i1337
Smash Ace
i never knew that :D lol
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Matchup Thread: WHAT TIME IS IT?
- Thread starter itsthebigfoot
- Start date
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DUB
Smash Lord
He speaks the truth.
I don't think that will work the cargo walk into mine, I'd rather low toss them into it. And I knew about the mine thing, and did you guys know you don't have to be afraid of edge mortars because up b just destroys them. Also begins to hit them if they are in animation. Did you guys know that from 0% a snake can't get away from DB unless he up B's . Reason is because they try and jump and the next hit in Down b knocks them out of it and since they can't really attack forward a or anything. But of course they can learn fast and up b it's rather un punishable.
itsthebigfoot
Smash Lord
rob time
personally, his camp is a real *****, however, if you get him into the air it becomes a very fun match, think a game of whack a mole except you can see into the machine, chase him down, and uair or usmash, he can't hit below him
you can gimp him if he's dumb enough to get hit by a fair/dair a few times.
CP stages = Japes, only good one I've found, delfino or rainbow cruise might work, need input
personally, his camp is a real *****, however, if you get him into the air it becomes a very fun match, think a game of whack a mole except you can see into the machine, chase him down, and uair or usmash, he can't hit below him
you can gimp him if he's dumb enough to get hit by a fair/dair a few times.
CP stages = Japes, only good one I've found, delfino or rainbow cruise might work, need input
A2ZOMG
Smash Legend
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You can edgeguard him since he can't air dodge while Up-Bing. Mind you though, he can easily edgeguard DK since he can hover pretty much anywhere.
ROB has a **** ton of trouble KOing unless he lands a U-smash or unstale N-air, and his only "combo" into U-smash is pretty much glidetoss Gyro into U-smash.
Brinstar hurts ROB by stealing his Gyro. Use that against him.
He has a really dumb 1 frame D-smash that has almost zero ending lag so at point blank quarters he usually wins.
ROB has a **** ton of trouble KOing unless he lands a U-smash or unstale N-air, and his only "combo" into U-smash is pretty much glidetoss Gyro into U-smash.
Brinstar hurts ROB by stealing his Gyro. Use that against him.
He has a really dumb 1 frame D-smash that has almost zero ending lag so at point blank quarters he usually wins.
ook
Smash Lord
Yeah, I like the matchup against ROB. Pretty much what you said, he can't hit below him lol.
For the gyro and laser... you can usually just shield it. If you don't, though, it's a pain yeah.
You could also punch the laser if you're close I guess.
Normally, I charge the punch all the way to get the super armor. ROBs tend to rely on their slow, high priority aerials a lot (nair, and maybe bair), so you can easily just punch them through it. I land the SA punch a lot against ROB, especially when I'm coming back to the stage.
um... on the ground, use up-b and down-b a lot. ROBs like to spotdodge.
But again, try to keep em in the air.
For edgeguarding... a lot of ROBs like to charge their gyro when falling. If they do that, jump out and bair them. They won't expect it, and it can kill them sometimes.
Other than that, just bair them anyway I guess. They can't do much about it.
Brinstar is a good cp against him. It's way too small for him to camp, and the punch and bairs kill him quickly. Plus, the acid means he'll be sent upwards into the air a lot. Incredibly EASY up-air kills.
And the pillars block his gyro.
I'd say 6:4 I guess. As long as you don't let him camp you.
For the gyro and laser... you can usually just shield it. If you don't, though, it's a pain yeah.
You could also punch the laser if you're close I guess.
Normally, I charge the punch all the way to get the super armor. ROBs tend to rely on their slow, high priority aerials a lot (nair, and maybe bair), so you can easily just punch them through it. I land the SA punch a lot against ROB, especially when I'm coming back to the stage.
um... on the ground, use up-b and down-b a lot. ROBs like to spotdodge.
But again, try to keep em in the air.
For edgeguarding... a lot of ROBs like to charge their gyro when falling. If they do that, jump out and bair them. They won't expect it, and it can kill them sometimes.
Other than that, just bair them anyway I guess. They can't do much about it.
Brinstar is a good cp against him. It's way too small for him to camp, and the punch and bairs kill him quickly. Plus, the acid means he'll be sent upwards into the air a lot. Incredibly EASY up-air kills.
And the pillars block his gyro.
I'd say 6:4 I guess. As long as you don't let him camp you.
itsthebigfoot
Smash Lord
DI the dsmash up, you can get out before the last few hits
Why don't you invite some ROB players to debate with you? It would be a little too one sided, if only DK players decide the match-up numbers.
I think DownB is very useful here, if you stay far enough aways from his dsmash. ROB loves to do Spotdodge -> dsmash, so try to outrange it...
I think DownB is very useful here, if you stay far enough aways from his dsmash. ROB loves to do Spotdodge -> dsmash, so try to outrange it...
itsthebigfoot
Smash Lord
put up an add on the rob board, but jamns chart says dk's at an advantage
DRaGZ
Smash Champion
I wouldn't trust Jamn's list that much. That list is composed from his own experiences, not from an objective standpoint.
R.O.B. is at a disadvantage until he realizes DK is actually pretty fast and long-ranged. Then he knows what to do; camp the hell out of DK, don't spotdodge, don't approach him when he's in the air with his back to you, and always look for the spike.
I would say it's about even, if not a bit in R.O.B.'s favor. If R.O.B. knows DK's speed and reach advantages, he can play keepaway for a large portion of each stock, which is not happy eats for DK. But this is evened up by the trickiness of handling DK's recovery as well as DK's ability to kill R.O..B. at relatively low kill percentages.
Generally, the three ways R.O.B. will try to kill you is with the spike, with the up-smash, or with an unstale n-air (which most R.O.B.s will do). The most common way R.O.B. will kill DK is with the n-air, but it'll probably be at strange points the DK does not expect a n-air to get through, like the lower part of his b-air. If R.O.B. killed DK with a b-air, either the DK had absurd damage on him or the DK is doing something wrong.
EDIT: Also, Jamn's chart actually says DK is at a disadvantage.
R.O.B. is at a disadvantage until he realizes DK is actually pretty fast and long-ranged. Then he knows what to do; camp the hell out of DK, don't spotdodge, don't approach him when he's in the air with his back to you, and always look for the spike.
I would say it's about even, if not a bit in R.O.B.'s favor. If R.O.B. knows DK's speed and reach advantages, he can play keepaway for a large portion of each stock, which is not happy eats for DK. But this is evened up by the trickiness of handling DK's recovery as well as DK's ability to kill R.O..B. at relatively low kill percentages.
Generally, the three ways R.O.B. will try to kill you is with the spike, with the up-smash, or with an unstale n-air (which most R.O.B.s will do). The most common way R.O.B. will kill DK is with the n-air, but it'll probably be at strange points the DK does not expect a n-air to get through, like the lower part of his b-air. If R.O.B. killed DK with a b-air, either the DK had absurd damage on him or the DK is doing something wrong.
EDIT: Also, Jamn's chart actually says DK is at a disadvantage.
Luigi player
Smash Master
Ah I absolutely HATE ROB. I've fought a really good ROB pretty often.
Stages:
I wouldn't pick Jungle Japes, because he can camp on one of the side platforms and just spam the laser and his gyro. I couldn't do anything against that. Well the first thing is that you can never charge your giant punch and the second is that you have to approach him, which is nearly impossible. With his nair invincibility frames and his sidedodge + dsmash he's nearly impossible to hit.
Brinstar: Yeah, the best stage vs everyone imo. If I lose a match, I ALWAYS pick Brinstar as my CP and choose DK, and I never lost there. ROB can't camp there really good, because the stage is so small. Your smashes have great range and the hitbox stays out longer if you hit some of the stagethings (I love that). Bair is pretty cool and if you both get hit from the lava and you are near him upair is wonderful.
I don't know what else I could say about it... You can kill there at really low percents, but just look in Ripples thread about Brinstar to know more.
Now about the general ROB things...
If his gyro is on the ground you can attack him and it makes your hitbox stay out a bit longer (this once won me a match! He wanted to punish my fsmash lag and ran to me, but my smash lasted longer because I hit his gyro and he died, it was awesome).
Bair is really cool in this match, and you should know how to respond to sidestep + dsmash. Maybe downB would be good. But I mostly just shield until his dsmash is finished and punish him with a bair.
I love to spike everyone. And it's somewhat easy to spike ROB, because he can't air dodge during his upB, but he can always come back...
I think I use dsmash in this match rarely, which makes it a good kill move at high %, but I usually just kill with DKs awesome fsmash, because it's range is just too good.
If you want ROB away from you tilt spam is pretty useful, but his ftilt has about the same range as DKs, and is REALLY fast, so you can't ftilt him all the time. But I think his ftilt has more ending lag.
If you want to hit ROB in the air be aware of his nair and bair. Just try to trick him to use it and hit him when the attack is finished (or be really fast and hit him before the attacks start).
I try to follow him off stage sometimes for some bair kills, but most of the time he comes from either very high (which he probably shouldn't), or from below which means you can't do anything >_>
I think ROB has the advantage here... but not a big one. Maybe 55-45...
Stages:
I wouldn't pick Jungle Japes, because he can camp on one of the side platforms and just spam the laser and his gyro. I couldn't do anything against that. Well the first thing is that you can never charge your giant punch and the second is that you have to approach him, which is nearly impossible. With his nair invincibility frames and his sidedodge + dsmash he's nearly impossible to hit.
Brinstar: Yeah, the best stage vs everyone imo. If I lose a match, I ALWAYS pick Brinstar as my CP and choose DK, and I never lost there. ROB can't camp there really good, because the stage is so small. Your smashes have great range and the hitbox stays out longer if you hit some of the stagethings (I love that). Bair is pretty cool and if you both get hit from the lava and you are near him upair is wonderful.
I don't know what else I could say about it... You can kill there at really low percents, but just look in Ripples thread about Brinstar to know more.
Now about the general ROB things...
If his gyro is on the ground you can attack him and it makes your hitbox stay out a bit longer (this once won me a match! He wanted to punish my fsmash lag and ran to me, but my smash lasted longer because I hit his gyro and he died, it was awesome).
Bair is really cool in this match, and you should know how to respond to sidestep + dsmash. Maybe downB would be good. But I mostly just shield until his dsmash is finished and punish him with a bair.
I love to spike everyone. And it's somewhat easy to spike ROB, because he can't air dodge during his upB, but he can always come back...
I think I use dsmash in this match rarely, which makes it a good kill move at high %, but I usually just kill with DKs awesome fsmash, because it's range is just too good.
If you want ROB away from you tilt spam is pretty useful, but his ftilt has about the same range as DKs, and is REALLY fast, so you can't ftilt him all the time. But I think his ftilt has more ending lag.
If you want to hit ROB in the air be aware of his nair and bair. Just try to trick him to use it and hit him when the attack is finished (or be really fast and hit him before the attacks start).
I try to follow him off stage sometimes for some bair kills, but most of the time he comes from either very high (which he probably shouldn't), or from below which means you can't do anything >_>
I think ROB has the advantage here... but not a big one. Maybe 55-45...
i1337
Smash Ace
uair is also good for rob. he cant hit below him 
Honestly to tell you the truth it's really hard for R.O.B. to kill the only real affective kill beside BS up smash when he guesses right. Is to bair him when he's off the stage, It's the most annoying crap because he doesn't have to be near you or time right . Just in the general area when your on your way there since the hitbox stays out for a ridiculous amount of time. But that is other wise the UPB's and the DownB's keep R.O.B.s rather confused since they can't really punish with downsmash after a dodge. SA punch ***** when you read his top. I can tell you camping DK with R.O.B. is much harder than you would think because of DK's SA and how fast he approaches. His multi hit and early kills give DK the edge.
CT Chia
Smash Obsessed
ROB has a strong matchup advantage against DK. I'm a ROB main (a friend told me bout this discussion going on) and I have a lot of DK practice practicing with Ultimodragon, UltimaScout, Ponchoman, and more. The matchup is ATLEAST 60 40, if not even more in ROBs favor, which it probably is.
The only downside is that DK can kill ROB much earlier than normal so he can't take advantage of his awesome recovery as much.
However for ROB he's got goin for him:
-DK is big, it's easy to hit him with stuff like projectiles, and the amazing uair (which does like 26% if all hits connect)
-DK can't deal with spam, and ROB is one of the best spammers in the game
-DK can't deal with ledgecamping, and ROB is one of the best ledge campers in the game
-ROB can easily get DK off the stage horizontally with a throw, then use the bair to edgeguard (it can hit through DK's upB. its tough to time without practice, but definitely possible)
-If DK is forced to recovery high (cause of fearing ROBs bair) and theres platforms, it's an easy free usmash from ROB which kills DK at around 170-230 depending on deteriation, DI, and more. Getting DK to this percent is easy with uair, and easy shield grabs.
Yea, it's gotta be more than 60 40 lol
The only downside is that DK can kill ROB much earlier than normal so he can't take advantage of his awesome recovery as much.
However for ROB he's got goin for him:
-DK is big, it's easy to hit him with stuff like projectiles, and the amazing uair (which does like 26% if all hits connect)
-DK can't deal with spam, and ROB is one of the best spammers in the game
-DK can't deal with ledgecamping, and ROB is one of the best ledge campers in the game
-ROB can easily get DK off the stage horizontally with a throw, then use the bair to edgeguard (it can hit through DK's upB. its tough to time without practice, but definitely possible)
-If DK is forced to recovery high (cause of fearing ROBs bair) and theres platforms, it's an easy free usmash from ROB which kills DK at around 170-230 depending on deteriation, DI, and more. Getting DK to this percent is easy with uair, and easy shield grabs.
Yea, it's gotta be more than 60 40 lol
Donkey Bong
Smash Ace
- Joined
- Sep 17, 2008
- Messages
- 610
yeah its definitely an uphill battle on this one
i shouldnt have taught my friend who mains R.O.B. how to glide toss
:/
i shouldnt have taught my friend who mains R.O.B. how to glide toss
:/
Like I said before it's a 6:4, and that is because the matchup is kept from being worse because of projectiles. Don't for one second think that spammy campy wins over Dk for one second. Because R.O.B.'s lazer and top aren't half as good at keeping DK away as you think. Dk almost never dies under 150 unless hit by a fully charged smash, being hit by a smash while facing away from the stage, or he is back aired of stage. Now in saying that R.O.B. never lives usually past 110 on average because of how good Dk is at killing him. He can approach and make it extremely hard for R.O.B. to counter him. His Bairs are faster, hit harder and out prioritize almost all of R.O.B.'s fast arials so he can't counter. On the ground Dk destroys the big robot because of his many multi hit continous attacks such as Down b that pops R.O.B. putting him in a bad spot. If he dodges or is somewhat near the ground up b destroys the dodge and can give 30 if timed right and if timed wrong armor frames the buffered downsmash from R.O.B.s. Besides that his projectiles are a minor inconvenience to DK. Because they can't really kill him even at 150 a fully charged top can be D.I.ed to survive.
But the most important and devasting move DK has against R.O.B. is armor frame punch because it kills him easily under a hundred and is easy to hit becaues of his size.
Second most devastating are his tilts because of how much priority they take over R.O.B.s tilts. Lets take R.O.B.s downtilt and put it against Dk's, the best he can hope for is a trip grab. While Dk can usually down tilt R.O.B. out of his down tilt and once out of range can Forward tilt him. DK's up tilt hits too far up for R.O.B. to really counter with anything.
But a move that I use to utterly destroy R.O.B.s is the headbutt, why you ask because R.O.B.s in general are campy dodgy players and don't expect to be punished for doing so. DK can Bair and then bair again on his way down now if R.O.B. catches on and begins to grab Dk after the first hit Dk can **** him by headbutting him. Either it hits or it ***** his shield too good. And if it hits R.O.B. is so big that Dk and run and upsmash without waiting for R.O.B. to pop out of the ground. DK has the strongest up smash in the game in terms of low kill percentage.
On a side note up air while R.O.B is unpunishable if used right since R.O.B. can't fast fall.
But the most important and devasting move DK has against R.O.B. is armor frame punch because it kills him easily under a hundred and is easy to hit becaues of his size.
Second most devastating are his tilts because of how much priority they take over R.O.B.s tilts. Lets take R.O.B.s downtilt and put it against Dk's, the best he can hope for is a trip grab. While Dk can usually down tilt R.O.B. out of his down tilt and once out of range can Forward tilt him. DK's up tilt hits too far up for R.O.B. to really counter with anything.
But a move that I use to utterly destroy R.O.B.s is the headbutt, why you ask because R.O.B.s in general are campy dodgy players and don't expect to be punished for doing so. DK can Bair and then bair again on his way down now if R.O.B. catches on and begins to grab Dk after the first hit Dk can **** him by headbutting him. Either it hits or it ***** his shield too good. And if it hits R.O.B. is so big that Dk and run and upsmash without waiting for R.O.B. to pop out of the ground. DK has the strongest up smash in the game in terms of low kill percentage.
On a side note up air while R.O.B is unpunishable if used right since R.O.B. can't fast fall.
itsthebigfoot
Smash Lord
chibo, i haven't heard of 1 of the dk's you mentioned, also, camp is not that bad for dk, the only bad part about robs camp is i can't ftilt and walk through.
now going off my few rounds with hugs and shadowrob, rob has major problems killing dk, and robs ledge camp is really easy for dk to destroy. fsmash and dsmash hit when they're below the stage, and if he's predictable you can run straight off and bair him against the stage, doesn't kill, but it sets up more bairs for more damage. you can upb edge camp in this matchup, however, the rob will catch on after 1 or 2
also, fair becomes your best gimp move, since he can't air dodge, it hits him hard enough to kill, and it beats most of his aerials (haven't tested all but it beats fair and bair when you space it
now going off my few rounds with hugs and shadowrob, rob has major problems killing dk, and robs ledge camp is really easy for dk to destroy. fsmash and dsmash hit when they're below the stage, and if he's predictable you can run straight off and bair him against the stage, doesn't kill, but it sets up more bairs for more damage. you can upb edge camp in this matchup, however, the rob will catch on after 1 or 2
also, fair becomes your best gimp move, since he can't air dodge, it hits him hard enough to kill, and it beats most of his aerials (haven't tested all but it beats fair and bair when you space it
- Joined
- Apr 10, 2008
- Messages
- 6,860
It's DK week in the Olimar boards. Here's the link: http://www.smashboards.com/showthread.php?t=172222
The general consensus is that Oli has a 60-40 advantage over DK. Oli's grab combo's/ shieldgrabs are just too much for the big guy.
The general consensus is that Oli has a 60-40 advantage over DK. Oli's grab combo's/ shieldgrabs are just too much for the big guy.
itsthebigfoot
Smash Lord
the olimars shall be enlightened to the donkey ****
NO kidding He can't grab DK with ground pound since it out ranges all his moves exept forward B. SA punch, up b....not to mention cargo throw off stage up b kills all his picmen so he can't recover. Combo's scary but seriously I laugh.
CT Chia
Smash Obsessed
i posted their names as the one, ultimodragon, is the one who wrote the dk guide thats stickied on ur guys forum lol. i figured that means u would have heard of him
no one barely commented on what i said really except that dk can deal with projectile spam, but he really cant that much lol. atleast, i havnt been proved otherwise
no one barely commented on what i said really except that dk can deal with projectile spam, but he really cant that much lol. atleast, i havnt been proved otherwise
Donkey Bong
Smash Ace
- Joined
- Sep 17, 2008
- Messages
- 610
haha wtf are you guys talking about?
everyone can fast fall, everyone can airdodge
and R.O.B.'s up smash will kill DK at lower percentages than usual when undiminished, i've died from it at approx 100-110 with DI
and you can only beat ROB in the air if you start your attack before his, his aerial hitboxes are as long if not longer than DK's
DK is an awesome character and all, but if anyone read these posts you'd think DK had no weaknesses
everyone can fast fall, everyone can airdodge
and R.O.B.'s up smash will kill DK at lower percentages than usual when undiminished, i've died from it at approx 100-110 with DI
and you can only beat ROB in the air if you start your attack before his, his aerial hitboxes are as long if not longer than DK's
DK is an awesome character and all, but if anyone read these posts you'd think DK had no weaknesses
Ripple
ᗣᗣᗣᗣ ᗧ·····•·····
- Joined
- Sep 4, 2006
- Messages
- 9,632
the only weakness DK has besides being able to be infinited is his recovery which still isn't that bad. If DK wasn't able to be infinted he would take G&W's place on the tier list
i1337
Smash Ace
Lol.
10lols
10lols
Four Leaf
Smash Journeyman
This thread makes me lol. Anyways, I'll be both helping Chibo set up the drexel tournament in Philly, PA and will be playing him. Its hard to talk **** until you're sitting next to them in a chair. We'll see what happens I guess.
Mmac
Smash Lord
I made a Compact Universal Matchup Template for you to use, if you want to use it. Just add in the Title/Numbers yourself, and whatever else you want to do with it
i1337
Smash Ace
Play an amazing dk and youll see what i mean and dont let me get a hold of your top or its over.
but thats a great chart mmac lol
but thats a great chart mmac lol
itsthebigfoot
Smash Lord
Play an amazing Dk and you'll see what I mean and don't let me get a hold of your top or it's over.
new dk meme ftw
new dk meme ftw
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