New Smash Bros for WiiU

[Johnknight1]

Toad definitely has a shot, given all of our information. He has been propelled into the conversation of being a possible newcomer, like most characters in the conversation, by giants like Meta Knight, King Dedede, Ike, Diddy Kong, Wario, Snake, and Sonic being already playable in smash. This has opened many doors to many characters.

Haven't really had a Smash dream (yet).

Most of my dreams about Super Smash Bros. from the far past to rather recent present deals with smash bros. games currently out, specifically Melee. I dream I am improving at Melee, or I dream of past matches that I remember vividly, often times playing out differently with different results (in other words, I actually win!).

Some of my recent dreams about smash bros have been about future smash bros. games. My most common dream is one where Ridley grabs Samus, and scrapes her alongside the walls of a stage, which in most of such dreams is Shadow Moses Island. This dream tends to change a lot with the details, though.

My other Smash 4 recurring dream always happens the same, minor details aside. A trailer is being shown at some Nintendo Press Conference. Sometimes, I am in the audience. Other times, I am watching on live stream or on TV. Describing it is long, but it would only take about 3 minutes real time at most (see hidden message below for more).

Spoiler

A video presentation is being shown by Nintendo. First, the Nintendo logo appears. Next, words about are written. Flashes of a scene are shown. although they are not clear. What is clear is that a major battle is going down in a destroyed city. Music slowly creeps in softly, yet it moves slowly. We are told of a time where humanity has only one hope, and its' hope is not necessarily human. The screen blanks. The music pauses. The camera changes its' focus. A quick blur is seen.

The camera changes directions, following that speeding blur. It moves, and suddenly a shining light glows from a unknown being. All at once, this music (0:45 on) starts BOOMING, the camera slowly pans up parts of said characters body, and then their whole body is visible! It is none other than THE MEGA MAN! The crowd cheers loudly at the announcement. Mega Man stands with one knee down atop a tall building, and then jumps down "into action." We see scenes of Mega Man dominating the roster (much like Sonic did in his confirmation trailer), and we see a number of unique moves.

We then see Mega Man land on the street level of this destroyed city. Dr. Wily is in one of his flying robots (think like his classic original Mega Man robot thing). Sonic and Mario are fighting Dr. Wily, but are getting beat badly. Dr. Wily just has too much firepower for them to handle. Mega Man sees this, and decides to take matters into his own hands.

Mega Man fires a fully charge Mega Buster blast at an unsuspecting Dr. Wily robot, stunning him. Dr. Wily realizes it was from Mega Man. Dr. Wily then yells "Take this Mega Man!" as he fires a barrage of missiles at Mega Man. Mega Man dodges around the missiles swiftly as he rushes towards Dr. Wily's robot. Mega Man gets out his Zero Sword, and slashes up a storm on Dr. Wily's robot.

Dr. Wily then presses a button, which launches an extendable fist from his robot at Mega Man. Mega Man slides under the attack with his slide tackle, and slide tackles into Dr. Wily's robot followed up by a huge punch on it. The robot then has a crack in the glass, and smoke is coming out from it. Dr. Wily, angered by his apparent defeat, flees. Sonic and Mario smile in the distance. Mega Man then lowers his guards and turns to them.

However, Dr. Wily's robot then turns around, and charges up a super blast at a seemingly unaware Mega Man. Sonic and Mario try to warn him. Yet it is too late. Where Mega Man stood is only a giant beam. Dr. Wily laughs at his victory over his longtime foe! THIS IS IT!" someone yells from above! Dr. Wily turns up, to see Mega Man atop Rush. Mega Man then launches Final Smash at Dr. Wily (which changes from dream to dream). Dr. Wily's robot blows up as Dr. Wily escapes via his escape pod. Dr. Wily is visibly upset at yelling at Mega Man as his escape pod floats into the distance.

We then see Mario and Sonic turn to Mega Man. "The fight has just begun" Mega Man says, as he hops atop of rush, and glides off into the distance to face his next challenge. The Smash Bros. Title then appears, along with a picture of each character confirmed so far, and a release date (whether just a year, month, or exact date).

Honestly, I have some ridiculous beyond belief dreams! But if that last one were real, it would rock-MAN!!! Who wouldn't be hyped after such an epic trailer=???

 

[Berserker.]

I don't know what you're listing there, because your edits caused you to go off on a tangent

Donkey Kong got his own private island with a wonderful wooden treehouse where he could live his own live. Depending on which cannon you go by, he grew old with his family of kongs and his animal buddies, and became cranky (literally) in his old age.

I'm an edit***** :D

SEE. He got his reward for such an amazing job. Now... He has gained immortality and will never age/die of age from his current age as of now.

 

[Kantrip]

Unlike a mere petty school teacher such as Wrinkly Kong.

 

[Berserker.]

Who died if my memory serves right

@John: Looks like I'm not the only edit***** here :U

Thank God Crimson posted. If he didn't, I'd have to edit my post which is what I'm doing right now. Oh ****

 

[Johnknight1]

Are we headed into "Is Cranky Kong the original Donkey Kong?", "Is Donkey Kong Jr. the current Donkey Kong", or "Is Cranky Kong Donkey Kong's Father or Grandfather" arguments=??? Because if we aren't, I'm heading them there now!

Also, is it me, or does it seem like Donkey Kong is adopted=??? Seriously, his dad/grandfather Cranky Kong is a monkey, his mother/grandmother Wrinkly Kong is a monkey, his nephew Diddy Kong is a monkey, and his love interest Candy is a monkey. Yet, Donkey Kong is a gorilla. The other Kong gorillas include Kiddy Kong and Chunky Kong (who ironically are brothers and cousins of sisters Tiny Kong and Dixie Kong, who are both monkeys), Funky Kong, Swanky Kong, and a few less significant Kongs. and Unless there is some serious Kong gene mutations, something is seriously messed up on Donkey Kong Island. Seriously, where did (the current) Donkey Kong come from, the Kong Island Stork=???

@ berserker
I don't like in editing hell like you do.

 

[Kantrip]

Actually most of the kongs are various different species and it is physically impossible for them to all be related if they mate in the traditional fashion.

It's a good thing they don't. I'm not going to spill the details, but let's just say the truth explains the whole grandfather/father/uncle mishap between modern Cranky and modern Donkey.

 

[Berserker.]

Yeah. At least you don't edit.... er... 5 or 6 times.

There's a secret lab of umbrella that mutates humans into monkeys or gorillas. Albert Wesker is in charge of it btw. This is my theory though and it's the only thing I can think of.

Expect 2 or 3 more edits here

Edit 2 :
[collapse=Donkey Kong]Forward B - Kong roll

Donkey Kong rolls forward (Travels 2 stage builder blocks) dealing 12% damage. This move can be auto cancelled into another attack.

Downward B - Ground pound

If you hold B instead of tapping it, Donkey Kong will start glowing. Release B then Donkey Kong will pound on the ground causing a HUGE shockwave. If the enemy is near or directly hit, they take 30% damage. If the enemy is far, they will inevitably be knocked back/away by the stage wide shockwave taking no damage. YES. This even pushes air dodgers.[/collapse]
[collapse=Diddy Kong]Neutral B - Peanut popgun

Much more spammable but it only deals 4% damage. Has some bouncy physics.

Upward B - Jetpack

Simply click up B to enter jetpack mode or input up B again to stop flying. You can do your aerials and specials while flying. This lasts for 3 seconds.

Downward B - Partner swap (Option 1)

Switches to Dixie[/collapse]
3rd edit for spelling error

4th edit for some editing (Duh)

 

[Johnknight1]

I'm pretty sure the Kong Island mutation and debacle is related to the government test center for all kinds of animals on a small island off Japan. The whol issue was created by the aftermaths of the two atomic bomb dropped on Japan. After that, all kinds of mutant crocodiles, monkeys, gorillas, orangutangs, beavers, swordfish, rhinos, hippos, pigs, and other creatures intermixed. Yet the offspring could only be one of said parent's species due to mutation, yet also due to mutation could have abilities of the other parent's species. The mutations further continued, and furthered to be even more mutated than before. At first it was gorillas making love to a monkey, in which the monkey gave birth to a gorilla, with the speed and reflexes of a monkey. 50 years later it became a monkey making love to a monkey, in which the second monkey gave birth to a gorilla.

Along with these mutations, changes, and developed intelligence, there was madness. About 40 or so years after the initial incident it was just the gorillas hating on the humans who took their babies, or the gorillas taking the human women to mate with them. This lasted until the only human the gorillas hated was the bug spray kid, because that bug spray seriously gave them an allergic reaction. About 10 years later, the crocodiles felt they were superior to the other species, and left Kong Island. The island and subsequent neighbor islands have since then all kinds of crazy animals, insanely mutated animals, warfare, and even technological and educational skills and understanding develop at an extremely fast rate.

Some people even say that the government continues to intervene by adding all kinds of fairies, tiki tribesmen, American pop culture of the 80's, 90's, and today (and all radio stations that use such a phrases!), gunpowder, and the dreaded VHS systems and boom boxes to see what results it will get. The government also put in an unruly crocodile with multiple personality disorder that thinks he is brother to multiple forms of himself as a further social experiment for their little "project." Yet again, we have found something else that is related to government conspiracies. Of course, which government am I talking about=??? None other than the Martian government of secret aliens from Venus who formerly lived on Mercury of course!

I think I pretty niftily told the history of Donkey Kong. And let me guess.... nobody here wants to follow this epic post! Any ways, I'm out! See ya'!

 

[Big-Cat]

Ok, Ghirahim now seems like a mix of Lambda-11 and Virgil.

I'm now on the final boss, but it's been a long day so I'm gonna finish it in the morning.

 

[Berserker.]

I'm pretty sure the Kong Island mutation and debacle is related to the government test center for all kinds of animals on a small island off Japan. The whol issue was created by the aftermaths of the two atomic bomb dropped on Japan. After that, all kinds of mutant crocodiles, monkeys, gorillas, orangutangs, beavers, swordfish, rhinos, hippos, pigs, and other creatures intermixed. Yet the offspring could only be one of said parent's species due to mutation, yet also due to mutation could have abilities of the other parent's species. The mutations further continued, and furthered to be even more mutated than before. At first it was gorillas making love to a monkey, in which the monkey gave birth to a gorilla, with the speed and reflexes of a monkey. 50 years later it became a monkey making love to a monkey, in which the second monkey gave birth to a gorilla.

Along with these mutations, changes, and developed intelligence, there was madness. About 40 or so years after the initial incident it was just the gorillas hating on the humans who took their babies, or the gorillas taking the human women to mate with them. This lasted until the only human the gorillas hated was the bug spray kid, because that bug spray seriously gave them an allergic reaction. About 10 years later, the crocodiles felt they were superior to the other species, and left Kong Island. The island and subsequent neighbor islands have since then all kinds of crazy animals, insanely mutated animals, warfare, and even technological and educational skills and understanding develop at an extremely fast rate.

Some people even say that the government continues to intervene by adding all kinds of fairies, tiki tribesmen, American pop culture of the 80's, 90's, and today (and all radio stations that use such a phrases!), gunpowder, and the dreaded VHS systems and boom boxes to see what results it will get. The government also put in an unruly crocodile with multiple personality disorder that thinks he is brother to multiple forms of himself as a further social experiment for their little "project." Yet again, we have found something else that is related to government conspiracies. Of course, which government am I talking about=??? None other than the Martian government of secret aliens from Venus who formerly lived on Mercury of course!

I think I pretty niftily told the history of Donkey Kong. And let me guess.... nobody here wants to follow this epic post! Any ways, I'm out! See ya'!

This

Ok, Ghirahim now seems like a mix of Lambda-11 and Virgil.

I'm now on the final boss, but it's been a long day so I'm gonna finish it in the morning.

and this

Anyone have comments regarding the DK duo revamps? Off for now again

 

[Big-Cat]

Well, I've cleared Skyward Sword (save for the sidequests), and I have a some things to say about what this game means for the Zelda characters in Smash. Warning, everything that I say will contain MASSIVE END GAME SPOILERS.

[COLLAPSE="MASSIVE SPOILERS"]Here's where I stand on the characters, Ghirahim, Impa, and Demise.

Ghirahim aka Debbie

Debbie is a sword spirit, much like Fi. In fact, his true form is something very similar to Fi. I love the character, and I would love to see him return in future titles, perhaps being the spiritual successor of Vaati. I doubt that his death in Skyward Sword will affect his inclusion since that's never been an explicit requirement.

Gameplay wise, I can see his moveset having a large emphasis on his daggers and teleports along with a Super Smash/Final Smash that has him in his true form.

Impa

IMO, Impa should be in. She would easily succeed Sheik considering they're both Sheikah. It would also for Zelda and Impa/Sheik to be fully separate characters, giving them a Down B move finally.

The only thing that makes me curious is that if they use Skyward Sword Zelda characters, where does Impa fit in this? Turns out that the Impa we've seen before release was actually her in the past. The old woman you meet early in the game is actually her and she died at the end (willingly mind you, not suicide). Probably doesn't mean much though as like Link and Zelda, there have been multiple incarnations of her throughout the series so she can be a Composite Character.

The other options are that Sheik is an alt. for Impa, meaning we get some fanservice, or we get an Impa alt. for Sheik. Either way, everyone wins as long as you aren't too picky.

Demise

Demise will probably never be playable. Well, technically. Ganondorf is the very embodiment of Demise's hate as hinted in the ending (and thereby confirming that a timeline exists). I think it would be the best thing ever that Ganondorf got a Demise alt.

The only thing I'm left curious about is Zelda's attire in Sm4sh. I thought she'd have something more regal at the end of the game, but the white gown is the closest thing to royalty (if you can call it that) she wears in the game.
[/COLLAPSE]

 

[Berserker.]

Zelda = SS outfit I think....

MEH. I'm fine with both. Maybe it should be her alt. costume

[collapse=Meta Knight]Neutral B - Mach Tornado

Low priority and lower damage (1% per hit)

Forward B - Drill rush

Low priority but it has a faster start up plus he's not helpless after which means you can follow up another move. He can't do the same move again after so you have to reset it by landing on the ground.

Downward B - Dimensional cape

Faster start up, quicker hit box pop up and ending. This also travels farther than usual.

Upward B - Shuttle loop

Lower priority, no invincibility, set knockback.

All normals

Lower priority, lower KO potential

Down air - Downward slash

Longer start up but it can meteor smash. Most of the time, it ground bounces

Dash attack - Tackle

The only attack with high priority and at least below decent KO potential. You can cancel the hit with another attack except for dash attack[/collapse]

 

[Diddy Kong]

Spoiler

Imo just BECAUSE Impa is from the past she would fit in perfectly. Even if the other Zelda characters aren't from Skyward Sword in Smash 4. Her role would still remain the same, as Zelda's protector. This is why I like the idea so much. Ad you could always imply that she used the Time Gate in the Distant Past to protect Zelda's newer incarnation. If Twilight Princess Zelda can somehow still transform in Sheik, this should be no problem at all. Cause this would actually be explained story wise.

And yes, Donkey Kong as we know is heavily implied to be DK Jr. from way back. Cranky IS arcade DK. Ever since DKC he's been breaking the 4th wall, complaining about the very games graphics, bonus rooms, and how he would complete it even without extra lifes. He also called DK lazy, and said that when he was young he was constantly kidnapping maidens and such. Mario himself is never mentioned by him though. But he is Diddy's biggest competitor in collecting the golden DK Coins in DKC2 (after Yoshi, and Link lol).

 

[Oasis_S]

Really hope Zelda wears the nice pink outfit and not the boring white one.

 

[Diddy Kong]

On the DK character revamps, I like your idea for the Ground Slap. The rest I also agree with cause I came up with the same ideas. People just don't reply to my moveset ideas mostly... >_>

Spoiler

Zelda should wear white, cause its the outfit of the Goddess Hylia, and she is her incarnation.

Also, the idea of Zelda using light arrows for B is good. Nayru's Love should be her new down B.

 

[Oasis_S]

Stop wearing a boring white dress, stop having a boring Smash.

 

[Berserker.]

This is my revamp for Zelda
[collapse=Zelda]Neutral B - Nayru's Love

Faster start up and faster recovery

Forward B - Din's fire

Pretty much like P:M EXCEPT...... After releasing the B button for um... controlling the fire ball, there's a small window for a follow up:

Click B once to make the fireball disperse into smaller fire balls. There's also another small window for one last follow up

Click B again to make the small fireballs quickly turn into fire beams then quickly track the opponent. Something like Wright's cellphone projectile

Downward B - Triforce trap

Lays a Triforce on the ground, anyone flying over it will be struck by a pillar of light. Deadly at higher percentages and a nasty Din's Fire setup.

Upward B - Farore's wind

Faster in general[/collapse]
TIME FOR..... STUFF INVOLVING SAKURAI

Spoiler

*Clap**Clap**Clap**Clap**Clap**Clap**Clap**Clap**Clap**Clap*

Toad's getting in! I'm sure of it!

ALSO RIDLEY! I think Ridley is more likely than him!

I think Mario is getting in Smash 4

*Blabber**Blabber*

So dur expectign Taod, Ridely, Saik (Insert likely candidates) Heh?

Trololol. I no wut 2 do

10 years later

WHAT'S TAKING SO LONG

I pursent, Super smash burthus univeeeeres

Shows Kirby fighting Goomba, Link fighting Metroid, Samus fighting generic enemy in sin and punishment. Does not show Mario.

Btw, Mario was removed

FUUUUUUUU---

The end

 

[Conviction]

@SSBF: There are better sales the day/week after black friday because they are trying to get rid of what wasn't taken.

Like at my mall things were 60% yesterday but they are 80% off now.

 

[Metal Overlord]

I was just thinking, Doc doesn't absolutely have to be a full-fledged clone of Mario.

He could play on the doctor stereotype...

 

[Diddy Kong]

Nah, Paper Mario if anything. Dr.Mario was added so that they could use his music >_> He was litterally filling up the roster. Was that neccecary? Weren't Meta Knight, Diddy Kong, Wario or King DeDeDe far more deserving? You answer those questions.

 

[Berserker.]

You mean using medicines to heal, injections to debuff or something? Then I'd like that. I'm pretty much open to unique fighters

 

[Metal Overlord]

@Diddy Kong- Blegh. deserving

@berserker- Yup, basically

 

[Berserker.]

Paper Mario would be unique too. He's number 3 in my list of unique characters however, I can't deny that he's still clone material since he IS Mario. The model and design though will just make it harder for Sakurai. I'm just hoping he's not a clone, semi clone or a hammer user (Since Dedede takes that role).

Everyone would be unique. Toad could be an all new lightning grappler in reference to Wario Woods, Super Mario Bros. 2 and New Super Mario Bros. Wii. Jr. can be an offensive/defensive set up character using his paint brush in reference to Mario Sunshine. Saki could be a projectile rush down character in reference to the gameplay of sin and punishment. Anyone can be unique if you think about it. It all depends on execution

 

[Conviction]

OMG! I had the best Idea for Link!

Key
Uair: Up Air
Dair: Down Air
Fair: Foward Air
Bair: Back Air
Ftilt: Foward Tilt
Utilt: Up Tilt
Dtilt: Down Tilt

[COLLAPSE="Amazing Link Moveset Revamp"]
Fair - The Vertical Spin Slash he does in Skyward Sword
Uair - A strong upwards strike that resembles his Utilt
Jabs - Rapid and fast like in Skyward Sword each jab does about 3% and slowly decreases to 1%
Ftilt: Thrust, this has 2 pros over the last Ftilt link usually has,
1) It would be faster
2) Since he is extending his arm out foward he will get more range out of it
Down B: Weapon Change (almost instant)
Zair: LadyBug thing, fires in a straight line. Grips the opponent for a good 10 frames. Doesn't grab through shields though. Good for following up or edgeguarding.

Default Weapon: Sword&Return of the Boomerang
Neutral B: Skyward Strike, you can aim at 3 or 9 angle with this move too. Chargable, while charging you can cancel it by jumping, shielding, spotdodging, or rolling.
Side B: Boomerang
Up B: Link does his normal Up B has had in Smash but the twist is, in the initial frame of his spin his boomerang flies out in the direction his heading. So even though link with still have his crappy vertical gain, he will have something covering him. (On the downside it would make this recovery even more vulnerable to characters with reflectors)

Weapon Change 1:Arrows
Neutral B: The Normal Standstill Arrow Charge and Shoot
Side B: Link rapidly fires 5 arrows in front of him (little start up lag but noticable ending lag)
Up B: Link Tethers a rope to an arrow and shoots for the ledge.

Weapon Change 2:Bombs
Neutral B: Draw a Bomb
Side B: (If a bomb is already in hand you just roll it) Link rapidly grabs two bombs rolls one and then throws the other (Amazing zoning move)
Up B: (The most dangerous) Link detonates a bomb on himself causing a large knockback so he can reach the stage, you won't fall into a helpless state but won't be able to use Up B again until landing on stage. This move causes 5% to Link and anyone around him. I guess you could use this as a Mid risk-mid reward move on stage when trying to avoid juggling traps or trying to follow someone in the air.

Weapon Change 3:Double Clawshot
Neutral B: Command Grab, fires one of his clawshots to grab you, if he misses with the first he sheaths his sword and fires the other clawshot to grab you. Usable in the air and has small landing lag if used in the air (about 5 frames, think of his Zair). Has tremendous ending lag on the ground though. (about a whole 60 frames) High-risk-Mid-Reward on the ground, Low-Risk-High-Reward in the air.
Side B: Fires a clawshot that sends you flying. Also Tethers to the ledge if recovering! (Think Zero Suit Samus)
Up B: Fires Clawshot upwards to tether the ledge. If an opponent is grabbing the ledge Link will grab both clawshots, use one to throw the opponent off the ledge (low knockback and damage) and use the other to tether the ledge. If the ledge wad free to start out with, Link can grab the ledge with one clawshot, press up b again, and link with swing in a semi circle back onstage, half through he will switch clawshots to regrab the ledge so he won't fly off (got to keep it somewhat realistic). During the clawshot change when he is most vulnerable to enemy edgegaurding. If you decide not to semi-circle up you can just do like regular tethers and recline back to ledge. This move is basically useless on stage. All link will do is fire on clawshot up and it will throw and opponent it touches, very low knockback, think of the Roy effect where even his moves were punishable on hit.
[/COLLAPSE]

That was probably the most thought I put into a moveset. I think it came out nicely. I could add exact percents and frames later if anyone would like.

 

[Berserker.]

Holy ****

This is awesome. Link practically is like Dante except he has no follow up after special/standard but that doesn't matter. Good stuff Iblis.

 

[Conviction]

Thanks, I might add movesets one of things i commonly do in here besides debating and derping, I mean getting off topic.

EDIT: I've given Link a new Zair now.

 

[Berserker.]

Don't worry about derping. Don't be ashamed just like me and Crimson
[collapse=Snake 2.0]Neutral B - Grenade

Leaves a puddle of flames. If it explodes in the air, the flames fall to the ground.

Forward B - NIKITA

Now tracks the opponent by itself. You don't control it. The travel speed is a bit faster. Mash the button to fire a maximum of 3 missiles.

Down taunt - Active camo

Snake activates his active camo rendering him invisible. EVERY visual effect, sound effect, model of his attacks and animations are NOT SEEN OR HEARD. You might be thinking of using bidirectional attacks.... Snake's dodges and his walk or dash speed is tremendously fast (As fast as Sheik). The Snake player can know when he's dodging when his GC controller vibrates or if his Wii U controller vibrates. Once he attacks/grabs/gets attacked by the enemy, the camo disappears. You have to wait for 3-4 seconds to use it again.

Backward throw - Smack down

Snake puts the enemy behind him and smashes him on the ground dealing 12% damage. This is great for tech chases since it leaves the enemy on the ground plus it does not have any sort of knockback.[/collapse]

 

[Conviction]

I don't I just I need something to do in here to keep me from getting bored.

I get tired of debating the same rung out topics that not surprisingly, the same people bring up with the same outdated argument, that I thought either I or someone else had already rebuttal in a clear and effective way.

I'm about to make a new moveset again. I just got to look around for some inspiration again.

EDIT: I like it Beserk. Especially the new side B. Ever thought of making his Up B detonatable? Would be a little cool effect for reversing those edgeguarding from above.

 

[Berserker.]

I'm pretty much getting tired of the toad debate and other things like Ganondorf not being in Smash 4. It's gonna get rough for me in the Top Roster Candidate competition.

My inspiration is pretty much UMvC 3. Not that I copy some stuff from it (Maybe some but with a twist so that it won't be like the move)

 

[Diddy Kong]

Snake is already overpowered, do you think he needs buffs? He's also way, way, waayyy too heavy. He should be middle weight, or a tad heavier if anything. Same weight as Link, but lighter than Ike is now.

And Metal Overlord, yes, deserving.

 

[Berserker.]

Snake is already overpowered, do you think he needs buffs? He's also way, way, waayyy too heavy. He should be middle weight, or a tad heavier if anything. Same weight as Link, but lighter than Ike is now.

And Metal Overlord, yes, deserving.

Lol at Snake being OP when Diddy is better than him (Based on match ups and tournament results). Snake isn't OP. He lacks good aerial options, recovery options and some other things I forgot. Snake isn't even near OP. Plus, Snake's metagame is pretty much dead sooo.... ****

Oh and he's also outcamped by Olimar and his projectiles are destroyed by Fox and Falco's lasers.

 

[Conviction]

Snake's far from OP....he is very lacking in the air.

When Snake gets transcendent grenades and an all around good aerial game. I'll start complaining.

 

[Berserker.]

Get ready for a surprise.....

 

[Diddy Kong]

He's still a great deal better than most characters, thus, overpowered. Simple as that. Yes Diddy is better than him, but I did suggest that he changes as well. But imo, Diddy's biggest advantage are his Bananas, without them, Snake is better. Thus as a designed character, Snake is more overpowered. With his options he doesn't even need to be in the air... >_> And it's not like his 'limited' recovery options aren't still way much better than others either. He easily covers as much distance with it as Zelda's Up B. And her recovery is one of her best aspects. Thus, overpowered.

Anyways, I'm up for invisibility for him if they nerf his weight and insane priority.

Also like the idea for Link having a weapon change option, but I still want my aimable Arrows. Think in the way how you can change directions with Charizard and Bowser's flame breath. Also, AA> tilt A moves, like his F Smash, but weaker. A combo that can do up to 15% easily. Similary to Marth's Dancing Blade, but not 5 hits, rather 3. Mediocore knockback, but good range, damage and speed.

 

[Berserker.]

He's easily edgeguarded by 3/4 OF THE CAST and aerial rush downs can deal with him. Most notably Wario. He has a lot of 50:50 to 60:40 match ups as of now. Also then again 1/2 or 2/3 of the cast outdo him in the air

.... Also, Zelda's recovery is one of her worst aspects actually.

 

[Diddy Kong]

It's not like he dies easily anyway. And his Up Tilt will keep most out of the air anyway. Exeptions might be Wario yes, cause he's so small and fast in the air. But he is overpowered in his own way.

Zelda's recovery is slow, but still covers up a lot of distance.

 

[Conviction]

Zelda's Recovery sucks. It's her range and defense that keeps her from being absolute garbage (even though she already is)

How does better than most of the cast overpowered??? That's called high tier vs lower tiers. He isn't Metaknight LOL.

Bananas are part of Diddy's character design...and you are telling me Snake won't ever be put into the air? I'm a mid-level player and I already know that's false. I can and have juggled Snakes for a good 80%. Snake is lacking in areas and you can't deny that. It's not like he is MK, where every option has 59qi49048i048q90r894r804 options to cover another.

WUT DE HEULL? Wario overpowered too? The vibe I'm getting from you is that, if one character is better than another that auto-deems the better character overpowered. Is Jigglypuff overpowered compared to Link? Is Peach overpowered compared to Sonic?

Your line of overpowered is so subjective the only way to fix it is to live in the ideal world. And we all know the ideal world of Smash will never happen.

Spoiler

On the bright side this is an argument I haven't ever seen in this thread.

 

[Berserker.]

It's not like he dies easily anyway. And his Up Tilt will keep most out of the air anyway. Exeptions might be Wario yes, cause he's so small and fast in the air. But he is overpowered in his own way.

Zelda's recovery is slow, but still covers up a lot of distance.

NOOOOOOOOPE.

It's punishable if it misses <--- Fun fact. Wario is OP watnow?

@IMPOSSIBRU: LOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOL

 

[Conviction]

Fox can unshield, Dash Usmash if Snake Utilts Fox's shield.

 

[Berserker.]

^^^^^ This