Melee Techniques Being Left out of Brawl

[Noypi_GjD]

I don't understand why individuals, namely scrubs persist that the competitive scene be dumb down the competitive scene rather than working on their skills to join the 'advanced players.'

 

[darkNES386]

Please stop complaining, everyone

IF it's in the game... GREAT... if it's not FINE. The better player will always find the small advantages to win... you know what matters more than wave-dashing, L-canceling? Understanding hit-blocks... frames... those things. Studying each character and understanding what moves take priority and what moves are best to use at low percentage versus high percentage... which moves follow into other moves best. NOT TO MENTION INTUITION... guessing where your opponent is going to move, what patters they follow.... it's like chess.... not a little kids game at a competitive level. SMASH bros is arguably one of the "fairest" games when it comes to veterans beating noobs.


L-canceling and wave-dashing are not like SNAKING in mario kart... I haven't played it... but from what I've heard it's ridiculous.

However... according to: http://nintendonow.e-mpire.com/modu...articleid=3303&myplid=20&myplfolder=articles:


If it's so easy to do, then why doesn't everyone do it? The fact is that a Power slide is easy to do, but efficient snaking most certainly is not. In order to snake like a pro, you must be able to move in a pattern that pushes you into as straight a line as possible. To do this, you must have quick enough thumbs to execute the Power slides in rapid succession, and you must be accurate with your button pressing. If you are sloppy with your button pressing (i.e. a button masher), you will not succeed in being an efficient snaker. More factors come into play as well, such as angling your Powerslide and throwing your weight around corners with the jump. I won't go into more detail here as this isn't a guide, but marginalizing the tactic by saying it's cheap is just unfair and screams that you are a sore loser.

 

[Dogenzaka]

It sounds to me like you want a game where the entire game is seeing who can press the A-button more rapidly in 5 seconds.

Not necessarily, I just don't think people should have these unnecessary advantages. I think the game should be left to those who are good, faster, and stronger, and those who aren't as good, fast, or strong, but that the techs/glitches are left out of the equation. That's just my opinion, and believe it or not, some people agree with it.

Even then, I can see you complaining that people "cheat" by positioning their hands in such a way where they can press the button more rapidly. It is clearly "cheating" because now people are holding the control in a way "that the developers never intended".

I've never even come across that, and I'm an avid player.

then he clearly needs to improve!

Normally I would agree with this. But the main issue that bugs me will be online play.

Random matches will be no fun to others when almost everyone will be using these techniques to their advantage.

Maybe you should be forbidden from using any B-button specials.

-_- That's an intended mechanic.

You have this weird belief that every fight should be dead even, while we are saying that learning new tactics/tricks gives us a fair advantage.

Well to me the techs/glitches are like handicaps added on to whether you have skill or not.

 

[Xengri]

Reason enough to take it out.

OPINION=/= FACT

It doesn't fail, there are people that agree with me. Plenty, in fact. So your opinion doesn't make me anything that you think I am.

Yes, there will always be people that agree on any view point, but that doesn't mean it's right. And where are these plenty of people? Only a few in this thread and your "friends" for all I know don't exist. Not a very good counter, but that " some People think so too!" isn't really that great of a argument.

I don't care if you think I'm annoying.

Never said you should, but that's the way you're coming off. A person that barely knows anything, but just wants others to believe your opinion on how we should get better, all about equality. News flash buddy, If something allows me to get better, I'm going to use it, regardless of what you think is right. And that L-cancel= not skill, exploit thing, isn't helping you. It just makes you look more ignorant. In fact you're not annoying just ignorant.

I can't be an advanced player yet still think it should be out?

Never said that.

Right, other people on this forum can say they can wavedash and L-cancel and people take them seriously, but I have to buy a capture card and video tape me doing it in order to get credit around here, simply because I don't buy into the bullcrap of the majority here's opinion?

Other people say that the use tech skills all the time with out proof, me being one of them. That's not a problem, but when you say that just to try to make a point in a argument, then that's when proof is needed.

The only thing you've said that's true.

And yet you still don't listen to it.....

 

[AlphaZealot]

People who don't know how to wavedash/l cancel DO suck at the game. It isn't because they don't know these things, because even if they did, they would STILL suck at the game. Knowing or not knowing, it makes no difference, you SUCK when you only play with your same 5 person group of friends, you don't suck when you START going to tournaments and gaining experience against multiple, avid players of the game who players with hundreds of other people.

This is why your argument is completely pointless. Take it out and 98% of the population doesn't even know it happened. I would say maybe, maybe 2% of the people that own SSBM know about wavedashing. Of those the people who don't like wavedashing ARE THE MINORITY, yet this minority claims to speak for the other 98% of the people. The thing is, when people find out about the more advanced and talented community around the game, they are inclined to either join it and play in tournaments...or not. I would say the numbers are much more positive for people who embrace wavedashing than the reverse. In other words, if 4 people find out about wavedashing, 3 people want to learn it and the 4th wants to be a scrub.

 

[Dogenzaka]

It sounds to me like you want a game where the entire game is seeing who can press the A-button more rapidly in 5 seconds.

Not necessarily, I just don't think people should have these unnecessary advantages. I think the game should be left to those who are good, faster, and stronger, and those who aren't as good, fast, or strong, but that the techs/glitches are left out of the equation. That's just my opinion, and believe it or not, some people agree with it.

Even then, I can see you complaining that people "cheat" by positioning their hands in such a way where they can press the button more rapidly. It is clearly "cheating" because now people are holding the control in a way "that the developers never intended".

I've never even come across that, and I'm an avid player.

then he clearly needs to improve!

Normally I would agree with this. But the main issue that bugs me will be online play.

Random matches will be no fun to others when almost everyone will be using these techniques to their advantage.

Maybe you should be forbidden from using any B-button specials.

-_- That's an intended mechanic.

You have this weird belief that every fight should be dead even, while we are saying that learning new tactics/tricks gives us a fair advantage.

Well to me the techs/glitches are like handicaps added on to whether you have skill or not.

 

[Xanderous]

Look, advanced techniques are just part of skill. When you're skilled, you know how to use them. I know you guys don't like to admit it, but it's just simple logic.

Nobody's forcing anybody to learn anything, but it's the same as shielding. Should we get rid of shielding too, because people that aren't any good don't do it?

 

[Kyu Puff]

Dogensaka:

You quoted "Tech skill should be taken out so that the game focuses on skill" or whatever, and you diregarded that part about tech skill being equal to skill. Making your answer have nothing to do with my post.

It wasn't a joke, that's indeed what I read in your post.

Oh, and I can say that you don't play competitively. It's so easy to tell. You are still challenging the statistic that I made up. Who cares about a statistic that is impossible to calculate? My point was that tech skill's relevance is infinitely small compared to that of mindgames. Therefore, removing advanced techniques does not level the playing field at all.

Right, and quote me saying that wavedashing needed to be in. I honestly don't care. If I dislike Brawl then I'll keep playing Melee.

Lastly, please expand on these "techniques" and "exploitations" that we are arguing about. Wavedashing seems to be the only thing you have on your mind, and it's pretty much deconfirmed already. L-cancelling is programmed into the game, and is as purposefully installed as shielding or jumping.

 

[Dogenzaka]

Yes, there will always be people that agree on any view point, but that doesn't mean it's right.

Same goes for you.

OPINION=/= FACT

Yup.

Never said you should, but that's the way you're coming off.

Boohoo. I have an opinion. Listen or leave.

News buddy, If something allows me to get better, I'm going to use it.

Exactly why Brawl's online random matches will be come a desert because no one will be willing to play with people like you, other than other people like you. Which is the minority.

Never said that.

You clearly did.

And yet you still don't listen to it.....

Nor do you.

 

[Ixninjax]

how are said techniques cheap if everybody has the capability of performing them? None of the moves affect your opponents at all (which is generally how we determine if a move is broken). My ability to move left then right (wavedash) doesn't really hurt anybody. It should be obvious that these techniques aren't broken considering how many ppl still beat others who use these techniques. My point being that if your a newb, advanced techniques won't magically remove that status. Only experience with those moves.

 

[Xengri]

You're kidding right? You know when you quote something you're not suppose to butcher it so that it leaves no argument. Try quoting all I've said and not just things out of context.

You didn't even quote any of my points!

Yeah, now I know that "advanced player" claim is total BS.
It's not the techs that makes a good player, it's the knowledge and thinking on a higher level.

Seeing how you don't even know the proper use of quotes, there's no way you have the proper Knowledge and the thinking on a higher level in no way pertains to you.

 

[Dogenzaka]

Oh, and I can say that you don't play competitively. It's so easy to tell.

Because I have an opinion different from mainstream Smash players? Go ahead and think what you want. Lol.

Therefore, removing advanced techniques does not level the playing field at all.

Taking away things like wavedashing, does remove unfair advantages, regardless of how big or small they are. Sure it's still left to mindgames, but that's just intelligence and experience and skill. That should be left in.

Wavedashing seems to be the only thing you have on your mind, and it's pretty much deconfirmed already.

Hoorah.

L-cancelling is programmed into the game, and is as purposefully installed as shielding or jumping.

Sadly, true.

If I dislike Brawl then I'll keep playing Melee.

Go ahead.

how are said techniques cheap if everybody has the capability of performing them?

Uhhh no they don't. Majority of smash players have never heard of it, don't have the time to practice and perform it, and it's not fair to tell people who don't know them to "learn it" simply because it was a discovered glitch, when it's an easier process to remove such a glitch from the game entirely.

None of the moves affect your opponents at all

It affects your speed however.

You're kidding right? You know when you quote something you're not suppose to butcher it so that it leaves no argument. Try quoting all I've said and not just things out of context.

I'm not butchering, I'm addressing each part of the post individually. If I posted a whole post as a giant chunk, and you replied with a giant chunk, it'd be unorganized and you'd have trouble detecting which part of my post I'm applying to which part of your post.

 

[Noypi_GjD]

Same goes for you.
Yup.
Boohoo. I have an opinion. Listen or leave.
Exactly why Brawl's online random matches will be come a desert because no one will be willing to play with people like you, other than other people like you. Which is the minority.
You clearly did.
Nor do you.

*rolls eyes* none of these give a valid argument, just a bunch of ongoing comebacks. I also love how you dodged AlphaZealot's post. You claim "Boohoo. I have an opinion. Listen or leave." oh yeah, we did listen or more so read your post, unfortunately you have no valid arguments or credibility to continue this debate.

*waits for this thread to die*

 

[Dogenzaka]

*rolls eyes* none of these give a valid argument, just a bunch of ongoing comebacks.

I already presented my argument that people agree with in the first post. Now I'm just replying to questions and comebacks.

I also love how you dodged AlphaZealot's post. You claim "Boohoo. I have an opinion. Listen or leave."

Yes I did claim that.
How did I dodge it?

oh yeah, we did listen or more so read your post, unfortunately you have no valid arguments or credibility to continue this debate.

Fortunately, I do, you just don't agree with them, probably because you're an avid wavedasher/etc. that wants them in the game, and therefore because you disagree with me, you think they're not valid.

*waits for this thread to die*

My thread's not going to die simply because I have an opinion that differs from mainstream. Sheesh.

 

[TheBuzzSaw]

Not necessarily, I just don't think people should have these unnecessary advantages. I think the game should be left to those who are good, faster, and stronger, and those who aren't as good, fast, or strong, but that the techs/glitches are left out of the equation. That's just my opinion, and believe it or not, some people agree with it.

Why do you refer to these advantages as "unnecessary"? Besides, they are not advantages until the player takes the time to learn them. At that point, the player then deserves to have a huge advantage since he actually took the time to learn them.

I've never even come across that, and I'm an avid player.

I was not talking about smash (if that is what you are referring to here). I am saying that if the button-mashing game were real, people would hold their controller differently, and that would supposedly upset you since they now have an advantage.

Normally I would agree with this. But the main issue that bugs me will be online play.

Random matches will be no fun to others when almost everyone will be using these techniques to their advantage.

Then do not play online. People go online to be the best and learn from the masses. If you want an opponent who plays within the constraints of "the intent of the developers", play a computer opponent.

-_- That's an intended mechanic.

L-canceling is intended. You seem to think that one should be out. Regardless, "intended mechanics" is an extremely flawed argument. I bet that if I watched you play a single-player mode (Zelda, Metroid, Halo, Half-Life, etc.), you would exploit the enemy AI. Why? Because it makes it easier to win. If "intended mechanics" are so necessary, then you should die a few times at every boss you come to. The designers worked hard at making that boss, and it will hurt their feelings if you defeat it on your first try. You are supposed to suffer, die, and win after numerous failures.

Well to me the techs/glitches are like handicaps added on to whether you have skill or not.

W... T... F... ? The tools that help you gain more skill are handicaps to said skill? I do not think you define "skill" the same way as the rest of the world. It would seem that you define skill as "the ability to adapt". Having knowledge beforehand is apparently illegal, and your opponent has to have an equal chance of winning despite years of practice on your own part. Tell me this, what game is fair that you can think of? According to your standard, I would say Candy Land falls into that category.

Also, for the record, it is incredibly easy to tell you do not play competitively. If you don't mind us asking, how many tournaments have been to?

 

[Empty-_-]

You know it's going to be funny when they remove all these "Exploits" and the "casual" players that refuse to learn the techs in melee and complain when they face people who do use them still lose despite them being gone. Techs or not, the better player is going to win. It's just another excuse, and them removing them is WORSE for the people who refuse to use them because they're going to be back to blaming luck or something sad.
If the techs can't be called cheap and an unfair advantage, then people will just whine about character balance more. The crying won't stop either way, and removing things that melee vets are used to takes a lot of depth out of the game which is terrible for everyone.

 

[Red Exodus]

Noobs are still going to get owned, regardless of advanced techniques. Noobs don't bother to learn the frame count of moves. Noobs don't bother to learn their favorite characters.

All dumbing down the game does is make it harder for a metagame game to exist while taking away the only johns scrubs and noobs have.

 

[Ixninjax]

So because others can't or won't take the 1 hour out of their life to learn to wavedash the game should lose depth? The only characters who gain a speed benefit from wavedashing are luigi and iceclimbers, everybody else gains a simple way to finetune their spacing (which only a competitive smasher would know). The only problem i have with your wanting said techniques out is because you obviously have no real experience with them. Us on the other hand (well, most of us) have been utilizing these moves in actual playing, so we can come to actual conclusions on its effectiveness, cheapness and such. The most obvious clue to your lack of competition is the fact the you want a move out that basically just moves you left then right...

 

[Xengri]

I'm not butchering, I'm addressing each part of the post individually. If I posted a whole post as a giant chunk, and you replied with a giant chunk, it'd be unorganized and you'd have trouble detecting which part of my post I'm applying to which part of your post.

That's BS. Only quoting the trivial parts in others post, while dodging all the actually arguments is butchering. I said I had time to waste proving you wrong, yet you don't give me anything to prove wrong...

Same goes for you.
Yup.
Boohoo. I have an opinion. Listen or leave.
Exactly why Brawl's online random matches will be come a desert because no one will be willing to play with people like you, other than other people like you. Which is the minority.
You clearly did.
Nor do you.

This is the crap that you gave me instead....

 

[Foxy]

Okay, honestly. You're just another scrub complaining about so-called "pro" techniques. If you really used them often and effectively and played excellent smash you would see the idiocy of your argument.

1. L-Canceling and Wavedashing are not GAME BREAKING! Not only do they add just a slight advantage, something barely discernible until you reach higher-level play, but they are MOVEMENT TRICKS. Also, L-canceling is very easy and shouldn't be considered one of the advanced techniques. Wavedashing I can understand, but it still doesn't give much advantage. Even many of those who can wavedash perfectly and constantly fail to use to to their advantage and often lose more because of it's utilization! So you're argument is pretty much void in the first place due to the fact that you're complaining about something that doesn't even affect the game very much, besides the top 5% of smashers (or less).

2. Why shouldn't Nintendo cater to the hardcore players? Smash Brothers is a hardcore series and the Big N can't possibly fail to see the still-continuing success of Melee in tournaments and high level play. Smash is a skill game, and taking tricks and advanced techniques out is like ripping the joints out of an animal. Without those special tricks we have in Melee, Brawl won't last as long due to the smaller gap between excellent and average players. Smash is never intended to be a game that players should be able to go online and have a fair fight every match.

3. A game without difficult and advanced tricks is a short-lived and unrewarding one. Brawl would end up as a play-for-a-month kind of title, where players tackle the 1P mode, and by the time they've conquered that they already sit at about the top of the cream of smash players. So then they go online and play for a week or two against similarly skilled players in pretty boring, repetitive matches and since they have nothing else to improve on or learn, Brawl sits in the corner and collects dust. The bigger the gap between noobs and pros, the more depth and tricks to discover, and the harder the game is, the longer it will last and the greater it will go down in history.

In conclusion, please stop arguing for your case. It is ridiculous to think that removing advances movement abilities will fix the game for new players, and even if it made matches more even it would certainly not make a better game.

 

[Ryudragon29]

It becomes an issue when in February people will be able to play random matches online with eachother, and if the technique is in, it will be left swimming with people using it, just like Snaking in Mario Kart.



But if my friend wants to be on par with me, he is pressured to learn it.

I agree with you on everything except this, you NEED snaking to perform good on wi-fi. You DON'T need to know the advance technique to perform good in wi-fi.

 

[Dogenzaka]

Why do you refer to these advantages as "unnecessary"?

They're unnecessary in my opinion because I don't think they need to be in >__>

Besides, they are not advantages until the player takes the time to learn them.

....Duh? lol.

At that point, the player then deserves to have a huge advantage since he actually took the time to learn them.

Not everyone has the time to learn them. Anyway, as far as we know, these techs are out, thankfully.

Then do not play online.

Uhhh no. Playing online is one of the major reasons to play Brawl instead of Melee.

you would exploit the enemy AI. Why? Because it makes it easier to win.

Beating a CPU AI makes me an exploiter? It just means I have a brain >_>

W... T... F... ? The tools that help you gain more skill are handicaps to said skill?

I don't consider the techs to be skill.
At least as far as we know the mechanics are out, Thank goodness.

According to your standard, I would say Candy Land falls into that category.

Well you can't cheat with Candy Land.

I consider the techs to be cheating. If you disagree, go ahead. I don't care.

You're just another scrub complaining about so-called "pro" techniques.

Lol flaming.

Why shouldn't Nintendo cater to the hardcore players?

That's a good question. Considering they're probably less than half a million compared to the 8 million smash owners.

That's BS. Only quoting the trivial parts in others post,

I quoted EVERY part of your post. If I DON'T quote a part in a post, it's because I agree with it or understand. I'm trying to speed through now because I'm running out of time.

1. L-Canceling and Wavedashing are not GAME BREAKING!

They just make you unnaturally faster and cancel out lag. Cheating. Unfair.

So because others can't or won't take the 1 hour out of their life to learn to wavedash the game should lose depth?

It took you 1 hour to master all the techniques with every character?

In conclusion, please stop arguing for your case.

Uhh no.

you NEED snaking to perform good on wi-fi.

Of course you do. That's what stinks.

You DON'T need to know the advance technique to perform good in wi-fi.

I'm talking about snaking in terms of advanced techniques >_>

I'm starving right now so I'm going to get some food so you can discuss this with me on AIM or MSN or email if you want and we can talk a bit later (PM me) but I have to go somewhere right now and I can't debate in the thread.

 

[greenblob]

My position:

No WD=nothing to complain about
New gameplay mechanics=nothing to worry about
Lack of depth/techs=biggest disappointment of the year

 

[Kyu Puff]

Not everyone has the time to learn them. Anyway, as far as we know, these techs are out, thankfully.

So people have time to waste playing random strangers online, and to complain about not knowing advanced techs, but don't have the half an hour it takes to learn them?

 

[Empty-_-]

Maybe we should all just play rock/paper/scissors anyway, that way we don't lose to those exploiting jerks.

 

[Xengri]

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You're serious aren't you? you're just going to sit here and take people's words out of context just because you can't counter there arguments...

Forget it, this is clearly a troll attempt, and yes, you did actually get me to believe that you had a point to argue, but no...

You're just an idiot.

Go ahead, quote this too, since it has no argument to fight against, you might actually quote whole sentences this time.

This wasn't even worth the facepalm...

 

[greenblob]

Not everyone has the time to learn them. Anyway, as far as we know, these techs are out, thankfully.

If I don't have time to practice piano, should I complain that other people are better than me at it? If I don't have time to practice my spiking in tennis, should I force other people to not spike?

 

[Red Exodus]

Dog is afraid of mindgamez. It's not fair that pros can analyze the match better than he can so he wants to john.

*knock knock*
Dog, the playing field isn't even at all. We don't all have the same brain, we all don't have the same experience and we all don't use the same character.

You can ***** about advanced techs all you want but the playing field will never be even.

 

[Metà]

To all the people who think advanced techs should be removed:

Just let us have our competitive game, and we'll let you have your casual game. Leave us alone and we'll leave you alone. The problem solves itself.

 

[Ryudragon29]

You're serious aren't you? you're just going to sit here and take people's words out of context just because you can't counter there arguments...

Forget it, this is clearly a troll response, and yes, you did actually get me to believe that you had a point to argue, but no...

You're just an idiot. Go ahead, quote this too, since it has no argument to fight against, you might actually quote whole sentences this time.

No, that's just a flamebait not an argument.

 

[Noypi_GjD]

[Yes I did claim that.How did I dodge it?]
You haven't nitpicked at it yet, even if you are "just replying to questions and comebacks."

[Fortunately, I do, you just don't agree with them, probably because you're an avid wavedasher/etc. that wants them in the game, and therefore because you disagree with me, you think they're not valid.]

Actually I'm not. I cannot properly incorporate washdashing into my game, why is wavedash "the" advance technique to complain about. I'm a puff user, I'm more into SHFFL, DI, DD, CCing... wavedash hell no. However, I don't go around bashing it, wavedash is simple and I play with people who were at similar level with me and I can see how much they improved because they practiced and got experience from tournaments and such. I have taught these techniques to plenty of 'scrubs' in the area and they always appear to want to learn them and improve so they would be able to use them in matches.

It leads me to believe that instead of dumbing down the gamplay, smashers should just inform the new players of how to improve -.-;;; the only 'students' that complained about the advanced techniques were the ones who were egotistical and lazy, (these whiner teenagers didn't join sports or even achieve high in school, they were WoW peeps who I suppose felt like they should 'be pro' with a lack of effort) which is why I tend to brush aside these post.

[My thread's not going to die simply because I have an opinion that differs from mainstream. Sheesh.]
No, I'm waiting for it to die because there are plenty of other post like this.

 

[Dogenzaka]

You know it's going to be funny when they remove all these "Exploits" and the "casual" players that refuse to learn the techs in melee and complain when they face people who do use them still lose despite them being gone.

Then let them complain. They will complain because they suck, not because they lost to a wavedasher. lol.

BTW I added more to my previous post. I got a phone call but I edited it now.

Dog is afraid of mindgamez.

What the ****? I play mindgames. That's fair. I just don't like to wavedash in circles around my friends who can't do it.

Dog, the playing field isn't even at all. We don't all have the same brain, we all don't have the same experience and we all don't use the same character.

I realize this. It doesn't make the field perfect but it evens it out more than it was previously.

but don't have the half an hour it takes to learn them?

Took you half an hour to perfect the techniques with every character?

 

[jambre]

I read through most of the 4 pages and i have to say it is complete BS

removing advanced techniques from the game a noob doesnt know about is like saying you should remove any combos a noob doesnt know about

perhaps exploits should be removed, but intended techniques definatly shouldnt.

it is NOT like snaking in mario kart where if you dont snake you lose vs someone who does
in smash you can beat someone who uses advanced techniques if you have better mindgames and execution of moves.

I could be considered a casual myself as i dont attend tournaments outside of local and most of the time just play for fun with my friends who dont use advanced techniques. Guess what happens when i use techniques in the match vs them? they dont complain, they ask how to do them to improve themselves.

Removing advanced techniques just lowers the maximum level of play, it does not give players an unfair advantage as both players could have the ability to do the techniques. it is a FAIR advantage as much as it is fair that a better player has an advantage over a worse player. It is not an unfair advantage as in one player has a perfeclty working controller and the other has a faulty b button.

 

[Red Exodus]

To all the people who think advanced techs should be removed:

Just let us have our competitive game, and we'll let you have your casual game. Leave us alone and we'll leave you alone. The problem solves itself.

No, they want to spout their opinions as if the manual tells you how you should play the game. They can't settle for the game to be played differently for some unknown reason.

I figure they try to come into the tournament scene, get owned and try to moan about how they get beat by people will more dedication than them.

 

[Digital Angel]

Ugh, everyone who is posting in this topic is ****ing stupid.

There's going to be new advance techniques everyone.

 

[Dogenzaka]

removing advanced techniques from the game a noob doesnt know about is like saying you should remove any combos a noob doesnt know about

Combos aren't glitches.
Wavedashing is.

 

[Dogenzaka]

Ugh, everyone who is posting in this topic is ****ing stupid.

Flaming much?

 

[Shai Hulud]

FAIL

That is all.

 

[greenblob]

Wavedashing is not a glitch. L-canceling is an official technique.

 

[TheBuzzSaw]

They're unnecessary in my opinion because I don't think they need to be in >__>

So, the game should cater to you? What about the rest of the world who wants a deep experience?

....Duh? lol.

But you refer to the techniques as if they magically grant certain players advantages over others! They take time to learn, so if someone learns them, they deserve to have an advantage.

Not everyone has the time to learn them. Anyway, as far as we know, these techs are out, thankfully.

Not everyone has the time to learn them? True... but who cares? That is how the world works. You are basically saying that if you went one-on-one with the world's best basketball player, his advantage is "unfair" because he has played in the NBA for X number of years. Life's not fair. The game should be modified to promote those who do not invest time into the game. If you want it to be fair, play others who have a similar skill level! That's how the world works, isn't it?

Uhhh no. Playing online is one of the major reasons to play Brawl instead of Melee.

I agree, but you want everyone to suck so you can win more. You don't want to put in the time and work necessary to be better than those people online. You just want to log on and start winning. Sorry, but Nintendo does not care about you at all.

Beating a CPU AI makes me an exploiter? It just means I have a brain >_>

Using L-canceling means I'm unskilled? It just means I have a brain >_>

I don't consider the techs to be skill.

And the whole reason is that you do not want to take the time to learn them. It is just too deep for your mind to grasp.

I'm starving right now so I'm going to get some food so you can discuss this with me on AIM or MSN or email if you want and we can talk a bit later (PM me) but I have to go somewhere right now and I can't debate in the thread.

Well, respond when you can. I'm really not interested in chatting with you. At least doing it out here, everyone can see how off-base you are. Where are these people who supposedly agree with you? I know they are out there, but they are not very outspoken.

At least as far as we know the mechanics are out, Thank goodness.

Which ones? Wavedashing is supposedly out, but L-canceling is probably still in. There will be many other new techniques to learn.

Well you can't cheat with Candy Land.

Exactly, so you should be able to win without so many cheaters getting in your way.