KSSU: Helper to Hero Mafia/Newbie 11 - Game Over!

[X1-12]

I'm not particularly sold either way on the Joey thing, people should talk about it and tell us their opinions on it

 

[#HBC | Nabe]

'kay.
July, thoughts?

 

[Gova]

2. July ()
3. -Joey- ()
7. Oki ()
8. X1-12 ()
9. Nabe ()

Not Voting: July, Joey, Oki, X1-12, Nabe

With 5 playing it takes 3 to lynch!

Deadline is January 29th at 11:59 PM CST (-6 GMT)

 

[July]

From my point of view, Joey must be scum now. Oki is confirmed town, leaving Joey, X1, and Nabe as potential scum. I don't know if we ever established if both ICs can be scum, but that would be drastically unbalanced, so as far as I see it they are not both scum. That leaves Joey as a scum partner to either X1 or Nabe.

Not that Joey hasn't done potentially scummy things on his own, with the latest scum slip possibility, leaving his vote on Ran, etc. These blended in with his pro-town actions to make him seem like he was just playing newb town, but now I believe those actions were actually intentional; my belief that Joey was town was inaccurate.

._. Well crap. Where do we go from here?
Do we get on Joey because of his supposed scum slip, or what?
Don't worry, I'm not gonna vote.

Oki, as confirmed town, your opinion is the only one that we know is pro-town; just remember that two of the opinions and scum reads you get are from town, and two are from scum themselves. My opinion is above that there is a newb/IC scum team, and that means Joey is scum. Idk which IC his scum buddy is more likely to be though.

 

[#HBC | Nabe]

Why am I up?
Thanks, July. Am I to understand that you have no read on either IC?

X1, I'd like your reads next, before Joey's.

Joey, I'd like you to evaluate any potential pros and cons of everybody claiming their character. (No one else comment on this before Joey, thanks.) You can tell us your own reads when X1 has expressed his own. If you disagree and would like to speak before X1, that's up to you.

Oki, I'd like you to withhold who you think is scum for now so that our opinion pool is in the dark about your take. Please ask questions of people if you like, and step in when you've decided who we'll be lynching toDay. If you don't want that responsibility, for now let us assume that you do.

 

[#HBC | Nabe]

X1, to clarify, you can choose if I go before or after Joey, but I'd like you to give your reads first.

 

[X1-12]

@Joey: If you want to re-read/collect your thoughts now then that's fine, just don't post them, copy-paste into a notepad and save it instead.

@All: Expect answers to all outstanding questions + full reads by tomorrow. Apologies

 

[July]

Why am I up?
Thanks, July. Am I to understand that you have no read on either IC?

I do have a read on the ICs, but I would like to hear Joey's opinions/reads before I share them.

 

[X1-12]

I'm happy with Lynching July, followed by Joey most likely. For a start July's town read on Joey has just completely 180'd into a scum-read which looks to me as though scum have found themselves in a tight spot and want to distance, I'm considering the possibility that Nabe could have told July to act in such a way, but in all honesty I would expect him to have done it much more subtly than that if he was, that may sound like dangerous reasoning but coupled with the fact that I'm yet to see any sizeable anti-town intent from Nabe while playing or whilst doing my re-read/re-skim (I skimmed most of the posts by dead or clear players). The worst I had on Nabe was his not wanting to talk about Oki, something I'm pretty much completely disregarding now since Oki is confirmed town. July has pretty much been a non-presence all game, but I'm going to beleive I only let her get away with it because its a newbie game. She has been relatively safe i.e asking ICs when its ok to hammer, however thats not particularly scummy on its own, just makes me think even more her partner isn't Nabe - She'd not bother asking in thread, she'd just ask him privately on AIM or whatever. I also don't think Nabe would advocate playing the noob card

A few things about Joey that stood out. in #228 she decides that whatever action TRS would make, she would still not be as good a lynch target as Ran/TGD (this is before the cop claim and the DH replacing in). In #467 she attacks July, for being safe, "really really really really safe" which does not convince me of intent to scumhunt. I feel Joey's attack on July is really poorly substantiated. July also seems to ignore what is being said and attacks Oki instead (#508) I'm still not sold on the #611 possible scumslip thing, but it definitely doesn't do anything to help his case. YesterDay Joey was also all like "If not DH then July", but at the start of the Day did not come in and say anything about July - its possible that Nabe had asked her to wait before should could though.

#529 Nabe says there is most likely scum between me/Oki/Joey, Oki claims cop and is cleared yet Nabe allows DH to go as opposed to the other 2. He has also done stuff like let me do all the work.. lol (#540) but I don't find that particularly scummy, maybe its my ego getting the better of me idk

@Nabe: Explain this (bolded), its about Doc Directing

^ Not that it matters in the long run, but I'd rather that I have two numbers to my name and Ran has three. If mafia does decide to try their luck, I'd rather we don't lose our clear.

I'm actually confident in either a Joey or July lynch because I'm as certain as I'll ever get of anything in mafia that they're the scumteam. I got a bit paranoid after I first saw Nabe as scum in another game because I saw how well he could play it, but I still don't see enough in this game for me to ever justify lynching him. Oki being cleared also helped a lot in this decision making process, not gonna lie.

Sorry it took ages guys, exams and stuff. Joey next please full reads

 

[Gova]

Joey will be prodded. His next prod will result in a modkill/replacement.

 

[Dooms]

Ehh. This game is pretty straight forward at this point.

It's obviously not Oki, and theres obviously not two IC scum, so I'm voting the obvious choice even though I was told not to.

Vote: July

Her play has been too safe since Day 1. When ever she's about to vote, she uses "Maybe" and she tries to make sure it's okay with the IC's before she votes.

X1, I'm not a she. >_>

 

[X1-12]

sorry about the 'she' thing, but do you not have stances? thoughts? other than july=scum.

Are you aware if both you and her are town, you've just lost the game for your faction?

Nabe maybe I'm getting hasty but I wouldn't mind just wrapping up about now. Post your thoughts first if Joey doesn't have anything

 

[Dooms]

Unless IC's are both scum, then it has to be July. I REALLY doubt that both IC's are scum. >_>; I honestly don't have reads on either of you two because I'm focusing on July until either me (town loses) or her (town gets another day) are dead.

 

[July]

Ehh. This game is pretty straight forward at this point.

It's obviously not Oki, and theres obviously not two IC scum, so I'm voting the obvious choice even though I was told not to.

Vote: July

Her play has been too safe since Day 1. When ever she's about to vote, she uses "Maybe" and she tries to make sure it's okay with the IC's before she votes.

X1, I'm not a she. >_>

This is pretty much what I said; I'm town, and if we were both town both the scum would have hammered me, I would be dead and the game would be over. The fact that I'm not dead means you have to be scum, and one of the ICs has to be scum. I have no choice but to think you are scum, my main reason you are scum is logic above all else.

Vote: Joey

 

[Oki]

Iunno if Nabe wanted to wait on my reads until he did his or what.

 

[#HBC | Nabe]

July, could you give your reads on the ICs, now that Joey has posted?

Joey, please elaborate on the potential pros and cons of everybody claiming a character. Do you think it's plausible we might catch scum that way?

 

[Dooms]

I don't understand how you can tell town v scum apart from Kirby Helpers ._. unless the scum characters aren't kirby helpers...? I don't know how useful it would be if scum had kirby helpers too because none of the kirby helpers really seem scummy I guess...

Since I'm a lynch Candidate though, I'm the plasma wisp. Electricity whoosh!

 

[July]

Yes, I can elaborate. Joey has had connections and suspicions to the ICs in general and X1, but I could find no distinct suspicions of you Nabe. Joey seems to have avoided you all together in his play so far, which makes me believe he is trying to distance himself from you. This is something scum would do to protect his buddy. My scumpicks right now are thus Joey and Nabe, Joey by a huge, huge margin.

Nabe I need to to really, really look back on in his own right, Day 1 I really didn't feel much of a presence from him, but since Day 2 he has been asking a lot more questions and taking sides on the lynches, yet even through all that there is still a lack of discussion between Nabe and Joey that greatly concerns me.

X1 gave me a town vibe Day 1, Day 2 with the various wagon he had supported and other suspicions it raised my suspicions, but I see X1 as much more unlikely as a scum partner to Joey based on their early interactions where Joey quite openly disagreed with X1. So X1 is still suspicious, just less suspicious than Nabe through association, but going into Day 4 I would like to look into BOTH their sets of interactions much more deeply.

Since my reads on the ICs are there but not concrete, Joey is the logical and only safe choice for lynch toDay.

 

[#HBC | Nabe]

July, what do you think about Joey's 657?

 

[July]

I don't know much about the characters of KSSU, so I'm not sure if plasma wisp means something good or bad, but character claiming seems like it could only help figure out scum from town.

My character is Rocky; I kinda look like Kirby's down-b from Smash, and I'm Vanilla Townie.

 

[#HBC | Nabe]

Mhm, thanks for the response. I wasn't asking about his claim, I was asking about his thoughts on claiming, so that was fine.


@X1 w.r.t. the doc directing, I would rather I go than a clear. And if I did go, I would expect that a town could catch scum without me. If not, there's always post-game to talk about what went wrong.

 

[X1-12]

@X1 w.r.t. the doc directing, I would rather I go than a clear. And if I did go, I would expect that a town could catch scum without me. If not, there's always post-game to talk about what went wrong.

I meant, why did you say "Not that it matters in the long run"?

 

[#HBC | Nabe]

Because I didn't think any of the three of us would be targeted.

 

[X1-12]

Joey doesn't seem to be posting anything, stances Nabe?

 

[#HBC | Nabe]

July/Joey scum is more likely than the other two options, but X1/Joey is more likely than July/X1 IMO so I'd rather Joey were lynched. Would also be fine with July going. In a non-math sense, July is the best choice because she's had some odd things to say in her posts.

Oki, if you'd like to post now, go for it.

 

[Dooms]

I have to post before the end of the day or else I'm mod killed.

I have nothing to add. I'm going to wait for Oki.

 

[July]

Same as Joey, my stances and my vote have not changed since my last post.

 

[Gova]

Oki will be prodded.

 

[Oki]

I feel like it is 50/50 between Joey and July, and so it's hard to pick. The way they are fighting though, I highly doubt they are both scum. July has had some odd things to say in her posts, but I also don't like how X1 keeps just dismissing Joey as too newbie to fake certain town tells. It makes a connection between them that I am not comfortable with.

@Mod: When is the deadline.
@Nabe: Why do you say that July is the better choice, but that you would prefer that Joey be lynched? That seems a little off to me. They are not both scum unless they have this super bussing setup going on. It can't be both of them. So why do you think they are both the better choice?

 

[Gova]

2. July (1) Joey
3. -Joey- (1) July
7. Oki ()
8. X1-12 ()
9. Nabe ()

Not Voting: Oki, X1-12, Nabe

With 5 playing it takes 3 to lynch!

Deadline is January 29th at 11:59 PM CST (-6 GMT)

 

[Oki]

Thankee modman.

 

[#HBC | Nabe]

@Nabe: Why do you say that July is the better choice, but that you would prefer that Joey be lynched? That seems a little off to me. They are not both scum unless they have this super bussing setup going on. It can't be both of them. So why do you think they are both the better choice?

If Joey and July are bussing, it's been planned since yesterDay. There would have been a lot of motivation to do so; the potential slip from Joey and everybody's pledged focus on July for toDay.

A Joey/July scumteam contains both members and has no bearing on which one is more likely to be scum. So, I'll explain why Joey's the better lynch by talking about X1/Joey and X1/July scumteams, and what the interactions between the two members of each team mean if both members are scum. Naturally this is all From My Point Of View (FMPOV).

X1/Joey: YesterDay, X1 pointed out a potential slip from Joey. If they're scum together, this was an attempt at a bus. ToDay he wants to lynch July, meaning he thought better of it.

X1/July: X1 is pursuing July toDay. This would be a solid bus. He considered pursuing the slip on Joey but thought better of it because it was rather weak (since Joey fumbled the meaning of MyLo and could have just been newbie-mistaken).

Of these, which is more likely? X1/Joey in my eyes -- if X1 is scum, I'm banking on him being an IC and not bussing his partner. Should I be? Probably not, and in a different game I would be pursuing X1 right now, rather than the two J's.


X1: why did you back off of me yesterDay after Kim claimed?

 

[X1-12]

X1: why did you back off of me yesterDay after Kim claimed?

As far as I remember, I was only on you very briefly as I was running out of scumpicks, I put you in a list along with DH and July of "probably scum in there" DH is now dead and I'm confident that between you and July, July is the scum. Its possible that you both are scum however I don't believe that you would as scum agree to a plan where both members are playing the "hiding, avoiding being noticed" game, especially in a newbie game where it is common practise for players to go after others for simple scumtells such as lurking. I also re-read/re-skimmed and tl;dr I don't find you very scummy.

I'll be voting Joey in 5 minutes

 

[X1-12]

Oh I realise that's not what you asked, I backed off when Oki claimed because if I had to take two of you/DH/July to endgame I would take You/July. DH is prone to less than perfect reasoning and tunnelling, something I don't want in endgame, if I get the scum in that lynch then even better.

 

[X1-12]

No-one is viewing

Vote: Joey

 

[#HBC | Nabe]

Oki picks the lynch. And we need to hear again from Joey.

 

[Oki]

Would like to hear again from Joey.
;; **** guys I am going to **** up and be all mad at myself for doing so.
I don't like how all of you are cool with a Joey vote and definitely one of you has to be scum and also advocating it. Haaaas to.
Which makes me want a July vote on impulse. Reading and making decisions.

 

[July]

For me, knowing between Joey, Nabe, and X1, two are scum, and X1 and Nabe cannot be scum buddies together, reveals two important things
1) Joey is scum (as I've said before) but more importantly
2) both ICs being okay with voting Joey just means one of them is bussing

 

[Dooms]

I honestly don't have anything else to say about this. It's who you trust. I'm sick 'n stuff so I'm not here to convince today. I can tomorrow.

Prod avoid~

 

[Oki]

I guess we will wait on Joey. I'm leaning toward him. I gotta read everything over.
;; All my dead townies, don't be mad.