Miracle Of Light - Palutena in SSB4 (Featuring Cereza from Bayonetta-series)

[Nabbitnator]

I actually think ness is the best he's ever been in a smash game.

 

[~ Valkyrie ~]

Whoever said Ness was cheap was right. I'm adding him to my ban list.
Yep, it's another one of my anger moments. It's bad enough Pit isn't as strong as he used to be... besides his improved range.

Pfft, I seem to notice that PK Fire is a major compotent. (Usually followed to a grab if you roll away and such. Also Dash Attacks and F-Aerials. When you get them down, most noobs or spammers become an easy game.

Palutena keeps surprising with her options still. Tilts still weird me out but rest of her is just plain good. Reflect Barrier is still kinda situational but in FD-metagame where projectiles seem dominant, she can easily gain an upper hand.

Also @Benmjy, welcome aboard!

 

[Admiral Pit]

Pfft, I seem to notice that PK Fire is a major compotent. (Usually followed to a grab if you roll away and such. Also Dash Attacks and F-Aerials. When you get them down, most noobs or spammers become an easy game.

Palutena keeps surprising with her options still. Tilts still weird me out but rest of her is just plain good. Reflect Barrier is still kinda situational but in FD-metagame where projectiles seem dominant, she can easily gain an upper hand.

Also @Benmjy, welcome aboard!

I need matches overall to review my bad points. I feel sad.

EDIT: Kind to think of it, we need a list on what stages are good and bad for Palutena. It doesn't hurt to try, despite the limitations.

 

[κomıc]

Anyone find some decent uses for Heavenly Light? The only thing I can think of its use is it's effect on pushing opponents away from Palutena gradually. But even then.. meh...

Angelic Missile is good with a d-throw follow up. Super Speed... Ehm, it is cute but not something I'd personally want to use.

Have yet to try Lightweight.

 

[Dinoman96]

Super Speed is actually kinda neat because you can do her dash attack after it's been initiated and you can even grab during it. It's a neat way of letting her approach with her grab/dash attacks.

Not to mention, jumping during it will give you the closest you'll ever get to having Melee styled jumps in this game (Her momentum is actually conserved when she jumps).

 

[mimgrim]

Super Speed is basically a sped up run animation with a hit box. Any thing you can do out of a run you can do out of Super Speed plus more and Super Speed's hit box is a really good combo starter. The move has a lot of different mix-ups.

 

[SegaNintendoUbisoft]

unfortunately I'll be leaving at four so i won't be able to have a few battles at 5..

No problem, maybe we could fight sometime on the weekend.

 

[Fluttershy]

No problem, maybe we could fight sometime on the weekend.

actually it changed and i can battle now until maybe 5:30 or 6

 

[kmpyj]

Hey guys, for my Palutena combo video, any song ideas? I was going to use boss battle theme 1, but Sakuraiiiiiiiiiiii had to beat me to it. (╯°□°）╯︵ ┻━┻. And also, should I make it now, or wait for the Wii U version (I have an HD capture card for all home consoles.)

 

[κomıc]

Hey guys, for my Palutena combo video, any song ideas? I was going to use boss battle theme 1, but Sakuraiiiiiiiiiiii had to beat me to it. (╯°□°）╯︵ ┻━┻. And also, should I make it now, or wait for the Wii U version (I have an HD capture card for all home consoles.)

Either Chapter 11 Reset Bomb Forest or Chapter 14 Lightning Battle

 

[kmpyj]

I need matches overall to review my bad points. I feel sad.

EDIT: Kind to think of it, we need a list on what stages are good and bad for Palutena. It doesn't hurt to try, despite the limitations.

On terms of which stage Palutena has the most potential in, I would say Gaur Plains (Xenoblade stage.) With all of those platforms, Palutena could be a Goddess on that stage (even though she already is.) Because when there are platforms, there is the gift of teleporting. If done right, Palutena could teleport all around that stage. It only makes her more dangerous because she can cancel off of her teleport from the platform edges. However, it is hard to land those successfully, but it is not impossible. I can only imagine what Palutena would look like in a TAS. But overall, I would say any stage with platforms Palutena would do great in.

 

[Admiral Pit]

On terms of which stage Palutena has the most potential in, I would say Gaur Plains (Xenoblade stage.) With all of those platforms, Palutena could be a Goddess on that stage (even though she already is.) Because when there are platforms, there is the gift of teleporting. If done right, Palutena could teleport all around that stage. It only makes her more dangerous because she can cancel off of her teleport from the platform edges. However, it is hard to land those successfully, but it is not impossible. I can only imagine what Palutena would look like in a TAS. But overall, I would say any stage with platforms Palutena would do great in.

As far as what I'm going with, aside from battlefield, YI, and FD, the other ones legal are Prism Tower, Brinstar, Japes, and Omegas as CPs. If I can utilize those stages early on I can be of good use.

 

[MysteriousSilver]

I think what a good Palutena stage will be is something with low cielings for uair and usmash kills, platforms to hit from underneath with usmash and aerials, and maybe lots of space to run around with super speed and lightweight.

could see her excelling at just picked bad stages for her opponent though, I feel like she's versitile enough to work well anywhere.

 

[Admiral Pit]

I think what a good Palutena stage will be is something with low cielings for uair and usmash kills, platforms to hit from underneath with usmash and aerials, and maybe lots of space to run around with super speed and lightweight.

could see her excelling at just picked bad stages for her opponent though, I feel like she's versitile enough to work well anywhere.

If someone's capable of checking out each Omega to see which ones have low ceilings or a ledge where she can attack under using U-air, it'll help. List-wise, it should be:

-Low ceiling (to help Palutena kill quicker with the D-throw > U-air combo, U-smash, or just overall)
-Sloped ledge (for Palutena to attack below from to make use of her U-air or something)
-Both (has the two above)

As an optional, the Omegas that allow Palutena's SS/Glide combo (for customs) to go under the stage and to the other side. For the regular FD, I can't get her to recover that way when going to the left for some reason. Each of these small details can prove useful to us.

 

[Cap'nChreest]

I don't know why people say Palutena is defensive. She clearly isn't. Her away game is awful. "Auto-reticle" is a terrible spacing move. Its only good for catching people in their get-up attacks. She's good at spacing with her f-air and then going in for a grab or jab into grab. Or jab>F-smash. She's really not defensive imo. She has good and quick options up close. or maybe just a couple really good options up close. Jab, grab, or F-air. They lead into so many other things. You can get a really good string going.

 

[mimgrim]

Just because a character can get good strings going doesn't mean the character isn't defensive. Sheik in Project M can get amazing strings going with her moves but she is one of the most defensive characters in the game. This is because she lacks a competent neutral game. Her whole neutral game is basically trying to fish for the grab. She isn't rush-down like I've seen so many people call her. Palutena is in the same boat, She lacks a really effective neutral game. She is definitely not aggressive. You could play her that way and if you are good enough you could see some success, but it isn't optimal. Just like with P:M Sheik.

You are also associating defensive gameplay with just keep away when there are multiple type of defensive play styles just like there are multiple ways to play aggressive. She's about creating walls with lingering moves or massive range moves, or both, similar to Melee Peach while forcing the opponent to approach with a really long ranged move, which Reticle accomplishes very well, like P:M Sheik.

 

[Mr.Lee]

Honestly, the way I find that I play Palutena is more chase down. But have to Play really careful(not defensively). Palutena has a really good chase down game if you can start something. Palu's play style for me seems to be really active.

Also, has anyone tried dair to Upsmash? They bounce up easier if they are in the air. Dair actually follows up for really good aerials, or Upsmash. It seems harder to dair them if the are on stage though.

 

[Burigu]

Sorry for my prolongued absence here, I just can keep me hands off the game these past few weeks, on that time with Palutena my favorite way to KO people is with her DAir, I chase them off the stage with DGrab, Jab, DGrab, Dash, then I do either of them double kick them so they can't recover or I go straight to the DAir, to meteor them. I see tons of people calling this move bad but the killing potencial is still there and for a meteor kind of move this one isn't that risky compared to other characters.

Also I have been working on the timing with Counter, for me it's a serious tool that many people simply don't use at all which for me is a big mistake.

For Little Mac trying to lure him be staying close to the ledge is a legit strategy?? I haven't tested this Online but seems to work against Level 9 CPU, I lure him to the ledge then Bthrow him and proceed with either the kick or the shield bashing attack, normally he can't even recover at low porcentages, not sure is this can work somehow against human players.

 

[MysteriousSilver]

That's basically the universal answer to Little Mac.

 

[mimgrim]

Lol. People have tried doing that to me so many times when I was able to play For Glory. Go ahead and camp at the ledge. I'll either just stay out of your range and just wait patiently for you to get impatient or slowly walk up to you and properly space a safe unpunishable attack.

Camping at the edge doesn't work against Macs who know what they are doing.

 

[MysteriousSilver]

I'm not saying it's an auto win but when you're in throwing range of the edge you're threatening to Mac. If you run out in to the middle he gets to have his way with you. We don't really have an option to pop him up and juggle him outside of throws so you might as well fight where throws become damning to him. Yeah, there are answers to it, but that's no reason to run out there and play his game. You have a projectile (assuming you aren't running Heavenly Light) so there's no reason Palu should be losing the patience game--just be careful not toget side-b'd.

 

[κomıc]

I think gimping Little Mac with Palutena will be a lot easier using Gamecube controls (or other preferable controllers). My thumbs seem to keep slipping off the d-pad at critical moments and screwing me up. And I normally don't have this issue with other 3DS games but for Smash 3DS... Ugh.

By the way, what do you folks think about Lightweight? I've messed around with it sparingly (not against a person), and I see it being somewhat useful with Super Speed. It really improves her mobility and correct me if I'm wrong but it feels like her moves come out a bit faster.

Can someone give me examples on follow-ups to Super Speed?

 

[MysteriousSilver]

Super speed can be followed up with any aerial, jump-canceled upsmash, probably rocket jump.

Lightweight is great when you're already sitting at high percent, makes dthrow combo into stuff later and makes you keepaway queen with enough room to move around.

 

[chipndip]

Just because a character can get good strings going doesn't mean the character isn't defensive. Sheik in Project M can get amazing strings going with her moves but she is one of the most defensive characters in the game. This is because she lacks a competent neutral game. Her whole neutral game is basically trying to fish for the grab. She isn't rush-down like I've seen so many people call her. Palutena is in the same boat, She lacks a really effective neutral game. She is definitely not aggressive. You could play her that way and if you are good enough you could see some success, but it isn't optimal. Just like with P:M Sheik.

You are also associating defensive gameplay with just keep away when there are multiple type of defensive play styles just like there are multiple ways to play aggressive. She's about creating walls with lingering moves or massive range moves, or both, similar to Melee Peach while forcing the opponent to approach with a really long ranged move, which Reticle accomplishes very well, like P:M Sheik.

Palutena is NOT about "making walls", thank you. Even with the wind-boxes, her smashes leave her way too open. She doesn't have many good lingering moves to choose from that would wall anyone to begin with. Since she can't camp, and she can't wall, all this emphasis on her defense is just lop-sided thinking. She has defensive special moves, yes, but her other tools take so much from "defense" that she's still not a defensive character. I don't know how to describe it, but it ain't no defense.

 

[Wintropy]

I do wish people wouldn't cite their own experiences as a priori facts.

We're here to discuss and appreciate Palutena, not squabble about how we should and shouldn't play her. This thread is about helping each-other improve, and unless that's done in a mutually respectful and well-informed manner, we're not going to get anything of merit done.

 

[deepseadiva]

Palutena is NOT about "hitting the opponent off the stage to their death", thank you. Her tools need to be used in the following exact matter. Any deviation from how I'm about to explain is mostly incorrect because I have never lost with her and I have been playing Smash for 3DS for seven years so listen up. She is a aggro-defense character with chain strings and octigonal priority that creates pressure walls from a gimping distance. If you're not playing her in that kind of manner lolololol you suck you might need to switch characters.

 

[chipndip]

Palutena is NOT about "hitting the opponent off the stage to their death", thank you. Her tools need to be used in the following exact matter. Any deviation from how I'm about to explain is mostly incorrect because I have never lost with her and I have been playing Smash for 3DS for seven years so listen up. She is a aggro-defense character with chain strings and octigonal priority that creates pressure walls from a gimping distance. If you're not playing her in that kind of manner lolololol you suck you might need to switch characters.

1) I sure hope you didn't think that was clever, and I also hope you don't think you made a point with that.

2) Did I tell him how to use the character? No. I said she's not about walling people out. Nothing she has makes a wall to begin with.

3) Maybe you can actually shed some light on the character instead of failing at being a smart ass?

I do wish people wouldn't cite their own experiences as a priori facts.

We're here to discuss and appreciate Palutena, not squabble about how we should and shouldn't play her. This thread is about helping each-other improve, and unless that's done in a mutually respectful and well-informed manner, we're not going to get anything of merit done.

Understood, but blatantly bad info should be contested or someone's gonna read it and get led astray. It sounds conceited saying it like that, but if I came to you and said "The best way to use Marth is to play defensive on the other side of the screen and wall people out", even if you used a little less attitude about it (I'll admit that much. That was overboard.), you would basically elect to shut that down before the poor guy suffers more losses than needed. Although somewhat rude, that was basically the same thing.

 

[Nabbitnator]

Palutena is NOT about "hitting the opponent off the stage to their death", thank you. Her tools need to be used in the following exact matter. Any deviation from how I'm about to explain is mostly incorrect because I have never lost with her and I have been playing Smash for 3DS for seven years so listen up. She is a aggro-defense character with chain strings and octigonal priority that creates pressure walls from a gimping distance. If you're not playing her in that kind of manner lolololol you suck you might need to switch characters.

I know she isn't about hitting the opponent off the stage to their death... but in general more players need to fight off stage more.

 

[deepseadiva]

Sorry I didnt mean to specifically pick on anyone I just want to work "aggro-defensive chain strings" into a post

 

[chipndip]

Sorry I didnt mean to specifically pick on anyone I just want to work "aggro-defensive chain strings" into a post

Oh...then my bad for getting "Chain Chomp" levels of aggro back at you. I can be chill, yo! D:>

But your little comment on "aggro-defense chain strings" does bring about a good thought on how we should summarize her play style a bit. She DOES have a weird defensive emphasis on her specials, despite her risk/reward from her normal moves. It's like her specials are simply to negate what others can do to her own offense, rather than for her to gimp theirs.

-A counter to fight against pressure
-A reflect to block spam from REAL walls
-Teleports to warp behind ledge guarders
-Multi-shot projectile that can't be easily reflected/countered back at her

I think her play style's been interpreted wrong to a degree. These tools don't make defense. They actually just put a damper on other peoples' tools, forcing others to fight in a much more "vanilla" fashion, which Palutena is tasked to keep up with via her jab, throws, f-air, and b-air.

 

[Cap'nChreest]

Palutena is NOT about "hitting the opponent off the stage to their death", thank you. Her tools need to be used in the following exact matter. Any deviation from how I'm about to explain is mostly incorrect because I have never lost with her and I have been playing Smash for 3DS for seven years so listen up. She is a aggro-defense character with chain strings and octigonal priority that creates pressure walls from a gimping distance. If you're not playing her in that kind of manner lolololol you suck you might need to switch characters.

I laughed.

You win this round....

 

[kamus_aran]

I main Palutena. I can't beat Classic Mode 9.0 boss, any advice guys? (

I've been fighting it about more than 10 times already (

 

[Admiral Pit]

Custom specials and Equipment are your friend in that request, so get to that Smash Run, get a good mix of Power and Defense, get the fireworks, and get to it. Spamming SH B-airs if done correctly prevent landing lag, and do damage.

 

[kamus_aran]

Thanks, but I'd like to win it without resorting to customs

 

[Nabbitnator]

The only custom I like is jump glide just because its both a recovery move and it can do what light speed can do without having to charge.

 

[kamus_aran]

I hate when the boss does something that push me far off the stage when it roars. I lose constantly because of that

Do you guys know how to avoid that? Wish i could remember the animation before it does it. That would help me a lot

 

[andimidna]

Hey guys, for my Palutena combo video, any song ideas? I was going to use boss battle theme 1, but Sakuraiiiiiiiiiiii had to beat me to it. (╯°□°）╯︵ ┻━┻. And also, should I make it now, or wait for the Wii U version (I have an HD capture card for all home consoles.)

This video sounds hype
http://youtu.be/MCqnOZ_8nyY will always remind me of Palutena in Smash now, not sure if it fits a combo video but its pretty great

Palutena is NOT about "hitting the opponent off the stage to their death", thank you. Her tools need to be used in the following exact matter. Any deviation from how I'm about to explain is mostly incorrect because I have never lost with her and I have been playing Smash for 3DS for seven years so listen up. She is a aggro-defense character with chain strings and octigonal priority that creates pressure walls from a gimping distance. If you're not playing her in that kind of manner lolololol you suck you might need to switch characters.

Dat 6666th post on the thread tho
@Hades the Magnificent should have snatched that one up lol

 

[mimgrim]

Lol.

Well at least I got a good laugh out of 2 people. One who intended to be funny and the other who probably didn't intend to be funny.

So thanks for that.

 

[kamus_aran]

Ok, i just know how to dogde it! But still struggling with those hands ==

 

[Yoshi Kirishima]

Palutena is NOT about "making walls", thank you. Even with the wind-boxes, her smashes leave her way too open. She doesn't have many good lingering moves to choose from that would wall anyone to begin with. Since she can't camp, and she can't wall, all this emphasis on her defense is just lop-sided thinking. She has defensive special moves, yes, but her other tools take so much from "defense" that she's still not a defensive character. I don't know how to describe it, but it ain't no defense.

But she most definitely IS "about" making walls. Because that's what makes it hard for them to approach, and allows you to read them and punish their approach and get grabs. She has fair as a quick move with decent range. She can read and stop dashes with ftilt and dtilt. She can read and punish rolls with fsmash (especially with the wind effect that stops their roll short and leaves them in front of you with their backs turned). She can cover both a dash and roll approach with ftilt. She can also throw out an occasional counter to mix it up. She even has that reflect barrier which can stop them short and leave you a fsmash or a grab. Her dodges are also very good especially because it's harder to read them, and she can get away from opponents by warping away or just running away with her huge speed. She also has that good dash attack that helps prevent ground approaches even more, and lets you attack through their attack or even bash them through their projectile if they try to camp you. Almost everything in her moveset is built around zoning and punishing them.

I also disagree that Palutena has a bad neutral game and that she has to be aggressive. AeroLink showed quite convincingly that her neutral game is very good and that her defense is excellent as well.