An ISO (isolation) of Soup's posts. This means looking at Soup's individual posts by themselves and judging the
intent behind them all. I've taken the liberty of sectioning everything Soup has done into significant events. If you all will take the time to listen to me. It's a long read, but it's a compilation of everything I believe is significant regarding Soup. I've tried to remain unbiased throughout the post, but obviously I'm naturally biased because I think he's scum.
[Collapse=RVS. Not so important.]
I'm glad RVS didn't last that long.
Joker, could you tell me what you were trying to gain asking Toaster such a loaded question? What's with your vote on Badwolf? He did nothing telling of alignment and it was weird for you to jump like that.
This and the posts that follows. Not important enough to quote them individually. I'll agree that Joker's question was entirely loaded, but it's the RVS comment that strikes poorly with me. Here he declares that RVS is over, 15 posts into the game. Thereby adding a serious intent to Joker's post that was not originally there. After I call him out, he reaffirms the RVS comment, and adds a break in confidence "unless joker's vote wasn't serious." Either he knew he was wrong and that I was calling him out here, or he legitimately never thought it could still be RVS. 17 posts into the game.
Later, when he realizes he's messing up all his words and everything, he says that he's just too tired and leaves. Either he was just super groggy and could not comprehend what Joker was doing, or he was trying to manipulate our views on Joker's post by declaring RVS over. I wouldn't put either of these past Soup. [/collapse]
[collapse=BSP. This one is important.]
Pop quiz. Someone tell me why I'm voting BSP.
Next comes the BSP shenanigans and the start of his "you guys do work" campaign.
This game is going to be extremely easy.
Exudes confidence when people follow his vote. Seeing the essentially strongest active player in the game exude confidence about his wagon, it puts a lot of peer pressure on you to follow him. I see no reason for this specific post to exist other than to bait a weak newbie into voting BSP.
Note's BSP's L-#.
I want everyone to look at this wagon though, and tell me if you honestly think that everyone voting BSP is town, I want you to look at who jumped on it, why they jumped on it, and when.
Continues his let newbies do stuff campaign. From here he leads several of you to your individual avenues of investigation. This is actually a good thing in general, as it leads to a closer look at many people. It's possible for scumsoup to have wanted this though to test the waters on how you all felt on each other and to know who he could push without raising a fuss.
The real thing is though. I really do think the reason he even voted BSP in the first place was to go off of that and vote somebody who followed him. As if he were baiting you into voting BSP. It's manipulative in nature (which is inherently anti-town) but Soup is also the kind of butt who would do this as Town just for the smallest chance to catch scum off it. It's still very fishy to me.
I don't think it felt right.
BSP is a new mafia player, inexperienced, and willing to try a game out. I think he doesn't have a clue. Soup is an IC, meaning that his job is not only to play the game alongside other newbies, but to help them as well. He would've pointed out or give him a reason why.
And yet....He cught onto this. Referring to BSP's post which Soup voted him for.
And voted him. Assumingly, I would've expected him to answer that he should vote one of the people who he thinks is scum but he has to be wise about it, and yet, he simply voted for him and in order to strongly convince others, he even said this. reference to Soup's "pop quiz" post. I agree that that post implied that you all SHOULD be voting BSP.
Personally, I think he's baiting you into voting him.
Heh.
It's good that you're town this game Vinyl., but you couldn't be any more wrong about my intentions. Going to let Joker respond.
Straight up calls Vinyl town for that post (there's more to Vinyl's post than what I quoted btw but I cut these posts to what I believe is important). Says Vinyl is wrong about his intentions with no evidence or an alternative that proves otherwise. The "Vinyl is town" comment could be a legit feel or much simpler he's doing that to resolve the conflict between him and Vinyl quick and easy. Because what sort of scum wants a conflict revolving around themselves? I really don't like this response to Vinyl.
Unvote
BSP is town.
Vinyl. is town
Tyranitar leans town
Ton is scummy
Toaster is weird/scummy
Sold2 is going to stay null.
Badwolf leans town
Joker is a curious case for me.
He put BSP as town awfully quick. I personally did not believe BSP's actions were warranting such a strong town read as newtown or newscum both could
have been confused on why Soup is voting them. Also his three scum reads... Tonberry, Toaster, and then Joker is "curious" but he did support BadWolf's push against Joker. Again, all 3 of the people who voted with him had it turned on them.
To conclude this whole section, the only alternative to Soup baiting everybody into voting BSP and then turning on them is that he was legitimately wanting to pressure BSP, had a instantaneous feeling of swagconfidence and then was appalled by the people that voted alongside him! Let me remind you all, Joker, Toaster, and Tonberry were the three people to vote alongside of Soup and all three of them had it turned against them, and all three of them were town. Soup turned it on Tonberry and led Badwolf to turning it on Joker nearly instantly.
disclaimer: I will not defend the wagon votes as good votes. I'm simply pointing out how odd this entire sequence of events is.
While Joker might have thought I was selectively choosing a wagon, that wasn't even my intention, I just voted someone I sincerely thought was scummy for the time being, BSP sitting around asking people who we should lynch is awful, but considering his attitude and response to me, it's blatant noobtown. Joker was right in one way, and that I was testing to see who would all jump on it, I did not have a master plan to catch scum in one fell swoop, I was just looking for reactions and getting people to interact with each-other.
Oh and here's Soup's response to the situation essentially. He's essentially saying he sat his vote there because it was a good place to sit his vote and see what happens. He's not wrong about that. It's believable...
But what I want answered here is what the "this game is going to be easy" comment was supposed to mean other than a show of (false) confidence and if it truly was just coincidence that all 3 players who followed you got bit in the butt for it.[/collapse]
After these two sections, the game sorta drives itself. Soup ends up going to Toaster eventually after a while. He got in a "difference between insulting a post and insulting a person" discussion which really did come from IC status and it actually drags on forever hahaha. None of this is really important, I'm just narrating it to give you all an idea of the timeframe of the game. At some point things shifted to a Toaster lynch and that happened. D1 ends.
[Collapse=D2]
Yeah D2 is so short I can fit it into one collapse tag and feel good! Isn't that something.
If I had to make a reaching guess like that I would possibly say Sold or Ori; I might re-read Ori. Huh. I wonder if he ever did this. Not that it mattered. I dunno nkill speculation is really weak and WIFOMy, you should never use it for a real case tbh. It's just a bit odd he singled us two out and well I guess Ori is dead. I suppose this does mean his dislike of me isn't instantaneous though.
I'm fairly confident in this lynch today, Tonberry is a pick that's been in the back of my head and someone I want gone just for the sake of my other reads. I might not be common with newbies but I like to also lynch on connections; Tonberry will give me just that.
I don't know if I ever asked which connections he expected to get out of Tonberry. Or which ones he did get out of Tonberry, but I will do so now.
The rest of this post goes on incriminating Tonberry. It's not wrong.
Well here he goes about the Trial of Tonberry. It's fine. Quoting this simply for the top paragraph regarding myself, and for the connections question.
BSP's case is something to look into, though I still want to pursue my own goals.
Care to compromise BSP?
I don't know if he ever looked into it. This is something I commented on earlier. The word compromise is weird but I won't dig into wording. This felt like he was trying to buddy/coerce BSP to join the Tonberry wagon and is kind of ignoring an alternative lynch in Vinyl.
I want to lynch Tonberry for the sake of Ttar if you want a more straight answer, Ttar has been on Tonberry consistently this whole time and I feel that one holds scum, If Tonberry flips scum I will definitely feel better about Ttar. My thoughts.
I want to compromise with BSP for the sake that he does have a fairly interesting case and something worth looking into, but I don't know his thoughts about mine or my reads for that matter.
In response to myself raising concerns to the above post. I suppose the question has to be asked. Tonberry flipped town. How do you feel about TTar?
Hammah
Hammah
HAMMAH
HAMMAH
HAMMAH!
Encouraging the hammering of Tonberry. D2 lasted less than 72 hours and it really bugs me. This is not something I can blame entirely on Soup even though it clearly involved him. D2 came and went and I believe I only got to make 1 post the entire day and I'm really mad that I couldn't have commented more seriously about the day. I don't know if his goal was to quicklynch there but I don't know why he was so eager to get the day over with.
I've got a plan if Ton flips town. Hell, I've got a plan if he flips scum. I just really wanted this to happen so we could move on.
Yes and this is what sparked my concern. This "don't worry if things go wrong!" It always gets me when someone has plans for their lynch target to flip town.
In conclusion I kinda felt that Soup streamlined the day to focus on Tonberry but it really wasn't just Soup. He was the leading factor of it but everyone seemed to go along with it but BSP. There's just not enough here to make it convincing one way or another, but I consider it scummy that he was eager to end the day because of the lack of information it has created for D2. The "I have a plan post" is fishy in it's own right.[/collapse]
And this ends D2. And also these are all the concerns I entered the day with.
There's only a couple things I want to bring up about D3. Soup accuses me and this case of being opportunistic. It strikes me as odd he would say this. I've been looking into Soup
all game.
[collapse=My posts vs Soup]
soup you can't just declare that rvs is over and also there are more tact ways of handling that question.
My original comment about his RVS.
Ragnarok/Soup- Why did you drop that read list on post #132? And also in #136 you posted that you agreed with BadWolf that you had a negative view of Joker. Did you ever get around to posting your exact thoughts on Joker or is this just a blanket "I agree with BadWolf's case?"
This post exists solely for Soup to respond to those concerns
right then so that he could not pretend what he was doing is one way or another.
What are you suggesting BSP to do here, Soup?
Are you lynching Scumberry or are you looking for connections from him?
If the latter, who?
This post is raising concern to how he handled BSP's case and also I guess I really did ask who his connections he wanted to get were. He vaguely replied.
You guys practically quick hammered yesterday before I can get a word in. I'm not in disagreement with the lynch choice, but the wagon was dirty.
Dude, past me. You're right. They did practically quick hammer. I suppose I'm just quoting this to prove that my "what the hell D2 quickhammer" wasn't made up on the spot and has been a red flag in my head.
In conclusion, no. Me voting Soup is not opportunistic at all and I find it nearly OMGUS (as in him suspecting me for suspecting him) that he says that.[/collapse]
Now that that's out of the way, there's only one more concern, right. If Soup really is lying about this, he needs a scum partner. Presumably we're dealing with a 2 man scum team. And until otherwise proven, I believe it's Soup and Vinyl.
[collapse=Soup+Vinyl]
Day 1, Vinyl FoS'd Soup and brought up a bit of a case versus him. Soup dismissed the case casually, though he eventually did explain himself to Vinyl's satisfaction. After which Vinyl forgot about pursuing Soup. I'd consider this "distancing" as in they planned this conflict to make themselves not be considered "connected." The fact Vinyl didn't vote him and dropped it so easily furthers this.
Day 2, Soup pushes Tonberry lynch, and then a case on Vinyl comes up. Soup continues to push for a rather quick Tonberry lynch. Vinyl can't get lynched if someone else is already getting lynched.
Day 3 gets an actual quote.
That feel when Vinyl. dumbtowntells.
This and the posts above it have Vinyl be surprised about Ori being dead. I swear to god it looks so much like an act between the two.
In conclusion, there is quite a bit of reason to think Soup and Vinyl are connected. Specifically the Day 2 thing. Now of course this all relies on the idea of Soup being scum, and therefore it doesn't matter for now. I made this section purely so Soup or someone else couldn't say "Well who's his scummate, huh?"
[/collapse]
This is a rather complete case. Note how well I organize my stuff for reading! ISO cases are great ways to really make a game serious. Note that I also tried to take this unbiasedly. I always considered the possibility of an alternative, but I assert that for them to be true would be quite a coincidence.
So really what I'm looking out of Soup is a response to what I've written (
specifically the BSP and D2 section. The RVS, Soup vs Me, and Vinyl section exist purely for completion.) Alternatively or additionally what I'm also looking out of Soup is something telling me that his role is not a lie. Perhaps a clue in an earlier post? Thoughts about his intentions regarding his role... etc. Because if Soup is indeed the reporter this also obviously clears him of scum. This is much harder to prove.
that's it. I like any comments from anywhere but let Soup address his own questions please.
