Social King K. Rool's Kremling Kutthroats: This...Is Our Finest Hour!

[Call_Me_Red]

So apparently Version 3.1.0 is dropping later this week.

So, do you guys hope we get more buffs for Rool, or will he sit this update out?

I imagine this is gunna be a small patch. Like, I'd be surprised if any of the characters get touched at all...right?

 

[Megadoomer]

I imagine this is gunna be a small patch. Like, I'd be surprised if any of the characters get touched at all...right?

They've already said that replay data will be impacted by this, so it's going to be a balance patch.

I think the general rule of thumb is that something like 4.0.0 would be a new character, 3.1.0 would be a balance patch, and 3.0.1 would be something minor, like an urgent bug fix (for example, Joker's final smash causing the game to freeze if you beat an opponent with it in classic mode). It depends on which number changes.

 

[TewnLeenk]

Everyone blast Gangplank Galleon in unison to pray for K. Rool buffs.

 

[Loliko YnT]

Hello everyone ! While I joined the K.Rool discord soon after his reveal , I never posted here.
I also wasn't a K.Rool supporter... If I remember correctly , I only seriously supported Ice Climbers before August.

However , he is definitely my favorite newcomer , and his reveal trailer was one of the most hype moments I ever had. He's the definition of everything I love in a Smash character.

He was one of the first characters I first tried when I got my hands on Ultimate. While I didn't played him too seriously at first... I soon realized that he slowly became my most played character. So he became my main I guess lol. I get some hate for maining him , but hey... It seem like anyone hate you for maining anyone sometimes. And if I go back to my Sm4sh main , I know that some people are gonna hate me even more lol.

So , long live the king !

---

As to balance patch 3.1.0 , I personnaly don't expect much. I'm fine with where he is , and the only buff I want is probably not happening. (Sucking directly with blunderbuss without shooting a kanonball)
When I lose with him , I honestly blame myself , or in rare cases , the match-up. A few match-up with him are just... No.
But then again , I was the guy who secondarie'd and back in Sm4sh. And fighting Clouds and Bayos constantly with them was pretty funny lol. So I can deal with K.Rool bad MU.

 

[~The Koopa King~]

the balance patch came out and the only change to k.rool was

"Increased the speed of the edge-grab range detection on Up Air"

 

[Kulty]

the balance patch came out and the only change to k.rool was
"Increased the speed of the edge-grab range detection on Up Air"

This patch is basically nothing for K Rool tbh. I tested it for a few minutes, and I don`t really notice that change.

 

[~The Koopa King~]

so what was even the point of this?

 

[Cruelcumber]

so what was even the point of this?

Be thankful that K. Rool got at least one minor buff.

Oliimar, Pichu, and Peach/Daisy got nerfed, while characters like Ryu/Ken, Lucario, Diddy Kong, Bayonetta, Bowser Jr., Little Mac, and Rosalina & Luma received buffs. King K. Rool may not have been really affected, and the same goes for others like Ridley, Kirby, Mario, etc. But this balance patch did show that whoever's in charge of balancing this game is paying attention to more than just online play, which is good. Although a lot of the updates in this balance patch I noticed seem to make sure a lot more characters' attacks actually hit opponents, which is good for making these moves consistent and reliable. So yes, there was a good point in this recent patch to the game. Plus with E3 around the corner, I'm sure we'll continue seeing more changes to SSBU in the future, so I'm not worried.

 

[~The Koopa King~]

it just seems like a buff that's so minor that it might as well not even exist

that's the problem

 

[Call_Me_Red]

it just seems like a buff that's so minor that it might as well not even exist

that's the problem

Why are you complaining about getting a buff? They probably just noticed some jank when using up air near ledge. They probably weren't going to give us anything until they noticed this.

 

[ChunkySlugger72]

I don't think this has been brought up before here or if some of you know, But in the Banjo-Kazooie thread we have heard rumors for a while that there may be a port of Rare Replay heading to Switch, It makes a ton of sense and wouldn't be too surprising since Nintendo and Microsoft seem to have a working partnership and have been collaborating on certain fronts.

I and a lot of us on the Banjo thread discussed how great it would be if they released a "Nintendo Edition" of Rare Replay that included:

- Donkey Kong Country 1-3
- Donkey Kong 64
- Diddy Kong Racing
- Star Fox Adventures

I would still buy a straight port no matter what, But adding the Donkey Kong games would absolutely make it a must have and the "Definitive Version" and would be very disappointed if they don't take this route as it would feel like a missed opportunity.

Not to mention it would be a nice way to celebrate Donkey Kong Country's 25th and Donkey Kong 64's 20th Anniversary and would be a nice consolation prize if for whatever reason they don't announce a new DK game at E3. (Which I still really hope they do)

Thoughts?

 

[~The Koopa King~]

Why are you complaining about getting a buff? They probably just noticed some jank when using up air near ledge. They probably weren't going to give us anything until they noticed this.

because it's the only buff we were handed and it's one that to this point on the discord....not many people have noticed this buff making much of a difference

 

[Rizen]

K.Rool got buffs last time so it's not terrible he didn't get anything this time. He definitely needs more but there's always next patch.

 

[Call_Me_Red]

because it's the only buff we were handed and it's one that to this point on the discord....not many people have noticed this buff making much of a difference

I'm just not sure why you're upset. We got some major buffs last time, yknow, last month. It's fine if we go one patch where we don't get anything. At least we weren't nerfed again.

 

[~The Koopa King~]

what were those major buffs? because it doesn't seem like much has really changed through the last couple of balance patches

and as for why I'm upset it's because months and months of being the meme character expecting a better future for K.Rool has just left me disappointed every time when the balance adjustments that do arrive don't really do much to address his core problems and simply act as a minor band-aid solution that really doesn't fix what people wanted fixes for

 

[Call_Me_Red]

what were those major buffs? because it doesn't seem like much has really changed through the last couple of balance patches

and as for why I'm upset it's because months and months of being the meme character expecting a better future for K.Rool has just left me disappointed every time when the balance adjustments that do arrive don't really do much to address his core problems and simply act as a minor band-aid solution that really doesn't fix what people wanted fixes for

Bruh, u forril? They greatly increased the sweetspot of forward tilt and forward air (both kill moves, both spacing moves, both strong as hell moves). That alone would have been enough, but they cut off a TON of lag on up air, making it an actual viable move. And even AFTER that they cut off some lag on his down b if you hit OR if you miss.

They massively improved 4 different moves. Giving him 4 more KO options, repairing 2 broken moves, and giving him a viable reflector, counter, and 'get out of combo free' card. Seriously, those buffs alone boosted K Rool multiple spots on the tier list, IMO. I could not have asked for any more from that patch.

 

[~The Koopa King~]

some of the buffs were nice but they weren't nice enough to be Meta-defining and boost him out of low tier

no idea why you think that honestly....you seem to be overrating and overestimating the effect these balance adjustments have had on k.rool

 

[BKupa666]

 

[S_B]

Bruh, u forril? They greatly increased the sweetspot of forward tilt and forward air (both kill moves, both spacing moves, both strong as hell moves). That alone would have been enough, but they cut off a TON of lag on up air, making it an actual viable move. And even AFTER that they cut off some lag on his down b if you hit OR if you miss.

They massively improved 4 different moves. Giving him 4 more KO options, repairing 2 broken moves, and giving him a viable reflector, counter, and 'get out of combo free' card. Seriously, those buffs alone boosted K Rool multiple spots on the tier list, IMO. I could not have asked for any more from that patch.

They were nice improvements, but KKR's problem isn't that he lacks kill options or that he needs better sweetspots on moves.

His problem is that he suffers from the same issues that heavies have always had in past SSB games: small, fast characters overwhelm him with very little room for counterplay. And this is not a problem that all heavies suffer from: Bowser, Gdorf, DK, and D3 all seem to be viable characters and they have answers to being overwhelmed and comboed to death.

We've seen Nairo do what would be considered UNTHINKABLE in past SSB games and use Ganondorf to defeat one of if not THE best Fox players in the world.

The balancing team is clearly capable of bringing KKR up to snuff, and I guess little buffs are better than nothing, but until he has answers to being overrun by speedsters, he's just plain not going to do well on the competitive side of things (and good luck spotting a KKR at any major tournaments).

 

[Call_Me_Red]

They were nice improvements, but KKR's problem isn't that he lacks kill options or that he needs better sweetspots on moves.

His problem is that he suffers from the same issues that heavies have always had in past SSB games: small, fast characters overwhelm him with very little room for counterplay. And this is not a problem that all heavies suffer from: Bowser, Gdorf, DK, and D3 all seem to be viable characters and they have answers to being overwhelmed and comboed to death.

We've seen Nairo do what would be considered UNTHINKABLE in past SSB games and use Ganondorf to defeat one of if not THE best Fox players in the world.

The balancing team is clearly capable of bringing KKR up to snuff, and I guess little buffs are better than nothing, but until he has answers to being overrun by speedsters, he's just plain not going to do well on the competitive side of things (and good luck spotting a KKR at any major tournaments).

The dev team decided to boost up what King K was already strong at instead of strengthening his weak spots. And besides, we DO have answers to being combo'd, they're not perfect but thats the struggle heavies are doomed to face. We have a frame 6 Nair and a frame 4 counter. You will be combo'd as King K, it's inevitable, but we do have tools to get us out.

some of the buffs were nice but they weren't nice enough to be Meta-defining and boost him out of low tier

no idea why you think that honestly....you seem to be overrating and overestimating the effect these balance adjustments have had on k.rool

I think the buffs were amazing for King K. I know he's not a top tier because of them, but frankly I don't think it matters that much. I think this game is balanced, and new enough, that tiers don't matter yet. Of course it is harder to win with King K as opposed to Lucina / Pichu / etc., but it's clearly possible to do well even with low tier characters.

Overall I think this goes back to 'Git Gud'. Unless you're going against all the top players in the world, there's no reason you cannot win with King K. Some matchups are harder than others, but overall it comes down to player skill.

 

[S_B]

The dev team decided to boost up what King K was already strong at instead of strengthening his weak spots. And besides, we DO have answers to being combo'd, they're not perfect but thats the struggle heavies are doomed to face. We have a frame 6 Nair and a frame 4 counter. You will be combo'd as King K, it's inevitable, but we do have tools to get us out.

It's not just being comboed that's the problem, though. Bowser also gets comboed extremely hard, especially by characters like Peach who can reliably take him from 0-60% in a single string without issue. But Bowser has the tools outside of that to still win regardless.

KKR's issue isn't just that he can be comboed but that he can be overwhelmed with relative ease as well, largely due to the fact that he doesn't have any safe pokes to throw out. Even trying to throw out a projectile against the wrong character will result in a free punish in most cases.

The problem is that his good matchups are extremly good for him but his bad matchups are extremely bad, so much so that counterpicking certain characters against him alone has made him unviable anywhere near the top level.

Remember that this isn't like SSB games of the past where heavies were basically guaranteed to be crap. Heavies like Bowser, Gdorf, DK, and D3 are actually viable this time around. We've even seen Nairo take out one of the best Fox players in the world with Ganondorf, something that would've been absolutely unthinkable in past games.

They need to tweak KKR so that he's less oppressive in some matchups and can survive better in others. I fully believe the balance team CAN do this, they just haven't yet (probably due to the initial reaction that KKR is overpowered from a lot of players).

 

[~The Koopa King~]

the buffs were not amazing for K.Rool I'm not sure why You'd think that red....those buffs didn't do enough to make playing K.Rool less of a chore

 

[Rizen]

Remember that this isn't like SSB games of the past where heavies were basically guaranteed to be crap. Heavies like Bowser, Gdorf, DK, and D3 are actually viable this time around. We've even seen Nairo take out one of the best Fox players in the world with Ganondorf, something that would've been absolutely unthinkable in past games.
.

Nairo's Ganon winning one set is being blown out of proportion. Ganon is still nowhere near solo viable. Even Smokk has been forced to use Wolf. Light later beat Nairo's Ganon and made him switch off him.

In past games we saw used frequently because their ding dongs... that sounds wrong... their throw to Uair combos. Heavies being used is nothing new. Tweek had a DK and Nairo had Bowser.

 

[S_B]

Nairo's Ganon winning one set is being blown out of proportion.

I'm not trying to say that Ganon is solo-viable (many pros would argue solo-viability is a thing of the past anyway). I'm just pointing out that the mere notion that Ganon would ever be used in a situation like that used to be unthinkable.

In past games we saw used frequently because their ding dongs... that sounds wrong... their throw to Uair combos. Heavies being used is nothing new. Tweek had a DK and Nairo had Bowser.

This is exactly my point.

The only times heavies saw use in SSB4 was for their throw followup gimmicks (with the exception of a few rare D3 breakaways). By the end of the meta and the rise of Bayo, heavies went the way of the dodo.

Watch videos of top level Bowsers like Mr. Bones or Leon and you'll see not just from the players themselves but from the expectations of the commentators that picking Bowser isn't considered to be a guaranteed loss, far from it. Same goes for DK and Gdorf. These characters work because they're well designed and generally well rounded, not because they have a one-off gimmick like in past games.

KKR not being at least reasonably viable is no longer "the norm" just because he's a heavy. KKR being invalidated by a counterpick is also not the norm because, in general, SSBU has done an excellent job avoiding situations like that. These are things that can certainly be fixed and I believe in time the balancing team will do so.

 

[MaddaD]

I want a Baron K. Roolenstein costume for my boy

 

[~The Koopa King~]

I'm still heartbroken that this game never came out. Banjo-Pilot was an okay substitute, but it didn't make up for the loss of aviator K. Rool and playable Klaptrap. I miss all of the DK spin-offs we used to get. Now the franchise barely gets any love from Nintendo. It sucks. https://t.co/TWAYn0Nleg

— Kremling Kampaigner (@KRoolKountry) June 3, 2019

Even during the post-buyout era, we still got the GBA remakes of the SNES DKC trilogy as well as some decent, albeit experimental, spin-offs. Other than the Tropical Freeze port, there hasn't been a new DK game since 2014. With #E3 coming up, maybe that will change...

— Kremling Kampaigner (@KRoolKountry) June 3, 2019

 

[ChunkySlugger72]

Thought you guys would be interested in this.

"A new 2D platformer from the original creators behind Donkey Kong Country & Banjo-Kazooie"

For some of those who don't know the studio behind this game is named Playtonic Games, A studio formed of mainly Ex-Rareware employees that were behind the games I mentioned before and took an earlier crack at a spiritual successor to Banjo-Kazooie with this very same franchise a couple of years ago, This looks like a great DKC style game that also looks like they took notes from Retro too as it looks very Returns/Tropical Freeze like and this could potentially scratch that itch for a new DKC game if we don't get one anytime soon and the soundtrack will be composed by none other than David Wise & Grant Kirkhope !!!

 

[Kulty]

Thought you guys would be interested in this.

"A new 2D platformer from the original creators behind Donkey Kong Country & Banjo-Kazooie"

For some of those who don't know the studio behind this game is named Playtonic Games, A studio formed of mainly Ex-Rareware employees that were behind the games I mentioned before and took an earlier crack at a spiritual successor to Banjo-Kazooie with this very same franchise a couple of years ago, This looks like a great DKC style game that also looks like they took notes from Retro too as it looks very Returns/Tropical Freeze like and this could potentially scratch that itch for a new DKC game if we don't get one anytime soon and the soundtrack will be composed by none other than David Wise & Grant Kirkhope !!!

I'm interested in the original Yooka Laylee. Is it worth to play or no?

 

[MaddaD]

I'm interested in the original Yooka Laylee. Is it worth to play or no?

It doesn't have the charm of the original Banjo games but it's good if you have time to kill. The controls are a bit sticky as is the camera but you get used to it.

 

[Rizen]

I'm interested in the original Yooka Laylee. Is it worth to play or no?

It's fun if you liked Banjo Kazooie and the quiz game isn't nearly as bad.

 

[Dalek_Kolt]

Just got out of the mire of the current speculation craze.
I am so glad that Ridley and King K. Rool got put in the main game. I can't imagine trying to defend their claim to a place in Smash after all this time.
Banjo and Geno fans must be so tired...

 

[Jetsurge]

Just got out of the mire of the current speculation craze.
I am so glad that Ridley and King K. Rool got put in the main game. I can't imagine trying to defend their claim to a place in Smash after all this time.
Banjo and Geno fans must be so tired...

I've given up on Geno, his mii costume is definitely coming back though. As for Banjo let's hope the leaks are true, booth King K. Rool and Banjo in would be amazing.

 

[lanky_gunner]

Last team combo video for now. But enjoy two healthy does of K. Rool butt whoopins.

 

[Red Dead Redeemed]

Spoiler: Just in case anyone here hasn't seen E3 yet.

I love how happy K Rool looked when Banjo and Kazooie popped up...and then after the gameplay it cuts to him getting his ass dunked on by them lol.

 

[Dalek_Kolt]

The new trailer had some great visuals.

 

[IMainKingKRool]

Loved seeing K. Rool lazing about in DK's house with them as if they're all one big dysfunctional family.
It's so sweet that this is how they did the trailer.

 

[KirbyWorshipper2465]

Seeing a K. Rool Trailer 2: Electric Boogaloo was the last thing I expected. And yes, I was just as happy as when K. Rool was confirmed. Couldn't have been a more appropriate way to reintroduce the duo once again.

Rool being beaten ala Grunty's first defeat was simply icing on the cake.

 

[Rizen]

I dislike they showed K.Rool as friends with DK; he was never the type of villain to team up with the good guys. That's more for bafoons like Bowser and DDD.

 

[Raxxel]

I dislike they showed K.Rool as friends with DK; he was never the type of villain to team up with the good guys. That's more for bafoons like Bowser and DDD.

I see it as K. Rool leaving the beef cold with the two for now until we get a new DKC game. When (and yes, I do feel at this point it's a when and not if) K. Rool eventually returns to the DKC series, this trailer will seem dated, but it's an in the moment fan service kind of thing. Best not think too hard on it.

 

[Red Dead Redeemed]

I dislike they showed K.Rool as friends with DK; he was never the type of villain to team up with the good guys. That's more for bafoons like Bowser and DDD.

The way I like to head-canon it, at first it was nothing but war between DK and K. Rool that went on damn near forever until they both realized that in the Smash universe, everything goes right back to the way it was after a match ends. Now they're frenemies that both hate each other and casually hang together because as it is now there's no way for them to settle the score. Now they just beat the crap out of each other daily in matches and let it go after that until (as Raxxel said) we get a new DK game where they can really start the rivalry up again.