New Characters for Project M Discussion Thread (Voting Closed)

[Pacack]

Votes:

Sukapon/Skapon: YES! I WILL ACTUALLY TRY PROJECT M IF THIS GUY GETS IN! (He's my fourth or fifth most wanted character and he has next to no chance of being in the actual game, so...YES!)

Toad: Please? He's my third most wanted character and he has potential as a semi-semi clone of Peach (turnips) and the Mario Bros., at the very least.

Black Shadow and Ganondorf: I want this to happen in the next game as well, but this is the next best thing if that doesn't work out.

Sami: Becaues Chronobound made a good argument for her.

Ridley: Self-explanitory. Want him as much as Sukapon.

1/2 Votes:

Bowser Jr.: I'd be fine with him, and he'd be easy to develop, for sure.

Tails: Why not? I have a soft spot for the guy.

Waluigi: Because WAAA!

Dixie Kong: Because it's easy to make her and she'd make people happy.

King K. Rool: Because I'm honestly really worried that he might not make it into the next game.

Tingle: Because...why not?

Downvotes:

Dark Samus: Why? We have Ridley. It'd be cool and all, but not when Ridley is a thing, and there are other characters that are more worthy.

Hector: Do I need to explain this one?

Paper Mario: Not when we have Toad and Bowser Jr. around.

Krystal: Not important enough, too much work.

Shadow: I kinda like him, but not for this.

 

[Arcadenik]

I would vote for Ridley, Dixie Kong, Toad (he would be the Wolf to Mario's Fox and Luigi's Falco), Tails, and maybe Meowth as a semi-clone of Marth but with projectiles (swordplay replaced with scratches... coins as projectiles)...

 

[MagnesD3]

Hmm im beginning to see ssb4 thread disscusion faces...

 

[Swamp Sensei]

I vote for Ridley, Isaac, Lyn, King K.Rool and Bowser Jr.

 

[shinhed-echi]

Alright, new day, new topic for me.
Today I'd love to talk about new faces. Particularly Saki!

Alrighty I guess I'll talk about ideas for Saki

Saki (Sin and Punishment) Moveset ideas

First and for most, Saki would be a fast, mostly projectile based character, with strong close rangephysical moves involving the sword on his cannon sword. Saki would be slightly lighter then Marth, but heavier then someone like Fox. Mobility is key for Saki in Sin and Punishment, so I figured I'd use that as a main point of his moveset.
\

Love your moveset. Different than mine which is awesome because you reminded me of some moves that I completely forgot. Meaning Saki has a LOT more potential than I gave him credit for.

Overall, I picture Saki as agile and powerful as vBrawl Sheik. Sure, a good P:M Sheik would destroy him, but Saki's advantage would come from his outranging attacks, both for projectiles, and for melee attacks.

He'd be super light, though. And I mean lighter than most "human" characters, since his game was supposed to be called "Glass Soldier" due to how frail Saki looks.. i thought it would've been quite fitting, to be honest.

As far as recovery moves go, the jetpack sounds really good. But I just recalled Kachi's (or was it Achi's) hoverboard from S&P2. That way it'd look less clone-ish, could probably work like Jak's hoverboard in PSASBR (although straight up/sides could be a little bit too extreme. Perhaps you can aim the direction a'la Fox's recovery)

 

[~ Valkyrie ~]

Well this was quite turn of events, eh?

My Wishlist Newcomer Votes:

1- Isaac (Represents a new franchise which I'm sure everyone is keen to be added. Besides I love Golden Sun to death despite playing as Jenna or Ivan rather)
2- Lyn (A fan-favourite in FE-community enough to be one of the very infamous wishlist newcomers to the series back in SSBB-speculation, which would be received very well by many people and has potential to be rather unique, fast and lethal character if done well.)
3- Ridley (Another huge fan favourite which if not making it to SSB4, would make PM truly stand out from it, along with being another iconic villain from Nintendo's franchises. Besides it's a PURPLE DRAGON OF DOOM. More interesting to me right there than another version of Samus which hasn't really been cemented to the series as much as Ridley has. )
4- Dixie Kong (The 3rd Kong which all agree should complete the Kong Trilogy. Besides my childhood heroine due he game truly feeling like traveling through Scandinavia's landscapes. I mean DKC3.)
5- Sukapon ( A fighting robot from a first fighting game Nintendo has done aside from Punch-Out! ? I'm all in. He'd be very unique and perhaps personality-filled little fighting bot. I highly suggest adding as PM's retro addition due it's nature because since PM drives on being a fast-paced fighter, Sukapon would really fit this)

Post-Wishlist Votes:

- Sami
- Samurai Goroh
- Saki

Down Votes:

- Pichu (8 Pokemon characters + intentionally bad clone? Why people want him back again? )
- Paper Mario (Not too keen on different versions of Mario in one game, thank you)
- Black Shadow + NewDorf (People forget that Ganondorf works already well as he is and just wants to fix him for sake of pandering to their not-very-important "characterization" wishes that have a chance to override his functionality as a possibly good playable character
- Waluigi (Belongs best to Mario-spinoffs as it's all-star rather than in a Nintendo All-Star game)
- Dark Samus (I know he'd be unique but like Paper Mario, no characters that are different versions of the same character, thank you.)

 

[Pacack]

5- Sukapon ( A fighting robot from a first fighting game aside from Punch-Out! ? I'm all in. He'd be very unique and perhaps personality-filled little fighting bot. I highly suggest adding as PM's retro addition due it's nature because since PM drives on being a fast-paced fighter, Sukapon would really fit this.

You nailed that. If Project M is adding a retro, it should be Sukapon. He's just perfect for the role.

 

[Hungry Headcrab]

Just my two cents on the whole Black Shadow / Ganondorf issue, since a lot of things have already been said...

Let's say the idea does gain traction and is welcomed by the PMBR. A lot of arguments are about losing Ganondorf's greatness or whatever... I get the vibe that it's like there's no new character being added at all. Do you doubt the ability of the PMBR to make a Ganondorf that will piss your piss pants like they did in the Roy/Mewtwo videos? Yes, you would lose the visual appearance of Ganondorf from his old moveset (without changing the metagame at all), and this may be whatever degree of a negative for you... but consider the degree of awesome that could be made out of a new character, as well.

Also, I like how the discussion is being kept pretty consistent here. That way when it's over and people start discussing another character, I can link to the beginning of the Black Shadow/Ganondorf discussion in the OP so that people don't repeat themselves needlessly further down the line.

The problem with this argument is that, for as much as Smash and Project M is a competitive fighter, it is also a Nintendo crossover populated with their best characters. For everyone who is a fan of Ganondorf and his current moveset, they already have the perfect character. While the moveset and the meta game would still exist if Black Shadow was placed over Ganondorf, I personally would be less inclined to play the character and the game would immediately become less enjoyable. Just imagine that any of the other characters whose moveset doesn't make sense (and there are plenty, and I still argue that, for the most part, Ganon's moveset makes sense) were just replaced in the proposed Black Shadow-Ganon way. People would be upset, despite the fact that the movesets are still there. People play characters and the movesets. It's a package deal.

Also, I don't doubt the PMBR's ability to make a great character, I would just rather not have the clone engine be an excuse to dramatically change a character for no good reason when there are so many better options for the clone engine.

I hate that I feel the need to constantly come back to this argument...

 

[Eltrion]

Having looked up Sukapon, I can say that I certainly wouldn't mind him, and his moves look fun, and he looks easy to model and animate. But in all honesty, how many people have heard of him? He's going to have an uphill battle getting in over all of the suggestions here...

Adding Half Vote for Sukapon.

 

[Curious Villager]

Well I guess I'd vote for Ridley and Lyn if their the only viable choices in that list. Ridle because he's overall a very popular and demanded character for Smash Bros and Lyn because I personally find her to be a very fun and interesting looking character. But that's just my opinion. ^^

 

[Ninka_kiwi]

Alright, new day, new topic for me.
Today I'd love to talk about new faces. Particularly Saki!




Love your moveset. Different than mine which is awesome because you reminded me of some moves that I completely forgot. Meaning Saki has a LOT more potential than I gave him credit for.

Overall, I picture Saki as agile and powerful as vBrawl Sheik. Sure, a good P:M Sheik would destroy him, but Saki's advantage would come from his outranging attacks, both for projectiles, and for melee attacks.

He'd be super light, though. And I mean lighter than most "human" characters, since his game was supposed to be called "Glass Soldier" due to how frail Saki looks.. i thought it would've been quite fitting, to be honest.

As far as recovery moves go, the jetpack sounds really good. But I just recalled Kachi's (or was it Achi's) hoverboard from S&P2. That way it'd look less clone-ish, could probably work like Jak's hoverboard in PSASBR (although straight up/sides could be a little bit too extreme. Perhaps you can aim the direction a'la Fox's recovery)

I figure the Jetpack Isa uses would be more fitting due to Isa being Saki's son, and also, it'd be easier to have him cancel into different attack with it while keeping the animations looking semi natural, and the hover board not just disappearing, as Saki would have the Jetpack on his back at all times.

as for the Glass Canon idea, yes that is what I'd love to see, as there really aren't any good humanoid glass canon characters with long range.
I specifically mention character like Strider when making his set as I'd suspect his stats to be a bit like his.

 

[giantrobots]

The problem with this argument is that, for as much as Smash and Project M is a competitive fighter, it is also a Nintendo crossover populated with their best characters. For everyone who is a fan of Ganondorf and his current moveset, they already have the perfect character. While the moveset and the meta game would still exist if Black Shadow was placed over Ganondorf, I personally would be less inclined to play the character and the game would immediately become less enjoyable. Just imagine that any of the other characters whose moveset doesn't make sense (and there are plenty, and I still argue that, for the most part, Ganon's moveset makes sense) were just replaced in the proposed Black Shadow-Ganon way. People would be upset, despite the fact that the movesets are still there. People play characters and the movesets. It's a package deal.

Also, I don't doubt the PMBR's ability to make a great character, I would just rather not have the clone engine be an excuse to dramatically change a character for no good reason when there are so many better options for the clone engine.

I hate that I feel the need to constantly come back to this argument...

I voted for a new Ganondorf character, but I can definitely appreciate this perspective. If Ganondorf is kept as he is, I hope that his neutral B is at least changed to something that is more viable than what it is now. I've never found much use for it, other than trying to style while edge-guarding : /

Since creating a projectile isn't an option, maybe a chargeable move like Marth's neutral B could be good, for which Ganondorf uses his sword? That could add more of Ganondorf's "history" into his moveset, without changing the character from what people like now. (I also wouldn't mind if his Up-Tilt Volcano Kick were changed to something more immediately useful.)


Edit: Maybe replace neutral B with a sword, move Warlock Punch to his forward smash, and make the Up-Tilt Volcano Kick a taunt. That way, the only thing that would really be lost would be the elbow.

 

[OrangeSodaGuy]

I understand the people who are concerned that we have too many pokemon, but I'm still perplexed that so many of the anti-Pichu crowd is arguing that he shouldn't be in the game because he was a bad clone.

Roy was a bad clone, and look at how interesting he's turning out to be!

I would personally advocate that Pichu should stay a joke character--- however, that's not to say that a joke character can't have an interesting playstyle or moveset. Falco still boasts incredibly an unique playstyle compared to Fox, for example.

The PMBR has also done a fantastic job of revitalizing previously meh, average, boring, useless, and/or terrible characters like Mewtwo, Bowser, Ness, Link, Zelda, Game and Watch, Donkey Kong, etc. and making them incredibly interesting, fun, and dynamic characters to play. Mario, Luigi, and Pikachu went from ehhh to amazing, and Yoshi and Kirby will also be amazing once they're released.

Nothing against anyone who just doesn't like Pichu. I can understand that. I just think the "he was a bad clone so he would be pointless to add" is a very flawed and biased argument.

* Edited for grammar reasons. Derp

** further edit-- I would suggest Pichu's inclusion as a costume, but his radically different size and proportions not to mention his unique qualities such as self-damage are not things I can see the alternate costume system doing any justice.

 

[shinhed-echi]

I figure the Jetpack Isa uses would be more fitting due to Isa being Saki's son, and also, it'd be easier to have him cancel into different attack with it while keeping the animations looking semi natural, and the hover board not just disappearing, as Saki would have the Jetpack on his back at all times.

as for the Glass Canon idea, yes that is what I'd love to see, as there really aren't any good humanoid glass canon characters with long range.
I specifically mention character like Strider when making his set as I'd suspect his stats to be a bit like his.

The Jetpack is great too. In fact, it would be the more sentimental choice, and I'd be happier with it, tbh. I was just throwing the idea of the Hoverboard being another option. :D

One thing I'd love seeing implemented in his moveset, is a complete aiming system like in Sin & Punishment. Just throwing this idea as well just in case the PM:BR can make this possible (and I know there can be plenty of other options if it's not).

My idea was that if you hold B, Saki would be locked in place, and the player would gain control of a crosshair where Saki keeps firing non stop. Obviously, these shots wouldn't flinch the enemy (Fox style).

But I was thinking it would be a unique way to represent the side-scrollyness and aiming factor of Sin & Punishment.
I don't know... I just happen to be very in love with this idea. And we already have a crosshair in the game.

(Though to be honest, I got this idea from TMNT Smash Up where if you hold the Right Block button, a crosshair appears on the screen and you can "shoot/trigger" some things in the stage)

What do you think? :D


Heh, since you mentioned Strider, I can totally picture Saki with melee combat based on him.

 

[YoshiandToad]

I'd vote for the following:

+ 1 Vote

Toad(obvious from username). Only Playable main Mario game protagonist/Big 8 member left to include. Has a decent size fanbase; fairly unlikely at this point to be in SSB4. Would be fun to manhandle characters like Bowser or the abusive Princess Peach with; could have a DK style pick up and carry.
Would settle for Mario/Luigi clone, but would prefer a mixture with Peach's down + B plucking, and B spore counter attack. Obviously would be stronger and faster than the brothers but with poorer recovery skills, just like in SMB2.

Ridley. This would make so many people's years it's untrue. Add Ridley, and I guarentee Project M will be even more popular than it already is. Also on the off chance he's not in SSB4, this would be the best gift you could give these boards.

Meowth. A character that pretty much should of been in SSB64 over Jigglypuff had it not been for time restraints. You'd make a lot of Pokemon fans very very happy with the addition of him. I can see him having speedy slashes like Metaknights sword strikes but I'm sure you guys could come up with something fun to play with.

Sami. Although I have Andy in my sig, I'd be more than happy to have the more combat orientated and easier to implement Sami. Using a modified Snake moveset actually suits her down to the ground and Advance Wars frankly deserves more recognition than it gets.

Isaac. Golden Sun, like Advance Wars, deserves it's recognition. Still pretty popular in the west, Isaac has a lot to play with and would be far more than your generic sword user(although using said sworduser for a base works rather well).

1/2 Votes:

Tails. I like Tails and so do many others. Your idea as a Sonic style clone with Peach hovering abilties sounds fine to me. If there's any secondary 3rd party character added; it should probably be this guy(Sorry Knuckles).

Samurai Goroh. Recognisable and popular. For F-Zero I mean. Whilst Black Shadow fixes Ganondorf's issues I think I'd rather have Ganondorf fixed without the need to add a replace Falcondorf.

Dixie Kong. Deserves the placement more than most. I just think she's got the strongest chance of those on this list appearing in SSB4.

Down votes:

Shadow the Hedgehog. Doesn't add anything that Sonic can't already really. Physical representation of Sonic's worst years, Sega's pathetic fan pandering to keep the character alive after his story was done, and is genuinely one of the few characters I truly dislike.

Dark Samus. Whilst easy to implement I'm fairly sure more people would prefer Ridley, and that he'd gather more interest than Dark Samus.

 

[loganhogan]

1-up votes:
Lyn
Ridley
Sami
Dixie Kong
Palutena

Half Votes:
Andy
K. Rool
Toad
Barbara
Stafy
Jill
Saki
Black Shadow
Samurai Goroh
Micaiah


Down Votes:
Pichu
Toon sheik
Young Link
Hector
Shadow, Tails, Knuckles, or any other Sonic/MGS character

I don't know if I should vote for Palutena, Dixie, or Ridley because they seem likely for SSB Wiiu/3ds but theres my vote.

 

[DrinkingFood]

I'm curious as to how many of these people voting already play project m and as to whether their votes should be as significant... i've changed my mind. PMBR please just use your best judgements and don't take any of these votes into serious account, including mine. I've already seen people here voting for Toad, so it's only a matter of time before we start seeing stupid things like Pac-man and Joseph the Hedgehog (original character).

 

[820]

Just to get this across, Paper Mario would in no way be a clone of Mario or really be similar at all. He comes from a COMPLETELY different game where he was plenty to draw off for his own move-set. The only thing they have in common is the name.

 

[Sanity's_Theif]

I'm curious as to how many of these people voting already play project m and as to whether their votes should be as significant... i've changed my mind. PMBR please just use your best judgements and don't take any of these votes into serious account, including mine. I've already seen people here voting for Toad, so it's only a matter of time before we start seeing stupid things like Pac-man and Joseph the Hedgehog (original character).

This, don't worry, the PMBR isn't stupid enough to look at this thread and judge it as an accurate representation of what the majority wants

 

[loganhogan]

I'm curious as to how many of these people voting already play project m and as to whether their votes should be as significant... i've changed my mind. PMBR please just use your best judgements and don't take any of these votes into serious account, including mine. I've already seen people here voting for Toad, so it's only a matter of time before we start seeing stupid things like Pac-man and Joseph the Hedgehog (original character).

What's wrong with Toad?

 

[Deleted member]

I'm curious as to how many of these people voting already play project m and as to whether their votes should be as significant... i've changed my mind. PMBR please just use your best judgements and don't take any of these votes into serious account, including mine. I've already seen people here voting for Toad, so it's only a matter of time before we start seeing stupid things like Pac-man and Joseph the Hedgehog (original character).

The PMBR is gonna look at characters mostly in terms on what they can do with them in regard to playstyle, this is why I'm confident that Lyn will get in if they DO decide to add new characters.

Bear in mind that's IF they add new characters, which I think it's likely.

This whole thread is basically just us having an epenis contest to justify our support for characters. Though, SOME characters might get in if they get enough support behind them.

 

[trojanpooh]

What's wrong with Toad?

I think the real question is what's right with Toad? He doesn't really do anything wrong, per say, but he's also extraordinarily bland.

 

[OcarinaOfDoom]

Up votes:
Lyn
Ridley
Isaac
Black Shadorf + New Gdorf
Saki

Downvotes:
Waluigi
All of the Sonic characters

 

[OrangeSodaGuy]

Pac-man would be a perfect fit for SSB4. I'm not expecting him to appear in Project M of course-- due to rights issues, etc.
He has plenty of moves that could be lifted from the Pac-man world series, he's cameoed in games alongside Mario himself, and he's one of the oldest, most iconic, and most recognizable characters in the history of gaming period.
He's arguably one of the most recognizable characters in all of fiction!

If Namco gets a playable rep in SSB4, there's no better choice.

As awesome as Tales is, that series hasn't really made the same impact on the industry and on pop-culture that the Yellow One has made.

But I digress-- lest I trail off topic, as this is a thread for P:M suggestions.

 

[AnOkayDM]

I'm just gonna cast my votes for now, and post some stuff about Paper Mario later on.

VOTES FOR:
Ridley (or Dark Samus, failing that)
Paper Mario
Black Shadow/Ganon
Isaac
Dixie

VOTES AGAINST:
Krystal
Waluigi

 

[BronzeGreekGod]

Just my two cents on the whole Black Shadow / Ganondorf issue, since a lot of things have already been said...

Let's say the idea does gain traction and is welcomed by the PMBR. A lot of arguments are about losing Ganondorf's greatness or whatever... I get the vibe that it's like there's no new character being added at all. Do you doubt the ability of the PMBR to make a Ganondorf that will piss your piss pants like they did in the Roy/Mewtwo videos? Yes, you would lose the visual appearance of Ganondorf from his old moveset (without changing the metagame at all), and this may be whatever degree of a negative for you... but consider the degree of awesome that could be made out of a new character, as well.

Also, I like how the discussion is being kept pretty consistent here. That way when it's over and people start discussing another character, I can link to the beginning of the Black Shadow/Ganondorf discussion in the OP so that people don't repeat themselves needlessly further down the line.

Yup!

Also, is there any chance you could do an in depth look at Ray MKII and Saki (sin and punishment)?
I think they both deserve some acknowledgement so that people can vote for them!

 

[BronzeGreekGod]

- Black Shadow + NewDorf (People forget that Ganondorf works already well as he is and just wants to fix him for sake of pandering to their not-very-important "characterization" wishes that have a chance to override his functionality as a possibly good playable character

People want him to be properly represented. With the clone engine it would be perfectly logical to make Ganondorf one of the new clone engine characters while moving his current moves to someone else. Instead of bringing in a completely new character with a new move set, Ganondorf who is already in the game deserves to be himself. Not a clone.

And this will be repeated a billion times more, since the move set is so functional and fantastic, we're not saying get rid of it. We're saying keep it, but give it to someone else.

I know some people disagree with this, but that's the way we Black Shadow/Ganon voters think.

 

[shinhed-echi]

I'm going to make one pause to go back to this dreaded topic just ONCE, but tell me exactly...

Let's say Ganondorf<>Black Shadow gets done... What's stopping people from abusing this and start requesting declonification of every character they find "unworthy" of having said moveset?

Maybe some of us were expecting NEW characters with NEW movesets to surprise us... Not going to teach old dogs new tricks, and let the new dogs get the old tricks. This would just be beyond disappointing.

*Challenger appears: Lip from Panel de Pon*
(Too bad, she inherits Lucas' moveset!) NEW LUCAS MOVESET ANNOUNCED!
That'd be just wrong. -_-

Looking at Toon Link, looking at Lucas, looking at Wolf, or Luigi, etc. What if this starts getting out of hand, this could seirously start ruining P:M for me and other players. Why can't these "declone-swaps" be part of ANOTHER hack? Why P:M? P:M was just PERFECT the way it was heading.

That is all. Not even going to bother dwell on this subject, it's just to kill my curiosity.

 

[Ninka_kiwi]

The Jetpack is great too. In fact, it would be the more sentimental choice, and I'd be happier with it, tbh. I was just throwing the idea of the Hoverboard being another option. :D

One thing I'd love seeing implemented in his moveset, is a complete aiming system like in Sin & Punishment. Just throwing this idea as well just in case the PM:BR can make this possible (and I know there can be plenty of other options if it's not).

My idea was that if you hold B, Saki would be locked in place, and the player would gain control of a crosshair where Saki keeps firing non stop. Obviously, these shots wouldn't flinch the enemy (Fox style).


But I was thinking it would be a unique way to represent the side-scrollyness and aiming factor of Sin & Punishment.
I don't know... I just happen to be very in love with this idea. And we already have a crosshair in the game.


(Though to be honest, I got this idea from TMNT Smash Up where if you hold the Right Block button, a crosshair appears on the screen and you can "shoot/trigger" some things in the stage)

What do you think? :D


Heh, since you mentioned Strider, I can totally picture Saki with melee combat based on him.

Considering the reticules appear in the Sin and Punishment 2 artwork, It'd make since to appear as an effect for one of his moves, So yeah, I'd be down with them

 

[Anti Guy]

Since I haven't posted yet... my votes:

Top 5 (no particular order):
-Black Shadow / Ganondorf
-Ridley
-Skapon
-Bowser Jr
-Isaac

Others:
-Dark Samus
-Samurai Goroh

Counter picks:
-Any Pokemon character
-Any Fire Emblem character
-Any Sonic character
-Any Star Fox character
-Any character not in the OP
-Sami
-Saki
-Waluigi

Dark Samus: Why? We have Ridley. It'd be cool and all, but not when Ridley is a thing, and there are other characters that are more worthy.

I don't get why use your down vote for the reason that we have Ridley. Both won't make it in. The general consensus so far is that for those supporters of a Metroid character, one of the two should get in, based on technical and game (i.e. being in SSB4) limitations. A down vote is for someone who you think shouldn't be in, period.

Anyways, now that the Black Shadow/Ganondorf discussion seems to be more or less over, here's a tally to see a snapshot of how well he's doing right now.

Black Shadow + Ganondorf
Total 1+ votes: 16
Total 1/2 votes: 5
Total down votes: 3
(1 oddball vote for +1 Ganondorf, but not Black Shadow. "Toon Ganondorf." 1 oddball vote for slightly changing Ganondorf)
CURRENT SCORE: 18.5 - 3.
87.5% of responders are favorable to this character combo.
66.7% believe that they should definitely be one of the 5.
12.5% are opposed to the idea.
(the two oddball votes were not included in the stats, but you can figure them in however you'd like)

Assessment: Black Shadow + Ganondorf is currently a very strong candidate

Next, Saki, as that's where the discussion seems to be headed now.

I am against the character in that he doesn't seem doable. Before you start going into grandiose movesets (which has already been done)... how do you think the PMBR can actually create his moves? There is no character that has a gun and sword. You can mimic a sword character, but he won't have a gun. You need to have an article for a gun. You can mimic a character with a blaster (like a spacey), but they won't have a sword. It'd be nice if someone in the PMBR can verify this, but I just don't think it's possible. Also, speaking of movesets... if you feel really strongly about a character, you don't need to map out each attack. Just describe it in general. Focus more on if it's possible given modding constraints rather than "THIS COULD BE HIS MOVESET FOR SSB4" (where anything is possible).

BronzeGreekGod, to answer your question about Ray-Mk II, tell me more about the character (I never played Custom Robo) and then tell me if you realistically think he's moddable.

 

[MagnesD3]

I'm curious as to how many of these people voting already play project m and as to whether their votes should be as significant... i've changed my mind. PMBR please just use your best judgements and don't take any of these votes into serious account, including mine. I've already seen people here voting for Toad, so it's only a matter of time before we start seeing stupid things like Pac-man and Joseph the Hedgehog (original character).

Yep it was bound to happen with the release of roy and mewtwo...

 

[BronzeGreekGod]

I'm going to make one pause to go back to this dreaded topic just ONCE, but tell me exactly...

Let's say Ganondorf<>Black Shadow gets done... What's stopping people from abusing this and start requesting declonification of every character they find "unworthy" of having said moveset?

Looking at Toon Link, looking at Lucas, looking at Wolf, or Luigi, etc. What if this starts getting out of hand, this could seirously start ruining P:M for me and other players. Why can't these "declone-swaps" be part of ANOTHER hack? Why P:M? P:M was just PERFECT the way it was heading.

That is all. Not even going to bother dwell on this subject, it's just to kill my curiosity.

For the most part I think people are not as outraged with the other clones.. If you've noticed, Ganondorf is the only one that keeps coming up.
Luigi makes sense as a clone, as does Lucas and Falco and Wolf. I think its stupid that Sakurai felt the need to add more friggin Landmasters in brawl, but whatever its fine. Falco and Wolf were different enough. The only other character I think could use decloning is actually toon link, but even he isn't that annoying to me. At least hes a link! GANONDORF ISN'T CAPTAIN FALCON JR. AND HE CERTAINLY IS NOT AN F-ZERO CHARACTER. WHY THE FFFFFFFFFFFFFFFFFFF IS HE A CLONE???????? He is from another franchise, and he has VERY specific iconic moves that should be represented. That is the main problem we all have. Its STUPID and Sakurai is a friggin moron for making him a clone in the first place. Anyone who disagrees on that specific point is delusional.
The other clones don't even really have moves to work with. Fox, Falco and Wolf have no moves in Starfox, they made their moves up. Luigi has been a clone of mario ever since Mario Bros. in 1985, Lucas is pretty decloned already, and like I said, Toon Link at least is LINK.

So in conclusion, I see the point you're trying to make, but it is invalid.

 

[XStarWarriorX]

+1 votes
Lyn
Ridley
Isaac
Krystal
Sami

1/2 votes
King K. rool
Saki
Toad
Dixie Kong
Captain syrup



Edited my voting, may edit again in the future due to smash4.

 

[BronzeGreekGod]

I'm curious as to how many of these people voting already play project m and as to whether their votes should be as significant... i've changed my mind. PMBR please just use your best judgements and don't take any of these votes into serious account, including mine. I've already seen people here voting for Toad, so it's only a matter of time before we start seeing stupid things like Pac-man and Joseph the Hedgehog (original character).

There are definitely a few silly votes, but I don't think the silly ones will be voted for much, so I doubt it would become an issue... I also think that the only characters that should be taken into consideration are only the ones that AntiGuy outlined in his first post (I want him to add Saki and Ray, but whatever). And OF COURSE the PMBR should use their best judgement. They're not gona just throw in a character because they are popular. I hope they at least consider popular votes, and see if they could make it work well.

But to my 2nd point - AntiGuy! Add this to the rules. Only the votes for the outlined characters will be counted.

 

[HyperrCrow]

I am against the character in that he doesn't seem doable. Before you start going into grandiose movesets (which has already been done)... how do you think the PMBR can actually create his moves? There is no character that has a gun and sword. You can mimic a sword character, but he won't have a gun. You need to have an article for a gun. You can mimic a character with a blaster (like a spacey), but they won't have a sword. It'd be nice if someone in the PMBR can verify this, but I just don't think it's possible. Also, speaking of movesets... if you feel really strongly about a character, you don't need to map out each attack. Just describe it in general. Focus more on if it's possible given modding constraints rather than "THIS COULD BE HIS MOVESET FOR SSB4" (where anything is possible).

Not to advocate for this Saki character (who I know nothing about), but there is a way to get a "gun" effect with a sword capable character, but the way it's done is unprofessional. So regardless, I'd have to agree with you against bringing Saki into P:M.

 

[Ninka_kiwi]

Next, Saki, as that's where the discussion seems to be headed now.

I am against the character in that he doesn't seem doable. Before you start going into grandiose movesets (which has already been done)... how do you think the PMBR can actually create his moves? There is no character that has a gun and sword. You can mimic a sword character, but he won't have a gun. You need to have an article for a gun. You can mimic a character with a blaster (like a spacey), but they won't have a sword. It'd be nice if someone in the PMBR can verify this, but I just don't think it's possible. Also, speaking of movesets... if you feel really strongly about a character, you don't need to map out each attack. Just describe it in general. Focus more on if it's possible given modding constraints rather than "THIS COULD BE HIS MOVESET FOR SSB4" (where anything is possible).

I don't see how it's not possible, considering I've seen movesets in the past use a mix of projectiles and swords.

Hell, if Saki were to use Link as a base, I'd guess a moveset would be completely viable due to his file size and his amount of projectiles and articles.

Would it be a helluve a lot of effort? Hell yeah it would be. While I'd say my ideas are pretty grandeous and borderline why bother levels of effort, I feel like there could be some really cool stuff done with Saki.

 

[shinhed-echi]

For the most part I think people are not as outraged with the other clones.. If you've noticed, Ganondorf is the only one that keeps coming up.
Luigi makes sense as a clone, as does Lucas and Falco and Wolf. I think its stupid that Sakurai felt the need to add more friggin Landmasters in brawl, but whatever its fine. Falco and Wolf were different enough. The only other character I think could use decloning is actually toon link, but even he isn't that annoying to me. At least hes a link! GANONDORF ISN'T CAPTAIN FALCON JR. AND HE CERTAINLY IS NOT AN F-ZERO CHARACTER. WHY THE FFFFFFFFFFFFFFFFFFF IS HE A CLONE????????He is from another franchise, and he has VERY specific iconic moves that should be represented. That is the main problem we all have. Its STUPID and Sakurai is a friggin moron for making him a clone in the first place. Anyone who disagrees on that specific point is delusional.
The other clones don't even really have moves to work with. Fox, Falco and Wolf have no moves in Starfox, they made their moves up. Luigi has been a clone of mario ever since Mario Bros. in 1985, Lucas is pretty decloned already, and like I said, Toon Link at least is LINK.

So in conclusion, I see the point you're trying to make, but it is invalid.

I'm 110% sure after Ganon, everyone will want Toon Link to be represented by a WW moveset. And I seriously hope this doesn't mean another potential newcomer will become the old Toon Link just to satisfy unhappy Zelda fans. ("Best" case scenario, it's Young Link)

BUT, enough is enough, really. Just wanted a clear answer. I won't say your point is invalid, you just look at it from another angle. I still disagree with it, but I'll stop right here. I rather discuss other characters.

 

[BronzeGreekGod]

I'm 110% sure after Ganon, everyone will want Toon Link to be represented by a WW moveset. And I seriously hope this doesn't mean another potential newcomer will become the old Toon Link just to satisfy unhappy Zelda fans. ("Best" case scenario, it's Young Link)

BUT, enough is enough, really. Just wanted a clear answer. I won't say your point is invalid, you just look at it from another angle. I still disagree with it, but I'll stop right here. I rather discuss other characters.

K lets talk about Ray MKII

 

[shinhed-echi]

K lets talk about Ray MKII

Ray MKII seems like a pretty fine choice. I'm a sucker for robot characters for some reason.
How would you handle his size (issue)? (I know nothing about the franhcise, what's the difference between MKI, MKII, and MKIII? Are they the same characters?)

I'd leave his size as his Assist Trophy version. Or at least upscale him to Olimar's size.
Haven't really played Custom Robo, but I've always been interested in it. And from his moves in Brawl I see he could at least have some pretty awesome directional laser fire and missiles.

 

[Paradoxium]

I want to see them add characters who are in deserving titles and do not already have members from their game in the roster