Mario Moveset Discussion. Current: None!

[BlueJx23]

If it's like Marth's: Five frames.

I have no real way of testing that however since I don't know how to count frames.

thanks for the info.

either the dtilt or dash attack should probably be the next move up for discussion since people seem to have gotten a head start on them anyway.

i'd be interested in learning more about the dash attack.

 

[mikybee93]

The one move I just can't get used to of Mario's is his meteor smash. I can never even make contact with the person, so I just up-b aerial.
The bad part about his up-b aerial is that after that you must touch down to be able to attack again.
I personally thing that Mario is a bad aerial character, but great at mind games and edge guarding.

 

[HeroMystic]

The one move I just can't get used to of Mario's is his meteor smash. I can never even make contact with the person, so I just up-b aerial.

>______>

Spoiler

B-air. Use it.

 

[SkylerOcon]

el oh el.

mkybee is a Mario n00b.

Anyway, could somebody sum up the SJP for me?

 

[Matt07]

I used information out of this thread too come up with the summary, credit goes to the original posters.

Super Jump Punch

Pros:
+It helps you recover.
+Last frame of attack causes stage spikes. (On edges like Battlefield, and Smashville.)
+Has invincibility on start, and goes throw all attacks.
+His best Out of Shield (OOS) option.
+Decent ledgecamp tool.
+Several aerials true combo into it.
+Amazing priority.

Cons:
-Not really the best recovery compared to others.
-Easily predictable.
-Ending lag can cause you to get punished.

If I missed anything, please add it .

 

[SkylerOcon]

Alright. Changed to the Neutral A.

 

[Matt07]

Pros:
+You can hold the A button so Mario can keep jabbing rapidly.
+All three hits damage your opponents to 9%
+Can jab cancel, especially useful with dsmash, or fsmash

Cons:
-Very low range, the last hit however has fairly good range

 

[HeroMystic]

Mario's jab doesn't really have a lot of uses.

Jab cancel is mainly used for mindgaming. You can cancel into a pivot grab, D-smash, U-tilt, f-tilt, etc. But they're not true combos.

You can use it out of shield or after a spotdodge, although Up-B is a better OOS option.

The last hit has some decent knockback. You can use it to follow-up with another attack.

Holding A like what Matt said can cause rapid jabbing to punish frequent spotdodging. (Plus it looks cool)

It's best used as a defensive move. The range really sucks on it, and there's not a lot you can do with the jabbing.

 

[BoTastic!]

Jabs are fast as hell. You can use them the oponent is too close to you and rack up damage.

Jab>Dsmash
Jab>Grab>Dthrow>Uair

Jabs have a few setups they're not useless at all. Also they can be used for Jab locking.

 

[Matador]

I love Mario's jab. Quick, and his jab-cancel options are plenty.

Jab -> Dash grab
Jab -> Dsmash
Jab -> Fsmash
Jab -> RAR Bair
Jab -> upB

Things of that nature. It's also a good follow-up to an autocancelled aerial because of the speed. Also, like Bo said, it can jablock on stupid stages like Luigi's mansion. Just Uthrow -> jab jab jab. One of his more useful moves imo.

 

[BoTastic!]

mario's jab is broken on luigi's mansion.

 

[HeroMystic]

<3 U-tilt > Jab Lock on Luigi's Mansion.

 

[Matt07]

Maybe I should use Luigi's Mansion as a counterpick more often, hmm....

Just remembered to bump Mario's Stage Discussion .

 

[A2ZOMG]

Jab comes out frame 2 from what it seems, which is SUPER fast for a Jab (not as fast as ZSS's Jab, but you have Up-B against her Jab).

Jab faking is cool. Jab lock is awesome when you do get it off. The other reason why the Jab is good is that the Jab combo counts as three separate attacks, thus counts three times towards diminishing returns.

The Jab in many ways is the way to go if you are playing conservatively since it's just super fast and low lag.

 

[mariofanpm12]

Jab to F-Smash is always nice.

Mario's got a fast one (2-4 frames, no?)

 

[SkylerOcon]

Could somebody sum this one up?

Time to move onto the next one.

 

[A2ZOMG]

Jab
Pros:
+Super fast (2 Frames)
+Jab Faking
+Punish spotdodges
+Jab lock
+3 hits to Diminishing Returns

Cons:
-Short Range

 

[mariofanpm12]

Mario's Jab...

+ Very quick (2-3 frames, no?)
+ Can be held infinitely
+ Can be cancelled into some other good moves
+ The three hit combo helps revitalize from Move Decay
+ Can Jab Lock on certain stages

- Short range

Overall: 7.50 / 10.00

How's that?

 

[A2ZOMG]

I vote that the next attack we discuss is Mario Tornado (D-air).

 

[Matador]

Mario's Jab...

+ Can Jab Lock on certain stages

How's that?

You can jab lock on any stage. It's just easier on Luigis or places with ceilings/close walls.

I second Dair.

Edit:...I was so tempted to say "double Dair" but I thought better of it...

 

[Judge Judy]

You can jab lock on any stage. It's just easier on Luigis or places with ceilings/close walls.

I second Dair.

Edit:...I was so tempted to say "double Dair" but I thought better of it...

Meh, Dair to Uair is much sexier.

 

[BoTastic!]

Bair. Its like Mario's best aerial.

 

[Monk/Honkey/Banana]

Dtilt....end of discussion

 

[SkylerOcon]

Changed to Dair. The next will be Bair.

And I couldn't find any pictures of Mario's neutral A. Would anybody be awesome enough to supply a picture by there own means? (I don't have any capture equipment).

 

[Monk/Honkey/Banana]

....Dtilt....cahmaaahhnnn

 

[SkylerOcon]

Mario has a dtilt? I thought it was but a myth.

(Just kidding. I'll do that one after Bair)

 

[Matt07]

D-Air

Pros
+Hard to shield grab the move due to the 'long lasting' hitbox.
+Punishes spot dodges, and roll 'spammers.'
+A good move to seperate the Ice Climbers.
+Good for baiting (You can move back and forth during the move, very slightly.)
+It auto cancels into a d-smash.
+Combo's well into other air attacks.

Cons
-Umm...I seriously can't think of any cons. I like this move to much I think .

 

[Matador]

If you Dair over items, you pick them up. Makes picking up Diddy's bananas or ZSS' armor much easier since it autocancels. Don't forget the priority as well.

 

[BoTastic!]

yea Matador is right. Dair has decent Priority, especially the last Hitbox.

I can think of a con. Its lack of range.

 

[Matt07]

Woot, thanks for the input.



Special thanks to bwaggleburgers and his video;
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=EqP72UVlWl4&fmt=18

 

[HeroMystic]

yea Matador is right. Dair has decent Priority, especially the last Hitbox.

I can think of a con. Its lack of range.

But that typically goes for all of Mario's moves except for B-air. Should it really be classified as a "con" when that really is just a con in general?

One con I can think of is that D-air lacks a general purpose besides an alternative to aerial approaching. It doesn't have enough KO potential, it's knockback properties doesn't allow gimping, and it can only be used for combos at low percentages (unless you use it as a combo finisher I suppose).

The best alternative it can do is to be used as a spacing tool, which generally B-air is better.

 

[mariofanpm12]

I use D-air often due to its good priority, aerial approach abilities, and combo abilities.

On the downside, though, it lacks range and if the last hit doesn't connect, it is (even more) lacking in knockback/damage.

Overall 7.25 / 10.00

 

[BoTastic!]

But that typically goes for all of Mario's moves except for B-air. Should it really be classified as a "con" when that really is just a con in general?

One con I can think of is that D-air lacks a general purpose besides an alternative to aerial approaching. It doesn't have enough KO potential, it's knockback properties doesn't allow gimping, and it can only be used for combos at low percentages (unless you use it as a combo finisher I suppose).

The best alternative it can do is to be used as a spacing tool, which generally B-air is better.

When we reviewed Mario's jabs, it's con was lack of range. Thats a weakness for Dair as well.

 

[A2ZOMG]

D-air is awesome.

Pros:
+Good priority especially on the last hit
+Like...ZERO startup and ending lag.
+SH D-air doesn't autocancel. IT FINISHES UP IN THE AIR.
+Because of that, D-air starts COMBOS at low percents since you can jump from it and U-air people IMMEDIATELY.
+Like Luigi, you can SH D-air -> N-air
+Punish dodges!!!
+Aerial with a ground hitbox.

Cons:
-Low range
-At high percents it doesn't lead to anything, and it won't kill either unless you kept it undiminished.

 

[BlueJx23]

+decent oos option with less risk than SJP. not as much range nor priority, though.

 

[Matador]

One con I can think of is that D-air lacks a general purpose besides an alternative to aerial approaching. It doesn't have enough KO potential, it's knockback properties doesn't allow gimping, and it can only be used for combos at low percentages (unless you use it as a combo finisher I suppose).

The best alternative it can do is to be used as a spacing tool, which generally B-air is better.

Not really. With Dair having a lingering hitbox and the last hit having a bit of impact, it's easier to approach with because it kills spotdodges and rolls with less risk of being shieldgrabbed. Bair is also more susceptible to P.shield -> punish. Dair also goes through projectiles like Mario's fireball and Pika's neutral B much better than Bair. Also, if you've seen any of my vids or played me online or anything, you'll notice that I do fulljumped rising Dairs quite often. That's because the hitstun of the attack until the last hit is pretty decent and can give you enough time to follow up with a fastfalled Bair or Uair afterwards.

Also, if Diddy, ZSS, or Peach want to throw one of their items at you, Dair allows you to grab them much easier as they're thrown and still be protected from their approach until the attack ends, where you can easily just throw it back.

*Tries to squeeze more uses out of Dair*

The last hit goes through MK's Nado!

 

[Monk/Honkey/Banana]

dthrow->dair works wonders on people that airdodge after the throw

 

[Kanzaki]

I like doing a short hop late dair -> grab. Land right before the last impact so it doesn't knock them away, and then grab, reminds me of the melee days ^^

 

[Matt07]

At least Mario Tornado has uses now, seriously, like who would use that move in Melee?...I'm suprised people wanted Mario's Tornado back, instead of FLUUD.

 

[HeroMystic]

I wanted the Smash64 Tornado...