MSM), new abilities from Mario Bros. Wii (Since he's one of the new features in the game along with the items), maybe a command grab special and the super jump ability which Dedede and Bowser already have.

 

[Holder of the Heel]

Yeah, I mean the way it opened up though he was saying that Toad was superior to them both in uniqueness, which is a stretch. What you say about standard attacks are right though, my bad.

Okay, come up with a moveset that isn't filled with strange spore things and at least not filled with random items that appear in the games he has appeared in then I may approve of it. Still won't like him more than Paper Mario since he is a favorite of mine, but I'll like the idea of him more.

 

[SmashChu]

Does anyone know the opinion or thoughts of the japanese SSB fans regarding Shulk?

From what Chronobound has found:

The top request are Roy, Mewtwo, Dixie Kong, and K. Rool. Shulk is in the next group of all the characters people care about just a little bit more. This includes Megaman, Black Shadow, Starfy, Takamaru and Bowser Jr. and a few others two.

 

[ChronoBound]

I am really looking forward to E3 2012. I am expecting there to be "something" pertaining to Smash 4, even if its not a trailer. More details about it would be great.

The top request are Roy, Mewtwo, Dixie Kong, and K. Rool. Shulk is in the next group of all the characters people care about just a little bit more. This includes Megaman, Black Shadow, Starfy, Takamaru and Bowser Jr. and a few others two.

Mega Man is definitely part of the Top 5 most wanted characters in Japan.

 

[N3ON]

I think it's important to note in regards to Shulk, if Chrono's data is relatively recent, it shows that (while it might still be a little too early) Shulk doesn't seem to be a "flavor-of-the-month" character along the lines of Ghirahim (who's popularity is already fading), as his game came out two years ago in Japan. If he is still currently in the "B" tier of newcomer popularity (or would it be "A" tier? whatevs), it bodes well for his staying power. Just speculation though, as usual.

 

[Johnknight1]

Mega Man will ALWAYS be 1 of the top 5 most desired characters in smash until he is finally confirmed! Seriously, we all know he's in. That's why Sakurai sounds so mad to IGN. That and the fact... he's being interviewed by IGN! (remember, they thought "characters like Cloud and Squall" should replace "characters like Wario")

Aside from Brawl's roster, I'd say that there are only around thirty semi-serious candidates for SSB4.

[COLLAPSE="I can list about 30 characters that may have been "semi-considered.""]Bowser Jr., Dr. Mario (I know that one for a fact), Waluigi, Geno, Hammer Bros., Baby Mario Bros., Dixie Kong, King K. Rool, Tingle, Vatti, Midna (with or without Wolf Link), Zant, Young Link, Ridley (possibly Meta Ridley), Dark Samus, Knuckle Joe, Pichu (at least considered), Mewtwo (fact), Deoxys, Plusle and Minun, Meowth, Samurai Goroh, Black Shadow, Jeff, Roy (fact), Lyn, the Black Knight (he actually has boss data on the disc), Kat and Ana, Ashley, Gray Fox, Little Mac, Jill Dozer, the Balloon Fighter, the Mach Rider, Dr. Wright, Saki, Isaac, Starfy, Custom Robo, Barbara, the Animal Crosser, Tom Nook, Excite Bikers, Miis, Mega Man).

That's 45 characters off the top of my head alone![/COLLAPSE]

Here you go. 2-3 years of development.
Unless we see the game being delayed, the game will be finished in three years since it started.

Well thanks for the source. That sounds like you could believe it, except the fact Brawl was delayed about 3 months. Plus, again, this is 2 games being developed, not 1.

 

[Berserker.]

From what Chronobound has found:

The top request are Roy, Mewtwo, Dixie Kong, and K. Rool. Shulk is in the next group of all the characters people care about just a little bit more. This includes Megaman, Black Shadow, Starfy, Takamaru and Bowser Jr. and a few others two.

Thank God *Phew*.

I'm a Shulk supporter. Surprisingly, he's my 2nd most wanted now.

Yeah, I mean the way it opened up though he was saying that Toad was superior to them both in uniqueness, which is a stretch. What you say about standard attacks are right though, my bad.

Okay, come up with a moveset that isn't filled with strange spore things and at least not filled with random items that appear in the games he has appeared in then I may approve of it. Still won't like him more than Paper Mario since he is a favorite of mine, but I'll like the idea of him more.

Not to worry, my fabulous friend.

Spoiler

Neutral B : Mushroom summon

- Toad summons 2 mushrooms that spin around. Bumping into it knocks down the enemy. It deals only 8% damage
- It originated from Sports mix.

Forward B : Toad rush *Gulp Chu*

-Toad enters into a running state (See the picture). In this state, he has something never before seen in a Smash game: Followup attacks. By putting these inputs in, you have access to a sub-moveset for Toad.
B: Stop - Stop in place.
Side B: Nothing in the direction you're facing, but the other way around lets you turn around.
Down B: Slides in and then tosses them on the ground, ground bouncing them. Delas 10% damage
Up B: Super Jump - Does a high jump forward, backward, or neutral depending on the input.
-Origin: A mixture of Toad's kart and Toad's superhuman ability

Upward B : Super jump

- Toad crouches then jumps upward. This deals 10% damage.
- It originated from Super Mario Bros. 2

Downward B : Bomb

-Toad pulls out a bomb from Wario’s Woods. Press B to leave it on the ground. You can have only one out at a time. If you do B again, the last bomb disappears in a harmless explosion. Side, Down, and Up B allow you to toss them in those directions. You can use the Side up inputs to toss them like a catapult. Time for the bomb to explode is around 3-5 seconds. It deals 15% damage
- It originated from Wario's Woods

2 super human based special
1 spore based special
1 item based special

I'm sorry Chu. I had to resort to getting into the complex area.

 

[Johnknight1]

Out of those, there are only two third-party characters whom I feel have a realistic chance (using it loosely here) of being in SSB4; Mega Man and Professor Layton. And third-party spots are going to be precious and few, so even if we do get four third-party spots (Sonic and Snake returning with Mega Man as the 1st newcomer), most people would prefer Layton/SE character/Ryu Hayabusa over a second Sonic rep.

Not really. Mostly the Layton and Ryu fans are small. Plus Pac-Man would be a much more logical choice for obvious reasons. Pac-Man is an icon of gaming, as well as Miyamoto's favorite video game character, and a character everyone recognizes. Basically, about 1 in 100 people know of Pac-Man have ever heard the word "Layton" used.

In other words, I narrow down the 3rd party choices (Sonic and Snake aside) to Mega Man, Pac-Man, Tails, and to a lesser extent, Ryu (Street Fighter), Grey Fox (I'm really reaching there), Slime, Geno, Bomberman and Simon Belmont.

Well, I did mention that Toad is a very popular choice for SSB4 and could be unique.

He could be unique, but not as unique as Paper Mario, Geno (who's a long shot, definitely), or Bowser Jr. IMO. Still, that doesn't mean he wouldn't be "fun." Ganondorf isn't exactly the most "unique" character in Melee, but he is sure is fun as heck to play!

 

[Berserker.]

[COLLAPSE="I can list about 30 characters that may have been "semi-considered.""]Bowser Jr., Dr. Mario (I know that one for a fact), Waluigi, Geno, Hammer Bros., Baby Mario Bros., Dixie Kong, King K. Rool, Tingle, Vatti, Midna (with or without Wolf Link), Zant, Young Link, Ridley (possibly Meta Ridley), Dark Samus, Knuckle Joe, Pichu (at least considered), Mewtwo (fact), Deoxys, Plusle and Minun, Meowth, Samurai Goroh, Black Shadow, Jeff, Roy (fact), Lyn, the Black Knight (he actually has boss data on the disc), Kat and Ana, Ashley, Gray Fox, Little Mac, Jill Dozer, the Balloon Fighter, the Mach Rider, Dr. Wright, Saki, Isaac, Starfy, Custom Robo, Barbara, the Animal Crosser, Tom Nook, Excite Bikers, Miis, Mega Man).

That's 45 characters off the top of my head alone![/COLLAPSE]

You could put Nook, Dr. Wright, Kat and Ana and Waluigi.

But you didn't bother putting toad

Whatever



DEAR GOD JOHN, You saved me from double posting. I love you lol.

 

[grizby2]

Ah, I got it.

But I think Ness and Lucas moves was not created by nothing.
Some of then was on the game series.

SOME?
then what moves that they have arent from the game? :x

 

[Johnknight1]

You could put Nook, Dr. Wright, Kat and Ana and Waluigi.
But you didn't bother putting toad
Whatever

I probably should have hindsight. However, my reason for not including Toad was Sakurai hasn't seen him as a "fighter"

Spoiler

even though I like Toad

.

DEAR GOD JOHN, You saved me from double posting. I love you lol.

Just remember to always support Mega Man and Ridley my dear child. And then, life will be good!

Funny you say that's a drag queen. (NSFW)

When I clicked that link, I had no idea for what I was in store for. After seeing that video, I have no idea about anything I just watched. All I know is the word "Clitoris."

Dear God, I think I have just become mentally disturbed...

 

[Berserker.]

I probably should have hindsight. However, my reason for not including Toad was Sakurai hasn't seen him as a "fighter"

Spoiler

even though I like Toad

.

YET

Just remember to always support Mega Man and Ridley my dear child. And then, life will be good!

You mean bad box art megaman right?

 

[SmashChu]

I am really looking forward to E3 2012. I am expecting there to be "something" pertaining to Smash 4, even if its not a trailer. More details about it would be great.

Now, we move at the same pace

Spoiler

Xenoblade joke

Mega Man is definitely part of the Top 5 most wanted characters in Japan.

Opps. My bad.

 

[Johnknight1]

YET

If it were up to me, Toad would 100% be considered.

You mean bad box art megaman right?

Nope. Classic only, or else your d**k will be eaten by whatever is in this video.

@ SmashChu
Apologize by repeating the phrases "Hail Mega Man, Cyborg of Grace, may your human heart and robot body save me from my sins" and "Dear God Ridley, May your immortal body and soul lead me to be strong enough to ripe through my enemies" 12 times.

 

[Berserker.]

If it were up to me, Toad would 100% be considered.

Just wait man...

Wait for the magic of Toad getting in

Well.... Think about it. Sakurai still mentioned Toad for some reason. He still said that he could not fight or anything because he was never shown fighting or at least having abilities. Looks like SMB 2 and WW won't be enough for Toad. Oh and brawl was based on the GC era. Well, 3/4 of it.

Now, since Toad is in NSMB Wii and also, he's in a bunch of other games (Luigi's mansion 2 where in he'll be Luigi's sidekick), he has to be considered as one of the more likely candidates. He also has a major role in Mario Galaxy 1 and 2. And, he is soon to be one of the playable characters in NSMB 2 which will hopefully, confirm that Toad can actually do stuff.

Nope. Classic only, or else your d**k will be eaten by whatever is in this video.

 

[grizby2]

they should put in a nicer "how to play" video this time around. (which , ofcourse, im guessing would star mario and bowser yet again) Not that its a huge priority or anything.

 

[Verde Coeden Scalesworth]

SOME?
then what moves that they have arent from the game? :x

Basic punches and kicks. I'm sure there's others.

 

[Johnknight1]

Just wait man...
Wait for the magic of Toad getting in

Well, I would like (not love) it if Toad would be playable. Toad definitely deserves to be considered as a potential new playable character candidate.

*snip (the post is right above me people; read it!)

Sakurai has mentioned a lot of characters. See: The Melee character poll and response, the Melee post-release Q&A, the Brawl character poll and response, and a ton of other various interviews with Sakurai. Plus you also have to consider how much history and great characters Nintendo has made over their 5 decades of being a video game company.

As for Toad's ability, I don't doubt it. I just don't think there is as much "there" to make him the way his move set looks and different moves he could have would be as original as other potential new characters. It should be noted that this isn't necessarily a bad thing. Having a "unique play style" can change all that (think Falco in Melee, Toon Link in Brawl).

 

[grizby2]

Basic punches and kicks. I'm sure there's others.

well thats true for about 75% of brawl. did olimar ever do that...spinning thing?

basic punches/kicks are kinda needed for fighting XD

 

[ChronoBound]

I am curious whether we should do a prediction league also for the first set of newcomers unveiled for Smash 4. Is anyone up for that?

 

[Berserker.]

As for Toad's ability, I don't doubt it. I just don't think there is as much "there" to make him the way his move set looks and different moves he could have would be as original as other potential new characters. It should be noted that this isn't necessarily a bad thing. Having a "unique play style" can change all that (think Falco in Melee, Toon Link in Brawl).

Regarding movesets, I think we should just focus on... the specials. Standard attacks are generic . Most characters have similar standard attacks (And that even goes for other fighting games).

Great examples:
Mario's kick (F-tilt) = Falcon's kick (F-tilt... Oh and not FALCON KICK)
Ike's U-smash = Link's U-tilt
The many characters who have a sex kick
DK's fair = Mario's fair
Many more....

Same can be said for the possible newcomers. They can be the same looking attack with maybe the same or different damage or speed.

Toad has a good amount of options for the specials which can hopefully, be different from the specials of other characters and even the newcomers. No newcomer (Even K.Rool) is quite the grappler like Toad. Also and of course, there's no newcomer with the ability... TO MANIPULATE SPORES *derp*. This is sounding subjective since I'm not Sakurai. Lol but I'm just saying facts and comparing Toad to other characters' abilities.

But like what you said, think Falco and Toon Link. It's not always bad to be unoriginal.

Edit : About the grappling thing, I meant throwing since ya know.... Super Mario Bros. 2 and Wario Woods

 

[Johnknight1]

@ Chrono
I smell... Mega Man. And K. Rool. And a overlooked pure retro character. And a new character (Isaac=???). And a recently revived retro character (Little Mac=???).

@ Berserker
I'm not singling out your move set, but a lot of Toad move sets seem to have a lot of gimmicky moves. And I really don't like that. Gimmicks should be for items, unless we're talking about rare events (ie: Peach pulling out bombs with her down B, King Dedede pulling out Smash Balls with his neutral B).

 

[N3ON]

I am curious whether we should do a prediction league also for the first set of newcomers unveiled for Smash 4. Is anyone up for that?

I definitely would be. Although my picks are already quite similar to John's

 

[Verde Coeden Scalesworth]

well thats true for about 75% of brawl. did olimar ever do that...spinning thing?

basic punches/kicks are kinda needed for fighting XD

And tails, bites, headbutts, etc.

To be fair, you didn't specify.

And a lot of his moves, I'm pretty sure he couldn't perform(Lucas' Smash Up A for example).

I could be wrong.

Anyway, at least half of Mario's moves are from his games(atleast in 64.)

Specials not needed to be said.

A A A is his SM64 combo.

Smash Down A is also from SM64.

Air Down A is definitely based upon his spin from Super Mario World.

His Throws are another 64 throwback.(no pun intended)

Aerial A is 64 as well. He can kick.

His Down A or Side A is similarly to his ability to kick shells.

Smash A is hard to say. A giant punch is right up his alley, I guess.

Special, yep.

So let's see...

3 specials, 10 normal attacks.

What's left is Smash Up A, Up A, and the rest of the aerials. So... 6.

However, every move is logical enough for him anyway.

 

[Johnknight1]

@ Chaos
That is because Sakurai likes diversity, and the formula I used (two mega popular characters, one recent revived character/a character who is both new and old (like how Mario is in games in 1981 and 2012), 1 purely retro character, and 1 newer character) or close variations to that (basic premise idea I just posted) have been used in the unveiling of newcomers for both Melee and Brawl.

 

[grizby2]

Toad has a good amount of options for the specials which can hopefully, be different from the specials of other characters and even the newcomers. No newcomer (Even K.Rool) is quite the grappler like Toad.

dixie would make a good grappler too.
dat prehensile hair...

are you talking about special moves that grab people (ie lucario/bowser side B) or just normally throwing people? i know toad can carry various things above his head, but ive never seen him throw a living being "smash" styled. what game was that in? i wanna see :o

 

[Johnknight1]

...To continue on from my previous post...

In Melee the initially revealed newcomers were Peach, Bowser, Sheik (Zelda was kept secret until a few days or weeks before Melee's release), and the Ice Climbers were the revealed new characters. Peach and Bowser were obviously super popular, Sheik was fairly recent, and the Ice Climbers were a purely retro character. Zelda fits the role of a new and retro character very well. She obviously had a recent redesign in Ocarina of Time, yet had been a staple in her namesake series form the beginning.

In Brawl, Wario and Meta Knight were the popular additions, Zero Suit Samus was the more recent addition, Pit was the retro addition, and Snake was the "WTF?" as well as the both new yet retro character addition.

 

[Berserker.]

are you talking about special moves that grab people (ie lucario/bowser side B) or just normally throwing people? i know toad can carry various things above his head, but ive never seen him throw a living being "smash" styled. what game was that in? i wanna see :o

Special move.

And Toad was never in a smash bros. game... I'm just showing how strong Toad is.

@ Berserker
I'm not singling out your move set, but a lot of Toad move sets seem to have a lot of gimmicky moves. And I really don't like that. Gimmicks should be for items, unless we're talking about rare events (ie: Peach pulling out bombs with her down B, King Dedede pulling out Smash Balls with his neutral B).

Of course, a lot of Toad movesets have gimmicky moves but the thing is, this is smash bros. It's a party game which soon will become, a competitive/party game (I think). Plus, gimmicks are what make the character quite unique despite being quite ridiculous (Phoenix Wright for example).

Well... It all comes down to playstyle/gameplay.

Edit : From what I've noticed regarding Toad movesets, it's usually based on spin offs, party games.