Ivysaur As A DLC! - VOTE NOW FOR HIM IN THE SMASH BALLOT!!

[Vsaur]

Honestly ivysaur is not that interesting a fighter, most his attacks are fairly generic, bullet seed is about the only really original attack he had.

Braydon is obviosly a dumb***

 

[Deleted member]

Honestly ivysaur is not that interesting a fighter, most his attacks are fairly generic, bullet seed is about the only really original attack he had.

Ivysaur may not be the most interesting, but he is so goshdarn cute. And the great thing about bringing him back for Smash 4 is that his moveset will be upgraded, with 2 new moves! Final Smash would have to be Solar Beam, and there are tons of options for his fourth special move.

Really, though, if Ivysaur comes back Squirtle has to as well. It would be a great DLC bundle. And many may prefer them as DLC anyway--I'm talking to all those who say "there are too many (Gen I) Pokemon in Smash QQ!!!1!!"

 

[Braydon]

I guess every fighter that isn't Mega Man is generic then.

Yes, clearly I mean something completely different from what I said...

Braydon is obviosly a dumb***

Charming

Ivysaur may not be the most interesting, but he is so goshdarn cute. And the great thing about bringing him back for Smash 4 is that his moveset will be upgraded, with 2 new moves! Final Smash would have to be Solar Beam, and there are tons of options for his fourth special move.

Really, though, if Ivysaur comes back Squirtle has to as well. It would be a great DLC bundle. And many may prefer them as DLC anyway--I'm talking to all those who say "there are too many (Gen I) Pokemon in Smash QQ!!!1!!"

Hey, a legitimate reason he should come back instead of flaming me! Only thing is what else would be in that bundle? Guess it could just be mii fighter costumes but I'd prefer a third gen 1 pokemon in it.

Still what would his up B and down B be? And what would make his side B interesting? Because it's not.

 

[FalKoopa]

Uniqueness lies in the eyes of the beholder. He uses his vines, the bulb on his back and his Razor Leaf has a 'grass' effect, which is plenty unique for me.

Ivysaur has one advantage in that Brawl and Smash 4 has similar file structures, meaning his animations can be ported over easily. Let's hope.

I wonder what he'll get for a Final Smash though. Probably Solar Beam.

 

[AEMehr]

Ivysaur would need a new Up Special, since Tether recoveries aren't a thing.

 

[Braydon]

Uniqueness lies in the eyes of the beholder. He uses his vines, the bulb on his back and his Razor Leaf has a 'grass' effect, which is plenty unique for me.

Umm...

Grass effect was removed, and even so it was an almost meaningless status effect that was only relevant when fighting squirtle or charizard. Razor leaf is just a generic projectile.

The vine is almost identical to the old olimar and ZSS up special, it had no uniqueness and would be removed in 4 as those types of recoveries are no more.

Which brings me back to he has one unique attack, bullet seed.


Attacking with vines and bulbs means nothing to gameplay, if you think it makes him unique you're just becoming disillusioned by aesthetics, it's like saying falcos different from fox because he attacks with wings...

 

[Nauzgo]

but I'd prefer a third gen 1 pokemon in it.

Brawl had 5 gen 1 pokemon, what's the problem? If Mewtwo was only cut from Brawl due to time constraints there also would have been 6 gen 1 pokemon.

And come on, Ivysaur is unique.

 

[VioletScarlett]

As much as I'd love Ivysaur and Squirtle back, I think Charizard being alone stomps their chances to dust. .-.

 

[Braydon]

Brawl had 5 gen 1 pokemon, what's the problem? If Mewtwo was only cut from Brawl due to time constraints there also would have been 6 gen 1 pokemon.

And come on, Ivysaur is unique.

I meant if they were making a pack of dlc pokemon with squritle and ivysaur I'd also like another one in it.

And no, ivysaur is not unique at all. He uses templates for basically all his moves, bullet seed is the only unique attack and there's nothing you have said to the contrary. "No he is unique" is not a counter argument...

 

[Nauzgo]

I meant if they were making a pack of dlc pokemon with squritle and ivysaur I'd also like another one in it.

And no, ivysaur is not unique at all. He uses templates for basically all his moves, bullet seed is the only unique attack and there's nothing you have said to the contrary. "No he is unique" is not a counter argument...

Haha oh I thought that was sarcasm. Hmm, I think they should take Pichu then.

If a character has different moves and design of that moves to other characters he's unique imo. A character who has the same moveset with just a little change in the physics and damage/effect, isn't really unique (that would be the case for Roy or Young Link in Melee).

 

[Vsaur]

I meant if they were making a pack of dlc pokemon with squritle and ivysaur I'd also like another one in it.

And no, ivysaur is not unique at all. He uses templates for basically all his moves, bullet seed is the only unique attack and there's nothing you have said to the contrary. "No he is unique" is not a counter argument...

Well for example his up air and down air are unique I'm pretty sure its the only up air that pushes you down.His recovery could be that he flips over and an explosion emits his bulb launching him up. His down special could be seed bomb (just like in project M) or it could be synthesis

 

[Vsaur]

Ivysaur would need a new Up Special, since Tether recoveries aren't a thing.

His recovery could be that he flips over and an explosion emits his bulb launching him up

 

[Braydon]

Well for example his up air and down air are unique I'm pretty sure its the only up air that pushes you down.His recovery could be that he flips over and an explosion emits his bulb launching him up. His down special could be seed bomb (just like in project M) or it could be synthesis

Okay but still that's 3 attacks that are unique, bringing me back to the whole, he's not very unique thing. Also, synthesis? As in self heal? No.

 

[FalKoopa]

Umm...

Grass effect was removed, and even so it was an almost meaningless status effect that was only relevant when fighting squirtle or charizard. Razor leaf is just a generic projectile.

The vine is almost identical to the old olimar and ZSS up special, it had no uniqueness and would be removed in 4 as those types of recoveries are no more.

Which brings me back to he has one unique attack, bullet seed.


Attacking with vines and bulbs means nothing to gameplay, if you think it makes him unique you're just becoming disillusioned by aesthetics, it's like saying falcos different from fox because he attacks with wings...

So? Are you going to say Mario, Luigi, Li'l Mac, Bowser and Wario are generic because they all use punches for jab attacks? Or Capt. Falcon, Samus and Ganondorf are generic because they share an Up-tilt.

Also, you should look away from just his Special Attacks. They make up a tiny part of a character's moveset. Ivysaur also uses his vines for his jab, tilts, aerial attacks and grab, which is unique to him.

As I said, 'Uniqueness' lies in the eyes of the beholder.

 

[Braydon]

So? Are you going to say Mario, Luigi, Li'l Mac, Bowser and Wario are generic because they all use punches for jab attacks? Or Capt. Falcon, Samus and Ganondorf are generic because they share an Up-tilt.

Also, you should look away from just his Special Attacks. They make up a tiny part of a character's moveset. Ivysaur also uses his vines for his jab, tilts, aerial attacks and grab, which is unique to him.

As I said, 'Uniqueness' lies in the eyes of the beholder.

Again using vines is just aesthetic and means absolutely nothing to gameplay. Lil macs, punches work entirely different from marios, I'm talking about gameplay hear not aesthetics. If aesthetics have you convinced he's unique then I'd say uniqueness lies in the ignorance of the beholder, if you allow yourself to be disillusioned by aesthetics.

 

[FalKoopa]

Again using vines is just aesthetic and means absolutely nothing to gameplay. Lil macs, punches work entirely different from marios, I'm talking about gameplay hear not aesthetics. If aesthetics have you convinced he's unique then I'd say uniqueness lies in the ignorance of the beholder, if you allow yourself to be disillusioned by aesthetics.

Well, you mentioned that his vines were similar to ZSS's whip, which isn't exactly true. ZSS's whip has an electricity effect. You may say that his individual attacks are generic, but the sum total of the parts makes him a very different character from the rest. That's what I'm getting at.

A few attacks being shared does not make someone generic. Are you going to say Chrarizard is generic because his Flamethrower is funtionally the same as Bowser's Fire Breath? If yes, then I'm not going to bother convincing you any more, as you and I have very different ideas of what it means to be unique.

For me, it's sufficient that a character looks different aesthetically and has a different playstyle from other characters. I don't compare characters move-for-move. I prefer to look at the whole picture.

 

[Braydon]

Well, you mentioned that his vines were similar to ZSS's whip, which isn't exactly true. ZSS's whip has an electricity effect. You may say that his individual attacks are generic, but the sum total of the parts makes him a very different character from the rest. That's what I'm getting at.

A few attacks being shared does not make someone generic. Are you going to say Chrarizard is generic because his Flamethrower is funtionally the same as Bowser's Fire Breath? If yes, then I'm not going to bother convincing you any more, as you and I have very different ideas of what it means to be unique.

For me, it's sufficient that a character looks different aesthetically and has a different playstyle from other characters. I don't compare characters move-for-move. I prefer to look at the whole picture.

But his play style wasn't really unique, and what I'm saying isn't that a character needs all unique moves but that a character would ideally have some unique moves.

 

[Deleted member]

As much as I'd love Ivysaur and Squirtle back, I think Charizard being alone stomps their chances to dust. .-.

I don't think so. I think it came down to splitting up all the characters and priority. We know that the team was once again running out of time, since Bowser Jr. barely made it in. Perhaps Mewtwo, Lucas and maybe even Wolf were not meant to be cut either. Charizard probably simply had a bigger priority because he's more iconic.

But his play style wasn't really unique, and what I'm saying isn't that a character needs all unique moves but that a character would ideally have some unique moves.

Yeah.....but there are many characters that share moves. Even Lucas, who's standard attacks are very different from Ness', basically has the same special moves. Ivysaur was the first quadrupedal fighter and was meant to be average between the fast and slippery Squirtle and the heavy Charizard. But he had some unique attributes such as that vine whip sweet spot that had an interesting angle, and, like you said, Bullet Seed. Overall I would say Ivysaur had some good spacing options and was just fun to play.

 

[SMAASH! Puppy]

Do you know how many characters share moves? Bowser, Pikachu, and Villager have the same (if not similar) Neutral Arials. Its how each character uses those moves that makes them unique. And don't assume that Tether recoveries are a thing of the past. A few characters still can use tethers, they just come out of the air grab. (Which never seems to work for me for some reason. I keep puling out my forward aerial instead.)

 

[Vsaur]

Okay but still that's 3 attacks that are unique, bringing me back to the whole, he's not very unique thing. Also, synthesis? As in self heal? No.

*sigh* tell me a character that has the same backair or even a backair close to ivysaurs. Who has a forward are like ivysaur? And why must ALL of his moves be unique! Mewtwo has the same neutral B as lucario and also has a very common recovery (zelda and sheik have mewtwos recovery) plus there lots of other characters that have a teleport like recovery.

Not to mention mewtwo has the same forward air as mario. Lucas has the same recovery and down B as ness. Also lucas has a very similar side B to ness

But his play style wasn't really unique, and what I'm saying isn't that a character needs all unique moves but that a character would ideally have some unique moves.

Your losing this fight...........

 

[Braydon]

You're winning the spam fight triple poster. Use the edit button...

 

[Vsaur]

You're winning the spam fight triple poster. Use the edit button...

Someones getting salty XD. Oh ya and I'm also new for smash boards sorry for not knowing .-.

 

[Spirst]

Yep, use the Edit button next time. Seeing as how you're new, you're let off this time. Next time, you'd be given an actual warning.

Also, tone down the whole back and forth taunting tone in the posts, people.

 

[SMAASH! Puppy]

So after scanning Ivysaur's move set, I think I have found the moves that are unique.
His Up Tilt is one of few where the hitbox doesn't go up in an ark.
The only other character that has a multi-hitting forward tilt is Wolf, and even then they aren't the same.
Ivysaur's Forward Smash is the only one that returns you to your original position after moving you that far forward. That's using your head Ivysaur! (Get it? cause Ivysaur launches himself headfirst?.....Never mind)
Ivysaur's Up Smash is the only one that is just an explosion. (I know it's spores, but I think explosion sounds more epic. )
Ivysaur's Down Smash is one of few that comes out on both sides at the same time.
Bullet Seed is unique, but you already knew that.
Vine Whip would be unique because nobody else has a tether that is an Up Special.
I hope this will convince you that Ivysaur is in fact, unique.

As for changes to his moveset, I think the Meteor Smash in his Down Arial should be easier to hit. His Back Arial should deal more damage... ANd that's really all I've got at the moment.

 

[Nauzgo]

So after scanning Ivysaur's move set, I think I have found the moves that are unique.
His Up Tilt is one of few where the hitbox doesn't go up in an ark.
The only other character that has a multi-hitting forward tilt is Wolf, and even then they aren't the same.
Ivysaur's Forward Smash is the only one that returns you to your original position after moving you that far forward. That's using your head Ivysaur! (Get it? cause Ivysaur launches himself headfirst?.....Never mind)
Ivysaur's Up Smash is the only one that is just an explosion. (I know it's spores, but I think explosion sounds more epic. )
Ivysaur's Down Smash is one of few that comes out on both sides at the same time.
Bullet Seed is unique, but you already knew that.
Vine Whip would be unique because nobody else has a tether that is an Up Special.
I hope this will convince you that Ivysaur is in fact, unique.

As for changes to his moveset, I think the Meteor Smash in his Down Arial should be easier to hit. His Back Arial should deal more damage... ANd that's really all I've got at the moment.

Pretty good work! But Olimars Up Special in Brawl was a tether too ^^ But that's wayne for Smash 4.

 

[SMAASH! Puppy]

Pretty good work! But Olimars Up Special in Brawl was a tether too ^^ But that's wayne for Smash 4.

Wayne? Anyway, Olimar and Zero Suit Samus's tether recoveries have been abandoned. (At least for their up specials) Ivysaur would be the only one with his Up Special as a tether.

 

[Deleted member]

If Sakurai didn't want an up special tether recovery, I was thinking it could be changed to 1. still Vine Whip but maybe Ivysaur spins around with them, like Donkey Kong's up special, or 2. a bulb explosion that propels him upward, while at the same time releasing a poison or sleep powder (similar to an up special of the Mii Gunner). Or maybe 3. Leaf Storm which surrounds him in spinning leaves which lift him up, kinda like Wario's up special.

And then he could still have the tether recovery tied to his grab.

 

[Putuk]

I'd love to see Ivysaur come back, I really would. It was my second-favorite Brawl character. Not to mention the only playable Poison-type (my favorite type) in any Smash game.
But I just can't see it happening. Besides, I already got Lucas back, so asking for more would just feel greedy.

 

[Vsaur]

Umm...

Grass effect was removed, and even so it was an almost meaningless status effect that was only relevant when fighting squirtle or charizard. Razor leaf is just a generic projectile.

The vine is almost identical to the old olimar and ZSS up special, it had no uniqueness and would be removed in 4 as those types of recoveries are no more.

Which brings me back to he has one unique attack, bullet seed.


Attacking with vines and bulbs means nothing to gameplay, if you think it makes him unique you're just becoming disillusioned by aesthetics, it's like saying falcos different from fox because he attacks with wings...

This hater just doesn't get it...........

 

[Braydon]

This hater just doesn't get it...........

I think you just don't get it, that's why you feel the need to go to personal attacks instead.

 

[SMAASH! Puppy]

(Growls menacingly) I'm tired of this fighting. Obviously Braydon isn't going to be persuaded, but that doesn't change the fact that Ivysaur is a veteran, and needs to return. All I request is that you don't give Ivysaur the Pichu treatment on this thread Braydon. Because even Pichu doesn't deserve the hate he gets.

 

[Braydon]

(Growls menacingly) I'm tired of this fighting. Obviously Braydon isn't going to be persuaded, but that doesn't change the fact that Ivysaur is a veteran, and needs to return. All I request is that you don't give Ivysaur the Pichu treatment on this thread Braydon. Because even Pichu doesn't deserve the hate he gets.

Well I'd left the thread but then something popped up in my alert box about my post being quoted, apparently someone wanted to insult me...


Also why does being a veteran make him deserve a return?

 

[SMAASH! Puppy]

Also why does being a veteran make him deserve a return?

Well how would you like it if your favorite character was cut from smash? Every cut veteran was at some point, someone's favorite character. It doesn't feel good when your favorite character gets cut no matter what every one else thinks about said character.

I'm curious. Who do you think Ivysaur is a clone/semi-clone of?

 

[Princess Toady]

YAS PLZ

Add me as a supporter, I always ditched Squirtle and Charizard to play as our favorite plant in Brawl, lol. Sucks that this is one of the veterans with the least popularity...

 

[Braydon]

Well how would you like it if your favorite character was cut from smash? Every cut veteran was at some point, someone's favorite character. It doesn't feel good when your favorite character gets cut no matter what every one else thinks about said character.

I'm curious. Who do you think Ivysaur is a clone/semi-clone of?

I wouldn't like my main cut, but that doesn't justify including it in future games. Someone might like it but someone isn't enough to justify recoding it over a newcomer, it needs to have a fairly decent amount of players who want it to justify it.

 

[SMAASH! Puppy]

I wouldn't like my main cut, but that doesn't justify including it in future games. Someone might like it but someone isn't enough to justify recoding it over a newcomer, it needs to have a fairly decent amount of players who want it to justify it.

Hence the existence of this thread. A place where Ivysaur supporters can band together and let everyone know that Ivysaur is still loved. And besides, this is DLC we are talking about here. There is no getting in over another character. He either gets in or he doesn't. Now all priority is postpone the release date should a character get in.

YAS PLZ

Add me as a supporter, I always ditched Squirtle and Charizard to play as our favorite plant in Brawl, lol. Sucks that this is one of the veterans with the least popularity...

You will be added as a supporter of Ivysaur just as soon as Bon~ returns to this thread. (Or really just Smashboards in general)

The ad at the bottom of the page is in the wrong position, and is jutting out into the left margin of the page. lol.

 

[Braydon]

Hence the existence of this thread. A place where Ivysaur supporters can band together and let everyone know that Ivysaur is still loved. And besides, this is DLC we are talking about here. There is no getting in over another character. He either gets in or he doesn't. Now all priority is postpone the release date should a character get in.

It really still matters, it still takes time to code DLC fighters and they're still only going to add so many, they're not going to be adding forever.

 

[SMAASH! Puppy]

It really still matters, it still takes time to code DLC fighters and they're still only going to add so many, they're not going to be adding forever.

This is only in effect when the demand for DLC lowers considerably. At the moment Ivysaur doesn't need to step on anyone to get to the top.

 

[sogeki]

You have no idea how badly I want him in. It's just. . . If we're going to have a grass starter, it should be sceptile. Even if there are too many pokemon reps.

 

[Aetheri]

I have nothing against Ivysaur, he worked out well in Brawl as a unique character...when he was grouped with Squirtle and Charizard...on his own he just seems random...he's honestly just a (and I say this term loosely) filler character...
Squirtle first stage basic starter, a decent amount of popularity to be a smash fighter I can see Squirlte working solo...
Charizard final stage fully evolved starter, and arguably just as iconic to pokemon as Pikachu...already working solo....
Ivysaur middle stage. . . .and is not Bulbasaur or Venusaur...if Ash would've evolved his Bulbasaur in the anime Ivysaur would've had enough going for him as he would've left a bigger impression on the fans and given this middle stage enough relevance to be a solo fighter...one problem with middle stages for the starters they are literally there to fill in the gap between cute and cuddly and awesome power...
Everyone here wants him back simply because he was in Brawl if he wasn't in Brawl no one would enough think of Ivysaur (save for a few pokefans that genuinely like the pokemon regardless of their role in smash)
when it comes to Pokemon as returning veterans go Squirtle has a better chance IMO as for newcomers (I actually see newcomers as very unlikely unless there's an announcement for a new pokemon game soon) Sceptile (or even Grovyle if you want those middle stage grass starters) has the better chance with ORAS being a thing...plus it gives another pokemon generation some representation as well...