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New recorded matches. Critique/Advice needed

Stos

Loves Pink Poodles
Joined
Mar 3, 2006
Messages
342
Location
1<3TO
Recorded July 18th 2009.

SSBM Audio wasnt recorded so no audio but it was replace with songs (well some are) but yeah I recommend using your own music.

I really need your help and advice. Thanks in advance.

Stos (Link) vs. KirbyKaze (Fox) - 3 games. Ignore the youtube titles.

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=fXmcGe0vn2Q
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=ZcJRS9Aq3R0&feature=channel_page

Stos (Link) vs. KirbyKaze (Sheik) - 3 games.
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=3MXq7LfIQLg&feature=channel
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=j4RbHV9Lqiw&feature=channel
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=XwxisJrUC18&feature=channel



I got destroyed, watch Ganon with "RNSM" tag: http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=W_G9gNMX3JQ&feature=channel_page#t=2m01s
 

Spife

Smash Master
Joined
Sep 15, 2007
Messages
3,016
Location
Neriak
I just watched 10 seconds into the first one and noticed you picked Link.
Stop doing that.

...
okay..I think I know what your problem is Social Studies (I assume that's what Sots or sost or what ever your name is....er I assume thats what your name stands for). Okay, you're sucking, and you need to stop :D


I'll watch later mang.
 

Skler

Smash Master
Joined
Mar 17, 2006
Messages
4,514
Location
On top of Milktea
You had such an amazing arrow edgehog on pokemon stadium, and it led into the most hilarious spin spike ever.

First thing I noticed during the Fox match was you move a lot without a purpose. It looks like you're moving just for the sake of moving.

When Fox is doing something like FJ nairs as early as he was you can just plan out grabs or utilts for whenever he lands. FJ nairs are one of the few things Link can punish consistently against a character like Fox if spammed.

Sheik is a completely different matchup than anything. You want to get hit a lot. Get hit and hold down the entire time, you'll eat fairs, ftilts, dtilts, utilts and dsmashes but you'll be able to smack her back every time. Link smacks Sheik harder than Sheik smacks Link (or at least Link can take getting smacked better). Sheik loses a stock as soon as you make her upB above 70%, Link survives everything Sheik can throw at him and is tough to survive being put the stage 100% (unless stupid stuff happens, which Sheik can do). That's a longwinded way of saying CC all the time. Don't be afraid of getting CGed unless you're on a stage like FD or DL64. Once she starts approaching with grabs you just stab her in the face every time she runs at you.

Your DI needs a little work, but it's really hard against Sheik because all her attacks are so **** fast.

Never ever ever ever ever be in a position where Sheik can shieldgrab you. The only moves you should be doing on her shield are extremely well spaced nairs and fairs or crossovers. Bair can also work, but it's a fickle thing that can get shieldgrabbed sometimes (and sometimes hits them when they try it for some reason).

You do it right on FD where getting grabbed usually = death by spacing fairs all day.

Sometimes you throw projectiles when you're too close to people, but that's just something Link players do every once in a while.

Edit: I double posted, please forgive me Mr. Samich!
 

Stos

Loves Pink Poodles
Joined
Mar 3, 2006
Messages
342
Location
1<3TO
thanks a lot skler.

It seems scary CCing a Sheik with Link. I'll have to work on it.
 

Skler

Smash Master
Joined
Mar 17, 2006
Messages
4,514
Location
On top of Milktea
It is scary, but you get used to it. You aren't necessarily CCing, you're just sitting there and dsmashing/jabbing/utilting (if she jumped) when she runs at you while holding down. If she hits you hard at higher %s you'll just end up teching the floor and if she hits you with anything less than a fair or grab she'll probably end up eating dsmash.
 

Bummerz

Smash Apprentice
Joined
Jul 8, 2008
Messages
96
after reading skler's post i see how pointless movement can be dangerous. i find myself throwing bombs up in the air and catching them for no aparent reason after i take a stock off my opponent leaving myself open for punishment. so first point: eliminate A.D.D.

link can live for a long time so make the best out of yor recovery and DI. be cautious of lame gimps by fox shines or nair ect. by other characters while useing hookshot recovey (we all know its comeing). mix it up which youre doing quite well but still leaning more tword the hookshot instead of your up b.

reading youre doing prety well i like it, combo... you know yor stuff.

knowing your match up is always important im not going to break u about that. i do tend to cc alot vs shiek just to jump on what skler said (it was prety nasty shiek tough just blame the tiers if all else fails)

last thing to add... carefull about punishable moves... grab, dair, up b outa shield ect ect.... carefull with them. the good thing about link is that people arnt use to playing agiants him. but play aganints someone who does and you might be left with an extra hole to poop with. i noticed vs fox you did quite a few up-b out of shield. and this brought up something to my attention specialy cause it was fox. CAREFULL with it. i played a link this past weekend and i dcided to use fox (after takeing it, you want to give it some times okay) so i baited out some moves i.e. baited out grabs and up b's tomake this short. be CAREFULL

sick link though... its prolly cause youre filipino
 

worldjem7

Smash Ace
Joined
Oct 10, 2006
Messages
981
Location
Canada
I know little to nothing about Link so the most advice I could give is just basic stuff.

Fox game 1
There wasn't much you could do there honestly that I could see, but I don't play link so i don't know what he can do. Fox was just spamming Full hop nair and it was winning. You're probably going to want to try and space your nair since it has more range so it would eat through his. Your mobility left something to be desire, but being link I don't know how fast he can go.
Skler is right pointless movement gets you killed so you just have to try moving quickly but usefully.

Fox game 2
Try paying more attention to where your opponent is moving. You threw a bomb way over his head at the start of the game and seemed to be trying to make moves hit him somehow by throwing them out when he was in your general vicinity. Also, try to use safer moves than U-smash or D-smash when pressuring him because these got you punished almost every time.
Nair, Bair, and situationally, Fair would be your safest aerials, so you'll want to use these a lot which you were in the ending half of the game.

Fox game 3
It seemed like because he was trying to approach, you wanted him to run into your moves. This won't work in general and especially not on Fox since he's fast enough to get out of the way. Once Fox saw this he started camping you. Don't really know what to say about the rest of the game.

Sheik
All I can say is, CC her moves at low % and punish, and DI away from her when she's combo'ing you.

Hope it helped.
 

ppig

Smash Journeyman
Joined
Sep 1, 2008
Messages
258
Location
red deer
its hard to critique someone that is better then u but all i have to say is u seem to want to get away as fast as u can from shiek.

thier are some times were u could have really punished shiek with a dair but you try and make space for your self and shiek just runs and gets u again.

also i donno correct me if im wrong but is it bad to use your second jump and boomrange it just leaves so much time for that person to jump up and fair you it would be better spent on another nair.

p.s someone tell that shiek she can tech left AND right lol
 

Spife

Smash Master
Joined
Sep 15, 2007
Messages
3,016
Location
Neriak
Okay, 1-3 vs KirbyKaze(KK)'s fox

0:20 was suppose to be a nair I hope, and I know you know this, but yeah, nair > fair if you're gonna fj and a fox is shielding below you (told you I was going to say EVERYTHING, this is going to take a while -.-)

0:24 was interesting, I would have fast fallen a dair ontop of fox (but I don't think about punishing very well, I think to hit with a strong move, rather then a combo),
but instead you pulled a bomb, which was a good defensive measure for later, but you had a fox below you who wiffed a nair. (Btw I don't play foxes to the calibur of KK haha)

0:28 was choice *steals*

0:34/5 I think you could have just utilted and hit fox out of his nair and then ****ed his ****, I need to start doing this too, and you were WAY to close for the boomerang

the wd back > fair right afterwards was good, then jabs to keep him at bay. I learned something playing against a fox the other day, moving forwards when you're both neutral (as in you're both standing, facing eachother) is never that good of an idea, neither is getting cornered though. Er, if they're camping you don't have a choice. I just noticed that you did wd > fair >jabs (to keep him at bay) then you got hit when you wd'd forward, you could have wd back again or jabbed, or shielded.

on your recovery at 0:38-0:40, it looked like KK was waiting for you to hook shot, try to hookshot with that second jump of yours. I don't know if you were baiting with it but you were high enough to through one out and *hopefully* tap that z button before he went "lolBLINK" on your head.


0:53 lol just upthrow that bomb > waveland > ****, don't throw bombs at held shines boyo

1:08 don't dash attack at those percents

*Note to the community* I can't think of a way, but lets brainstorm ways to beat out laser camping foxes (when fox comes up in matchup thread), I would say more bombs but what do I know?

start of your third stock is what you should have during your second stock (bomb to combo)\

1:27 *shakes head* I guess a nair to put him off the stage would have worked, but utilt/uair to dair would have worked, like you could have done another after that falling uair

*blinks....* wtf arrow? haha, alright alright

1:53, you got stuck in your shield, probably waiting to get pushed off onto the ledge (seemed like a good idea) then you did nothing with it. I'm probably being over criticle but come on. Ledge hop for invicibility then do something. Get up attack? lol that was a mistake I'm hoping.

2:10 space that fair a little better, you were right on top of him and it has to much range for you to do that, I know you wanted to take advantage of that bomb, and you missed your window to do so, had you spaced you would have been able to get away

2:20 ftilt (mistake though, now way you'd do that on purpose haha), just pointing it out

is there any reason you're usmashing so much? nice cc after the one around 2:24

you started jabbing around 2:25, good, jabs are good, this match needed more jabs, you're jabbing in case he trys to counter attack, needs more jabs to keep him at bay imo
KK, I assume you'll read this, that last combo on the first game, not gonna lie, made me happy some where south ;)

*sighs* game 2, here we go!

alright, already ****ed up by 2:49 by staying Link. (<3)

watch your close projectiles, you got him this time but he punished you for it

nairs > jabs to stop that counter attack, good, missed the grab at 3:13 but good effort
but then 3:16 you pull a rang, toooooo close

Grab at 3:23 and get up attack at 3:25 makes me confused, mistakes?
nice bait for his stock

at 3:38 when you get those jabs in, you could have either gone first jab > second jab > repeat or just jab jab jab jab (no second jab) or multi stab, I don't know at KK but that's usually profitable cause people don't think to hold away or shield, just to take it. I do that when people are that close.

3:45- 3:49 You should probably have wave landed or air dodged those fairs (looking back on it at least) for how he punished you, the first one you tried to wave dash away from him, should spot dodge the grab next time, at least now we know you can't wave dash out like that haha, fox's too fast

3:51ish NICE SPACING, good, now do that more haha

good grab
good combo
EDGE GUAAAARD
run off nair next time plz, it would have cut his second jump and worst comes to worst, if he saw it and recovered accordingly, an up b (facing him) can catch him, or hit him with final hit.

Again with the falling fair (4:01/2), good for spacing but it looks like KK is waiting for it to hit you AFTER you land/DURING your wd back

time between 4:00 and 4:30 I think you could uair him out of his full jump nairs on your shield, tsk tsk KK on no usmash at 4:18 lul, Stos, rang was to close at 4:23 and that's why you got usmashed, nair or air dodge or wave land might have worked

4:36 TO CLOSE WITH THAT RANG!

4:38 is interesting, I assume you jabb'd to stop him for going for the ledge, which is legit but fire fox starts up to long, then you went for the uair, I was sad it missed.

5:04, you hit with the bomb (good) approached (good good) and he shielded, I'm not sure if this is the first time this has happened, but if it keeps happening you could try for a grab cause he's blocking your follow up with that shield. OR, and this might be smarter at 10% on fox, run away and pull another projectile. No sense closing the gap between you and him if you have the choice.

5:18 you come down with a dair and are punished, i would just jump away and pull a projectile, or DI away if you want to save the dj

5:35 YEAAAAH THE SPIFE *stealing name from who ever didn't name it cause that's what I do* but you forgot to taunt,

nice beggining to his last stock, I wish wish wish you had waited to see if he got back on the ledge or not, then up-b spiked him for a clean 2 stock, oh well, I know I wouldn't have done that haha

I know it's just a friendly but there has GOT to be a better way to edge guard him then that, nice game though.

Gonna finish up the fox then I'll do Shiek later.

Match 4 (match 3 went where?)

Good start, I really think Link should play against fox like this if you have the room (read: make the room), just space nairs and fairs (so you come out doing the damage and unpunished) and pulling projectiles when you're not doing those things

1:08 I can't say I've seen anything glaringly wrong so far, that or I'm just tired from paying close attention to the other matches (took me way to long to get through them)

good good, you're just avoiding direct conflict via spacing and projectiles,

1:44 I would just hook shot the stage mang, no sense in double jump > air dodge every time when you could just hook shot and give them less time to react

I don't think I've seen enough utilts out of you, maybe you're usmashing instead but utilt is too beast

bomb jump for your third stock might have helped, worth a try anyway

(last stock) Okay, Fox's full jump nair was to much, just sh/fh uair when he's above you, don't challenge him cause even if you don't trade hits and he takes all the damage, he's still fox and you're still Link. Uair would have at least given you chance to put some space between you guys.

good idea for those last seconds, bad idea for that uair haha


Closing thoughts: the last match was played the best. More or less because (I think at least) you replaced all your close projectiles with nairs or fairs (spaced in a way that even if you wiffed you kept him at bay). Then, when you were away from him, you gave him a projectile to chew on. I think when and how you approach could have been better but well, yeah.

I don't know the match up well, but more jabs, jabs are a good way to stop that furry from getting in on you. I would keep up the nair/fair spacing, projectiles from a far, I know he ends up laser camping you, but you know. Also, uair that fj nair, no point in doing battle with it head to head so stab that ***** in the balls.

Also, I pointed out everything negative I could, and some positives that got me cheering for you Stos. I'm not saying those were the only things you did right, just the stuff that got me really into it haha. I also don't mean to come off condescending, I'm just typing what I see.



Do you want me to go on and do the shieks? I want to watch them but I don't have the time right now.
 

Stos

Loves Pink Poodles
Joined
Mar 3, 2006
Messages
342
Location
1&lt;3TO
Thanks a lot guyss.

Spife: no worries Its actually better pointing out the negatives than the positives when giving advice.

Looks like I missed a lot of shffled Uair to vs. Nair punishes.

thanks again.
 

Bummerz

Smash Apprentice
Joined
Jul 8, 2008
Messages
96
Okay, 1-3 vs KirbyKaze(KK)'s fox

0:20 was suppose to be a nair I hope, and I know you know this, but yeah, nair > fair if you're gonna fj and a fox is shielding below you (told you I was going to say EVERYTHING, this is going to take a while -.-)

0:24 was interesting, I would have fast fallen a dair ontop of fox (but I don't think about punishing very well, I think to hit with a strong move, rather then a combo),
but instead you pulled a bomb, which was a good defensive measure for later, but you had a fox below you who wiffed a nair. (Btw I don't play foxes to the calibur of KK haha)

0:28 was choice *steals*

0:34/5 I think you could have just utilted and hit fox out of his nair and then ****ed his ****, I need to start doing this too, and you were WAY to close for the boomerang

the wd back > fair right afterwards was good, then jabs to keep him at bay. I learned something playing against a fox the other day, moving forwards when you're both neutral (as in you're both standing, facing eachother) is never that good of an idea, neither is getting cornered though. Er, if they're camping you don't have a choice. I just noticed that you did wd > fair >jabs (to keep him at bay) then you got hit when you wd'd forward, you could have wd back again or jabbed, or shielded.

on your recovery at 0:38-0:40, it looked like KK was waiting for you to hook shot, try to hookshot with that second jump of yours. I don't know if you were baiting with it but you were high enough to through one out and *hopefully* tap that z button before he went "lolBLINK" on your head.


0:53 lol just upthrow that bomb > waveland > ****, don't throw bombs at held shines boyo

1:08 don't dash attack at those percents

*Note to the community* I can't think of a way, but lets brainstorm ways to beat out laser camping foxes (when fox comes up in matchup thread), I would say more bombs but what do I know?

start of your third stock is what you should have during your second stock (bomb to combo)\

1:27 *shakes head* I guess a nair to put him off the stage would have worked, but utilt/uair to dair would have worked, like you could have done another after that falling uair

*blinks....* wtf arrow? haha, alright alright

1:53, you got stuck in your shield, probably waiting to get pushed off onto the ledge (seemed like a good idea) then you did nothing with it. I'm probably being over criticle but come on. Ledge hop for invicibility then do something. Get up attack? lol that was a mistake I'm hoping.

2:10 space that fair a little better, you were right on top of him and it has to much range for you to do that, I know you wanted to take advantage of that bomb, and you missed your window to do so, had you spaced you would have been able to get away

2:20 ftilt (mistake though, now way you'd do that on purpose haha), just pointing it out

is there any reason you're usmashing so much? nice cc after the one around 2:24

you started jabbing around 2:25, good, jabs are good, this match needed more jabs, you're jabbing in case he trys to counter attack, needs more jabs to keep him at bay imo
KK, I assume you'll read this, that last combo on the first game, not gonna lie, made me happy some where south ;)

*sighs* game 2, here we go!

alright, already ****ed up by 2:49 by staying Link. (<3)

watch your close projectiles, you got him this time but he punished you for it

nairs > jabs to stop that counter attack, good, missed the grab at 3:13 but good effort
but then 3:16 you pull a rang, toooooo close

Grab at 3:23 and get up attack at 3:25 makes me confused, mistakes?
nice bait for his stock

at 3:38 when you get those jabs in, you could have either gone first jab > second jab > repeat or just jab jab jab jab (no second jab) or multi stab, I don't know at KK but that's usually profitable cause people don't think to hold away or shield, just to take it. I do that when people are that close.

3:45- 3:49 You should probably have wave landed or air dodged those fairs (looking back on it at least) for how he punished you, the first one you tried to wave dash away from him, should spot dodge the grab next time, at least now we know you can't wave dash out like that haha, fox's too fast

3:51ish NICE SPACING, good, now do that more haha

good grab
good combo
EDGE GUAAAARD
run off nair next time plz, it would have cut his second jump and worst comes to worst, if he saw it and recovered accordingly, an up b (facing him) can catch him, or hit him with final hit.

Again with the falling fair (4:01/2), good for spacing but it looks like KK is waiting for it to hit you AFTER you land/DURING your wd back

time between 4:00 and 4:30 I think you could uair him out of his full jump nairs on your shield, tsk tsk KK on no usmash at 4:18 lul, Stos, rang was to close at 4:23 and that's why you got usmashed, nair or air dodge or wave land might have worked

4:36 TO CLOSE WITH THAT RANG!

4:38 is interesting, I assume you jabb'd to stop him for going for the ledge, which is legit but fire fox starts up to long, then you went for the uair, I was sad it missed.

5:04, you hit with the bomb (good) approached (good good) and he shielded, I'm not sure if this is the first time this has happened, but if it keeps happening you could try for a grab cause he's blocking your follow up with that shield. OR, and this might be smarter at 10% on fox, run away and pull another projectile. No sense closing the gap between you and him if you have the choice.

5:18 you come down with a dair and are punished, i would just jump away and pull a projectile, or DI away if you want to save the dj

5:35 YEAAAAH THE SPIFE *stealing name from who ever didn't name it cause that's what I do* but you forgot to taunt,

nice beggining to his last stock, I wish wish wish you had waited to see if he got back on the ledge or not, then up-b spiked him for a clean 2 stock, oh well, I know I wouldn't have done that haha

I know it's just a friendly but there has GOT to be a better way to edge guard him then that, nice game though.

Gonna finish up the fox then I'll do Shiek later.

Match 4 (match 3 went where?)

Good start, I really think Link should play against fox like this if you have the room (read: make the room), just space nairs and fairs (so you come out doing the damage and unpunished) and pulling projectiles when you're not doing those things

1:08 I can't say I've seen anything glaringly wrong so far, that or I'm just tired from paying close attention to the other matches (took me way to long to get through them)

good good, you're just avoiding direct conflict via spacing and projectiles,

1:44 I would just hook shot the stage mang, no sense in double jump > air dodge every time when you could just hook shot and give them less time to react

I don't think I've seen enough utilts out of you, maybe you're usmashing instead but utilt is too beast

bomb jump for your third stock might have helped, worth a try anyway

(last stock) Okay, Fox's full jump nair was to much, just sh/fh uair when he's above you, don't challenge him cause even if you don't trade hits and he takes all the damage, he's still fox and you're still Link. Uair would have at least given you chance to put some space between you guys.

good idea for those last seconds, bad idea for that uair haha


Closing thoughts: the last match was played the best. More or less because (I think at least) you replaced all your close projectiles with nairs or fairs (spaced in a way that even if you wiffed you kept him at bay). Then, when you were away from him, you gave him a projectile to chew on. I think when and how you approach could have been better but well, yeah.

I don't know the match up well, but more jabs, jabs are a good way to stop that furry from getting in on you. I would keep up the nair/fair spacing, projectiles from a far, I know he ends up laser camping you, but you know. Also, uair that fj nair, no point in doing battle with it head to head so stab that ***** in the balls.

Also, I pointed out everything negative I could, and some positives that got me cheering for you Stos. I'm not saying those were the only things you did right, just the stuff that got me really into it haha. I also don't mean to come off condescending, I'm just typing what I see.



Do you want me to go on and do the shieks? I want to watch them but I don't have the time right now.
lmao!!! he ment everything
 
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