Q&A Mirror of Truth or Palutena's Advice? Both available at all hours of the day

[ReRaze]

http://youtu.be/IMyTW-9oqsg
@Wintropy here is a match of me against Villyness in a tourney (its from ages ago but it should give some insight on the villager with customs MU). Im using normal Pit.

edit: Should I have put this in the vid thread?....

 

[ReRaze]

Can anyone really think of a good use of utilt? I never use it except for a battlefield mixup and to catch airdodges out of d throw which doesn't always work.

Have you tried it to cover ledge getup options?

edit: whoops I forgot I just posted before this. Mod pls fix this Im sorry I double posted.

 

[Red Pittoo ~ Rekt]

Have you tried it to cover ledge getup options?

edit: whoops I forgot I just posted before this. Mod pls fix this Im sorry I double posted.

What options does it cover? It doesn't have much range, does it?

 

[ReRaze]

What options does it cover? It doesn't have much range, does it?

Well it should cover jump and normal get up. It could possibly lead to a frame trap on the roll get up too since it has very little cooldown you could ftilt and catch their roll.

 

[Red Pittoo ~ Rekt]

Well it should cover jump and normal get up. It could possibly lead to a frame trap on the roll get up too since it has very little cooldown you could ftilt and catch their roll.

Don't d and u smashes do the job better?

 

[ReRaze]

Well utilt is slightly more forgiving in terms of timing since it lasts longer than the other two (meaning it can catch the normal get up easier) as well as having less cooldown than usmash but yeah you are definitely right there when you say there are better options. Usmash does the same thing but more cooldown can be made up by the fact that it avoids some get up attacks due to pit jumping when he usmashes. Dsmash is also extremley safe and covers normal get up and roll easier. But dsmash doesnt cover jump and usmash doesnt cover rolls while utilt can possibly cover them all.

 

[Red Pittoo ~ Rekt]

Well utilt is slightly more forgiving in terms of timing since it lasts longer than the other two (meaning it can catch the normal get up easier) as well as having less cooldown than usmash but yeah you are definitely right there when you say there are better options. Usmash does the same thing but more cooldown can be made up by the fact that it avoids some get up attacks due to pit jumping when he usmashes. Dsmash is also extremley safe and covers normal get up and roll easier. But dsmash doesnt cover jump and usmash doesnt cover rolls while utilt can possibly cover them all.

Hm. Next time I play I'll test

 

[ReRaze]

Could anyone explain the priorities of fair and nair? like nair can beat out lemons and I think slingshots but what else, is nair even a disjoint? I find it sometimes gets out prioritsed by moves without a disjoint.


btw @ Red Pittoo ~ Rekt
Heres a pic I found that I thought you might like :3
http://pre13.deviantart.net/a1d1/th/pre/i/2015/230/2/e/red_dark_pitters_by_lady_of_link-d966t73.png

 

[Red Pittoo ~ Rekt]

Could anyone explain the priorities of fair and nair? like nair can beat out lemons and I think slingshots but what else, is nair even a disjoint? I find it sometimes gets out prioritsed by moves without a disjoint.


btw @ Red Pittoo ~ Rekt
Heres a pic I found that I thought you might like :3
http://pre13.deviantart.net/a1d1/th/pre/i/2015/230/2/e/red_dark_pitters_by_lady_of_link-d966t73.png

Oh yea I have that picture, thanks! And fair and nair are kinda weird. Nair can catch Sonics side b too, I don't even think there is much disjoint on it. I feel like it has such little range. Because of the range fair can beat Marios bair. I believe fair beats B jrs side b as well. Nair is really great for catching, approaching and combos, but needs more priority imo. That's all I know atm

 

[Mr. ShinyUmbreon]

Any advice for reading/punishing Air-Dodges? most of the time when I go for a d-throw combo, my opponents will air dodge out of it and leave me in an unfavorable spot, I've been getting into the habit of short hopping to bait out the air dodge and punish on the ground, but are there any other ways of punishing air dodges?

 

[Red Pittoo ~ Rekt]

Any advice for reading/punishing Air-Dodges? most of the time when I go for a d-throw combo, my opponents will air dodge out of it and leave me in an unfavorable spot, I've been getting into the habit of short hopping to bait out the air dodge and punish on the ground, but are there any other ways of punishing air dodges?

If they keep frequently doing it and it's super obvious, charge u smash without the short hop. If you wanna bait, do as you have been doing. U smash is an anti-air move. As for any other air dodge, F smash can be used if you notice they air dodge and move away. U smash of course as your best anti air. as previously stated, you may use up tilt to catch air dodges out of d throw into up smash as almost as frame trap (Not sure if it is because it doesn't always work). You can follow someone and grab them when they air dodge while falling. D smash is a pretty good option on characters who can mix up their air mobility well like Lucas. But when you just read an air dodge as they fall, side b (Depending on which Pit and the situation) is gonna be one of, if not, the best option. Dash attack into an airdodge read can become a grab. Since side b is so good at catching, this is most of the time your best option. Ways to get the initial read are just observation. Sometimes try to pick an option that you may miss, and iff they airdodge, it can be a sign they like airdodging d throw. When they achieve high percent, use this knowledge to punish. You may also just observe while they're airborne and notice their airdodges

 

[Crudele]

Can pit's uair drag people down like other multi-hit aerials? I like to use that tech with greninjas uair and zeldas nair, and usually follow up with a dtilt or grab. Does this work for the pits?

 

[LancerStaff]

Could anyone explain the priorities of fair and nair? like nair can beat out lemons and I think slingshots but what else, is nair even a disjoint? I find it sometimes gets out prioritsed by moves without a disjoint.


btw @ Red Pittoo ~ Rekt
Heres a pic I found that I thought you might like :3
http://pre13.deviantart.net/a1d1/th/pre/i/2015/230/2/e/red_dark_pitters_by_lady_of_link-d966t73.png

Aerial priority is simple, Xacer. Besides against projectiles, whichever disjoint is bigger, wins. Nair's disjoint is pretty small, and the hitbox is oddly square and is smaller then the animation would lead you to believe, so it gets beat out a lot. Against projectiles it's purely damage.

Can pit's uair drag people down like other multi-hit aerials? I like to use that tech with greninjas uair and zeldas nair, and usually follow up with a dtilt or grab. Does this work for the pits?

Yep. It's harder to do it with Pit though since his gravity is low.

Gravity is separate from fall speed, if you didn't know. It's essentially how quickly you stop moving up and then how quickly you accelerate down. Zelda I believe has higher gravity then Pit so the technique is easier for her.

 

[Crudele]

Yep. It's harder to do it with Pit though since his gravity is low.

Gravity is separate from fall speed, if you didn't know. It's essentially how quickly you stop moving up and then how quickly you accelerate down. Zelda I believe has higher gravity then Pit so the technique is easier for her.

I'm imagining using this after the fast fall (ideally), but I'll definitely have to hit the lab and try this after work. Thanks! Is it viable to do with pit, or not so much cause it's harder to pull off?

 

[LancerStaff]

I'm imagining using this after the fast fall (ideally), but I'll definitely have to hit the lab and try this after work. Thanks! Is it viable to do with pit, or not so much cause it's harder to pull off?

I wouldn't really know since I'm stuck playing laggy wi-fi all the time, but between that and how Uair is fairly laggy it's definitely difficult to pull off in a real match. Usmash comes out frame 6, same as his grab, so that's another thing to keep in mind when trying it out even though the hitbox is pretty high.

 

[gridatttack]

Hey there, I picked up Dark Pit somewhat recently and I think I have a bit of trouble on how to approach. What are Dark Pit ways to approach?

I've been using auto cancelled forward airs, but dunno if its the right thing. Also, I have a bit of an issue in using the silver bow way too much (coming from a main who has no projectiles whatsoever, I cant resist using the bow :v )
What would the best way to use arrows be? I now mostly do it when someone is off stage, but I think it might be better to edge guard them instead.

I mostly now have seen some videos of Nairo playing as Dark pit, but what are the best options as a kill move? So far, forward Smash and sometimes forward throw in the edge has been good. But I think I might be missing other options.

Any pointing to useful threads would be appreciated too

 

[LancerStaff]

Hey there, I picked up Dark Pit somewhat recently and I think I have a bit of trouble on how to approach. What are Dark Pit ways to approach?

I've been using auto cancelled forward airs, but dunno if its the right thing. Also, I have a bit of an issue in using the silver bow way too much (coming from a main who has no projectiles whatsoever, I cant resist using the bow :v )
What would the best way to use arrows be? I now mostly do it when someone is off stage, but I think it might be better to edge guard them instead.

I mostly now have seen some videos of Nairo playing as Dark pit, but what are the best options as a kill move? So far, forward Smash and sometimes forward throw in the edge has been good. But I think I might be missing other options.

Any pointing to useful threads would be appreciated too

There's lots of ways to approach, most anything really. Any aerial besides Uair has conventional uses, most being safe on shield due to autocancels, and dash grab and dash attack are great for their distance and dash attack is also safe on shield when properly spaced.

Dark Pit's arrows are okay. If the animation reaches a certain point in the air then it'll end sevenish frames sooner. The trick is to fullhop and then immediately hit B to draw the arrow, then let go right before he'd hit the ground during the animation and you'll cancel some endlag while shooting low enough to hit people. Pit just jumps, shoots, and RCs it.

I find Dark Pit's best used while recovering or while the opponent is above you, Pit's can be used much more effectively in neutral. Pit's pretty much just the better of the two because of it.

Truth is that they have plenty of KO moves, but they're all situational. Fsmash, Usmash, back of Dsmash, side specials, Fthrow, Uthrow (platform required to be decent), Uair (need to jump pretty high though, with platforms it kinda gets crazy), Bair, Fair and Pit's Ftilt. Gimps are your best bet, and Fthrow will probably be your best outright kill move.

Things are kinda messy right now, so the social (The Skyworld hub, probably the only decently active topic. ) is your best bet if you need a question answered.

 

[Ssbm_Jag]

Is there a diagram or a good way to describe where the inert detector is around electroshock arm?
I'm looking to learn how to punish pit's side B when he's sweet spotting side-b.

 

[LancerStaff]

Is there a diagram or a good way to describe where the inert detector is around electroshock arm?
I'm looking to learn how to punish pit's side B when he's sweet spotting side-b.

Not as far as I know, but it's functionally the same as Captain Falcon's Raptor Boost.

Don't think it's punishable outside of throwing a projectile at him and punishing the uppercut, and obviously that's not always an option.

 

[Ssbm_Jag]

Thanks, I've figured it out. You are right, but I guess I also can try to punish him on startup even tho that's really hard.

 

[Koiba]

Question~

What does the angels shield advantage numbers look like on their moves with the new patch?

And do we have any moves that has frame advantage on shield? I doubt it lol

 

[LancerStaff]

Question~

What does the angels shield advantage numbers look like on their moves with the new patch?

And do we have any moves that has frame advantage on shield? I doubt it lol

I had it posted in the social the other day... I'll dig 'er out real quick.

Edit: https://docs.google.com/spreadsheets/d/12a9yZTmAUrL17sL6BQC4DJiKUVN1s3jxsOlzBuyZdMo/edit?pli=1

Big thing about shield safety is that it's not just how quick you can act vs. how quick they act, but also how much space you put between you and the opponent. Since Pit's got good reach he can keep away from the typical jabs and Dtilts most characters use to punish. This is pretty much what sinks Roy... Has a sword, but properly spacing it for damage isn't really safe most of the time since if you get perfect shielded once you're getting grabbed.

Actually, Pit's interesting in that his Fair can't be perfect shielded properly due to the multihits.

 

[CHOMPY]

With the new patch, is Pits falling Fair safe on shield?

 

[ReRaze]

With the new patch, is Pits falling Fair safe on shield?

nope....but it is safe if you space it and ff autocancel it, always was.

 

[FiXalaS]

I feel the shield changes nerfed Pit a bit

or maybe not... at least it seems it did not help us at all.

Edit: I haven't felt much difference but reading LancerStaff's post in that dedicated thread It seems Pit does get some benefits

 

[Buffoon]

Hello Pit and Dark Pit players, I have a question for you all.

Can anyone explain how the H a Dark Pit amiibo without any equipment hit me with Electroshock, then immediately grabbed me before I had a chance to be knocked away from taking a hit???

 

[LancerStaff]

Hello Pit and Dark Pit players, I have a question for you all.

Can anyone explain how the H a Dark Pit amiibo without any equipment hit me with Electroshock, then immediately grabbed me before I had a chance to be knocked away from taking a hit???

If you space the move in the air properly then you'll cancel the attack animation, and combined with the electrical effect (think ZSS) Dark Pit can combo with it.

 

[Buffoon]

If you space the move in the air properly then you'll cancel the attack animation, and combined with the electrical effect (think ZSS) Dark Pit can combo with it.

Thanks for the reply, can both Pits do that?

 

[LancerStaff]

Thanks for the reply, can both Pits do that?

The cancel? Yep. Only Dark Pit can combo with it though.

 

[ReRaze]

Is it just me or did the shield mechanic changes make down smash less safe on shield?

 

[LancerStaff]

Is it just me or did the shield mechanic changes make down smash less safe on shield?

That's actually impossible, heh. Back hit is safe on shield now, front is safe on like Wario or something.

Truth is that only ZSS's stunning moves lost raw safety. Marth and Roy's sourspots are technically just as safe as before, but you can shield DI sooner. Since Pit doesn't have any hitstun modifiers less then 1, he wasn't effected negatively whatsoever.

 

[ReRaze]

That's actually impossible, heh. Back hit is safe on shield now, front is safe on like Wario or something.

Truth is that only ZSS's stunning moves lost raw safety. Marth and Roy's sourspots are technically just as safe as before, but you can shield DI sooner. Since Pit doesn't have any hitstun modifiers less then 1, he wasn't effected negatively whatsoever.

ah ok good to know its just me.....
wait front hit isn't safe anymore?

 

[LancerStaff]

ah ok good to know its just me.....
wait front hit isn't safe anymore?

Pretty sure it wasn't ever really safe. Against some characters sure, but safe on everybody? No.

Two important aspects of safety... Frame data, and distance it creates. Even the back hit is negative on shield I'm sure, but the space it creates makes it impossible for many characters to punish. Certain fast projectiles or tether grabs could probably punish it.

 

[Zio~]

Can someone help me on this match? I know I made mistakes(Specially when I changed Pit) but I'd like to know if anyone has some tips on this match up, it's only one match, you don't have to watch the whole thing, specially because is really embarazing being rekt like that, but I would like some help from you guys so I can Improve

Starts at 3m52s

 

[Mr. ShinyUmbreon]

Can someone help me on this match? I know I made mistakes(Specially when I changed Pit) but I'd like to know if anyone has some tips on this match up, it's only one match, you don't have to watch the whole thing, specially because is really embarazing being rekt like that, but I would like some help from you guys so I can Improve

Starts at 3m52s

I noticed you rolled a lot at the beginning, but you played fairly well otherwise, I think you suffer from a similar problem that I have, where you needed to mix up your recovery, because Meta Knight is really good at ledge guarding, he was easily able to to stage spike you. Not sure if you could have teched any of them though.

 

[LancerStaff]

Can someone help me on this match? I know I made mistakes(Specially when I changed Pit) but I'd like to know if anyone has some tips on this match up, it's only one match, you don't have to watch the whole thing, specially because is really embarazing being rekt like that, but I would like some help from you guys so I can Improve

Dial back the Usmash use. It's good, but you got punished for it more then a few times. Utilt's great at terrorizing platforms and slides out of a walk, give that a try. I wouldn't throw out so many Dash Attacks either.

You can't gimp MK with onstage GOs. Offstage it might work, but onstage it only works on Ike and Little Mac.

If you're offstage against somebody like MK you should try to get the ledge with Uspecial ASAP. That way if you're hit out of it you'll still have jumps. You also gotta use arrows to cover yourself.

 

[Dr. Windbox]

I need some advice from all you wonderful smashers. I am about to attend my first tournament (E2C 19, In the chicago area) and am quite nervous. What can I do to calm my nerves, as well as get some good training hours in before saturday? What can I do to prep for the tournament? Thanks so much!

 

[LancerStaff]

I need some advice from all you wonderful smashers. I am about to attend my first tournament (E2C 19, In the chicago area) and am quite nervous. What can I do to calm my nerves, as well as get some good training hours in before saturday? What can I do to prep for the tournament? Thanks so much!

Tournament nerves usually don't go away without playing at tournaments, and the best way to get experience is to play in tournaments. So good luck with that.

Really though, if there's other events/people to play with then you should try and attend and play friendlies. If you don't have a way to play offline then try online, namely Anther's.

 

[Mr. ShinyUmbreon]

I need some advice from all you wonderful smashers. I am about to attend my first tournament (E2C 19, In the chicago area) and am quite nervous. What can I do to calm my nerves, as well as get some good training hours in before saturday? What can I do to prep for the tournament? Thanks so much!

Like Lancer said, anthers is a great place to train, here's a link https://www.smashladder.com/
If you're anything like me, you'll probably get your ass kicked in your first tournament, but that's okay, most competitive smashers are nice people. Take every match as a learning experience, ask players for advice if they beat you. Play friendlies as much as possible, and try to make some friends at your tournament scene. Trust me, there is NO REASON to be nervous while at a tournament, (unless it's like grand finals or something) no one will judge you for losing aside from yourself. And you might notice that there are other people who are nervous as well

 

[Dr. Windbox]

Tournament nerves usually don't go away without playing at tournaments, and the best way to get experience is to play in tournaments. So good luck with that.

Really though, if there's other events/people to play with then you should try and attend and play friendlies. If you don't have a way to play offline then try online, namely Anther's.

Like Lancer said, anthers is a great place to train, here's a link https://www.smashladder.com/
If you're anything like me, you'll probably get your *** kicked in your first tournament, but that's okay, most competitive smashers are nice people. Take every match as a learning experience, ask players for advice if they beat you. Play friendlies as much as possible, and try to make some friends at your tournament scene. Trust me, there is NO REASON to be nervous while at a tournament, (unless it's like grand finals or something) no one will judge you for losing aside from yourself. And you might notice that there are other people who are nervous as well

Thank you guys so much for the advice! I think it will help me greatly! You da best!