New AT-Glide Bounce

[HelloAxi]

Possibly a new AT that I found while playing around with Palutena. I haven't seen another post regarding it yet but I only quickly skimmed the threads. It utilizes her third up special: Jump Glide. This technique looks like this
(0:12)
I'm mostly just trying to figure it out in this replay.

After starting Jump Glide she moves backwards slightly then shoots forwards again.
Pay attention to 1:12 as well.

Didn't catch that? Here:

Yup. She is hanging on backwards. I freaked out about it and jumped off before i could try out rolling and attacking in this position and I have yet to replicate this. Reverse ledge hang might turn out to be a weird and interesting way to edgeguard in this game, if we find out how to do it consistently.

So how do you do this too?
Fairly simple. There are two ways to accomplish it.
First you need to unlock the custom move Glide Jump.
Then you can do it the way pictured in the video: Use GJ (on ground or in air) then turn Palutena around and immediately smash stick the way she is not facing, as if you were b-reversing it. She should move backwards a bit then bounce forwards again once she reaches top speed.
The much easier way is to b reverse it and then smash the opposite direction.
As a bonus you can use an aerial the entire time you are airborn. Fair into grab, anyone?

Notice how when she lands she also slides quite a bit. This maneuver seems somewhere between a wavedash and a dash dance. You can play mindgames with the jump glide, either charging ahead or Glide Bouncing back.

I think a god name for this technique would be Glide Bouncing or Hover Bouncing, seeing as it seems similar to a wave bounce but uses a glide.

My theory on how this works goes like this.
The bounce is a delayed, automatic, wave bounce that activates when the glide reaches top speed. The movement seems similar to a wavebounce's reflected momentum and is inputted as if you were using a b-reverse twice, in opposite directions.

Another trick with this is lengthening the glide before bouncing. This utilizes the top speed trigger, By only slightly using an directional input to move backwards and then releasing the control stick she will glide longer. In order to initiate the bounce back you need to reach top speed by pressing the way she is floating. This is how I changed the length in the video. It can be quite small (about as big as a marth dash dance in melee) or very large.
I think this can be used as a good approach and mindgames tool, strengthening what (atleast to me) appeared to be a weak character.
It's fairly easy to learn and can be practical and makes her much faster without using lightweight.
What do you guys think?

 

[InfinityCollision]

Interesting find. Kind of a pain on the 3DS, I think I'm inputting the up-b with a slight tilt backwards or something... won't be an issue with a GCC so whatever.

I see this as more of a mindgame/mixup tool than anything. It's somewhat reminiscent of options like WD back into fsmash. You can move back in to pressure with aerials or keep moving away as you see fit.

 

[HelloAxi]

Interesting find. Kind of a pain on the 3DS, I think I'm inputting the up-b with a slight tilt backwards or something... won't be an issue with a GCC so whatever.

I see this as more of a mindgame/mixup tool than anything. It's somewhat reminiscent of options like WD back into fsmash. You can move back in to pressure with aerials or keep moving away as you see fit.

I agree.
Additionally you can bouncle multiple times by using the more difficult method after the first. Requires more height but is possible.

 

[Cap'nChreest]

I've killed myself because of this before. I was doing the up-b off stage. Then I went the opposite direction and died.

 

[Yoshi Kirishima]

Wow, so much is being found out... haha for now I'm still just having lots of fun practicing and learning the basics. So much to play around with!

 

[TsuKiyoMe]

So... was messing around with it during my lunch break. This actually is really awesome and has some (narrow) uses.

Basically the input for those who don't quite understand it can best best be summarized as such:

Up B, brief pause, Back, Forward.

Just flick the joystick back to forward quickly as if you were trying to do a dash dance.

Once you get used to it and can do it on demand, it has a few interesting use cases.

1. Approaching w/ BAir

You can use it at slightly less than half FD distance to punish a laggy move with a BAir. You're technically not "Wave Bouncing" the Jump Glide as you want to hit BAir just before you achieve that. You could already do this with normal jump glide but sometimes going past them and Bairing them is too slow. Also, Bairing them into the center of the stage is not as good as just doing this. It's better than RARing a Bair also as it is much lower to the ground and will hit shorter characters like Greninja.

2. Reverse FAir.

If you input Up B, pause, Back, Forward, Back+A you'll get a FAir to come out that pushes her slightly forward from where you originally where. This is useful out of shield. Use it, go behind them and FAir them in the back. If it hits or is blocked, you can continue with things like Jab and such just as you would normally from an auto canceled Fair.

3. Retreating/Cross Up BAir
Input the bounce from out of shield and you'll go past them, then bounce back to your same spot. Mixing up with the Reverse Fair above, you have a mixup where your opponent doesn't know if you're going to immediately fair them then jab/grab them or if you're going to fake it and hit them with a cross up BAir. I'm not sure how practical this is in a game like Smash. If your opponent is no where near you, you can just pop them in the face with a retreating BAir if they try to approach/run in stupidly.


Basically, you have to be really good at this technique I feel like for this to be practical cause you don't ever want to mess it up. A lot of this stuff you need quick fingers and execution for it to have any real hope of being practical.

I'm gonna try to incorporate this stuff into my game. . . I just don't know if it'll be worth anything.

 

[HelloAxi]

So... was messing around with it during my lunch break. This actually is really awesome and has some (narrow) uses.

Basically the input for those who don't quite understand it can best best be summarized as such:

Up B, brief pause, Back, Forward.

Just flick the joystick back to forward quickly as if you were trying to do a dash dance.

You can do it off of the ground with out needing to pause by b reversing it then flicking the opposite way to gain speed. She pops up moving forwards while facing backwards if you do it correctly. It's much faster than the way I think you are describing. Forgive me if I misunderstand you but I believe the way you are describing is the way I used in the video which is slower and more difficult (but not as rough on the stick). I'll post a video later today of the faster way.

 

[TsuKiyoMe]

Messing around with Ninjalink and this trick.

Your "glitch" seems to only work on the Mute City stage from what we can see.

The "bounce" only seems to occur by the way when you hit a certain speed... so reversing your Jump Glide and going just a hair under max speed allows you to drift backwards the entire duration of the glide until you hit the floor. Speeding it up (holding forward again) will cause the bounce.

Why is this awesome? Because you can drift backwards and approach with Bair and beat all attacks that try to stuff you on approach. Think your Bair is going to get punished/blocked/side stepped? Speed up the Glide to max speed as you approach the floor... you'll slide backwards away from your opponent ala "Wave Dash"

This is awesome.

Edit: NinjaLink vid inc soon.

Edit 2: We now understand why this glitch works!

 

[HelloAxi]

Messing around with Ninjalink and this trick.

Your "glitch" seems to only work on the Mute City stage from what we can see.

The "bounce" only seems to occur by the way when you hit a certain speed... so reversing your Jump Glide and going just a hair under max speed allows you to drift backwards the entire duration of the glide until you hit the floor. Speeding it up (holding forward again) will cause the bounce.

Why is this awesome? Because you can drift backwards and approach with Bair and beat all attacks that try to stuff you on approach. Think your Bair is going to get punished/blocked/side stepped? Speed up the Glide to max speed as you approach the floor... you'll slide backwards away from your opponent ala "Wave Dash"

This is awesome.

Edit: NinjaLink vid inc soon.

Edit 2: We now understand why this glitch works!

That's what I was saying in the original post.
And I was wondering if it was just mute city with jank collision.
imagine if it worked on omega mushroom kingdom or another stage with walls.

 

[NinjaLink]

 

[HelloAxi]

Appreciate the credit, guys.

 

[KuroganeHammer]

Man this character is so glitchy LOL

 

[Admiral Pit]

This is probably one tech I can't do, along with the Super Speed one, but it's still great to know. Maybe the GCC will make it better.

 

[HelloAxi]

Man this character is so glitchy LOL

Rushed maybe? It's only alt moves.

 

[KuroganeHammer]

I think less rushed, more "no one does these things in playtesting and these moves all have weird af properties"

 

[SethTheMage]

Holy ****. Now I see no reason to not run Jump Glide. Great find!

 

[rpgcaster]

I'm hoping this will be easier to manage of the GCC. I can do it in training but not consistently in the heat of battle, and even then I'm not 100% sure on the applications. I do like the reversed jump glide Bair approach though~

 

[Skinutski]

So, about reverse ledge hanging. It seems that simply timing a turnaround at the apex of a vertical Jump Glide, right before you grab the ledge makes you sort of turn while you grab it. That's the ez way I guess.

Now if only there were practical applications other than being silly

 

[HelloAxi]

So, about reverse ledge hanging. It seems that simply timing a turnaround at the apex of a vertical Jump Glide, right before you grab the ledge makes you sort of turn while you grab it. That's the ez way I guess.

Now if only there were practical applications other than being silly

In my video I simply hit it after bouncing with no turnaround.
Perhaps the game thinks palutena is facing the right way when she does the reverse glide (but the animation is backwards because jumpglide is only designed to go forwards) and the bounce remedies that. But the animation is flipped on ledges, with the game thinking it is correct, once again. This means the ledge would act the same. But I digress.
What I'm saying is that turning at apex isn't the only way. Have you done it consistently with your method?

 

[Skinutski]

In my video I simply hit it after bouncing with no turnaround.
Perhaps the game thinks palutena is facing the right way when she does the reverse glide (but the animation is backwards because jumpglide is only designed to go forwards) and the bounce remedies that. But the animation is flipped on ledges, with the game thinking it is correct, once again. This means the ledge would act the same. But I digress.
What I'm saying is that turning at apex isn't the only way. Have you done it consistently with your method?

Yes, I'm able to hang on thin air quite consistently, I believe the turning is essential here. True, my method is not the only way, but the easy positioning makes timing the turn simpler than when gliding to it with horizontal momentum.

Now, having watched your video and tried out some bouncing to the ledge myself, I'm more inclined to believe that you actually hit the turnaround timing as you reached the ledge. My guess is that you continued holding right after bouncing, so that as you lost bounce-momentum you started the turnaround, just before grabbing the ledge.

edit: Here, I made something crappy

 

[HelloAxi]

So it looks like the get up attack is reversed and you end up facing the opposite way. Right?
what does a roll do?

 

[Skinutski]

So it looks like the get up attack is reversed and you end up facing the opposite way. Right?
what does a roll do?

Nothing spectacular, unfortunately. Rolling works just like the get up attack: you end up on stage, rolling towards the ledge.

 

[Saykrd]

I think the bounce is more input dependent than by "top speed" though. Its probably setup in a way where if the player inputs a direction opposite to the direction she's facing, it waits some number of frames while receiving input to allow her to turn around and then flips the vector to match her facing direction (since its assuming her movement vector is always pointing in the direction she's facing) .

We're probably confusing the game during the first few frames of the turn around to make it think she's facing the direction she's moving and then the game ends up correcting itself by thinking you're turning around again and then flipping her move vector.

That's my take on it at least, there might be more to it

(Edit: Actually I might be wrong, it's probably triggered by speed.)

 

[TsuKiyoMe]

Just in case it gets buried in the General Thread: This is still in the Wii U version

 

[Apple Jaxx]

So in order to keep the momentum for a reverse jump glide do you have to wiggle the stick back and forth? If I just hold the direction she bounces back automatically after a short distance.

 

[TsuKiyoMe]

Stop holding the direction. Just let the stick go neutral after you input the direction to move.

Up B, pause, Back, Forward, (let go of forward). When you want to trigger the bounce, hold forward again.

 

[Apple Jaxx]

I got it now, thanks!