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Make Your Move 27: Jamcon 2 Comments Ahoy! Kefka and Wriothesley crash Jamcon

tunz

Smash Cadet
Joined
Sep 4, 2022
Messages
25
Here's my Jamcon 1 entry themed around that sweet sweet cash money!

Have you ever wanted to be more than just some random person with feelings, emotions, depth? Well I'm happy to tell you that you can throw all that stuff in the trash bin and become crabulous! Other appropriate adjectives include; glamorous, fabulous, glittering and SHINY.

(The title is unfoldable. There is an invisible arrow on the left side of it that unravels the rest of the document. Thought I'd say in case it starts off as folded up when you click it.)
 

Arctic Tern

Smash Apprentice
Joined
Mar 12, 2022
Messages
129
ACHERON (WCF)

Acheron is a set primarily about treason, already a good start. By using NSpec, he can switch his allegiance to one of two rival nations and summon reinforcements from them, but having both on stage risks him becoming victim to one group’s attacks. This isn’t all doom and gloom for Acheron, however, as it also allows him to hit the reinforcement from the rival nation and take their equipment for himself to buff his attacks, as well as gain a boost of mobility from the horse the cavalry unit leaves behind. His SSpec and FSmash also change drastically based on what nation he is aligned to, with the FSmashes in specific being tailored to taking out members of the rival nation. It’s a very fitting mechanic for a traitor like Acheron to have, and his poor mobility and defensive options mean that having two reinforcements (the max, which is not explicitly stated but inferred through careful reading) can legitimately end up being as good for him as it can be bad.

When he’s not committing treason, Acheron summons drawbridges that he can use as shields from opposing reinforcements as well as platform extensions. This gets a surprising amount of use, from extending the distance that one of his SSpecs can travel to setting up for earlier kills from the sweetspot of one of his FSmashes. A good portion of Acheron’s set can be described as a “parody” of the sets of the Fire Emblem lords who have canon sets - he has Marth’s Shield Breaker on an FAir (good for shield pressure when he doesn’t do well against them), smashed aerials with equipment like Robin, and a division between magic and lance skills similar to the way Byleth’s moveset is structured. Not only is this good characterization, since he essentially is an evil Lord in the actual game from what the set tells, but they actually manage to flow within the strategy based playstyle fairly well. Acheron also has some dirty tactics, such as sneaking up on the foe with his DSmash, which hits harder if it hits the back like Nosferatu, crossing them up with Dash Attack then immediately punishing since it turns him around, and a Back and Up Throw that can be swapped out at will to mixup DI. The only real issue here is that there’s no mention of potential tech chase follow ups, which seem like they would be fairly prominent given the presence of reinforcements and adds another parallel to the lords since Marth’s prone game is fairly notorious (as well as the fact that the sizes of the reinforcements aren’t actually stated). Alliance FSmash also seems a bit too gimmicky to be viable since the hitbox doesn’t hit his front, but the range extension through mages does give it nice utility and it is still easier to kill with than the Empire FSmash.

In any case, Acheron is a set with a very fun central mechanic that plays off of the idea of “evil FE protag” in unique ways that generally add depth to his playstyle. Definitely a man I’d trust with my life!

ZAGREUS (DeanSeventeen)

A warm welcome to MYM, Dean.

Zagreus is meant to be a rushdown character, which is in-line with the fast-paced nature of his own game from what little I’ve seen of it. His main gimmick is that his presence causes boons to automatically spawn on stage randomly, which he can pick up from a variety of buffs. It’s a nice mechanic that pays homage to Hades’ roguelike nature, and the buffs seem pretty varied, enough so that no one choice is better than the other. Individual attacks are fairly interesting from their concepts, such as NSpec applying a stackable damage debuff, FSmash being a projectile, and USmash being a bomb that stays out a bit after initially used. I also appreciate the fact that Zagreus only has a fairly small loadout of weapons - most of the setmakers interested in the character seem to want to give him everything he has, which simply isn’t feasible within the constraints of Smash. It would be cool, but with the boon mechanic that you’d have to include it would just be too much for the player to realistically learn, probably the same reason why Joker doesn’t switch Personas in Smash despite it being one of his major abilities.

However, what ultimately prevents me from liking this set more is the overall lack of detail. Zagreus’ moves are just described as combo moves or enders, with nothing about their uses in the neutral or disadvantage, meaning there’s not a lot of visible depth to the gameplan shown. You also don’t describe or show photos of any of the weapons or abilities he shows, leaving readers who aren’t familiar with Hades in the dark about what they are or their reach compared to other attacks (as well as who he even is, since there’s no intro text besides stats). Lastly, while I appreciate the effort to describe the frame data of every attack, the endlag numbers are far too fast, with none of Zagreus’ attacks having endlag over 20 frames and some having no start or endlag. As an example, his DSmash, a spinning sword slash, has 7 frames of endlag, while most similar DSmashes in canon Smash have around 30 frames of endlag. Zag should definitely have fast frame data given his gameplan, but he should at least be punished for whiffing a move, and as it is now he can’t be

Overall, while this set certainly has interesting ideas, lack of detail and off frame data ultimately severely hurt Zagreus. Those ideas are still very good ones, however, and if you want to make a set to properly compete I suspect you’ll do fairly well given enough time.

Link to full comment repository here!
 

Katapultar

Smash Lord
Joined
Nov 24, 2008
Messages
1,257
Location
Australia
1708416350496.png
"My name's Maple, and I guess I'm the guild master? My strength is poison and vitality. I'll do my best to lead you!"
This is not a Jamcon entry (read those first), but it's the reason why I was unable to participate this time around because I was focused on her and excited to get her finished. Can't believe that I was able to write something of this length in just 1.5 weeks while still having work and time off on one of the two weekends.

Many thanks to Slavic's Sigma moveset for kickstarting the inspiration to start on this set!
 
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WeirdChillFever

Smash Hero
Joined
Jun 10, 2014
Messages
6,496
Location
Somewhere Out There
And just like that, the first JamCon of MYM27 comes to a close!

A big round of applause to everybody who entered! JamCon sets require a special kind of grindset and the whopping eight movesets here are a testament to the can-do attitude around these parts of town.

With that out of the way, let’s introduce our contenders:
  • The friend-and-merch-shaped balloon from the ever-profitable Pokémon franchise, Drifblim by ArcticTern!​
  • The glittering decapod with the shinest set, Tamatoa by tunz!​
  • The scamming shadow of a brazilian behemoth, Buzz Buzzard by BrazilianGuy!​
  • The pilfering pirate from the treasure-troving Wario Land series, Hinyari by Hyper_Ridley!​
  • The insect with the same instinct as all of us, the Hoarding Bug by GolisoPower!​
  • The curator of planets and collector of the stars, Dagded Dujardin by TortoiseNotTurtle!​
  • The villain born of crude capitalizing of a very profitable parasite, Knull by n88!​
  • The financially-driven phantom, Phantom Shadow by UserShadow!
Which money-maker takes home the prize? Voting period lasts until March 8th, so put your money where your mouth is and get to reading! You can’t vote for your own moveset, only the rich get to cheat in this world.
 

Katapultar

Smash Lord
Joined
Nov 24, 2008
Messages
1,257
Location
Australia
Man, this Jamcon’s got some fun personality. A fulfilling intro, the humour of Dagded interrupting the moveset and even him having a freaking taunt that launches a projectile if your opponent taunts! Those taunts and early animations sure do a good job of conveying his overpowered character. It would have been fun if Dagded threw in more quips across the moveset, but I could see they could get repetitive, and how they’d take a good amount of energy to think of when you’re under time constraints with this set.

I like the F-tilt beam’s recoil and U-tilt’s projectile status, and while the latter’s random timing is a bit annoying for inconsistency, I’m glad the move acknowledges this and mentions being able to observe when the planet falls down. I could see that you had to rush the frame data section of later non-Specials due to comparing them to existing moves, but that doesn’t do anything to detract from them. F-throw and B-throw are unorthodox and kind of interesting as potential combo starters or side-swapping tools, but I think there could be more to them if you took the time to edit this set later: the teleport says it can reposition foes, which makes me think that there’s no reason why Dagded couldn’t teleport his opponent to move them a certain distance. It could make for a fun mix-up if you teleport them away a set distance (by smashing the input), maybe for your ranged attacks or into a distant set-up - and if they try to attack you out of the throw, they’ll end up hitting thin air and leaving themselves open. In any case, the rest of his throws serve as a stunner and KO option, so he’s not starved for good throws without his side throws.

Neutral Special is fittingly a projectile that can get insanely powerful under the right conditions. I don’t know if it canonically relies on absorbed energy to get stronger, but I think it would be cool if Dagded could charge the projectile normally like Sephiroth or so - it should easily be within his capabilities, and would further sell his power without needing to rely on opponents with energy projectiles. It feels situational right now.

Side Special is actually pretty cool, as it’s essentially a floating sword trap that Dagded can pluck out of the air to use as a battering item. If I’m understanding correctly, the floating sword stays out for 15 seconds and has a 4 second cooldown, but shielding will dispel it early, which is a neat dynamic as it means Dagded has to avoid being put on the defensive to maintain the sword for as long as possible. He also has a uniquely-flavoured warp (no pun intended in the context of the ice cream sandwich meter) that can be used up to 7 times, but each use gets put on a cooldown for 5 seconds. I think this recovery is pretty underpowered when it only travels 2 grids and has no noted upsides to compensate for its cooldown. You would easily be justified in doing crazier things with this move, like increasing Dagded’s recovery distance, or even giving him no end lag out of his teleport so he can use it as a powerful combo tool (maybe he’s even invincible out of his teleport, or can teleport foes with him?). It synergizes well with Side Special’s shield limitation where Dagded can get screwed over if he is put on the defensive or left in disadvantage without a teleport, however.

While there are a number of moves that could be refined or improved upon, Dagded was nonetheless one of your stronger movesets, and just might have the most potential of all your sets so far…

Oh, and Dagded just might have one of the nuttiest Final Smashes ever made, and I’ve seen a lot of things in MYM. This might be the only Final Smash that counters other Final Smashes that we’ve ever seen, and it shows off how absurdly powerful Dagded is that he just casually tanks the foe’s strongest attack and hits them with something that’s stronger than most Final Smashes. He can also just fly around to hurt opponents and reflect projectiles during his speech about snails. I also love how you effectively included a freaking overpowered joke moveset at the end of your moveset, and in a Jamcon no less. People used to make these kinds of ridiculously powerful joke sets in the single-digit MYMs, and while they could be bland or obnoxious this one is actually genuinely funny, like Dagded just casually making all of his stats 999 without putting any thought into them (and the retorts of the consequences of various stats being maxed out). Oh, and even the move descriptions are just stupid (in a good and funny way, of course). I think the main advantage this set has over those old joke sets is that it was placed as an extra after a proper, balanced moveset for the joke character in question - it makes readers feel more invested in the character and has more of a build-up over the course of a proper set, compared to if someone randomly posted a Saitama joke set and made him invincible and made his entire set punches that did 999% and killed instantly.

Seriously? You get to vote on whether the main set or joke set is better, and clicking YES or NO leads you to a different doc? And repeatedly clicking NO gives you the bad ending? That’s some seriously cool reader immersion, feels like something old MYM would have done if Google Docs existed back then. It honestly makes Dagded handily the most fun I’ve had with any of your sets so far, so you should be proud of him in that sense.

I am all for this chain of obscure(?) horror characters from you, even if the Hoarding Bugs don’t seem horrifying by their description. The set primarily focuses on building up a duplicate by stashing away items in a nest and protecting it for 15 seconds - Reisen had a similar mechanic where the player built up a meter to get access to a duplicate, but this set goes about earning the duplicate in a different way. Beyond that, this set does something I’d always thought about myself: the ability to equip the props on your regular attacks as items! I think all the Specials are good - the items, the bouncing projectile that can cause crumple if it hits right, the exploding jetpack, bee nest to defend your nest and combo extend with its flinching - though I’m a little confused at how the bee nest says it doesn’t deal hitstun yet paralyzes opponents like ZSS’s attacks. My favourite move in this set is probably the F-Smash, due to its pushback that works in with stuff like Side Special and getting space for your items, as well as F-air’s somewhat specific and committal hitbox and D-air being a heavy crate dump you can then use as a throwing item. Even Jab dealing set knockback is actually interesting for spacing needs, and a move that just deals consistent knockback so it’s easy to use no matter the situation.

This set feels like Alternate Gabriel where the Specials and mechanics have cool ideas, but I think it’s more messy and unrefined than it could be and that’s fair given the time constraints you had. Now, I am all for items and I think the idea of being able to reproduce the hitboxes on your regular attacks as items is cool, but items are strong, and I think that this would end up pretty overpowered in practice. The set also doesn’t mention a limit on the number of items Hoarding Bug can have out. Additionally, I’m not sure if the set mentions whether your Hoarding Bug ally can hold and throw items, but it feels like a missed opportunity to not exploit generated items with a CPU ally. The set also doesn't go into detail about the implications of the ally bug’s varying damage output, which could lead to some weaker attacks being stronger combo tools(?), though to be fair that would be quite a lot to talk about.

Welcome to MYM! First up, you don’t need to worry about being hated for posting something, even if it’s not up to our lofty standards. Happy to see that you used Muno’s movesetting template here.

I have minor knowledge on Zagreus and that he is from the hit game Hades. This brings me to my first point: the set is very, very under-detailed, and effectively assumes that the reader is as familiar with the Hades game as you are. While the game is popular from my understanding, and I get why you’d think most readers would be familiar with it, it’s generally best to approach set-writing with the assumption that your readers don’t know the source material you’re talking about. For instance, Neutral Special says “shoots a projectile towards the enemy,” but I don’t know what kind of projectile just going by the move’s name “Bloodstone.” I also don’t know anything about Zagreus as a character outside of the picture provided, or the context behind boons.

Even if broader attack details and applications are difficult for you to convey right now, adding in some flavour-based details would really enhance the experience of reading this set: an intro to say who Zagreus is, a description of his stats (maybe if they’re trying to emulate a certain type of feel from his game) and some details of his more notable attacks and mechanics, like some basic background on their source material and what boons are. And while not necessary, pictures or GIFs where possible would go a long way. For an example of a newcomer set that manages to perfectly sell their character’s source material in spite of not having that much detail on their attack’s application, I’d recommend looking at the Professor Layton set we got this contest.

For this set itself, I’ll jot down some points:

  • Might be a good idea to describe at what frequency boons appear, like every 10-15 seconds for instance, and whether opponents can use them.
  • Neutral Special is pretty overpowered, as it sends a projectile towards the enemy (does it home?) that can’t be reflected or absorbed, increases the damage they take (does this status effect go away after a certain amount of time?) and has extremely low lag. To be fair, you might be under the impression that 12 frames of start-up and 10 frames of end lag is longer than it really is, which I could understand as frame data can be tricky to grasp. Alternatively, the move might be balanced around the fact that the projectile is slow or doesn’t deal hitstun, but neither of these are described. If you want, you can just say a move has low, medium or high start-up or end lag.
  • Not to pick on you for it further, and this is the last time I will, but the set’s frame data in general is very low, particularly the end. Might be a good idea to check Ultimate Frame Data for a general idea of the average lag fighters experience for their attacks. Up Special mentions having no starting lag (which would make it frame 1), though to be fair some Up Specials like Mario’s come out so fast that it looks like they have no start-up!
  • It’s difficult to understand the kind of playstyle Zagreus is going for with the short detail on his attacks, other than the playstyle section mentioning the single word “Rushdown.” (which does help!) D-tilt, U-tilt and Dash Attack do manage to convey that they trip and are combo tools for the former and latter two respectively, but describing their level of knockback and their launch angle would help to give off a better understanding of this.

I’m not sure if you’ll see this comment, but if you do feel free to hop into our Discord - we’d like to know what you’re into and if you have any more plans or goals for MYM.

While not the type of character I was expecting from you for this theme, Drifblim is nonetheless a welcome addition. The exploding shield mechanic rocks, and I’ve had similar ideas for it in the past: applying it to a Prinny moveset, or an exploding character who had constructs that benefited from being struck by the powerful explosive hitbox. My idea would have been to give the foe who broke the user’s shield immunity to the blast, similar to the logic with the Yellow Devil stage boss on Wily’s Castle, but you can still shrink your own shield to break it and damage opponents. I don’t mind the way it’s implemented here though, as the blast doesn’t have immense reach and Drifblim will generally die before its opponent, as well it being possible to shield poke.

Drifblim opens up with some shorter but very fun Specials. Ominous Wind lets you create a custom wind path to move while being grounded and threaten Aftermath more easily, while Shadow Ball is an unorthodox downwards projectile that works super well with Drifblim being air-based and playing off of its custom wind path. N-air is a fun sweetspot vs sourspot DI dragging tool, as well as F-air for its unique knockback angle and set-up applications. All the Aerials really. I also like F-Smash for being a slow move that’s not great at KO’ing, but is more effective for whiff-punishing and setting up edgeguarding scenarios - a very smart type of Smash attack for an aerial-focused character. There is also turning your wind into a hitbox with custom knockback with that attack. F-throw has a fun interaction with Aftermath, which feels more balanced with Drifblim’s grounded moves not being the best and the fact that it can’t shield in midair, but I think the Smash attack recoil is necessary - Drifblim does have a very good recovery, and most opponents wouldn’t know that specifically using a Smash attack while under Destiny Bond would make them suffer recoil. The idea of their recoil knockback being based on Drifblim’s damage rather than theirs is fun, though. I also like the flavour and general application of U-throw’s cargo carry.

Overall, Drifblim was surprisingly great for its length and being made so quickly, giving the set a solid chance of being my nomination this time around.

This character choice rocks. I went to see Moana with my mum when it came out because we were born in New Zealand, and Tamatoa is a pretty solid Disney villain. Anyway, I read this set after Hinyari and found it funny that you and Hypah shared a brain cell and both made super heavyweight fighters who are weak from behind. Tamatoa handles it a bit differently with a spinning style move for his Neutral Special. If I had to make a suggestion to go in line with his back weakness, why not make it so Tamatoa moves backwards more slowly than forwards, and make his spinning attack’s knockback leave opponents in front of him? Anyway, it’s kind of fun that Tamatoa’s fall speed isn’t arrested during this move like with some spinning Specials in Smash. His Side Special is admittedly a bit simple, but I know that Tamatoa does not have a lot to work with power-wise. Perhaps his claw attack could be a command grab to make it feel more like a Special? Maybe it could also behave differently depending on the foe’s percent, like throwing them diagonally downwards if they’re at higher percents where it stops comboing effectively.

  • “Tamatoa’s falling speed and aerial momentum are slowed by about 50% as he goes through a somewhat cocky summoning animation, which is of course utter bull**** because Tamatoa doesn’t have any sort of special magical control of water. He’s just an asshole.” This is a surprisingly funny line.
  • Up Special summoning a geyser from the bottom of the screen or ground below Tamatoa to meet him is kind of wild. It might be too good at walling off space, but its hitbox doesn’t seem to amount to much unless Tamatoa was near the top of the blast zone - in which case I assume its 2 grids of set upwards knockback would KO foes regardless of their position or percent? I wonder if it would be better to just make the geyser appear directly below Tamatoa no matter where he is - could even function like Sonic’s Spring or a trap against opponents, where Tamatoa could place his back against the geyser to cover his back. Maybe in exchange for the potential to be knocked into the geyser himself?
  • Down Special has a nice chunk of character animation to it. I think the move is going for a mix-up where you can use the move’s non-charging super armour to beat out attacks meant to interrupt your charge, which is nice, as well as the ability to call the geyser on the ground while you’re airborne. Maybe he should lack super armour from behind, to further sell his weakness to being attacked from behind.
  • I don’t think there are any Dash Attacks or Standard moves in Smash that automatically turn you to face your opponent, but I do like the application with its high-angled knockback. Could get confusing if there are multiple opponents and one ends up behind you and the other in front of you, but I assume it would prioritize the closest opponent in that case.
  • I’m glad to see that U-Smash and D-Smash are only front-hitting moves. The latter can be pretty strong at higher percents as a kill confirm, but maybe you could mention that the move’s long duration leaves him open if he misses?
  • I actually like F-air being a casually powerful heavyweight move that rewards Tamatoa for keeping foes in front of him, especially when it would be easy to get behind him while he’s airborne. B-air is also useful for being weaker, but turning Tamatoa around.
  • U-air is another good move for Tamatoa’s playstyle. Being a grab hitbox, I think I can see why you didn’t make Side Special a grab because otherwise U-air wouldn’t be able to link from it - might be a good idea to mention that, since Side Special is a special move. I think tech chases would be somewhat fascinating with Tamatoa: foes might try to get behind him to get to his back, and potentially suffer for that predictable move.
  • Oh, so Side Special is a command grab according to the grab section.
  • Humorously realized that you made a set for another grab in Kingler by reading the alt skins section.

I think there is room for improvement on Up Special, but otherwise I actually think Tamatoa is one of your better movesets, as his back weakness provides what is probably the strongest melee hook in your movesets so far.

I heard in the chat that you struggled a bit to get ideas for this guy, but I’m glad you went through with it because I like to see how setmakers fare in the face of Jamcons. In your case, you got yours down quite quickly, and it’s a real short read too!

  • Neutral Special reminds me of a bit of old MYM, where it’s a brief and short super armoured dash that can be canceled into standard attacks to act as a pseudo-counter.
  • Bucket Head functions as a minion, but Side Special doesn’t mention the conditions or frequency for when he uses his ice-spitting attack. I assume he uses it once he’s summoned, but I also get the impression he can use it while he’s being a minion since the move mentions that frozen foes can slide into Hinyari. To be fair, you were on a tight timer when making this set, and those details can easily be added in later.
  • Does Side Special’s freezing have the properties of freezing in Smash? AKA reduced damage and knockback? Probably not, I assume by F-Smash’s description. Otherwise I like how opponents are frozen in the frame of animation they were in.
  • Up Special has a neat approach going for it with its fear/respect factor when Hinyari can cancel into his Neutral Special, but not back into Up Special. Could be worth mentioning that it can be used as an out-of-shield option when you can edit this set.
  • Down Special ties Hinyari’s base concepts in an interesting way, where he suffers from overhead attacks but can equip his helmet to give himself a passive overhead hitbox, making him more oppressive when his Neutral Special armour makes him difficult to attack head-on. I wonder if the helmet should come with some kind of cooldown once it’s removed, so Hinyari can’t put it back on too easily if he is knocked away.

  • I like the application of Sakurai knockback in this set. It’s not something I really think about.
  • D-tilt and F-tilt feel a bit similar, since they have a bit of start-up and deal Sakurai knockback that KOs at 140-120%.
  • I remember the old Paunch “memes” back in MYM5. Imitating Captain Falcon was the cool thing to do back then.
  • I’m a bit iffy on U-Smash not having a hitbox without your helmet, but the idea of a jump that can be charged to give it i-frames and be angled finely is good. I actually think U-Smash and Up Special should be swapped: Up Special’s grounded attack feels like a regular attack, and it being a funny horizontal Smash attack would work in with Hinyari having a hard time against grounded foes without his helmet. Up Special could keep its aerial variant, and make the grounded version the current U-Smash - it feels more like a Special than a Smash.
  • B-air being a strong and slow attack is just what I’d want for a set with a back weakness, and it can play in with a partially-charged U-Smash.

While he’s a very short entry by modern standards, and naturally missing out on a little Side Special clarification, I think Hinyari is pretty impressive for his wordcount! Cu and Citizen V were strong short sets last contest at around 6.5-7.5k, but Hinyari is like half of their length and still manages to have a solid moveset hook while conveying necessary details for the shorter moves. Believe it or not, he is not that far behind Fang the Hunter for me.

A new MYM rep for Three Houses, Archeron strikes me as being an odd pick when he’s a minor character from a game with many memorable units, but no less welcome for showing one of the game’s many sides. MYM is no stranger to minor characters getting movesets, after all. The stats mock-up looks nice, and I’m definitely a fan of when sets use the height section to display their character’s canonical height if it’s available (since I do it myself).

Neutral Special has an interesting utility take on the average summoning input: you can pre-set your allegiance, use the flag for projectile defense (I imagine Archeron waves it around with strong, dignified sweeps, befitting on a noble) and spam the flag-waving move to summon an ally! The minions’ descriptions are nice and concise and easy to understand by comparing them to Assist Trophies. It gets particularly intriguing where Archeron’s backstabbing nature comes into play - he can have both the calvary and mage minions out at the same time, but the first one to be summoned becomes a hazard to him as well! And Archeron can’t just attack and kill them off either, at least not until they become hostile. Adding to the fun are the items each soldier can drop when defeated, which only Archeon can use. The step-by-step set-ups and items/mechanics that can apply direct buffs to Archeon’s attacks if earned have both become synonymous with your recent sets, as I remember them being present in Irene Landry and Ilyana. The dynamics of having to beat your minions to get their items and being able to use your flag to reflect their attacks back at them is a lot of fun, and the white flag gives Archeron a funny way to bail out if fighting his minions is too much. The whole concept of a character who exploits minions they are sent by a higher force reminds me a lot of Smady’s Fassad moveset in MYM17.

  • I wonder if you could add in pictures for the minions? It’s not necessary, but I imagine there must be images of them out there since they are likely enemies in the game.
  • “Acheron’s opponents might not be able to use of these loot drops, other Acherons in the match can! There’s no betrayal like betraying oneself, it seems.” Good.
  • “To top it all off, Acheron has a great resemblance to the bridge troll from Dora the Explorer. ” Lol what?

The bridge itself has an interesting dynamic with blocking enemy projectiles, but also obstructing units both friendly and not, so it can potentially be a hindrance. It conveys Archeron’s tactical and cowardly nature well. I like Specials and attacks that provide a solid benefit, but are implemented in a way where they can obstruct or even worsen parts of the user’s game. Iirc, Smady’s praised Cap’n Cuttlefish for having a similar approach. The move also gets extra fun with bringing the bridge down to create extended ground over ledges, or literally bridge the gap between the two lower platforms on Battlefield and give your units more space to move around among other things.
  • “If Acheron tries to use this move in the air or when a bridge is already on-stage, he pulls at nothing with a shocked expression on his face. How could he be so stupid!” This line hilariously implies that Archeon is actually stupid. Or maybe prone to making big mistakes.
  • Down Special adds more to the mix, with a 3/6 per stock attack where one is lost for every 50% he takes while allied, putting a bit of pressure on him to use up these Gambits earlier rather than conserve them.

  • “Aside from being able to commit literal treason basically at will, Acheron’s two-faced nature is also portrayed by splitting the basic parts of his set (aerials and standards) across the two power sets he possesses: His vertical and neutral inputs make use of magic and his horizontal inputs take from his stint as Cavalier and use a lance. This is similar to Byleth, who splits his allegiance five-fold between Aymr, Areadbhar, Failnaught and the Sword of the Creator in a similar way. Acheron appears empty-handed in his idle pose and basic animations, but sneakily pulls out his lance and tome as needed as opposed to someone like Robin, who shows his cards in advance. He even hides any stolen Silver Lances or Sage’s Tomes that he nicked from his old helpers, and the UI doesn’t show which weapons he possesses either! This is not exclusively beneficial to the Acheron player, who has to manually keep track of the when and where of smuggled wares.” This is a fascinating piece of characterization. While not necessary, it might be good to move the first 3 paragraphs of N-air above it and below the Aerials header, as they don’t directly involve describing what N-air does.
  • The Aerials section being combo-based, or at least with the spells, reminds me of Ilyana. I’m a bit unsure on D-air’s tome-boosted projectiles traveling 5 grids downwards when the move sounds quick, even if Acheron has to go through some legwork to get the tome, and it has limited uses. Maybe it should be reduced to 3 grids? That way there’s some reasonable counterplay for opponents as they can jump up and attack Archeron if he tries to bombard them with ice projectiles predictably. It would also play more into the move’s last paragraph where opponents can capitalize on you using the attack to easily get rid of hostile units from above.

  • F-Smash is another two-in-one option based on your alliance. The first one has a fun “hurtbox” positioning and pseudo-counter that works if opponents attack the space ahead of Archeon where the hitbox spawns, as well as being a way to exploit and kill hostile mages to better widen the hitbox against opponents. The second hitbox also pairs well with your mage minions.
  • I like U-Smash’s characterization.
  • It’s good that the set acknowledges a few ways Archeon can get backstabs for his Down Smash.
  • F-tilt is a simple but effective move that plays into reinforcements well. Like-wise, D-tilt going into your aerials.
  • Dash Attack is an interesting little move that turns you around. Not sure if it’s perfect, but I think it works in the context of ledge get-ups.
  • B/U-throw DI mix-up is kind of neat, and works in the context of Archeon transitioning into either his air combos or ranged game.

While Archeon has a fun base and a pretty solid moveset altogether (though the throws lean a bit on the simple side), I ended up preferring Ilyana from last contest by a decent margin. I think it comes down to being unsure whether Archeon got the best mileage out of his core concepts: like the drawbridge, horse and perhaps ways to capitalize on your support minions. I also wonder if the lance and tome drops were underutilized across the set, and whether the two-faced gameplan between air combos and spaced focus is spreading it thin a little. On the other hand, it’s smart not to apply too many lance and tome buffs if the set doesn’t need them, and limiting the tome attacks to Aerials means Archeon can conserve them for his comboing aerials (though maybe he could have a throw that uses the tome?). I also think this set is smart with its implementation of minions by only making them attack from the ground, which means they can’t interrupt Archeon’s air combos.

A standout among the other Jamcon entries for his wordcount, I heard you pumped out this entire set sans the Smashes (and intro?) in a single day and kind of had to rush it a little, just to bring it up here for posterity’s sake. I think it shows a little in the stats write-up, which is a little different from your other sets in it being more drawn-out and slightly unsure of itself in places. Not a demerit to the set, anyway.

Gotta love the wackiness of starting out with a mechanic that lets Knull take control of minions by KO’ing them with certain attacks. It’s done in a balanced and thoughtful way like Taranza, and has some neat mechanics to it where excess damage done to the minion is added to their HP when you take control of them - and Knull can kill them and take control of them with his powerful Smashes. Being able to control stuff like Pikmin, minions and KO’able ATs feels extra balanced when it’s on a big man with little weight.

  • I didn’t know “Knull” meant that word in Sweedish. Reminds me of FU from No More Heroes 3.
  • U-Smash has a unique series of hitbox placements, a bit of a reverse Palutena U-Smash that can keep going even if you’re attacked, but is kept in check by high starting lag and its active frames. Like-wise, D-Smash has its range extension and a unique 1.9x charging multiplier that is justified when you have to charge it, the latter helping to spread more void. Got the impression that these Smashes were just set-ups into the big things Knull will do with his Specials…

  • I don’t know if you’ve read Alucard yet, but projectiles passing through your Symbiote minions (with the visual of a hole that regenerates) reminds me of that set, only it’s a power display on a minion. The Symbiote not sponging projectiles and being slow mover and attacker makes them feel very tame and balanced for a minion. Even a fun little mix-up where creating the minion increases the end lag on your biting attack.
  • Void on your Smashes creates some classic hard interactions with the Symbiotes to consume them in exchange for boosting Knull’s Smashes. I wonder if you should highlight the Smash inputs (Forward Smash, etc.) in something like red when they are listed near the end of Side Special? Might help with presentation and to split up the move a little more. The hard interactions are modest but sensible, and it’s smart that they’re not big things that Knull needs to hyper-focus on getting like with some older set-up based movesets.
  • Neutral Special has a fun dynamic of being able to delay it to split up the sword and pillar hitbox, as well as combo the former into the latter at lower percents. The separation aspect is further interesting when void is taken into account, as you can have both the sword and pillar use a single piece of void or send out the latter and have it expend a different void - or just expend one where the sword attack would not. Gives Knull a handy way to use void that opponents may be standing over.
  • Using the void pillar to turn your opponent into a Venom is wild flavour-wise, but I probably should have seen it coming. Sounds like it will have implications in his grab…
  • I like Knull’s auto-turn against shields if he flies at one while he’s using Up Special along the ground. The dynamic of getting brief obscuring from a void, but Knull having no grounded attacks that hit below the ledge, is a good one too.
  • Down Special is unique for being a regular hitbox that leads into a high-up command grab, so it can technically be shielded against in a funny way. Those kinds of unorthodox but still organic-feeling command grabs are cool. I like its utility where you can move around your grabbed opponent to position them more optimally for follow-ups, as well as create void for free in exchange for not being able to link into the attacks that do make use of it. Homing the hand on your Symbiotes as a pseudo-counter and opponents with one is probably the most fun part of the move.

  • Jab is kind of fun with the mix-up on its rapid jab finisher not being guaranteed, but good for baiting out defensive responses.
  • Dash Attack fits well as a void-powered move, given you can obviously burst into your opponent from a void spot, and being a move that helps you fight back for stage control.
  • I like F-tilt’s very casual and arrogant animation of Knull just not putting effort into his sword swing. It’s also good as an easy poke that’s not rewarding.
  • Landing lag cut for landing over your void is good. N-air is a fun little move where its ability to start combos is tricky because the late hitbox isn’t active for long, and you can hit with the early launching hitbox instead. F-air is refreshingly short, and no less useful in Knull’s gameplan.
  • D-air’s handsy grab gives me Akechi II vibes. The dragon trick near the end in FFA situations is a fun little touch.
  • F-throw is definitely good for its application of consuming void in one big potentially deadly throw, with a bit of a caveat that you need a lot of void ahead of you and to use it over void. U-throw also reminds me of Sauron in making a construct, except it helps to catch landings and that’s useful for the slow Knull.
  • D-throw ends on a cool note by interacting with your Symbiotes, and even summoning new ones to help! It leaves you in frame-neutral though, which is bad for Knull at close-range since it can backfire on him.

While you said Knull had some crazy attacks that might be off-putting, I actually found him to be a pretty tame and well-crafted moveset from start to end for the sheer time crunch you were working with, with some neat MYM’y bits sprinkled on in the grab game. Neutral Special did foreshadow at Venomified foes being more vulnerable to Knull’s grab game due to having their grab timer extended, but I assume that the symbiote on them counts as a piece of void to exploit your void-powered throws from anywhere? If anything, I think his concepts weren’t -as- wild or inventive as some of your other Jamcon entries like Strange, Mordo and Citizen V, primarily due to being a “cover the stage in goop and use it as a resource” set that doesn’t bank on that resource too hard to ensure he isn’t overly-reliant on it. Regardless, this set has left me a bit unsure on whether I want to nominate it or Drifblim this time around, not accounting for Phantom Shadows and Buzz Buzzard at the moment.
 
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Katapultar

Smash Lord
Joined
Nov 24, 2008
Messages
1,257
Location
Australia
You’ve expressed interest in classic cartoons before, but I’m glad to see you dip your toes into them. This might be our first Scooby Doo moveset ever? These guys remind me of the Dark Scorpions with their ability to set an ally to attack and allow you to attack while they’re in lag, but you just have one ally, your moveset isn’t split among a group and you have a specialized Neutral Special that lets you program a set of inputs and hold the input again to make the second guy perform them all. They even have a fun little mini-tether that lets you attach the second Phantom to your opponent to access them more quickly and closer to your opponent, but they can easily break the chain, and the Down Special that lets you set the last input you made as a “trap” to repeat with another input. The Specials in this set have a nice charm to them, being short but also meaningful.

The Second Phantom mechanics make an otherwise simple F-Smash an interesting trap the player-controlled one can knock foes into. D-Smash was admittedly confusing to begin with, but here’s how I understand it: you have to have the second phantom available to use it, but it effectively doubles as a powerful ranged attack and delayed teleport for the player phantom, with attack canceling that can lead to combos! Quite a cool move. There’s also an U-Smash that allows your partner to create a temporary platform for you while they’re charging, which is also dangerous for opponents, but they can’t hold the charge forever, and setting them out to hold the platform limits their otherwise potent offensive uses and leaves them vulnerable to being attacked and KO’ed. I was wondering what Phantom Shadow would do with their attacks, since they’re a pair of guys in sheet costumes, so it was interesting to see you get a good chunk of mileage out of these one-shot villains.

The Standards are solid - F-tilt a spacer, D-tilt a potentially quick enough move for even your second Shadow to use, and U-tilt bit of an airspace denier that works well from Neutral Special’s chain of commands for enemy conditioning. Dash Attack might be the cooler move here, as it’s either a simple whack or committal multi-swing that can drag opponents around - and works wonderfully for positioning the second Phantom for your Up Smash and Down Smash that utilize him well. It’s also neat fun with how the Side Special shackle works!

N-air continues the somewhat common trend of radial knockback N-airs, but with the unique trait of being momentum-based and thus working well from Phantom Shadow’s recovery. F-air is a consistent pushing tool that’s slower than it would be on another fighter’s kit, which is of course balanced given their Up Special flight and the trap-like applications of your Smashes when used with your Second Phantom. B-air has a funny little trap that might seem random, but I think it’s surprisingly clever with the input - slapped onto a Second Phantom chasing your opponent, I could see it being used for fun little ping-pong applications.

  • “The Phantom Shadow makes an exaggerated downward swipe of his claws, trying to pull the victim in. Upon succeeding, there's a moment of hesitation- almost as if he meant to scare off the foe, and thus take a moment to realize 'wait, now what?'- before grabbing his chain and wrapping it once around the victim.” This is a funny bit of characterization.
  • Anyway, F-throw’s cargo throw is a good bunch of fun - not just for the fact that you can make it disjointed, but its synergy with Side Special and D-air (smart move to make the downwards throw deal less hitstun than the others), as well as using Down Smash to teleport yourself back onto the stage.

While not entirely dissimilar to the Dark Scorpions in their mechanic, I actually liked Phantom Shadow a decent bit better, mostly because their moveset was consistently interesting from start to finish - their mechanic being more simple probably helped with that. I’d say they’re one of your better Jamcon sets, to the point where they’re now set to be my nomination for this Jamcon! Time for your next win that was denied from King Radical.


You wrote all this on the first few days of the Jamcon? That is seriously impressive given your previous two Jamcon entries were notably shorter than this. Not familiar with the source material this character comes from, but I’m glad to see this type of character getting moveset representation. Doubly so when it’s a character and series that you’re passionate about.

Neutral Special has a cartoonishly funny animation for making your opponent “sign” your policy. The death insurance is of course something Buzz has to work for, but I’m a fan of the move’s (literal) secondary use of being able to tax your opponent for using certain types of moves. If I may make a suggestion, it might be worth doubling or tripling the amount of taxes you get from an opponent when they use their throws. Throws would see a lot less use than Standard or Aerial attacks, which would effectively make it the worst of the 4 input options to go for. In any case, I like the write-up about figuring out the match-up to discern which is the best type of tax to impose on your opponent. Smashes are the only moves you can’t tax, which is funny because they are generally the most committal attacks in a fighter’s arsenal.

That being said, it’s hard not to notice that Neutral Special is a command grab that is stated to extend 5 units forward. I have no issue with cartoon logic here, but it’s seriously meant to be a long-ranged grab then I think it needs to be stated that it has a good amount of lag, among applications like catching out your opponent from a distance. I think its reach is very overlooked. At first I thought the grab just became Kirby-sized and swiped directly in front of Buzz, but then Side Special’s projectile mentioned traveling 6 units.

  • Side Special has a funny write-up.

Down Special gets into the bulk of Buzz’s fun and the meat of what he can spend his money on. There’s a weird and hilarious logic to the fact that Buzz literally has to pay money for objects he already has on-hand in his coat. The cigars are a decent enough boost to his recovery, albeit limited in use, but more interestingly for their early hitbox - could see this as being useful for keeping your opponent in place as you fly away from them, perhaps for your ranged options. The drink’s Standard-cancel into your Neutral Special grab is also nice. That being said, I think this type of cancel would justify Buzz’s Neutral Special having high start-up to go with its long range, which would also prevent him from being able to casually use his regular attacks to lock shielding foes into his Neutral Special grab. It also makes me think that it would be interesting if Buzz could aim his Neutral Special grab to land it from his U-tilt. The 3 options from Down Special all feel like buffs based around Buzz’s survival or that fit into him getting more money, but nothing that really allows him to directly score KOs more easily. We’re still only into the Specials of this set, though.

  • I don’t think it would be realistic for Buzz to talk for a length of time during his Jab (it would probably take too long), but it’s funny to imagine nonetheless.
  • Alright, I see that the tuxedo gives Buzz immunity to his grease trap from Dash Attack, and gives buffs to his regular attacks in general. Knocking opponents into the trap to trip them is fine, but making fighters trip just by walking over the grease might be too effective as stage control, especially when the grease is almost as long as a platform, lasts for 8 seconds and can be used multiple times. Maybe fighters can walk over it fine, but they’ll slip if they start their dash over it? The move also doesn’t go into much detail about its hitbox, but I like the idea of a movement-based attack that leaves a construct behind that you’re vulnerable to - allowing it to backfire if you whiff the attack and opponents smack you back into your construct.
  • F-tilt is perfectly functional and good as a move, but its lag feels particularly short for a quick attack that hits 2 grids in front of you (I think that’s longer than some sword swings, and a little under half the length of Belmont’s F-Smash).
  • D-tilt reminds me of Saul Goodman planting signs in the ground and making money from them - the idea of taxing your opponent for using the ledge is hilarious (and losing money yourself if you use that ledge, heh). I think it would be fine to double the taxes imposed on this move.

  • While you were under time constraints to finish this set, It’d be neat if Buzz could use money or the props he can buy to make his Smashes easier to kill with, as that’s the kind of pay-off you’d expect for building up money. The tuxedo lets him act while his U-Smash arrow is flying around, so that helps at least.
  • Certainly wasn’t expecting Buzz to fire bullets for his grab game, and have a Z-air to be a Bayonetta/Joker style attack. It feels like one of Buzz’s attacks with some of the most noted melee applications in his set.
  • “Buzz was not playing around during his Wild West era, bro was wanted for killing 273 sheriffs and counting. In this throw, he will gather all of the souls of the sheriffs he killed into a single shot. His guns grow cartoonishly large before blasting with a small explosion that launches his opposers to their graves. ” That got insane really fast. Gathering the souls of the dead into a single attack sounds very anime-like, and something Alucard would do.
  • I like that N-air is a move that directly benefits from the amount of money Buzz has. The 3 grid large safe hitbox might be a bit too big - maybe bigger safes deal more knockback, but also have more end lag and landing lag? (but increased hitstun if you drag an opponent so you can use them for combos more consistently)
  • F-air is also affected by money, in a more simple way where it changes to a strong move when you get 500 or more bucks. Or spend money to perform it earlier.
  • As much as I prefer for Buzz to utilize his spending money for bigger rewards as much as possible, I think him having an U-air and D-air that are consistent tools, particularly the latter for neutral and interactions, was a smart move.

While there are some points that could be improved upon, partly with Neutral Special’s grab range and perhaps applying money (or the suit) to F-Smash and D-Smash, I think Buzz is your best Jamcon set so far and one of your best. His Specials are all solid enough and have their place, while he has some fun little tricks like his Dash Attack spill, his U-Smash and D-Smash and his Z-air to a degree.

It was a close tie and Knull and Drifblim nearly got it, but my nomination this time around goes to Phantom Shadow by UserShadow7989.

Hypah’s return must have triggered a Sonic Boom, because we’ve already gotten 4 Sonic sets out of the first 40 sets posted! Amy Rose is a longer set from you that conveys a more “normal girl” feel and a unique Hammer Flip mechanic, where you can perform a super jump at the cost of expending both your jumps and not being able to act during this jump. It reminds me of FA’s Sheoldred set, which he actually brought up very recently in the chat, and I think the idea of a special jump that lets you jump in a controlled arc while setting your air friction to zero would be cool and on-brand for you to attempt.

Anyway, Amy has a few moves to unpack in her Side Special. Tornado Hammer is immediately unique for extending hitstun rather than resetting it, which is very rare to see in a moveset! You can also run into the tornado and use it to boost your momentum. Boomerang attacks are also fun too, speaking of the third of Side Special’s variants, and it’s interesting for Down Special to pull a niche (albeit justified) trick for Amy’s history. I like this move for effectively being an Electrode you can force onto your opponent, giving them a window where they have to throw away the gift box or get exploded by it. It’s made even more viable by not interrupting them out of hitstun, which further plays off of the special hitstun mechanic present in Tornado Hammer. Neutral Special is admittedly an odd duck and strikes me as a somewhat iffy input like Knuckles’s Neutral Special - the move has good balance, and I do like “prediction-based” attacks among the lines of Specials from Hol Horse, Randall Flagg and Dr. Facilier, but just being a simple counter that gives you a one-time auto-dodge against the attack you countered feels a bit underwhelming. It doesn’t play into the rest of Amy’s established Specials and mechanics, and might be somewhat frustrating to play against in practice. I think it would be better if Amy’s prediction was more offensive-based: less shield stun and the same slow-down if you dodge the attack, and some kind of boost for interrupting the attack like higher knockback or hitstun.

  • U-tilt has a nicely-detailed animation.
  • Dash Attack is surprisingly long, and has some nice synergy with your tornado. The grab at the end is a funny little effect, but doesn’t feel too overpowering against shields since it’s rather specific to pull off. Does have very minor synergy with your Tarot counter at least.
  • U-Smash is notable for its Hammer Flip and Tornado Hammer synergy.
  • N-air is actually pretty unique, being an unusually spammable aerial with varying (and visually logical) landing lag that ranges from good to bad. So you need to master the timing of landing to use it well. The airstall and its drifting properties also make it quite a fun aerial to chase foes with.
  • U-air’s momentum-reversing trick is actually pretty cool! Works with a number of stuff in Amy’s set, as well as making it easier to follow up on the back spiking hitbox. Like-wise, D-air adds to Amy’s cool momentum-based tricks, with the option to use it as a drag-down tool or bounce and takes foes back up with you, as well as potentially be safe against shields. The momentum-based stuff Amy can do is arguably where the set shines the most, in my opinion.

All and all, I liked Amy around the same level as your other entries this contest, but the cool tricks she has with her momentum and tornado give her a slight edge.

Though they weren’t quite posted at the same time, it’s wild that we got two sets for Knuckles within a similar timeframe. This one’s considerably more simple than Turtles’s moveset, but it does share some similarities - a wall-cling, and Glide, Spiral Upper, Dig and Drill Claw’s input placements and ground vs air usage, though Turtles used the spin dash for the grounded Side Special as opposed to Drill Boost. Of course, these are signature abilities of Knuckles, and he has Smash mods made for him, so it makes sense that there would be design overlap between the two of you.

The Neutral Special is different here, tapping more into Knuckles’s raw power as a charge-and-store move with movement and armour - 3.5 seconds might be a bit too long to charge, even when it can be stored, mostly because similar moves like Giant Punch take 2 seconds to charge and even that is considered a time commitment (at least in neutral). It’s almost uncanny how similar Dig is functionally between these two sets. One interesting trick this set does with its Glide is letting Knuckles use it to give his Neutral Special a momentum boost!

The remainder of the moveset is simple, but the attacks have noted applications to them in Knuckles’s playstyle. It’s interesting how Turtles’s Knuckles Standards placed more emphasis on boxing opponents with quick attacks, but your take has him focus more on shield pressure and lean into his nature as a bruiser. Down Tilt is probably my favourite Standard input for packing a tripping hitbox, which allows Knuckles to go into some of his power-based attacks on hit. I think F-Smash being a straightforward punch attack is a little redundant with Neutral Special and F-tilt - it could be fun if it had other properties, like trample priority for beating out attacks or being some sort of multi-hit barrage that ends in a big punch. Also, Grab’s reference to the Sonic 2 movie is funny.

This set is likely to be overshadowed by Turtles’s set due to differences in their levels of detail, but your Knuckles still manages to stand on his own, and it’s not every day you get to see two different setmakers’ take on the same character in the same contest.
 
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Arctic Tern

Smash Apprentice
Joined
Mar 12, 2022
Messages
129
Every set in this Jamcon has been read and ranked! You can find the block for this (and all other Jamcons) by clicking this link, which will automatically take you to the section I've designated for them.

As for nomination, it would have gone to Knull... if it weren't for those meddling lawyers and their pesky Phantom Shadow guise! Congrats on managing to successfully replicate a Scooby-Doo chase in moveset form, US!
 

n88

Smash Lord
Joined
Oct 10, 2008
Messages
1,530
A.B.A by Arctic Tern Arctic Tern
Probably not big news for you in this comment since I previewed the set, but I didn't find myself clicking with this one quite as much as I wanted to. I think the set doesn't find quite as strong an identity for itself as I'd like; A.B.A's toolkit is incredibly wide and it kinda just feels like she can do whatever at times. Some of that may be down to the presentation of ideas. You have a very rigorous, methodical approach to fleshing out melee options and I think leading off with the Tension inputs (which are meant to contrast her usual options) maybe ends up foregrounding them a bit too much? I know this is something you made some edits to tone down but I also felt pretty strongly that A.B.A's claimed weakness against shields was not particularly present.

It's an interesting adaptation of a fighting game character philosophically. It has some very direct 1:1 translation type stuff but it also adds some of its own wacky ideas in the grab game and it has the odd low-key wild direction on inputs like Up Smash. I'm not sure it always carries through things that are cool about A.B.A in Guilty Gear though. Her sort of super state entrance/exit vortex game (something I was kind of fascinated to read about GG A.B.A) isn't really played up and I think some of the choices around Goku Moroha (particularly limiting the ability to exit it) are pragmatic but not exciting.

There's a lot of solid melee stuff through the set and some cool attacks (USmash, Jab, DThrow), but she's not threatening Friedrich for fave Tern set this contest. I suspect she's the kind of thing that's gonna start out in an okay spot on my votelist but probably struggle to hang onto that.

Hoarding Bug by GolisoPower GolisoPower
I'm really on board with this moveset conceptually, but it definitely suffers from jamcon crunch - certain core concepts are underdetailed and I think toward the end some of the melee applications of moves felt maybe a little off. There are also certain ideas that just don't come back around after being introduced. The premise of NSpec is very cool, f'rinstance, but certain items are missing information about how likely they are to summon the dog and then at the end of the day I didn't feel like the dog was something Hoarding Bug cared about much.

The set finds some very fun melee along the way, though. The Smashes are a great input section, and I really enjoyed the second Hoarding Bug stuff. There's some fun hard interaction animation stuff on top of the desync strats that does a lot to sell character. They always feel like silly little guys. Ultimately I don't think it'll be in the running for my jamcon nom, it's just a bit too undercooked. But I had a lot of fun with it!
 

BrazilianGuy

Smash Cadet
Joined
Sep 10, 2022
Messages
41
Time to try and comment on Jamcon sets. I'll post the tier list once they are all done.

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I love Moana, great movie watched it in theaters, and Tamatoa is one of the greatest characters in the movie, Shiny is also an amazing villain song, so I was happy to see some crustacean love, we also need more animated movie characters in here IMO. The main thing with Tamatoy is his size, and you get around it well, I kinda feel like he'd be a character that would be good for a Multiversus moveset since that game handles giant characters better. I like how you incentivize him to hit forward by making his stronger moves the ones that hit in front of him and making stuff like Back Air weaker. His specials are all pretty cool and ok, Down Special is to me the coolest one, I think if this wasn't a Jamcon with the limited time there could be something with the bioluminescent mode? But this perfectly gets his character, he is big, you are small, he hits you and he eats you. With the limited time he has on screen, I think its hella cool to see all you were able to include. Lastly I'm glad Tomatotoa is in the alts, made me happy. All in all I really liked Tamatoa, great stuff. Shiny/10

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This is a character I never heard of, but the buzzwords of pirate, boxer, and penguin immediately make me love him, penguins are my favorite animals and boxing is my favorite sport. It's also very cool to know you have so much passion for Wario Land, and I'm sad to report I couldn't clear the side-quest, no idea what that color scheme is meant to be. Boxing attacks feel really awesome, I like his bob and weave and how he can use it with other attacks as well as the mind games for using it defensively. I kind of wished you explored his Down Air more, him having a way to do a penguin pelly slide sounds fun but is kind of kept short. Also this is just a short moveset in general, no extras or anything, but since it's jamcon season I believe that is ok. The best thing about this is how his Up Tilt and Up Smash both take advantage of the helmet, makes a lot of sense and feels smartly designed to take advantage of it. The Final Smash is also fun. Good stuff all in all, gets a Sherbert/10

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Also knew nothing about this guy or his series in general, but I see you're quite passionate about it eh Chonk? I really like the way you present your movesets, it's different and unique from everything else and I enjoy that highly! I'm still not sure what Dujardin is, but the fact he is a Slayer or Beerus kind of character who doesn't take the fight seriously makes him super entertaining, all his animations just have so much charm like his Crouch being him becoming smoll, his confetti Forward Air and his use of planets as tilts. Also, speaking of which why are tilts together with Smash Attacks? Feels weird. Also would have been nice to have a size on his up tilt planet. His specials also bring in a bit of his more powerful side to the light, the meteor shower is my favorite love the idea! And Dujardin coming in to make his own super-busted moveset? Hilarious, the fact he just puts 999 on everything despite it being a bad idea in some cases is brilliant. Also that ending? Super unique and fun use of google docs, I loved it. Dagded may not have as much in each move but the fun factor alone makes him stand out for me in the entire tournament, love seeing unique things like this, Handsome/10

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Very neutral on Drifblim as a Pokémon, like, I remember it exists but not much else. This moveset does a thing I really like to see with Pokémon sets which is taking a random critter and doing the most with its design and the little info from Pokédex entries. The balloon angle is really neat, makes it really feel like a wandering spirit in the wind, and moves like Neutral Special and it's aerial mobility reinforces this. I also love how you gave it both its more common ability as well as the hidden one, great detail. Explosion in general is a very fun input, Driffy feels very go big or go home. Also just to say, Im kind of mixed on this being on the jamcon tho, like, yeah there is a reason, you make it work, but eh, more of a pet peeve. I like how it's ghostly nature gets represented with all the tricks it has like the interaction F-Smash has with Up Special, Forward Throw, and the extra buffs some moves receive from it's hidden ability. As it is a Pokémon there is not a lot of personality in it, which is a shame since I really liked the personality you gave in Alucard's moves. All in all I liked Drifblim's moveset, the character just doesn't do much for me, it is a better balloon fighter concept than Puff tho. Bloons/10

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So Lethal Company is funny game. I love the idea of taking what is to my knowledge the Goomba of that game and giving it a really fun moveset. Of the sets I've read this one has the most interesting use of money, with the bug using it to build a nest to then build up a friend depending on how much money it got. Weird how many sets I've read for MYM yet this is the first time an Ice Climber style partner is a thing, really cool concept and fits the strength in numbers. Neutral Special is really good since you're not always gonna be aiming for more charge, reminded me of Pac's Neutral Special which is a very big compliment. "Why, it comes from a Hoarding Bug’s Nest, of course!" this reminds me of "Why, it's Amy Rose of course!" sorry not sorry. Also I think the bee's not flinching but paralysing may be a bit better than the beehive item. I loved Forward Throw for how silly it sounds and how good the version with a friend sounds, Up Throw for how it interacts with the nest, giving you a reason to maybe set it up near ledge to then get them there with up throw, and grab's stealing capabilities. I wanna know how chaotic an 8 player Hoarding Bug match with items on high would be, just casually getting a Master Ball from the nest, you know, no biggie. I enjoyed Bug quite a bit, think it does the money theme the best so far, and has a lot of funny item animations and interactions, a Lethal/10

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Knull is the only moveset, as far as I know, that mentions "Venom" by Eminem. This fact alone already got me hooked, but what really got me was your writing style, is very fun! And even though I'm not too well versed with comics you sold Knull very well and showed lotsa passion for him and the entire Venom stories, loved the Venom tangents. I will say his connection to the theme is on the same level as Drifblim's but you do sell it a lot better. One of the things I really enjoyed seeing was the interaction of Symbiote with Minions, like in Smash this would be minuscule, only really worth mentioning for Free for Alls with Assist Trophies, but since MYM has so many **** buddies it becomes a neat detail, and I like how it comes back later in the set. Smash Attacks are all great and I love reading your thought process, is something I love seeing as I think it helps me understand movesetting a bit better. I also love how many layers the Specials had, in my eyes, it fits him perfectly, he is a big comic book villain, of course, he'd always have some extra trick off his sleeves. I'd honestly say the highlight move for me was Down Throw, the concept is really creative as it makes use of the minions. Up Tilt's description was also good and funny with the " You did several things wrong if that happens, but at least you got there eventually" that really got me. I'd say Knull's biggest issue is just the lack of extras, I know it's Jamcon, and the time is limited but man, his move already have great animation descriptions, I can only imagine what his victory animation and taunts would be, outside of that kinda big exclusion I do find Knull an amazing set. Great playstyle, unique mechanics, had a nice time reading, genuinely had me interested in the character, if extras get added later this might be one of my favs of the whole tournament, right now I really loved it. A **** in Swedish/10

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As the cartoon moveset enthusiast, this one speaks to me. I had a DVD with these old Scooby episodes, while I don't recall this episode, I do recall the design of the monster, one of the greatest ones, is so simple but cool looking at the same time. I love the characterization that a lot of the moves have, such as the rope in Up Special being barely visible, the dry ice trick being mentioned quite a couple of times, the Down Smash Flashlight, you managed to translate perfectly this concept of 2 bros tricking people that they are ghosts. And since I mentioned it, yeah Down Smash is weird to understand at first, I thought it was because of me not having english as a first language, but other comments mention it too, so yeah. My only other real negative is the lack of extras, I imagine it'd be hard to figure so many animations when they have such limited screen time, but it could be hella fun. But speaking of hella fun, the concept is amazing, being able to call in your partner in crime as well as set him up with Neutral Special and Down Special sounds so fun. Also, the kirby section left me wondering, how insane that could get in the right hands. Extremely complex moveset from a character you don't really expect that from, also with Jamcon time, how do you people pull this off? But yeah, despite no extras, Phantom Shadows are a cool duo who excel at showing off their characters and having a really fun moveset with plenty of tricks that fit they Scooby origins. All in all they get a Delight of Fright from the Night/10

A consistently RICH jamcon with plenty of great characters, good job to everyone who did such a great job in such a short time, but in the end, someone must take home the gold, for his great creativity, fun dive into the character, mention of "Venom" by Eminem and the unique style, I give my vote to the symbiote god Knull. Later on, I will post my updated tier list to the thread, so yeah S2
 
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Arctic Tern

Smash Apprentice
Joined
Mar 12, 2022
Messages
129
MAPLE (KAT)

Maple is a tank in every definition of the word - ridiculous weight and potentially amazing recovery, but slower speed than everyone in the game, and a 7-frame jumpsquat just to make jumping that much more committal. On top of that, she also doesn’t have a lot of low percent KO moves, and the ones that she does have are either very difficult to land or come at some risk to herself. What Maple does have is a hecking lot of cheese tactics, starting with automatically putting her shield up when moving, acting as a shield towards attacks and projectiles. It can also automatically absorb projectiles 5 times a stock to buff her poison based attacks, or if it ends up breaking a shield automatically KO the foe. The poison in and of itself is capable of stacking and lasts a long time, and also automatically KOs the foe once their percent reaches a certain point, and there are multiple ways to apply it. Lastly, after grabbing the opponent Maple can choose to make it a tether that makes her move with them if she knocks them past its boundaries, allowing for scarier tech chases, better combos, and better ability to move them towards the blast zone so her moves can KO earlier.

All this adds up to a set with a lot of mechanics going on, but they all manage to interconnect with each other very well. NSpec is the main way of applying the poison effect, either spawning a cloud that’s useful for damage racking and quick positioning or poison hydras that can apply a field of poison. SSpec is a chargeable projectile that can’t be canceled out of if charged, but also serves as one of Maple’s few truly good kill methods and gives her some recoil if uncharged she can use for movement. Both of these moves also give her immunity to hitstun, meaning that she can actually get away with using them raw, something their duration would normally prevent. USpec summons Maple’s pet turtle Syrup to give her a mobile platform to use grounded attacks on, as well as fire a laser beam that forces reactions. Lastly, DSpec is a sphere that gives her a major boost in speed, allowing her to approach if Maple is clever enough and cover the stage in poison, that also lets her trap the foe in it to pressure potential combos from her or offstage KOs.

As with Suisen before her (somewhat ironic given Maple’s build is essentially the exact opposite of the optimized Disgaea build), most every move has some sort of gimmick, and she even has the same gimmick of a throw that changes based on distance! The Smashes have the most fun gimmicks, with the highlight being the DSmash; it essentially applies a time bomb to herself that has immense power, but also harms herself, though she is tough enough to take it. Jab summons a pseudo-projectile that Maple can approach behind, with two variations based on tap or hold that either extend combos or KO if she mixes it up. DAir is a stall-than-fall with a hard read hitbox above her that buries foes hit by it on the ground, and also turns Syrup into a projectile if she lands on her. Lastly, DThrow applies various status effects, the most notable being increasing the rate at which poison damages the foe and decreasing the threshold of the automatic KO. Throughout it all, the core concepts of Maple struggling to KO without cheese but being extremely threatening once she gets close remain prominent, and there’s very interesting usage of the mechanics of her tether in the set - there’s a lot of words, but there’s enough to the set that it needs that word count.

In summary, Maple is an excellently-crafted set that pays as much homage to the character as possible while also having an incredibly unique playstyle. It’s a definite lock for SV in my book, and a serious contender for my favorite set in the contest (unless some other set takes away that claim).

KNUCKLES (FazDude)

This version of Knuckles is a lot simpler (and shorter) than the other Knuckles set we got, but that doesn’t mean it isn’t worth reading. I like the implementation of Deep Impact as a chargeable NSpec, it’s something I haven’t seen in any Knuckles set and a fun take on the move for the mobility it offers. The ability to maintain any air momentum out of a glide also adds some neat flavor and technicality to his combo strings. Lastly, while most of the moves are simple there are some highlights, like a DTilt that has a “sweetspot” that automatically trips the foe on hit at the cost of high endlag if it whiffs.

The set is on the basic end, however, not really listing anything about the moves other than their knockback or how well they combo. Knuckles, as such, feels a bit bare bones compared to other sets (not just the other Knuckles set). The conclusion also claims that he has a poor disadvantage state, but I don’t really see it in the set; he’s got a frame 10 USmash, a fast DSmash, a strong, fast USpec, and a good recovery with everything put together. Knuckles probably would have trouble escaping due to the low range on the attacks and his defensive options having a good bit of lag, but no true attention is paid to those flaws in the set; it could probably be improved by bringing them up in the descriptions of the moves themselves. I do feel that this is better than Waluigi, however, due to the better knowledge of combo routes as well as an overall more solid gameplan, so you definitely succeeded on that front.

TREASURE KNIGHT (Majora)

Treasure Knight starts off with a very neat mechanic; every 10 hits landed or received will flood the stage, having no effect on other characters but changing his movement to be more air focused and altering most of his moves. The most notable is his SSpec, which summons a treasure chest that normally acts as a trap grabbox, but when the stage is flooded has its area of effect drastically increased. More importantly, the suction also affects all of the projectiles Treasure Knight can have onstage, including turning his DSpec caltrops into a tornado hitbox that deals knockback towards the chest if they’re in range. NSpec is the main projectile, firing a diamond that rebounds off of anything it hits; when flooded, they become trapped in bubbles, but retain all their properties if the bubbles are popped, setting up for a lot of potential chaos if everything is set up. The result is a stage control/bullet hell set balanced around a very weird stance change, an idea I quite like.

The rest of the set actually manages to play off of this base in interesting ways. Treasure Knight’s standards and throws allow him to manipulate his setup in a variety of ways, and his FSmash allows him to switch places with the opponent to reverse ledge situations or deposit them next to treasure chests. USmash creates a wall that he can bounce his projectiles off of, while DSmash creates a platform if the stage is flooded that he can interact with in a variety of ways. The aerials are a bit weird, however, with three of them being dedicated to moving Treasure Knight around the stage with his anchor cannon. While I like the idea, as well as the benefit of canceling them into each other if the stage is flooded, it also deprives him of the ability to combat foes in the air for the most part since his NAir needs to be primed before he can actually use it as an attack. But despite all of that, I did enjoy Treasure Knight and his concepts, and they served as a bit of a nice throwback to old-school MYM tropes.

GOLBAT (Khold)

Golbat is a short and sweet little set that overall works out to be a fairly simplistic combo character. The main gimmick is that pressing the A button once Golbat lands its biting attacks will result in it leeching the foe’s blood, increasing its weight and fast fall speed and healing it a bit. Additionally, it can also expend this blood through DSpec, sacrificing the survivability the higher weight grants it in exchange for a potentially very powerful kill move. Golbat’s other Specials are fairly simple, but I still like them, with NSpec being a smoke screen its wind based attacks push around and SSpec causing illusionary clones to appear and attack the opponent once they’re hit by it.

The rest of the attacks are fairly simple, but I do like the various applications Golbat gets out of NSpec haze, from using it to pressure platforms from juggles or threaten a powerful BAir through a RAR. I also like the light emphasis on the execution barrier on getting the most out of Leech Life, something of a balancing factor and something that isn’t really discussed in most of these movesets. My main issue is that Golbat’s mechanics aren’t given the detail they should: aside from there not being an explicitly stated weight and fast fall cap from Leech Life, it takes until NAir to mention it has more than one double jump and doesn’t mention their strength or how many it has and it’s never specified how many clones SSpec summons. I’m also not big on FThrow being intentionally bad - there’s no reason given as to why this is the case design-wise and it just feels weird to deliberately make a move useless. Even if it fits characterization wise, sometimes you have to sacrifice a bit of character in order to benefit the quality of the actual set. But in any case, Golbat is still a fairly strong set for what it is, and certainly an encouragement for me to start thinking about my plans for Zubat.

Link to full comment repository here!
 
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Katapultar

Smash Lord
Joined
Nov 24, 2008
Messages
1,257
Location
Australia
I’m a fan of getting another moveset for a character related to Tinker Knight, and another moveset from you that’s ocean-themed. I wasn’t expecting a modern MYM set to flood the stage with water like Ludicolo, King Ramses or Jeanne d’Arc, but here we are! Some might say that flooding the stage would conflict with Smash’s swimming mechanics, but I’ve never been fond of said mechanics or the flavour-based implications of fighters being water-challenged, so I’m very fine with stage-flooding. It allows for the translation of a gimmick from Treasure Knight’s boss fight. Water aesthetic aside, the mechanic itself works in a neat way: take or receive a total of 100% to automatically enter a stance change/buff for 6 seconds. The fact that it’s automatic means that Treasure Knight has to go with the flow depending on the situation, and that can result in him getting less time to utilize his waterlogging if he, say, got sent flying and was forced to recover. At least waterlogging gives him higher air speed and an extra jump!

  • The way Neutral Special works during waterlogging is actually pretty cool - basically turns them into traps, or you can hit them yourself to pop the bubbles and send the diamonds bouncing forward like their standard projectile variants, even set off a bunch of bubbles and have the diamonds pop them for a big chain reaction. It’s potentially powerful, but very balanced by the fact that waterlogged only lasts for a limited time. Just two questions: do the bubbles pop automatically when the waterlogging state ends? And do the diamonds still go flying out even if your opponent attacks and pops their bubble? For the latter, I assume the diamond would go flying away from the opponent so it doesn’t harm them, but it probably can’t harm Treasure Knight.
  • Side Special is a funny little short-lived trap grab. I think having a grab radius of one grid around itself might be too big - maybe the grab hitbox should just be on the chest itself. Otherwise I’m a fan of the chest’s suction effect on your projectiles and ability to get stronger by soaking them up.
  • Up Special absolutely sounds like a move Treasure Knight uses in his boss fights.
  • I kind of like how short and simple Down Special is as a trap.

  • Some simple but effective bubble/projectile positioning tools among TK’s Tilts. Classic MYM stuff.
  • F-Smash being able to switch places with a target strikes me as a bit weird, despite the fact that it technically makes sense from an animation perspective. I think it’s just that the “switch” is described as a teleport, and in my mind I envision the switch as “anchor your opponent and pull them in while simultaneously reeling yourself forward to switch places with them”. That aside, it’s a cool move for its reversal properties near the ledge, as well as the neat hard interaction of switching places with a treasure chest to catch out approaches. Might be one of my favourite F-Smashes among your movesets.
  • U-Smash is the MYM’ian wall for bouncing your diamonds that we were waiting for. It’s kind of fun that this wall produces a wall on both sides of Treasure Knight instead of just one, as well as the fact that said walls have a weak spot. Given the location of the Grapps’ eyes, I assume that their eye is located at the top? Means that foes have to jump up to smack them.
  • “He’s surprisingly agile with those swimming legs of his. I know you just scrolled up because you forgot what his legs look like, don’t lie to me.” Surprisingly relatable MYM reading moment.
  • Adding to the MYM’ian fun is D-Smash’s waterlogged platform. I do like how some use cases and interactions are listed for this platform, especially where you can use your treasure chest to elevate or lower the platform depending where the chest is placed.

  • N-air is an odd-duck, and closer to a Special input given its two-step process and nature as a weak, omnidirectional projectile. I’m fine with the orbs not interacting with Treasure Knight’s other stuff, but I think the input could do with a little extra clarification on its use-cases. It’s fun, but it feels a little out-of-place.

The directional aerials’ (minus B-air) multi-grapple anchor usage is fun from waterlogging, being something of a Bayonetta style laddering tool with coin ground coverage from the D-air. That being said, I can’t help but think that Grapple Anchor should have been Treasure Knight’s Up Special, while his current Up Special should be moved to the D-air slot. “Move in X direction before entering helpless” feels like it’s the type of move that should be on an Up Special, which would also free up two melee slots on Treasure Knight’s Aerials (F-air and U-air). I also think Treasure Knight’s F-air and U-air forcing him to commit to a movement attack and then enter helpless would be unfun - his N-air isn’t a conventional melee attack, and none of his Specials have conventional melee hitboxes, which means he would struggle against frontal opponents while he’s airborne. And that might not have been your intention when writing this set. Even a simple F-air and U-air replacement that work into his game and interact with his projectiles if you like. Right now the Aerials section feels like the weakest part of Treasure Knight’s set, and hold back an otherwise solid set.

  • Being able to grab and throw your chests to reposition them and imbue them with effects is more MYM’ian fun, and a nice way to end this set. I’m most fond of the U-throw capture bubble and F-throw eel from this approach.

All and all, Treasure Knight performed above my expectations. A cool gimmick, relevant set of Specials and other neat moves like the Smashes that feel like they come together decently. He’d actually be my favourite set of yours at the moment, but the Aerials section hold it back from that spot at the moment. Otherwise I could see myself voting for this set to make up for Felix (who I wanted to vote for, and was just one slot away from getting a WV).
 

GolisoPower

Smash Master
Joined
Sep 17, 2017
Messages
4,337
Hindenberg's Smaller, More Successful Cousin
Drifblim by Arctic Tern Arctic Tern

Starting off our JamCon this contest is Drifblim, coming in hot with some balloony fun. It comes in real damn strong with a much-more weaponized version of Jigglypuff's shield gimmick, where it does a Kamikazee-style explosion on a shield break (which you mistakenly refer as Magic Burst BTW)...but on the plus side it doesn't lose a stock when it pops. Great anti-shield-pressure mechanic there. The playstyle based on the Specials here establishes Drifblim as a trickster who uses unorthodox movement and far-reaching attacks to keep foes guessing. The Up Special and Side Special are good burst movement options where Drifblim can stay afloat for longer or do an invisible teleport that can create an explosion at the other end of the path. Those two together are already kind of nuts making him difficult to avoid, but then you have Explosion and Shadow Ball, the latter being a projectile that turns Drifblim into a bomber blimp by shooting it downwards and the former being a radial read attack that gives it a risky buff where it takes damage over time but deals more damage. All this makes Frifblim someone who just loves to play with danger, toeing the line of life and death. Fitting for a Ghost-type Pokemon.

Drifblim also has some notable normals that just soothe my soul. F-throw for example, has the evil effect of reflecting the damage back at the foe within the next few seconds, albeit it's got a small window of frames for fighters to avoid it. I also find it fun that Side Smash interacts with Up Special's updraft for extra range, allowing for some insane poking potential with just a single attack alone. And finally I love its Final Smash, going full Pennywise and making its foes float. Little Georgie's not surviving, not gonna lie.

You started it off pretty good with this, Tern, nice work!

Mr. Krabs Wishes He Had This Much Bling
Tamatoa by tunz tunz

Coming up next is Tamatoa, and despite having not seen Moana it definitely lives up to the musical number it was based on, and another step in the continual rise of quality you've been on. Tamatoa is a decent bait-and-punish heavyweight with crazy burst damage and some surprising range with some of the geysers going on here. You got the Side Special command grab and close-range attack that many super heavyweights like to carry with them in their kits, but then you have geysers that give him some surprising disjoints in Up and Down Specials, granting Tamatoa some amazing anti-air and reading potential to boot. A lot of his attacks are just glamorous, too, showing off a charming character covered head-to-toe in gold and bioluminescence. It comes together in a fun little set that's just as musical as his source and shines like the sun. Sorry if I didn't have much to say, but I think you did pretty good here, tunz!

Pingu's Scarier Uncle
Hinyari by Hyper_Ridley Hyper_Ridley

Much like Tamatoa before it, Hinyari is a pretty quick read to go through (I say as I take a few days to read this), with a simple playstyle of a super heavyweight with surprising tools to keep him in the game. We have a bob-and-weave Special as a pseudo-counter that has armor frames and allows Hinyari to be extra-evasive in midrange engagements, a powerful anti-footstool Down Special that buffs D-tilt and is constantly active, a minion summoning Side Special that summons Olimar-like minions to patrol portions of the stage and stuns people on hit, and an Up Special flurry attack that can be canceled into Neutral Special and goes on a sharp angle when used in the air. All those together make for an interesting brawler set with mild stage control and a unique bait-and-punish playstyle that I'd personally love to see modded into the actual game. His normals also give vibes of a bulky streetbrawler while adding a wintery flair to it that I just appreciate. I don't really have much to say with this like with Tamatoa, but honestly I had a nice time reading it. Nice work, Hyper!

WE'RE MAKING IT OUT OF THE MILITARY WITH THIS ONE🔥🔥🔥🔥🔥
Buzz Buzzard by BrazilianGuy BrazilianGuy

The third simple set this JamCon is Buzz Buzzard, a character from a cartoon I remember growing up with. He is more direct about his money mechanic, this time revolving around scamming his way to riches like he was some ornithological Ed Edd N' Eddy character. He can inflict people with a Policy that gives him a large burst of it should they die by any means whatsoever, and it's applied through a scary command grab. Grabbing them also leads to a unique taxing state where certain moves will lead to Buzz getting more money when using specific moves, making it easy to build up a quick buck against those who like to spam that one move. Buzz can also throw a projectile that he can control how much distance it goes while also giving himself a nice sum of money for the snake-oil projectile in question. I do find his Up Special hilarious, really showing off his lung strength here. Aside from that, does its job well. Lastly we have a way to use that money, and your options are an extra-special cigar to buff your USpec with an omnidirectional function, a Gargle-Blaster that increases movement speed and grants the ability to cancel out of normals into NSpec, and a suit that gives him increased weight and the ability to build up money by landing attacks with attacks that don't give you money. Overall, this is makes for an intriguing transitional playstyle where it starts with a bait-and-punish style but with enough prep turns into a full rushdown character that's basically got an Install Super with extra steps. Out of Buzz's normals, I'd say a few stick out, such as F-tilt being the classic cartoonish bonk, D-tilt having a pricetag for ledges, and B-air getting more powerful the more money you have. The animations really shout out to the old days of cartoons and I can feel the passion of a character that's extremely prominent in your culture, that I can absolutely appreciate. Nice work there, Brazil!

On Some King Sh*t
Dagded Dujardin by T TortoiseNotTurtle

...well dang, that's another for the list of franchises MYM has got me into. So anyways, Dagded is yet another short read that has a pretty decent base-

Come on, now, you can praise me better than that!

Wh-what the-?!

Obviously, you snails don't give my set enough credit! If anything, I should have all the votes by default!

Ugh, look, that's not how it works, this is a matter of taste-

Well, they need to refine their taste! So vote for me or I swear I'll-huh? Wait, what're you-

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...thank you, Lip.

I'll be back to get you someday, you cheeky snail.

Yeah sure whatever. Anyways, Dagded is a surprisingly fun set that is really making me want to delve into some Super Sentai. Bro may have the temperament and personality of a spoiled brat, but you can't deny he sounds fun to play, in no small part thanks to how this set is compacted so well. The F-throw and B-throw are generally intriguing because while they appear to do nothing like some infamous old MYM sets they make up for it with some hitstun, making it pretty good for repositioning and also for set-ups into other Specials he's set up. Speaking of, I like the Dying Neutron Star for if he wants to annihilate the lactose intolerant, a planted floating projectile that can barrage foes if positioned correctly, a teleport to disorient your foes, and the powerful meteor shower that makes for great burst damage. Those make Dagded into the most annoying character in this contest, playing with his food before digging in. A good effort, Tortoise, I look forward to see what else you make!
 
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Katapultar

Smash Lord
Joined
Nov 24, 2008
Messages
1,257
Location
Australia
You know, it’s surprising we’ve never had a proper moveset for Golbat (outside of Rocket Executive Hugo), and I’m impressed you went so hard on the presentation of a moveset for a simple Pokemon.

Immediately going into Leech Life’s mechanic, and I get the impression that you’d have to press A or B during the hitlag of your connecting attack to drain blood. Similar to how Snake’s Brawl DACUS (Dash Attack Cancel into Up Smash) was easier to pull off if the attack connected because the hitlag from landing Dash Attack extended the attack’s active frames. Anyway, it’s a neat choice to base Golbat’s mechanic off of its dex entry of draining blood and getting heavier, the latter being a drawback to Golbat’s flighty nature but also completely optional. My only issue is that the set doesn’t give specific numerical changes to Golbat’s stats for when it drinks blood.

  • I think 3 seconds is too long to charge up a storable smokescreen that doesn’t come with a threatening hitbox, but otherwise Haze is a fine move. Probably good to reduce it to 1 second. It’s kind of fun that Golbat can push the Haze around organically using its wing-based attacks.
  • Supersonic making the opponent see clones of Golbat immediately brings Rocket Grunt’s Zubat to mind. It’s kind of funny how the clones behave predictably and in a way that would make them easy to spot and almost ineffective were it not for smokescreen. It’s interesting to see that Golbat’s set was melee-driven, and the Specials were written last rather than first. I’m very glad you didn’t go for the unfun “reverse controls” scheme to translate the confusion status effect, and yet you kind of had to throw in Supersonic and confusion because they’re kind of a part of Golbat’s identity as a character.
  • The Wing Attack interaction with Supersonic is kind of interesting and could lead to a lot of mix-ups, even if they’re not mentioned here.
  • F-air might be my favourite move in the set, with a weaker comboing hitbox at the start and a stronger, farther-reaching power hitbox after that.
  • It’s nice that U-air gives a mention of how Leech Life affects Golbat’s air game as it builds up blood.
  • It would be kind of neat if D-air did more damage the heavier Golbat was - it would make sense from a logical standpoint, as well as the fact that getting up into the air to actually divebomb effectively would be harder, thus justifying the greater reward on hit.
  • I think that either F-throw or B-throw could be spiced up by allowing them to force tech situations.

While a fun moveset, I think the way Golbat’s moveset was designed and the fact that its Specials were done later hampered its potential. Smokescreens in general feel weak as movesetting hooks in my opinion, and the set’s approach as a straightforward combo set prevents it from taking advantage of the smoke as much as it could have aside from tricks like Dash Attack conditioning and N-air/Side Air mix-ups. I also wonder if Supersonic would have been better as some kind of basic projectile to supplement Golbat’s neutral game? Since right now the move doesn’t seem to have a hitbox or any real use outside of NSpec and USpec interactions. While attacks being named “Bite X” or “Slap X” has its own charm to it, it’s hard not to notice that Golbat has a lot of biting attacks - nothing wrong with that, it makes sense for Golbat, but I think that biting and wing-based attacks being tied down to uses with Leech Life and Haze respectively limited some of the potentially interesting individual attacks Golbat could have had, especially when all of its Smashes are biting attacks. All this means that I don’t vibe with Golbat as much as other veteran sets this contest, but I’m glad to see a new quick set from you, and one for Pokemon Day no less.
 

n88

Smash Lord
Joined
Oct 10, 2008
Messages
1,530
Hinyari by Hyper_Ridley Hyper_Ridley
A small, straightforward little (big) fella. Pretty fun, small set with a lot of fundamentals stuff. I think his command movement options (NSpec, USmash, DAir) are the real stand-out inputs for me, very fun heavyweight options that give him a distinct flavor. The passive hitbox stuff is also fun to play around with, and I really dig the set respecting the thematic cross-up weakness (strong DSmash that only hits to one side is one of my favorite genres of DSmash).

A lot of his options are pretty straightforward; it makes for breezy reading but does mean that Hinyari doesn't do that much to set himself apart at the end of the day. But hey, it's a jamcon and I'm not gonna complain about an easy read.

If I had to pick at something beyond just expressing a general MYMy madness for getting into it a bit more, I do think the Bucket Heads feel a bit odd in the broader context of the set? They're kind of an aberrant element that Hinyari doesn't feel like he gets a lot of ways to directly leverage. They're just a touch awkward to set up, and teleporting one to his location sounds like a bit of a detriment in many situations, since he wants kind of a killbox (for lack of a better term) with the opponent caught in the middle. Might be fun if he deployed them with a snowball toss instead of just summoning them in place. They might also be better if they stayed in place instead of roaming, since even if Hinyari has to make the space himself, they become kind of a defensive trick he can drop down and then advance past to shore up the cross-up weakness. Ah, I dunno, I'm just rambling at this point. I think the general idea is fine and good, just maybe some of the details could dovetail into his gameplan a little more.

The exit door Final Smash is funny - I kinda wonder if that "hey man you can retreat ANY time" vibe could have been baked more into Hinyari's kit? It's not necessarily the most direct thing to translate so no fault for not making "forcing a hard choice on the opponent" a cornerstone of the playstyle, but I like that gambit as a character detail. The idea that he sort of presses the other player into giving up and backing off would be fun.
  • 35 frames is probably a biiiit fast for something that "radically" shifts the match in his favor, that's not too crazy to get away with. That said losing the helmet off 30% damage and being Dedede's size/weight means he loses it pretty easy too, so sure.
  • He can DTilt in the air! What's its landing lag like?
  • Hinyari actually put me in mind of Joe Calzaghe.
  • This doc's color scheme is of course based on the color scheme of Iraynih, the inverted good guy Hinyari.
  • Haven't hit Fang yet, so this is the first set I've read from you in... 12 years or so? I've said it before but since this is my first actual read: welcome back!
Buzz Buzzard by BrazilianGuy BrazilianGuy
Cool to see another ambitious pseudo-heavy villain in the jamcon, and I dig the general design here, fun jamcon entry. I love the super-statey stuff you can build up to, though I do think Buzz could use some more ways to spend money. It's a bit of a shame that he gets this big buff to money collection with the tux but then he has at most one other big-ticket item he needs at that point. I was hoping there'd be more spending in the set after DSpec so I was a little disappointed not to get much of that, though the aerials did at least bring in some more use of the money at the end. Overall he stays a fun read, though, and the aerials are a good note to end on, they've got some pop even independent of bringing the money stuff back around.

Policy is pretty straightforward but has some interesting dynamics in how it's such a big money-maker that he's incentivized to have it down at some point. Feels like it could lead to some particularly tense play if the opponent gets near death without you ever landing it, since Buzz has to think about how hard he really needs that $500. Taxes feel a little big and silly and out-there, but cool. Kinda wonder if you could tax by input direction (ie side taxes side inputs and so on) instead of tying directions to input sections? Might make it more intuitive control-wise and also less punishing for characters that rely on some particular input section. Though I suppose it's mostly just meter gain for Buzz anyway on the latter point and isn't actively messing with Jiggs for using aerials or w/e.

DTilt kinda goes nuts with the ledge interaction, very wild when the tilts are otherwise pretty conservative melee-focused things. I wonder if it could just apply its price whenever the opponent (or Buzz) moves past it instead of happening exclusively at the ledge - then it's a bit less of a hard-coded niche thing, but it's still strong at the ledge just since opponents don't have a choice but to move past it.
  • "be it by destiny itself" - that's usually what I chalk it up to when I fail to recover as Ike.
  • I guess he's getting propelled upward but I really processed that USpec pic as "Buzz Buzzard Jack-o pose", a powerful thought I didn't expect to have today.
  • "at the cost of having his turning speed be now the same as Captain Falcon’s" - I could be off-base here but I thought Falcon's issue was more-so that the animation for his turnaround just sucks since he sticks his leg so far out? I do like using the Falcon turnaround weakness either way, suits the theme here and it's fun to play with mechanically.
  • You can tell Buzz is a villain by how hard he promotes smoking and drinking in this moveset.
  • "a Brawl player’s worst nightmare" - anyone still out here playing Brawl is a pratfall-loving masochist.
  • USmash is a stand-out fun input, really enjoy both the mechanics and the writing here.
  • Wouldn't mind the Smash attacks having some money stuff like NAir/FAir/BAir do. FSmash especially I think could use the pop.
  • The flavor on the grab game is silly but cool, I think something that's mechanically a grab but not aesthetically a grab is perfectly valid/fun space to play around in.
  • 273 sheriffs? Where did he even find that many, at a sheriff convention?
  • Kinda wish NAir got some kind of buff when the safe is golden, it feels like a visual indicator of... something.
  • "Multiversus, a weird place to pull for comparisons I know." - urban legend says that if we reference it 3 times in the same set it gets released for real.
  • Man writing this comment at the end of the set I went back to SSpec and kinda just realized "oh yeah, he has a projectile". This move doesn't come back around much.
  • Your sets have this really mellow fun energy, always dig that about your style.
 
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Katapultar

Smash Lord
Joined
Nov 24, 2008
Messages
1,257
Location
Australia
Legendary Pokemon are criminally underrepresented in MYM for how many Pokemon sets we have, so it’s genuinely refreshing whenever someone makes a fleshed-out moveset for one of them. I never thought you would come back and make a moveset for Miraidon or any Legendary Pokemon, but Miraidon is such an insanely fitting Pokemon for you, since you vibe with both dragons and robots and Miraidon is both of those. In any case, here we have a meter-based set that makes you a bit stronger and allows you to apply Electric Terrain to surfaces once it’s full. I think making Miraidon’s (electric-based) attacks deal an extra second of hitstun inside Electric Terrain is… okay, numbers-wise, and I do appreciate that a specific amount of (very reasonable) shieldstun is mentioned. Definitely a fan of bringing back the x-ray visual from electric attacks in Super Smash Bros 64.

  • I like it when Pokemon movesets use attacks from the TCG. Feels like an overlooked source material among Pokemon movesets. The laser’s bouncing is kind of neat in the context of Hadron Engine’s mechanics - if the laser hits a grounded opponent and bounces down into the ground to incur Electric Terrain, then I assume that ET’s hitstun would overwrite the Lightning Laser’s knockback, turning it from a launcher into a potential combo starter? That’s actually a pretty cool take on a projectile.
  • Dragon Breath is a wee twist on Bowser’s Fire Breath, where producing a lingering trap at full power incentivizes players to be conservative with the move’s uses. I assume that repeat uses before the breath is recharged function like Bowser’s Fire Breath and don’t travel as far? The idea of a breath attack leaving a lingering effect that deals periodic stun and destroys projectiles feels like an old MYM effect, but its properties as a trap are very reasonable given the cooldown on Dragon Breath. I like how being in Miraidon’s super state speeds up the move’s recharging time.
  • I never thought Electro Drift would be translated as a Spin Dash style move, let alone one that can tag the stage or an opponent with a semi-delayed hitbox befitting of the move’s in-game power. Rolling through the air to build Hadron Engine charge is also a bit of a funny way to build up meter in a set. Like-wise, Draco Meteor’s base use has a futuristic touch as crystals that fire a delayed energy beam.

  • Very glad that Miraidon’s first two Jab hits do not deal extended hitstun on Electric Terrain. Its high KO power is reasonable when it requires a full meter and costs a chunk of meter to use.
  • “Tail tippers also incur a lot of hitstop and a nice crunchy sound effect. You're both slicing and shocking your target, after all.” I like the attention to detail on what kind of sound Miraidon’s tail makes on hit.
  • D-tilt being a whole form change and something of a 5th Special is kind of wild, and it reminds me of Dark Gaia’s Down Tilt for some reason (even though that move involved summoning a minion, rather than being a stance change). Little suggestion here: perhaps Miraidon’s driving mode could be on a “Crouching Special,” essentially an alternate Down Special you have access to while you’re crouching, which would leave room open for Miraidon to have a regular D-tilt? (maybe one that plays off of Electric Terrain?) Otherwise I kind of like the dynamic of Miraidon being able to use its Neutral Special while driving around, and its body serving as a mount for teammates just like in the original games. Wheelie would be proud.
  • Ah, the good old “keep going Dash Attack” trope. I do like this set’s trend of making Miraidon charge up certain attacks to gain meter. My only issue with how this works here is whether it would be feasible for Miraidon to build all that much charge from a running move, since it will eventually run out of stage to run along given its high running speeds (unless it can keep charging even if it reaches a ledge, similar to how most Dash Attacks don’t send you off-stage). I also wonder whether Miraidon should get Hadron Engine charge as soon as it starts charging rather than after it holds out the move for its 30 frame charge. It probably doesn’t matter all that much though, since Miraidon has a bunch of ways to charge up its Engine..

  • F-air is a very MYM’ian attack with its ability to be held out and kept as a short-lived trap.
  • D-air has a neat dynamic with harassing grounded foes with the tipper vs rebounding the tail off of ground to produce Electric Terrain.
  • “This is a fairly niche throw, mainly used if there's a Dragon Breath cloud or Power Gem above you to attempt a combo.” I assume Power Gem refers to Draco Meteor, and is a carry-over from an old draft where that was the original Down Special? You said before you had to think the Down Special.
  • “This is the go-to throw in Hadron Engine, but I will say that even while supercharged, grabs are not something Miraidon is going to go for that often. If you want a grappling buffed dragon, wait for someone to make a moveset for the other Gen 9 cover legend.” Hmmmm…
  • Charging Smashes naturally builds up the Hadron Engine. It’s kind of a cool dynamic that Miraidon’s Smashes don’t get as much power as other fighters to compensate.
  • U-Smash would be a great tool for bullying shields ala Wolf’s F-Smash if the hitbox wasn’t vertical.
  • This move does well in ending on a high note for Hadron Engine, where the Smashes get big boosts from your super mode at the cost of eating up a lot of meter. D-Smash is a satisfying finisher, but F-Smash is probably my favourite for adding on mini projectiles that can be used to lock foes into the beam or get bunch of lingering zaps that can be used for comboing if you fire it off with most or all of your meter.
  • “Should a playable version of these Paradox Pokemon be in the match, they will not appear from a Paradox Ball. If all 6 are in the match, Paradox Balls won't spawn at all. As a Paradox Pokemon enjoyer, I am in favor of MYM making it impossible for my own stage mechanic to occur.” Slither Wing over there is looking pretty tempting (and you’re 100% right, Paradox Pokemon are great).
  • Never thought I’d see custom win/lose animations with sets from MYM25, especially Black Alice of all characters.

While Fang and Miraidon are both equally passionate projects, I ultimately preferred the former for what I thought were significantly more fun and creative ideas (Tail Spring, Marvelous Queen, Flare Trap), but the two aren’t that far apart. Miraidon is still a solid set with good execution and no glaring flaws, mind you, it’s just that I have a preference for sets with strong ideas. Nonetheless, you’ve been doing good this contest, and now that your two main projects are out of the way I have to wonder what you’ll cook up for MYM next…
 

Arctic Tern

Smash Apprentice
Joined
Mar 12, 2022
Messages
129
MIRAIDON (Hypah)

Miraidon is a meter set focused on its Hadron Engine, where charging certain moves will also charge this meter. Doing so will grant a minor buff to its attacks, but more importantly make it so that all of its electric attacks create electric terrain, which adds a second of hitstun to all attacks performed in it as well as a few frames of shield stun. There’s a good bit of intricacy to how this works, including the fact that the moves that allow Miraidon to cover the main stage in electricity are committal and thus adding risk to the moves that do so. While I would have liked to see more emphasis on the shield pressure scenarios the shieldstun buff brings along, the set does do interesting things with the Hadron buffs, like making UTilt intangible or making FAir produce a lingering spark. Miraidon’s Specials are fairly basic, but still neat, with NSpec covering a lot of ground fast, USpec creating a spot that gets struck by lightning after a while, and DSpec being a weak, delayed laser without Hadron and a strong meteor with it.

While most of Miraidon’s attacks are on the simple side, they still mesh together to create a fairly interesting zoner with a specialty in countering other zoners, with a reflector NAir and a DTilt that lets it mix up its movement. I particularly like the smashes, which take a shorter time to charge than usual at the expense of less power, but also charge Hadron if overcharged. The actual moves are nice as well, with FSmash gaining arcs that stun opponents hit for the meaty projectile and covering a lot of ground in terrain and USmash creating a AOE damage over time hitbox. My main issue is that the DTilt is way too unconventional to be a DTilt, better suited as an alternative Special; additionally, the size of the laser on the non-Hadron DSpec isn’t actually stated. Ultimately, while I like Miraidon’s concepts notably more than Fang, I ultimately feel the lack of attention paid to the more intriguing applications of them means that they end up around the same level of quality in the end.

GOLDEN QUEEN (Salty)

Golden Queen has an actually fairly interesting set of Specials, with NSpec being essentially a ranged Egg Lay clone. While I do think that the range makes it a bit too obnoxious as an edgeguarding tool, it does still grant intangibility to the victim afterwards and I like the uses it has for damage racking. DSpec is the mechanical centerpiece, I feel, summoning a turret that fires projectiles to any foe that comes near. There’s actually a good bit of nuance to them mentioned in the set, with mention of using them to bait opponents into Golden Queen’s attacks or grabbing them when they shield the projectiles. I do believe that the fact that they have a hitbox on spawning is a bit too strong when combined with NSpec, though, and personally I’d be fine with removing the hitbox.

The rest of the set has a surprising amount of depth for something that was self-admittedly written intermittently in the span of a few days. FTilt is a poking tool where the angles allow it to shield poke that can also bait foes into getting into the range of turrets due to it being easy to jump over. DSmash is an incredibly slow move, but is very powerful in turn, and works well with Golden Queen’s ability to stun opponents with NSpec. The last move I feel like noting is FSmash, a long range projectile that actually has some good power to it. While the rest of the moves are very basic, none of them truly detract from the core; the main issue is just the fact that in a lot of cases the lag isn’t really specified. Despite that, Golden Queen still manages to reign supreme among the other sets by this author due to having the most interesting base without having any “true” weaknesses.

Link to full comment repository here!
 
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Katapultar

Smash Lord
Joined
Nov 24, 2008
Messages
1,257
Location
Australia
Better late than never!

  • “You’ve heard of heavyweight male antagonists, now get ready for heavyweight female antagonists. ” Oh, we’ve had a few HFAs before. Not too many, but still, we’ve had sets like Elder Princess Shroob.
  • “This is completely unrelated to how she fights, but when she is in Golden Plains her body attracts all the coins to herself. She doesn’t get affected by turning gold, ‘cause her other gimmick already works like if she got the gold effect you can obtain in that stage (Only to a degree though). But you can still annoy your friends with that, It only works until the coins respawn tho, after that the coins will work as normal.” This might be one of the funniest niche mechanics I’ve seen. It makes the set more memorable.
  • Neutral Special is a surprisingly cool grab state, because you can build up knockback on an opponent and let it accumulate for all kinds of different results. A bit like how knockback storage works with burying, but post-release intangibility means Golden Queen can’t get too ridiculous.

Golden Queen might have the most legitimately solid set of Specials among your sets, with Side Special and Down Special playing into zoning applications while Up Special is a committal attack that’s taken from her boss fight. I do like Down Special, but I think being able to have 3 turrets out is a bit much when just one of them is pretty potent. Can multiple turrets fire at the same time? The move also doesn’t mention the rate turrets fire at: for instance, there could be a 15 frame delay before they start firing at foes within their range (giving them time to react and get out of their line-of-fire), and they stop they won’t fire again for something like 2.5 seconds. Additionally, I think the falling turrets being a meteor smash is a bit strong for what is effectively a non-committal projectile option, especially when compared to your far more committal Up Special. Maybe they should just deal no knockback? That might no seem satisfying, but it can leave opponents within range of the turret when it lands and fires on them. To be fair, there is a lot of stuff to take into account with a move like this. It’s nice that Down Special has some applications listed for it at the end of the move, anyway.

  • Might be a bit advanced, but Jab’s low-angled knockback could potentially force tech chase scenarios against opponents.
  • F-tilt is a pretty good move, with some well-defined strengths and weaknesses and a few gameplay applications. The low-angled version says it semi-spikes, but I’m not sure whether it’s just for that variant or for the entire move.
  • The set’s Smashes are pretty good and play into Queen’s zoning. I like how D-Smash is this big power move that’s largely impractical, but finds a niche as a solid launcher out of Neutral Special.
  • “While in this animation opponents will be unable to move but they will gain an immunity to grab as to not make this move too spammable.” Worth noting that fighters receive one second of grab immunity after being grabbed in Smash 4 and Ultimate, so no need to worry about such balance precautions here.

Though she’s a fairly typical zoner at the end of the day, I think Golden Queen was put together well enough that’s she my favourite set of your so far, with non-Special moves that generally have some relevance to her main playstyle.
 

n88

Smash Lord
Joined
Oct 10, 2008
Messages
1,530
Dagded Dujardin by T TortoiseNotTurtle
I was having fun with the fourth wall breaking character intrusion, shame it disappears from the middle of the set (I assume due to time constraints, which I can't fault you for!). The gag in-character moveset at the end was a really fun way to close things out and sell Dagded, though, got a kick out of it. The idea that he doesn't actually understand what the numbers mean is a solid bit. You do a a strong job selling the character; past the writing, the set finds a lot of fun in its animations too. The mechanics feel a bit bare-bones though. There's enough there to be functional but not to really go above and beyond that. The inclusion of randomness on UTilt/DSpec is fun and I think used well here as something Dagded has to play around a bit. He does seem like he might be pretty strong to me since he's got a couple super fast up-close attacks - even if some of his big, flashy things are lacking up close, a couple crazy fast point-blank tools (Jab and DTilt are both pretty yoked) go a long way to flesh out a kit that has some big nasty tools in it. Recovery is a bit on the weak side I suppose (and that Fox level weight is unkind), but that's the only thing I really see working against him.
 

Hyper_Ridley

Smash Champion
Joined
Dec 21, 2007
Messages
2,291
Location
Hippo Island
Jamcomments Time

I have a feeling there's a Pokemon for every possible Jamcon theme one could think of. What does surprise me, is that this isn't Goldengho.

While a lot of internet culture focuses on Drifblim's spooky lore, I appreciate this moveset capturing its status as a cute balloon octopus. Ominous Wind is the perfect special, letting it float around just vibin', and do some combo shenanigans along the way. With FSmash it can even turn its wind tunnels into a roller coaster for enemies. USmash allowing it to deflate to dodge attacks is tempting me to spam it like Ken's Shoryuken in Street Figher. On a less cute note, I enjoyed Shadow Ball's implementation as a zepplin bombing run, and I forgot Drifblim could learn Explosion. Oh the hugh-Mantine...

It's a bit awkward that it can deliberately blow itself up to trigger Aftermath, considering Explosion is RIGHT THERE, but to be fair it seems more interesting in gameplay than to use up Explosion's input for a manual detonation. I didn't even know it had that Flare Boost ability, my Pokedentials aren't up to snuff.

Not a whole lot to say, he's a big crab who smashes stuff in a shiny way. The throws have gleefully brutal animations, and I like the big geyser specials. I don't really think he has more of a frontal focus than the typical platform fighter, especially when he has several spinny attacks and a fairly standard BAir, but he would be fun to pick and wreck things regardless. Respect for the character choice, I only saw Moana a year or so ago, but this dude was a show-stealer. Love the final smash.

This was a really good read, I could tell you were having a lot of fun writing it. I didn't realize how popular Woody Woodpecker was in Brazil; As Kat used to say, this moveset was fun and educational! There are also a few funny typos where something's range is described as "training mode stages". Wow, he can grab from across the entire training stage!

The ways he literally makes the other players pay him for basic mechanics is a really unique take on a "money meter" character. He's even got a pay-to-win outfit! This is what would happen if EA made a platformer fighter. I want to see Buzz and Fang in the same match; Fang oils a ledge, Buzz places his pricetag, the next poor sap who needs that ledge has to pay twice. Then they proceed to get Buzzsawed and Marvelous Queen'd to death anyway.

The one thing I'm iffy on is the "grab". MYM is no stranger to wacky animations for the actual grab, but this one has some logistical issues. What happens when he "grabs" someone if they're offstage? I'm thinking it might work out better like Fox and Falco, where their grab itself is still physical, but keeping the gunshots during the throws. To be fair, it is a nice excuse to give him a ZAir, that's somehow the one official mechanic MYM has trouble fitting in to our stuff.

After hearing Lethal Company mentioned in Discord a few times, this is my first time actually seeing one of its inhabitants. I like how its mostly attacking through improv with the items, managing to make a shotgun look cute, and how it can convert them into actual item pickups for any player. There's some potential for wacky 2v2 item-drop combos here, and I'm not just talking about the helper bug. Gotta love how, according to its mechanic description, a simple folding fan is worth more to it than a master ball.

I think this may have a bit too many things going on. It's got Peach's float, an Ice Climbers partner, and item storage all as innate mechanics. I guess it's trying to balance things with backfire potential, but with the noisy items it seems like there's a bunch of ways to just combo into Keller at a safe distance.

With the treasure theme this MYM thread seems to be having, we all know Hoarding Bug is the unsung hero in the story mode, who's been keeping the item that nullifies the big bad in their nest the whole time.

This is a wacky guy, even compared to the Power Ra- I mean Super Sentai stuff I grew up with. He just casually volleyball bumps a planet for Pete's sake, and that's a tilt! His gameplay is just as goofy, with all sorts of quirky zoning tools, including that volleyball planet having random airtime. One interesting nuance is how his FTilt is built around pushing himself back rather than enemies; It provides a way to reliably maintain range IF he doesn't back himself into a corner.

When I first saw the "Ultimate" moveset in the outline, I thought he was going to have some type of superstate, but what actually happens is far better. Love how this cosmic deity can't grasp the concept of frame data. It reminds me of playing with Legos with my brother and friend, and I'd be the one who had to reign in their OP characters.

That final smash would be great if it was following something like Supernova or Triforce Seal. Oh, he got an entire planet blown up, or sealed away with the powers of a literal Goddess? "That was annoying"

This was a pleasant surprise; Of the few actual comics by Marvel I've read, bits of Donny Cates' Venom is among them. The animations feel spot-on, in particular I love how the Symbiote dragons are incorporated throughout the set rather than just some token Final Smash animation. And of course, I approve of all the Ridley comparisons. Well, maybe not with DAir, but Knull's actually seems like an attack he'd want.

Gameplay-wise, it's cool how his smashes and specials play off each other with setting-up and paying out. An easy mistake with powerhouse characters is having a lot of redundant inputs in the quest for more damage, but Knull is encouraged to shift between 2 different sets of power moves depending on the phase of his set-play. It's almost like a stance change without actually changing movesets, and both stances are set to "big hits".

It's fitting how his summons are just kinda throwaway extras for him to use as organic C4. He can even "stick" it to other players and summons! I like how symbiote Pikmin and Luma are just casually mentioned in that section. Surprised there's no mention of what would happen if Venom were to receive symbiote status.

This is more funny than an actual flaw, but: How is his jab longer than the DThrow both inflicting a status AND summoning symbiotes? For that matter, jab is one of the longest inputs and DThrow might be the shortest :laugh:

It's been so long since I've seen anything related to Scooby-Doo that I didn't recognize this supposed iconic villain.

I love the details in the animations, and how subtle they'd be in actual gameplay. That smoke-and-mirrors stuff even translates well to gameplay, with a not-quite-Nana, floating wire traps, and invisible "teleport" markers. I can't believe Palutena's Temple is one big greenscreen!

Their gameplay is, naturally, all about the dirty setups. I had to read DSmash a few times to figure out what it actually did, but between that and Down Special we've got some real Scooby-Doo ZOINKS moments. BAir and FAir both feel wierdly brutal but also would be fun to go around using on everyone I see. My favorite input, however, is USmash. It just screams "old-school cartoon villain trap", and letting the main Shadow use it as a platform while the double holds it up is a nice touch.

The throws are perhaps where things are a bit too much. They've got a cargo throw with flight, a better K.Rool bury, and Mario's BThrow with extra versatility. It's like the moveset itself starts buying in to their grift. Guess we'll have to call over Shaggy and Velma from Multiversus limbo to bring them down a peg.


Overall, I think I need to hand it to Buzz Buzzard, for his cartoon platform scamming!
 

FazDude

Smash Master
Joined
Jan 26, 2021
Messages
3,079
Location
Wherever good books are sold.
The Giant Enemy Crab (Tamatoa by tunz tunz )
  • Right off the bat, making Tamatoa suspectible to enemies who can get behind him is a fun concept! His specials do a pretty solid job at conveying this idea, especially with Neutral Special being able to turn him around while remaining offensive. Same case with Down B, given how it only hits in front of Tamatoa and can't be reversed (at least, that's what I assume given the Roy/Chrom comparison).
  • Up Special is kinda wonky to me - It doesn't seem to be that great for an attack unless you're already very close to the top blast zone, where you would already have a few stronger options to work with. I like how it serves as a hitgrab, though.
  • Dash attack autoturning to face your opponent is a really fun concept, especially when combined with Tamatoa's back weakness.
  • Up and Down Smash only hitting in front of Tamatoa is another great show of his forward focus while being suspectible to those behind him. Same case goes for the strength of Fair and the weakness of Bair.
  • Overall, a fun moveset which captures Tamatoa's character in a very interesting way while also putting emphasis on a weakness of his without making it feel forced. A few rough patches with Up Special, but overall a great set!
For the sake of transparency, I will say that I was planning on doing more comments tonight beyond Tamatoa, but I think I need some rest after today. I plan to get back on the comment grind for real by Friday at absolute latest.
 

tunz

Smash Cadet
Joined
Sep 4, 2022
Messages
25
Jamcon 1 (Money) Comments!

-You've made Drifblim quite a bit smaller than I would have imagined, though I suppose Pokemon can be basically any size due to the fact that they're a species and not a single character, so I'm on board.

-The way USpec in general works and especially how it interacts with NSpec is fascinating. Drifblim seems like one of those fighters I'd play every now and then because I really want to get a cool set-up combo but ultimately have no clue what I'm doing, kinda like Pac-Man! USpec does last for a very long time though. Even Pac's Hydrant doesn't last as long as 15 seconds which makes me worry that Drifblim might have a little too much stage control using this. But then again, it is a bit tricky to set up and you have to sacrifice it for recovery sometimes, so maybe it's not a big deal.

-Explosion is an interesting move. The burn effect granting 1.25x damage and knockback is insanely strong, with Marth/Lucina counter only giving 1.2x and that's just for one move with a very specific requirement to come out and is heavily punishable. Drifblim's version lasts for 10 seconds and applies to every attack, with some attacks gaining other benefits too! Now yes, you did balance this out by making Drifblim take 25% (which is a LOT of damage, especially to such a light fighter) and I think that creates a very interesting dynamic in its kit. Risk dying super early in order to get a massive long-lasting buff. Very interesting to think about.

-Its aerials (and moves in general, but especially the aerials) flow very well together. They're cohesive and very easily understandable, something I greatly applaud and appreciate as someone who has a deal of trouble keeping my attention in one place for extended periods of time.

-Your color-coding of its various moves is great, with Ghost type or Ghost-adjacent moves being purple and Flying type or wind-adjacent moves being light blue just like in Pokemon! I get very clear ideas of what these moves would look like in my head, partially because of that.

-FAir is a very interesting move that I imagine would be very fun to play around with. I also imagine there’d be a lot of interesting and tricky set-ups involving sending people into NSpecs that are being directed around by USpec.

-Being able to cancel a multi-hit move like DTilt into itself before it’s even over could quickly create an infinite where you literally just spam DTilt and the opponent is never launched because a new one takes the place of the old one before the opponent is launched. I may have missed something specifying that this wouldn’t happen somewhere, but that could be pretty problematic nonetheless.

-Unique take on a Pokemon Final Smash, not using a big damaging move from Pokemon. I dig it.

-Overall, great set with a lot of cohesion and it genuinely seems like a very fun moveset to play around with! When it comes to my Jamcon ranking: 8/10.



-I love me a Heavyweight Male Antagonist with beefy melee hits, so this seems to be to my tastes!

-NSpec is a very interesting move to give to a heavy like this, I like it!

-SSpec follows suit, being an intricate combo tool that can also set up for edgeguards. Preparing for many a Yeet Smash clip using the Bucket Head. I do wonder if it travels maybe a little too fast, as it would practically be inescapable at higher percentages where a lot of characters would just be practically dead from how far they slide off-stage. But maybe I’m misjudging here.

-The helmet from DSpec could give a lot of interesting approach options and combo routes. Very interesting to think about.
-Funnily enough it seems we both made Jamcon sets that focus on keeping the enemy in front of you, though to varying degrees of importance and in different ways.

-Not sure if you know this and choose to go your own way, but Smash attacks all have a set rate of power-increase when you charge them, resulting in 1.4x the attack’s original power when fully charged. I noticed on FSmash and DSmash that the maximum damage numbers exceed what a 1.4x multiplier applied to the uncharged damage would do. Not a big knock against the set, just a little detail really.

-In the Back Throw section, I’d probably list some imagined combo routes you could get at the mid-percentages you state that it would be a combo throw during.

-Overall, a very silly and charming set for a character I literally didn’t even know existed until I opened the document. You did a good job conveying personality and character, and it felt like you had a good core gameplay feel here. As for my Jamcon ranking: 7.5/10.



-Floaty being listed as both a pro and con is surprisingly funny, even if I don’t think you intended for it to be as funny as I found it.

-”Smokes the hookah” is up there for the best line in any moveset I’ve read.

-I like the decision to let the opponent have a sort of safe haven from taxes in their Smash Attacks. It still heavily limits them for sure, but it doesn’t make the game unplayable for them.

-I can just imagine a Bowser that’s been using USpec out of shield a bit too much, and watching Buzz angrily slap a Specials Tax on him.

-I like that FTilt is a pretty simple move, giving Buzz a staple normal to throw out in various situations. I also really like the effect from The Old Panther, making it similar to Captain Falcon’s UTilt for example. Really good touch and I love me an impractical yet exciting spike.

-You mention using UTilt out of shield, and correct me if I’m wrong, but at least in Ultimate, that isn’t possible. OoS options like USpec and USmash are possible because they cancel your jump out of shield during the jumpsquat frames, and tilts cannot do that. You would have to drop shield, then UTilt for this to work, although it could probably still work in some cases due to the speed of this move.

-The decision to give him a mechanic that punishes and limits the enemy’s recovery when Buzz himself is pretty good at knocking people off-stage is one I can definitely rock with. Very interesting dynamic, especially since he can harm his own game with it.

-Not sure if you know about this, but Smash Attacks universally have a damage and knockback multiplier that gradually increases as you charge the move, capping out at 1.4x. Buzz’s Smash Attacks’ damage numbers are slightly off of this mark. FSmash would have 21-29,4%, USmash would have 20-28% and DSmash would have 21-29,4% as well. Of course, if this was a deliberate decision you can always say that Buzz’s multipliers work differently, but I thought I should point this out just in case. Overall not a big knock against the set at all, just a little detail I find many people don’t actually know.

-Grab, Pummel and Zair are certainly interesting and unique concepts, the likes of which I haven’t seen before. I like them, don’t get me wrong.

-I was delighted to see Junkrat and Tamatoa in Buzz’s Classic Mode, thank you very much for including them!! :D

-Overall, a fun and memorable moveset! Buzz is way out of my league in terms of skill required to play him optimally, but I can’t help but feel like I would choose him every now and then to try to pull off a devious money-making scheme just for the fun of it. And when it comes to my Jamcon ranking: 8.3/10.



-I suspect Jab may be potentially very strong on walk-offs, but it’s not like moves like that don’t already exist. (cough cough cargo throw cough cough)

-FTilt’s name is hilarious. Just, wow.

-I love just how much of Lethal Company you’ve managed to include in this set, from an incredibly diverse amount of the items available, as well as other monsters as well.

-Being able to swap places with your companion bug while charging USmash is very cool and a great benefit to having a buggy buddy with you.

-Locking healing your buddy behind landing a grab and having to use a specific throw is probably a good idea, seeing as they could have as much as 120HP. Good call there.

-In the third paragraph of FAir you (I believe) mistakenly refer to it as FTilt, thought that I’d point that out in case you didn’t know and would like to fix it.

-I love the taunts, victory theme and animations, even the applause pose is amazing and full of personality for such a typically basic enemy. The costumes are also clever and fun references to important tools in its kit and things you didn’t include in a move like the flashlight.

-Overall: Very fun set. Full of interesting mechanics, unique and cleverly designed moves that correlate heavily and have a lot of interactions with each other, faithful and thought out inclusions from Lethal Company and above all in my book, characterization and personality. Yes, it’s a little here-and-there and a bit messy sometimes, but accounting for the slack I’m cutting you due to the Jamcon time restraints, and the fact that I mostly still understood everything you tried to communicate, I wouldn’t say it’s a big hit against the set. As for the Jamcon rating: 8.7/10.



-Okay, the battle between the writer and Dagded is very fun and likely something I may try my hand at if any future character choices from me make sense for it. Already you’ve made some bonus points from that.

-The use of images to have Dagded’s narration in wackier spots like scrawled over yours at an angle is clever. Not something I would have thought of doing, so props for that.

-The crouch got a “woah” out of me. Very unique and interesting.
-FThrow and BThrow are interesting, but slightly confusing. I think I get the gist of them though.

-You could mention which moves in particular you could “get the kill” with out of DThrow. I imagined DSmash, but there may be other applications as well that you could explore slightly further.

-The doc-hopping ‘vote’ at the end is a really brilliant idea and it felt obvious yet mind-blowing at the same time. Great stuff with the meta insights in this, seriously!

-Overall, an extremely charismatic and personality-filled document with a bunch of characterization, which is important since this is a character I assume not too many people know intimately, including me. I do however miss a liiiittle more in-depth and explored applications of moves and stuff, but I’ll cut that a lot of slack since this was under a time constraint after all. I’ll give it a ranking of 7.9/10.



-”Tipping the scales at just 95 (weight) units” I caught that subtle Robin “time to tip the scales” reference! Very clever word usage.

-”The thing only comes out on frame 32, which you might recognize as ‘****ing slow’” got me good, I’ll give you that.

-As a norwegian (I live right next to Sweden and our languages are pretty much identical) knull does in fact mean “the act”, “doing the boinkydoink”, “sex” and other synonyms in both swedish and norwegian. Good knowledge there.

-Pocketing the void dragon is a really funny concept and I really want to see Isabelle send one out from her pocket dimension now.

-Does the symbiote takeover mechanic work on the second Ice Climber? Potentially a 90/10 matchup for Knull there.

-Damn, SSpec is… long. Cool move with a lot of different applications though.

-Killing Jabs are always welcome and appreciated. Interesting use-cases and mind-games related to the finisher as well.
-Limiting Knull’s fastest move behind a positioning-specific set-up resource is a good idea for this kind of archetype. Smart decision there.

-His aerials all feel very appropriate. I will admit it took me a couple seconds to comprehend NAir not having air stall from the wing-’flap’ but that’s a me-issue, not an issue with the writing. I got it eventually.

-The flavor writing (which is sometimes interwoven with practical info) is very charming and often manages to crack a smile or a chuckle from me. Keeps things fun in times of huge text-blocks.

-”Gremlin damage” is a phrase that I will now be using, thank you.

-The lack of any extras at all does slightly hurt this set, I will say. Still, it’s an overall fun and very understandable set with interesting mechanics and just cool moves scattered throughout. I think I’ll give it a ranking of 8.9/10.



-Really low traction just makes sense for a Scooby Doo character. It fits the vibe and in this case fits the gameplan as well.

-I do think you should probably have led with USpec instead of NSpec, given that you mention that the second Shadow is in “the USpec state” in both the intro and the NSpec section. The reader, at both these points, would have no clue what that means at all. They can assume and probably be somewhat correct, and sure, they will learn slightly later, but I think it would still be an overall improvement on the comprehension of the reader, if a relatively small one. I’d at the very least encourage moving USpec to the second move right after NSpec if nothing else.

-DSmash is a very unique and complex move. I like all the different uses a typically filler/shoe-in moveslot has in this set! The confusing language is confusing though that is what you intended and you play it off for laughs which does work. I like that decision and it did make me chuckle once or twice.

-This set seems like one for the Gigabrain Gamers out there, kinda like Pac-Man or Steve. The Specials and Smashes alone are enough to confirm that to me.

-In UTilt you mention its use out of shield. Correct me if I’m wrong but I don’t think that is possible, at least un Ultimate. Unless you mean dropping shield and then using the move.

-Dash Attack feels very appropriate for a Scooby Doo character. Goofy and fun.

-The aerials all seem to be pretty thought out in terms of use-cases, combo routes, etc. These are the highlight of the set to me because they show your competence and comprehensiveness.

-The sheer magnitude and amount of different traps, set-ups, tools and tricks the Phantoms have at their disposal is impressive and sound really fun to play around with. As I mentioned earlier, it sounds like one of those Gigabrain sets I’d see a really cool combo or set-up for and try it myself only to fail miserably.

-I will say the same thing I said for Knull, that the lack of extras does hurt this set somewhat in my eyes. I see you’ve planned on and want to add them, but they aren’t there at my time of finishing the set at least. Still though, not the biggest deal. A well thought-out set full of interesting and complicated mechanics. I am impressed you whipped this up within such a short timeframe, so with all that said I’ll give it a ranking of 8.5/10.


For those of you keeping track, this means that the top 3 sets on my list this Jamcon are:
(drumroll please)
3: Phantom Shadow by US with a spooky 8.5 points!
2: Hoarding Bug by Goliso, who hoarded 8.7 points!
1: A huge round of applause for Knull by n88, forming 8.9 black gooey points from his own body!

Thanks to everyone who submitted and waited patiently for me to finish reading! Every set submitted was entertaining in wildly different ways and I liked them all a lot! It was very difficult to decide as you can see by how close the points were. I mean, the range was only from 7.5 to 8.9! That’s really close so good job to everyone!

So, if it wasn’t clear enough already, my vote goes to Knull by n88.

Also, thanks to everyone who read/commented Tamatoa!
 

FazDude

Smash Master
Joined
Jan 26, 2021
Messages
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Wherever good books are sold.
Spectres Squared (Phantom Shadow by U UserShadow7989 )
  • Already catching my eye with an interesting choice from Scooby-Doo; I feel like a lot of the villains from the series could fit a money theme, so I appreciate a less obvious pick.
  • Being able to summon the second Phantom Shadow from a held attack is a really fun concept and I can see it leading into all sorts of crafty madness and fun chases, which I feel is pretty appropiate for the Scooby-Doo series. Combining that with their ability to do smashes and grabs, and you have a really big brain fighter! The smaller details, such as the Phantom being able to be KO'd and unable to use items, are also interesting facets which add some extra cerebral aspects.
  • Being able to "record" a string for the second Phantom is ingenious and something I can see being fun to work with in just about any scenario.
  • I do agree that you probably should have led with U-Spec given how emphasized the second Phantom's U-Spec state is.
  • D-Special is a nice versatile trap that works really well with the tap/hold relationship between the two phantoms.
  • The aerials are also really fun and sell the idea of a more theatric Scooby villain. The highlights for me are Down Smash and Down Air, but the throws are also pretty fun with the idea of "whoops, didn't mean to grab, what now".
  • Overall, a pretty fun set which captures the spirit of Scooby-Doo while standing on its own as a highly cerebral, yet rewarding character!
Ain't That the Cyclops from the SpongeBob Movie? (Treasure Knight by majora_787 majora_787 )
  • Making Treasure Knight's waterlogging a stat-changing mechanic is a fun way to interpret his fight in Shovel Knight - I can see it being both helpful and hindering depending on the circumstances, which encourages a more varied playstyle.
  • Neutral Special is pretty straightforward, but I like how it acts as a sort of trap while waterlogged while still retaining its normal functionality after the fact. Goes well with its bouncing mechanics, too (especially when U-Smash joins the mix).
  • Waterlogged Side Special is great synergy with Neutral Special. Great set-up potential!
  • Waterlogged Up Special is a fun mixup tool given all the facets like the bubble bouncing and retaining of midair jumps.
  • The basics are interesting - A lot of fun ideas like Jab and Dash Attack animation-wise. I didn't get the purpose of Forward Smash at first, but my mind was actually blown by the Treasure Chest setup. Genius stuff.
  • Up Air making you go up is a cool idea, especially given how its usefulness depends on whether or not Treasure Knight is waterlogged or not. I also like its functionality with Back Air.
  • Overall, a stellar set with a lot of fun ideas banking off a unique mechanic which is a genius adaptation of one of the character's most iconic traits. Great work, and thanks for the reminder to continue my Shovel Knight campaign!
 

n88

Smash Lord
Joined
Oct 10, 2008
Messages
1,530
Phantom Shadow by U UserShadow7989
This is a pretty solid set and generally my favorite of the jamcon so far. I think my biggest criticism is that a lot of the Specials really don't get into speed or safety, so it's a bit hard to grok the shape of Phantom Shadow's set-up game. Can he do a cheeky program or trap door, or does he need a lot of space? How easy is it to connect with SSpec? It's sometimes hard to get a sense of the finer points of his gamefeel. (Also NSpec really cries out for... some kind of visual cue of what's happening, this feels like a really obtuse input to use if picking up the set blind).

Despite that, the set has a decent hook, carving out a distinct niche for Phantom Shadow as a combo fella who has just enough awkward weaknesses and lag to give him trouble if you're not leveraging his double in a smart way. And his Specials being almost all non-combat moves doesn't do him any favors in the "options" department, which again pushes him toward leaning on the double; kind of a subtle-but-fun effect of the 4D Chess all-admin Specials section. I don't necessarily have a ton to say about most of the normals (especially since I got two more Jamcons to read whoops), but they do a good job building on his core.

USmash ended up being a highlight of the set for me, my favorite input by a wide margin. DSmash's teleport is neat and all, but I'm a bigger fan of the way USmash finds a really fun application of the way the second Phantom charges Smashes, and marries it neatly with the goofy Scooby-Doo sensibility. The play around it is very funny to think about; these kinds of cartoony characters are an archetype you always do really well with and this is the set at its strongest.

Random number nitpick but 2 Units is probably a bit too tight a range on SSpec's tether effect for what you're going for; the melee moves feel pretty well designed around the tightness of the range (shout out to USmash and DAir), but on the other hand, it's hard for breaking the tether to have a tactical application when it's so small that the characters will just separate off a stray hit or unintentionally moving in opposite directions. Either character rolling away from the other is also just about always gonna break the chain (unless the opposite character is moving in to stop that from happening - the game's shortest back roll is just over 2.5). I'm also not sure if it's great that the opponent doesn't really get a way out of it once landed, though maybe that could be justified if the attack is hard enough to land.

I did get a bit lost in DSmash - I think the "Used the way you normally would" cue at the start of that one paragraph just didn't quite clue me into the context that "normal" meant charging and charging meant the second Phantom was using it, so therefore player Phantom was the one getting teleported. Ended up rereading the earlier parts of the attack a time or two to figure out what I was missing. Peeped some of the other comments and saw that this attack being confusing was kind of a common thread so I imagine you're already on it; but I'd wager a better transition from the prior paragraph into this one would solve the attack's woes.
  • I did kinda wonder if Dash Attack should just work like the Smashes for the second Phantom Shadow? Though that's also a bit more awkward than the smashes control-wise by virtue of input placement. It feels a bit more organic than BAir to me in the "lingering hitbox" category, generally dig the input.
  • "how obnoxiously good his own out of shield options are" - are they? I clocked NAir as probably pretty good, but didn't get the vibe he had a ton else going on.
  • DThrow is very fun, great flavor on the animation.
Drifblim by Arctic Tern Arctic Tern
Kinda going rapid-fire mode here to knock comments out and get to sleep at a reasonable hour so uh.... bullet points it is.
  • Heck yeah, shield break explosion.
  • "Jumping out of the stream will leave Drifblim with its four midair jumps, regardless of its position on stage." - did take me a second to grok what this implied given it's not meant to refresh jumps, but I think the takeaway is that "jumping" out of the stream doesn't consume a jump? At least in the case where Drifblim gets carried off the ground by it, presumably that can't work if it enters the stream from the air or it could stall.
  • USpec fun, always dig when a recovery is also associated to something else and that's used to gate certain things in a character's kit.
  • Electric Blimp God Fist
  • FAir damage seems meaty relative to its speed though I guess at least the range is kinda puny.
  • "the afterlife, i.e. the upper and lower blast zones" - the side blast zones of course lead to purgatory and other limbo dimensions where souls do not permanently reside.
  • FAir should get an animation twiddle under the Explosion buff. Just some fire in the miasma or w/e.
  • Surprise FSmash hard interaction! Generally quite like FSmash, Ganon UTilt style suction is a fun effect.
  • "Unfortunately, the startlag means that it comes out too late to be an OoS option" - this is a bit off-base IMO. You've got it intangible on 4-19, which is just as fast to start as the average roll and lasts a bit longer (plus leads almost immediately into an attack with low endlag). I'd say the narrow hitbox is what holds it back from being a be-all end-all OoS option, the speed is just fine considering.
  • DSmash again just needs a lil visual indicator for the Explosion buff - I'd consider giving it some common visual identity with FAir that marks it out from the rest of Drifblim's moves even outside Explosion too. So that there's a lil "X move looks like Y move, X move has interaction..." breadcrumb trail.
    • I'm not gonna keep saying this if there are more attacks where this holds true but y'know, general advice.
  • Spiritually I'm still counting UTilt as a spiking UAir.
  • Tern sets this contest really going wacky with status effects. FThrow's smash punish thing probably workable with some kind of visual indicator though. Something that amps up during the opponent's startlag/charge and then goes off when they actually land the attack.
    • Probably beating this drum a lot, but just... "give attacks helpful animations" is some of my biggest advice that people lose track of a bit sometimes in MYM, I do it too.
  • Love BThrow, "smack the foe down into the stage but it can conditionally miss the stage" is a very funny genre of throw and the conditions on this one are very silly.
  • Generally really dig the set, most of my issues are quibbles and this is leaning into a lot of tropes I'm a sucker for. I think you and I stray into similar conceptual territory sometimes (possibly just a result of your absurd output giving you a degree of Simpsons Did It factor?) and this is very much a set after my own heart. Recalls Broken Vessel in a couple ways.
Tamatoa by tunz tunz
Again, pardon the rapid-fire bullet points comment.
  • Didn't expect this guy to be Jemaine Clement.
  • "a lot of his body would be in the unhittable Z-axis." - MYMX movesets eatin' good tonight.
  • Ah, heavier than Bowser, you love to see it.
  • I like SSpec in premise but it could maybe feel a bit more... Special? Idk, nothing wrong with a simple one but I wish it felt more prominent in the kit even if not flashy unto itself.
  • Was thinking the startlag on a charged DSpec could decrease more than it does, what with needing to charge so dang much, but then read on to find out it got superarmor, which forgives a little startlag.
  • Generally a big fan of DSpec, always enjoy a big chunky charge effect. Also a sucker for a move that happens on the ground even when the character is in the air.
  • DSpec does kinda sound like it's implying different-sized shields have different HP, which isn't a thing? Might be me misreading it though.
  • Yeah I don't think there are attacks in the game that specifically have autoturn during their endlag, that's a fun little twiddle for him since he's sensitive to cross-ups.
  • Always a big fan of a real-strong DSmash that only hits to one side.
  • UAir that sends down, love to see it.
  • "amounting to 14.4% if my 2AM calculations are correct." - big jamcon energy.
  • Super small note but I like the detail that he's symmetrical. I don't always note it in my sets but it is something I think about here and there.
  • Overall Tamatoa is pretty solidly designed; he knows what he's going for and has the right kinds of attacks for it. I'd probably like him more if he got a little wilder or a little more in-depth here or there, but I can't complain too much about the guy either.
  • Found myself kinda wishing he had some more unga-bunga rush-in type attacks that could maybe send him past the opponent for some higher-risk maneuvers?
With a tip of the hat to Phantom Shadow, gotta go Drifblim for my jamcon vote, definitely the set I was most into as I was reading this jamcon.
 
Last edited:

UserShadow7989

Smash Journeyman
Joined
Aug 13, 2007
Messages
306
Hinyari by Hyper_Ridley Hyper_Ridley

While the set is built to be simple and play on fundamentals, it still provides multiple interesting aspects that tie into each other nicely- the helmet is the obvious one, with a weakness to cross-ups and a lack of hitboxes hitting above Hinyari without it giving him a non-traditional weakness to play around, but not the only one.

Movement options among the inputs, Neutral Special allowing him to add armor to any non-special input, the various ways he causes or deals with tech chases, the counter-esque down smash and potential ohko Forward Smash all give the set quite a bit of depth. His Side Special minion bucketheads are the primary thing that strikes me as not connected, but that's something of the point; their benefit is good enough in a vacuum and acts simply as a means to keep opponents from exploiting his heavyweight appropriate frame data and weaknesses while potentially setting him up for an easy cheap-shot if he does well enough.

It's a light read, but a very fun one that played to my nostalgia; nicely done!


Drifblim by Arctic Tern Arctic Tern

Funny enough, Drifblim also is a set that makes excellent use of movement effects and has a Down Special buff, though that's where similarities end. Ominous Wind, Shadow Ball, Phantom Force, and Explosion make for a fun and tricky core- Aftermath as a mechanic being the extra twist that's simple in concept but changes how people would have to approach fighting it.

Of them, Ominous Wind steals the show; allowing use of its various attacks in motion or even in the air from the ground, redirecting the normally down-only Shadow Ball, expanding the hitbox of a smash, and more. That's not to dismiss the others; Explosion has some fascinating secondary effects on a few inputs, Aftermath has a surprise interaction with Forward Throw (being an interesting interpretation of Destiny Bond), and the air-heavy focus of the set with a weakness to shields and a trade of easier vertical kos at the cost of poor horizontal ko options makes for a unique playstyle blend that ties it all together nicely.

I'd love to try playing a character like this someday- or at least dream up how its match-ups with some of my own aerially-inclined sets would play out. It's given me the itch to do another Pokeset, to be honest, which is funny timing given we just passed Pokemon day.

Small Typo in Down Throw: "At low percents, this is a worse combo throw than BAir"


Tamatoa by tunz tunz

A fabulous character choice, and my personal introduction to him and the movie from which he hails- and quite a pleasant introduction at that! He makes an excellent impression despite his limited screen time, and encouraging a view of his song number did help quite a bit in abridging the explanations for animations in the set. It's always fascinating when people take a character who maybe doesn't stick around long in their source material and stretches it out to make a strong impression.

Tamatoa has a simple design goal: staying large and in charge when he succeeds in keeping foes where he can see them, and suffering if they manage to escape his notice and catch him from behind. A nice way of embodying what happens in his portion of the story, and conveying his single-minded focus on all things shiny. He has a few rotating attacks and ways to turn about in a pinch to give him some means of covering his back, and Back Aerial is of course an attack that hits behind him, but crossing him up still serves as a notable weakness as intended- quite nicely handled.

For as simple as the set is, it still has a few moves that leave a notable impression- Down Special is a stand out favorite of mine, and Up Aerial brings back good memories of older MYM sets (kind of crazy that 'Up Aerial is actually a grab hitbox that throws/drags opponents down' managed to be a trope for us but that's the place old MYM was). Though of course, it feels far more justified and sensible here in terms of characterization, mechanical execution, and playstyle.

I hate to leave off with such short comments, but this one is a pretty straightforward set- not much to complain about from a surface reading, and numerical nitpicks are out of my wheelhouse so I can only say everything seemed reasonable there. Nicely done!


Buzz Buzzard by BrazilianGuy BrazilianGuy

On the other end of the spectrum, Buzz Buzzard is a classic slapstick comedy cartoon character and makes dang well sure you know it with the hilarious and high energy animations and cartoon logic therein. FThrow and UThrow are two of my favorites there.

Buzz is an ambitious set for a Jamcon, Buzz is all about the main theme of the hour: moolah, dough, bread, filthy lucre, cash, bucks, loot, treasure, scratch- or if you want to be really obscure, money. This isn't the first time we've seen a money mechanic, a certain other con artist set in 25 did as well, but Buzz has more focused and more zany uses for it (which is impressive).

The assorted ways Buzz can accumulate those liquid assets all push the opponent into a lose/lose situation; he can set up a tax for certain sections of their set and receive funds for every use, put up a toll on the ledges of platforms, or just rough them up for some spare change. Notably, he does still need to actually engage the opponent to make bank- he can't just sit back and let his wallet get fat, as it's gained through both him and his opponents actively doing things rather than a passive gain.

And he does just fine in that regard, balanced how one would hope. Aside from Up Aerial, which is not exactly a one-size-fits-all input he can use everywhere, most of his set is either situational, or is on the weaker side until he lines his pockets and/or spends at his own store. There's enough options to make for interesting decisions mid-match without bogging players down with twenty different things to weigh; just three upgrades, one for better recovery, one for stronger attacks, and one for an all around buff that improves other attacks too, and the benefit of just having money on him for other moves. Since he retains half his stash when KOed but loses upgrades, he might also be inclined to set aside for his impromptu retirement and sudden return to the workforce thereafter instead of spending at the end of his current stock, with obvious trade-offs there, too.

If I HAD to nitpick I would've liked if Down Tilt maybe hit harder if he did land it, giving it a niche on stages without notable ledges- the current combination of slow, limited reach, and not that impressive pay-off without actually getting paid makes the input feel dead on some stages. But that's hardly a deal breaker.


Hording Bug by GolisoPower GolisoPower

Item-based sets are always a treat, and I do so love when that's paired with a Nana-like partner for maximum shenanigans. The nest serving to both safely store your attacks for later in the form of useful items and produce a partner if you build enough of a stash up is a fun little cornerstone for the set's playstyle, as well as the appearance of a dangerous but inconsistent hitbox with noisy items in particular that can make the otherwise extra-points-sized Hording Bug less easy to punt over the blast zone with rushdown tactics.

The vast collection of items never feels too overwhelming, having simple values and effects that can play off of each other in fun little ways, while happily conveying the sheer raw comedy that Lethal Comedy embodies underneath the horror venear. It nicely conveys the little nusiance that can become a big problem if not handled in the appropriate way, the Hording Bug being easily KOed if the opponent approaches them correctly, but proving to be an evasive little bugger in the right hands.

Helping this is the surprising level of stage control the Hording Bug can exert; Side Special's big bouncing projectile, the Beehive being a damage-racking area denial tool, the aforementioned Noisy items serving as a proverbial dinner bell for the Eyeless Dog who could show at any moment, and eventually a desync-able partner who can make additional use of those same items littering the set. It's a great little ball of controlled chaos, and I'm always a fan of that.

Nitpicks: "So you can try to poke somebody with this attack, and even if you dodge or hit their shield you can still create some distance by." In second paragraph of Side Smash; I assume it's "even if they dodge" and you meant to cut the "by" at the end. Second paragraph or FAir also refers to itself as FTilt near the end.


Dagded Dujardin by T TortoiseNotTurtle

Clearly the second set was the best.

Jokes aside, this set does a wonderful job of establishing who this nutball is and the threat they present, from a well-written bit of back and forth and a clear backstory, to creative and clever animations that demonstrate the immature and mocking nature of the villain.

The latter extends even to the character's mechanics, with several of his moves forgoing a direct assault and doing no damage or knockback (F/BThrow and UAir to name a couple) or giving it a slight randomness to the effect (UTilt and DSpec). Each has a reasonable function for its placement to never leave him truly without a crucial tool, mind, and use of these inputs often leads to a different, powerful attack in a manner that gives the impression of an overwhelmingly strong being toying with his victims- exactly in line with the set's mission statement.

The inputs themselves are simple and broken down in easy to comprehend manner, with flashy animations backed by perfectly functional mechanics. The set doesn't over-complicate things, but it still has some very fun inputs. Side Special jived with me in particular; I love the ways to make use of the floating blades, from combo extenders to spacial control to equippable weapon to making them act as projectiles once more, all with a control scheme that imposes limits on you while they're active to keep them from being too insane- you're denied your specials and your shield while they're active if you want to just leave them hanging in place to bounce foes off of, and being forced to shield or failing to give them up after some time will leave you with a nasty cooldown.

Even the use of the Special button to perform another Special triggering the projectile function has fun applications in combinations with said Specials- it was an unexpected treat and may well be may favorite individual input in a Jamcon with a LOT of fun ones. I'm sorely tempted to crib off of this for a remake I've been meaning to get to.

If I had to nitpick something- and I feel like I should try given how little advice I've actually had to give through these comments- maybe add a tiny bit of damage to FThrow/BThrow? I get their intended purpose and the nice little mind game they present, it's a cool idea, but I feel weird not having something off of the throw itself. Maybe he taps them on the shoulder (and zaps them with magical energy in the process) after teleporting behind them? I kind of love them the way they are, though.


Knull by n88 n88

After Venom Strange from the last contest (...wait, no it was 25, not 26- man, it feels more recent), seeing a sizable set tackling the symbiotes once more in a Jamcon set of your making was pretty exciting, and Knull didn't disappoint. He presents that traditional Heavyweight Male Antagonist energy we at MYM all know and love, with a set of powerful blows hindered by start up and blindspots galore but more than capable of obliterating foes in a few good hits.

Separating him from all the rest are the void and his creations, the symbiotes; his Smashes are high risk and high reward, but even if they don't hit the opponent, they leave a massive spread of black goop across the landscape that empowers his entire set in various deadly way. His Specials boast multiple charge-able options that push beyond their normal, more functional and sane uses into Falcon Punch-style impractical but awesome finishers, made less impractical by the level of stage control he can exert (and subvert, when faced with MYM-style minions) and the terrifying range he boasts for some of his attacks.

While a few such buffs are extra spice and damage, the majority are added effects that pile on some interesting wrinkles to the affected inputs that nevertheless fall in line with the original moves' intended purposes in a way that prevents their use cases from getting too over-complicated. Softer interactions like Dash Attack specifically helping him zip back to a patch of Void are present as well, keeping everything functioning within reason. The more general number increases are still alluring and prevalent enough to make it worth interacting with, though I do wish he had an input or two more that would be buffed by it but not use it up so he'd have a little more leeway in spending it.

I think my favorite inputs are Down Special and Down Throw. In the former case, the hitbox locking on to symbiotes within a small range from where it normally appears is a fun hard interaction, making it dangerous to pick off the otherwise frail if dangerous mooks. As for Down Throw, he already had a source of minions, but setting them all (including a pair that appear at the edges of the platform he's on) to be hyper-aggressive for a period in exchange for the throw itself leaving him in a tight spot short-term is such a fun little detail- though like Dagded I'm simultaneously loving it as is and wondering if it needs a little damage or something.

This set hits a lot of my favorite notes; minions, stage effects, hard interactions, etc, but doesn't feel like it'd be hard to track in gameplay. If I had to nitpick, a few more moves that didn't consume void but benefited from it passively would be cool, allowing you to put off spending it for a moment to get a better pay out, but I could see that being an intentional choice for balance/flavor reasons.



My vote for this Jamcon goes to Knull by n88 ; Hoarding Bug and Buzz Buzzard are close honorable mentions, and everyone's sets had a strong appeal here, but I feel that nate pulled out the win here.
 

BridgesWithTurtles

Smash Champion
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The long road to nowhere
3DS FC
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Well, another Mar10 Day has come and passed. Nintendo have had their fun mass-promoting the series that needs promotion less than any other in their portfolio, but now that it's all done with and wrapped up, I've got something I've been waiting to say.

"Hey, Plumber Boy! Mustache Man! Your worst nightmare has arrived!"
crash the party.png
"Check it out! Whattaya think about that?"
 

FazDude

Smash Master
Joined
Jan 26, 2021
Messages
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Location
Wherever good books are sold.
SKYLANDERS SET POGS (Golden Queen by SaltySuicune SaltySuicune )
  • Pretty simple mechanics, but reasonable.
  • Neutral Special is really cool with its accumulation of knockback - Kinda reminds me of how a BoTW Link mod for Rivals of Aether did something similar with stasis. It's a really fun tradeoff for being unable to directly damage a statue'd opponent.
  • Side B is also a neat tool - Having the animation be identical between both variants is a cool instance of mindgames.
  • Up B being high risk/reward feels pretty appropiate, and the instant shield break sounds brutal, if just a bit broken.
  • Five blades for each Down Special turret sounds like a bit much in all honesty, especially given their range and how you can have three turrets out at once - Maybe whittle it down to three of 'em with lesser range. Still great for pressuring and conditioning opponents, though.
  • I like how the normal attacks are set up to play into Golden Queen's zoning strengths in unique ways, such as Down Smash playing off her Down B while being incredibly situational otherwise and Bair.
  • Overall, a pretty solid set with a solid gameplan and execution while still sounding very fun to play with. Great work!
Alright, I've cleaned up my to-do list when it comes to pre-Jamcon sets I really wanted to look at, so I can say with a certain degree of certainity that my next moveset will begin development! I'll try to keep up with comments (I'm gonna loop back to Bridges' Knuckles, and they just released Crash yknow I gotta read that), but that'll be my priority regarding MYM until it's ready.
 
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Katapultar

Smash Lord
Joined
Nov 24, 2008
Messages
1,257
Location
Australia
I wasn’t expecting you to jump on board the Sony Ship and make a set for Crash Bandicoot, but it makes a lot of sense given your penchant for making video game protagonists. I’ve played most of the Crash games and the original trilogy were my childhood, so I can relate to Crash Bandicoot as a character pick and understand his source material a lot more than your previous sets. That just means I can bring up such details in my comment.

  • Giving Crash low air friction is a smart move, requiring players to be precise with their landings just like in the games.
  • I’m a fan of showcasing some of Crash’s basic idle and movement animations in the form of GIFs.
  • I was half-expecting the Quantum Masks from Crash 4 to be somewhere on Crash’s Specials to give him a big chunk of moveset potential, but his line-up of Specials still make perfect sense and stick to the “classic” Crash feel one would expect if he was in Smash.

With that being said, Spin is the perfect choice for Crash’s Neutral Special. I didn’t expect this move to have such short active frames, as Crash’s spin lingers for a decent moment when you use it in his games, but it makes sense to give it short active frames to balance out its speed. It captures the timing-based essence of his game, and I like the fact that the spin can be out-prioritized because there are hitboxes that can beat it out in his games. And, of course, you nail the spin’s cartoony knockback traits from the games.

This isn’t a complaint at all, but design-wise you could be justified with making Crash’s Spin his Side Special. While Spin is his signature move, which is normally where Neutral Specials go, putting it on his Side Special would allow players to maintain their momentum when they go to input the move, which would match how Crash can spin while he’s moving around in his games (though I don’t think he can spin while he’s sprinting in Crash 3?). This came to mind because Bubby’s Scout moveset from last contest put Scout’s shotgun on his Side Special rather than his Neutral Special with this in mind, to mimic how TF2 characters can move around as they fire their weapons (from my understanding). Crash’s current Side Special would even make sense as a Neutral Special input, given it’s a conventional projectile and has aiming properties.

  • Extremely minor nitpick: I wonder if Wumpa Fruit should have their healing cut down from 10% to something like 4%.
  • I like the dynamic of Crash being able to use his spin to easily knock foes into TNT or Nitro crates, exactly like in the Crash Bandicoot games.
  • I think that aerial crates should disappear over a set time like other third party Smash recoveries that leave constructs, especially with the aerial iron crate as fighters can bonk their head on it. Might be annoying if a Crash player accidentally sets an Up Special crate somewhere where it’s difficult to dispose of or they have to go through the trouble of whipping out the ! crate. I do like how Down Special influences what type of crate you can pop out with Up Special, though.
  • I’m a big fan of the attack names in this set. They sound exactly like level names from the games (like Crash and Burn, Droid Void, etc.), and I have little doubt that’s the approach you were going for.
  • Slide makes perfect sense for Crash’s Down Tilt. Didn’t know he had that flip kick follow-up as a thing in his games - I’m guessing it’s from the Skylanders games? The move’s various perks remind me of Amy Rose’s Dash Attack, and I have to keep telling myself that it’s a Down Tilt and not a Dash Attack.

  • Forward Smash’s animation rocks. I’m a fan of a non-Special attack using up Crash’s Down Special charge like his Up Special, but in a way that makes sense from the attack’s animation. The Nitro Crate is my favourite of the bunch, as it’s unhinged like Crash himself and I like moves that deal self-damage and knockback. I wonder if the TNT and Nitro Crates should deal less damage to Crash? Sure, it makes sense for them to deal him their full damage, but you could justify it as Crash taking less damage due to not being close to the blast compared to his opponents?
  • D-Smash has a fun/funny attack name and animation.
  • F-air is a surprisingly cool move when paired with its D-tilt cancel to potentially chain the two moves together, and its synergy with crates and setting up for off-stage harassment. It’s my favourite move in the set.
  • “By the way, do yo-yos spin the opposite direction in Australia?” I don’t know - I don’t play with yo-yos, and don’t have any on-hand to test this (I also don’t know which direction yo-yos are typically supposed to spin in).
  • “Because the animation of the pummel visually obscures Crash and his opponent until the last second before the throw starts, this makes it very difficult for the foe to react to whatever throw Crash goes for, making DI more or less a crapshoot. Truly dizzying!” This is actually neat, and the pummel animation makes perfect sense for Crash.
  • I could see Crash’s Down Air body slam being a good “tech chase” from F-throw if you choose to jump and end it early, as that leaves opponents prone beneath you.
  • “If you have an Iron Crate stored for use, you can use Up Special directly above the buried foe to plant an Iron Bounce Crate that will force them into a tumble if they mash out, forcing them to either risk that scenario or eat an attack from Crash.” This is a surprisingly cool use of Up Special with burying.

I think Crash’s Specials were a bit weaker as a hook compared to your sets from this and last contest, as his Standards and Smashes could feel unremarkable when they didn’t have much to play off of. The set picks up on the Aerials and especially the Grab game, the latter probably my favourite section of the set, as your ability to make some neat and creative individual moves shines more on these moves. To be fair, Crash is inevitably going to be limited in his moveset potential compared to other popular video game mascots, like the fact that you have to work around his spinning as a core move while staying true to its usages from his games. I don’t need to tell you that this moveset perfectly captures Crash’s gameplay and character, just as you have done with all your sets recently.
 
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