New Characters for Project M Discussion Thread (Voting Closed)

[TopTierPichu]

Did you not play Mother 3? The Masked Man's techniques, if I recall correctly, consist of sword swipes, arm cannon shots, PK Thunder, and PK Love. He also has wings that he uses to fly away a few times. None of these wow me as much as they seem to wow others.

No, Masked Man and Ninten are just other kids who use PSI. I wouldn't be adverse to Giegue, or Loid, or Jeff, or Teddy. In fact, I think there's been a decent amount of support for Jeff, and I believe you mentioned Giegue a dozen or so pages ago. Perhaps it was somebody else?

Maybe you are right about Ninten but didnt you just contradict yourself about Masked Man?

 

[Shin F.]

No, Masked Man and Ninten are just other kids who use PSI. I wouldn't be adverse to Giegue, or Loid, or Jeff, or Teddy. In fact, I think there's been a decent amount of support for Jeff, and I believe you mentioned Giegue a dozen or so pages ago. Perhaps it was somebody else?
Fire Emblem ISN'T made up of sword users though. There are axe users, lance users, magic users, and bow users. Just like how Mother has more than just Ninten/Ness/Lucas types.

It was me who mentioned Giegue, yes, but the thing is - the attacks you mentioned for him in your original post were actually the ones suggested for Ninten. There is nothing Giegue can do, aside from looking like Mewtwo, that Ninten can't (since Mother characters borrow abilities from their team mates anyways). So, how is it that you're so very against one of them, and not adverse to the other?

You're not using your imagination for Claus at all. Just because he uses PK Thunder doesn't mean he has to use it in the same way as Ness/Lucas. He could have a PK Thunder Beam, use his sword rather than punches, kicks or PSI for his normals, use his wings to recover instead of PKT2. He can use his arm cannon. He'd be more like a mix of Meta Knight/Pit and Samus than a Ness/Lucas clone.

Also... Teddy? Why Teddy? What on earth could he possibly, as a sword user, offer that Claus doesn't? Claus is a more badass Teddy on crack.

I disagree. From my point of view, Pichu doesn't bring anything to the table aside from being an inferior clone of Pikachu. After seeing what they've done with Wario though, I have nothing but confidence that, if they tried, the PMBR could make Pichu not only decent, but quite a bit different from Pikachu. In that case, though, why not just make an all-new character? Why port a character that will have to be changed so much? If they are going to have to change it so much, then why not just make Plusle & Minun?
(Although I still think 8 Pokemon is too much.)

I don't care for Pichu either, but why on earth would you choose something like GROUDON of all things over him?

Maybe you are right about Ninten but didnt you just contradict yourself about Masked Man?

He's contradicting himself in most of what he's said since he started posting.

 

[Saito]

At first I wanted Pichu in only because of the latent potential the character had, but at this point I really want him in because of the aforementioned reason and to see just how much salt it will cause.

It will be even saltier when people start kicking ass with him too.

 

[Solbliminal]

Can we please talk about a character that is not on the OP? I want to see suggestions that might make me interested in a character.

-Ashley (Wario Ware)
-Ashley (Trace Memory)
-Donbe (Shin Onigashima)
-Takamaru
-Chibi Robo
-Daroach (Kirby)
-Anyone not on the OP

^ Do any of these characters strike someone's fancy? I don't know anything about these characters other than Ashley from Wario Ware and a little bit of info I dug up on Donbe.

 

[Shin F.]

Can we please talk about a character that is not on the OP? I want to see suggestions that might make me interested in a character.

-Ashley (Wario Ware)
-Ashley (Trace Memory)
-Donbe (Shin Onigashima)
-Takamaru
-Chibi Robo
-Daroach (Kirby)
-Anyone not on the OP

^ Do any of these characters strike someone's fancy? I don't know anything about these characters other than Ashley from Wario Ware and a little bit of info I dug up on Donbe.

Ashley, from Wario Ware. Can we talk about her? I don't know much about her, having not played many Wario games, but her song has me convinced she's a badass who deserves to be playable.

 

[Xebenkeck]

She's a witch.

 

[Starcutter]

you know who was in brawl?

Spoiler

 

[Shin F.]

She's a witch.

Yes, that I actually knew. I also know she has a companion called Red, who's a little demon. That's pretty much it.

you know who was in brawl?

Spoiler

King of Red Lions ftw! He can have water and wood based attacks, with his Final Smash being him turning human and touching the Triforce, getting an instant win for the match.

 

[Promestein]

So much to reply to... You sure know how to keep me busy.

Maybe you are right about Ninten but didnt you just contradict yourself about Masked Man?

Masked Man is a kid, Masked Man predominantly uses PSI. Compare to Ness and Lucas, who are kids who predominantly use PSI. Bonus points for all having the same body shape at the same time.
Compare to Giegue, who is an alien who uses extremely powerful PSI. Compare to Loid and Jeff, who are kids who use technology. Compare to Teddy, who is older and uses all sorts of blades.

It was me who mentioned Giegue, yes, but the thing is - the attacks you mentioned for him in your original post were actually the ones suggested for Ninten. There is nothing Giegue can do, aside from looking like Mewtwo, that Ninten can't (since Mother characters borrow abilities from their team mates anyways). So, how is it that you're so very against one of them, and not adverse to the other?

Exactly. Neither of the two use the attacks we mentioned, but both characters are from Mother. Techniques from Mother would fit for either, since neither really have attacks they could use in Project M. So, if they have the same proposed moveset, what reason is there to pick Ninten over Giegue? Giegue would fill that longed-for villain spot for Mother and doesn't look almost exactly the same as Ness.

You're not using your imagination for Claus at all. Just because he uses PK Thunder doesn't mean he has to use it in the same way as Ness/Lucas. He could have a PK Thunder Beam, use his sword rather than punches, kicks or PSI for his normals, use his wings to recover instead of PKT2. He can use his arm cannon. He'd be more like a mix of Meta Knight/Pit and Samus than a Ness/Lucas clone.

Has little to do with gameplay. Thematically, aesthetically, it's just not interesting. It, again, is another kid using PSI powers. Note that I didn't mention Ana, Paula, or Kumatora as alternatives up there either. Because they're kids, using PSI powers. I feel really repetitive saying that so much, but that's how it is. Mother has more than just kids with PSI powers, why not demonstrate some of them?

Also... Teddy? Why Teddy? What on earth could he possibly, as a sword user, offer that Claus doesn't? Claus is a more badass Teddy on crack.

It was just an example. However, Teddy could potentially be more interesting. Incorporating knives and his katana, it would be a bit better, I think, than Samus's arm cannon on Marth who has wings and PK Thunder (that was also a joke).

I don't care for Pichu either, but why on earth would you choose something like GROUDON of all things over him?

Don't be silly. It was a joke. In all actuality, if you asked me to pick legitimate characters to fill that 8th Pokemon slot, I'd say Blaziken, Plusle & Minun, Gardevoir, Deoxys, Darkrai would all fit better.

 

[TopTierPichu]

I just went through Brawl looking for stuff from Pokemon ranger (because they would make a good ZSS clone) but the only reference I have is the game appearing in the chronicle, I guess that isnt good enough to have them be considered. . .

 

[Saito]

Don't be silly. It was a joke. In all actuality, if you asked me to pick legitimate characters to fill that 8th Pokemon slot, I'd say Blaziken, Plusle & Minun, Gardevoir, Deoxys, Darkrai would all fit better.

I'm going to just throw it out there that Pichu is the only Pokemon based character who has a chance of making it in due to it being a Melee veteran.

Anyone else from Pokemon should probably be avoided.

That's my thought on the matter though.

 

[Starcutter]

Anyone else from Pokemon should probably be avoided.

?

 

[Shin F.]

Masked Man is a kid, Masked Man predominantly uses PSI. Compare to Ness and Lucas, who are kids who predominantly use swords. Bonus points for all having the same body shape at the same time.

Marth is a man. Marth is a man who predominantly uses a sword. Compare to Roy and Ike, who are men who predominantly use swords. Bonus points for all having the same body shape at the same time.

See what I did there?

So, if they have the same proposed moveset, what reason is there to pick Ninten over Giegue? Giegue would fill that longed-for villain spot for Mother and doesn't look almost exactly the same as Ness.

So, if they have the same proposed moveset, what reason is there to pick Giegue over Ninten? Ninten would fill that longed-for Mother 1 protagonist spot for Mother and doesn't look almost exactly the same as Mewtwo.

Has little to do with gameplay. Thematically, aesthetically, it's just not interesting. It, again, is another kid using PSI powers. Note that I didn't mention Ana, Paula, or Kumatora as alternatives up there either. Because they're kids, using PSI powers. I feel really repetitive saying that so much, but that's how it is. Mother has more than just kids with PSI powers, why not demonstrate some of them?

Wat. Taking aspects of different characters and using them to create one that is unique in their own way is what makes interesting characters. Ana, Paula and Kumatora are different in that their moves are already borrowed by others, where Ninten and Claus (and, yes, Giegue as well...) have unique techniques not yet in Brawl at their disposal.

It was just an example. However, Teddy could potentially be more interesting. Incorporating knives and his katana, it would be a bit better, I think, than Samus's arm cannon on Marth who has wings and PK Thunder (that was also a joke).
Don't be silly. It was a joke. In all actuality, if you asked me to pick legitimate characters to fill that 8th Pokemon slot, I'd say Blaziken, Plusle & Minun, Gardevoir, Deoxys, Darkrai would all fit better.

Now you're just trolling. Or you're a very casual player who can't tell the difference between Fox and Falco's movesets.

 

[PsionicSabreur]

Did you not play Mother 3? The Masked Man's techniques, if I recall correctly, consist of sword swipes, arm cannon shots, PK Thunder, and PK Love. He also has wings that he uses to fly away a few times. None of these wow me as much as they seem to wow others.

"But you can have them all together! Think of the tools!"
Somebody is getting ready to say that, as they read this, and, well, I can't really argue with that kind of logic, but the same could be said for all proposed characters.

Hm. I promised myself I wouldn't criticize your downvote, because I can get a little defensive of my choices, but here's where I don't follow your logic:

Besides, Masked Man only has, what, two attacks? PK Thunder and sword attacks, I believe, except for the final battle where he also can use PK Love.

This is incorrect. PK Love is used in both battles with him, and he obviously knows it throughout the game because he can pull needles, so I don't get how why you're downplaying it by saying it's a final battle only thing. As stated, Claus obviously possesses some form of swordsmanship, so not all sword attacks will be identical. Claus has an affinity for lightning, but I don't think it's ever described as PK thunder. Not to mention, he also uses the Shield Killer in battle and a bomb during a cutscene.
In contrast, Lucas has: PK Love, support PSI, hit with stick in-game.

The problem is you seem to be painting the moveset in the absolute worst light possible, whereas the same issue is ignored for a few of your upvotes. Just calling swordplay "sword swipes" completely ignores that his sword adds plenty of different moves, such as a stab, a slash, or the jump attack he uses before the first battle. Plenty of characters from RPGs were given this sort of treatment, or borrow moves as you've suggested for Giegue, so acting as if it exclusively makes Claus bland is flawed.
An arm cannon adds plenty of moves in the vein of Samus's aerials and the sort of playstyle you've envisioned for Pico, as well.

So, Masked Man has physical attacks, like Teddy, technology like Jeff, and PSI like Giygas/Giegue.

I can see how it might not wow you, but calling Claus's moveset potential shallow is a bit of a stretch.

Masked Man - The main reason for me opposing this character is stated in the OP: He is a walking spoiler. I can speak from experience, Project M convinced me to try out something I've never played before, namely Castlevania. It's been said that Lucas can wear the (Un)Masked Man's outfit in P:M 3.0. That is fine

Consider it like this, anyone who bothers to play Mother 3 after they play P:M will have seen Lucas wearing the Masked Man's clothes and using his sword, and possibly read Lucas's trophy, which states that he crosses swords with his missing brother, Claus. Why is such a dead giveaway okay but the character (who doesn't even have to be directly revealed as Claus) unacceptable?

However, I do not feel that Mother needs another representative, and especially not two from the same game

I wouldn't be adverse to Giegue, or Loid, or Jeff, or Teddy.

Why do you cite over-representation as an issue if it obviously isn't really an issue for you?

 

[Ninka_kiwi]

Can we please talk about a character that is not on the OP? I want to see suggestions that might make me interested in a character.

-Ashley (Wario Ware)
-Ashley (Trace Memory)
-Donbe (Shin Onigashima)
-Takamaru
-Chibi Robo
-Daroach (Kirby)
-Anyone not on the OP

^ Do any of these characters strike someone's fancy? I don't know anything about these characters other than Ashley from Wario Ware and a little bit of info I dug up on Donbe.

Takamaru is a personally favorite of mine, but I actually think he might have a pretty good chance of appearing in Sm4sh, so I really haven't thought to request/suggest him. I personally just think Lyn would be the better choice for a samurai type character as she is having no chance in Sm4sh.

 

[Yeerk]

When/if I ever reboot the poll (presumably when a new character is announced), I'll restrict the voting to non-technical reasons for wanting/not wanting a character. Reason being is that those are really completely different criteria and can be handled separately. For now though, what each potential candidate might be technically be capable of doing is still valuable to the discussion though.

I'm having trouble understanding. By "technical", do you mean how the character functions in the game (cloning, movement, attacks, animations) and the ease with which they're implemented?

If so, I think changing the requisites for voting is a good idea.

As long as it serves to exclude impossible/idiotic candidates, and therefore narrow down the candidates for the PMBR to choose from, I agree that it's valuable. But I don't see the rationality in that when comparing the value of two proven legitimate candidates like Andy and Sami. (Sorry that's my only example, it's just the one I'm most attached to.)

 

[Promestein]

Marth is a man. Marth is a man who predominantly uses a sword. Compare to Roy and Ike, who are men who predominantly use swords. Bonus points for all having the same body shape at the same time.

See what I did there?

It's true. Personally, I would have liked Hector to be in there somewhere as well, just to diversify, but I feel Roy was a good pick nonetheless. He was in Melee, and was different from Marth in the sense that he had unique attributes and animations, and some pros and cons over Marth. For a while, some even thought Roy would be ranked higher than Marth in the tiers because of his advantages.
(I only added that last part because somebody will say the same thing about Pichu and Pikachu.)

So, if they have the same proposed moveset, what reason is there to pick Giegue over Ninten? Ninten would fill that longed-for Mother 1 protagonist for Mother and doesn't look almost exactly the same as Mewtwo.

There is only one 'psychic cat' already on the roster. There are two psychic kids already on the roster. Although, I still think three reps is more than enough for Mother. That's equal to the amount of games the series has had. That would be like actually adding Louie for Pikmin.

Wat. Taking aspects of different characters and using them to create one that is unique in their own way is what makes interesting characters. Ana, Paula and Kumatora are different in that their moves are already borrowed by others, where Ninten and Claus have unique techniques not yet in Brawl at their disposal.

Oh, I thought your idea for Ninten involved PK Beam. While I don't believe a moveset consisting of 4th Dimension Slip, DefenseUp, OffenseUp, and LifeUp would be interesting in any way, to each their own.

Now you're just trolling. Or you're a very casual player who can't tell the difference between Fox and Falco's movesets.

Ah, yes. The "you must be trolling" defense. I haven't seen that used on me since Brawl launched.

I'm going to just throw it out there that Pichu is the only Pokemon based character who has a chance of making it in due to it being a Melee veteran.

Anyone else from Pokemon should probably be avoided.

That's my thought on the matter though.

I completely agree. Pichu is, without a doubt, the most likely candidate to get in. As you said, it was a Melee veteran and it has a huge edge because of that.
However, I do not think Pichu should get in. Again, what would it add (aside from Pichu) if Pichu were added? There ARE more deserving Pokemon to choose from (although that's relative, obviously).

 

[JCOnyx]

I'm just going to say this:

You do not have to be a fan of a series to up-vote a character from it. I have literally never played a Mother game and yet I'm a massive supporter of Claus/Masked Man. I've also never played Fire Emblem GBA which Lyn originates from. MM is also my least favorite Zelda game yet I wouldn't mind if Skull Kid got in, that would actually be pretty cool. I've also never played a MGS game, but Liquid would be boss.

Not everyone who is voting for these characters are raging fanboys, gosh people.

 

[Banjodorf]

The reason I was given as to why nobody is requesting Takamaru is that it's generally believed he has a pretty sizable chance of being in Smash 4, which is perfectly true. However, if he were to be revealed to not be playable, his odds and # of requests for Project M would likely increase, because he's such a cool, hype-tastic character. Sort of like Little Mac, if he somehow isn't playable in Sm4sh. Otherwise I'd be discussing him like there's no tomorrow.

Honestly, if anyone thinks we really need anymore Pokemon characters, please re-evaluate that. This is one of those times where overrepresentation is actually the problem. If Pichu or another Pokemon character is added, there's going to be alot more "Ugh, another Pokemon character" than there would be for another Mother character or even Zelda character. At least Zelda hasn't already used a clone slot.

I've already seen "If Mewtwo wasn't in Melee, I wouldn't have supported his inclusion" numerous times. 8 is too many, simple as that.

Also, I'm going to agree that people need to stop using "Walking Spoiler" as a reason for excluding Masked Man. If he's just called Masked Man, and since he's silent, doesn't say anything, why exactly would people automatically guess who it was? Nothing about the character has to be a spoiler, apart from already-existing data like Lucas' trophy, which even then is up for interpretation by people who don't know better.

 

[Shin F.]

Oh, I thought your idea for Ninten involved PK Beam. While I don't believe a moveset consisting of 4th Dimension Slip, DefenseUp, OffenseUp, and LifeUp would be interesting in any way, to each their own.

It did. I think you may have misread my comment. I was saying that they weren't as eligible because a majority of their moves were already borrowed by Ness and Lucas. When I said 'unique techniques not yet in Brawl', I was referring to both their techniques and those that could be borrowed. So, yes, that includes QuickUp and 4th-D Slip, it also includes things he could borrow that Ness and Lucas haven't, like PK Beam.

Ah, yes. The "you must be trolling" defense. I haven't seen that used on me since Brawl launched.

Defense? More like incredulous statement. Let's see...

1. Guy makes account on website to vote for something there.
2. Guy, in almost every post he's made, contradicts himself in multiple ways.
3. Guy just doesn't seem to understand how he's contradicting himself.

Yeah - intentionally or not, sounds like a troll. And you've been accused of being one before, eh? Huh. What coincidence.

I completely agree. Pichu is, without a doubt, the most likely candidate to get in. As you said, it was a Melee veteran and it has a huge edge because of that.



However, I do not think Pichu should get in. Again, what would it add (aside from Pichu) if Pichu were added? There ARE more deserving Pokemon to choose from (although that's relative, obviously).

Yes, but a lot of the ones you mentioned aren't more worthy than Pichu.
Blaziken - yeah, probably a good one. Maybe not more so than Pichu, though, since Blaziken may be similar to Captain Falcon anyway.
Plusle & Minun - It's just a double Pichu, and a more complex one, so no.
Gardevoir - wtf? Why? Just no.
Deoxys - Maybe.
Darkrai - Ehh, close but no.

 

[Promestein]

This is incorrect. PK Love is used in both battles with him, and he obviously knows it throughout the game because he can pull needles, so I don't get how why you're downplaying it by saying it's a final battle only thing. As stated, Claus obviously possesses some form of swordsmanship, so not all sword attacks will be identical. Claus has an affinity for lightning, but I don't think it's ever described as PK thunder. Not to mention, he also uses the Shield Killer in battle and a bomb during a cutscene.
In contrast, Lucas has: PK Love, support PSI, hit with stick in-game.

While I did forget, somehow, that he obviously knew PK Love beforehand, I wasn't trying to downplay PK Love at all. That'd be like trying to downplay, say, Sephiroth's Supernova by saying it's only in the final (real) battle.

The problem is you seem to be painting the moveset in the absolute worst light possible, whereas the same issue is ignored for a few of your upvotes. Just calling swordplay "sword swipes" completely ignores that his sword adds plenty of different moves, such as a stab, a slash, or the jump attack he uses before the first battle. Plenty of characters from RPGs were given this sort of treatment, or borrow moves as you've suggested for Giegue, so acting as if it exclusively makes Claus bland is flawed.
An arm cannon adds plenty of moves in the vein of Samus's aerials and the sort of playstyle you've envisioned for Pico, as well.

So, Masked Man has physical attacks, like Teddy, technology like Jeff, and PSI like Giygas/Giegue.

I can see how it might not wow you, but calling Claus's moveset potential shallow is a bit of a stretch.

While you certainly aren't wrong, I still can't agree. His moveset potential isn't shallow at all, it just does not seem interesting. I mean, Mew could be added and would have insane moveset potential, but I don't think it would be very interesting, nonetheless.

Consider it like this, anyone who bothers to play Mother 3 after they play P:M will have seen Lucas wearing the Masked Man's clothes and using his sword, and possibly read Lucas's trophy, which states that he crosses swords with his missing brother, Claus. Why is such a dead giveaway okay but the character (who doesn't even have to be directly revealed as Claus) unacceptable?

A valid point. I have no argument.

Why do you cite over-representation as an issue if it obviously isn't really an issue for you?

Again, I'm opposed to any new Mother reps. I just don't feel like the series needs any other characters.
BUT, if a Mother rep were being added and somebody told me to pick the one I feel would be best for both the series and Project M, it would likely be either Loid or Giegue.
(I will say this: I would like Masked Man being added if only so I could use his final battle theme fittingly.)

The reason I was given as to why nobody is requesting Takamaru is that it's generally believed he has a pretty sizable chance of being in Smash 4, which is perfectly true. However, if he were to be revealed to not be playable, his odds and # of requests for Project M would likely increase, because he's such a cool, hype-tastic character.

Is Takamaru seriously that popular? I loved his original game, but I thought he was pretty much forgotten.

 

[Anti Guy]

I'm having trouble understanding. By "technical", do you mean how the character functions in the game (cloning, movement, attacks, animations) and the ease with which they're implemented?

If so, I think changing the requisites for voting is a good idea.

As long as it serves to exclude impossible/idiotic candidates, and therefore narrow down the candidates for the PMBR to choose from, I agree that it's valuable. But I don't see the rationality in that when comparing the value of two proven legitimate candidates like Andy and Sami. (Sorry that's my only example, it's just the one I'm most attached to.)

Yeah, pretty much -- how easy it would be to put them in. That's a huge chunk of it, but in the end, they know best about that anyways.

 

[EdgeTheLucas]

Ashley seems like she could have potential if they decide to add her and not Captain Syrup from Wario Land instead. But I haven't played any WarioWare games, only every Wario Land game as well as Wario World and Wario: Master of Disguise.

About Captain Syrup...you know how she's a female pirate? What if they decided to go with her instead of Tetra, another female pirate? Because some people were for her but not Toon Zelda, and without Toon Zelda playing Tetra might feel odd, so going with Syrup might prove a better alternative for Tetra supporters.

Also someone downvoted Masked Man for being a walking spoiler...I was the person who brought that up. However, TopTierPichu reminded everyone that Lucas' trophy gives his identity away anyway, so my argument has been discredited. So, there's no reason to downvote Claus anymore if his spoilerness is your reason. (If he does make it in, I'd still keep him as "Masked Man" and not "Claus" however.) Plus support for him is dwindling since his outfit is being used as an alternate costume for Lucas anyway.

 

[Banjodorf]

Is Takamaru seriously that popular? I loved his original game, but I thought he was pretty much forgotten.

While his game isn't too well known with Western audiences, he's a sizably requested character in the more hardcore Smash fanbase, and quite a popular request in Japan iirc.

In addition, Sakurai's discussed wanting to add him before, but wanted to see if he got more exposure and more games. Now that he's had Western exposure with Samurai Warriors 3 and Takamaru's Ninja Castle in Nintendo Land, people are believing he has alot more credibility as a serious contender these days, which is perfectly logical and probably true.

 

[Yeerk]

At least Zelda hasn't already used a clone slot.

8 is too many, simple as that.

Honestly, I'm against the "(hasn't) already used a clone slot" reasoning. Not sure if it's a primary reason for you, or just something you're falling back on, but in my mind there's not much difference between a series having 6 chars (Zelda) and one having 8 (Pokemon).

 

[Banjodorf]

Honestly, I'm against the "(hasn't) already used a clone slot" reasoning. Not sure if it's a primary reason for you, or just something you're falling back on, but in my mind there's not much difference between a series having 6 chars (Zelda) and one having 8 (Pokemon).

It's not a primary reason for me, it just seems tacky for a series to use more than one of so limited a rersource, when the goal should be "Implement awesome characters people will be hype about, and give as much representation as possible while we do that."

Since the only logical Pokemon contender is Pichu, and he's not popular as is, why even consider using one of five on him?

 

[Anti Guy]

Ashley seems like she could have potential if they decide to add her and not Captain Syrup from Wario Land instead. But I haven't played any WarioWare games, only every Wario Land games as well as Wario World and Wario: Master of Disguise.

About Captain Syrup...you know how she's a female pirate? What if they deg ded to go with her instead of Tetra, another female pirate? Because some people were for her but not Toon Zelda, and without Toon Zelda playing Tetra might feel odd, so going with Syrup might prove a better alternative for Tetra supporters.

Also someone downvoted Masked Man for being a walking spoiler...I was the person who brought that up. However, TopTierPichu reminded everyone that Lucas' trophy gives his identity away anyway, so my argument has been discredited. So, there's no reason to downvote Claus anymore if his spoilerness is your reason. (If he does make it in, I'd still keep him as "Masked Man" and not "Claus" however.) Plus support for him is dwindling since his outfit is being used as an alternate costume for Lucas anyway.

I would love Captain Syrup as a playable character, and as a recurring villain in the Wario Land series, I think she should be in. That said, she's not in Brawl at all... which goes to show how much Sakurai hates Wario Land (on top of the whole making him based off Wario Ware)

 

[Shin F.]

That said, she's not in Brawl at all...

Honestly, it's a travesty when an important character like her doesn't rate so much as a sticker, and yet we have things like... the Trophy Stand Trophy.

*Time to go hack a sticker to look like Vaati*

 

[Solbliminal]

You all do realize we could just you know...vote and talk about the characters we want and if Sm4sh confirms them, disqualify said character. This prevents us from tip-toeing around ideas we want just because we are afraid they may already be confirmed. Fire away at Takamaru or whoever else. But if you all are still worried about that, I did suggest Donbe earlier. He seems very unlikely to be in the new Smash, but has a fairly decent reception. Anyone interested?

 

[Yeerk]

It's not a primary reason for me, it just seems tacky for a series to use more than one of so limited a rersource, when the goal should be "Implement awesome characters people will be hype about, and give as much representation as possible while we do that."

Since the only logical Pokemon contender is Pichu, and he's not popular as is, why even consider using one of five on him?

Oh, I wholeheartedly agree about Pichu. What I'm saying is neither franchise needs another character. I think "already too many" is a better reason for excluding Pichu than "only 5 spots left!"

It might be nitpicking, but it makes sense to me.

 

[Banjodorf]

Oh, I wholeheartedly agree about Pichu. What I'm saying is neither franchise needs another character. I think "already too many" is a better reason for excluding Pichu than "only 5 spots left!"

You're right, and it is, I just find there to be too many reasons to exclude him or any other Pokemon rep to ignore them all. The same could probably be said for Zelda too though, you're right.

Skull kid would still offer more than Pichu and Toon Zelda...

 

[EdgeTheLucas]

I would love Captain Syrup as a playable character, and as a recurring villain in the Wario Land series, I think she should be in. That said, she's not in Brawl at all... which goes to show how much Sakurai hates Wario Land (on top of the whole making him based off Wario Ware)

Aww, not even as a sticker?

I guess Ashley for second Wario rep then.

 

[True Fool]

Everybody who mentioned Lucas' new alt costume counting against Claus, should be aware that Lucas did in fact wear that outfit in Mother 3. That was part of the story, he wore the outfit as a disguise. If anything counts against Claus, it would be the fact that one of Lucas' colors is ALREADY A CLAUS PALETTE. The new costume did nothing to Claus' chances that Lucas' alt color didn't already do. Just so ya know.

 

[Promestein]

It did. I think you may have misread my comment. I was saying that they weren't as eligible because a majority of their moves were already borrowed by Ness and Lucas. When I said 'unique techniques not yet in Brawl', I was referring to both their techniques and those that could be borrowed. So, yes, that includes QuickUp and 4th-D Slip, it also includes things he could borrow that Ness and Lucas haven't, like PK Beam.

Indeed, I think I did misread your comment. My apologies.
I still believe that Giegue using borrowed Mother techniques could have more potential than Ninten using borrowed Mother techniques, and this is coming from somebody whose favorite Mother protag is Ninten. Ness is just so similar.

Defense? More like incredulous statement. Let's see...

1. Guy makes account on website to vote for something there.
2. Guy, in almost every post he's made, contradicts himself in multiple ways.
3. Guy just doesn't seem to understand how he's contradicting himself.

Yeah - intentionally or not, sounds like a troll. And you've been accused of being one before, eh? Huh. What coincidence.

I disagree. I don't think I've been contradicting myself at all, I just think perhaps I'm not being clear enough.

Yes, but a lot of the ones you mentioned aren't more worthy than Pichu.
Blaziken - yeah, probably a good one. Maybe not more so than Pichu, though, since Blaziken may be similar to Captain Falcon anyway.
Plusle & Minun - It's just a double Pichu, and a more complex one, so no.
Gardevoir - wtf? Why? Just no.
Deoxys - Maybe.
Darkrai - Ehh, close but no.

The only ones not very popular among those are Plusle & Minun, whose entire purpose would be to be a double Pichu.
Now that I think about it, though, that seems like it might actually solve a fair bit of problems with Pichu right there.

You all do realize we could just you know...vote and talk about the characters we want and if Sm4sh confirms them, disqualify said character. This prevents us from tip-toeing around ideas we want just because we are afraid they may already be confirmed. Fire away at Takamaru or whoever else. But if you all are still worried about that, I did suggest Donbe earlier. He seems very unlikely to be in the new Smash, but has a fairly decent reception. Anyone interested?

I'd say Donbe has as much chance to be in Smash 4 as Kraid, but I've never played Shin Onigashima. Enlighten us.

 

[Anti Guy]

Aww, not even as a sticker?

I guess Ashley for second Wario rep then.

Yep

Honestly, she'd be the one character that I would say "screw the rules" for; she's a friggin veteran character. Would Nintendo get upset for including Captain Syrup in the game? Seriously, thinking about a playable Syrup would be awesome. Tetra has nothing on her as far as she-pirates go

 

[Shin F.]

Indeed, I think I did misread your comment. My apologies.
I still believe that Giegue using borrowed Mother techniques could have more potential than Ninten using borrowed Mother techniques, and this is coming from somebody whose favorite Mother protag is Ninten. Ness is just so similar.
I disagree. I don't think I've been contradicting myself at all, I just think perhaps I'm not being clear enough.

Okay, I'll try to explain it as best I can.

Project M is a mod in which the primary purpose is to create move sets for characters with two goals:
1. Make it play like Melee, but improve it as much as possible so all characters are viable.
2. Stay as true to the characters as possible while maintaining balance.

Having said this, nothing matters more than the techniques and abilities each character has. Not representation. Not bringing something back just because. While that is important, it's all about the metagame.

When we say Giegue and Ninten have the same moveset potential as far as borrowed techniques and PSI, you say you'd take Giegue but not Ninten. Your best argument is 'he looks like Ness.' Yet, Giegue looks like Mewtwo. He's kind of different, but Ninten can also be made to look different if he's based on his appearance from the original Mother commercial, or even his sprite. You're rejecting one character for the exact same reasons you wouldn't mind the other, which is highly hypocritical. Now do you understand how you're contradicting your own statements?

The only ones not very popular among those are Plusle & Minun, whose entire purpose would be to be a double Pichu.
Now that I think about it, though, that seems like it might actually solve a fair bit of problems with Pichu right there.

I'd say Donbe has as much chance to be in Smash 4 as Kraid, but I've never played Shin Onigashima. Enlighten us.

Kraid has zero chance. I can't say anything about Donbe since I don't know him, but he's got to have more potential than Kraid of all things.

 

[Solbliminal]

I'd say Donbe has as much chance to be in Smash 4 as Kraid, but I've never played Shin Onigashima. Enlighten us.

I never played it myself. I was looking for characters that may interest others. Heck I haven't even played Joy Mech Fight and I would love to see Sukapon. All I know is that Shin Onigashima was a well received.

 

[ChronoBound]

I am not sure why people are arguing about Giegue/Giygas being a possible Mother newcomer considering he does not even qualify for Project M.

As for Donbe (and/or Hikari) showing up for Smash 4, I think its possible we might see an Assist Trophy based off of the two, however, as mentioned above, all the signs have been pointing towards Takamaru if Sakurai is going to go with a Japan-only retro character (I believe Sakurai even said back during Melee's development that if Takamaru ever had another game that he would include him. It remains to be determined whether Samurai Warrior 3's Nazo no Murasame mode or the Takamaru's Ninja Castle mini-game in Nintendo Land count to Sakurai as "another game", but I think they are good enough in Sakurai's book).

 

[Starcutter]

Tetra has nothing on [Syrup] as far as she-pirates go

it's because she's taller, isn't it?

 

[Alfonzo Bagpipez]

-Ashley (Wario Ware)
-Ashley (Trace Memory)
-Donbe (Shin Onigashima)
-Takamaru
-Chibi Robo
-Daroach (Kirby)
-Anyone not on the OP

^ Do any of these characters strike someone's fancy?

Not me...I'm sorry.

Now, onto what I came here for.
Based on popular demand (3 people), I will be giving ideas for Micaiah's specials (cloned from Ness). A full moveset may come later.
[collapse=da special specials]
Neutral B: Mend

very pretty, much heal...

A traditional Fire Emblem healing staff. Works just like Ivysaur's Synthesis, but working 1.25x faster. (dunno the actual numbers). Instead of being a charging sequence for an attack, the primary purpose of this is healing. However, upon the first 3 frames of the move, it acts as a pseudo-Counter. She'll counter using the staff, dealing 4% and causing a trip.

I would've used her trademark move "Sacrifice", but that doesn't make a whole lot of sense in a 1 v 1, and I dunno if it's possible to recreate in teams. If it is possible, maybe it can be like a Taunt switch type of thing, switching between Mend and Sacrifice.


Up B: Rexaura

On the ground, sends a large pillar of light energy directly above her, kind of like Pikachu's Thunder.
In the air, Micaiah fires the same pillar below her, propelling her upwards.
Not a good edge guarding technique due to the knockback, which always sends the enemy straight up, but good for kills off the top. Does 15% and doesn't have as much knockback as one would expect.


Side B: Light Ball (cloned from Ness' Final Smash)


PK Starstorm, but a little smaller (just a little). No charge necessary. Fires it straight ahead on the ground, diagonally downwards in the air (doing so will also send her backwards, like Mewtwo's Shadow Ball, allowing for SOME use in recovery). Travels VERY slow (just a bit faster than Lucario's Spirit Bomb), posing the threat of a strong, lingering hitbox. Only two can be out at a time. Does 13%, can only kill midweights at VERY high percents (>200%). Primarily a spacing move.


Down B: Thani (cloned from Ness' PK Flash)

Her signature spell in FE10.
I have 2 possibilities for how it could be made.

1. Having it travel and exploding at a set distance, not requiring player control, freeing up the player for
movement. This method is MUCH more useful than Ness' PK Flash, befitting for a signature attack.
The player can press Down B again to have it explode instantly for less power.
(25%, 15% if exploded prematurely)

*This would be optimal

2. Having it work EXACTLY like PK Flash with minor aesthetic changes. The easy way.


Final Smash: Goddess Yune


Micaiah becomes possessed by the Goddess Yune and uses all of her powers.
Her eyes become red and she emits a light yellow aura.
ALL of her attacks triple in percentage and knockback for 20 seconds.
She can move twice as fast and has an infinite number of jumps.

*Very minor spoilers

[/collapse]
Potential Alt Costumes:

Spoiler

Her original appearance for reference

Light Sage (I would prefer this one, her cutest outfit IMO)

Light Priestess

Her Awakening, fan servicey appearance (Dark Mage)

Muy bueno?
Tres mal?
How I do?