Social Lower Norfair

[Deleted member]

Seems a bit too much of an extreme measure just to put one character into the game...having rebalance all the stages and characters around Ridley rather than the other way around...

Also something I feel the devs would never do...

But what if Ridley isn't the only larger character.....?
While the size gap between DK and K. Rool isn't as wide as Samus and Ridley, K. Rool would still be one of the largest characters in the game if not the largest without factoring in Ridley.

I don't think characters themselves need to rebalanced to accommodate larger characters (though all characters would be given rebalancing anyway with newcomers thrown into the mix as usual), but with stages being designed around DK and Bowser being the largest characters in the past, things could change so that characters that are larger than them are the ones being put into account.

all im looking at is another ridley is too bigot person obviously

.....
We're done here.

I never understood why the "Olimar argument" wasn't valid (in terms of resizing), especially given things Sakurai has said about Smash 4's development (both in terms of Ridley himself, and the characters presented).

Because it's literally not just Olimar that was resized, it was everything from the Pikmin franchise.
All other aspects from Pikmin were scaled up accordingly to fit with Olimar's increased size. Whereas normally Mario's foot would just step on the entire Distant Planet or Garden of Hope stages and could accidentally kill a Bulborb with ease, in Smash he sees the world of Pikmin in Olimar's perspective and has to fear Bulborbs eating him for lunch.

In the case of Ridley, he would be the only thing from the Metroid series being scaled down, just for the sake of having him playable.

This is why for example (not that it would ever happen, but honestly, it would be much better than Goku) if someone like Godzilla were to be in Smash, it wouldn't be an issue of scaling despite him being at minimum 50 meters tall.
Because everything about the Godzilla franchise would be "scaled down" in accordance to Godzilla himself, meaning characters like Mario are kaiju-sized when interacting with anything in his "universe" much like how he is microscopic when interacting with anything in the Pikmin universe.

 

[CaptainAmerica]

Because it's literally not just Olimar that was resized, it was everything from the Pikmin franchise.
All other aspects from Pikmin were scaled up accordingly to fit with Olimar's increased size. Whereas normally Mario's foot would just step on the entire Distant Planet or Garden of Hope stages and could accidentally kill a Bulborb with ease, in Smash he sees the world of Pikmin in Olimar's perspective and has to fear Bulborbs eating him for lunch.

In the case of Ridley, he would be the only thing from the Metroid series being scaled down, just for the sake of having him playable.

This is why for example (not that it would ever happen, but honestly, it would be much better than Goku) if someone like Godzilla were to be in Smash, it wouldn't be an issue of scaling despite him being at minimum 50 meters tall.
Because everything about the Godzilla franchise would be "scaled down" in accordance to Godzilla himself, meaning characters like Mario are kaiju-sized when interacting with anything in his "universe" much like how he is microscopic when interacting with anything in the Pikmin universe.

Heights:
6'7" (2.0 m)
1'4" (0.4 m)
1'8" (0.5 m)
4'11" (1.5 m)
5'7" (1.7 m)

So for other franchises, things are not necessarily scaled down/up evenly.

Given that most people dislike his Other M design (myself included), what are people's thoughts on Proteus Ridley's design? Would you approve of it being the base of a hypothetical playable Ridley?

Anyway, I'd really be up for any Ridley design. I didn't hate the Other M design, but I know it's not popular at all. His face did look a bit funny, but I liked the spiked tail. His Brawl design was actually great.

Realistically, though, as long as he's in...

 

[Deleted member]

Heights:
6'7" (2.0 m)
1'4" (0.4 m)
1'8" (0.5 m)
4'11" (1.5 m)
5'7" (1.7 m)

So for other franchises, things are not necessarily scaled down/up evenly.

Pokémon's really just the exception if I'm going to be frank, likely due to the fact the Pokémon series itself is inconsistent with scaling that isn't necessarily accurate to the PokeDex statistic.

 

[Megadoomer]

There's also Palutena, who goes from being about twice Pit's size in most material related to Kid Icarus Uprising to being shorter than Pit in Smash 4.

 

[**Gilgamesh**]

I have a legit question. Has there been any boss character in the smash bros. universe that also became a character in Smash? Putting aside Sakurai sentiments towards Ridley, what precedent if any of a stage-boss or hazard boss character has there been in Smash becoming a playable character? Wouldn't this contradict the Smash Universe by having Ridley be a giant in the smash games and then suddenly being Scaled down to a character in the next installment? Sakurai values consistency.

 

[Deleted member]

There's also Palutena, who goes from being about twice Pit's size in most material related to Kid Icarus Uprising to being shorter than Pit in Smash 4.

I don't get what you mean by Palutena being twice Pit's size or that Pit is taller in Smash, but their model sizes in Uprising and their appearance in Smash are nearly 1:1. And even if there is a minimal size gap decrease, minimal is the key word.

 

[Zeox]

I have a legit question. Has there been any boss character in the smash bros. universe that also became a character in Smash? Putting aside Sakurai sentiments towards Ridley, what precedent if any of a stage-boss or hazard boss character has there been in Smash becoming a playable character? Wouldn't this contradict the Smash Universe by having Ridley be a giant in the smash games and then suddenly being Scaled down to a character in the next installment? Sakurai values consistency.

Wouldn't contradict Smash universe if the characters were toys in one game and then suddenly they become trophies in the next smash game?
Not to mention that Ridley is always changing looks and sizes in every smash, the ridley from brawl is not the same from smash 4, etc..

 

[Aetheri]

There's also Palutena, who goes from being about twice Pit's size in most material related to Kid Icarus Uprising to being shorter than Pit in Smash 4.

Palutena is not a good example since in Uprising you can see her at one point being the size of a mountain and another the size of a regular person...

 

[Megadoomer]

I don't get what you mean by Palutena being twice Pit's size or that Pit is taller in Smash, but their model sizes in Uprising and their appearance in Smash are nearly 1:1. And even if there is a minimal size gap decrease, minimal is the key word.

Oh, okay; I was going off of Palutena's newcomer trailer and the boss fights involving Palutena in Uprising.

 

[Smashoperatingbuddy123]

I think it's better we leave the talking about sizes to the side.

 

[pupNapoleon]

I have a legit question. Has there been any boss character in the smash bros. universe that also became a character in Smash? Putting aside Sakurai sentiments towards Ridley, what precedent if any of a stage-boss or hazard boss character has there been in Smash becoming a playable character? Wouldn't this contradict the Smash Universe by having Ridley be a giant in the smash games and then suddenly being Scaled down to a character in the next installment? Sakurai values consistency.

Charizard was pretty boss in Saffron City

...I now hate myself.

But legit, he was a stage hazard.

 

[Onyx Oblivian]

Wouldn't contradict Smash universe if the characters were toys in one game and then suddenly they become trophies in the next smash game?
Not to mention that Ridley is always changing looks and sizes in every smash, the ridley from brawl is not the same from smash 4, etc..

If we’re talking action figures, I guess it would be the equivalent of owning the amiibo vs owning the Figma

This hypothetical Smash Bros kid owned the 12” Ridley figure and then for Christmas his parents got them the 4” version to match his other little toys

 

[IronTed]

I mean, yeah a boss has technically never become a playable character, but there isn't any evidence that's a rule, either.

The fact is, Smash doesn't have many bosses to begin with, so there aren't any examples. We only have examples of characters who were items (Charizard, Little Mac).

 

[Ridley_Prime]

Oh yeah, Charizard was a popout hazard in Saffron City I guess, and a pokeball summon up until Brawl... Consistently inconsistent I suppose.

Plus too in Smash 64, Ridley had a stage background appearance like Dedede.

 

[Aetheri]

are the only NPCs from previous games to have been made into playable characters so far...

Of course others were previously trophies like Dedede, Olimar, and Wario for example but apart from that no one else was put into the game that wasn't directly made playable...

 

[Ridley_Prime]

Regardless, can’t say I’m a fan of some notion like “well he’s always been a boss, so that’s what he must always be”, the whole self-defeatist prophecy of making Ridley the exception because reasons.

At least Little Mac going from assist trophy to playable would be potential ammo for Dark Samus in the future, who would still be my first Metroid backup choice (sorry Sylux).

 

[JamesDNaux]

Were we talking sizes again? Sure, you can argue that everything from Pikmin is scaled up. You could argue that Pokemon are basically animals and the Pokedex height is more or less an average, so sizes can vary. You could say anything, really.

But I continue to say the best example for Ridley's case is Ganondorf.

Almost literally two Links in height (Link only measures up to his damn crotch) in Zelda, but in Smash, he's barely a couple of heads taller than Link. If Ganondorf can be almost cut in half, then Ridley would have zero problems losing a few pounds.

 

[FunAtParties]

Were we talking sizes again? Sure, you can argue that everything from Pikmin is scaled up. You could argue that Pokemon are basically animals and the Pokedex height is more or less an average, so sizes can vary. You could say anything, really.

But I continue to say the best example for Ridley's case is Ganondorf.

Almost literally two Links in height (Link only measures up to his damn crotch) in Zelda, but in Smash, he's barely a couple of heads taller than Link. If Ganondorf can be almost cut in half, then Ridley would have zero problems losing a few pounds.

Not a bad point honestly

 

[Venus of the Desert Bloom]

Hey guys, Venus here and I have some ball-busting leak busters to deal out. I have it on high and realizable authority from my Aunt’s boyfriend’s younger brother who is drinking buddies with a janitor/plumber at NoA that Ridley is, in fact, not a playable character. I repeat not a playable character. And once more for impact, Not. A. Playable. Character.

But fear not; he is in the game. According to my 100% reliable source, Ridley will have multiple functions that, according to my source, makes him more visible than just a silly roster addition. According to my source, Ridley will be replacing Toad for Peach’s Neutral B so that’s Toad can be added as Captain Toad. Once more, according to the source, both Chrom and Dunban be added to the roster with Ridley providing much needed assist to Robin and Shulk.

If that’s not enough to make your mouth water, Ridley is also confirmed, according to my source, to function as Wario’s Bike and can even be exploded into tiny Ridley bits to be used as items! Ridley will also be replacing the Pikmin and Olimar will be changed to Olimar & Ridley. This is also happened with Rosalina & Luma with Ridley taking over for Lima. He even shoots out stars during the Final Smash! Finally, every playable Pokemon will be able to Mega Evolve into Ridley so I guess he’s somewhat playable. Mii Fighters will also have a Ridley ourift. All of this of course is provided by my source and, seeing as how he’s a janitor/plumber, he’s used to mopping up messes and fixing broken leaks.

 

[NintenRob]

Hey guys, Venus here and I have some ball-busting leak busters to deal out. I have it on high and realizable authority from my Aunt’s boyfriend’s younger brother who is drinking buddies with a janitor/plumber at NoA that Ridley is, in fact, not a playable character. I repeat not a playable character. And once more for impact, Not. A. Playable. Character.

But fear not; he is in the game. According to my 100% reliable source, Ridley will have multiple functions that, according to my source, makes him more visible than just a silly roster addition. According to my source, Ridley will be replacing Toad for Peach’s Neutral B so that’s Toad can be added as Captain Toad. Once more, according to the source, both Chrom and Dunban be added to the roster with Ridley providing much needed assist to Robin and Shulk.

If that’s not enough to make your mouth water, Ridley is also confirmed, according to my source, to function as Wario’s Bike and can even be exploded into tiny Ridley bits to be used as items! Ridley will also be replacing the Pikmin and Olimar will be changed to Olimar & Ridley. This is also happened with Rosalina & Luma with Ridley taking over for Lima. He even shoots out stars during the Final Smash! Finally, every playable Pokemon will be able to Mega Evolve into Ridley so I guess he’s somewhat playable. Mii Fighters will also have a Ridley ourift. All of this of course is provided by my source and, seeing as how he’s a janitor/plumber, he’s used to mopping up messes and fixing broken leaks.

When anything does anything, Ridley takes his place
Ridley: "Leave it to me!"

 

[Retroend]

unpopular opinion but i liked the other m's ridley design.

 

[NintenRob]

My biggest curiosity of Ridley getting in Smash are his taunts and victory animations.

He doesn't exactly express much personality in the games unfortunately. Although one thing I'd like to see is him admire his claws kinda like he did when he first shows up in Prime1, ideally with a smile since the angle and model in the cutscene makes him look like his smiling at them.

I just don't want generic roars like Charizard

 

[Danpal65]

My biggest curiosity of Ridley getting in Smash are his taunts and victory animations.

He doesn't exactly express much personality in the games unfortunately. Although one thing I'd like to see is him admire his claws kinda like he did when he first shows up in Prime1, ideally with a smile since the angle and model in the cutscene makes him look like his smiling at them.

I just don't want generic roars like Charizard

I could absolutely see him pull out the baby Metroid in its jar thingy as one of his taunts. He could pull it out, look at it, then put it away.

Another could be his classic screech, maybe accompanied by him doing the screeching pose from Other M?

Not sure what his last one could be though... Maybe something similar to Mario's where he grows bigger?

 

[StormC]

To me, Ridley's problem has never been necessarily his size but his weird, gangly proportions. Samus Returns actually gives him proportions that would be workable for Smash scaled down IMO.

 

[James Phillips]

My biggest curiosity of Ridley getting in Smash are his taunts and victory animations.

He doesn't exactly express much personality in the games unfortunately. Although one thing I'd like to see is him admire his claws kinda like he did when he first shows up in Prime1, ideally with a smile since the angle and model in the cutscene makes him look like his smiling at them.

I just don't want generic roars like Charizard

It’s pretty strange, Ridley’s always referred to as having a high intellect (he’s the leader of space pirates after all) indirectly but directly he’s nothing more than a regular beast who shows up and leaves.

His taunts could show that he’s smarter than he appears which would give him something to differentiate him from the other dragon on the roster.

 

[Deleted member]

Were we talking sizes again? Sure, you can argue that everything from Pikmin is scaled up. You could argue that Pokemon are basically animals and the Pokedex height is more or less an average, so sizes can vary. You could say anything, really.

But I continue to say the best example for Ridley's case is Ganondorf.

Almost literally two Links in height (Link only measures up to his damn crotch) in Zelda, but in Smash, he's barely a couple of heads taller than Link. If Ganondorf can be almost cut in half, then Ridley would have zero problems losing a few pounds.

Would be more reasonable of a point if Ganondorf wasn't literally thrown in the prior Smash at the last minute as an easy clone using a non-canon tech demo appearance just because the model happened to fit Captain Falcon's frame and it would be an easy way to accodate his fans' requests for him.

What was Sakurai going to do at that point? Just scrap Ganondorf for Brawl?

 

[SmashKeks]

It’s pretty strange, Ridley’s always referred to as having a high intellect (he’s the leader of space pirates after all) indirectly but directly he’s nothing more than a regular beast who shows up and leaves.

His taunts could show that he’s smarter than he appears which would give him something to differentiate him from the other dragon on the roster.

Probably won't happen, but honestly, on the intellect debate (and the personality one too to an extent), since people always mention that Ridley has spoken in the manga, I've always wondered what simply giving Ridley some talking roles would do for the character. Maybe he has a Link status where they just don't want to try making him talk/giving him a voice, or maybe Nintendo just hasn't considered it for an official Metroid game. I know that if they did do it, they'd probably want to do it in a Metroid game before first attempting it in Smash.

I heard someone say that Metroid Prime 1 had a cutscene of Ridley commanding some lesser space pirates. Things like that could prove Ridley's intelligence as well. Even if he didn't talk, give him cutscenes where he makes clever strategic moves to hinder Samus, in a level or in battle. Something more than showing up for a boss fight and roaring like a standard non sentient animal. Maybe have him use his wings to fly away from Samus and spit fire balls at her, forcing the player to find a way to disable his wings and force him to confront Samus head on. That'd be a pretty smart move given that he knows he's been bested by her many times, and he could just fly away or high enough to where she can't reach him. Maybe he could go the extra mile and attempt to drop things on her.

On the topic of Ridley talking, what kind of voice would he have? I could imagine something low and smooth, that just reeks of condescending cunning. Any actors/voice actors you could envision portraying Ridley? Personally, I would nominate Ron Perlman for the voice of Ridley. Particularly him doing a voice similar to his voice of Slade from the Teen Titans cartoon.

 

[MasterOfKnees]

I've always imagined he'd have a low and almost venomous voice, with an obvious alien tone to it. The closest I've found to what I imagine it in my head are the Nagas from Warcraft 3:

 

[NintenRob]

It's hard to describe how I picture Ridleys


Harsh I guess, but well put together

Maybe a bit like Metal Face, but not British and a bit animalistic instead mechanical

I dunno

 

[Phaazoid]

Palutena is not a good example since in Uprising you can see her at one point being the size of a mountain and another the size of a regular person...

Wait, you're saying that in some games, characters can appear at multiple different sizes, even within the same game? That sounds a little hard to believe. IMO once a character's height is set in the international video game character height book, it takes years of legal battle to change that stuff. It's no wonder Sakurai doesn't bother with Ridley, even a man with his work ethic would balk at that amount of paperwork.

 

[Cosmic77]

Every time you all talk about what Ridley's voice would sound like, my mind wanders off to that video of Gilbert Gotfried clips being played over Ridley's SSE intro.

 

[IronTed]

If Ridley ever gets voiced, Slowbeef and Diabetus as voice actors or riot.

 

[CaptainAmerica]

Half of me kinda likes what they pulled with Bowser, Charizard, and DK, and I’d really like Rids to have some saurian screeches as a voice. Just take the raptor yells from Jurassic Park and I’m good.

And if we’re gonna have a size debate again, let’s not dismiss every counterexample as “that’s an exception.” If everything’s an exception, nothing is.

 

[Bestmand902]

It's really a shame Tony Jay is dead, because I would've absolutely loved to hear him voice Ridley, because quite frankly that'd be absolutely terrifying. Though Mark Hamill, who can do refined and monstrous-sounding at the same time, would be a close second.

 

[Swamp Sensei]

If it was Palutena, I wouldn't be mad; her character is sexual all the time

Okay that's a load of bull.

Palutena is snarky, but she's not very sexual.

 

[Aetheri]

Wait, you're saying that in some games, characters can appear at multiple different sizes, even within the same game? That sounds a little hard to believe. IMO once a character's height is set in the international video game character height book, it takes years of legal battle to change that stuff. It's no wonder Sakurai doesn't bother with Ridley, even a man with his work ethic would balk at that amount of paperwork.

Uhh..I think you misunderstand...

Palutena is a Goddess in the KI Universe...she has the powers of a Goddess which would allow her to appear large and menacing or allow her to be more the size of regular humans...other gods and goddesses in the game have the same power like Viridi, Hades, Medusa etc...

That's why I say she's a bad example since she has the power to change her size and appearance when needed...

 

[IronTed]

Uhh..I think you misunderstand...

Palutena is a Goddess in the KI Universe...she has the powers of a Goddess which would allow her to appear large and menacing or allow her to be more the size of regular humans...other gods and goddesses in the game have the same power like Viridi, Hades, Medusa etc...

That's why I say she's a bad example since she has the power to change her size and appearance when needed...

Well, Ridley is the cunning god of death...

/s

 

[Zeox]

Wait, you're saying that in some games, characters can appear at multiple different sizes, even within the same game? That sounds a little hard to believe. IMO once a character's height is set in the international video game character height book, it takes years of legal battle to change that stuff. It's no wonder Sakurai doesn't bother with Ridley, even a man with his work ethic would balk at that amount of paperwork.

Yeah, some people must believe that when they say Ridley's size can't change, when in every metroid game he is changing:

Spoiler

Not only Ridley changes size in every game, but also his colors, sometimes his wings are bigger, sometimes they are smaller.

The claws, the colors, and even the size of these 2 ridley are different.

The size of the wings of this ridley are 2 times bigger than the sprites ones, the color is different, he have spikes, etc... yet he is supposed to be a perfect clone of ridley.

The first sprite is some kind of gray, second is brown, ridley from other m is purple, and this one, the one from brawl, is blue.
He have bigger wings than the first sprite but smaller than the other m version, have a pupil, and have 4 fingers instead of the 3 fingers than the super metroid had.
What I'm trying to say is, Ridley doesn't have 1 design, he is always changing size, color and looks, and if someone believes he cannot be resized then that person doesn't know he is always changing sizes and looks.

 

[Raxxel]

One could argue that Ridley's size itself is largely inconsistent in the Metroid universe. Compare something like Super Metroid Ridley to Samus Returns Ridley, and there is a very, very noticeable size difference.

 

[Phaazoid]

Uhh..I think you misunderstand...

Palutena is a Goddess in the KI Universe...she has the powers of a Goddess which would allow her to appear large and menacing or allow her to be more the size of regular humans...other gods and goddesses in the game have the same power like Viridi, Hades, Medusa etc...

That's why I say she's a bad example since she has the power to change her size and appearance when needed...

I understand. I'm foiling idea of something as silly as a international video game character height book with the idea that a character can't be resized, because that's how silly I hear that argument to be. It was an indirect jab at Ridley, for the sake of my argument Paultena's canon is irrelevant .