Marth's Moveset (Possibilites)

[NoLife]

What the hell do old M2K combo videos have to do with PewPewU shield breaking in Melee?

o u wanted the pewpewu shield break....i cant remember where i saw that in ik it was a doubles match though

 

[Thane of Blue Flames]

Why wouldn't the fsmash work just as well in those situations? It has the exact same arch and gets stronger faster. It isn't that the old SB is totally useless, the biggest problem is that it is a redundancy and doesn't differentiate itself enough from the fsmash and in the air a nair has similar knock back too. I am not saying it is like sing in terms of its uselessness. It just doesn't do enough to make it a better option than fsmash on the ground or nair in the air, in most cases.

Because the weak non-tipper hit is strictly worse than a charged shield breaker, which is even damage across the hitbox.

Additionally, the shield breaker charge time outlasts the smash charge time and happily several characters have recoveries that take a day and a half to get back. A properly timed Melee shield breaker can cover every option and pack a nuke's power without a care for spacing.

 

[Commander]

Because the weak non-tipper hit is strictly worse than a charged shield breaker, which is even damage across the hitbox.

Additionally, the shield breaker charge time outlasts the smash charge time and happily several characters have recoveries that take a day and a half to get back. A properly timed Melee shield breaker can cover every option and pack a nuke's power without a care for spacing.

If you're playing Marth you should already trying to have immaculate spacing so a good Marth doesn't need to worry about spacing fsmash vs shield breaker. There is no reason why you can't sit there not charging your smash while you wait and then start charging at a later moment when it would actually hit. A properly timed and spaced fsmash would work much better than that shield breaker.

 

[Thane of Blue Flames]

If you're playing Marth you should already trying to have immaculate spacing so a good Marth doesn't need to worry about spacing fsmash vs shield breaker. There is no reason why you can't sit there not charging your smash while you wait and then start charging at a later moment when it would actually hit. A properly timed and spaced fsmash would work much better than that shield breaker.

So you're telling me that you're fine with throwing out the safer option because you can properly implement a more situational option, which just by virtue of strict spacing requirements is inferior, and can end up saving opponents if you flub the hit.

K.

 

[ぱみゅ]

Also, Offstage SB, which is by far superior to Fair.
idk, I'm fine with whatever Shield Breaker he gets, it will apparently have less ending lag, so, it will be cool at least.

 

[Commander]

So you're telling me that you're fine with throwing out the safer option because you can properly implement a more situational option, which just by virtue of strict spacing requirements is inferior, and can end up saving opponents if you flub the hit.

K.

Yes. It isn't inferior, the fsmash is a better killer. The opponent can save thmselves no matter what you hit with if they smash DI towards the stage and tech. Git gud nub!

Offstage nair has similar knockback to the shield breaker.

 

[NoLife]

Yes. It isn't inferior, the fsmash is a better killer. The opponent can save thmselves no matter what you hit with if they smash DI towards the stage and tech. Git gud nub!

Offstage nair has similar knockback to the shield breaker.

im gonna disagree with the last statement. the fair has less knockback and sends them at more of a upward angle, (straight up if u tipper it) the SB has more knockback ( and the tipper doesnt matter cause its one of marths few moves where there isnt much of a difference whether u hit with the tip or not) and sends them at more of a diagonal trajectory...for that reason i will never finish a combo with a fair of stage unless they hav a lot of damage (110+) and it follows from another fair. usually i only use it close to the blast zone to the point to where they cant recover.....rarely will i actually kill of the side with a fair as a finisher...so...yeah

 

[Commander]

I said NAIR. Not fair. Nair is not different at any point on it. SB does change at the tip.

 

[Thane of Blue Flames]

Yes. It isn't inferior, the fsmash is a better killer. The opponent can save thmselves no matter what you hit with if they smash DI towards the stage and tech. Git gud nub!

Offstage nair has similar knockback to the shield breaker.

Them's fighting words, boy.

Anyway, argument's over I guess. If you think that one of Marth's few moves to not depend on his tipper and be strong without regard for spacing, covering the same options as FSmash without its drawback, is not objectively better than a spacing depending move that requires more commitment (and is still good for edgeguarding, I never said it wasn't) then you're not going to be convinced no matter how many times I say it.

 

[Sephiroths Masamune]

It's as if talking to a wall.

 

[NoLife]

I said NAIR. Not fair. Nair is not different at any point on it. SB does change at the tip.

ok 3 things.......1) ****......2) my bad 3)...nair actually is different when u hit it on the tip it has more knockback ur more likly to hit the tip if the opponent is somewhat behind u. usually only useful when u ledgehop nair as an edgeguarding purpose...so yeah....again my bad i read that wrong

 

[Thane of Blue Flames]

I mean, it's not like Nair and aerial SB have comparable hitboxes.

 

[Commander]

It's as if talking to a wall.

You really should be talking about yourself. I already pointed out that in edge guarding from the ground it doesn't have as much reward as tipped fsmashes do and in the air it isn't very special.

 

[Eternal phoenix Fire]

At 5:50. Marth charges his forward tilt.

 

[•Col•]

At 5:50. Marth charges his forward tilt.

No, it just looks like that. There's a piece of food item on the ground (the kind that heals you when you pick it up). You can clearly see that Marth picks it up and it makes the 'glowing' healing effect while he does his forward tilt.

 

[Eternal phoenix Fire]

No, it just looks like that. There's a piece of food item on the ground (the kind that heals you when you pick it up). You can clearly see that Marth picks it up and it makes the 'glowing' healing effect while he does his forward tilt.

Oh ok I didn't see that.

 

[CTL TaBuu]

As previously stated by many users, Marth's character build is extremely solid as is and his moveset does not demand any drastic changes due to the lack of any significant flaws in his fighting style. However, there's always room for improvement and here's what I'd personally like to see change from Brawl to Smash IV :

• Range : Literally, Marth's playstyle revolves around his ability to wield a sword that provides a constant defensive and offensive presence. The ability to utilize a disjoint hit-box that outranges most moves in almost every single move in Marth's movepool is amazing to say the least. That being said, Marth's range has been nerfed from the transition between Melee to Brawl. Seeing the updates and pictures of the new Marth, however, hopes of a longer sword are definitely not far-fetched.
  
  
• Grabs : Marth has a decent grab game as he does pack some nifty chain-grabs against certain characters. However, it'd be pretty nice for Marth to receive a buff in his range (perhaps his horrendous dash grab) and also a power-boost in his throws as many of his throws are pretty weak to be honest.

--------------------------

Oh and about his D-Air and Shield Breaker.
D-Air is difficult to use in Brawl no doubt about that. Minimizing the landing lag from the move would be great but from what we've seen so far, that doesn't seem to be the case.
Shield Breaker should stay in Brawl form, imo. The range that Shield Breaker provides is a tool worth having when Fair won't do the job. Marth has so many other options for edge-guarding, I don't see why it's necessary to bring back his old Shield Breaker.

 

[Thane of Blue Flames]

Strong throws =/= good throws

 

[NoLife]

Strong throws =/= good throws

Agreed

 

[Snagrio]

There really isn't much you can change about him honestly. Though Shield Breaker looks broken now based on Sakurai's description...

 

[ぱみゅ]

Eh.... I don't really feel Marth's range was nerfed that much between Brawl and Melee.

That being said, I haven't played melee in a while, and you're probably just referring to the tippers.

 

[Shaya]

Try fsmashing through the wood transformation on pokemon stadium1 in melee and brawl