Link Social Thread

[Pug]

Once you get a feel for when to do it, bomb punting is much more useful than it would seem. Z-dropping bombs as you jump over enemies forces a reaction and if they make the mistake of shielding they get to enjoy shield pressure from the bomb. Leaving bombs on platforms wards against certain approaches (in fact some players don't like going anywhere near bombs but usually that's because they're not familiar with the Link MU).

 

[Heero Yuy]

So I've been in the lab working on a ZSS and Ike. ZSS mainly for Link dittos and Tink both of which I absolutely despise as Link and Ike for smaller stages.

I also thought it'd be best to use secondaries since this is the most balanced Smash and therefore matchups are more important. Any insight on my choices?

 

[Deleted member]

So I've been in the lab working on a ZSS and Ike. ZSS mainly for Link dittos and Tink both of which I absolutely despise as Link and Ike for smaller stages.

I also thought it'd be best to use secondaries since this is the most balanced Smash and therefore matchups are more important. Any insight on my choices?

ZSS makes sense but I'm not sure about Ike. I could imagine it's pretty hard to get around projectiles with him.

 

[GarmWyrda]

Hi everyone !

I just come to say hi and share something that may be useful for every Link players.
That's small things, I hope it'll be fine on this thread !

I was playing in the lab, and I come to 2 ideas while practicing for DashDance :
1- Using a Dacus out of dashdance can be really usefull/cool ! It can be really fast.. I don't think I have to describe it more.

2- DashDancing above a "grounded" bomb. It could be great to deny some char to dash attack you or else the bomb will explode and you could get out of any combo. Plus, you can always "dashdance away" the bomb before it explodes. Or you can DD, feint that you will rush your opponent, and then WD back, and by doing so grabing your bomb to throw it at him !
To be honest, I'm not sure that's really good, but maybe some great players could actually do something with this...

Anyway, what do you guys think ?

 

[Phan7om]

Does* Link's arrows have any significant usage in the ditto? Just wondering, thanks for the help!

 

[Player -0]

Is Link's arrows have any significant usage in the ditto? Just wondering, thanks for the help!

You can eat bomb jumps with arrows. Pretty much anything that you would usually use arrows for.

That should be does, not is btw.

 

[Phan7om]

You can eat bomb jumps with arrows. Pretty much anything that you would usually use arrows for.

That should be does, not is btw.

Thanks man, and tbh I totally know that "is" was grammatically incorrect rereading it and it feels strange that I even typed that lol. I must have been trying to ask something else like "Is Link's arrows useful in the ditto?" or something

 

[Player -0]

Thanks man, and tbh I totally know that "is" was grammatically incorrect rereading it and it feels strange that I even typed that lol. I must have been trying to ask something else like "Is Link's arrows useful in the ditto?" or something

That would still be are though. Idk. You might've been trying to ask "Is there a significant use for Link's arrow in dem 's?

 

[Mr.Pickle]

I'm honestly very worried on how the pm dev team is going to handle the nerfs to link. He needs a couple sure, but there seems to be a lot of link hate out there that I don't quite understand, and that might lead to an over nerf in the next version. What do you guys think?

 

[Deleted member]

So I've been playing exclusive PM Link for quite awhile now, to the point where my muscle memory only knows Link and I play other characters very badly. I feel if I focus and practice on alts that it might mess up my Link timings. Anyone have tips with dealing with this?

 

[JesteRace]

So I've been playing exclusive PM Link for quite awhile now, to the point where my muscle memory only knows Link and I play other characters very badly. I feel if I focus and practice on alts that it might mess up my Link timings. Anyone have tips with dealing with this?

I play a lot of friendlies with the people in my scene every week, and what I'd do is just play Link and my alts(Bowser/Luigi) every other match. Link, Luigi, Link, Bowser, Link, Luigi, Link, Bowser, etc. Practicing my alts while keeping Link fresh.

 

[Gunslinger]

I'm honestly very worried on how the pm dev team is going to handle the nerfs to link. He needs a couple sure, but there seems to be a lot of link hate out there that I don't quite understand, and that might lead to an over nerf in the next version. What do you guys think?

His tether recovery is going to be nerfed to the extreme. I can also see them making his projectiles less powerful, but you can easily crouch cancel them. I honestly wouldn't mind them nerfing his recovery if they buffed some aspects of him for his onstage presence, like gave him a better wavedash or longer dash dance.

 

[Deleted member]

His tether recovery is going to be nerfed to the extreme. I can also see them making his projectiles less powerful, but you can easily crouch cancel them. I honestly wouldn't mind them nerfing his recovery if they buffed some aspects of him for his onstage presence, like gave him a better wavedash or longer dash dance.

all I want is a better wavedash for Link

 

[Player -0]

That would require changing his friction amongst other things. Which overall may be harmful to Link as a whole.

 

[Gunslinger]

That would require changing his friction amongst other things. Which overall may be harmful to Link as a whole.

I didn't know that, thanks for the knowledge drop. What do you think is the ideal way Link is handled in 3.5?

 

[JesteRace]

He doesn't need nerfed. People are crybabies.

 

[Player -0]

I didn't know that, thanks for the knowledge drop. What do you think is the ideal way Link is handled in 3.5?

I'm not exactly sure.
- Maybe make it so boomerang can cover low or just make it so super crouch characters don't crouch over everything (Not really a link change).
- Have it so Link never recatches boomerang even if it touches him. It would help with spammability, Link has other options in neutral that are overshadowed a lot by boomerang because it's so good, you would still be able to combo into it and combo off of it. It would also add an interesting (can do it atm but it's harder/less precise) way to harass people offstage.
- I'd almost like to see aerial Up-B damage buffed for last hit a bit because of how tether was nerfed but it's fine as is. Increasing damage would allow for more bomb jumps.


Not many changes are needed in my opinion. I'm not really sure about my changes either, boomerang probably needs to be reworked a bit though from where it currently stands.

 

[Mr.Pickle]

He doesn't need nerfed. People are crybabies.

They are to a point, but some of the things they complain about have merit. Refusing the possibility of changes to him and insulting critiques is not a way to go about it. I'd give my opinion on what needs to be done with him, but I don't main him and it's not my place to begin with. I just take an interest in his design because a good buddy of mine, whom I train with often, mains him. If @Beorn gives his opinion on it, I'll chime in, but that's about it.

 

[Heero Yuy]

I've been in the lab with numerous characters to CP Link dittos and I've narrowed it down to Marth and Sonic.

Who does better vs Link in your opinions? Both characters do beat Link soft counters IMO, cuz Marth can swap away the projectiles and punish him hard while Sonic is just so fast to get in.

 

[Player -0]

Sonic can wreck tethers super hard right now and doesn't have as many recovery problems as Marth. Depends if you want the range or the speed. I think Sonic is better.

 

[JesteRace]

Marth's advantage is that he's a mid-range swordsman like Link, so it's an easier transition than going to Sonic, who is NOTHING like Link. Thing is, I don't think he counters Link at all. It's pretty even, at least in my experience. Sonic definitely gives Link a harder time.

 

[Heero Yuy]

So guys whether or not he reads this, I'll say it anyway... I'm gonna challenge Anaky (best Link in the UK) to a MM to see if I'm good. Hopefully I can get it streamed too.

If he is reading this...Please let it be less than 5 pounds. I'm a poor college student lol.

 

[Player -0]

Money Match him to a money match.

 

[Deleted member]

So guys whether or not he reads this, I'll say it anyway... I'm gonna challenge Anaky (best Link in the UK) to a MM to see if I'm good. Hopefully I can get it streamed too.

If he is reading this...Please let it be less than 5 pounds. I'm a poor college student lol.

do what matt dot zeb does and challenge everyone to $1 money matches lol

 

[Fortress]

IMO Pit is the go-to counter to Link. He's got the movement options to deal with Link's wall of projectiles, the sheer speed in his entire moveset to stuff most of everything Link has (can anybody say frame three uSmash), some terrific range in those normals, and possibly one of the most effective projectiles in the entire game, with even more utility and control than boomerang (which Pit's tools can also just shut out).

Marth can be spammed out rather easily, and is floaty enough to see some early and reliable kills off of dAir, and Sonic's movement can be shut down by Link's safely-ranged sword attacks (even nAir beats out Sonic's spinning attacks most of the time). Bombs can be used to just blow Sonic up as he rolls over them, which goes about the same way for a Marth who is swinging for the fences.

Pit's just got everything that can put Link into the worst positions Link can be in. An even longer ranged game that is fast enough to keep a constant pressure on Link, similarly to how Falco can do it (Arrows of Light really don't care about Hylian Shield the same way Falco's blaster does) helps maintain a presence at even Link's most comfortable ranges, for one. Second, once he's in, Pit's in to stay, with some of the fastest normals in the game (that hit like a freight train, mind you), and a grab that combos into pretty much anything that Pit has to offer, all of which will almost certainly be faster than anything Link might have to offer.

People say that matchup is 50/50, Pit mains will say it's 55/45 (Pit), but I honestly think it's 70/30 (Pit).

He doesn't need nerfed. People are crybabies.

Link definitely needs to be toned down in some respects.

• Rang should be 2.5 rang sans catching animation
• uTilt recovery should be longer and/or active frames reduced to make it not link into itself so well
• Jab2 should have higher knockback and/or later IASA so as to not have so many guaranteed followups (this in itself makes actually confirming through Jab1 important)
• Dash Attack should start a little later (maybe on frame 9, so it doesn't hit nearly as high)

I think Link could stand to see some improvements in some other areas, though.

• less durable bombs; making the bomb recovery more feasible and at the same time making shield pressure through projectiles a stronger option, further focusing Link's game on zoning
• slightly larger box on Hylian Shield, further emphasizing Link as one of the go-to projectile users with the tools to deploy them and deal with them at his own range

Most of the changes I can dream up for Link are along the lines of decreasing his sword's effectiveness and increasing his focus on projectiles/dealing with projectiles, making him the archetypal 'zoner who struggles up close', where now he sits as a sort of clunky jack-of-all-trades kind of character. He's fast enough to where his 'trouble zones' aren't too troublesome for him.

 

[EmptySky00]

NEW VERSION HERE I AM TO WHINE AGAIN

But seriously, I don't like the new special fall landing animation xD Can we please revert that at some point?

Frame 5 jumpsquat had me so excited. It's a massive boon to my playstyle lol.
I like how Link was changed in a way that's clearly a nerf or "toning down" but made to feel different enough so that I don't just dwell on what I can't do anymore. I approve thus far.

Does it seem to anyone else like his bomb throw distance is shorter?

 

[cmloe]

NEW VERSION HERE I AM TO WHINE AGAIN

But seriously, I don't like the new special fall landing animation xD Can we please revert that at some point?

Frame 5 jumpsquat had me so excited. It's a massive boon to my playstyle lol.
I like how Link was changed in a way that's clearly a nerf or "toning down" but made to feel different enough so that I don't just dwell on what I can't do anymore. I approve thus far.

Does it seem to anyone else like his bomb throw distance is shorter?

What new special fall landing animation? maybe i haven't noticed it yet. Link feels faster in this build with his faster jumpsquat. I agree about the bombs too, i used to throw my bomb into my boomerang and the bomb would pop up so i could do some neat bomb tricks but not it barley pops up but the bombs are closer to me since they don't go as far

 

[Fortress]

My crew and I are enjoying the new Link. Not only does our Ganondorf have new tools to deal with Link's kit, but the recovery game in general has been dialed back enough to make defeating Link rewarding enough while keeping his game crisp, fast, and clean. I've still got my options, my crew has new ones to deal with me. It's a win-win, really.

 

[Hylian]

Glad you guys are understanding and enjoying the new build.

 

[EmptySky00]

When you land with up B you go into a derpy ass face plant looking thing. It was much nicer looking before.

He was toned down quite a bit in regards to harassment game. At least how I played it. But all (most) of the dumb **** seemed to be toned down as well, so in relation it might be ok. That movement though...


and ZSS is going to be ****ing absurd. I'm calling this ****.

 

[Mi4Slayer]

I really don't like the changes. hope he still manage to be a high tier

 

[EmptySky00]

People vastly overestimated him in 3.0 <_< M2K being the best example. Link was never top 3. Or top 5. That's just ****ing absurd.


But I'm willing to give these nerfs a whirl. I wasn't carried by my character and I'll still **** people up.

Explain to me why his Nair was made weird though? I've no idea how this will affect gameplay, but it seems annoying.

 

[Mi4Slayer]

yeah :/ is nair is nerf, is Ftilt , up tilt, from what I saw from the channel log. Is rang damage at mid rang I can understand, and even the 2 frame add up. But the other stuff... I don't get it.

some even say that is recovery was slightly nerf... But i saw nothing in the log and I didn't take my time to really play it much yet.

 

[EmptySky00]

yeah :/ is nair is nerf, is Ftilt , up tilt, from what I saw from the channel log. Is rang damage at mid rang I can understand, and even the 2 frame add up. But the other stuff... I don't get it.

some even say that is recovery was slightly nerf... But i saw nothing in the log and I didn't take my time to really play it much yet.

Rang got ****ed harder than I thought. But I'm not going to ***** and complain.

The biggest thing I overlooked when constructing my optimism is that the angle it hits was changed from 80 to 70. So follow-ups are much harder.


Also the Empty Combo is gone <_< I'm actually a little pissed about that. Dthrow --> Up B seems to work much better now, but that's not as swag.

 

[AtlusKnight]

Hello everyone I'm a new Link main trying to get better at smash, I started about 6 months ago in smash. Thanks to my scene who helped me a lot I think I improved a lot over those 6 months. Of course I was lurking all the boards and looking up all the videos of some top links. Regardless I hope my interactions with you all will further improve my game and help me.

 

[EmptySky00]

Hello everyone I'm a new Link main trying to get better at smash, I started about 6 months ago in smash. Thanks to my scene who helped me a lot I think I improved a lot over those 6 months. Of course I was lurking all the boards and looking up all the videos of some top links. Regardless I hope my interactions with you all will further improve my game and help me.

I'll be making a 3.5 version of my Link advanced Technique guide as soon as a certain Puerto Rican mofo gives me my recording equipment back, so that may help you out in some way depending on where you're at with your game.

 

[Hylian]

I'm going to be streaming in about 30 minutes if anyone wants to watch. twitch.tv/hylian88

 

[EmptySky00]

So I'm legitimately starting to realize how bad some of these nerfs are. I believe Link is probably fine, but some of this **** is beyond excessive. Did Fair need to lose the damage? Did Nair need to be altered? Did Utilt really need to lose 1 frame of startup and IASA?
Why can boomerang be crouched at 110? I'll deal with it, but my optimism is nearly gone.

 

[Fortress]

Yes. The changes made are about making more meaningful interactions between players happen. Part of that is going to be having to put more than four brain cells into picking an attack for the correct situation. On top of that, recoveries on the whole are weaker to make actually removing a character from the stage more rewarding. Link's recovery has never been great outside of PM, and it was taken to an extreme in PM. It's been dialed back to what is a good balance for his onstage control. Get over it, and learn to deal.

fAir losing a bit of damage isn't huge, nAir is still fine, just learn to space your moves properly, and yes, uTilt did need to be slower so as not to combo into itself until the end of time. That's been more-or-less the idea across the board for some of the higher-ranked characters; less brainless followups, more meaningful thought put into repeating an attack or initiating one.

Good players can learn to deal, and make their character work. Link is just fine, probably the best version of him I've played yet.

 

[AtlusKnight]

Actually went into lab right away, the wave dash is really fast and good feeling so microspacing with Link is amazing actually. On top of that the KB for Fair is significant it will really change how it feels. The boomerang continues to be a hitbox as it flies back from clang. Link feels really smooth for the most part and requires some adjusting which was super easy honestly. The nair nerf is totally fine it allows for some follow ups. After some time in friendlies I have found out the bombs are stronger and has increased KB but same damage. Killed a squirtle at 120ish.