Sarix
Smash Ace
It all really started after Link's boomerang got changed in 2.6, (for the better imo). But what ya gonna do?Worst thread NA...
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It all really started after Link's boomerang got changed in 2.6, (for the better imo). But what ya gonna do?Worst thread NA...
See I know your joking now.Have the animation match with Link's nair frame data from Melee and have it instantly end as soon as the hitbox vanishes, duh.
I'll call you when you were being addressed. I'm free to incite a discussion about a change. It wasn't even that real. So I'd appreciate it if you would mind your own business and not try to belittle me. Thanks.Worst thread NA...
Links nair was one of the only moves(if not the only move, I can't think of any others) to have hitboxes out after the animation ends. How is that not past a threshold? The reason for changing it was polish. It got changed for the same reasons that we changed a bunch of hitboxes on links moves. Changing those hitboxes for polish inherently buffed link, while matching nairs hitbox to it's animation inherently nerfed him(even though it's so insignificant you might as well be arguing semantics). Why aren't you complaining about the hitbox changes to links moves? Those didn't pass a threshold. Things don't need to cross a threshold for us to change them, if that was true half our characters moves wouldn't even exist. Lucario wouldn't exist, ZSS would be incredibly different etc etc. Having creative freedom when designing characters means taking from some aspects of the character and adding to others is a thing that needs to be thought about. If every move was looked at by itself then characters would be incredibly shallow.
No, I'm not arguing that it's not objectively worse, I'm saying the move is still so good that the point is almost negligible, you are asking why was it changed at all then and I'm telling you it was for polish, the same reason other hitboxes he had were changed.
Because being able to grab out of the air is a huge balance/enjoyment factor concern so more thought needs to go into the risk/rewards of polish vs balance. I personally think Link SHOULD be able to grab out of the air, but I'm not the only one designing him and I was alone in this thought even though I argued essays about it. Some standards have to be deviated from for various reasons even though we don't often enjoy doing it.
Uh..what? I was trying to point out how tunnel visioned you were being by only focusing on one move as opposed to changes to the entire moveset and how changes to the entire moveset could affect said move. Yes, old nair was a little better, but link doesn't need it with all the changes he got, I would much rather his hitboxes be consistent with their animations.
So...you are nitpicking.
But I guess your argument is the other side of the coin, that it’s so insignificant that it should be changed for polish’s sake.
Yeah I honestly don't see why anyone would make a fuss about Link losing some active frames on his Nair. It still has a long duration and still fulfills its original functions.Are we still arguing over the miniscule loss of active frames on link's nair, which was clearly unpolished and not well coded in melee and is logically fixed to make sense in P:M because there is no need to replicate the jank due to the fact that the loss is negligible in practice, and only matters if you count frames (ie theory talk), and despite that, he's been compensated to the point where that particular aspect is becomes even less valuable in the grand scheme of things?
I wasn't trying to be combative, which is sort of what my statement was acknowledging, that it became that way regardless of original intention.No need to be combative, this is exactly my point.
Well for starters F-throw now sets up a DACUS follow up really well which is great for all sorts of combo options since DACUS is one of Link's best combo fillers. The F-throw > DACUS is also useable against floaties like Peach so it's very useful. F-throw also has a chain grab on fast fallers that can carry to the ledge to rack up like 50%. I believe around 50% if Link F-throws a fast faller or any non-floaty he can get a possibly guaranteed knockdown and do an oki set up. I don't know if fast fallers have the frames to tech before landing from it so I may be wrong.I read somewhere (perhaps even earlier in this thread) that there were some slight changes to Link's throws in 2.6 that are designed to make him less reliant on just D-throw. Anyone care to enlighten me on that subject? I personally find myself using D-throw for combos and the other throws just for positional advantage (i.e. tossing people off ledges or onto platforms).
Holy crap! Those ledge bomb tricks are delicious. Definitely learned some new things that I can use with Link...Some matches from a tournament I was at about a month ago:
Hylian vs Vro: http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=aJc2yIl10-Y
Hylian vs Calabrel: http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=M_RU4aJfgVc
I haven't watched these yet but I had an injured finger this tournament so I probably played pretty bad lol. Keep in mind this is 2.5 as well.
Edit: Also here is some good doubles play from the losers finals of that tournament if anyone is interested in doubles:
Hylian/Strongbad vs Darkatma/Deku
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=uU88ELPKVj8
o snaps thxYou press down!
Stream going up in a couple of minutes, come check out Me/Metroid/Darkatma and friends play, Roy/Mewtwo gameplay going to be streamed as well.
www.twitch.tv/metroid1117
Haha I've been practicing some of your bomb tricks. Got the bomb drop and push with z-air down just about. And can kiiiiinda do the double aerial glide toss to tether the ledge... not coordinated enough to let go, jump and AGT the bomb again tho lol... still working on that.I always love hearing that . I do have some pretty mean zair tricks actually but they are very situational so I end up not using them a lot. I really want people to realize you can be creative and awesome with a character while still being somewhat simple and effective so I base my playstyle around that. I've yet to see someone learn all my bomb tricks though and I really want to see some videos of other Links using them because they really throw opponents off in tournaments lol because it's not something you can practice against.
I can land the hits with it most of the time, but I think it's more of a 'I have better options available' type of problem that I'm having. I'm using it when I could be doing other things, and I'm neglecting the powerful 'rang+spin attack killer that Link can do. I think I'll try the second option, and just stop using it for a few games and see where that takes me, and what it opens up for me.Wifi version has light press airdodge. Offline has fullpress airdodge.
As for weaning yourself off the boomerang, the best way is probably to play against people who will punish you for using boomerang poorly. Another way is simply to play a bunch of games without using boomerang at all, which forces yourself to adapts your playstyle. Lastly, if you have a recording setup you can analyze videos of yourself to find moments when you could have been punished, or when a different option would have been better, and then go back to playing and mentally slapping yourself anytime you recognize a situation where you should have done something other than boomerang. (This last one probably isn't that great of a solution, but i do recommend doing this for the very sake of figuring out if your boomerang usage is actually a problem.)
I also do this occasionally as I use it waaaay too much heheh.I can land the hits with it most of the time, but I think it's more of a 'I have better options available' type of problem that I'm having. I'm using it when I could be doing other things, and I'm neglecting the powerful 'rang+spin attack killer that Link can do. I think I'll try the second option, and just stop using it for a few games and see where that takes me, and what it opens up for me.
I think my soul just collapse on itself and imploded the universe of existence...It's just so BnB like Mario's fireballs or spacie lasers, you just toss it out without really thinking. Everybody does it at some point
If you feel that way, you can do what I do and experiment with the other projectiles. It's greatly improved my zoning and pressure game and gives me an idea of how each tools is applicable.I'm not really getting punished for it. I mean, it's landing hits, leading into combos, and helping me pick people up off of the ground, but I can't help but feel as if I'm missing something here.