New Smash Bros for WiiU

[Verde Coeden Scalesworth]

He should stay cut because there are literally thousands of better choices for the development team to spend their time working on. As I (sarcastically) stated a few posts ago, you could make a Super Mario Smash Bros. game that featured all the different forms of Mario with the same model and basic moves, but alter their physics a bit and change one of their specials. Dr. Mario should never have happened in the first place because fans were screaming for so many other choices. I don't think that anyone was happy that Metal Mario got into Mario Kart 7 over lots of other good choices (and Waluigi, a series veteran), and the situation is almost perfectly parallel to Smash Bros.

No, they aren't better choices since he was playable first. That's a fallacious logical statement. Any characters that aren't playable are worse choices than any already playable character by that alone. Also, there's no reason to make all those different versions, as Dr. Mario is his own full series as well. The only other Mario that would be easy to implement with no real issues is Paper Mario. All of those other Marios are very silly choices and don't do anything to prove your statement right. Dr. Mario was already playable. That means he's already a more worthy addition where it matters, in the game itself. Whether you like him or not, he's already been a worthy choice. That cannot really be denied.

I understand that people enjoy playing as him, but you'd have a hard time making me believe that he's so fun that he should come back at the expense of a newcomer.

Except he can come back without the expense of anyone whatsoever. That's another silly statement and no veteran would throw out the appearance of a new character. New characters have priority first, if Brawl is any indication.

@Diddy: I am a competitive person, but I actually play casually. I'm more like a mediator on both ends. I also believe every character should return and nobody should ever get cut. I'm an equal-opportunity person.

 

[Metal Overlord]

Yeah, that's right, Zzuxon, speak for thousands if not hundreds of thousands of Smash fans that you don't know and most likely never will know in your life when you say that

Give this guy a freakin' medal

 

[LC-DDM]

He didn't weight anything more. Same exact weight iirc, maybe with a change of one point. And wheren't you a casual HyperFalcon? Casuals especially would say Mario and Doc are basically the same character. Only the proffesionals would say otherwise, and yes; it's only cause of TWO moves.

I'd like to point out that I'd like to have the good doctor back for Smash, at least as DLC.

As it stands, the current Mario is different enough from his Melee version. So, assuming they'd give him more moves based off Galaxy or Sunshine, it'd be enough to warrant... well, a Melee "version" of his character in the form of Doc Mario, which would play as the "old" Mario did.

 

[Sephirothxxx]

Haha, thanks, but that's the only thing funny I remember saying

You're attitude today is hillarious today in general.

If they put in Dr. Mario back in, I would rage. And so would the majority of smash fans.

Uh no. That's bull****.

Somebody call ZZZ! We need some doc defense!

 

[Big-Cat]

I'd like to point out that I'd like to have the good doctor back for Smash, at least as DLC.

As it stands, the current Mario is different enough from his Melee version. So, assuming they'd give him more moves based off Galaxy or Sunshine, it'd be enough to warrant... well, a Melee "version" of his character in the form of Doc Mario, which would play as the "old" Mario did.

Reminds me of NESTS Kyo and Flames Iori as KOFXIII DLC.

 

[Opossum]

So...I made a Goroh Moveset. I'll post it in a bit.


Suspense!

 

[Verde Coeden Scalesworth]

So...I made a Goroh Moveset. I'll post it in a bit.


Suspense!

I want to see a Prince Goro moveset now.

 

[GiantBreadbug]

No, they aren't better choices since he was playable first. That's a fallacious logical statement. Any characters that aren't playable are worse choices than any already playable character by that alone. Also, there's no reason to make all those different versions, as Dr. Mario is his own full series as well. The only other Mario that would be easy to implement with no real issues is Paper Mario. All of those other Marios are very silly choices and don't do anything to prove your statement right. Dr. Mario was already playable. That means he's already a more worthy addition where it matters, in the game itself. Whether you like him or not, he's already been a worthy choice. That cannot really be denied.

Except he can come back without the expense of anyone whatsoever. That's another silly statement and no veteran would throw out the appearance of a new character. New characters have priority first, if Brawl is any indication.

It is not a fallacious logical statement, because Veteran does not automatically equal better choice. That would mean that Dr. Mario is a better choice for Smash Bros. than any number of characters that are not yet playable, which is absolutely not true. Ridley, Pit, Little Mac; the list of characters that should've been in Melee instead of Dr. Mario is a long one. And if Dr. Mario makes it into another Smash Bros. game, and a character on that aforementioned list doesn't, then he got in over them. He was developed, and they weren't. And trust me, if Dr. does return, there will be characters that people wanted that don't get in.

I don't like for veterans to be cut either, but the world needs to realize that Masahiro Sakurai is just as prone to lapses in judgement as the average person. This is the man that was going to cut Ness, and possibly cut Roy and Marth from the western version of Melee. He thinks Ridley is impossible, thinks characters that don't fit the "fighting" stereotype are impossible (I happen to disagree with this stance, but it does happen to be that Dr. Mario has never been featured in a "violent, fighty" role - to use the words of some), and fought the competitive crowd every step of the way (not that that upsets me, since I'm not a competitive player) with his Brawl. Dr. Mario being playable was one of those bad Sakurai decisions. And let me note that I adore Sakurai and everything he's done for videogames, just as a disclaimer.

Dr. Mario is no more "his own series" than the number of Mario sports titles and spinoffs. Kart Mario has his own series, too. Mario Kart. If that sounds stupid, listen to the argument that Dr. Mario is a separate series just because it features Mario in a different role. And my statement about the many Marios isn't silly; changing Mario's appearance and playstyle silghtly based on appearances in different Mario games and adding him as a separate playable character is unacceptable. Period. And that's what they did with Dr. Mario.

 

[Diddy Kong]

Anthony Higgs is the only moveset I'm interessted in right now. And of coarse Impa. They are pretty much my most wanted a long with King K.Rool and Dixie. And a returning Mewtwo. Don't care much about the rest, but am supportive of most original ideas.

 

[Verde Coeden Scalesworth]

It is not a fallacious logical statement, because Veteran does not automatically equal better choice. That would mean that Dr. Mario is a better choice for Smash Bros. than any number of characters that are not yet playable, which is absolutely not true. Ridley, Pit, Little Mac; the list of characters that should've been in Melee instead of Dr. Mario is a long one. And if Dr. Mario makes it into another Smash Bros. game, and a character on that aforementioned list doesn't, then he got in over them. He was developed, and they weren't. And trust me, if Dr. does return, there will be characters that people wanted that don't get in.

That's exactly what it means. And no matter who gets in, characters people want won't get in. It's not related to him at all.

Dr. Mario is no more "his own series" than the number of Mario sports titles and spinoffs. Kart Mario has his own series, too. Mario Kart. If that sounds stupid, listen to the argument that Dr. Mario is a separate series just because it features Mario in a different role. And my statement about the many Marios isn't silly; changing Mario's appearance and playstyle silghtly based on appearances in different Mario games and adding him as a separate playable character is unacceptable. Period.

Dr. Mario, Paper Mario, Wario Land and Wario Ware are all unique separate series that are not just spin-offs. Mario Kart and Mario Party are pure spin-off. The others are not.

You can't say it's unacceptable when he was already added in. It clearly wan't unacceptable. Veterans should not be cut are already better choices than any new characters as they were there first. They already count. However... the fact of the matter is new characters will always get in before certain veterans. Even if Dr. Mario got in, nobody would be cut before him. He'd be a last minute clone addition, and wouldn't even get first dibs of any clone. Roy would be there first, for starters.

Him being in would not hurt anyone's chances whatsoever. That's entirely baseless since new characters already took more priority over him in the first place, proving that false.

 

[Sephirothxxx]

So...I made a Goroh Moveset. I'll post it in a bit.


Suspense!

I'm ready for it.

F-Zero time

 

[Metal Overlord]

And if Dr. Mario makes it into another Smash Bros. game, and a character on that aforementioned list doesn't, then he got in over them.

HAI GUISE if Ridley doesn't make it into Smash, then you can blame it on Doc now! It wouldn't be because Sakurai didn't want him in or didn't have enough time to implement him, it'd all be because of that goddamned Doc!

/sarcasm

 

[Diddy Kong]

I guess your right. If Doc returns is like his appearance in Melee, a last minute addition. But I doubt that they'll add in characters like that.

 

[Verde Coeden Scalesworth]

I guess your right. If Doc returns is like his appearance in Melee, a last minute addition. But I doubt that they'll add in characters like that.

I actually doubt this too, but that's possibly what would've happened in Brawl for the earlier clones if they got in.(and the other 3 clones not called Dr. Mario and Roy)

 

[Diddy Kong]

Personally... I think Mewtwo was the only non clone not added.

 

[Metal Overlord]

Mewtwo IS a clone

 

[Diddy Kong]

My mind is now blown...

 

[Metal Overlord]

And why is that?

 

[Diddy Kong]

Forgot Mewtwo was a Mew clone lololol

 

[Metal Overlord]

trolololo mission accomplished

 

[Diddy Kong]

Can feel good at times am I right? ^^

 

[Oasis_S]

I just thought of a reeeally Stupid character for Sm4sh.

Spoiler

Doc

 

[Diddy Kong]

Stupidest idea ever indeed.

 

[LC-DDM]

What do you mean, adding Zoidberg into Smash 4 is stupid?! >:V

 

[GiantBreadbug]

That's exactly what it means. And no matter who gets in, characters people want won't get in. It's not related to him at all.



Dr. Mario, Paper Mario, Wario Land and Wario Ware are all unique separate series that are not just spin-offs. Mario Kart and Mario Party are pure spin-off. The others are not.

You can't say it's unacceptable when he was already added in. It clearly wan't unacceptable. Veterans should not be cut are already better choices than any new characters as they were there first. They already count. However... the fact of the matter is new characters will always get in before certain veterans. Even if Dr. Mario got in, nobody would be cut before him. He'd be a last minute clone addition, and wouldn't even get first dibs of any clone. Roy would be there first, for starters.

Him being in would not hurt anyone's chances whatsoever. That's entirely baseless since new characters already took more priority over him in the first place, proving that false.

Warioware/Land contains separate characters that did not originate in the Mario series. They are an original series. Paper Mario features characters based on Mario characters and original characters. It is an original series.

I simply can't be convinced that Dr. Mario is its own unique, separate series when it has two minor games (good, but not near as expansively developed as Wario/Paper). I don't understand how you've decided the threshold between spinoff and original series. Dr. Mario features Mario and Peach in a puzzle game. It is its own series, but it isn't an original one like the ones you mentioned, because it didn't build original characters, it only featured Mario characters in a nonplayable, unsubstantial way.

And if what you're saying is that Dr. Mario is less "deserving" (don't like that word, but it is pretty succinct sometimes) than any new characters, then I would absolutely agree with you. The only instance in which I would see/want him returning is when we've exhausted all other options. And even then, I'd rather see him as a costume; Sakurai can change his mind, you know, and I would love for the good Doctor to be playable as a Mario costume. I don't think it's out of the realm of possibility (eventually) since Sakurai tends to say things that he may not end up sticking with, especially when it comes to characters.

Anyways, opinions are fun and all, but my fingers are tired from all this typing. So, I must say that I am finished. Unless your response intrigues me. Which it probably will.

 

[Diddy Kong]

GiantBreadBug... what about Sheik?

 

[Verde Coeden Scalesworth]

I meant a Clone in Smash terms.

And yeah, that's true, only clones were cut, whether because of a storyline or because they were just gameplay clones. That's funny.

I simply can't be convinced that Dr. Mario is its own unique, separate series when it has two minor games (good, but not near as expansively developed as Wario/Paper). I don't understand how you've decided the threshold between spinoff and original series. Dr. Mario features Mario and Peach in a puzzle game. It is its own series, but it isn't an original one like the ones you mentioned, because it didn't build original characters, it only featured Mario characters in a nonplayable, unsubstantial way.

It does not play anything close to the regular Mario series. It's gameplay is unique. It also has atleast 5 games in the series, and Paper Mario has less. It has a specific version of Mario that even got his own Metal Mario version. Not regular Metal Mario, but Metal Dr. Mario. It's unique. Also, by that logic, Paper Mario isn't unique either. It has a pretty small list of completely original characters, while the rest were just upgraded enemies.

And if what you're saying is that Dr. Mario is less "deserving" (don't like that word, but it is pretty succinct sometimes) than any new characters, then I would absolutely agree with you. The only instance in which I would see/want him returning is when we've exhausted all other options. And even then, I'd rather see him as a costume; Sakurai can change his mind, you know, and I would love for the good Doctor to be playable as a Mario costume. I don't think it's out of the realm of possibility (eventually) since Sakurai tends to say things that he may not end up sticking with, especially when it comes to characters.

Except for the fact that he didn't return in Brawl because Sakurai refused to make him a costume. This is the same reason why he's a separate character in Melee. Because he won't make him a costume. He's going to be his own guy, or not be in at all. His word is still law, and until he says otherwise, that's what it'll be. Sakurai indeed considers Dr. Mario his own completely different character, so why would that suddenly change?

You're banking on Sakurai doing something he explicitly said he won't do. That's silly and is a false premise. Dr. Mario won't prevent anyone from getting in. He'll most likely get in last minute. He won't be a costume. The first and last are pure facts as of right now. The second one is a maybe.

 

[Diddy Kong]

Mewtwo being cut is not funny at all. Actually.

 

[---]

Doc may be a stupid character, but it was his theme song that got him in.

 

[Bowserlick]

Make his Down B make him pull twin swords. Making his character even more diverse. 2 moveset in one character you know?

That neutral B is interesting. How long can you "play tennis" with it?

Yeah his Up B in Brawl is booty, you can hit Ganon out of it if he lands on you. It's pretty embarassing LOL

Not sure about the double swords. If Ghirahim does make it (which is not guaranteed), I believe he should get double swords along with a "high risk/ high reward based on reading the opponent" strategy.

 

[Metal Overlord]

Imagine a cinematic trailer for Smash somewhat like this:

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=-_2KHa0DyRo&feature=related

Except switch out those two for Mewtwo and Ganondorf

 

[Diddy Kong]

****ING YOUTUBE ADVERTISEMENTS....!!! Always interrupting my music... :/

Anyways, yes cinematic trailers before each fight would be awesome. But only when it's one vs one, and it's skipable.

 

[Metal Overlord]

I meant like trailers to hype up the game pre-release, not during the game, but that's a good idea, too

Of course they'd be skippable

 

[Diddy Kong]

Doc may be a stupid character, but it was his theme song that got him in.

Ok, this was in fact mildly amussing.

 

[Verde Coeden Scalesworth]

Doc may be a stupid character, but it was his theme song that got him in.

How can a Doctor be stupid.

 

[Metal Overlord]

Doc isn't stupid, meaniefaces

 

[GiantBreadbug]

I do like the Dr. Mario games, and I loooooooooooooooooooooooooove the music. More like the Main Theme and Chill in SSB4, please.

 

[Diddy Kong]

Never knew of him, and even Melee didn't get me interested.

 

[Bowserlick]

Really? Doctor Mario? Smash sequels take a long time to make. Don't we want new characters that offer flavor and new mechanics and new strategies? Arguing for Doctor Mario and Pichu (roster padders) does not make sense at this stage in the series to me.

 

[Metal Overlord]

Spoiler

Y'all know y'all want him