Moves and Matchups Guide: Submissions Thread

[Wogrim]

Nowaytoeatatater I'm pretty much considering yours a joke post.
The Wario thing I'm not going to add until it has seen more testing. I still have hope for it because lag is significant when compared to how short hitstuns are in this game. Since the last group of characters we filled in decent information pretty fast, I'm going to open up submissions on several more characters again, mostly based on how often I've faced them (and therefore how likely I would expect you are to fight them):
Squirtle
Charizard
Ivysaur
Rob
Pit
Ness
Luigi
Ice Climbers
Lucario

I'm still working on new names for the sections and reorganizing them, so these will just go in Hard Matchups Part II for now. Please put what section you think a character should be in when you submit (5 is hardest, 1 is "easiest" (not necessarily easy, but the easiest 5 - 8 matchups should be a 1) )

 

[Nowaytoeatatater]

It really isn't much of a joke post. MK really is just that bad of a matchup for Falcon.

Or maybe the MK that I fight just is that much better than me.

 

[Wogrim]

It really isn't much of a joke post. MK really is just that bad of a matchup for Falcon.

Or maybe the MK that I fight just is that much better than me.

yea but you didnt really say anything useful except falcon kick, which was already in the guide

 

[Blackbelt]

Let's cover the Pokemon Trainer.

Squirtle: Congratulations, you actually have an advantage here.

Difficulty: Water Gun Gimp.

Solution: Recover from below the stage and grab the ledge. Any other recovery method will render you suseptible to gimping.

__________

Ivysaur: This matchup is so unfair...

Difficulty: Every approach option you have can be stopped by Ivysaur (Ground based approaches can be Razor Leafed, Diagonal approaches can be Vinewhipped, Straight above approaches can be Bullet Seeded)

Solution: Every move listed has at least a little bit of lag. You're gonna have to Mindgame Ivysaur into using something, than rush in (Bullet Seed has more lag than Vinewhip has more lag than Razor Leaf)

Difficulty: Ivysaur's Ground game is alot more powerful, and has more range than yours.

Solution: Knock Ivysaur into the air. Seriously, this is the only way you're gonna win, as Captain Falcon in the air is far more powerful than Ivysaur in the air.

______________________________

Charizard: Even game.

Difficulty: Flamethwoer wrecks ground based approaches.

Solution: Approach by air. Also, Falcon Kick can approach fairly easily, suprisingly.


Difficulty: Almost every one of Charizard's attacks can KO you easily.

Solution: Charizard's attacks are laggy. Take advantage of this. Play defensively.


Difficulty:Charizard's Shield grab has alot of range and is very fast.

Solution: Space well.

______________________________

Good Stages:

Batlefield: Ivysaur and Charizard don't work as well here as Captain Falcon does.

Lylat Cruise: The tilt hurt Ivysaur and Charizard quite a bit (Especially Ivysaur)


Bad Stages:

Final Destination: Ivysaur can have her way with you on this stage.

Any grounded stage: These stages erase Ivysaur's only weakness (Recovery)


Overall, the PT is somewhere between a 3 and a 4 matchup, mattering upon where other characters are placed.

 

[Nowaytoeatatater]

There, I fixed it.

 

[Revolutionary1804]

ok so Falco is a really hard opponent,
he can chaingrab
he can laser
he is a spacie

idk what to do besides play defensively but even then he can camp with lasers so any suggestions would be appreciated

 

[Wogrim]

ok so Falco is a really hard opponent,
he can chaingrab
he can laser
he is a spacie

idk what to do besides play defensively but even then he can camp with lasers so any suggestions would be appreciated

This is a submissions thread; you submit information for the guide (there's a link to it in the first post; it hardly gets bumped). If you have problems with a character that you don't know how to solve, your submission would look something more like this:

Falco

-- Chaingrab
+ ?

-- Laser spam
+ ?

Since those problems are already in the guide (and being a spacie isn't any real problem), your post is not very helpful. The point of the guide is for people who have a decent amount of experience against a good opponent to submit whatever helpful information they can about the matchup, since it will help us fight these characters better a lot faster than trying to find a good opponent of every character and playing enough games with them to get good at the matchup. For example, I played pretty evenly against a Marth today, but I would have done a lot worse if I hadn't have heard some good tips from submissions. This guide is a compilation of experience/knowledge about our foes, since no one has played enough games with a good opponent of every character to write such a guide by himself. I guess maybe you mistook this for a discussion thread....

 

[Blackbelt]

Lucas:

Since the dificulties have been named already, I'll go with the stages wrap-up.


Bad stage:

Final Destination: Generally speaking, projectile users just do well here.

Smashville: It's nice and flat, and Lucas can actually use the platform very easily.

Good Stage:

Lylet Cruise: The tilt wrecks PK Fire spam, and can hurt Lucas' Recovery alot when Lucas is forced to use PK Thunder.

Yoshi's Island (Brawl) : The uneven ground generally hurts Luicas.


Oh, and just a note: Lucas can edgeguard really well with PK Thunder and PK Freeze. Be careful.

 

[chaindude]

Lucas:

Since the dificulties have been named already, I'll go with the stages wrap-up.


Bad stage:

Final Destination: Generally speaking, projectile users just do well here.

Smashville: It's nice and flat, and Lucas can actually use the platform very easily.

Good Stage:

Lylet Cruise: The tilt wrecks PK Fire spam, and can hurt Lucas' Recovery alot when Lucas is forced to use PK Thunder.

Yoshi's Island (Brawl) : The uneven ground generally hurts Luicas.


Oh, and just a note: Lucas can edgeguard really well with PK Thunder and PK Freeze. Be careful.

just thought i'd add that the end of his bair is a meteor smash

 

[Blackbelt]

just thought i'd add that the end of his bair is a meteor smash

as a Lucas user, I can tell you that Bair spike is very difficult to land on faster characters, and Captain Falcon is definitely one of those characters.

 

[chaindude]

as a Lucas user, I can tell you that Bair spike is very difficult to land on faster characters, and Captain Falcon is definitely one of those characters.

really >.> i find it really easy i used lucas for a bit then i got sonic and TL everything just shifted away from lucas from there now he is a for fun character for me

 

[Wogrim]

Yeah this got stickied for some reason earlier today or late last night, I'm glad people still see it (I tend to look past the stickies). If anyone who stickied this reads it, please sticky the actual guide thread instead of this one, because this one gets bumped every day or nearly so, while the guide thread hasn't been bumped in over a week (there's a link to it in the first post of this thread).

I havn't reordered where the characters should go in the new difficulty groups, because I havn't played good versions of every character yet so I can't really compare them that well, so please give some input as to which characters should go in what groups. There should be roughly 8 in each group from nightmare (5) to fair (1) matchups; ignore the easy and very easy categories. So I need some input on who needs to be moved. Some characters definately need to be moved down and some up, but most of them I'm not really sure if they should be a 2, 3, or 4. So if you want to list out all the characters in a hardest-first order or just put the difficulty when you submit something for a character, that'd be nice.

And no I havn't updated the guide with submissions yet; I'll get to it when I'm ready to put in all my thoughts on the new characters I've opened submissions for (sometime tommorrow probably).

 

[A2ZOMG]

I don't see why Sonic is a bad matchup.

Falcon actually wins in priority in this matchup. U-air >>> Sonic's air game. Also he wins in KO power. I see the matchup as rather even at worst.

 

[Red Alloy]

I don't see why Sonic is a bad matchup.

Falcon actually wins in priority in this matchup. U-air >>> Sonic's air game. Also he wins in KO power. I see the matchup as rather even at worst.

It's a bad matchup because they're all bad.

 

[Blackbelt]

It's a bad matchup because they're all bad.

And that, Ladies and Gentleman, is the sad truth.


The only exception is Squirlte, and he can just call out the dreaded Ivyzilla, making it a moot point. T_T

 

[Wogrim]

Updated the guide.

I still need input on which characters deserve which difficulty rating (just call them 1 through 5 still, 5 is hardest, because I'm still toying with difficulty names).

I'll probably open submissions on the rest of the characters tommorow.

And thanks for the info, but please be a little more specific on how stages "hurt" characters.

One last thing: do you think it would be good to list all of each character's kill moves (or main kill moves) so that we know which ones to watch out for?

I'm also thinking the video section might not be very useful....

 

[dobee]

Oh I play a Falco every friggin day, and that match is still ********. But im experienced with one so i'll see what I can do

Falco

-- Chaingrab
+ Dont get Grabbed. I know this may sound ******** or everyone says that, but that is the truth. Either that or be prepared to start each stock at 60%... And make sure you stay calm, dont go mashing buttons and just keep DIing away. So when they go for the spike off the edge you can possibly still recover.

-- Laser spam
+ Man keep spot dodging, rolling and powershielding. I've gotten pretty good at approaching through laser spam from just dodging them. And if they're actually good at shdl (short hop double lasers) then try to approach from the air because if you approach from the ground chances are you'll get grabbed.

Moves
+ Nair to neutral a
This combo ***** falcon if your not careful... and neutral a can cancel out a smash attack... too broken.
+Dair spike
Not the best spie in the game but pretty good. Just meteor cancel it right and you shouldbe good up to about 70% Also falcon's uair outranges it so use it
+Bair
That thing is friggin strong when sweetspotted, and it has high priority
+FSmash
Deceptive range and power makes this pretty good move and it hits behind them...
+Dsmash
Will **** you if your not careful, It comes out quick so watch out

Good Stages
+ Delfino Plaza : This place ***** falco when the platform is floating through the air. His side-b is almost useless because they will just go through the platform if not sweetspotted. So edgeguard even if you arent invulerable because unless your damage is high you can recover and falco will jutt float to his doom.

+ Halberd
Same reason...

Bad Stages
+FD: Flat stage, no platforms or anything... Falco can do anything he wants.

+ Jungle Japes (legal in my area)
If you played melee you know exactly why this is. But if you didnt, The side b will sweet spot from anywhere, he has a spike, lasers are exact height to **** anyone on this stage.

Other stuff.
Falco can tech chase like a mofo... if youre not careful, uair will take you to you're doom
But Falco's recovery is predictable. USE FALCON PUNCH when he side b recovers if he doesn't sweet spot it , he's dead. Trust me and if worst comes to worst, then he will just recover and the battle will continue.
I think thats it, if you have any other questions that i missed feel free to ask.

OH and some videos against a falco

http://ie.youtube.com/watch?v=uZjM0Hmj97g

http://ie.youtube.com/watch?v=5BQm7kg7pBA

http://ie.youtube.com/watch?v=dK73yYeJ12U

http://ie.youtube.com/watch?v=uEr_H4M56gk

 

[Tenki]

A2ZOMG:
uh... I posted a link to your Sonic vs Mario video thread. I didn't watch the videos, but according to some people in the Sonic section, the person that you play with who uses Sonic isn't exactly too good with him. Maybe you don't have experience against good Sonic players..?

4 {Painful Matchups}

4.8 Sonic​

Summary
-- I'll write this; please do not submit a summary

Difficulties

-- Homing Attack
+ This move seems to like to come from the top; just time a UTilt (or Falcon Punch?) [00]

-- He's faster than you
+ Kill him to regain your honor! [05]
+ Keep the pressure up; his moves are slow and his jab is a lot slower than Falcon's [05] [00]

Quotes

Bad Stages

> Stage 1 Name
-- Why not to fight here
+ Tips for fighting here

> Stage 2 Name
-- Why not to fight here
+ Tips for fighting here

Good Stages

> Stage A Name
++ Why to choose this stage

> Stage B Name
++ Why to choose this stage

Videos

> Video 1 (link to a good fight between Falcon and this character)
++ Moments to focus on/examples of points made in the guide (particularly difficulties and how to solve them)

> Video 2 (link to a good fight between Falcon and this character)
++ Moments to focus on/examples of points made in the guide (particulalry difficulties and how to solve them)

lol I can help you out there.

-- Homing attack
+ Dodging will make it lose its target
+ Shield > U-air to counter

-- Spindashes (grounded or aerial) link into true combos or juggles
+ Grounded spindashes can be stopped by jab spam
+ They are generally used as move punishment or from techchasing.

-- Sonic tech-chases very... very well.

-- Spring is sometimes used to do auto-cancelled D-airs for spacing or movement.
+ These tend to get predictable, especially if they're facing you. If that's the case, shield and try to grab their landing, or see if you can catch his landing with a smash or aerial.

-- He's considerably faster than you... on the ground.
+ His speed (running, spindash, move cancels) can be used to bait attacks and reactions. He also has enough speed to close distance quickly, so don't feel safe just because he's standing half way across the stage, or think that spamming a tilt while waiting for him is a safe thing to do.
+ On the ground, speed can be used to escape you, so chasing will only lead to whiffed moves.
+ His general aerial speed is more... normal. If you have him in the air, you can chase from the ground.

-------------

Good Stages (for Falcon vs Sonic):
Battlefield, Lylat
- Platforms tend to ruin the aerial game, and vertical escapes/approaches (autocancelled D-airs from spring, Full hop over opponent, etc) are pretty common for him, so he loses alot there. This forces him to play a pretty grounded game. However, this isn't to say that you should be underestimating him. His u-airs have good vertical priority, so try to keep him above you. BF isn't a COMPLETE counterpick though. The small stage makes it easier to bring people off the edge, and needless to say, Sonic has an above-par gimping game.

Yoshi's Island
One large platform can mess up some of Sonic's aerial approaches again, but a notable thing about this level is that you cannot go under it, and sometimes platforms come up to save a gimped person. Some of Sonic's KO's are done via gimps, stage spikes, and sending people under stages, and this stage skews with that.


Bad Stages (or stages that Sonic does well in?):
- FD, Smashville, Halberd
Flat stages with alot of gimp opportunities. Halberd has a low ceiling and Sonic can go under/through the platform when it's in the air, and this can work to his advantage.

 

[Doggalina]

Wogrim, maybe you should add the average killing percent of each killing move next to its name.

I fight Kirby, MK, ICs, Snake, Mario, and Falco regularly; so I may write some stuff up about those. The Mario just started playing him (he plays ICs, too), but he's picking some stuff up.

Maybe you should add a section on secondary character that can counter Falcon's worst matchups.

>Fair (the knee)
++ At least on Battlefield, it's pretty much an autokill at around 100% even with DI.

 

[Hero Falcon]

Kirby

I fight Kirbys all the time and this is what Ive analyzed so far...

#1: At early %'s usually they go for fthrow<uair. If its right of the new stock they also throw in fthrow<fb. That is pretty much about 45%.

#2: If you ever go into a jab anything they usually like to just dtilt<fsmash so these times you always read early and dair. In fact dair ALOT against kirby if you ever expect an attack in close range. You avoid and punish. Too manny Falcons are afraid because of the lag but if you hit them while they are attacking it dosent matter. (Make sure its not when they are at an early % and you are at high %'s because then they bair or hammer you since they didnt go high enough.)

#3: ALL Falcons need to master their spacing. One thing is utilt. Smart Kirby players tend to poke alot with bair and retreat it, so you need to space and utilt. It kills and semi-sidesteps you from attacks.

#4: When you are being edgeguarded they also like to get on top and stone read it early and grab them out of it with your upB. In fact do this every time you see the stone .Your edgeguarding him usually consists of reverse uairs.

Overall I give this matchup: Falcon being a 3
Kirby a 3.

(Sometimes they like to be funny and swallow you only to spit you back out under the stage while they recover. You can be awsome and just recover to the other side.)

 

[Doggalina]

Against Kirby, I've learned that recovering from below the stage is freaking dangerous due to Kirby's nasty dair.

Kirby
> Dair can gimp you
++ Don't recover from below

Mario
> Cape can gimp you
++ Don't Raptor Boost to recover EVER.

 

[Matumakka]

I 2nd main Falcon, and ive had it easier against lucas when im wit him then my main shiek ( as ridiculous as that may seem) and ive vs toruney winning lucas's so im being serious here.
Lucas:
I actually never have had a big problem wit him in the past due to certan reasons:

. using tilts such as f-tilt for spacing and Utilt for hitting him while hes gliding in the air rly help
. If you have noticed, if you throw down lucas at a range of specific damage, lets say from like 40 and up, if you use the knee, it will almost always hit. its the pefect killer against lucas.
(im not sure about ness yet.)
. Falcons speed also helps greatly, but you have to use it wisely and not F*** up when lucas has his mind game face on
. And Falcon can kill. DUH

 

[Wogrim]

Consider all characters opened; I don't have time to put them in right now.

 

[mr_kennedy44]

I can add another bad stage for Snake.

> Lylat Criuse
-- Snake's mines blend in with the platforms.
-- Snake's u-tilt is perfect for hitting you on the platforms.
+ Snake's grenade game is hurt here by the tilting.

 

[Wogrim]

I'm working on recoloring the guide and adding the rest of the characters, so it probably won't be updated tonight.

 

[Wogrim]

6.1 Bowser
6.2 Donkey Kong
6.3 Fox
6.4 Ganon
6.5 Ike
6.6 Jigglypuff
6.7 Link
6.8 Mario
6.9 Peach
6.10 Samus
6.11 Sheik
6.12 Wolf
6.13 Yoshi

Got them in there and recolored the guide; let me know if I forgot a character.

I'll do a full update tommorrow, including moving the characters around to the difficulties I feel they belong in.

 

[Wogrim]

I've put in all the info I can remember from fighting those characters, but for about half of them I couldn't think of anything to put (either because I havn't played them enough or I'm too tired). Update isn't finished, as I havn't gotten your guys' input in there yet, or moved characters to the right sections.

 

[Red Alloy]

Luigi

-Tornado
+While it's often used for recovery, this move has a somewhat laggy ending. Proper timing can allow for a spike.

-Missile
+Time it right and you can unleash a Falcon Punch. Don't abuse it, though. He can figure that out and wait until you're vulnerable.

 

[Wogrim]

I 2nd main Falcon, and ive had it easier against lucas when im wit him then my main shiek ( as ridiculous as that may seem) and ive vs toruney winning lucas's so im being serious here.
Lucas:
I actually never have had a big problem wit him in the past due to certan reasons:

. using tilts such as f-tilt for spacing and Utilt for hitting him while hes gliding in the air rly help
. If you have noticed, if you throw down lucas at a range of specific damage, lets say from like 40 and up, if you use the knee, it will almost always hit. its the pefect killer against lucas.
(im not sure about ness yet.)
. Falcons speed also helps greatly, but you have to use it wisely and not F*** up when lucas has his mind game face on
. And Falcon can kill. DUH

First point doesn't really address a problem, so I don't have a place for it.
Second point I find very hard to believe, and still doesn't address a problem.
Third and fourth points aren't helpful at all.

Please follow the formatting instructions and address the problems in the guide if you don't have any.

The guide is updated and has a new section, which is basically meant to be a quick reference of moves to avoid: their combos, their kill moves, and their gimping/edgegaurd moves; it will be a simple list of moves, and will have no commentary and no credits. It is just supposed to be a quick reference of things to think about when you are at low percents, high percents, and recovering, which will allow you to better anticipate your enemy's plans.

Here's a very rough idea as to which difficulty sections I will be moving characters around to, but since I have been spending a lot of my smash time on the boards lately and havn't played good versions of all characters, please suggest modifications. And make sure to tell me if I forgot a character.

Nightmare

Wario
TL
Marth
Olimar
G&W
MK
Pikachu

Painful

Zelda
Kirby
Falco
Fox
IC
Diddy
ZSS
Ivysaur
Snake

Difficult

Rob
Pit
Lucas
Ness
Lucario
DDD
Diddy
Sonic

Not-So-Bad

Charizard
DK
Bowser
Ike
Peach
Mario
Luigi
Sheik

Fair

Ganon
Samus
Captain Falcon
Jigglypuff
Squirtle
Yoshi
Link

 

[The real Metal Man]

After all the toning down of captian falcon he still has some life left in it just means now I can't be as farntic with him and I will need to slow down a bit.

He s my favorite and always will be.

his knee is still good but harder to sweet spot but with brawls floatyness it means his fast falling is not as big a problem now.

but what I do say is that falco vrs falcon usally ends with falcon in bad end.

 

[Wogrim]

Moving the characters around is a big pain since I have to change colors, so forgive me if they are labeled in the wrong sections for the next couple of days.

 

[Wogrim]

Characters moved around and in order of toughest to easiest (in my opinion). Don't bug me about moving a character within a section until we have more info, but if you want to suggest moving a character to a different section and can back it up, go for it. I also finally got pictures in for further ease of navigation, although a few of them are not final because I havn't found the appropriate ones.

So the guide would look really sweet if we had some more info... (hint hint).

 

[Nitros14]

I have to say it's impressive the work you're putting into Captain Falcon, this board had nothing but 'Falcon sucks' a month ago.

I main Bowser so I can say a few things on him.

+ He'll rarely use fire breath just standing on the ground (which is begging to be punished), it's almost always short hopped.

- If he approaches with a short hop and uses fire breath it will beat out spot dodging, rolling and shielding and he can point it straight down making you take at least 30% trying to DI through it, more at low percents. He's helpless due to it's lag if you jump over his approach.

- If he short-hops fire breath backwards defensively just wait it out, he can't fire breath forever it has to recharge. That leaves an opening for spaced aerials and follow ups.

+ Bowser can do an aerial grab with flying slam that has an animation similar to his forward air, be careful trying to shield if he approaches from the air.

+ His up air kills extremely early (60-80%), avoid it at all costs.

+ Due to his massive bulk his down smash will eat up anyone who's predictable in rolling behind him. Very large hitbox and lasts a long time (if he whiffs it he's completely vulnerable though)

+ His fist will mysteriously enlarge giving his forward tilt surprising range, it will clank or go through most moves in the game, including mach tornado and falcon kick. Don't underestimate it's range or priority.

+ His up tilt has as much knockback as his up smash and is much faster, a main kill move. I noticed you mentioned his up smash but not this.

+ Bowser loves Whirling Fortress (UP+B) out of shield, you need to make sure you space yourself away from him after aerials that get shielded or you'll eat this repeatedly for 16%. If you space well you can bait him into using whirling fortress and punish it's severe lag.

+ Bowsercide is easily counterable by DI-ing towards the stage (assuming you're lower percent than him, which is usually the case when a Bowsercide is attempted).

+ Norfair is easily Bowser's best stage, but any stage with lots of platforms to put his wicked up tilt to use and to protect himself from aerial approach is helpful for him. Battlefield is another one to avoid.

That's pretty much all I can think of. Perhaps it'll help your guide look nicer.

 

[SmashBrother2008]

First point doesn't really address a problem, so I don't have a place for it.
Second point I find very hard to believe, and still doesn't address a problem.
Third and fourth points aren't helpful at all.

Please follow the formatting instructions and address the problems in the guide if you don't have any.

The guide is updated and has a new section, which is basically meant to be a quick reference of moves to avoid: their combos, their kill moves, and their gimping/edgegaurd moves; it will be a simple list of moves, and will have no commentary and no credits. It is just supposed to be a quick reference of things to think about when you are at low percents, high percents, and recovering, which will allow you to better anticipate your enemy's plans.

Here's a very rough idea as to which difficulty sections I will be moving characters around to, but since I have been spending a lot of my smash time on the boards lately and havn't played good versions of all characters, please suggest modifications. And make sure to tell me if I forgot a character.

Nightmare

Wario
TL
Marth
Olimar
G&W
MK
Pikachu

Painful

Zelda
Kirby
Falco
Fox
IC
Diddy
ZSS
Ivysaur
Snake

Difficult

Rob
Pit
Lucas
Ness
Lucario
DDD
Diddy
Sonic

Not-So-Bad

Charizard
DK
Bowser
Ike
Peach
Mario
Luigi
Sheik

Fair

Ganon
Samus
Captain Falcon
Jigglypuff
Squirtle
Yoshi
Link

This quide all seems very accurate to me; except for Ike. Ike should be down in "Fair".

 

[Wogrim]

This quide all seems very accurate to me; except for Ike. Ike should be down in "Fair".

My problem with Ike is you can't really approach from the air because of his huge smash range and retreating fairs/nairs. And if you mess up on an approach you can get killed from a fatty fsmash at low percents. If you have some good information for where his new spot should be (in between which characters) and why, please submit it.

Here's how the list currently is in the guide:

3 {Nightmare Matchups}

3.1 Meta Knight
3.2 Pikmin & Olimar
3.3 Pikachu
3.4 Marth
3.5 Mr Game and Watch
3.6 Toon Link
3.7 Wario​

4 {Painful Matchups}

4.1 Ice Climbers
4.2 Falco
4.3 Zelda
4.4 Zero Suit Samus
4.5 Ivysaur
4.6 Fox
4.7 Kirby
4.8 Snake​

5 {Difficult Matchups}

5.1 ROB
5.2 King DeDeDe
5.3 Pit
5.4 Diddy
5.5 Lucas
5.6 Ness
5.7 Sonic
5.8 Wolf
5.9 Lucario​

6 {Not-So-Bad Matchups}

6.1 Bowser
6.2 Donkey Kong
6.3 Charizard
6.4 Luigi
6.5 Ike
6.6 Mario
6.7 Peach
6.8 Sheik​

7 {Even Matchups}

7.1 Ganon
7.2 Link
7.3 Samus
7.4 Jigglypuff
7.5 Captain Falcon
7.6 Yoshi
7.7 Squirtle​

It's supposed to be hardest to easiest (even in the sections), so tell me where you want Ike (and any other changes). Basically I have Yoshi and Squirtle as easy matchups right now (they're below Captain Falcon), although I'm thinking Jiggs should go down there too because of ridiculously short range. But this is mostly from my limited personal experience, so lots of input is good (including on the characters, not just how hard they are).

 

[SmashBrother2008]

I 2nd main Falcon, and ive had it easier against lucas when im wit him then my main shiek ( as ridiculous as that may seem) and ive vs toruney winning lucas's so im being serious here.
Lucas:
I actually never have had a big problem wit him in the past due to certan reasons:

. using tilts such as f-tilt for spacing and Utilt for hitting him while hes gliding in the air rly help
. If you have noticed, if you throw down lucas at a range of specific damage, lets say from like 40 and up, if you use the knee, it will almost always hit. its the pefect killer against lucas.
(im not sure about ness yet.)
. Falcons speed also helps greatly, but you have to use it wisely and not F*** up when lucas has his mind game face on
. And Falcon can kill. DUH

To be honest, Lucas IS very punishable. And what better character to use for punishing?! Captain Falcon!

 

[Tenki]

I'd just like to note that you can jab Sonic out of his d-smash.

THE D-smash that outprioritizes MK's tornado.

hahahaha

 

[TokiDoki]

I'm not sure because I've only tried this on a level 9 cpu but if you grab release Wario you can use u-tilt or an up angled forward smash for a guaranteed hit.I think you can even chain grab him too when he reaches a little above falcon's head as he's falling. Of course this is on a cpu so I don't know if it works on a human.

 

[Wogrim]

I'll update tonight. I have some Sheik info to fill in.

 

[Wogrim]

Havn't seen a reason to move Ike yet so I havn't. I'll look more into the Wario grab release sometime to see what moves after it are inescapable. I feel like I'm forgetting something, so I'll just fill it in if I remember it later. Otherwise the guide is updated.