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Most Realible Kill Moves

FuLLBLeeD

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I've been playing Samus alot, and I really like her. I can rack up damage really fast, but I have trouble landing the kill sometimes. So I have some questions.

Is fsmash really that terrible? Does angling it up get kills at lower percents?

Is there a way to punch or smash into a chargeshot? Whats the best way to set up for dtilt?
 

n00b

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The fsmash is not a terrible move at all, relative to a lot of Samus's moves. It's terrible compared to its Melee counterpart, but it can get the job done. I use it to punish and stuff dash-ins, its decent out of a shield dash drop and bomb setups.. If your opponent gets predictable to pressure and rolls behind you, do an empty sh or whatever might force them to roll behind you and just charge an fsmash in the opposite direction.. granted, that won't work on the more intelligent players. Angling it up tends to have higher knockback, yes, but chances are you've racked up enough damage to be throwing out fsmashes for kills.

I set up my chargeshots after eliminating most of the players options. Usually it's during their recovery, or after a set up. While they recover, their main priority is to get to safe ground.. This leaves them vulnerable to a well placed charge shot because they don't have as many options as they would on the ground. As for setups, I like to force them to move into a shot rather than try to combo because it's an obvious combo ender. For example, I could approach with a SH super missile cancel, and right when I land do a full jump charge blast. Some players would instinctively react to the imminent threat of a super missile with a jump, but the charge shot stuffs that as well. A more classical textbook setup is just shzair -> charge shot, but as the game developed I don't think people fall for that as easily.

Also, grab release sets up great for both dtilt and charge shot. It just takes a bit of mindgames and tricky timing to trap your opponent into reacting poorly and getting punished for it.

Good luck!
 

Crystanium

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Is fsmash really that terrible? Does angling it up get kills at lower percents?

Is there a way to punch or smash into a chargeshot? Whats the best way to set up for dtilt?
Samus' best KO moves are as follows:

D-tilt: 131%

F-smash: 133%; 123% upward; 145% downward

D-smash: 144% uncharged; it should be noted that if the opponent walks or runs into the d-smash, the damage and knock-back is increased. This was seen in Ravin's video between him and Mr. Game & Watch.

B-air: 122% if Samus hits Mario with her foot.

Charge Shot: 109% (charged)

This was all tested on Mario.

As for using a smash attack and then using your Charge Shot, that's an unusual one. You can use your f-smash, and if that lands, you can follow it up with your Charge Shot.
 

FuLLBLeeD

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In the Smash Back room discussion, someone said that Samus's killing problems will become less of an issue over time.

See, Samus does kill at decent percents. Falco's forward smash is actually worse than Samus's iirc. The problem is landing the moves. This thread will serve as a guide to setting up and landing fsmash, chargeshot, and dtilt.

We already know Samus is deadly off the edge. so this thread is for learning to set up the other kill moves. If we can just learn a set up for up angled fsmash, that would be great.
 

XxBlazingSpeedxX

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well ive also been able to kill with a Utilt at about 100% from the edge of the stage. Like when they try to jump back after they have been hanging on to the ledge will almost be a definite kill if it hits.
 

FuLLBLeeD

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well ive also been able to kill with a Utilt at about 100% from the edge of the stage. Like when they try to jump back after they have been hanging on to the ledge will almost be a definite kill if it hits.
Thanks man! This seems like a great way to edgegaurd. I'll have to try it out, though when I try to utilt I always end up doing the flamethrower by accident. :/
 

Crystanium

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Thanks man! This seems like a great way to edgegaurd. I'll have to try it out, though when I try to utilt I always end up doing the flamethrower by accident. :/
Simply hold up on the analog stick and tap neutral A. I have "Tap Up" off so that I will not jump. Anyway, that's really only good if your opponent is above the stage while trying to return. I'd recommend using your Homing Missiles and z-air to edge-guard.
 

XxBlazingSpeedxX

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Simply hold up on the analog stick and tap neutral A. I have "Tap Up" off so that I will not jump. Anyway, that's really only good if your opponent is above the stage while trying to return. I'd recommend using your Homing Missiles and z-air to edge-guard.
yeah thats true, itll only work if they jump back onto the stage. So, if your playing someone that doesnt seem to that very much Dryns right Zair and Homing missles are your best option.
 

FuLLBLeeD

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Simply hold up on the analog stick and tap neutral A. I have "Tap Up" off so that I will not jump. Anyway, that's really only good if your opponent is above the stage while trying to return. I'd recommend using your Homing Missiles and z-air to edge-guard.
It seems like it would be good against Fox/Falco/Wolf though.
 

Crystanium

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yeah thats true, itll only work if they jump back onto the stage. So, if your playing someone that doesnt seem to that very much Dryns right Zair and Homing missles are your best option.
Yeah. Homing Missiles set up Samus so that she can use her d-air and spike her opponent. That's what n00b once told me. Z-airing off of the stage is also useful, because it can push your opponent back. You can actually KO your opponent with z-air.
 

n00b

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^ If you don't believe the HM -> dair setup, watch Rohins in offstage super samus mode.. haha

Oh, and a setup for utilt on the edge

If I notice they like to recover from below the edge or with a grapple, I do a bomb drop edgeguard (drop the bomb and roll back onto the stage)

Once they get wise to that, I'll run at the edge of the stage and drop a bomb at "standing" distance (where it would hit them if they just got up by tapping forward from the edge) and then Raigoth cancel to a utilt because they might try to jump or ledgejump over it. If they roll, you have that space that you set up with the bomb to dash away and maybe pivot grab or something.
 

ll Mafia ll

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Oh, and U Tilt works wonders for ledgehopped attacks.
Just predict correctly, and up tilt in time, BAM, done.
 

Rohins

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I say dtilt is most reliable based on that it comes out fast, big hitbox, and probably easiest to setup. Dair would be her "best" kill move if we're considering what kills at the lowest %. Problem is if you're playing smart people (as you should be) dairs become more and more scarce since they'll look out for it.

Some nice dtilt setups:

Fair -> dtilt (seems to be really popular)
Uair -> dtilt
Jab -> dtilt (works best if they are in the air when your jab)
HM -> dtilt (my favorite)
 

FuLLBLeeD

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Rohins, whats your input on using the control stick? I tend to use fsmash as a glorified punch more than a kill move. Btw, thanks for your input.
 

Smash_Gigas

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Unless I'm mistaken, Utilt has a slightly better KO potential when you smack your opponent with it while they're in mid-air, as it takes the vertical knock back and adds it horizontally. I think I've KOed with Utilt that way a lot more then when my oponent is on the ground.

Bair's got some pretty good KO power, though it's not always easy to land. I believe you even have to sweet-spot it, making it a little tougher. I usually try to knock them up in the air somehow and then land it, rather than RARing the SHBair. If I'm lucky enough to get a grab in, Dthrow --> Bair.

I'd have to agree that Dtilt's probably the best. It's got decent range, and you can play a little Bomb mindgames to go with it. A lot of times, I lay a Bomb and DI backwards, and as the opponent rushes in, Dtilts. They should be right where the bombs at, giving you a little extra defense. From my experience, it helped preventing my opponent from shieldgrabbing me, or causes them to hold their shield up a little longer.

Even though it's probably not the best idea, personally I also rely heavily on the Charged Beam for KO. I either need to fire it at point blank, as a counter for a laggy attack, or play a few missile mindgames. The benefit of the missile mindgames is that you should be able to rack up damage while toying with them at the same time. (An example of this is to MC --> Dash in --> halt dash with Charged Beam) Just delay it a little bit so they don't know if / when you're going to fire. But the majority of me landing it is during my recovery off-stage.
 

Deception

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^ If you don't believe the HM -> dair setup, watch Rohins in offstage super samus mode.. haha

Oh, and a setup for utilt on the edge

If I notice they like to recover from below the edge or with a grapple, I do a bomb drop edgeguard (drop the bomb and roll back onto the stage)

Once they get wise to that, I'll run at the edge of the stage and drop a bomb at "standing" distance (where it would hit them if they just got up by tapping forward from the edge) and then Raigoth cancel to a utilt because they might try to jump or ledgejump over it. If they roll, you have that space that you set up with the bomb to dash away and maybe pivot grab or something.
What's a Raigoth cancel? Sorry, I just started using Samus a few weeks ago.
 

0RLY

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What's a Raigoth cancel? Sorry, I just started using Samus a few weeks ago.
Crouching to cancel the morph ball animation. Only works on grounded b-downs. IMO, I don't think it really works. It's just really effective to crouch after dropping a bomb. I just call it crouch cancel to avoid confusion.
 

n00b

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Crouch cancel shares a definition with a melee term for crouching to absorb knockback, which doesn't exist in this game. I think it really works, because if you do it perfectly you don't even crouch after the bomb.. You can bomb crouch cancel/raigoth cancel into an immediate dash attack, dash, jump, shield, whatever..
 

SinkingHigher

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Focus on getting them off the side of the stage, then spike. It may get repetative, but if you want to win... Hey, at least it's not a chain grab.

If that fails, have a charge-shot ready for when they try to recover. Doesn't hurt to lay a bomb too.
 

Frozt

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D-tilt and u-tilt are teh sex!
they kill most chars at decent percentages, and the chars these moves can´t kill are easily d-aired which is the sexier way to kill with samus
 

0RLY

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Most reliable kill moves would be utilt, charge shot, dair, and bair. Utilt is very powerful on airborne foes. Your other attacks that don't have enough KB to KO usually give you enough time to charge your charge shot. Dair, obvious. Bair is pretty effective if you fastfall with it.
 

FuLLBLeeD

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Most reliable kill moves would be utilt, charge shot, dair, and bair. Utilt is very powerful on airborne foes. Your other attacks that don't have enough KB to KO usually give you enough time to charge your charge shot. Dair, obvious. Bair is pretty effective if you fastfall with it.
Thanks! Yeah, I usually use dsmash to give me more room to charge my beam.
 

Mars-

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The fsmash is not a terrible move at all, relative to a lot of Samus's moves. It's terrible compared to its Melee counterpart, but it can get the job done. I use it to punish and stuff dash-ins, its decent out of a shield dash drop and bomb setups.. If your opponent gets predictable to pressure and rolls behind you, do an empty sh or whatever might force them to roll behind you and just charge an fsmash in the opposite direction.. granted, that won't work on the more intelligent players. Angling it up tends to have higher knockback, yes, but chances are you've racked up enough damage to be throwing out fsmashes for kills.

I set up my chargeshots after eliminating most of the players options. Usually it's during their recovery, or after a set up. While they recover, their main priority is to get to safe ground.. This leaves them vulnerable to a well placed charge shot because they don't have as many options as they would on the ground. As for setups, I like to force them to move into a shot rather than try to combo because it's an obvious combo ender. For example, I could approach with a SH super missile cancel, and right when I land do a full jump charge blast. Some players would instinctively react to the imminent threat of a super missile with a jump, but the charge shot stuffs that as well. A more classical textbook setup is just shzair -> charge shot, but as the game developed I don't think people fall for that as easily.

Also, grab release sets up great for both dtilt and charge shot. It just takes a bit of mindgames and tricky timing to trap your opponent into reacting poorly and getting punished for it.

Good luck!
I don't even have to read this to know it is wrong, there is no reliable kill move on samus.
 

FuLLBLeeD

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I don't even have to read this to know it is wrong, there is no reliable kill move on samus.
You do not understand the context of the thread.

Samus can KO the opponent. There isn't a single character in the game that "can't kill". This thread is to discuss Samus's best options for killing.

I don't know whats up with you and ****ting in every post/thread I make, but it needs to stop.
 

n00b

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I don't even have to read this to know it is wrong, there is no reliable kill move on samus.
Thanks for the insightful contribution. I'll let you have the honors of trying to help other Samuses out from now on.

Cheers! :bee:
 

Mars-

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You do not understand the context of the thread.

Samus can KO the opponent. There isn't a single character in the game that "can't kill". This thread is to discuss Samus's best options for killing.

I don't know whats up with you and ****ting in every post/thread I make, but it needs to stop.
I'm sorry but your posts/thread just seem to have the most meat to them. Although thats the only reason, I have nothing against you.
Thanks for the insightful contribution. I'll let you have the honors of trying to help other Samuses out from now on.

Cheers! :bee:
Don't stop, two opinions are better then one. And because a normal visit to smashboards consists of clicking on User CP, I am not always getting into all the new threads.
 

Orichalcum

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I Ko'd a pit when he was trying to go under FD. We both were at last stock and i suddendly had a flashback from watching a video. I never did that before so i was like "**** it lets go for it" so i let go of the edge and slowly fell down, shootin a smash missile asap and it hit him right on his back and he bumped off to his death. **** that felt sooo good. It looked awesome and he didnt really see that one coming.

Reliable or not against pit i found it very usefull because gimping him is a bit *****y, he would avoid my dairs whenever i try.
 

FuLLBLeeD

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I dunno if you guys do this, but hitting someone with a neutral charge shot and then a up angled smash is crazy good. I'm racking up so many kills with Samus since I started doing this.
 
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