Little Mac, W.V.B.A. Champion confirmed for SSB4

[DoubleYooToo]

I don't see why it's so terrible for Mac to mimic some of his fighters from the games. I always pictured his Forward Smash would be that King Hippo hug. Or his BackAir would be Super Macho Man's Clothesline punch where his arm spins around.

Because it's boring and it shows a lack of creativity and respect for the source material from the designers. It's totally outside of Mac's character to do things like that, the whole point of those characters' moves is that they fit what they're about, like Super Macho Man doing big, showy moves and Aran Ryan cheating with a rope. Giving Mac those moves would be like making Mario breathe fire, or giving Link dark magic, it may come from their games but it just wouldn't make any sense for those characters to be the ones doing the things.

 

[Vintage Creep]

Because it's boring and it shows a lack of creativity and respect for the source material from the designers. It's totally outside of Mac's character to do things like that, the whole point of those characters' moves is that they fit what they're about, like Super Macho Man doing big, showy moves and Aran Ryan cheating with a rope. Giving Mac those moves would be like making Mario breathe fire, or giving Link dark magic, it may come from their games but it just wouldn't make any sense for those characters to be the ones doing the things.

Says the guy with Villager doing Balloon Fighter's move in avatar?

 

[DoubleYooToo]

Says the guy with Villager doing Balloon Fighter's move in avatar?

Yeah, the Animal Crossing final boss battle with Balloon Fight guy was really intense.

 

[greenluigiman2]

If you could only choose 7 variations of the main theme not including the main version itself to play on the boxing ring stage, which would they be? For me:
1. Doc Louis
2. Mr. Sandman
3. Don Flamenco
4. King Hippo
5. Super Macho Man
6. Bear Hugger
7. Von Kaiser

 

[shinhed-echi]

Yeah, I don't like the idea of Little Mac stealing moves from other boxers. I want them to be cool ATs or Bosses even instead.
Unless it's something that feels natural to boxing, like the uppercuts for example.
L.M. has plenty to work with by himself, if you ask me.

-
As for the 7 variations, here's what I'd choose:

1.-Super Macho Man
2.-Soda Popinski
3.-Von Kaiser
4.-Mr.Sandman
5.-Don Flamenco
6.-Aran Ryan
7.-Piston Hondo

And I really like the Major Circuit and Major Circuit Boss themes, but I guess those count as part of the MAIN THEME. :D

 

[BKupa666]

Because it's boring and it shows a lack of creativity and respect for the source material from the designers. It's totally outside of Mac's character to do things like that, the whole point of those characters' moves is that they fit what they're about, like Super Macho Man doing big, showy moves and Aran Ryan cheating with a rope. Giving Mac those moves would be like making Mario breathe fire, or giving Link dark magic, it may come from their games but it just wouldn't make any sense for those characters to be the ones doing the things.

I understand this point and agree with it when I see Little Mac getting bizarre stuff like Aran Ryan's glove-on-a-rope or Great Tiger's teleporting in a moveset. It reminds me of people stuffing Toad movesets full of obscure power-ups for the sake of making him seem interesting. But, based on Mac's unique boxer style alone, he doesn't even need that. That being said, I think less-flashy versions of, say, King Hippo's hug or Bald Bull's spinning gloves wouldn't be too far a stretch.

 

[Opossum]

Yeah, things like Macho Man's clothesline are okay. Just not...bizarre things.

 

[DoubleYooToo]

I understand this point and agree with it when I see Little Mac getting bizarre stuff like Aran Ryan's glove-on-a-rope or Great Tiger's teleporting in a moveset. It reminds me of people stuffing Toad movesets full of obscure power-ups for the sake of making him seem interesting. But, based on Mac's unique boxer style alone, he doesn't even need that. That being said, I think less-flashy versions of, say, King Hippo's hug or Bald Bull's spinning gloves wouldn't be too far a stretch.

I wouldn't even agree with that. Bear Hugging is kind of seen as a dirty move, and that whole spinning your fists and punching thing is extremely stereotypical Hollywood bad guy. They go against Mac's characterization as a clean boxer.

 

[Stompman]

Because it's boring and it shows a lack of creativity and respect for the source material from the designers. It's totally outside of Mac's character to do things like that, the whole point of those characters' moves is that they fit what they're about, like Super Macho Man doing big, showy moves and Aran Ryan cheating with a rope. Giving Mac those moves would be like making Mario breathe fire, or giving Link dark magic, it may come from their games but it just wouldn't make any sense for those characters to be the ones doing the things.

What about Ness? He never, ever learned PK Thunder or PK Fire, yet he has those abilities in Smash.

 

[8-peacock-8]

I wouldn't even agree with that. Bear Hugging is kind of seen as a dirty move, and that whole spinning your fists and punching thing is extremely stereotypical Hollywood bad guy. They go against Mac's characterization as a clean boxer.

Too be fair he will be fighting people that use ray guns, arm cannons, buzz saws, explosives, etc.

 

[Vintage Creep]

Yeah, the Animal Crossing final boss battle with Balloon Fight guy was really intense.

LOL just read this, what the **** of an answer is this? Villager never used Balloon Fighter's stuff, so he shouldn't do it in this game. That's EXACTLY what you're talking about. Double standards much?

 

[DoubleYooToo]

LOL just read this, what the **** of an answer is this? Villager never used Balloon Fighter's stuff, so he shouldn't do it in this game. That's EXACTLY what you're talking about. Double standards much?

You might want to cool it a bit, nobody's threatening your human rights here.

Actually that's not in the slightest what I was talking about. You clearly didn't read my post very carefully at all. I cited Mario breathing fire because that's an ability Bowser has always had, and Link using dark magic because that's an ability Ganon always has. The point that I was making is that it wouldn't fit to give these moves to the heroes of these games when they originate from the antagonists, no more than it would fit to borrow moves from the many antagonists of Punch-Out. The Villager using Balloon Fighter's move is a reference to the fact that balloon fight is available as a minigame in the first Animal Crossing. In itself, the Balloon Fight main character would not have enough to work as a fighter, as there isn't much you can do with the way he behaves in his own game. But as just one of many moves to the villager, one that isn't too much of a stretch on the villager's "use a lot of random ****" moveset design, it fits well.

The Villagers in animal crossing don't really have characterization. The whole point is that they are you, and you control their every move. You're not really the protagonist or the antagonist, and neither of these exist through characters separate to you. There certainly isn't an antagonist who wears a helmet and floats around on Balloons. Little Mac on the other hand does have some established character. He is the protagonist and the various fighters are the antagonists. They act as bad guys do, they cheat, they showboat, and they badmouth Little Mac (well, most of them at least, Glass Joe is pretty complacent.) This contrasts Little Mac who is a modest, clean fighter at a constant and obvious disadvantage. It's outside the realm of his character to do many of the things that Punch-Out's opponents do, some of the things being suggested as additions to his moveset. It's not just that Mac never used that stuff, it's that he wouldn't use that stuff, because it's not who he is.

Do you understand now what I was getting at?

 

[shinhed-echi]

You might want to cool it a bit, nobody's threatening your human rights here.

Actually that's not in the slightest what I was talking about. You clearly didn't read my post very carefully at all. I cited Mario breathing fire because that's an ability Bowser has always had, and Link using dark magic because that's an ability Ganon always has. The point that I was making is that it wouldn't fit to give these moves to the heroes of these games when they originate from the antagonists, no more than it would fit to borrow moves from the many antagonists of Punch-Out. The Villager using Balloon Fighter's move is a reference to the fact that balloon fight is available as a minigame in the first Animal Crossing. In itself, the Balloon Fight main character would not have enough to work as a fighter, as there isn't much you can do with the way he behaves in his own game. But as just one of many moves to the villager, one that isn't too much of a stretch on the villager's "use a lot of random ****" moveset design, it fits well.

The Villagers in animal crossing don't really have characterization. The whole point is that they are you, and you control their every move. You're not really the protagonist or the antagonist, and neither of these exist through characters separate to you. There certainly isn't an antagonist who wears a helmet and floats around on Balloons. Little Mac on the other hand does have some established character. He is the protagonist and the various fighters are the antagonists. They act as bad guys do, they cheat, they showboat, and they badmouth Little Mac (well, most of them at least, Glass Joe is pretty complacent.) This contrasts Little Mac who is a modest, clean fighter at a constant and obvious disadvantage. It's outside the realm of his character to do many of the things that Punch-Out's opponents do, some of the things being suggested as additions to his moveset. It's not just that Mac never used that stuff, it's that he wouldn't use that stuff, because it's not who he is.

Do you understand now what I was getting at?

I think you pretty much nailed it.
It's one thing that Megaman uses enemy weapons (because that's what he does INgame).
It's one thing that Ness borrows Psi moves from Paula (because at least it's something that he could potentially learn, and doesn't affect his character).
However giving Little Mac the enemy's dirty boxing moves is as bad as giving Link Ganon's dark magic in my eyes.

Also, the thing about using Ray Guns, Beam Swords, and other items doesn't really hold much water because this isn't a Punch Out game, it's a SSB game where new rules apply.
Otherwise.... we wouldn't be seeing Pika/Jiggs using Pokeballs, since that's against the rules of the Pokemon League (and in general, the rules of life in the Pokemon universe).
But it's also it's job to keep the characters as in-character as possible, so within their own limitations, they should represent what they are and what they do best.... And using Aran Ryan's horseshoe-in-a-glove-on-a-rope isn't one of them. As fun as that would be...

 

[Yoichi Hiruma]

Agreed.
The point of Little Mac is to be diverse but simple at the same time. He has more than enough moves in general to work into a moveset. Personally, I don't think Mac needs moves from other boxers, clenching, or, Heaven forbid, elemental punches as many people have suggested.
Also, speaking of out of character moves, does anyone else REALLY hate the idea of Giga Mac being part of Mac's moveset?

My 7 renditions of the Punch-Out Theme for SSB4 would be:
1. Punch-Out Wii
2. Bear Hugger
3. Aran Ryan
4. Don Flamenco
5. Von Kaiser
6. Super Macho Man
7. Soda Popinski

 

[Deleted member]

My Top 7 would be:
1. The regular Punch Out!! Main Theme
2. Major Circuit
3. Mr. Sandman
4. Doc Louis
5. Glass Joe
6. Aran Ryan
7. Soda Popinski

 

[shinhed-echi]

Oh, I forgot, maybe instead of Piston Hondo, I'd like to have a medley of Super Punch Out! battle themes. :D

Punch Out Wii is awesome and all, but SPO is almost as good!

 

[Knight Dude]

My Top 7 would be:
1. The regular Punch Out!! Main Theme
2. Major Circuit
3. Mr. Sandman
4. Doc Louis
5. Glass Joe
6. Aran Ryan
7. Soda Popinski

Those would be my choices for the theme songs as well. Maybe throw in the original 8-bit theme as well.

I guess Mac's final Smash would be turning into Giga Mac wouldn't it?

Not sure if Mac needs to borrow other characters moves from Punch Out, it's not like we have another boxing character in the game. But I guess if you really feel the need to have a flashy character, then it could work. Still wouldn't recommend it.

Oh, and he needs the pink jumpsuit as an alternate costume. That'd be killer.

 

[Deleted member]

I think that Giga Mac would be Little Mac's Final Smash. Admittedly, it's not the most exciting Final Smash, but it will do.

I can imagine Little Mac using other moves from the other boxers from Punch Out!!, but I can also see that not happening at the same time. There are a ton of boxing maneuvers that Little Mac can do as a part of his moveset.

 

[Cobalsh]

Sign me up. It took me way too long to find this page. Almost an effing year. Jeez...

 

[BluePikmin11]

We need more supporters , maybe we'll beat the record of Megaman supporters.

 

[Yoichi Hiruma]

Giga Mac always baffled me. It's like what Arkham Asylum did when they made Joker a hulking brute after taking the Titan Formula.
They made a character that's about tactics one about brute strength.

 

[Smashiny]

I fully support him being in !

 

[MopedOfJustice]

I wouldn't even agree with that. Bear Hugging is kind of seen as a dirty move, and that whole spinning your fists and punching thing is extremely stereotypical Hollywood bad guy. They go against Mac's characterization as a clean boxer.

Here's my issue
He'll be able to use beam swords, guns of several different types and pokeballs, but he can't use a rope?
I'm not saying he should, I'm just saying that the "clean fighting" thing becomes completely invalid if he also throws bombs, Mr. Saturns and Wheeled Crates.

 

[greenluigiman2]

Here's my issue
He'll be able to use beam swords, guns of several different types and pokeballs, but he can't use a rope?
I'm not saying he should, I'm just saying that the "clean fighting" thing becomes completely invalid if he also throws bombs, Mr. Saturns and Wheeled Crates.

Using beam swords, guns, bombs and such is optional. They're items and not moves for a reason.

Using your logic, Snake's whole "realistic military weapons" thing becomes invalid if he can use star rods, party balls and banana peels. There's nothing wrong with incorporating colorful, cartoony weapons into his moveset right? Of course there's something wrong with that. Optional items should have nothing to do with how characters are designed at their core. Snake uses realistic military weapons, Pikachu uses electric attacks, Zero Suit Samus has a limited arsenal of weapons (aka one weapon), Sonic is super fast and Little Mac is a clean fighter. These are examples of who the characters are at their core and how they should be portrayed in SSB. I don't see how this is even debatable.

 

[MopedOfJustice]

Using beam swords, guns, bombs and such is optional. They're items and not moves for a reason.

Using your logic, Snake's whole "realistic military weapons" thing becomes invalid if he can use star rods, party balls and banana peels. There's nothing wrong with incorporating colorful, cartoony weapons into his moveset right? Of course there's something wrong with that. Optional items should have nothing to do with how characters are designed at their core. Snake uses realistic military weapons, Pikachu uses electric attacks, Zero Suit Samus has a limited arsenal of weapons (aka one weapon), Sonic is super fast and Little Mac is a clean fighter. These are examples of who the characters are at their core and how they should be portrayed in SSB. I don't see how this is even debatable.

No, because he uses whatever the hell he can get. He scrounges for snacks off of dead bodies.
The point of the whole moveset debate is that there are things Mac doesn't do.
"Well, using items is optional, so it's ok."
Well... Why not make his bair a swing of his gloves by a rope, wired with a bomb, while he fires off an AK-47 with his other hand, because it's "optional to use a bair"?

 

[greenluigiman2]

No, because he uses whatever the hell he can get. He scrounges for snacks off of dead bodies.

In other words you would be okay with Snake using colorful cartoony weapons in his moveset because in his games he uses "whatever the hell he can get"... That's all I need to know to see where this is going.

Well... Why not make his bair a swing of his gloves by a rope, wired with a bomb, while he fires off an AK-47 with his other hand, because it's "optional to use a bair"?

I didn't say "optional to use" I simply said "optional."

Let me explain it to you like this: Whether or not you use the move, Little Mac's bair is designed into his character. It is an optional move to use, but unlike items it is NOT optional to get rid of. Items are a completely separate entity that essentially change the rules of everything and should have no baring on how a character is designed at his core. Just because Snake has the option to use colorful, cartoony items, that doesn't mean that fact should have anything to do with how his moves are determined.

 

[MopedOfJustice]

In other words you would be okay with Snake using colorful cartoony weapons in his moveset because in his games he uses "whatever the hell he can get"... That's all I need to know to see where this is going.


I didn't say "optional to use" I simply said "optional."

Let me explain it to you like this: Whether or not you use the move, Little Mac's bair is designed into his character. It is an optional move to use, but unlike items it is NOT optional to get rid of. Items are a completely separate entity that essentially change the rules of everything and should have no baring on how a character is designed at his core. Just because Snake has the option to use colorful, cartoony items, that doesn't mean that fact should have anything to do with how his moves are determined.

Meh... Snake has demonstrated, like in nearly any shooter, the ability to take weapons that are lying around, or off of dead bodies. It's not that much of a stretch.

As for the thing about Mac, his animations for picking up and throwing items, as well as shooting or hitting with them are in his character design, should they be incorporated, and may be relevant even without items on. He could still grab a turnip out of the air and through it back, for instance.

 

[papagenos]

I'm ok with mac getting a little dirty here, it's smash bros. not boxing so the "rules" change and mac can do things considered "legal" in the smash ring that aren't "legal" in boxing and still be a "clean" fighter.

that said I still want mac to be about tactics and boxing moves so i'm less inclined to see him use the non-boxing "cheap" moves his opponents use simply because it just wouldn't capture his personality and style, but this is smash so mac should bring everything he can even if that means moves borrowed from his opponents. though i would rather see bull charge and macho mans close line and stuff people have mentioned just because they capture the "boxer" feel better than other characters.

 

[FirstBlade]

I know a lot of people are saying Little mac should be left intact but I think some other fighter moves would actually fit him and make him more interesting...of course only if they fit. For example, here are some ideas I had:
I had tried to pull moves from different characters.
Bull Charge (Bald Bull): A charging move that works just as it does in Punch Out!. Could be used as a side special.
Clothesline Spin (Super Macho Man): 3 360 spins that has Mac spin around like a top. Can be moved around but does not come off of ground. Down Special? Down Smash Attack?
Dreamland Express (Mr. Sandman): 3 uppercuts in quick succession. Unlike Mac's signature uppercut, Mac does not come off the ground with this move. Possibly a regular move or smash attack that if hit on the sweetspot puts the victim to sleep for a couple seconds (Dreamland Express puts you to sleep... get it?)
Toro Uppercut (Don Flamenco)- Simply a very fast uppercut. Get-up attack.
Hondo Rush (Piston Hondo)- This I can see as being a unique move. Similar to how it is used by Piston Hondo in Title Defense, the normal attack (3 jabs and a quick uppercut) would be the initial move but repeatedly pressing the button should allow for up to 6 extra hits in fast sequence allowing for good combos. In a sense it is similar to Marth's Dancing Blade only there can be more hits.
Bear Hug (Bear Hugger)- A two handed pummel/grab. Grab seems like most obvious thing here. I could also see this being a special attack or normal attack where if it connects the victim will be dazed as if being hit by a Deku Nut.
Hammer Attack (King Hippo)- Mac already has them in the Bear Hug grasp due to his grab and he simply swings his fist down which sends the player downward. I could see this being a down throw as stated above but maybe also as a down aerial with meteor smash qualities and maybe as a down smash or something.
Soda Fury (Soda Popinski)- Pretty much the same minus drinking the soda. Little Mac turns red with anger and does 4 uppercuts in a row on either side of him. What makes this unique is if used in succession it becomes faster (as if he drinks more soda). Special move?
Von Kaiser Wave (Von Kaiser)- A weird dash thingy.... dash attack I guess.

Of course, as said by other people Mac has plenty to work with on his own and I expect the majority of his moveset to be that way. An incorporation of earning stars to get more powerful Star Punches would be cool. His down dodge should resemble his sidestep dodge from all the games and his shield stance should have him covering his face like he does to block in the games. His Star Uppercut would be an obvious pick I think for a recovery move and as many other people have stated Giga Mac seems like a likely choice for his Final Smash. There are definitely other possibilities but this post is getting long so...

 

[?????????????]

If you could only choose 7 variations of the main theme not including the main version itself to play on the boxing ring stage, which would they be?

1. Doc Louis
2. King Hippo (Minor Circuit Title Fight Version)
3. Bear Hugger
4. Don Flamenco (Major Circuit Title Fight Version)
5. Soda Popinski
6. Super Macho Man
7. Mr. Sandman

 

[APC99]

​

Happy holidays, Little Mac supporters!​

 

[Opossum]

Seven song variations? Von Kaiser, Soda Popinski, Doc Louis, Aran Ryan, Bear Hugger, Mr. Sandman and the original main theme.

 

[Vintage Creep]

I bought the Wii game a week ago, it's really nice but damn it's also pretty hard.
By playing it I see even more similarities between the franchise and the Boxing Ring stage.
I have no doubt Little Mac will show up anymore.

 

[Deleted member]

Yikes. Starfy is returning as an Assist Trophy. I hope the same fate won't happen to Little Mac… I'm honestly scared that it could happen. If it does, I would be greatly upset and heavily surprised.

 

[BluePikmin11]

Just remind yourself of the Boxing Ring the Leaky 3 leak, I'm damn confident he'll be a character. I don't know why you guys are doubting. :9

 

[Diddy Kong]

I'll condemn that leak forever. Mii and PacMan are horrible choices.

 

[Deleted member]

I'll condemn that leak forever. Mii and PacMan are horrible choices.

I will be sad if they get confirmed. I don't want Pac-Man at all (and it would make me disappointed to see him personally, Bomberman please) and the Miis are tied with Cloud Strife as my least wanted character.

Without the leak, I am confident that Little Mac will be playable. The other two though, I really hope that they don't happen.

 

[Diddy Kong]

I don't trust any leak till right before the release date.

 

[Deleted member]

I don't trust any leak till right before the release date.

Same. Again, without the leak, Little Mac is extremely possible thanks to what has been revealed to us. The other two, I doubt they will happen.

I am not believing any leak as well, mostly because I go by my mentality of "I don't believe it until I see it."

 

[Diddy Kong]

Wii Fit Trainer's prediction was just lucky chance, nothing more.