DISCLAIMER: TL;DR
I could do some stuff with MAS involving Jigglypuff, but I want to bring up something vital towards the successive usage of MAS & the Back Slashes real quick after having a skype call with @
erico9001
--
Mighty Air Slash Tip
I feel that most of us play with AS or AAS, so we're very accustomed to delaying the 2nd hit for horizontal gain which is especially important for the
DShield + AAS combination. BUT, this is completely different for MAS. The secret to recovering horizontally with MAS is the opposite to what you'd do with AS or AAS; you simply mash the B button for both hits of MAS while holding the control stick towards the ledge, or instead for the 2nd hit you'd:
- Press
- Tap
- Flick the in any direction:
Any of those button inputs above are fine to use for the 2nd hit of AS AAS & MAS. If you wonder why you'd be pressing the A Z or C-stick buttons see this quote from the AT's thread:
Air Slash Recovering Horizontally
How to perform it:
(Recovering Left)
» Immediately Tap & Hold
» Delay Pressing
/
/
/
(Recovering Right)
» Immediately Tap & Hold
» Delay Pressing
/
/
/
Applications: Optimizing our recovery with Air Slash is vital & very helpful. Times you're launched out too far & need to inch closer horizontally with the 2nd hit of Air Slash is key for surviving longer. For a visual signal of when it's safe inputting the 2nd hit of Air Slash after enough time delaying it, watch the red Beam disappearing from the Monado as it's swung behind Shulk. Right as you see that happening, input the 2nd slash while holding toward the direction you're moving towards to maximize the horizontal distance of the Air Slash. This helpful tactic is further improved by the Jump & Speed Arts because of their respected increased mobility stats, & as you'd figure the Shield Art makes this worse, delaying the 2nd hit of Air Slash with Shield active can still save your stock because delaying the 2nd slash to move forward or backward in most cases is always better than not delaying it at all.
*Note* Whenever you're performing an Air Slash & per-say you get hit in the midst of the delayed 2nd hit of Air Slash by an attack near the ledge, then pressing the B button again while holding forward would input as Back Slash which is a huge no-no. Instead of pressing B, conditioning yourself by pressing the A button or flicking the C-stick would input as a F-air. And pressing the Z button inputs as Airdodge, which finishes quicker than F-air. Perhaps maybe players would think it's good to input Air Slash normally & instead press Z for the 2nd slash in hopes to avoid inputting a move that could be a dangerous risk to do.
So back to MAS, you recover greater horizontal distance by inputting the move quicker essentially making MAS "easy-mode" in this manner. Not only do you gain a great amount of vertical height from both hits of MAS, but the mashing allows better horizontal drifting after both hits of MAS full finish & you're free-falling in the special-fall state. It's quite helpful.
Now something I recently figured out upon messing around with MAS is when you're inputting MAS with
+
, you'll want to flick the
to the
or
while holding
so that you stay going straight up while shifting forward during the 2nd hit. It doesn't appear to look any different but you do get a better horizontal recovering result. Still, the most optimized way that @
erico9001
& I figured out is to mash
for both hits, or pressing
/
/
for the 2nd hit while holding
/
in order to greatly recover better for both vertical & horizontal.
I will say that after doing more messing around with it via 1/4 (Hold L) setting in Training Mode, Shulk goes higher if you very slightly delay the 2nd hit so that he reaches his 1st hit's apex. I hope this information helps MAS get on some sets but I didn't even discuss about the damage / KO potential.
My Back Slash Realizations
Currently in the OP, we see Back Slash in most of our sets & Back Slash Leap in only a couple of them. At first we had good reasons not to include BSC in a single set, then we discussed about it being good in theory with some provided examples of it's potential, then we decided against putting it in any sets except one at max. But now I feel that we should at least be in favor to change that. Recently with the discussion relating to the sets we'd like, it's been going well but the Back Slashes are rarely mentioned yet again with reasoning to why that is -- Back Slash doesn't define the set. We say that the Back Slash variant doesn't define the set unlike the Monado Arts Air Slashes or Vision variants do, but perhaps we could give more insight & notice to the Back Slashes so that they help solidify a set like icing on a cake.
Back Slashes basically have 3 hitbox categories aka phases in order:
- Startup
- Falling
- Landing.
If you've checked the frame data pastebin for the Back Slashes, you'll notice that Back Slash has a bunch of outcomes in the Startup category, & Back Slash Charge having many outcomes in the Landing category. .That's nice & all, but don't pay too much mind to it because we're focusing on what really matters -- the best part of each Back Slash variant (IMO). Let's go over each one:
Back Slash, The Well-Rounded Falling of Doom
The regular BS is a well-rounded move primarily used as a mixup tool, capable of destruction with a couple of good reads. Like I said, the Startup, Falling, & Landing hitbox portions are all well-rounded in that connecting with either one of the 3 is fine & dandy especially the airborne Falling portion.
Because BS has a good spread of damages & knockback & it's properties of the move itself is a treat. The endlag is the least of the 3 on top of this move getting a bit of a advancing jump to hop over linear projectiles that are kind of off the ground. Notable mentions of Back Slash are always welcomed & favored as a follow-up from B-throw, & stage spiking with Back Slash as means of sacrificing a stock can net a hype KO if they don't tech. Not much else to say, but I will say that out of the most isntances we'll get any phase of BS, it will most likely be the Falling or Startup hitbox. I'll list what I think we should focus on for BS going in order of importance & priority:
- All 3. .Okay fine I'll do alphabet letters:
a. Falling
b. Startup
c. Landing
"Why isn't the Startup ranked higher than Falling?", you may be asking. Like I said, all 3 phases of BS are good in their own way, but the falling hitbox would be the most important because this is what we aim for the most, not to mention that using the Startup in a regular situation especially Neutral is unsafe & will be most likely punished without mercy. "But that can be said for all the Back Slashes.", yes that it can, but right now, BS has the least endlag of the 3 variants, so why focus on the beginning of the move when we want BS to go as smoothly as we can to avoid whatever punish we may receive? Because hitlag on top of out of shield reactions from the opponent give them much more time to punish our move rather than utilizing the Falling hit to at least deal decent damage on shield & shield knockback while suffering a bit of hitlag much later than early. This all factors in & I'd rather take hitlag later than having my opponent watch a Back Slash done early close by shielded in response. BS can be used for roll reads as well, & the Falling hitbox is much more likely to connect that the Starrtup or Landing hitbox. Although, if you want to get technical about the maximum damage you can deal on shield, the Landing hitbox of BS deals more shield damage because the Landing hitbox phase deals the most additional shield damage, a whopping (+10) for every BS variant, whereas the Startup & Falling hitbox phases are only (+7). However, actually trying to perform only the Landing hitbox phase on an opponent is not easy & is IMO the hardest hitbox phase to connect with BS. Nonetheless I wish you good luck mastering all hitbox phases of BS.
Back Slash Leap, The Landing Terror
The custom BSL is essentially a closer-quarreling higher jumping punish in reaction to avoiding a larger projectile, mistake or a committed action from the opponent regardless of their position. Yes, I'm even talking about off-stage, any Back Slash off-stage is hype! BSL basically skips the Startup hitbox phase since you're less likely to hit someone in most cases, & shifts to the Falling & Landing hitbox faster than the regular BS, but the trade-offs are that BSL's Startup Damages are the worst of the 3 Back Slashes, BSL's Startup is the worst between its 3 hitbox categories, & BSL has longer endlag. Having any commitment to using this move can be more dangerous to Shulk as he's very punishable during this. While the Falling hitbox is great alike to the regular Back Slash, the distance Back Slash Leap travels forward is the least out of the 3 & you may still whiff someone in mid-air especially if they're drifting away from you even if you get the airdodge read. I'll list what we should focus on for BSL going in order of importance & priority:
- The Landing
- The Falling
- The Startup
Most of all, the greatest aspect of BSL I feel is the Landing hitbox portion & here's my broken record reasoning why:
- Back Slash Leap performed from the stage floor underneath a platform on more than several legal stages results in BSL's Landing hitbox occurring even sooner because of the platform's height being just high / low enough for Shulk to land on it quicker on top of BSL being a few frames faster on the Startup than BS. You make BSL that much better of a move when you involve the move's placement on platforms or any stage formations that favor the apex height of BSL to compensate for the longer endlag. The key thing here is you don't have to be grounded to land on a platform above you. If need be, you can always SH or FH up to reach a platform if it means landing on it to still reach for the legendary 18%(+10).
- A Buster Art active while performing the BSL platform strategy closer to the platform's edge can cause Shulk to physically slide off the platform, making Shulk "safer". He still takes the entire endlag but he is off of the platform nonetheless. If you happened to break their shield in the process, then congrats to your tons of damage following the way. If not, then it does put a damper on things now that the opponent knows of the strategy & won't be as careless, but you weakened their shield very low so they won't be as reliant on it for a bit. The Landing hitboxes for all 3 Back Slashes deal more additional damage than any other hitbox phase, & because BSL deals the most damage being 18%(+10), it's no wonder why a Buster Art especially HBuster makes the Landing hit on the backside of their shield so deadly.
- Despite that the Startup IMO is the worst phase of the 3 since it has the worst damages between the 3 BS variants, outside of using platforms to your advantage you'd never likely hit someone with the Startup because you start in the air higher than Ganondorf standing tall, & lastly it's a very short active frame window. After the active frames of Startup finishes & you're not too close by to the opponent upon rising up during BSL's Startup, the usage of platforms automatically skips the Falling hitbox phase going straight to the Landing phase. That's fantastic when you really think about it. The higher that the platform is off the ground enough for BSL to land on it, the quicker BSL's Landing hitbox will occur.
Back Slash Charge, The Unyielding Startup
The custom BSC is an odd move & is wondered if it's even good. My answer deep down is mixed for this move, but we as well as I know that BSC's damages are very petty, the knockback is less-than-impressive, & the endlag afterwards is just atrocious to the point we question why we'd even use this move, so why? Why would we truly roll with this custom in a Singles format other than it's ability to intervene in Doubles? One word: Startup. Out of the 3 Back Slashes, BSC takes the award for having the worst Falling hitbox phase despite the great distance & reach. Players who enjoy using BS will usually utilize it for the regular Falling hitbox, so in that regard it's understandable why Back Slash fans dislike BSC when it's Falling & Landing phases are underwhelming. But worry not, for we shouldn't look at a Back Slash for just one phase let alone the Falling phase of BSC -- it's terrible albeit the distance traveled is something else.
I'll list what we should focus on for BSC going in order of importance & priority:
- The Startup
- The Landing
- The Falling
TBH I think that the Landing & Falling phases can be on the same level of importance but they're both eh regardless. One factor aspect about this move that we widely know about is also the Super Armor. It starts on Frame 1 & ends on Frame 31. Back Slash Charge's Startup hitbox hits on Frame 31 & ends on Frame 32. "So how is the Startup ranked #1 even with Super Armor?" -- The Super Armor allows us to trade taking damage for dealing the ideal back-hitting 15% damage that we'd want from that moment. However, we can also utilize the amazingness that is Frame 1 Super Armor for times we're being juggled / combo'd to the sides. As long as we're not too far off from the stage's floor to come back to, & the height / angle that you're launched isn't too low, BSC has the pseudo-horizontal potential to make it back to the stage whenever we're in that dire situation on the verge of losing our stock. We'd only suffer BSC's endlag for the price to land on the stage thus living longer. When it comes down to Shulk getting juggled / combo'd, it's quite struggling & tough to deal with those moments due to Shulk having poor frame data & -- let me stop there. BSC is Frame 1. . .that's a solution right? "But that will get repetitive & the opponent will keep their mind open to the fact that we could BSC at anytime in a panic moment." -- That's good. Making the opponent aware that we have an option for that dire situation lets them know we have SOMETHING to combat one of Shulk's struggling problems. You're using a
Shield Art? Great, the hitstun reduction you gain from the reduced knockback taken allows you to input other options like doublejumping away, Vision countering, AAS, or airdodging, but add BSC to the mix & now you're a tank who takes reduced damage & Super Armors through a moment for up to 30 frames. Since Jump Seed & Shield Arts do not affect the jump height, air speed, or generally the distance BSC travels, it makes that much more sense to use it with a Shield Art recovering -- or at the least promotes the suggestion that it could come in handy once or twice in mixing up how you recover. Using a
Smash Art? Great, that compensates for BSC's petty knockback but not until later percents where you have some kind of Rage Effect to add onto your knockback. Damage output is even worse unless you get the sweet sweet back hitting Startup, & that has moderately nice KO power.
Bottom line is, yes the endlag is the worst of the 3 Back Slash variants, & yes the move deals the least damage, but this move gives us an opportunity to utilize an option starting with SA on Frame 1 no less -- Let's use it more & see just how much less we get combo'd with this on shall we?
Also, I don't recommend just doing this whenever you feel like you need to GTFO at anytime especially from airborne juggles / combos. Although, a character with slow running speed, average air speed for drifting for the chase, or any fast options to close the gap quick enough that they lack could make BSC that much better for the occasion.
The Landing hitbox phase is interesting to say the least. As I've said earlier, the Landing phase deals the most additional shield damage (+10), & it can do well with BSC if you get the right hit. There's one hitbox moment Shulk lands on the ground upon impact & then there's an additional hitbox moment that stays out for a brief part of the sliding. Just don't get used to thinking the entire slide is a hitbox though, because only the Blade portion of the second portion of the Landing phase is hitbox-worthy
(It's confusing yes I know. . .). Otherwise, the first initial Landing hitbox is all of the Monado including the Beam. It still doesn't justify the horrendous endlag though. And despite that BSC has great horizontal distance, the Falling hitbox is very eh as I've mentioned earlier, but it is great range to get that back hit you're reaching for.
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That's about all I have for thoughts. Oh wait. .so about sets. I've said that BSL is great on platforms for several reasons, so if we have AAS for the platform-drop-through strategy, then why not have some X22X sets for counterpicking / playing stages with platforms?
Stages that can be successful with BSL + AAS:
- Battlefield
- Delfino Plaza
- Kongo Jungle 64
- Skyloft
- Halberd
- Lylat Cruise
- Castle Siege (Transitions 1 & 2)
- Town & City
- Smashville
- Duck Hunt
So yeah. Tell me about your thoughts & what you disagree with. It opens up much more to discussion that way.
