It's time for a rule change

[Roneblaster]

1. Its time to stage strike from ALL legal stages.

2. If not #1, The only stages to be struck from should be DL64, FD, and BF.

Theres nothing neutral about stages with floating movimg platforms.

 

[CloneHat]

Theres nothing neutral about stages with floating movimg platforms.

How are the two factors related at all? Also, if you want less moving platforms, why would you want more of them as possibilities?

It's a good idea, but what's your argument for it?

 

[HT F8]

Most people would just strike the silly stages first, making the process take longer, and would still most likely start on BF.

 

[Mr.Jackpot]

1000x NO's

 

[mers]

I've struck to YS plenty, why would you exclude it from the striking process?

 

[-ShadowPhoenix-]

We're doing stuff wrong... >.>

lets not ban more stages and bring back pokefloats/mutecity/corneria plzzzzzzzzzzz

 

[Roneblaster]

Im not asking to ban anything. Im asking for less neutrals or to strike from ALL legal stages.

 

[Roneblaster]

I've struck to YS plenty, why would you exclude it from the striking process?

This isnt a thread made for describing my thoughts, plenty of people share my sympathies, i want this thread to be a discussion of the merits and negatives of the proposed rule change.

Thats also directed at clone hat.

 

[mers]

This isnt a thread made for describing my thoughts, plenty of people share my sympathies, i want this thread to be a discussion of the merits and negatives of the proposed rule change.

Thats also directed at clone hat.

Yeah, I was asking for the merits. What's the benefit of excluding YS?

 

[FrootLoop]

Floating platforms are neutral on RC but not FoD?

 

[Brookman]

but why are you mad in the first place?

 

[Walt]

I think a big problem here Reneblade is that Falcon specifically sucks **** on FoD so he gets this really lame auto ban that makes the stike/ban system stupid and not effective for him. If that wasn't the case I'd ban BF every game just because I don't like it. Other good characters can mostly function on all neutrals and CPs, provided they aren't floaty and going to PS by Fox.

I think the main problems in the stage system is Falcon gets rolled by FoD, and chaingrabbing on FD.

 

[Roneblaster]

Actually it has nothing to do with my character.
Yoshis is NOT a neutral stage, it has a floating platform that is out of the players control and can and does influence the outcome of matches

 

[Strong Badam]

i don't think randall is any more significant than the possibility to platform camp on Dreamland/BF while not being able to on FD, or being able to chaingrab on FD while not being able to on other stages. i find that these differences in stages not only rarely affect tournament sets, but challenge the player to be more diverse in competitive play.
if rainbow cruise and brinstar are banned though so should Kongo Jungle.

 

[Pengie]

I don't see why you would use the three stage list when it will almost always end up on BF; you might as well always use BF first round. I'm having a hard time picturing a scenario where you wouldn't alwaysemd up on BF.

 

[MasterShake]

Yup BF should be first round for every set imo. And we should get in the habit of doing more 3/5 sets.

 

[Bones0]

It's hilarious anyone can even suggest REQUIRING BF for game 1. At the least you should require a strike. What if you are playing dittos; why should you be forced to go to BF when there are 4 other completely fair and legitimate stages to choose from? Same goes for every other matchup. If striking doesn't always end up on BF, why force it into Game 1?

There's nothing wrong with any of the 5 neutrals we have now. KJ64 should replace FoD in teams. Strike like we have been and use Modified DSR with 1 ban. Best of 5 when possible.


As far as floating platforms, you need an actual argument as to how they detract from the skill gap before you can demand they are banned. Randall isn't within the control of the player, but neither are the height of stationary platforms. Both players are aware (or at least should be) of where Randall is when recovering, so it isn't like you can get a surprise save. Part of edgeguarding on YS is covering the Randall option. As far as FoD, people can argue that the platforms "mess people up," but that's just people not knowing how to work with them correctly. It isn't like they are flying all over the stage. They rise and fall pretty slowly, and not one character is completely handicapped by the lower heights. People just need to learn how to play on them the same way Marth players have to adjust from YS platforms to DL platforms.

 

[onionchowder]

Actually it has nothing to do with my character.
Yoshis is NOT a neutral stage, it has a floating platform that is out of the players control and can and does influence the outcome of matches

The presence of a moving platform does not stop a stage from being neutral. FD has a complete lack of platforms, which has a HUGE influence on the outcome of matches.

Being "out of the players' control" has nothing to do with it. The fact that Battlefield's ledges are difficult to tether is "out of the players' control". Dreamland has wind, which is out of the players' control.

What's your point?


I know some people don't give a ****, but Brawl uses Smashville as a neutral. It's got a single moving platform, but it's also widely considered to be the most neutral stage (or Battlefield). FD is far worse than Smashville because FD is pretty big, both in stage size and in blastzones, and the total lack of platforms strongly favors characters with good grabs or projectiles.

 

[Ghostbone]

Everyone just ignoring the other suggestion? Striking from the whole stagelist should be the standard, as it determines the most 'neutral' stage in the match-up better than the starters do.

Why should a characters ability on 5 stages be worth more than their ability on the other legal stages? If all the stages are deemed fit for competition there's no reason to favour some over others. (excluding when you have an even number, than a stage needs to be left out for the sake of striking)

Also Battlefield isn't one of the most neutral stage in Brawl lol. And I'm not going to go into why smashville isn't the most neutral either because this is melee discussion >.>

 

[Grim Tuesday]

Brawl is hella unbalanced.

All the top tiers **** on BF/SV, even though it is quite even amongst them.

Except for SV, which is one of MK's best stages.

 

[HT F8]

Everyone just ignoring the other suggestion? Striking from the whole stagelist should be the standard, as it determines the most 'neutral' stage in the match-up better than the starters do.

Why should a characters ability on 5 stages be worth more than their ability on the other legal stages? If all the stages are deemed fit for competition there's no reason to favour some over others. (excluding when you have an even number, than a stage needs to be left out for the sake of striking)

Most people would just strike the silly stages first, making the process take longer, and would still most likely start on BF.

I didn't ignore it. I can't really think of a situation where a counterpick stage other than maybe Stadium would end up being chosen for the first match, though. If anyone could, I'd love to hear their thoughts.

There's nothing wrong with any of the 5 neutrals we have now. KJ64 should replace FoD in teams.

Yes! That may be a biased 'yes' though, since I play Puff in teams.

Part of edgeguarding on YS is covering the Randall option.

QFT. You can tell by the elephant in the back of the map where Randall is going to be.

 

[Grim Tuesday]

I didn't ignore it. I can't really think of a situation where a counterpick stage other than maybe Stadium would end up being chosen for the first match, though. If anyone could, I'd love to hear their thoughts.

Any ditto match-up.

 

[HT F8]

Any ditto match-up.

I suppose. Could you give a more specific example? Like maybe Peach v Peach going to Kongo? I wouldn't see the point, though, cause you'd both be dying at the same % anyways.

 

[Grim Tuesday]

Well it comes down to player preference in a ditto, doesn't it?

But the counter-pick stages are pretty dumb, it's like... 5 neutrals as the starters, two neutrals as counter-picks (RC and PS) and then 2 stupid stages as counter-picks (Brinstar and Kongo Jungle).

There are quite a few stages that are fairer than Brinstar and KJ.

 

[HT F8]

Well it comes down to player preference in a ditto, doesn't it?

Very true. I guess if you had Dr. PP vs another Falco who liked RC you could definitely end up there Game 1. I suppose I don't see that being a situation that comes up very often, though. But one could argue that variety is a good thing.

But the counter-pick stages are pretty dumb, it's like... 5 neutrals as the starters, two neutrals as counter-picks (RC and PS) and then 2 stupid stages as counter-picks (Brinstar and Kongo Jungle).

This is very true lol. Although I see RC to be way sillier than KJ... but again, I play Puff, so that could be the bias speaking. A big stage with moving plats and a barrel seems less silly to me than a sinking boat and a bunch of crazy ****. Like you said, player preference, though.

There are quite a few stages that are fairer than Brinstar and KJ.

Agreed.

 

[Grim Tuesday]

Well, while I would agree that Rainbow Cruise is a lot weirder overall and different from the norm, in terms of match-ups... RC is a lot fairer.

KJ skews a lot of match-ups due to camping the top platforms, in particular: Puff, Peach, Falco, Ganondorf, Fox, Ice Climbers, etc... All have their match-ups greatly influenced by the stage. RC doesn't influence match-ups as much.

 

[Rubyiris]

everything would be solved if mushroom kingdom 2 was the only legal stage.

 

[Grim Tuesday]

Rubyiris knows what's up.

 

[Divinokage]

Genesis 2 had a beast ruleset, that one should be used anywhere. It was simple and fast. Over 80% of the matches started on BF btw. Mine ALWAYS started on BF except maybe with a few players. If not BF, it was either Yoshi's or DL.

 

[Roneblaster]

I remember why i said im done with smashboards last week.

GG all.

Close this thread.

 

[Mr.Jackpot]

I don't see how people can complain abourt FoD platforms so much yet say nothing about DL64 wind.

 

[Sinji]

1. Its time to stage strike from ALL legal stages.

yea i'm with you. Corneria should be legal.

 

[Divinokage]

I lost to S2j and SS on FoD in MM/tourney. If you know what you are doing, it's not that bad.

 

[OverLord]

I lost to S2j and SS on FoD in MM/tourney. If you know what you are doing, it's not that bad.

In fact I really don't think it's that bad for Falcon either.
I like that stage, and Falcon can turn platforms heights to his own advantage if you know what you're doing.

 

[Rubyiris]

y'all are gay just play on mushroom kingdom 2.

 

[WaterlessFishie]

This isnt a thread made for describing my thoughts, plenty of people falcon mains share my sympathies, i want this thread to be a discussion of the merits and negatives of the proposed rule change.

Thats also directed at clone hat.

There ya go.

 

[Strong Badam]

I remember why i said im done with smashboards last week.

GG all.

Close this thread.

1. make a thread stating a controversial opinion.
2. some people agree, some people disagree. healthy discussion ensues.
3. proclaim that smashboards is stupid, request a thread lock

am i the only one here at a loss for words?

 

[Allin]

1. make a thread stating a controversial opinion.
2. some people agree, some people disagree. healthy discussion ensues.
3. proclaim that smashboards is stupid, request a thread lock

am i the only one here at a loss for words?

It looks like a bad attempt at trolling, but we can't be sure just as baffled as you are.

 

[Kason Birdman]

meh lets just strike 5 stages lol

 

[erbanez]

The 5 neutral stages exist as the first stage of a set. So just strike those. I play falcon, strike FoD first, no big deal. So I start on battlefield. Whatever. Counterpick stages are only for counterpick games, so why strike them? Doesn't make sense to me.