Q&A Mirror of Truth or Palutena's Advice? Both available at all hours of the day

[Makorel]

So with the new jab buff I've been playing around with rapid jabs more and I think they're a great help in the Sonic match up. Before I would keep myself from doing a rapid jab by intentionally not pressing the A button fast enough for the rapid to come out, and now that I'm not doing that jabs come out much quicker. Jab is Pit's least committal action and it helps a lot just to land blows on Sonic when other moves might not be fast enough. Importantly, every part of jab clanks with Spin Dash. Chances are you can clank with Sonic outside of his punching range but still inside of your blade range and still be able to punish him when he goes for reaction jabs. I think this is more likely if you use the rapid jab portion, so what I like to do is bring up the rapid jab and leave it up when I see Sonic start spinning. This still leaves me open to jump + homing attack, but Sonic gets much less out of a Homing Attack than a Spin Dash.

 

[SilverWolfLaguz]

Try to stay put, and make him approach you. Don't use slower attacks (like smashes), stick with fast ones like the jab and dtilt. Try to stay around the middle of the stage to avoid the back throw killing you.

 

[Steelballray]

Hello. I have a little question concerning Pit and his gameplay.

I tried him few times and he always seemed lacking to me. There are 55 characters in the game and whenever I play any of them, they usually manage to make me FEEL something, that theres something cool about them. Captain Falcon approaching at extreme speeds and delivering tons of damage with few strings, Fox comboing out of u-tilt and his meaty u-air and stupidly fast and strong up smash, Luigi and his d-throw and his slide. I can go about the rest of the characters and even the lamest looking ones will have something unique that gives them a different feel than the rest. And then there's Pit. Nothing about him sets him apart that much.. Hes just.. Average. I guess the arrow is unique and fun but nothing else gives me any kind of fun when I use him.. Like, what is there to him? I don't believe a character that has a clone can be as shallow as I see Pit to be, there HAS to be something that make him not the very average character.. I just need you guys to tell me what is if

 

[ReRaze]

Hello. I have a little question concerning Pit and his gameplay.

I tried him few times and he always seemed lacking to me. There are 55 characters in the game and whenever I play any of them, they usually manage to make me FEEL something, that theres something cool about them. Captain Falcon approaching at extreme speeds and delivering tons of damage with few strings, Fox comboing out of u-tilt and his meaty u-air and stupidly fast and strong up smash, Luigi and his d-throw and his slide. I can go about the rest of the characters and even the lamest looking ones will have something unique that gives them a different feel than the rest. And then there's Pit. Nothing about him sets him apart that much.. Hes just.. Average. I guess the arrow is unique and fun but nothing else gives me any kind of fun when I use him.. Like, what is there to him? I don't believe a character that has a clone can be as shallow as I see Pit to be, there HAS to be something that make him not the very average character.. I just need you guys to tell me what is if

His edgeguarding is my favourite thing, Pit can go so deep and just mess with people.
Here's a vid from nairo

@Kiram I just had to use a video of you here hope you don't mind

 

[LancerStaff]

Hello. I have a little question concerning Pit and his gameplay.

I tried him few times and he always seemed lacking to me. There are 55 characters in the game and whenever I play any of them, they usually manage to make me FEEL something, that theres something cool about them. Captain Falcon approaching at extreme speeds and delivering tons of damage with few strings, Fox comboing out of u-tilt and his meaty u-air and stupidly fast and strong up smash, Luigi and his d-throw and his slide. I can go about the rest of the characters and even the lamest looking ones will have something unique that gives them a different feel than the rest. And then there's Pit. Nothing about him sets him apart that much.. Hes just.. Average. I guess the arrow is unique and fun but nothing else gives me any kind of fun when I use him.. Like, what is there to him? I don't believe a character that has a clone can be as shallow as I see Pit to be, there HAS to be something that make him not the very average character.. I just need you guys to tell me what is if

Pit's a lot like Mario in that he's an all-arounder. Whereas Mario is more about offense, Pit's more about defense. For starters, his range is quite similar to Marth's, but his frame data is much better. His arrows are much better then you think, too. Big thing is shooting arrows out of a fullhop. Not only do you get 10-ish frames of lag shaved off the end, you're out of the way of most projectiles. They also can't be reflected properly if you play it smart.

But besides that... Pit's less about a single, definitive playstyle and more about the tools he has. Arrows obviously, and then he has tons of options out of a dash. Dash grab is great and he gets tons of reward off of his throws, his dash attack is safe on shield when spaced right and otherwise really fast, and all his aerials SH auto-cancel easily. His recovery is one of the best in the game, to the point where 99% of the cast can't touch him offstage, which obviously leads to his great offstage game. Dair is a powerful combo tool, basically being MK's Uair but below him. Dsmash both comes out fast and ends quickly, making rolling behind Pit quite risky. Actually, rolling in general around Pit is bad. Fsmash comes out relatively quick, hits on two separate frames, is one of the longest reaching Fsmashes in the game, and is still quite powerful to boot. It can be spotdodged, but that's roughly a two-frame window so I don't think you can count on it.

Basically, Pit is a bag of tools that lends to many different playstyles. He can just about become whatever you want him to.

 

[Project_B]

Got a lot of help from this thread. I still rely on DAirs a bit too much but I love FAirs for stage spikes and punishing air dodges. Also my back airs have been much more accurate. Really appreciate y'all!

Learning how to bait opponents into relaxing about returning to the ledge by hopping off in pursuit but returning to the edge until late in the game where I'll be able to catch them off-guard with a full pursuit. Also, getting back to the ledge has been easier by mixing up how many jumps I use before I UpB

Because of Pit's very linear recovery with no hitbox, you need to do two things to improve your recovery game.

First, you need to be expecting a stage spike. You need to anticipate this and get ready to tech. If you either have trouble teching certain moves, or can't get the timing right, you should practice with a friend, starting on a stage with wide lips such as battlefield. Stage spikes can kill really early, and they're avoidable enough for you to not need to get harmed by them. And besides, if you don't tech everyone around you will yell "we tech those!"

Secondly, you need to snap to the edge--overshooting rarely goes unpunished, and due to the time for which you will be helpless, that probably means death, or a charged f-smash to the face. To snap to the edge, you need to, when going straight up, up-B from the edge of the screen on the bottom or just outside the screen. Be careful not to drop too deep! You could also angle the up-B into a wall to slide up and snap to the edge. Practice recovering on different stages in Training mode (although if you ever played Pit on pre-patch Lylat, you already should have ).

Everyone else already talked about moves to use offstage, so all I will say on that is that the easiest one to land tends to be nAir, right near the ledge. I know this post is very late, but if you read it then hopefully it helps you recover more safely. And remember, "we tech those!"

 

[Project_B]

Pivot grab is godlike if you can pull it off well. It allows you to create the amazing mixup/mindgames of punishing an opponent accustomed to grabs by grabbing them some more.

Also, if you are fighting a tall character, you can do a jump-cancelled up-smash to read a spot dodge while you are dashing in.

 

[Tito Maas]

Pivot grab is godlike if you can pull it off well. It allows you to create the amazing mixup/mindgames of punishing an opponent accustomed to grabs by grabbing them some more.

Also, if you are fighting a tall character, you can do a jump-cancelled up-smash to read a spot dodge while you are dashing in.

But when are pivot grabs most effective and when should they be used? I would say that many people aren't well-cersed on how to use them in the neutral.

 

[Project_B]

Pivot grabs have many uses in many different aspects of a battle. I am going to assume for this that you can pull off a pivot grab (it should also be on the Smash Wiki). If you have dash grabbed your opponent (a decent opening for a character with few good moves to throw out against shield), it can condition them to spot-dodge if you are to run at them again. Remember that shield is one of the best tools for every character and that grabbing allows for many follow ups with Pit(too). So if you either dash grab or even pull of something like an empty hop to bait out shield, then drop down and grab, it will make your opponent weary to the approach by Pit (it helps that from one grab, pit can get a throw + a somewhat charged up smash).

Now, if your next approach in neutral is dashing in, your opponent will likely spot dodge to try to get the free punish. Instead of just grabbing, you run right through your intangible adversary, then turnaround and grab them while they are in the frames of endlag on their spot dodge. Do keep in mind that a less defensive player may instead throw a hitbox at you, in which case you will need to react by shielding. You will probably still get hit, but you have a shot at powershielding of the move is not very fast.

The other large use for pivot grabbing is to read rolls behind you. I would suggest using a short hop side B with Pit/Dark Pit to read a roll behind you, but either is tough to punish due to how you will move a good distance away from your opponent. If, however, you are playing a character without a good move in their kit for roll punishing, or a character with a short grab range (pivot grabs have a surprisingly long range), this can be an optimal move. It can also catch people rolling from the ledge, allowing you to forward throw them off, due to how you turn around as you grab.

Top players have been using pivot grabs since the 3DS days for Smash 4, and so I feel that anyone can get some better results with this, especially for characters with a kill or combo throw.

 

[Project_B]

Hello. I have a little question concerning Pit and his gameplay.

I tried him few times and he always seemed lacking to me. There are 55 characters in the game and whenever I play any of them, they usually manage to make me FEEL something, that theres something cool about them. Captain Falcon approaching at extreme speeds and delivering tons of damage with few strings, Fox comboing out of u-tilt and his meaty u-air and stupidly fast and strong up smash, Luigi and his d-throw and his slide. I can go about the rest of the characters and even the lamest looking ones will have something unique that gives them a different feel than the rest. And then there's Pit. Nothing about him sets him apart that much.. Hes just.. Average. I guess the arrow is unique and fun but nothing else gives me any kind of fun when I use him.. Like, what is there to him? I don't believe a character that has a clone can be as shallow as I see Pit to be, there HAS to be something that make him not the very average character.. I just need you guys to tell me what is if

Pit may feel average to you, but that's because he is... Mostly average. Pit's arrows are really the only gimmicky thing about him, and those aren't even that cool. But with pit, you get a sense of dominating the air. That's what I feel at least, and it is a great feeling, and actually the main reason for all of my character picks in smash games. Back in the days of a swiftly changing Melee meta, the Marth player Ken showed the Smash community how much there was to gain off of treating the game as an aerial fighter. In Melee, it was pretty tough to pull off more than one or two aerials offstage for many characters. Unless they could float. Under my icon, my Melee main is shown as Young Link, but that is merely because that is the character I played since picking up the game casually. Once I started feeling more competitively in matches I switched to a better and at that point more enjoyable character, Peach. I know Jigglypuff technically rules the air even more, but I loved hitting my enemies offstage, then floating far away and nAiring them right out the side. I even tended to avoid easy chain grabs, instead opting to dthrow>fTilt>whatever aerial I wanted. Then in Brawl I played Marth and Meta Knight. Both of these characters had great aerials and could dominate many other characters offstage. Meta Knight even had two different ways to activate a glide mechanic! Now, I find Pit to be one of the most fun picks. His movement isn't particularly awesome, and his airspeed leaves something to be desired, but whether I am dThrow>dAir>dAir>uAir ing people to set up into juggles and surprise back airs, or if I'm using all three jumps to "float" around like I did with Peach in Melee or MK in Brawl to land that deep spike, then upBing and recovering from the bottom corner, it feels great.

Focus the most on your air fighting. I find it particularly amusing to edgeguard against ROB and Villager type recoveries because I can choose whether I want to send them away from the stage, stage spike, or even just spike them with dAir. Pit is fun because of how he controls the air by swing swords and being able to go deep offstage and use his jumps to prolong his time down there, then, after he's satisfied, he can still recover.

But that's just me, and it's kind of based in my history in the Smash series, so maybe your idea of a fun character is different, but whatever it is, I hope you find some character that suits you perfectly.

 

[Wintropy]

Pit can dictate the pace of the match if you're good with him.

Few characters can play so ubiquitously on reaction as he can.

 

[ZTD | TECHnology]

What are my best options for punishing a Yoshi who is trying to space Fair on my shield?

 

[Project_B]

@ ZTD | TECHnology - If you can powershield/perfect-shield it, you should get a free punish, but if the timing is too difficult or you're playing online and the connection isn't great, try to, instead of shielding, foxtrot back and forth when the Yoshi approaches, and if you get an opening, you can space out with jab or fTilt. If you want to risk contact, then sideB has super armor frames on it, and should either beat out Yoshi's fAir or trade with it, and it won't give you knockback.

 

[ReRaze]

What are my best options for punishing a Yoshi who is trying to space Fair on my shield?

You have alot better spacing tools than yoshi because of your disjoint, e.g you could use retreating fairs. As for punishing it you could use dash attack or dash grab.....

 

[Fujiwara]

Pit can dictate the pace of the match if you're good with him.

Actually, no. Pit suffers the most from very fast characters in almost every situation. Roy, Sonic, Captain Falcon and Fox are good examples how useless he can be.

 

[Wintropy]

Actually, no. Pit suffers the most from very fast characters in almost every situation. Roy, Sonic, Captain Falcon and Fox are good examples how useless he can be.

Strongly disagree, with experience to verify my claim, but you're entitled to your reaction.

 

[Project_B]

I agree with Wintropy on this one. Pit's air speed may be lacking and his ground speed, while good, is not one of the best, but his frame data is fine, plus he is a sword character that is very floaty and has multiple jumps allowing for him to throw out many disjointed hitboxes. Pit is not useless against fast characters, and he doesn't even particularly suffer from them. Captain Falcon and Fox both have recoveries that are so linear that a Pit player could just float and keep jumping by the ledge and hit A to stop their recoveries. I would even say, from my personal experience, that Pit is one of or the only non-top tier character to have such a doable matchup against Sheik, who is the best fast character in the game.

 

[Fujiwara]

okay guys, let's get back to work:
How will you approach someone, who..

is faster than you.
Sounds simple enough, right? But no, it isn't. Here's an example what I've to play all the time: Roy

My Roy can power-shield through every arrow
He is faster than Pit, so he will be next to you within a second > grabs
f-Tilt, d-Tilt have enough ending lag (yes, you read it right) so he can still approach you without any problems
short hop fAir has enough start-up frame so he can still counter it with a shielding or dodge
short hop dAir or a regular dAir let you open in any case. Fallback dAir? Roy will short hop with a combo into you
fake fSpecial (use it in the air just one mili-sec after you jumped) for breaking more and more his shield? Can be easily punished with a uSmash from Roy
nAir is predictable at this point and can be punished at the end or just broken with a fSmash if not close enough or just missed
and don't forget: air attacks will go in favor for Roy due the frames

So, what would you do?

 

[Sora66]

What are pits/Dark pits better options against rosalina and luma?

 

[Fujiwara]

Focus the most time on Luma, abuse as Dark Pit the electroarm.
Go for Rosalina when Luma is down.

 

[Project_B]

okay guys, let's get back to work:
How will you approach someone, who..

is faster than you.
Sounds simple enough, right? But no, it isn't. Here's an example what I've to play all the time: Roy

My Roy can power-shield through every arrow
He is faster than Pit, so he will be next to you within a second > grabs
f-Tilt, d-Tilt have enough ending lag (yes, you read it right) so he can still approach you without any problems
short hop fAir has enough start-up frame so he can still counter it with a shielding or dodge
short hop dAir or a regular dAir let you open in any case. Fallback dAir? Roy will short hop with a combo into you
fake fSpecial (use it in the air just one mili-sec after you jumped) for breaking more and more his shield? Can be easily punished with a uSmash from Roy
nAir is predictable at this point and can be punished at the end or just broken with a fSmash if not close enough or just missed
and don't forget: air attacks will go in favor for Roy due the frames

So, what would you do?

There really is no simple way to approach with Pit that is completely foolproof, and if your arrows are always power-shielded, it can be a real problem. Pit is a character that thrives off of reading his opponent. Pit doesn't have amazing options in neutral the way that Sheik has needles, Pikachu has his full hop thunder jolt, or Rosalina has several tilts and a jab with Luma that can easily wall out approaches. He does, however, have a tool to win each situation as long as you can get a read on your opponent. Pit has a very good instant dash attack (done by tapping the control stick forward and c-stick down immediately after), a good dash grab, a great pivot grab, and one of the best hip-checks (a pivot fTilt spaced out on a shield so that you end standing behind your opponent facing them - check out the tech videos by on Tourney Locator). None of these options win in every situation, but they all set up into various conversions, and stuff like getting a dThrow combo off of a grab or a juggle out of a dash attack makes up a good amount of Pit's ability to deal damage. Plus, the arrows and sideB are better off to stymie approaches, even if all of your arrows get power-shielded, they still cause Roy to either stop or jump over them, and the super armored sideB combined with adequate arrow use is great for stopping characters in their tracks after you gain a percent lead.

I'm probably leaving something out, but the main way to deal with these matchups is just to mix up your approaches and be patient. Pit may not have an aerial that is completely safe on shield, or a ridiculous projectile, but he does have some options.

 

[Pazx]

Twice on this page have I seen the suggestion of short hopping immediately before using side-B. What's the logic behind that?

 

[Funkermonster]

Only curious, but what would you say Pit's chances are against ? Trying to find a 3rd character to keep myself entertained with some diversion, and he's the one char I find besides Sheik that beats both my main & second . Its not really that big a loss with either of them and I could afford to learn the MU (seeing as how I'm doing this for fun mostly), but I just wanted a 3rd character to keep things interesting and I'd maybe prefer it to be just someone who's good or okay against Fox. I'm having the most fun with him outta every other one of my candidates, and people in my region seem to think I'm good okay with him.

Just curious is all, probably will still play Pit anyways.

 

[TopTierTaite]

Hey guys, I picked up Dark Pit because
1. Top tiers are boring. I tried Ness and Luigi, and as much as I love them as characters, they were very boring to play.
2. Low tiers are infuriating and gives built-in johns. I still love Robin though <3
I did okay on For Glory tonight, went 3/3 with a ZSS main. He pull Diddy out once, but I beat it. Beat a bad Shiek, lost to a laggy Kirby, and beat the same guy when he switched to Villager. My neutral game is mostly fairs and arrows, until I can land a throw into juggle damage. Should I be doing more than that? I found that my kills came from either a side B read, a forward smash read, a up smash to punish ZSS's Up B's that I DI'ed out of, or a DThrow UAir. Are Dark Pit's kill options limited or is it just my inexperience? Lastly, I'd like to integrate down B and any of his tilts if they're practical. I saw Nairo down-B a skull bash from ESAM, but that's really it. Nothing at all from tilts, just curious if any of them are at least a little viable.

 

[Project_B]

@ Pazx - when you whiff side B on the ground, you have a lot of endlag, and if you hit an opponent's shield, you are probably dead. In the air, you can still hit people on the ground, and upon a miss, there is less endlag, and upon hitting a shield, you can bounce away and try to avoid being punished, and you can go offstage/to the edge as a mixup. SH immediate side B is much less punishable than a grounded variant. Overall, it is much less risk for slightly less reward. I recommend this more with DP than Pit, because while Pit's still sets up into juggles, it won't kill nearly as well. DP's doesn't kill early anyway, so if you want the opponent offstage, it's a good option.

@ Funkermonster - Pit does fine against Fox, and so do several other characters. As well as the top tiers (Rosalina, Sheik, Pikachu, maybe even Mario), there are mid/low tiers that can do well against him like Kirby, G&W, and even Robin. If you play the matchup correctly, characters with good offstage presence tend to do well.

@ TopTierTaite - I am going to edit this as I think of stuff, but for now, Dark Pit has an insane exploit against Kirby and Ike with his down B. Basically, if they use their recovery and go up past the edge as you use guardian Orbitars, they will be forced away and will fall to their death. Try to take away these characters jumps and then stand on the ledge ready to down B them. You might want to try it out in Training first though - the move comes out pretty slowly. This is very easy to land on Kirby, but a bit tougher to land on Ike.

While on the subject of down B, it can really stop anybody who fails to sweetspot the edge because of how it forces people away (like when Pit goes straight up while facing away and just doesn't grab the ledge). It can also gimp Ness/Lucas' recoveries by either deflecting the PK Thunder, pushing them out of the way, or shattering and halving the distance that they travel.

Dark Pit mostly nets kills from edgeguards, but he has a few options. Tipper back air is easy to land and almost safe on shield, plus easy to land after a ledge trump; the back hit of down smash (or slightly less powerful forward hit) has kill power and can be a great punish after a powershield, or reading a roll if side B gets predictable. Forward smash can punish spot dodges and has kill power, but it's laggy and easily punished on a whiff. Running offstage and landing a fAir near the blastzone can kill, but only at high percents. Forward throw is a great kill throw, and after a dash grab you will slide forward, allowing for you to get closer to the edge. On fast fallers like Fox, try down throw -> empty SH (read air dodge) and up smash. Pit and Dark Pit don't actually kill until higher percents than many characters, but they can also kill at much lower percents offstage.

As for tilts, Pit's tipper fTilt can kill pretty well, and Dark Pit's fTilt, when used as a hip-check (pivoting within a certain window and hitting with the back/reverse hit) can jab reset. I barely ever use up tilt, it's just not a very good move. Forward tilt can be used for spacing and has insane range, but it has some endlag. Down tilt is great for spacing and pops people up to allow for juggles. You can try to integrate more jabs into your play--try jab1->grab (not guaranteed), or jab1->dTilt->uAir.

Some miscellaneous things: around 60% on fast fallers you should try to read an air dodge after dThrow and then uSmash, and on floaty characters, try dThrow->dAir->dAir->uAir.

Dark Pit rewards players for making reads and having good fundamentals more than other characters because despite him not having any amazing tech (like Rosalina's jab at the ledge with Luma), he also has no large weakness in his gameplay.

 

[Katzwinkel]

Out of blatant curiosity, if one was to main Pit and perhaps use him in tournament, what matchups or situations would they want to switch to Dark Pit for?

 

[Wintropy]

Out of blatant curiosity, if one was to main Pit and perhaps use him in tournament, what matchups or situations would they want to switch to Dark Pit for?

Rosalina maybe. If you can get a side-b hit in on Luma without punishment, you can neuter it pretty handily.

Otherwise, maybe somebody like Mac or Doc that you can side-b off-stage and edgeguard easily.

Honestly, the arms are so niche in their practical use that it's nearly a trivial issue.

It's mostly down to personal preference.

 

[Psymon]

Which moves does Pit have that lock the opponents (like, jab-locks). I've seen sweet-spotted D-air lock from an un-teched back-throw, but are there any others? If so, what % do they work around/until?

 

[ReRaze]

Which moves does Pit have that lock the opponents (like, jab-locks). I've seen sweet-spotted D-air lock from an un-teched back-throw, but are there any others? If so, what % do they work around/until?

I made a full thread on dark/pit's jab locks if you missed it.
http://smashboards.com/threads/pit-dark-pit-jab-reset-guide-updated-on-8-6-15.403018/

 

[ReRaze]

Edit: Didn't mean to double post, I think my post from a different thread got moved here just before I posted this one.

okay guys, let's get back to work:
How will you approach someone, who..

is faster than you.
Sounds simple enough, right? But no, it isn't. Here's an example what I've to play all the time: Roy

My Roy can power-shield through every arrow
He is faster than Pit, so he will be next to you within a second > grabs
f-Tilt, d-Tilt have enough ending lag (yes, you read it right) so he can still approach you without any problems
short hop fAir has enough start-up frame so he can still counter it with a shielding or dodge
short hop dAir or a regular dAir let you open in any case. Fallback dAir? Roy will short hop with a combo into you
fake fSpecial (use it in the air just one mili-sec after you jumped) for breaking more and more his shield? Can be easily punished with a uSmash from Roy
nAir is predictable at this point and can be punished at the end or just broken with a fSmash if not close enough or just missed
and don't forget: air attacks will go in favor for Roy due the frames

So, what would you do?

tl:dr, you just have to choose the right option for the right situation. Roy isn't some god tier character that completely nullifies all pit's options, you are probably just getting outplayed by your opponent or making mistakes/whiffs or choosing the wrong options. If you outplay your opponent well, being faster means they'll only be running into your attacks faster and getting punished.

You ask how to approach, but then you list off examples of how roy's approaching. I'll just reply to your points since @ Project_B already addressed the how to approach part I think.

-Any competent player will know how to deal with projectiles. Even characters such as sheik can't rely solely on her needles. Him power shielding your arrows, doesn't matter because the point of using a projectile is generally to force opponents to approach (onstage). Pit's arrows are self explanatory offstsge. And also you asked "how do you approach someone who....". I don't think you approach someone by shooting arrows at them in the first place.....

-He approaches you, and sure he's fast but not even sonic is fast enough to punish you like that unless you throw out an unsafe move (i.e grounded arrow, fsmash, or close up ftilt, dtilt, etc)

-Any move has enough startup to be shielded if the opponent reacts in time, shielding is the fastest option in the game followed closely by dodges, pit's fair is no exception. At higher competitve levels you can see people perfect shielding attacks as fast as shiek's bair (3 frames) just watch ZeRo, Nairo, etc.

-Shff fair is safe on shield if you space it right so no roy can't punish you if he shields it, same with shff bair. Or you could try crossing over people with dash attack, dair, and nair. But yes he can 'counter' your attacks.

-With dair if your'e getting punished for using it like that then stop, you weren't specific enough explaining how you used it but I'm assuming you are using it as a retreating/approaching option? Fair is better suited to that. Dair is a really good OoS option though to punish roy if he attacks you, its great because it can start combos/strings. Most of roy's attacks are not safe from an OoS dair. In short, Dair isnt much use as an approach/retreat (which is probably why you are getting punished) but more as a punishing option itself (onstage) imo. Dair offstage is self explanatory too.

-Why would you even use the upperdash arm to break someones shield like that, it may do alot of shield damage but any competent player will definitely punish you for it not just Roy. Upperdash is more useful when you have a read and your looking for the kill, not to pressure someones shield. (unless its already really weak).

-Most attacks can be punished if whiffed, not just nair, and even then nair's auto cancel makes it very hard to punish. True, nair does have weak priority but roy can't punish it with an F-smash unless you completely whiff from the start of the move to the end right in front of him when he's already charging......
Nair's low priority means it gets beaten out by alot of moves so you should be using it sparingly in the first place.

-Frame data, doesn't mean much here. Look at pit's nair, its a frame 3 move. Faster than all of Roy's attacks, does that mean that attacks always go in fsvour of pit? There are alot more fsctors behind that. e.g spacing, timing, placing, etc. Maybe wait for him to attack first and then use your own attack or shield it and punish.

If you find yourself losing to Roy when challenging him then just let him approach and punish him instead for what he is doing. Nothing is unpunishable (to a certain extent) and this is true with Roy. If he is coming in for grabs then just don't sit there shielding nor throw out an unsafe attack. If he approaches with fair, dash, attack, nair, etc just shield grab it or use an OoS option.


Also this is just my view on things, everyone is subject to their own point of views.

 

[Gadiel_VaStar]

Does anyone have an idea on how Pit does vs Sheik? Is there a MU discussion anywhere?

 

[ReRaze]

Does anyone have an idea on how Pit does vs Sheik? Is there a MU discussion anywhere?

Pretty sure there is an MU discussion thread but we probs haven't discussed shiek yet. In general Pit does pretty well against shiek compared to the rest of the cast, his floatiness lets him escape combos a little easier, he is very hard to gimp which is trouble for sheik since she cant kill reliably. Pit is one of the few characters that can challenge shiek offstage too. A well spaced fair beats out all of shiek's moves even bouncing fish.

 

[Uncle Honey]

How does Pit fair against Luigi, Sheik, Ness, Fox, Yoshi, C. Falcon, Villager and Villager customs. Numbers are fine; only need a general scope. I am deciding on picking up the character.

 

[ReRaze]

How does Pit fair against Luigi, Sheik, Ness, Fox, Yoshi, C. Falcon, Villager and Villager customs. Numbers are fine; only need a general scope. I am deciding on picking up the character.

Without customs the only character I have trouble with is Yoshi, Pit can deal with the other characters just fine imo having an advantage against fox, ness and falcon whilst going even against luigi, shiek and villager
With customs, villager and shiek will be a bit harder (villager defensively and shiek offensively). Imo Ness, Fox and C.Falcon shouldnt be too much harder unless they land the jank stuff like pk thunder 2, twisting fox and captain fakcons lightning kick infinite. Idk what yoshi gets off customs....
this is just my opinion from experience though u should test things out yourself if u can

 

[Wintropy]

I don't think Falcon's customs are anything to write home about, for what it's worth. It's mostly just speed / strength changes, I don't think his moves fundamentally change how he plays, so just play the Falcon matchup the way it's meant to be played.

Villager is a bit trickier. I don't have much experience with custom Villager, how does Pit fare with stall tactics?

 

[ReRaze]

I don't think Falcon's customs are anything to write home about, for what it's worth. It's mostly just speed / strength changes, I don't think his moves fundamentally change how he plays, so just play the Falcon matchup the way it's meant to be played.

Villager is a bit trickier. I don't have much experience with custom Villager, how does Pit fare with stall tactics?

You mean the tripping tree and explosive balloons? Pit can deal with it a little better than most of the cast from my experience. Like, most Villagers I've played camp around the tree and when opponents try to jump over it they can slingshot him/her. With Pit you have three options, you can super armour right through the tripping tree or you can dash attack, hitting villager before tripping or use multiple jumps to avoid getting slingshotted, you have to mix things up and see how the villager reacts. Other than that you can camp villager to a stalemate with fullhop arrows.

As for the explosive balloons, well you can either respect them or go ham on Villager offstage. They aren't impossible to pop and gimp villager with pits long disjoints but there is no guarantee that you wont get hurt. If the villager wants to regrab-camp just full hop arrow him while he's on the ledge or run offstage away from the balloons as he regrabs it and hit him.

 

[Uncle Honey]

One last question. How often do you find yourself using Pit's ftilt as a kill option as opposed to fmash since they come out on the same frame?

 

[Wintropy]

One last question. How often do you find yourself using Pit's ftilt as a kill option as opposed to fmash since they come out on the same frame?

I tend to use f-smash more often, but I really think I'd be better off if I used f-tilt more.

Pit's f-smash is too much of a risk if it whiffs, there's some comfort in knowing that a whiffed f-tilt isn't too much danger. The issue is getting the sweetspot, but that's why Palutena invented the pivot~ ;3

 

[Red Pittoo ~ Rekt]

Can anyone really think of a good use of utilt? I never use it except for a battlefield mixup and to catch airdodges out of d throw which doesn't always work.

 

[Wintropy]

Can anyone really think of a good use of utilt? I never use it except for a battlefield mixup and to catch airdodges out of d throw which doesn't always work.

It's good to get the opponent off of you if they're in your face or just above you.

Otherwise it's kinda naff.