Jumping with Samus

[Rat]

This thread is to ask what you Samus Experts (Sexperts? Exmus'? Samperts? Sexmusperts?) think of the X, Y, or up on the control stick with Samus.


I pretty much think Samus' Aerial Stance is Balls Terrible. Every time I jump I regret it. Even if I do waveland shenanigans, they are usually full of fail.

Are their really good ways or places to jump? Like I understand the need to Anticipate your opponents Evasion Jumps. (Ie SH Nair over them). But that's only when you know know know know they will jump. not have a guess. Unless you are balls risky.

So is jumping with Samus something useful? And in which situations? Or should jumping be used as a "Mindgame", Mix-up, or in Anticipation?

 

[Egg Fu Yung]

I usually only jump if :
1) Theyre above me
2) I wanna waveland on a platform
3) I messed up a wavedash :S (Accidentally of course)

 

[Pi]

I think it really comes down to the character, and the player, and the situation.

Glad I could help.

 

[Rat]

Someone once told me if you want to sound smart and yet have no idea, just say "It depends on the Context."

 

[Corigames]

Jump to mess up timing. If you leap at someone, you can always mid-air jump to delay your attack or bait them to do something. Jumping for Samus though means a few things. If you are Samus above someone, they will always think you will Dair. If you are at level with them, then a Nair is always expected if facing front and a Bair if reverse. If they are above you, an Uair or Fair is expected.

If you can mix it up while still being practical (meaning not Nairing when you should be Bairing just to toss it up, actually hit if you can), then you can gain a mindgame advantage. However, you do not have to necessarily be jumping around to do that. Samus does just fine on the ground and really should stay rooted in many match-ups.

Also, I'm an advocate of control-stick for jump..

 

[Binx]

Samus has a lot more options while grounded, the same is true for all characters, the general rule for all characters is you should only jump if you know your gonna connect with an attack during that jump, you HAVE to jump to avoid an attack, or you are doing it for mobility, which will rarely be the case for Samus unless you are wavelanding off a platform to missile or something.

Samus' fastest moves come off on the ground, try and stay there.

 

[Rat]

You can always mid-air jump to delay your attack or bait them to do something.... They will always think you will Dair....

If you can mix it up while still being practical....

I'll play around with Baiting with DJ. Maybe I can jump at the edge of their Good Zone, then DJ punish?
Maybe DJing is vastly superior to Single Jumping? My friend (who casuals Samus) was DJing like a mother. You are way smaller, and can FF sooner.


The weird thing for me is that, I don't think, that they think, I will Dair. I've already decided that Dair is, generally, a bad move. I Dair because I think, that they think, I will Early Nair (beat jump/counter attack), So I Dair to beat a shield. =\


I'm not really sure what you mean by mix-up here. Like just Doing a different aerial? Cuase that isn't really mixing up if it's the Same angle of approach....

Do mean like mixing up the Timing? Like nairs 4 frames vs Dairs 16 frames?

Stuff here

I think I understand what you are Saying. Ground is generally good for most characters.

Do you think it is worth it to jump with Samus, if the purpose is to increase mobility by Wavelanding?

Are you more successful, have better options, and/or have more openings when you use the platforms as your central local/locomotion?

I've seen Samus' like Echo or Zjiin hang out all dai on platforms. But I've never really understood the benefit.

 

[Geist]

I'm a sexmuspert.

On a predominantly flat stage, jumping is disadvantageous. Samus has smelly air speed, and she kinda just floats (duh). The good thing about her jump is that it's activated pretty fast. As fast as fox's actually. This is why I think platforms are really good to jump around, because combined with her wavedash, she has a respectable speed to get around the stage with.

Like Binx said, she has more options on the ground, and like Corey said, mixing it up while staying practical gives you an small advantage to what may have been bad for samus without it. I don't know if this is exactly the kind of thing that Corey was referring to, but I find using a fast falled uair when directly above an enemy can really throw off their timing, and shut down potential shield grabbers with a quick jab. Of course, this option is only safe if you take advantage of platforms... or if you're amazing.
If you don't like her prone arial stance, just pull off a nair as soon as you possibly can after you jump. Nair covers you pretty well, and you'll be able to do another arial if you want to.

As for DJ, while it's usually a bad idea with floaties (**** jump stealing gimps), with Samus it's not as bad, because of her recovery. But it can still get you combo'd to hell and back if you're not careful. DJ is faster than normal jump, and by alot, so if you think the reward is higher than the potential risk, I say go for it - but make sure there are platforms to back you up.

 

[Pi]

Someone once told me if you want to sound smart and yet have no idea, just say "It depends on the Context."

I'm sure it's easier for you to assume that than to realize that the amount of situations that present themselves in any given match where jumping could be beneficial couldn't possibly be brought up.

There is no proper way to jump with samus, there is no guaranteed way to use her x/y/joystick^ and come out on top, the only answers anyone can give you is what has worked for them in the past, which could so easily change given a different situation.

So, if you want to know what really works out great for me as far as jumping goes then here it is;

When you're off the stage and your UB, bomb jumping, & grapple won't save you, double jump to get into a better position.

 

[Mars-]

I like to jump to cancel my missiles it is also very helpful for my recovery. When they are above me I like to jump up so I can hit them.

 

['Fro]

I generally keep my air time short with Samus, but I try to do certain things so that they're afraid of when I do jump. If I can get a read on when someone wants to jump, I like n-airing them out of the air to make them think twice. Another thing is, on sheilding opponents, after I hit their sheild with a missile, I'll aim for the back of their sheild with a d-air, usually leaving them with almost no sheild left. Aside from that, and platform mobility, that's about it for me.

 

[ihavespaceblondes]

I only jump when I know it'll work.
awesomeface.jpg

 

[The Irish Mafia]

I'm a little bit of a samus player, so I'll throw in my 2 cents. Smash nowadays is expanded because of sha's and the like, so Samus' balls jump isn't very helpful. Her high priority nair and uair are almost shields that you can use to not get boned for jumping, so if you regret a jump, use your *****-foot to not get punished. One of my favorite tricks is on a tier'd stage, jumping, wavelanding a platform, and then dropping on the other side to a uair. Jumping over someone to nair isn't a bad idea, because if they don't jump into it, just drop on them. If you really regret a jump, just missle everything until you land.

 

[DrewB008]

i jump a lot, it works enough for me to keep doing it

more importantly, watty is actually good and he jumps a good amount

its not as bad as most people think, except vs marth probably

 

[Dew Rag]

for me it's kinda a prediction, like i know they're gonna sh some aerial move, i just sh nair before they do so they get hit instead : \

it's pretty good if u pull em out faster than ur opponent and hit them before/when they jump
so.... i'm basically saying what spaceballs said... um...

i try to hit them from the side with a uair or fair if i see them coming down in the air above the stage : \

 

[soap]

my samus is jumpy. u can either space an aerial or if u suspect a dash dance u missile cancel.

Jumping isnt bad if u space.

Use her sh back jump when she backflips, it helps to space and i feel it gives u more aerial mobility and i feel like u have less airtime. that may just be a placebo animation though.

 

[Lanowen]

I love jumping.

Jumping is the best.

Maybe that is why I lose so much...

**** you guys >_>

 

[Geist]

If Samus was a fast-faller I would jump all day long. I wouldn't even attack either, I'd just be so happy.

 

[The Great Radsby]

Silly rabits, you don't just jump with Samus for absolutely no reason. You jump to missile cancel, continue a combo, or to manuever around platform stages more swiftly. Down smash/dtilt THEN jump. Oh, and to edgeguard. You never want to full hop though. But Samus's SH is pretty difficult so I seem to make that mistake a lot.

 

[Geist]

Are you suggesting we don't jump for no reason? Because those would be fightin' words

Welcome to smashboards btw

 

[The Great Radsby]

Haha thanks. And I'm not sure how to answer that because I didn't read the whole topic, just the last page.

 

[Geist]

lol
This thread is pretty vague anyways. We've all come to conclusion that A) we all like jumping and B) that's why we lose. except Ihavespaceballs, but w.e.
Feel free to add anything to that.

Yeah apparently all the Samus's are on vacation or something. Usually this place is pretty active, for a melee character specific forum. *Goes into rant about Brawl*

 

[The Great Radsby]

Jumping is ok, but I'd rather lay a bomb. Bombs are awesome. Kills most peoples approach, fancy grapple tricks, triple missiles. Just awesome. Really need to work on bomb>taunt.

 

[Geist]

Elabotate on the triple missile part.
Do you mean missile *bomb explodes*-> missile cancel -> missile?
Sounds suspicious.

 

[The Great Radsby]

Yeah, my "triple missile" is me laying a bomb, di(ing) back laying another, di forward again to explosion, missile cancel, pop up again on behind bomb, missile cancel, standing missile. Boy, that sounds confusing.

I go forward and back because just laying them in place makes me pop up to high and the missile cancel doesn't end soon enough. It also confuses some people.

 

[Rat]

Yeah this topic is pretty vague...

It was more noting how bad Jumping with Samus is, and trying to figure out how to use it better. Like Hugs hardly ever jumps. But then Spaceballs jumps and Dairs like a madman.

The protecting your jump with a Nair thing doesn't make sense to me. Samus' floatiness makes here landing position too predictable. =/.

 

[ihavespaceblondes]

To be honest, I don't just jump at opponents and hope for the best. Watty is more of a "jump over a shield and dair" Samus than me, I just dair out of other moves a lot (and made a ******** video that apparently actually changed people's opinion of me ;_; ), especially uthrow.

As for jumping with nair, that's mainly on people who jump out of shield to punish a lot. Like you pressure a Ganon or Falcon's shield with jabs or utilt or ftilt, then jump at them with a nair to predict their jump out of shield. It starts conditioning them to roll instead, and then you try to predict their rolls.

Weee I love Samus vs Falcon or Ganon. You're both pretty evenly matched in terms of oos options and pressure. Unlike Samus vs Marth, where everything you do turns into fair out of shield.

 

[Rat]

Maybe the question should be how does watty get away with Jumping and Dairing?

Yeah, in your tournament videos you are much safer. I'm surprised at how often and effectively you get close (Utilt/Ftilt range). WDing (or moving) through that mid range is scary for me =(.
(Are you going to be at the Kansas City tournament? (the one mango is apparently going to). Cause I'm going to try and make it down.)


I love shield pressure. Jab Jab SH Fair is my favorite (and Jab, do nothing).
Also marth is gay. Trying to Space Ftilts perfectly is dumb. Maybe I'll just grab all the time. =(

 

[soap]

watty has cojones

 

[TheLifeRuiner]

he's watty.

it's a mindgame within itself.

and the above.