[June-8] Detailed Moveset Analysis (Knockback/Launch Speed+ KO Percentages)

[Jeepy Sol]

*DISCLAIMER: Ankoku's method, not mine.*

These tests basically measure how much knockback and launch speed each of Lucario's attacks has.

This is how it was done. I would hit Mario with a move when he was at 0% and 300%, and calculate how much knockback was added for every 1%.


Soooo;

Initial Power= How much knockback each move does when opponent is at 0%.
Power Growth= How much knockback is added at each percent.

Moves generally KO at around 7000, give or take a couple hundred. (Depending on trajectory)

When Lucario is at 0%:

Jab (Punch)
Damage: 2%
Initial Power: Decent (1126)
Power Growth: Terrible (~16)
KO Percent: N/A

Jab Combo (Punch 2)
Damage: 1%
Initial Power: Decent (1308)
Power Growth: Terrible (~17)
KO Percent: N/A

Jab Combo (Kick)
Damage: 3%
Initial Power: Strong (2321)
Power Growth: Terrible (~14)
KO Percent: 313%

Tilts

Up-Tilt
Damage: 4%
Initial Power: Decent (1900)
Power Growth: Terrible (~19)
KO Percent: 209%

F-Tilt
Damage: 9%
Initial Power: Decent (1717)
Power Growth: Terrible (~18)
KO Percent: 260%

D-tilt
Damage: 5%
Initial Power: Decent (1764)
Power Growth: Poor (~21)
KO Percent: 237%

Smashes

Up-Smash
Damage: 9%
Initial Power: Decent (1820)
Power Growth: Average (~25)
KO Percent: 160%

F-Smash (Tip)
Damage: 11%
Initial Power: Decent (1687)
Power Growth: Decent (~29)
KO Percent: 163%

D-Smash
Damage: 10%
Initial Power: Decent (1612)
Power Growth: Decent (~26)
KO Percent: 185%

Aerials

U-Air
Damage: 7%
Initial Power: Decent (1293)
Power Growth: Poor (~23)
KO Percent: 195%

F-Air
Damage: 3%
Initial Power: Decent (1529)
Power Growth: Terrible (~13)
KO Percent: 432%

D-Air
Damage: 11%
Initial Power: Strong (2723)
Power Growth: Poor (~23)
KO Percent: 224%

B-air
Damage: 8%
Initial Power: Decent (1183)
Power Growth: Average (~25)
KO Percent: 213%

N-Air
Damage: 8%
Initial Power: Decent (1409)
Power Growth: Poor (~23)
KO Percent: 218%

N-Air (Late Hit)
Damage: 5%
Initial Power: Decent (1146)
Power Growth: Terrible (~17)
KO Percent: 323%

Specials

Aura Sphere (Uncharged)
Damage: 5%
Initial Power: Weak (734)
Power Growth: Terrible (~16)
KO Percent: 790%

Aura Sphere (Charged)
Damage: 13%
Initial Power: Decent (1912)
Power Growth: Average (~25)
KO Percent: 192%

Double Team
Damage: 8%
Initial Power: Strong (2698)
Power Growth: Poor (~23)
KO Percent: 163%

Force Palm (Grab)
Damage: 9%
Initial Power: Decent (1923)
Power Growth: Poor (~22)
KO Percent: 239%

Force Palm (Flame-Tip)
Damage: 5%
Initial Power: Weak (870)
Power Growth: Terrible (~18)
KO Percent: 386%

Throws

U-Throw
Damage: 4%
Initial Power: Strong (2323)
Power Growth: Terrible (~10)
KO Percent: 406%

F-Throw
Damage: 7%
Initial Power: Strong (2678)
Power Growth: Terrible (~14)
KO Percent: 291%

D-Throw
Damage: 10%
Initial Power: Amazing (3386)
Power Growth: Terrible (~7)
KO Percent: 399%

B-Throw
Damage: 10%
Initial Power: Strong (2449)
Power Growth: Terrible (~19)
KO Percent: 205%

When Lucario is at 50%:

Jab (Punch)
Damage: 2%
Initial Power: Decent (1126)
Power Growth: Abysmal (0)
KO Percent: N/A

Jab Combo (Punch 2)
Damage: 1%
Initial Power: Decent (1308)
Power Growth: Abysmal (0)
KO Percent: N/A

Jab Combo (Kick)
Damage: 4%
Initial Power: Strong (2323)
Power Growth: Terrible (~17)
KO Percent: 271%


Tilts

Up-Tilt
Damage: 5%
Initial Power: Decent (1937)
Power Growth: Poor (~22)
KO Percent: 186%

F-Tilt
Damage: 11%
Initial Power: Decent (1796)
Power Growth: Poor (~21)
KO Percent: 223%

D-tilt
Damage: 6%
Initial Power: Decent (1813)
Power Growth: Average (~25)
KO Percent: 202%

Smashes

Up-Smash
Damage: 11%
Initial Power: Decent (1935)
Power Growth: Average (~25)
KO Percent: 131%

F-Smash (Tip)
Damage: 14%
Initial Power: Decent (1854)
Power Growth: Good (~30)
KO Percent: 132%

D-Smash
Damage: 12%
Initial Power: Decent (1740)
Power Growth: Good (~31)
KO Percent: 151%

Aerials

U-Air
Damage: 9%
Initial Power: Decent (1374)
Power Growth: Decent (~28)
KO Percent: 162%

F-Air
Damage: 4%
Initial Power: Decent (1549)
Power Growth: Terrible (~15)
KO Percent: 375%

D-Air
Damage: 14%
Initial Power: Strong (2820)
Power Growth: Poor (~21)
KO Percent: 184%

B-air
Damage: 10%
Initial Power: Decent (1287)
Power Growth: Good (~30)
KO Percent: 176%

N-Air
Damage: 10%
Initial Power: Decent (1498)
Power Growth: Decent (~27)
KO Percent: 181%

N-Air (Late Hit)
Damage: 6%
Initial Power: Decent (1184)
Power Growth: Terrible (~19)
KO Percent: 275%

Specials

Aura Sphere (Uncharged)
Damage: 6%
Initial Power: Weak (752)
Power Growth: Terrible (~8)
KO Percent: 674%

Aura Sphere (Charged)
Damage: 17%
Initial Power: Strong (2084)
Power Growth: Good (~30)
KO Percent: 154%

Double Team
Damage: 10%
Initial Power: Strong (2786)
Power Growth: Decent (~27)
KO Percent: 134%

Force Palm (Grab)
Damage: 11%
Initial Power: Good (2024)
Power Growth: Decent (~26)
KO Percent: 197%

Force Palm (Flame-Tip)
Damage: 7%
Initial Power: Weak (909)
Power Growth: Terrible (~17)
KO Percent: 328%

Throws

U-Throw
Damage: 5%
Initial Power: Strong (2340)
Power Growth: Terrible (~12)
KO Percent: 348%

F-Throw
Damage: 9%
Initial Power: Strong (2726)
Power Growth: Terrible (~17)
KO Percent: 244%

D-Throw
Damage: 10%
Initial Power: Amazing (3386)
Power Growth: Terrible (~7)
KO Percent: 399%

B-Throw
Damage: 10%
Initial Power: Strong (2449)
Power Growth: Terrible (~19)
KO Percent: 205%

When Lucario is at 100%

Jab (Punch)
Damage: 3%
Initial Power: Decent (1126)
Power Growth: Abysmal (0)
KO Percent: N/A

Jab Combo (Punch 2)
Damage: 2%
Initial Power: Decent (1308)
Power Growth: Abysmal (0)
KO Percent: N/A

Jab Combo (Kick)
Damage: 5%
Initial Power: Strong (2362)
Power Growth: Poor (~20)
KO Percent: 226%

Tilts

Up-Tilt
Damage: 6%
Initial Power: Strong (2002)
Power Growth: Decent (~27)
KO Percent: 147%

F-Tilt
Damage: 15%
Initial Power: Decent (1936)
Power Growth: Decent (~26)
KO Percent: 180%

D-tilt
Damage: 8%
Initial Power: Decent (1900)
Power Growth: Good (~30)
KO Percent: 164%

Smashes

Up-Smash
Damage: 15%
Initial Power: Strong (2143)
Power Growth: Wonderful (~37)
KO Percent: 101%

F-Smash (Tip)
Damage: 18%
Initial Power: Strong (2158)
Power Growth: Magnificent (~44)
KO Percent: 99%

D-Smash
Damage: 16%
Initial Power: Decent (1976)
Power Growth: Wonderful (~39)
KO Percent: 116%

Aerials

U-Air
Damage: 11%
Initial Power: Decent (1519)
Power Growth: Good (~34)
KO Percent: 126%

F-Air
Damage: 5%
Initial Power: Decent (1585)
Power Growth: Terrible (~18)
KO Percent: 313%

D-Air
Damage: 18%
Initial Power: Strong (2992)
Power Growth: Good (~26)
KO Percent: 145%

B-air
Damage: 13%
Initial Power: Decent (1474)
Power Growth: Wonderful (~36)
KO Percent: 138%

N-Air
Damage: 12%
Initial Power: Decent (1656)
Power Growth: Good (~34)
KO Percent: 143%

N-Air (Late Hit)
Damage: 8%
Initial Power: Decent (1251)
Power Growth: Poor (~23)
KO Percent: 225%

Specials

Aura Sphere (Uncharged)
Damage: 8%
Initial Power: Weak (784)
Power Growth: Terrible (~10)
KO Percent: 552%

Aura Sphere (Charged)
Damage: 21%
Initial Power: Good (2395)
Power Growth: Wonderful (~38)
KO Percent: 116%

Double Team
Damage: 12%
Initial Power: Strong (2944)
Power Growth: Good (~34)
KO Percent: 106%

Force Palm (Grab)
Damage: 15%
Initial Power: Strong (2205)
Power Growth: Good (~32)
KO Percent: 154%

Force Palm (Flame-Tip)
Damage: 9%
Initial Power: Weak (978)
Power Growth: Poor (~21)
KO Percent: 266%

Throws

U-Throw
Damage: 6%
Initial Power: Strong (2370)
Power Growth: Terrible (~13)
KO Percent: 290%

F-Throw
Damage: 11%
Initial Power: Strong (2812)
Power Growth: Poor (~20)
KO Percent: 194%

D-Throw
Damage: 10%
Initial Power: Amazing (3386)
Power Growth: Terrible (~7)
KO Percent: 399%

B-Throw
Damage: 10%
Initial Power: Strong (2449)
Power Growth: Terrible (~19)
KO Percent: 205%


When Lucario is at 150%

Jab (Punch)
Damage: 4%
Initial Power: Decent (1126)
Power Growth: Abysmal (0)
KO Percent: N/A

Jab Combo (Punch 2)
Damage: 3%
Initial Power: Decent (1308)
Power Growth: Abysmal (0)
KO Percent: N/A

Jab Combo (Kick)
Damage: 6%
Initial Power: Strong (2402)
Power Growth: Poor (~22)
KO Percent: %

Tilts

Up-Tilt
Damage: 8%
Initial Power: Strong (2069)
Power Growth: Good (~31)
KO Percent: %

F-Tilt
Damage: 17%
Initial Power: Strong (2080)
Power Growth: Good (~30)
KO Percent: %

D-tilt
Damage: 9%
Initial Power: Decent (1991)
Power Growth: Wonderful (~35)
KO Percent: %

Smashes

Up-Smash
Damage: 18%
Initial Power: Strong (2361)
Power Growth: Wonderful (~43)
KO Percent: %

F-Smash (Tip)
Damage: 22%
Initial Power: Strong (2482)
Power Growth: Superb (~51)
KO Percent: %

D-Smash
Damage: 19%
Initial Power: Strong (2219)
Power Growth: Wonderful (~45)
KO Percent: %

Aerials

U-Air
Damage: 13%
Initial Power: Decent (1669)
Power Growth: Wonderful (~40)
KO Percent: %

F-Air
Damage: 6%
Initial Power: Decent (1622)
Power Growth: Poor (~20)
KO Percent: %

D-Air
Damage: 22%
Initial Power: Amazing (3170)
Power Growth: Good (~30)
KO Percent: %

B-air
Damage: 16%
Initial Power: Decent (1668)
Power Growth: Wonderful (~42)
KO Percent: %

N-Air
Damage: 15%
Initial Power: Decent (1819)
Power Growth: Wonderful (~39)
KO Percent: %

N-Air (Late Hit)
Damage: 9%
Initial Power: Decent (1320)
Power Growth: Decent (~27)
KO Percent: %

Specials

Aura Sphere (Uncharged)
Damage: 10%
Initial Power: Weak (817)
Power Growth: Terrible (~12)
KO Percent: 552%

Aura Sphere (Charged)
Damage: 25%
Initial Power: Good (2719)
Power Growth: Wonderful (~45)
KO Percent: %

Double Team
Damage: 15%
Initial Power: Amazing (3108)
Power Growth: Wonderful (~45)
KO Percent: %

Force Palm (Grab)
Damage: 17%
Initial Power: Strong (2393)
Power Growth: Wonderful (~38)
KO Percent: %

Force Palm (Flame-Tip)
Damage: 12%
Initial Power: Strong (2204)
Power Growth: Good (~27)
KO Percent: %

Throws

U-Throw
Damage: 8%
Initial Power: Strong (2401)
Power Growth: Terrible (~14)
KO Percent: %

F-Throw
Damage: 13%
Initial Power: Strong (2900)
Power Growth: Poor (~24)
KO Percent: %

D-Throw
Damage: 10%
Initial Power: Amazing (3386)
Power Growth: Terrible (~7)
KO Percent: 399%

B-Throw
Damage: 10%
Initial Power: Strong (2449)
Power Growth: Terrible (~19)
KO Percent: 205%

Character Weight

For lighter characters, expect better results. For heavier characters, expect worse results.

Bowser 108.02
Donkey Kong 107.35
Snake 106.15
King Dedede 105.56
Samus 104.98
Charizard 104.68
Yoshi 103.9
ROB 103.83
Ganondorf 103.52
Wario 103.45
Ike 102.63
Link 101.99
Captain Falcon 101.45
Lucario 101.35
Ivysaur 101.06
Mario 100
Luigi 99.96
Wolf 99.55
Ness 98.42
Sonic 98.33
Pit 98.28
Lucas 97.72
Toon Link 97.59
Ice Climbers 97.34
Diddy Kong 97.22
Peach 96.97
Marth 95.52
Zelda 94.64
Olimar 93.55
Zero Suit Samus 92.17
Sheik 92.15
Falco 91.83
Kirby 91.74
Pikachu 91.34
Meta Knight 91.06
Mr. Game & Watch 89.95
Fox 89
Squirtle 88.97
Jigglypuff 87.55



FUTURE UPDATES:
*Will determine Initial Power/Power Gowth when Lucario is at:
-50%
-100%
-150%
-200%.

*Will determine each KO percent at:
-50%
-100%
-150%
-200%.

 

[Nodrak]

Good job! ... what do the numbers mean again?

 

[Jeepy Sol]

Well, the numbers next to "Initial Power" are basically the launch speeds (mph...seriously) for each of Lucario's attacks when your opponent is at 0%. The numbers next to "Power Growth" represent how much knockback is added at each percent. So, up-tilt dealt to an opponent at 0% has a launch speed of 1900. At 1%, 1919.

Moves *generally* KO at around 7000, give or take a couple hundred. (Depending on trajectory)

 

[PSYCHE]

Oh. Snap.

This is beautiful... Can't wait for KO percents!

 

[Kitamerby]

Great! Amazing! Phenominal!


...So what does this mean again? Also, how do you know the mph, and how can it translate into something more... useful?

 

[PSYCHE]

Brawl runs on a mph system. Thats just the way it goes. I wouldnt know how to translate it, maybe Jeepy does, but its actually pretty simple.

See how d-throw does 3386? Thats its launch speed. 3386 is a very good launch speed, even for a throw.
Now see the 7 next to power growth? That means that for every percent added to your enemy, the launch speed goes up by 7.

 

[Browny]

dthrows launch speed looks wrong, i think thats because its including the downward slam. the enemy get throws into the ground a lot faster than they bounce back up. i havent tested it but i suspect MK and kirbys uthrow will be the same.

 

[Jeepy Sol]

Technically, it's not wrong, but you've got a point. Since there is no way to test the bounce up, that will have to do.

And yes, Kirby and Meta Knights u-throw are the same.

 

[PSYCHE]

Ha, that's funny that an uncharged Aura Sphere KO's at 790%.

By the way, what are the descriptions next to initial power and power growth based on? All of Lucarios moves or other characters moves?

 

[phi1ny3]

Nice guide, but, what is the airspeed velocity of an unladen swallow?

 

[Nodrak]

European or African?
Chart for what Jeepy has up already, cause i said I would.

 

[Jeepy Sol]

Monty Python fans, eh?


Got 50% up. Will try to finish KO percents today.

Some interesting things to note:

*Lucario's first two jabs experience no Power Growth at all once he gets to 50%.
*Uncharged Aura Sphere experiences half the Power Growth as it does when Lucario is at 0%.

Strange, yes?

Oh, and thanks a lot for the chart, Nodrak! I will add it once I have completely finished, just in case I need to make any quick changes. Case in point: Misread my own handwriting. d-throw doesn't kill until 399%, not 309%.

 

[Nodrak]

I'll update the chart with your % updates.
I think Lucario's first 2 jabs not gaining power is normal, they probably don't gain knockback/power simply because it's meant to be an AAA combo. The 2nd or last jab wouldn't connect if it got a power/knockback increase past 50%.

 

[Browny]

thats expected... his first two jabs only do 2% or something?

to have an increase in damage (2-3), they would have to do 50% more, lucario's other moves dont start doing 50% more until about 80%.

 

[PSYCHE]

I was just thinking. Does a fully charged aura sphere have the same knockback/launch speed as an ALMOST fully charged one? Cause that would make the "almost fully charged aura sphere" mindgame so much better.

 

[betterthanbonds9]

are 50% increments until 200% the exact damage increasing increments?

or is it like a line graph going from 1 at 0% to 2 at 200% with 1.25 at 50%, etc?

 

[Jeepy Sol]

are 50% increments until 200% the exact damage increasing increments?

or is it like a line graph going from 1 at 0% to 2 at 200% with 1.25 at 50%, etc?

Each move has different aura multipliers and caps at different percents. I decided it would be best to test KO percents at 50% incriments, just to be consistant.

 

[Jeepy Sol]

Updated with Knockback/Launch Speeds and KO percents for 100%.

I took down "Force Palm Base/Middle" because it is almost immpossible to be space them accurately, and I don't want to feed you false information.

 

[PSYCHE]

Love the KO percents. Keep up the good work man.

 

[shi]

The luc boards never disappoint me at how helpful and in depth they are

 

[Nodrak]

I'll start updating my spreadsheets!

 

[Milln]

Lemme know when the Double Team spreadsheet is redone, so we can have a more accurate one in the guide. =o

 

[Jeepy Sol]

Wait, what was I supposed to do again? =3

 

[Milln]

FUTURE UPDATES:
*Will determine Initial Power/Power Gowth when Lucario is at:
-50%
-100%
-150%
-200%.

*Will determine each KO percent at:
-50%
-100%
-150%
-200%.

This >O Do this

 

[Jeepy Sol]

Mmkay. I remember you posting something about redoing my Double Team KO Chart in my other thread, so I thought that's what you were talking about.

 

[Samuelson]

Jeepy Sol you are amazing and so is this information thank you so much

 

[phi1ny3]

The luc boards never disappoint me at how helpful and in depth they are

Lucario mainers, IMO, need to be aware of more than just combos and tactics. They have to be aware of statistics, percentages, adaptability, the list goes on. Lucario's need to devote lots of skill to adapt the strategy, because it changes A LOT. Lucario players don't act smart to brag, they do it to survive and win the fight.

Oh, and because we are a relatively nice board (instead of certain other boards, who often say "no, u suck!", or even have the gall to throw up threads like "who do u think is the most nooby player?") <- yes, I've seen this happen, and thank goodness there are Mods who shut these down.

 

[NESSBOUNDER]

Thanks guys for the KO percents. I was going to help, but I've been so busy lately. wwww...*~*

Although perhaps it may be a good idea to consider testing for when Lucario is one stock ahead or behind.

 

[Milln]

I know you've been busy. =o I was just abotu to be all "Where's that Nessbounder....?"

Mmkay. I remember you posting something about redoing my Double Team KO Chart in my other thread, so I thought that's what you were talking about.

Nodrak did the chart, so we're making him update it. >,>

 

[Jeepy Sol]

!!!! I forgot about testing when Lucario is one stock ahead/behind! *sigh* I guess I can do that once I'm done with 150% and 200%.

 

[Nodrak]

Nodrak did the chart, so we're making him update it. >,>

Yeah, I'll try to keep updating as Jeepy finishes his tests but I'm reluctant to post until he's 100% done a section, in case he sees a mistake or something has to be changed. I guess I'll post the chart anyway though, I'll finish it up later tonight and post tomorrow for the 100% section. I can always change it quickly if Jeepy does fix something

 

[Milln]

It doesn't have to be now. XD It can wait until it's all done. He's got it going up to 200%, anyway which we've mathematician'd out to not be the cap for Double Team. The guide topic can wait till he's done since the current chart, with the given percents is accurate. The only thing we need is DT's true cap documented on the chart and replace it with 200%

 

[NESSBOUNDER]

And on a side note: I am really impressed by this data. Even at 50%, Lucario has decent KO power all around, and can rack up damage like some kind of delerious funkypriest. 15% off Ftilt and Dair? wow. And at a meagre 100%, he is KOing with fsmash in the late 80s.

That's awesome.

 

[PSYCHE]

Force Palm (Flame-Tip)
Damage: 9%
Initial Power: Weak (978)
Power Growth: Poor (~21)
KO Percent: %

You forgot to do the KO percent on this one.

 

[Jeepy Sol]

Whoops! Thanks, I'll have it up soon.

 

[CAPTAIN Z-X2]

also if lucario is in last place of a match his aura sphere is bigger. when i was playing with my cousin we all chosed lucario so i could show them some thing. when i was at 43 % damage my aura sphere was still puny but my cousins aura sphere was huge and powerful at only 25 percent then again at 14 percent but the thing is he was in last place of me and my other cousin. plus that f-B chain grab is very useful but if your opponent is spot dodging then u don't get alot of hits in. but i don't like about lucario is the fact that when u are ready to end a match with opponent at his last life and above 100 and u are at 0 u still can't kill him with a decent smash attack unless ur close to the edge of a level

 

[Gymn]

Good chart, hopefully will improve the way some lucarios play technically

 

[PSYCHE]

So Jeepy are you going to do 2 stocks behind/ahead or 1 stock behind/ahead?

 

[phi1ny3]

If this is going to be tested Mythbusters style, then it will be both.

 

[Jeepy Sol]

Ha, I'm not trying to bust any myths, but yeah, I'll probably end up doing when he is two stocks behind/ahead... But dang, it's going to take months! @__@ I'm still working on 150%, by the way.