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Kingdom Hearts Mafia~Day 8~End Game!~Roles revealed!
- Thread starter Chill
- Start date
- Status
agentli
Smash Apprentice
Or...we can put on a time restriction, and therefore end the voting at the end of a certain time. Looking at how some people are on vacation, maybe next week friday if it gets that far? It won't be necessary if we have a majority of the votes down.
Yay! Less angry words! Woot! ^_^
Yay! Less angry words! Woot! ^_^
Ronike
Smash Ace
- Joined
- May 14, 2006
- Messages
- 612
Alright, sounds good. Prolly wont need that long as we only need 2 more approve votes and its an awesome idea. But anyways, we should try and get a completely indifferent "attacker" somehow. Perhaps we should also have voting for the attackers? This way, we lower the chances of mafia member attacking mafia member. Perhaps we should have three votes for who attacks who?
agentli
Smash Apprentice
Hmmm...well it'd probably be easier if we just appointed a panel of people to decide the "attacker"/"defender" stuff. The appointing can be done through voting, and then the panel can decide all of it without having to go through tons of time-consuming voting. If necessary, we can have a vote at the end to approve or disprove of the match-ups. Any dissinents can say their reasons and we can discuss them quickly.
agentli
Smash Apprentice
^_^
Except....we don't know who's in the mafia so how can we tell the mafia not to be on the panel? you probably want the panel to be an odd number too.
Except....we don't know who's in the mafia so how can we tell the mafia not to be on the panel? you probably want the panel to be an odd number too.
Ronike
Smash Ace
- Joined
- May 14, 2006
- Messages
- 612
Higher number of panel members means a greater probability of a lower percentage of mafia members on the panel. And as for the number, five seems too many, and three seems too few. If there is a tie on votes, we could always have a fifth as a tiebreaker chosen, but five always seems like too many to me.
agentli
Smash Apprentice
The panel actually doesn't matter, because the match-ups will be random anyway. What could happen is if 4 people discussed the topic, then if there is a need for a tie-break, the 5th member of the panel will decide. The 5th member won't be allowed to post about the match-ups, he will only be there to post a deciding vote.
agentli
Smash Apprentice
Right, but someone ought to make a list. If we had someone make a list though, that person might be the target of a mafia night kill the next night.
So um....who makes the list? let's get this approved first before we keep talking about it.
So um....who makes the list? let's get this approved first before we keep talking about it.
well, it looks like I have some limited access, my bro doesn't have access though...
I applaude your plan agentli, I think it is the best innovation yet in a game to do something... It may take some time to do this...and with this panel thing, I am a little confused, it seems like you want them to communicate with each other without posting in the thread, but we can't do that, its againt the rules...and when I am attacked along with others who have been active, won't the same arguments be brought up again and defended the same way again, meaning that there wil be just a lot of repitition? but I still like the idea
I applaude your plan agentli, I think it is the best innovation yet in a game to do something... It may take some time to do this...and with this panel thing, I am a little confused, it seems like you want them to communicate with each other without posting in the thread, but we can't do that, its againt the rules...and when I am attacked along with others who have been active, won't the same arguments be brought up again and defended the same way again, meaning that there wil be just a lot of repitition? but I still like the idea
Kujirudo
Smash Lord
Sounds good agent, you are the hero of saving me of boredom. I'm with you.
A sidenote, I'm going to my dad tomorrow, but I don't know if the internet is working at his new home yet. I'm not sure if he has, so please excuse me if I'm not active from tomorrow untill Sunday.
A sidenote, I'm going to my dad tomorrow, but I don't know if the internet is working at his new home yet. I'm not sure if he has, so please excuse me if I'm not active from tomorrow untill Sunday.
Alright so I'm back now and here's what I've come up with so far:
First and foremost, when a game comes to a standstill, you go back and reread things and create discussion from that. You don't come up with utterly ridiculous game changing ideas like the one agentli came up with. I can understand that you guys might be desperate but you need to realized just hwo horribly flawed agentli's idea is. Oh and before I go into explaining my view on agentli's idea, I just want to let you all know that you need to quit being gutless and los ethe habit of just tossing FOS's left and right. It's honestly pathetic. If you are suspicious of someone, VOTE FOR THEM. It's not like your vote is permanent. The only reason you should be FOSing someone is if you are suspicious of them but are UNABLE to vote for them for a certain reason, which could include a voting restriction, yoru vote being occupied by another suspicious person, the game being in a lynch or lose situation or hammer vote, etc. STOP FOSing AND START VOTING! You all complain about how slow the game is moving when you are all partially responsible for it because no one knows the true nature of your suspicions because you never vote for anyone other than the quiet folk. Ok now that that's out of my system, its time to move on.
This whole partner bull is so ridiculously stupid. It totally takes away from the very fabric of teh game. First of all, half of the people here have so little post substance that no one could hope to construct a formidable attack, or constitute a defense against an attack if such a clash is ARTIFICIALLY CREATED. You don't artificially create conflict because all that does is put the entire town in an argumentative state and creates unwarranted suspicions and confusion that should have never existed had teh game been allowed to continue normally. Artificial conflict will also cause people to stretch points, use poor logic, and overall degrade their current "town" image. Forcing people into a combative situation with almost nothing to use in such a debate is an absolutely awful idea. Not to take away from your efforts agentli, as it really seems that your plan was well thought out, you need to realize that it was a nasty concoction brought abotu as a result of idleness, and is inherently destructive to the flow of the game. I truly do beleive you are town agentli, but plain and simple, your idea sucks.
To be quite honest, if it wa spossible I would probably vote for all of you for so blindly agreeing to parttake in this proposition, but I obviously can't do that. So I guess I need to narrow it down to one person eh?
The decision here is altogether simple for me. I can clearly identify a consistant antagonist from this group. That would be Ligolski, and I'll start by doing this: Vote: Ligolski
It really seems to me that Ligolski has a bad habit of going after people for easy reasons, a common scum trait. My first example of this was him continuing to chase after commonyoshi when he again proposed a nameclaim, an idea that had already been shot down. I for one beleive that commonyoshi is town, and that he either was forced to propose the idea again due to role contraints or he simply did it as a scum lure. Regardless, it seemed to work and really drew fire from ligolski.
Strike one.
Next, though many of you might see this as a personal suspicion because of teh very nature of the attack, Ligolski seems to be quite adamant about simply getting me killed, as opposed to the rest of the inactives. Why is it that he is monitoring my activity and keeping records of it but not doing the same for teh others in my position? That in itself is definately suspicious because it seems that hes trying to CREATE suspicion to place on me, as opposed to FINDING suspicious behavior. Also, turning a blind eye to others and setting your sights on seemingly ONE person among a group of similar people really sets off alarms for me, because it tells me that he sees me as a possible threat and is jumping at the possibility to eliminate me. Also, going back to the whole "creating over finding suspicion" point I just made, this also provides me with an explanation as to why Ligolski so easily dropped his suspicions fo agentli in favor or pursuing this obviously broken plan. Ligolski, who seems to specialize in creating over finding suspicions, would excell in an activity that at its very foundation operates on that level. He woudl easily be able to pick people apart with "created" suspicions and thereby would be justified to do so, because that is all that the system warrants.
So yeah, aiming to gun me down = Strike two
Immediate support to a broken system that caters to his destructive methods = Strike three
As you can see, I'm pretty convinced Ligolski is scum. I'm also very suspicious of Karshkin for pretty much mirroring everything Ligolski does, though I'm not sure whether or not that is just because they are siblings or something. Also, this is all based entirely on my light re-read of day 2. I'll be going back to day 1 sometime to try and make some connections to my initial suspicions.
So please everyone, don't let this post go to waste; stop complaining about a dying game, use this as a springboard, and lets get this thing moving again.
First and foremost, when a game comes to a standstill, you go back and reread things and create discussion from that. You don't come up with utterly ridiculous game changing ideas like the one agentli came up with. I can understand that you guys might be desperate but you need to realized just hwo horribly flawed agentli's idea is. Oh and before I go into explaining my view on agentli's idea, I just want to let you all know that you need to quit being gutless and los ethe habit of just tossing FOS's left and right. It's honestly pathetic. If you are suspicious of someone, VOTE FOR THEM. It's not like your vote is permanent. The only reason you should be FOSing someone is if you are suspicious of them but are UNABLE to vote for them for a certain reason, which could include a voting restriction, yoru vote being occupied by another suspicious person, the game being in a lynch or lose situation or hammer vote, etc. STOP FOSing AND START VOTING! You all complain about how slow the game is moving when you are all partially responsible for it because no one knows the true nature of your suspicions because you never vote for anyone other than the quiet folk. Ok now that that's out of my system, its time to move on.
This whole partner bull is so ridiculously stupid. It totally takes away from the very fabric of teh game. First of all, half of the people here have so little post substance that no one could hope to construct a formidable attack, or constitute a defense against an attack if such a clash is ARTIFICIALLY CREATED. You don't artificially create conflict because all that does is put the entire town in an argumentative state and creates unwarranted suspicions and confusion that should have never existed had teh game been allowed to continue normally. Artificial conflict will also cause people to stretch points, use poor logic, and overall degrade their current "town" image. Forcing people into a combative situation with almost nothing to use in such a debate is an absolutely awful idea. Not to take away from your efforts agentli, as it really seems that your plan was well thought out, you need to realize that it was a nasty concoction brought abotu as a result of idleness, and is inherently destructive to the flow of the game. I truly do beleive you are town agentli, but plain and simple, your idea sucks.
To be quite honest, if it wa spossible I would probably vote for all of you for so blindly agreeing to parttake in this proposition, but I obviously can't do that. So I guess I need to narrow it down to one person eh?
The decision here is altogether simple for me. I can clearly identify a consistant antagonist from this group. That would be Ligolski, and I'll start by doing this: Vote: Ligolski
It really seems to me that Ligolski has a bad habit of going after people for easy reasons, a common scum trait. My first example of this was him continuing to chase after commonyoshi when he again proposed a nameclaim, an idea that had already been shot down. I for one beleive that commonyoshi is town, and that he either was forced to propose the idea again due to role contraints or he simply did it as a scum lure. Regardless, it seemed to work and really drew fire from ligolski.
Strike one.
Next, though many of you might see this as a personal suspicion because of teh very nature of the attack, Ligolski seems to be quite adamant about simply getting me killed, as opposed to the rest of the inactives. Why is it that he is monitoring my activity and keeping records of it but not doing the same for teh others in my position? That in itself is definately suspicious because it seems that hes trying to CREATE suspicion to place on me, as opposed to FINDING suspicious behavior. Also, turning a blind eye to others and setting your sights on seemingly ONE person among a group of similar people really sets off alarms for me, because it tells me that he sees me as a possible threat and is jumping at the possibility to eliminate me. Also, going back to the whole "creating over finding suspicion" point I just made, this also provides me with an explanation as to why Ligolski so easily dropped his suspicions fo agentli in favor or pursuing this obviously broken plan. Ligolski, who seems to specialize in creating over finding suspicions, would excell in an activity that at its very foundation operates on that level. He woudl easily be able to pick people apart with "created" suspicions and thereby would be justified to do so, because that is all that the system warrants.
So yeah, aiming to gun me down = Strike two
Immediate support to a broken system that caters to his destructive methods = Strike three
As you can see, I'm pretty convinced Ligolski is scum. I'm also very suspicious of Karshkin for pretty much mirroring everything Ligolski does, though I'm not sure whether or not that is just because they are siblings or something. Also, this is all based entirely on my light re-read of day 2. I'll be going back to day 1 sometime to try and make some connections to my initial suspicions.
So please everyone, don't let this post go to waste; stop complaining about a dying game, use this as a springboard, and lets get this thing moving again.
Kujirudo
Smash Lord
The reason why I agreed to join agentli's system was just to kill out boredom. It could work you know. If people fail to defend them self, you can at least say that is suspicious. Yes, it could be that they are just bad in defending themself for whatsoever reason, but at least you have a lead then. We were stuck and needed a move. Agentli came up with this and imo it sounded good.
About ligolski, I know what you mean. I was thinking the exact same thing some while ago but I didn't know the proper words to tell you how I thought about him. And frozen knows how to say it:
I've noticed this multiple times, the biggest thing was when common suggested a nameclaim for the 2th time. Ligolski, you are on the wrong way now.
Vote: Ligolski
Something else:
So FoS is not just something to throw out when you already voted someone, it's more of a lower degree of a vote. I think this action of you shows that you just want us to vote on people rather than giving them a good chance to defend themself. Scummy people (like ligolski) also like to vote on people without giving them a warning and/or a chance to defend themself. FoS: frozenflame751
I'm off now to my dad, I hope he has internet at his place but I can't promise anything!
About ligolski, I know what you mean. I was thinking the exact same thing some while ago but I didn't know the proper words to tell you how I thought about him. And frozen knows how to say it:
He jumps on people for every single mistake that they make. It doesn't matter if it's a big one or not, he takes every single opportunity to draw fire to them. He doesn't give other people a chance to defend themselfs. And he retracts his votes only when other players retract their vote too, which is a smart thing to do for a scumbag. It then looks like he agrees with the others while he actually fears to be found suspicious if he would keep his vote on X person.frozenflame751 said:
I've noticed this multiple times, the biggest thing was when common suggested a nameclaim for the 2th time. Ligolski, you are on the wrong way now.
Vote: Ligolski
Something else:
What you are saying here is that we shouldn't FoS people because voting is better. Well, that is true but I think that your defenition for the utility of a FoS is not correct. A FoS shows that you are suspicious of someone. Yes, so does a vote but FoS can also be seen as a light vote. You warn somebody and want him to explain why he did something. And if what he says doesn't convince you, the FoS can turn into a vote which is more of a huge warning. You still want the other player to explain himself, but it can better be a good explanation because otherwise he could be gone after a few more votes.frozenflame751 said:
So FoS is not just something to throw out when you already voted someone, it's more of a lower degree of a vote. I think this action of you shows that you just want us to vote on people rather than giving them a good chance to defend themself. Scummy people (like ligolski) also like to vote on people without giving them a warning and/or a chance to defend themself. FoS: frozenflame751
I'm off now to my dad, I hope he has internet at his place but I can't promise anything!
Deathreaver780
Smash Ace
I for one have read all of frozens post. I agree that the "game" or whatever u want to call it is flawed. (think thats teh word)
So for me I disapprove of the idea.
As for ligolski, havent really seen him doing the "jump on people for every single mistake that they make" so Im gonna re-read soon here, and see if I can find it or not.
So for me I disapprove of the idea.
As for ligolski, havent really seen him doing the "jump on people for every single mistake that they make" so Im gonna re-read soon here, and see if I can find it or not.
agentli
Smash Apprentice
I have to admit, I really didn't put that much thought into it, despite what I had you all to believe. Ten seconds of..."How do I put activity back into the game?" and then the plan was hatched. And the response I got from it created several reactions for myself.
What was surprising, yet expected was that everyone agreed to do it, at first. The plan indeed was flawed. It would fall apart after about the third week because it was getting nowhere and the voting process was getting too bogged down. Although, the excitement Ronike had for it perhaps got me into my own plan a little too much.
But it served its purpose. There are people actually looking in this thread now, instead of posting their boredom. Which leads me to go back to a post I had a while back, and the response ligolski gave to it...
Pg. 47...otherwise known as the spun synopsis of Day 2...
2-5. Fine.
6. Not fine. Ligolski, I've seen you play in past mafia games, as town. This is not how you act.
Flipping opinions to suit the situation is not the way you play town. After you switched from being anti-me + commonyoshi, to agreeing, you didn't say any evidence at all besides you support my reasoning, which just doesn't cut it. After vehemently pursuing this, and then realizing you may have overextended yourself, you retract back.
2-5 was just to show you moving in one direction, that part isn't suspicious. 6 is the suspicious part. And then after that, when the momentum shifts to provoking frozenflame751, you show no caution at all, immediately voting him.
Your defense on pg. 48 doesn't shift my suspicion. Vote: Ligolski
What was surprising, yet expected was that everyone agreed to do it, at first. The plan indeed was flawed. It would fall apart after about the third week because it was getting nowhere and the voting process was getting too bogged down. Although, the excitement Ronike had for it perhaps got me into my own plan a little too much.
But it served its purpose. There are people actually looking in this thread now, instead of posting their boredom. Which leads me to go back to a post I had a while back, and the response ligolski gave to it...
Pg. 47...otherwise known as the spun synopsis of Day 2...
Ligolski's defense:
1. Fine
2-5. Fine.
6. Not fine. Ligolski, I've seen you play in past mafia games, as town. This is not how you act.
Flipping opinions to suit the situation is not the way you play town. After you switched from being anti-me + commonyoshi, to agreeing, you didn't say any evidence at all besides you support my reasoning, which just doesn't cut it. After vehemently pursuing this, and then realizing you may have overextended yourself, you retract back.
2-5 was just to show you moving in one direction, that part isn't suspicious. 6 is the suspicious part. And then after that, when the momentum shifts to provoking frozenflame751, you show no caution at all, immediately voting him.
Your defense on pg. 48 doesn't shift my suspicion. Vote: Ligolski
Or you can skip the whole stupid process, vote for people you are suspicious of and then unvote them if they provide ample defense. Last time I checked, votes weren't permanent and they didn't condemn anyone to death or perpetual suspicion. As a matter of fact, votes are probably MORE effective at getting people to defend themselves because they actually MEAN something. To be quite honest I wouldn't care in the least if everyone in the game FoS'd me, because guess what? Nothing happens to me! Votes on the other and are actually potent. When someone votes for you, you're one step closer to death, which for a mafia member especially will put on significant pressure. Essentially, your definition of an FoS as a warning is actually the true definition of a vote. People vote for someone they think is suspicious and they have to defend themselves. However, that person wont get killed before they defend because anyone who hammers prior to a defense is clearly anti town. However, if people still want to express suspicion but can't vote because they would hammer in such a situation THEN they FoS. See what I mean? FoS should be used as a suspicion marker in times where votes are potentially dangerous.
So yeah, I just thought I'd clear that up. ^_^
DiamondFalcon
Smash Journeyman
I think your points are well conceded, frozenflame. You seem to be looking after the best interests of the town. I will revert back to my original feelings of suspicion of Ligolski as well. I supported Agentli's plan because it would bring information and discussion out into the open, but I failed to realize that it may be detrimental to town as well. Also, the inactives are very likely to be the mafia, and I didn't quite understand how those would fit in.
Unvote: frozenflame
Vote: Ligolski
Unvote: frozenflame
Vote: Ligolski
i explained this all before....glad u can read >_>... maybe you should stay more active
Guess what everyone...I know frozen, personally, and I know his activity from other games and I looked at you cuz you are always more active and you are always online checking up on your stuff...thats why I zeroed in on you...
the rest of your post is fabricating lies, whixh you are seemingly good at doing...
first you are overreacting to the whole thing of me quoting your posts, I didn't even revote you or anything, I maybe fos'd you but as you say they are worthless or are they?
I didn't see you as a threat before but as an inactive/lurker who we needed to get into the game so I voted you to pressure you back into the game because you are a good player when you are town and it was always the possibility that you were town and inactive...plus the fact that you call yourself a threat when you didn't even post anything is utter BS...if your inactive/lurking ans not posting anything then you are not a threat to me in theory because you weren't doing anything to g against me...if I wanted to "elimanate you" I would have left you alone and left you stay inactive...but instead I wanted you active...
I dropped my suspiciouns of agentli because he persuaded me like many others who you seem to forget about which makes it seem like YOU are aiming in on one person...hmmm...hypocrit? PLUS it wasn't like I dropped my suspiciouns just for his new plan...if you look we went into a week of lull...I wouldn't call that abondanoning "my suspiciouns" on him and jump right on his plan and support him...
as for agentli's plan, I agree with you with you arguments against it BUT as for when you used it against me>>> when I read his plan I simply sped read because I had to go, SINCE I WAS ON VACATION...so I quickly typed down a few things and I left to go have fun...PLUS in my brief ability to go on and view the thread and type down something quick I was already picking out little things that may present problems, just go back and read my last post and you will see that...
well on to the other posts I guess...
I always jump on people's small mistakes if I catch them...check all the other mafia games I have playedand I allow people to defend themselves, as frozen said votes are not permenant they are subject to wtihdrawl...
I am not "playing town", I am town and I believe now that you are town and you convinced me of this, I was never "anti" you and common, I argued against you but it wasn't like I was all hell bent on lynching you and common, cuz if I was I would still be going "AH LYNCH THEM CUZ I SAID SO!!!!" hehe which plainly I am not...
basically the same with me< directed at frozen
as for the whole fos thing, I agree with frozen...fos's are pretty much useless unless like I said before they are used correctly...hence the reason why I vote first...and speaking of this...why hasn't anyone attacked frozen for "not letting me defend" and just voting for me...cuz everyone this is directed at is now a hypocrit because they have voted for me without letting me "defend" myself...
karshkin
Smash Rookie
Hey frozen guess wat suck me!!! total bs fallowing liggy i agree with him because he is an experienced mafia player yea... and since you guys are friends you try to kill the other faster no matter wat side your on and liggy usally wins so i think any arguments bewteen you and ligolski should be disregard.
karshkin
Smash Rookie
yea i asked chill to replace me cause i can't stay active because mafia is not fast paced enoughfor me so yea about that last post it was funny LOL... Good night and good luck
agentli
Smash Apprentice
I think ligolski usually wins because frozen is always killed night 1
Hahaha quite the comedian we have here. I did read and to put it simply I think your explanations are crap and that the true nature of your behavior is a result what I have deduced. The argument can't go any further than that because I can't know your thoughts.
Wooooo hurray for pointlessness. Last time I checked I didn't tell you my entire schedule for every day of my life. I was busy, plain and simple. Don't beleive me? Fine, I don't care. There is no way we can prove each other wrong so what was the point of even saying this. To me it just looks like a desperate attempt at an emotional appeal that aims to make it seem like my arguments should be disregarded simply because I was inactive for a bit.ligolski said:
How am I overreacting? Sorting out facts is overreacting now? All I did was say that you were monitoring me and not monitoring other people who were inactive like me which makes me suspicious of you. I don't care if you didn't vote or FoS me, you still attacked me. Not voting for someone or FoSing them doesn't make the post go away and have no meaning. That's just plain awful reasoning.ligolski said:
Check it out I can negate this entire section with one example: thedocsalive. Heck I can even use myself as an example. But anyway, its pretty clear that people can still be viewed as threats based on past games. A perfect example is me and my "die night 1" streak in teh first handful of games. Remember Dark mafia? I was killed nigth one in that game and I NEVER POSTED! If that doesn't scream that I was a threat I don't know what does. Furthermore, look at thedocsalive these past bunch of games. He's been killed night one every time, and it wasn't as if he was making tons and tons of uber long posts or anything. The mafia simply know he's a strong player and targeted him. I don't see how that can't apply here.ligolski said:
Doesn't matter. You still argued with him. Just because you were "persuaded" doesn't mean I can't still be suspicious of you for arguing with him in the first place. A perfect example is me and Tetaway in Sicily Italy mafia. He attack me and I "persuaded" him. I still thought he was scummy and guess what? He turned out to be scum. Whadya know. Besides you say that you were "persuaded" when it just seems to me that you decided to quit before you dug yourself into a deeper hole. That's just my opinion though. It's more or less my word against yours in that matter.ligolski said:
HARDLY! I hope you're kidding. You attacked me first. Disregarding an attack from someone and trying to divert attention elsewhere oozes scumminess, so why wouldn't I attack your points? How you came to conclude I was a hypocrit is beyond me.ligolski said:
Why should I care? You posted it which means its fair game for anyone to attack. If you aren't confident that your post is backed by sufficient evidence and reasoning then why would you even post? You said you were going on vacation, which means no one was expecting heavy activity from you, so why did you bother to post if you knew it wasn't going to be top notch? Don't try and make me look like the bad guy when it's clearly YOUR fault for making a crap post.ligolski said:
Jumping on every little mistake people make is characteristic of scum because like I said earlier, they try to create suspicion as opposed to finding it. Some mistakes don't warrant attacks, because townies aren't perfect you know. It's not like making bad points is an ability restricted to mafia members.ligolski said:
The bolded part is contradictory. You don't have to be uber vigilant to be against someone as you seem to beleive you have to be.ligolski said:
commonyoshi
Smash Hero
I find that a bit... no... for some reason. (bleh. what lame description) It's not in the game much less this forum so dont tell us that.
Ronike
Smash Ace
- Joined
- May 14, 2006
- Messages
- 612
I guess now that I think about it, I see the negatives in agent's plan. I just got overexcited to be able to do something, and something new for that matter. As for Ligolski, I agree he is acting way different than in other games. You are turning stuff around too much. You are too unfocused. You play like me when you are town: unwilling to change your mind easy once it goes either way. Thats why Ive been so loath to vote you, I let our friendship in thing get in the way. Ah well. Lets all hope we arent making a mistake vote: ligolski
HAHA...you weren't active in that game and the reason you were killed was because you weren't active...if you would have paid attention to that game you have noticed that the mafia killed off all the inactive members so that the town would have nothing to talk about which is why they won...
another horrible example...SI mafia is one heck of a twisted mafia game, almost everyone in that game is mafia... so that doesn't help your argument there
I wasn't trying to divert attention, but only to question your actions...what I meant by hypocrit is that you blamed me for "aiming down the sites" while you have ignored all the other people who followed me and did the same things but yet you don't mention them and try to keep them out of the picture...
Yes, but if you read the post I was partially dissenting his idea with little bits of problems we might run into if we did it...its all there...and I can easily find posts of yours in this game that can be considered "crap" and why is that post considered crap I ask you? there is nothing wrong with it...if you attack me for that post, then why don't you attack everyone else who has done the same thing...or even attack the rest of the people who even agreed mroe with agentli's plan?
I agree with the last part, as I said before that I made a mistake and agentli persuaded me to see this, thats what argumentation is all about...and then I say but if a townie, being me, in other games has done that, then you can't just assume that I am scum now since a townie, being me, in other games has done this...what I am saying is that you can't declare that a scum trait if a town player has used it in the past...
is this worded wrong by chance? cuz I can't understand it completely, please clarify for me
it fits in for me, but I'll drop it since you guys don't want it there...meh...w/e
I was only using that to try and prove a point but I won't use that any more...and I won't tell you the dirty little secret then about frozen...
Kujirudo
Smash Lord
Hooray for me fixing the internet.
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Lol, let´s stop arguing about this. We both have our own definition
.Personal life is of no importance here.
Hey, how about this: You have made up more suscpiciouness before than for example me. That's why it's kinda weird that you focus on 1 person while you're saying at the same time that aiming on 1 person is hypocritical. Again controversional.
Same thing here.ligolski said:
Members that will be replaced if they don't post.
Uncle Meat
Jarc
Eoringlas
Tetaway
Vote count coming...
Uncle Meat
Jarc
Eoringlas
Tetaway
Vote count coming...
What made the mafia choose me over the other inactives? I was the most threatening inactive because of my past performance. Also, how and why would I have payed attention to a game after dying night one while one vacation? Don't go criticizing me for that kind of stuff when you are using the vacation card yourself. It almost makes you seem, dare I say it, hypocritical! =O
Actually its a great example because at that point in time (when I was debating with tetaway) the game hadn't been broken. Nice try though.Tetaway said:
1.) The only person I've seen do exactly what you've done is Karshkin, and guess what? I DID MENTION HIM. Did you just miss that or did you just "speed read' again?ligolski said:
2.) Why am I focusing on you? Because you bloody attacked me! I'm defending myself against you and trying to build a case by doing so. You honestly expect me to say "well ligolski is the one attacking me and even though that's suspicious I'm gonna totally ignore that and attack other people who I don't find suspicious"?
What are you talking about? Dude YOU said your post was crap, or atleast hinted to it. Look:ligolski said:
In the bolded part you're using your vacation as an excuse for your post. I said that you quickly agreed with agent and you said that I shouldn't even regard that post because of the situation you were in when reading and posting. This is such utter and complete BS, you totally just tried to turn that whole thing around on me. YOU criticized your post to begin with, so again quit trying to make me look like the bad guy. Oh and just an FYI, don't criticize me for not reading when you clearly didn't. Check out my initial post against you. Do you recall this line?ligolski said:
Jee whiz, sure looks like I attacked everyone there doesn't it? Never call me a hypocrit again until you can be consistant yourself.FrozenFlame751 said:
Wrong, wrong, wrong. Townies can make mistakes, therefore townies can be scummy, therefore townies make scum tells, therefore just because a townie does something regarded as a scum tell, it doesn't me that that scum tell is now null and void.ligolski said:
I agree that does sound a little messy. What I was trying to say is that according to you, in order to be "anti" someone you have to have bloodthirsty "I won't rest until you're dead" behavior toward them, which is wrong. Arguing with anyone at any time means that for the moment you are "anti" them, so by arguing with commonyoshi you were at that point "anti common" plain and simple.ligolski said:is this worded wrong by chance? cuz I can't understand it completely, please clarify for me
Excuse me? It that's not ad hominem I don't know what is. Read:http://www.mafiascum.net/cgi-bin/wi...l/Ethical appeals only show logical weakness.ligolski said:I was only using that to try and prove a point but I won't use that any more...and I won't tell you the dirty little secret then about frozen...
Sorry I've been gone for awhile.
Members that will be replaced if they are not more active.
Uncle Meat
Jarc
Eoringlas
Tetaway
---------------
falcoX is replacing karshkin.
--------------
Official vote count
Uncle Meat: 1
Eoringlas
Commonyoshi: 1
lance87
frozenflame751: 2
ligolski, karshkin(now falcoX)
ligolski: 4
forzenflame751,kujirudo,agentli, Diamondfalcon
9 to lynch
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frozenflame had been leaning against a wall apart from the group. He watches them shufffle around as if in a trance. Aside from the occaisonal argument the group is silent. He rolls his eyes and walks over the others. Immediately he points his finger at ligolski.
"You."
Members that will be replaced if they are not more active.
Uncle Meat
Jarc
Eoringlas
Tetaway
---------------
falcoX is replacing karshkin.
--------------
Official vote count
Uncle Meat: 1
Eoringlas
Commonyoshi: 1
lance87
frozenflame751: 2
ligolski, karshkin(now falcoX)
ligolski: 4
forzenflame751,kujirudo,agentli, Diamondfalcon
9 to lynch
---------------
frozenflame had been leaning against a wall apart from the group. He watches them shufffle around as if in a trance. Aside from the occaisonal argument the group is silent. He rolls his eyes and walks over the others. Immediately he points his finger at ligolski.
"You."
Battle Of The Massive Posts!
2- I understand that I attacked you, I am not questioning at this point that I attacked you, and I don't expect you to ignore me at all, this is good discussion and can only lead to more...
Lets say that you argued with your parents and about going to the movies or something, I wouldn't call that being anti-parents, I would call that a dispute, and I'm sure that you would still love them and therefore are not "anti" them...my way of using anti is just different from yours and I think its just that...
you can't say that because you can't exactly read their minds, though it is a possibility, the fact that they killed all teh inactives shows just what I was aiming at before...and I had no clue you were on vacation once you died, so don't go shoving that into my face
though the game wasn't "broken", there was still the high chance even then that you would be argueing against scum...
1- actually I was refferring to the fact that you "counter"-attacked me using the whole jumping on common thing...others joined me and thats what I was referrigng to, the fact that you didn't mention them...not just karshkin who has now been replaced
2- I understand that I attacked you, I am not questioning at this point that I attacked you, and I don't expect you to ignore me at all, this is good discussion and can only lead to more...
I never said my post was "crap", you inferred that and your wrong...what I meant by that was that I didn't have time to post anything substantial, and by this I mean lots of quality thoughts, I was only able to get down some basic things and then I left, thats not to say I wrote down some ****ty BS and then left...and if its so crappy tell me where I am wrong in the things that I brought up against agentli's plans...
I am not calling you a hypocrit for that, it was about the other reason you counter-attacked me with but yet there were others who did the samething, shouldn't they be equally suspicious?
ah...i see what your saying now...my mistake...I agree with what you say here...I confused my self or something...
let me use an example of how I think anti is used because I think this is coming down to how we each view this word...
Lets say that you argued with your parents and about going to the movies or something, I wouldn't call that being anti-parents, I would call that a dispute, and I'm sure that you would still love them and therefore are not "anti" them...my way of using anti is just different from yours and I think its just that...
agentli
Smash Apprentice
Well, I think Chill was trying to reference the fact that the rest of the town has been walking in circles doing nothing "as if in a trance" and Frozen comes in and finally takes charge to do something. It's not that Frozen has been inactive per say, although he has...It' that it's justified now since he's leading us in some kind of direction, rather than before where no one was doing anything at all.
Actually, yes I can say that because it is the most logical reason for their actions. If you can think of a better reason then please enlighten me. Also, yes you did know I was on vacation, as I recall you played in Lost Mafia and SSBR Mafia, and I explicitly stated in both games that I was on vacation during that time, since all three games were concurrent.
Yeah it does, because I did. I personally thought it was a pretty cool depiction of the in-game events. As I explained earlier, I had good reasons for singling you out so its not like it's a bad thing.
Dude, we talked about this a long time ago. I already told everyone that the reason I came back was Chill sent me a PM saying "get back or be replaced." I could have cared less about your pressure votes.
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