New Smash Bros for WiiU

[victinivcreate1]

How about no version exclusives.

with version exclusives, more characters can get in.

 

[PsychoIncarnate]

with version exclusives, more characters can get in.

Yeah, no

Let's not discuss version exclusives.

This kind of discussion is just going to end up with people adamantly, and mostly ignorantly, supporting their claim with no real discussion.

 

[Mario & Sonic Guy]

Well,

Spoiler

if Skyward Sword is anything to go by, it's very well possible that Toon Link and Link are technically one in the same. Same goes for Zelda and Toon Zelda, but perhaps those four are more comparable to carrying on superhero legacies than anything else.

Skyward Sword takes place before The Wind Waker though, which pretty much negates your theory.

 

[PsychoIncarnate]

Until we hear anything solid, I'm still going by the split timeline theory.

One Nintendo rep said the split timeline isn't real, but Nintendo have also had statements it is real.

The timeline splits after OoT, one being the future and the other being the past.

The future was left in ruins after ganondorf, and unable to rebuild itself. With the hero of time absent in that timeline (Since he returned to the past) and unable to reincarnate, Ganondorf returned and decimated that world. In turn the goddesses flooded the world to stop him. This is windwaker

Meanwhile in the past, Link returns and serves the Hyrule royal family until his death. Years later, Ganondorf returns. With Link having lived his life out in this timeline, the hero of time was able to properly reincarnate and defeat Ganondorf. This is twilight princess


Edit: Then again, I have never played Skyward Sword, LOL...It may have a theory breaking storyline

 

[Shorts]

Yet I still prefer the 3D Mario games (Sean Malstrom must be foaming at the mouth right now.).

i still think he stands a chance. IMO, a characters presence or absence does not affect a character so easily. Remember Gameplay > Relevance.

Of course I know this, I just think most people like to HOP on bandwagons. "Oh, not in the newest game? OUT."

Well then, it looks like THAT STATMENT Psycho made is strictly personal. One of my favorite Mario games is Sunshine, and I know a lot of people wouldn't agree with that. But the game wasn't bad.

I'm excited for the eventual NSMBWii level, and I may be excited for the Galaxy level... if it isn't absolute crap. I hope they tastefully execute the gimmick. I can see that NOT happening pretty easily though.

 

[Mario & Sonic Guy]

Until we hear anything solid, I'm still going by the split timeline theory.

One Nintendo rep said the split timeline isn't real, but Nintendo have also had statements it is real.

The timeline splits after OoT, one being the future and the other being the past.

The future was left in ruins after ganondorf, and unable to rebuild itself. With the hero of time absent in that timeline (Since he returned to the past) and unable to reincarnate, Ganondorf returned and decimated that world. In turn the goddesses flooded the world to stop him. This is windwaker

Meanwhile in the past, Link returns and serves the Hyrule royal family until his death. Years later, Ganondorf returns. With Link having lived his life out in this timeline, the hero of time was able to properly reincarnate and defeat Ganondorf. This is twilight princess


Edit: Then again, I have never played Skyward Sword, LOL...It may have a theory breaking storyline

Nice theory speech there. But from what I've heard, Skyward Sword took place before Ganondorf even existed, so it's probable that Skyward Sword came before Ocarina of Time.

 

[Diddy Kong]

Skyward Sword would in any time line be considered the origin, I heavily suggest you play it. It's... cool and stuff. And Link's a player in the game.

Spoiler

Disregard females, attain Gratitude Crystals

Also I don't think the Japanese hate DKC, they just didn't know how to handle the series proper. Which is infact no suprise, cause Nintendo doesn't really care too much about continunity and story.

 

[PsychoIncarnate]

Nice theory speech there. But from what I've heard, Skyward Sword took place before Ganondorf even existed, so it's probable that Skyward Sword came before Ocarina of Time.

I know that

I just don't see how Toon Link and Link can be the same person unless Skyward sword has some kind of special plot twist, since I've never played it.

They take place in alternate timelines where the hero of time never really existed in one of them and couldn't be reincarnated so a different person donned the costume of the hero of time and had to prove himself his heir to the goddesses themselves, while in the other timeline the hero was already worthy since he was just reincarnate to fulfill his unending purpose

 

[Mario & Sonic Guy]

I never played Skyward Sword myself either. But thanks to that game, it has been making me wonder if Skyward Sword Link got married during his adulthood, and that eventually lead to the birth of Ocarina of Time Link.

 

[Diddy Kong]

Mostly all Links are different incarations, but in a way the same person... Play Skyward Sword, it's very well described near the end of the game. Also Zelda and I guess Ganon's history is explained as well as the Triforce's.

The spirit of the hero / realisation thing is differently translated in each game. Which is logical... What point is there in living the exact same life over and over again? If I was Link I'd tell Faore, Din and Nayru to kill Ganon themselves.

 

[Big-Cat]

Skyward Sword takes place before The Wind Waker though, which pretty much negates your theory.

That's what I was getting at. Wind Waker, and to a lesser degree Twilight Princess, heavily imply that Link and Zelda are the same characters in each game. Or, at the very least, the torch is passed on to the next Link and Zelda. Zelda's

Spoiler

can easily be explained as all the descendents of Skyward Sword Zelda having the blood of Hylia in them so her powers are passed on to each generation.

Link

Spoiler

on the other hand is a mystery. There doesn't seem to be any indication that the Links are explicitly related to each other.

I don't understand why you and Psycho are arguing this when the one game that will explain everything is a game you haven't played yet.

 

[PsychoIncarnate]

Link from Wind waker definitely isn't the same Link, but the one from Twilight princess most likely is.

 

[Mario & Sonic Guy]

I forgot how good the DKC2 was though.

Why can't they make games like that these days?

They put more time, money and effort into games these days and still can't match the old school

That sounds just like what Cranky Kong would say about today's games. Punch-Out!! Wii is less difficult compared to the original, and it's all thanks to the ability to pause and restart matches (of course, Mac's Last Stand prevents you from doing this, which makes things more challenging).

 

[Claire Diviner]

Oh, I want to change the most important element of Smash. THE FREEZIE: While an opponent is frozen, they can be picked up and thrown like a barrel or crate. When thrown against a surface, the ice will shatter and the opponent will receive lots of damage.

Or just throw them off the stage to their death. Whichever's more convenient.

 

[Diddy Kong]

Link from Wind waker definitely isn't the same Link, but the one from Twilight princess most likely is.

Same one as who? The Link we have in Brawl?

 

[Big-Cat]

Link from Wind waker definitely isn't the same Link, but the one from Twilight princess most likely is.

You're thinking in way too literal terms here. I've only said that TECHNICALLY they're the same person. Note that the recent games have mentioned that the Link in each game is the hero chosen by the goddesses. Since Link and Zelda are mortal, this "title" is passed down over time.

IIRC, Wind Waker Link is OoT Link reincarnated and the same goes for Zelda. You also completely forgot about Majora's Mask where he may have stayed in Termina.

 

[PsychoIncarnate]

You're thinking in way too literal terms here. I've only said that TECHNICALLY they're the same person. Note that the recent games have mentioned that the Link in each game is the hero chosen by the goddesses. Since Link and Zelda are mortal, this "title" is passed down over time.

IIRC, Wind Waker Link is OoT Link reincarnated and the same goes for Zelda. You also completely forgot about Majora's Mask where he may have stayed in Termina.

At the end of OoT, Link returns to the past.

WW is the timeline of the future. There is no hero of time to be reincarnated there since he returned to the past. The plot of wind waker IS so because Link couldn't be reincarnated. That's why the world is flooded. That's why the new hero had to prove himself to the goddesses, and why his title isn't "Hero of Time", unlike in TP

Link never stayed in Termina in MM. He returned to Hyrule and served the royal family for until his death. TP takes place in the past where linked returned to, some generations after MM and the hero of time was reincarnated into TP Link

 

[Mario & Sonic Guy]

Link from Wind waker definitely isn't the same Link, but the one from Twilight princess most likely is.

It's hard to say how long it has been since Ganondorf was sent to the Twilight Realm in the past timeline. It could've been at a point where the Ocarina of Time Link passed on, and his descendant took the scene.

In fact, it's even possible that the Hero's Spirit from Twilight Princess is actually Ocarina of Time Link, during his times serving the Royal Family.

 

[Claire Diviner]

You're thinking in way too literal terms here. I've only said that TECHNICALLY they're the same person. Note that the recent games have mentioned that the Link in each game is the hero chosen by the goddesses. Since Link and Zelda are mortal, this "title" is passed down over time.

IIRC, Wind Waker Link is OoT Link reincarnated and the same goes for Zelda. You also completely forgot about Majora's Mask where he may have stayed in Termina.

There's a theory going that the MM Link returned to Hyrule to find that Ganon has taken over the place, resulting in the start of the original Legend of Zelda, and years later, Zelda 2. Of course, those are merely theories.

Also, I wouldn't think WW Link to be a reincarnation, as he had to completely learn how to wield the Master Sword and discover the Triforce of Courage, as he didn't have the said Triforce from the beginning... though I guess the same could be said of other Links, but this Link seems to imply he is not a descendant of any previous Link.

 

[PsychoIncarnate]

The generally accepted, and implied by nintendo, theory is the split timeline

Oot Future (Where there is no Link) - > WW

OoT Past (Link returns to) - > MM - > TP

from there it gets fuzzy

 

[Claire Diviner]

The generally accepted, and implied by nintendo, theory is the split timeline

Oot Future (Where there is no Link) - > WW

OoT Past (Link returns to) - > MM - > TP

from there it gets fuzzy

True. Some people believe TP to take place in the Future Timeline, sometime before WW. I don't know how that would be, since the ending of the game gives no lead-up to a flooded Hyrule, but it is implied to be the earliest time we see Ganondorf with that chin curtain, which he later has in WW... that, and we can also notice he was getting a little on the chubby side, until some point before WW (and maybe after TP) when he's in the void, he binge eats out of boredom and becomes the old fat guy we see in WW. Just a thought.

 

[Diddy Kong]

Yeah but in the Wind Waker the Triforce of Courage was cut in pieces, thus Link was unable to get it by normal means. Also, there was a Hero of Time before OoT Link, so it's still not 100% certain OoT comes exactly before Wind Waker I think? Of coarse it's heavily implied, but there is space for a middle of the road game. And in TP, Link isn't the Hero of Time. Not sure what title he has other than 'chosen hero', which should be enough actually...

And I agree with Mario & Sonic guy that the teacher of the sword techniques could easily be OoT Link. But, he's quite a lot taller than TP Link. I prefer that he's OoT Link after MM though, being a Stalfos and all. Also, the frustration that he couldn't defeat Ganon himself could have caused the spirit to wane and he could only find rest by teaching TP Link the sword techniques (as a sort of punishment by the God's even..? Poor Hero of Time).

Btw talking about the sword techniques, I really want them back in a new game!

Spoiler

I missed them a lot in Skyward Sword for sure.

 

[PsychoIncarnate]

Yeah but in the Wind Waker the Triforce of Courage was cut in pieces, thus Link was unable to get it by normal means. Also, there was a Hero of Time before OoT Link, so it's still not 100% certain OoT comes exactly before Wind Waker I think? Of coarse it's heavily implied, but there is space for a middle of the road game. And in TP, Link isn't the Hero of Time. Not sure what title he has other than 'chosen hero', which should be enough actually...

And I agree with Mario & Sonic guy that the teacher of the sword techniques could easily be OoT Link. But, he's quite a lot taller than TP Link. I prefer that he's OoT Link after MM though, being a Stalfos and all. Also, the frustration that he couldn't defeat Ganon himself could have caused the spirit to wane and he could only find rest by teaching TP Link the sword techniques.

Btw talking about the sword techniques, I really want them back in a new game!

Spoiler

I missed them a lot in Skyward Sword for sure.

Which game has Link called "The hero of Time" before OoT Link?

 

[Diddy Kong]

There was no game in which he was called Hero of Time, but soon after Link gained control over his adult body and encountered Sheik, she told him that he resembled the old Hero of Time a lot cause of the way he held the Master Sword and stuff. Which means there was of coarse another Hero of Time before him... And likely, it was another Link incaration. Just an unknown one. And I really hope Wii U Zelda- Link becomes that one.

 

[PsychoIncarnate]

I'm still going with WW being after adult timeline OoT, because it's the only way I see of it making sense.

The world is flooded in WW because Link wasn't reincarnated to stop Ganondorf after he returned to Hyrule. The only way I see this as happening is because Link travelled to the past, so he never lived on in that timeline.

The TP storyline doesn't make any sense except in the child storyline regardless...I don't think I need to defend on that one

 

[yani_]

So I watches the KI trailer.. It seems Medusa is too big

 

[Claire Diviner]

The world is flooded in WW because Link wasn't reincarnated to stop Ganondorf after he returned to Hyrule. The only way I see this as happening is because Link travelled to the past, so he never lived on in that timeline.

Wait, I thought Ganon escaped the void long after Hyrule flooded.

 

[PsychoIncarnate]

Wait, I thought Ganon escaped the void long after Hyrule flooded.

No, the story of WW is the goddesses acted when Link wasn't reincarnated and flooded the earth in an effort to stop him (Ganondorf)

 

[augustoflores]

But from what I've heard, Skyward Sword took place before Ganondorf even existed, so it's probable that Skyward Sword came before Ocarina of Time.

Skyward Sword most definitely took place before Ocarina of Time... it is an official statement from Eiji Aonuma that Skyward Sword is THE earliest point yet on the zelda timeline.

I just don't see how Toon Link and Link can be the same person unless Skyward sword has some kind of special plot twist, since I've never played it.

They take place in alternate timelines where the hero of time never really existed in one of them and couldn't be reincarnated so a different person donned the costume of the hero of time and had to prove himself his heir to the goddesses themselves, while in the other timeline the hero was already worthy since he was just reincarnate to fulfill his unending purpose

top half: Toon Link (as you refer to him as) is not within the reincarnation stream of the hero of time... he was a nobody... a commoner with courage. he had enough courage that rivaled the original hero. as the hero of winds, Toon Link began a new reincarnation stream not seen in hundreds of years. does this clear your doubt?
bottom half: well... the hero of time did exist in both (as technically, the timeline was one line)... but after the split when the future was left with no reincarnation stream... well you get the rest.

Link from Wind waker definitely isn't the same Link, but the one from Twilight princess most likely is.

Lol wut? define "same link". by Aonuma's definition, every Link is us... the player. as for TP Link, MM Link did not grow up to be TP Link nor do they have the same blood. as evidenced by the Triforce on the back of his hand, he is the reincarnation of MM Link at some unidentified point in the future of the young time line.

At the end of OoT, Link returns to the past.

WW is the timeline of the future. There is no hero of time to be reincarnated there since he returned to the past. The plot of wind waker IS so because Link couldn't be reincarnated. That's why the world is flooded. That's why the new hero had to prove himself to the goddesses, and why his title isn't "Hero of Time", unlike in TP

Link never stayed in Termina in MM. He returned to Hyrule and served the royal family for until his death. TP takes place in the past where linked returned to, some generations after MM and the hero of time was reincarnated into TP Link

well... im glad that i didn't have to correct anything here... good job mate.
and yes... the split timeline is official but Nintendo does not answer what goes where... in a file cabnet at the office of Nintendo, it shows exactly what goes where after the game is made. the game makers aren't allowed to see where in the timeline their game is being placed or else they might become influenced by it in development... and games are never usually made with a thought as to where in the timeline it falls, gameplay comes first... as it should.

now that i cleared some of this zelda timeline discussion... might i ask... what will you do with this conversation in regards to smash bros 4?

 

[Diddy Kong]

So I watches the KI trailer.. It seems Medusa is too big

She is. Also, shes' too 'jiggly' so she won't make it in.

Also Psycho Incarate: http://www.youtube.com/watch?feature=endscreen&NR=1&v=VP3XxCWpZgE pass to 5.30. From there it's all explained about the Hero of Time

Spoiler

(with Irish voice acting)

EDIT: This guy is awesome! Was just looking for how OoT 3DS looks like, and I found much more. I've played through OoT at least 5 times, but this guy makes it interessting again. Watch and have a laugh.
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=qW9C1uYhwS8&feature=relmfu

 

[augustoflores]

hmmm... massive...

~yes, quite.

 

[Aurane]

Yeah, no

Let's not discuss version exclusives.

This kind of discussion is just going to end up with people adamantly, and mostly ignorantly, supporting their claim with no real discussion.

._. My two cents: Don't be ignorant when you talk about it. Problem solved.

Link from Wind waker definitely isn't the same Link, but the one from Twilight princess most likely is.

I disagree... For many a-resons. I don't even think I have to get into it Lol

Or just throw them off the stage to their death. Whichever's more convenient.

Brawl 101: If you can't smash'em, throw'em.

KI talk is starting to rise... Gj, Chronobound

Also, New boss idea:

After listening to the song..
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=KcAfG0Sn-u4
I also watched the battle of Bowser VS Dark Bowser...
I APPROVE. Nuff said

 

[Mario & Sonic Guy]

So I watches the KI trailer.. It seems Medusa is too big

Being a goddess, Medusa can easily manipulate her size so that she appears to be gigantic. Palutena can easily pull off that same trick as well.

And yes I know that it's a sarcastic post. I'm just pointing out how stupid the "Ridley is too big" excuse is.

 

[Claire Diviner]

hmmm... massive...

~yes, quite.

Not gonna lie: I'd hit that... maybe both of em.

 

[PsychoIncarnate]

._. My two cents: Don't be ignorant when you talk about it. Problem solved.



I disagree... For many a-resons.



Brawl 101: If you can't smash'em, throw'em.

Well, excuse me for not having faith a discussion about a controversial topic that probably requires information on character data we don't have could possibly not turn ignorant in THIS thread.

Also, that zelda timeline just makes the most logical sense. The writers of the game aren't exactly deep thinkers into the storyline, they said themselves they just make a game and hope it fits somewhere.

 

[Claire Diviner]

Also, that zelda timeline just makes the most logical sense. The writers of the game aren't exactly deep thinkers into the storyline, they said themselves they just make a game and hope it fits somewhere.

That's what they want you to think. Don't you know the conspiracy? They have a timeline somewhere, but refuse to release it as to prolong the suffering of timeline theorists. Nintendo are indeed the king of trolls in the game world, and have been in the game since the 1980s.

 

[Aurane]

Well, excuse me for not having faith a discussion about a controversial topic that probably requires information on character data we don't have could possibly not turn ignorant in THIS thread.

Also, that zelda timeline just makes the most logical sense. The writers of the game aren't exactly deep thinkers into the storyline, they said themselves they just make a game and hope it fits somewhere.

1st para: Tsk tsk, this is a fourm to discuss such things.

2nd Para: I REALLY Hope your talking about just ONE game, and it depends on which one -_-

 

[Mario & Sonic Guy]

Also, New boss idea:

After listening to the song..
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=KcAfG0Sn-u4
I also watched the battle of Bowser VS Dark Bowser...
I APPROVE. Nuff said

I actually inputted Dark Bowser as an alternate outfit pick for Bowser. It doesn't affect Bowser's moveset though.

 

[Aurane]

I actually inputted Dark Bowser as an alternate outfit pick for Bowser. It doesn't affect Bowser's moveset though.

I do remember you saying something about Dark Bowser... I just heard of him today

So, I'm buying Star Fox 64 3DS. Bout time -_- Been waiting for money for awhile Lol

 

[PsychoIncarnate]

What's the point of having a secret timeline and using obscure things to link between them?

Just to laugh as fans try and connect the dots?