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You didn't make the contradiction of saying that inactivity didn't factor into voting me then saying it did? say what?
You're scum, gheb is null. Simple.
1. I fail to see why this is the "more complicated" explanation. Scum is painfully aware of what IS scummy, and unless you have evidence that supports your interpretation of his actions you're essentially just guessing (yes I know that we're guessing regardless, but at the very least with evidence we can make our guesses "more sophisticated" if you will). My evidence is that Gheb's actions were inappropriate given the circumstances. What's yours (not rhetorical)?
I'm primarily asking you this so to further help my read on you. Also tbh I AM still open to being persuaded if the argument is good enough.Gheb said:
Why? Why is NH, me, and PJB town? Why do you want Soup or Gheb lynched? You literally need to back everything you're saying up.
Still too vague. How am I supposed to expand on it when I believe I have already sufficiently explained it?
Why did you even have stances then? You're saying that you've haven't had time to orient yourself. Okay, fine. In that case though, how did you come to the conclusion that me/PJB/NH were town and Soup was scum? Also, why is Gheb null to you? By putting him in the null category, you're implying that there's something about his play that you're unsure of how to interpret, correct? If so, then what is it?
There's literally no clarification here, just stating that these are your reads, simple as that. You ask "Why shouldn't I be confident in my reads?" and then 11 minutes after that you're saying that you need to read back through. If you can't clarify now, then maybe that is reasoning as to not be confident in your reads?
He wasn't scummy.
*headdesk*You don't have to if you don't want to. In fact, I'm not even sure whether soup is actually clear or not.
1.) You could just look at the facts and work from there. Fact: I was the first to post a screenshot of a role PM that says I am town and at least 2 people other than me must've seen it. The question is - did Zen give scum fake role PMs to take screenshots of in the beginning or not? Considering Zen felt the need to add rule #4 after soup and I posted our screenshots it's pretty unlikely, don't you think? It's pretty clear that he simply forgot about the rule and had to add it retroactively because it would've broken the game. Had Zen had a fake role PM for the mafia in petto he wouldn't have needed to add the rules. If that's not enough to see me as cleared [which the majority of the people seemto believe] then I don't know what more persuation you could possibly ask for.
Do you have any proof that he's playing poorly? Just because he doesn't yield to your silly expectations of how one should play this game doesn't mean it has to be poor. Do you know whether his reads are accurate or not? Why should I assume that your play isn't far worse than his? And since when the hell is poor play scummy?
My case is proof enough, you're too inept and thick headed to look at it.
It's not my expectations, well ok it kinda is but I still do not see why Soup would as town ever react like that.
He is sheeping every single damn counter wagon whenever he can. He's playing solely for self survival. Not for town's best interest.
Because I'm town.
Because Soup is experienced enough to not do this as town, this is bad play that I do not beleive Soup as town would put out.
Not til you're dead.
1. If you recall from the beginning of the game I did assume both you and Soup were cleared and I was thinking more or less from along the same line. The prior existence of rule 3 just strengthened the argument that you two were town to e, because if Zen did send scum fake claims at the same time then why even have rule 3? Tbh the only thing I'm finding wrong with your logic is paranoia. I am slightly paranoid that Zen would put in rule 3 just as a red herring. I mean why give us the ability to quote our role PMs at all? Why give us the ability to post screenshots at all? If he wanted us to remove time stamps, yet still was okay with us posting screen shots, then wouldn't he probably give scum screen shots from the beginning?1.) You could just look at the facts and work from there. Fact: I was the first to post a screenshot of a role PM that says I am town and at least 2 people other than me must've seen it. The question is - did Zen give scum fake role PMs to take screenshots of in the beginning or not? Considering Zen felt the need to add rule #4 after soup and I posted our screenshots it's pretty unlikely, don't you think? It's pretty clear that he simply forgot about the rule and had to add it retroactively because it would've broken the game. Had Zen had a fake role PM for the mafia in petto he wouldn't have needed to add the rules. If that's not enough to see me as cleared [which the majority of the people seemto believe] then I don't know what more persuation you could possibly ask for.
2.) The outburst is a huge null-tell and it bothers me that players got hooked on it so much. I think Ryu's case on soup was pretty poor and his reaction was understandable, especially if you try to see things from his point of view. If he was acting under the assumption that it was well understood that soup has at least semi-cleared himself then it's obvious he'd get angry about Ryu making such a pathetic case and PJB just sheeping it. But based on the fact that most points against soup have been weak and the fact that he screened his role PM I'll conclude that he is very likely town.
Actually on second thought this isn't really paranoia but more a legit question.me said:
What do you think about Orb's 323? He states that he needs to orient himself to answer Soup's questions, but yet prior to that he's stated that he's confident on his reads. Does that not seem odd to you?
Actually that is kinda odd, but Soup has don
Deadline is more than 24 hours from now, it's not like I'm going to miss it lol.
Paranoia is legit in this case because the 1% chance of it being a red herring or some other sort of nonsense by the mod is still there. It's the reason why I didn't really go out of my way to make the point because somebody will likely make a counter-argument with that 1% "but what if..." scenario as its basis. I mean, of course you can pick the 100% safety route and assume that soup and I could still be scum somehow but I will pick the 99% safety route that gives me a cleared player to work with, which is a lot more productive.
If soup weren't cleared I'd still say it's a null-tell.
A very good point. I completely forgot that Orbo posted his screenshot but now that you mention it, I remember he did.
I don't think he purposefully *gave* us the ability to post screenshots but simply forgot about it. The more I think about it the less sense it makes to look at the whole ruleset as if there were any red herrings. When I look at rule #3 and #4 I can imagine that they *could* be red herrings but I fail to see in what ways they would be of any consequence. Neither of these rules really take away anything we know about the role PMs that have been screen capped.
Okay...
Do you think he is an exception to the rule or do you question the rule alltogether now? Would like to hear the why for either answer you give.
