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Social Melee Social Thread and stuff

Crooked Crow

drank from lakes of sorrow
Joined
Jun 11, 2007
Messages
2,247
Does anyone know when there will be more 20xx memory cards? I'm coming back from a break and I don't know how to hack a Wii or anything, and even if I could my SD card slot is broken.

God I miss this game. I don't care about Smash 4.
 

SG Goose

Smash Rookie
Joined
Jan 18, 2015
Messages
23
Location
Tampa, FL
Hacking a Wii isn't too hard tbh. There's lots of videos on youtube teaching how to do it. The reason I say that is because getting the 20xx Hack Pack is better than 20xx TE, for training purposes anyways
 
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Audos

Smash Apprentice
Joined
Apr 24, 2015
Messages
104
Location
Austintown, Ohio
Hacking a Wii isn't too hard tbh. There's lots of videos on youtube teaching how to do it. The reason I say that is because getting the 20xx Hack Pack is better than 20xx TE, for training purposes anyways
Yeah, but his SD card slot is broken. I don't use a hacked wii anymore, but I thought that was pivotal to doing it. :l
 

Spak

Hero of Neverwinter
Joined
Jul 30, 2014
Messages
4,033
Location
Earth
Not much. Moved to college in Indiana and the smash scene is MUCH smaller.
 

standardtoaster

Tubacabra
Joined
Nov 26, 2009
Messages
9,253
Location
Eau Claire, Wisconsin
first day of the semester tomorrow and my first class isn't until 4pm. going to try and not goof off much this semester by reading and noting before one of my courses begins the next day instead of doing it day of like usual
 

Chainz

Sleepy Chainz
Joined
Nov 21, 2014
Messages
9,496
Location
Las Vegas, NV
3DS FC
1075-1816-9029
Do any of you guys travel for Melee? My own scene pretty small, so usually I go to Austin or Dallas for tournaments. But there only an hour and half from where I am so it's not too bad.

The semester already started for me, so far been able to balance school and smash pretty well lol. Hopefully it stays like that.
 

Spak

Hero of Neverwinter
Joined
Jul 30, 2014
Messages
4,033
Location
Earth
Do any of you guys travel for Melee? My own scene pretty small, so usually I go to Austin or Dallas for tournaments. But there only an hour and half from where I am so it's not too bad.

The semester already started for me, so far been able to balance school and smash pretty well lol. Hopefully it stays like that.
I know some guys that have traveled from ECU or the triangle area to Pier Pressure (in south-eastern NC) which is about two and a half hours and two hours, 45 minutes respectively. I used to just attend stuff around the triangle, though, which was a max of 30-45 minutes away.

Now it's time to write a 2-page reflective essay about Chapter 1 of a required reading book lol.
 

-ACE-

Gotem City Vigilante
Joined
Sep 25, 2007
Messages
11,536
Location
The back country, GA
I know some guys that have traveled from ECU or the triangle area to Pier Pressure (in south-eastern NC) which is about two and a half hours and two hours, 45 minutes respectively. I used to just attend stuff around the triangle, though, which was a max of 30-45 minutes away.

Now it's time to write a 2-page reflective essay about Chapter 1 of a required reading book lol.
Where's Pier Pressure? Wilmy?

Look how bad it got at my house on the outer banks during that tropical storm that came through.

https://youtu.be/z0MfrKbcnf8

20160813_192713.jpg

The storms cause "pier pressure"
 
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Spak

Hero of Neverwinter
Joined
Jul 30, 2014
Messages
4,033
Location
Earth
Where's Pier Pressure? Wilmy?

Look how bad it got at my house on the outer banks during that tropical storm that came through.

https://youtu.be/z0MfrKbcnf8

View attachment 117392
The storms cause "pier pressure"
Yeah. The address is 1800 Carolina Beach Ave N Carolina Beach, NC 28428, and here is the link to the first one. There have been a few more Per Pressures since then, usually posted on the NC Melee Facebook page.
 

gmBottles

Fun Haver
Joined
Jul 20, 2014
Messages
6,002
Location
Fairhope, AL
NNID
komfyking
Do any of you guys travel for Melee? My own scene pretty small, so usually I go to Austin or Dallas for tournaments. But there only an hour and half from where I am so it's not too bad.

The semester already started for me, so far been able to balance school and smash pretty well lol. Hopefully it stays like that.
I live in South AL but I mostly play in North FL since their scene is both bigger and better. Still play in AL plenty when I can, though.

Not in school anymore for the time being, but work kills.
 

Chainz

Sleepy Chainz
Joined
Nov 21, 2014
Messages
9,496
Location
Las Vegas, NV
3DS FC
1075-1816-9029
I live in South AL but I mostly play in North FL since their scene is both bigger and better. Still play in AL plenty when I can, though.
Maybe one of these days when money isn't an issue. I'll join ya in Pensacola for a tournament ;)
 

Folly

Smash Rookie
Joined
Aug 12, 2016
Messages
14
Decided I was going to try and pick up Melee

Had to face the horrible reality only like 4 characters are viable on a higher level of play

L cancelling is a very bad mechanic, doesn't add anything except an unnecessary heightening of the skill ceiling

I can feel the mediocrity emanating off of my two favourite characters

Melee is so clunky, it really took until Brawl for the feel to get smoother

The only thing I can imagine hurting your hands more than mastering this game is playing the guitar
 
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gmBottles

Fun Haver
Joined
Jul 20, 2014
Messages
6,002
Location
Fairhope, AL
NNID
komfyking
Decided I was going to try and pick up Melee

Had to face the horrible reality only like 4 characters are viable on a higher level of play

L cancelling is a very bad mechanic, doesn't add anything except an unnecessary heightening of the skill ceiling

I can feel the mediocrity emanating off of my two favourite characters

Melee is so clunky, it really took until Brawl for the feel to get smoother

The only thing I can imagine hurting your hands less than mastering this game is playing the guitar
>posting things even slightly negative about Melee

1473906973168.png
 

gmBottles

Fun Haver
Joined
Jul 20, 2014
Messages
6,002
Location
Fairhope, AL
NNID
komfyking
Ey, it's not a perfect game. Especially when there has been a massive dedicated fanbase that's been picking it apart in every facet conceivable for 15 years straight. It's hard not to notice these things.
No such thing as a perfect game. I wasn't being serious, though there are a couple things I flat out disagree with, such as the game being clunky (imo movement feels amazing, I actually find the new games clunkier because of the lack of movement options), only 4 characters being viable (at least the top 12 have a chance at a regional), and I never thought L cancelling was bad, even when I first started.

Also, who are your two characters you think are mediocre? As a Bowser/Fox dual main, I can say that you should play whoever you have the most fun with, though I do recommend having a top tier as well.
 

Folly

Smash Rookie
Joined
Aug 12, 2016
Messages
14
No such thing as a perfect game. I wasn't being serious, though there are a couple things I flat out disagree with, such as the game being clunky (imo movement feels amazing, I actually find the new games clunkier because of the lack of movement options), only 4 characters being viable (at least the top 12 have a chance at a regional), and I never thought L cancelling was bad, even when I first started.

Also, who are your two characters you think are mediocre? As a Bowser/Fox dual main, I can say that you should play whoever you have the most fun with, though I do recommend having a top tier as well.
The lack of movement options can be a problem for some people, but an issue I find with Melee's flow is the lack of fluidity between inputs. It feels very delayed. Now, this could be because I am running Melee on Dolphin and for whatever reason my 3,000 dollar gaming PC is not receiving Melee very well, but I also recall this being an issue I had with the game on the GC long ago, I even had this issue with Project M. On the bright side, this clunkiness does make some defensive options less effective, which I guess is healthier for a fighting game overall. In Brawl and Smash 4, it just feels like you can do basic things quicker.

Many characters can win a reigonal but it's still a bummer that only Fox, Fox 2, Marth and Sheik can be viable at the highest level of play, or at least that's what everyone says.

L cancelling is just not a good mechanic. It doesn't really add any depth to matches, it doesn't make too much sense to have when you could just not have much landing lag on moves to begin with. It's just a really silly thing to have to master.

I main Ganondorf and I play alot of Mario. It doesn't feel good to be outranged or outsped by a Fox, man.
 

Spak

Hero of Neverwinter
Joined
Jul 30, 2014
Messages
4,033
Location
Earth
The lack of movement options can be a problem for some people, but an issue I find with Melee's flow is the lack of fluidity between inputs. It feels very delayed.
I've found quite the opposite. Melee seems more responsive than the other games, and the lack of buffered inputs (other than doing things OoS) allows me to more precisely control my character than in other Smash games.
Now, this could be because I am running Melee on Dolphin and for whatever reason my 3,000 dollar gaming PC is not receiving Melee very well, but I also recall this being an issue I had with the game on the GC long ago, I even had this issue with Project M. On the bright side, this clunkiness does make some defensive options less effective, which I guess is healthier for a fighting game overall. In Brawl and Smash 4, it just feels like you can do basic things quicker.
It could be your monitor. Melee feels horrible unless it's on a really good gaming monitor or a CRT.
Many characters can win a reigonal but it's still a bummer that only Fox, Fox 2, Marth and Sheik can be viable at the highest level of play, or at least that's what everyone says.
Falco is REALLY far from Fox 2 since they have pretty different styles of play, and top 8 can win a national (although only top 6 have won regionals recently). I think Sm4sh is less balanced than Melee, but we won't see if that's true until Sm4sh is 15 years old.
L cancelling is just not a good mechanic. It doesn't really add any depth to matches, it doesn't make too much sense to have when you could just not have much landing lag on moves to begin with. It's just a really silly thing to have to master.
L-Cancelling is makes the game more technical and raises the skill ceiling. Having inputs that benefit the player if they execute them properly helps distinguish the higher level play and lower level play, makes the game more difficult and impressive to master, and I've found the ability to halve landing lag extremely useful in every scenario. It makes the combo game more robust because it opens up options that were not possible without L-Cancelling, it allows for new types of shield pressure that were not viable options before (like a last-frame Knee before landing making you -1 on shield if you L-Cancel), and makes the game feels faster overall.
I main Ganondorf and I play alot of Mario. It doesn't feel good to be outranged or outsped by a Fox, man.
You're outranged and outsped by Fox in Sm4sh, too. With Melee's superior movement options, you can actually level the playing field if you're better than a Fox. Look at Mango's Mario (ScorpionMaster) and you will see that it can beat 99% of players just because of how good Mango is.
 

Plunder

Smash Ace
Joined
Jul 12, 2015
Messages
862
Location
Port Royal
NNID
1337-7734-8008
Decided I was going to try and pick up Melee

Had to face the horrible reality only like 4 characters are viable on a higher level of play

L cancelling is a very bad mechanic, doesn't add anything except an unnecessary heightening of the skill ceiling

I can feel the mediocrity emanating off of my two favourite characters

Melee is so clunky, it really took until Brawl for the feel to get smoother

The only thing I can imagine hurting your hands more than mastering this game is playing the guitar
This is kind of like reading a review of The Godfather from a person who thinks the Transformers movies were some of the best movies ever made.

Tripping. Smooth. Brawl.

It a bit too obvious that you just find L cancelling And wavedashing too difficult. That is fine, but you have to realize that your handicap has nothing to with the game's design quality or caliber. Anything that adds skill and practice time to competitive game is what makes it more legitimate and less of a party/casual game. But beyond that you're not even playing Melee, you're playing an illegal emulation of it on a false platform and no doubt you haven't spent enough time with it to render any kind of actual opinion.

It's all sort of silly.
 
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Folly

Smash Rookie
Joined
Aug 12, 2016
Messages
14
Falco is REALLY far from Fox 2 since they have pretty different styles of play, and top 8 can win a national (although only top 6 have won regionals recently).
That was a joke, I realize they're different but Falco is a clone.

L-Cancelling is makes the game more technical and raises the skill ceiling. Having inputs that benefit the player if they execute them properly helps distinguish the higher level play and lower level play, makes the game more difficult and impressive to master, and I've found the ability to halve landing lag extremely useful in every scenario. It makes the combo game more robust because it opens up options that were not possible without L-Cancelling, it allows for new types of shield pressure that were not viable options before (like a last-frame Knee before landing making you -1 on shield if you L-Cancel), and makes the game feels faster overall.

Tripping. Smooth. Brawl.

It a bit too obvious that you just find L cancelling And wavedashing too difficult. That is fine, but you have to realize that your handicap has nothing to with the game's design quality or caliber. Anything that adds skill and practice time to competitive game is what makes it more legitimate and less of a party/casual game. But beyond that you're not even playing Melee, you're playing an illegal emulation of it on a false platform and no doubt you haven't spent enough time with it to render any kind of actual opinion.

It's all sort of silly.
I have to reiterate I'm not talking about movement options or game mechanics itself, but the fluidity in which you're able to preform those actions and transition in to another. Brawl and Smash 4 to me feel more responsive, you are not understanding what I am saying,

I never said anything about wavedashing. I quite like wavedashing, it has lots of different applications, it alone adds a layer of depth to movement and offensive gameplay. L cancelling however, does not. L cancelling only has one application, to cut landing lag. There is no reason to not use L cancelling at certain times. L cancelling offers you absolutely no options, it's about as good as having little amounts of landing lag on moves to begin with, it arbitrarily raises the skill ceiling of the game without actually expanding on the gameplay. Just because it adds a level of skill doesn't mean it's good, I don't like it because I don't think it is a good mechanic from a game design standpoint, not because I'm not a master at it.

Also. what does me playing on Dolphin have to do with it anyway. I own Melee, I've had my own disc copy for over 10 years, but I'm not going out of my way to try and put 20XX on my Gamecube when I can get the same result much easier and faster from using Dolphin. Since you're using movie metaphors this is like someone saying you can't have an opinion on a movie if they streamed it online without purchasing it.
 
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Ten of Nine

Smash Apprentice
Joined
Mar 6, 2016
Messages
172
Location
South
Why are you here?

If you don't like Melee then simply don't play it.

Why waste your time talking about a game you supposedly don't like. Are you that bored? Seeking attention and replies?
 
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Folly

Smash Rookie
Joined
Aug 12, 2016
Messages
14
Why are you here?

If you don't like Melee then simply don't play it.

Why waste your time talking about a game you supposedly don't like. Are you that bored? Seeking attention and replies?
I don't hate Melee. As a matter of fact, I really like Melee, it's why I'm picking it up to begin with. But it's not perfect, I do find it to have some pretty questionable design sometimes.
 
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-ACE-

Gotem City Vigilante
Joined
Sep 25, 2007
Messages
11,536
Location
The back country, GA
L-canceling definitely adds depth. It makes top level shield pressure harder to accomplish. Being able to a light press to L-cancel so you don't disturb your tech window is an intriguing mechanic. Also light shielding to cause people to miss an L-cancel is pretty cool. You have to be good with your spacing/positioning to get an edge cancel without hitting L/R. It also makes you want to learn your auto cancelled aerials so you don't hit R/L unnecessarily. It makes it so it takes skill to be fast. Pretty cool imo.
 

tauKhan

Smash Lord
Joined
Feb 9, 2014
Messages
1,349
Also light shielding to cause people to miss an L-cancel is pretty cool.
How does light shielding make people to miss l-cancel? I never understood how it is supposed to do that, since the timing of your landing is the same regardless of when you hit the shield and hitlag is same.
 

-ACE-

Gotem City Vigilante
Joined
Sep 25, 2007
Messages
11,536
Location
The back country, GA
How does light shielding make people to miss l-cancel? I never understood how it is supposed to do that, since the timing of your landing is the same regardless of when you hit the shield and hitlag is same.
If they are timing their fastfall by muscle memory they can miss the fastfall and ruin their timing. Most people read whether they'll hit, hit shield or whiff, and time R/L accordingly. Hardly anyone double taps R to ensure the cancel. Great vs climbers.
 
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Folly

Smash Rookie
Joined
Aug 12, 2016
Messages
14
L-canceling definitely adds depth. It makes top level shield pressure harder to accomplish. Being able to a light press to L-cancel so you don't disturb your tech window is an intriguing mechanic. Also light shielding to cause people to miss an L-cancel is pretty cool. You have to be good with your spacing/positioning to get an edge cancel without hitting L/R. It also makes you want to learn your auto cancelled aerials so you don't hit R/L unnecessarily. It makes it so it takes skill to be fast. Pretty cool imo.
Is that actually depth, though, or is it just an increase in the complexity of the gameplay? the way I define depth in a game is the amount of options the game gives you in a given scenario, what you just described seems to be more of a technique to optimize your gameplay rather than a brand new option presented by L cancelling. This is a matter of depth vs complexity, they are not synonymous.
 
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-ACE-

Gotem City Vigilante
Joined
Sep 25, 2007
Messages
11,536
Location
The back country, GA
Is that actually depth, though, or is it just an increase in the complexity of the gameplay? the way I define depth in a game is the amount of options the game gives you in a given scenario, what you just described seems to be more of a technique to optimize your gameplay rather than a brand new option presented by L cancelling. This is a matter of depth vs complexity, they are not synonymous.
What if tilting the stick was all you need to do to wavedash? Would that remove depth?

I don't think depth has one single definition. There's also the technical/execution side of the game versus the gameplay itself.

Think about pool. In many cases, using a bridge to guide your aim with the cue makes executing an accurate shot much easier. But in the end, a shot is a shot, whether you steady the stick yourself or the bridge does. Just like an L-cancel is an L-cancel, whether you do it or the game does it for you. But wouldn't using the bridge for every shot remove SOME depth from the game (pool)?
 
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Plunder

Smash Ace
Joined
Jul 12, 2015
Messages
862
Location
Port Royal
NNID
1337-7734-8008
Is that actually depth, though, or is it just an increase in the complexity of the gameplay? the way I define depth in a game is the amount of options the game gives you in a given scenario, what you just described seems to be more of a technique to optimize your gameplay rather than a brand new option presented by L cancelling. This is a matter of depth vs complexity, they are not synonymous.
I don't think you even understand your own made up definition of depth. Your argument objectively makes no sense.

L-cancelling does open up a lot more options, offensively by allowing you to act quicker after aerial hits to combos and defensively by making shield pressure safer.

It separates the good players from the casual players. That pretty much is a text book definition of depth in a fighting game.

Really give up on this man, consider the overwhelming majority that disagrees with you objectively here. It's pretty obvious and I'm almost positive your mind will change once you actually play this game long enough. I've had similar conversations with players new to competitive Melee about game mechanics, their minds almost always change when they get experienced.
 
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