Isaac (Golden Sun) in SSBB thread

[raphtmarqui]

All that is pretty much just your own opinion not fact. Nostalgic doesn't come for everyone and just because a character is current doesn't mean everyone has heard of them

 

[A Link to the Snitch]

*sigh* Why in the world would not having the advantages of retro characters or the advantages of current characters not hurt their chances?

 

[Bassoonist]

Current characters are currently recognizable and have an increased chance of inclusion.

Retro characters have a "rich history" with Nintendo.

But out-dated characters have less chance because they neither have a rich history or are nostalgic, but they aren't as known as current characters. They lack the advantages of both.

And just because those characters were deconfirmed doesn't mean that being retro or current doesn't matter. No one ever suggested that being retro or current means you are playable.

This whole thing about being "retro" it's all a bunch of BS made up by certain people. Sakurai NEVER defined what "retro" was.

Besides, Golden Sun brings nostalgia to me, and I've seen other people around here say the same thing.

 

[A Link to the Snitch]

Nostalgia? How can you feel nostalgic about a game that's only a few years old, which you probably still have and probably play it a lot?

 

[Bassoonist]

Nostalgia? How can you feel nostalgic about a game that's only a few years old, which you probably still have and probably play it a lot?

Because I was twelve/thirteen years old. It was the beginning of my teen years, and now I'm almost 19.

I don't think you should be the one defining what's nostalgic in other's lives. We aren't all the same age.

 

[A Link to the Snitch]

Hell, I'm only 20 years and 11 months old. Something a generation old shouldn't inspire a feeling of nostalgia, especially, like I said before, when you probably play it pretty regularly considering your opinion of the game.

 

[Bassoonist]

Hell, I'm only 20 years and 11 months old. Something a generation old shouldn't inspire a feeling of nostalgia, especially, like I said before, when you probably play it pretty regularly considering your opinion of the game.

I don't play it regularly, the last time I played through it completely was 5 years ago. Of course it's nostalgic for me.

So what, something that happened in my childhood can not be considered nostalgic in my life by your definition?

 

[A Link to the Snitch]

Oh come on, that's not nostalgia. Hell, LttP is nostalgic - I first played that when I was four. Sure, GS will be nostalgic some day, but not when you're still a kid.

 

[Bassoonist]

Oh come on, that's not nostalgia. Hell, LttP is nostalgic - I first played that when I was four. Sure, GS will be nostalgic some day, but not when you're still a kid.

I'm not a kid. I'll be 19 in four days.

GS is nostalgic to me right now, and I'm not the only one. -_-

 

[A Link to the Snitch]

I'm not a kid. I'll be 19 in four days.

GS is nostalgic to me right now, and I'm not the only one. -_-

Oh, don't take it as an insult. I mean, you're still a teenager, you're not that disconnected from your kid years.

 

[Bassoonist]

Why are you even arguing this? I've clearly had nostalgia.

 

[Deleted member]

Me either, but I don't think they should both be Earth Adepts. If there's a second character, it should be a different element. Period. I'm sorry Felix supporters, I don't think it will happen.

That's silly.

I think Piers is pwnage, but he's not a main character. I could see a GS spot(s) going to either Isaac, Isaac and Felix, or else the main for a possible GS3 (Roy clause). Felix and Isaac are different enough to have semi-different B movesets and different physicals.

 

[A Link to the Snitch]

Why are you even arguing this? I've clearly had nostalgia.

My last post was in response to the kid issue.

 

[Rubydragon]

My God, I leave for an hour to play Fire Emblem Path of Radiance and I come back to find this...

And by the way, I found the 'rumor':

I bring here a rumor:



Link

Of course it is nothing more than a rumor... but a Golden Sun on the Wii? That'd be one other reason for me to buy the Wii.

I don't know if we should believe it, though.

Has this been proven a lie yet?

 

[Bassoonist]

I think that was proven wrong... but the fact that Nintendo and Camelot want to make a Golden Sun 3 is not a rumor - it's a fact.

 

[Magically Enhanced Hobo]

I know for a fact that Golden Sun brings me nostalgia. So does Ocarina of Time, and I can pop that into my N64 any time I want, but it's nostalgic because it was the first game I ever played in 3D. OoT isn't that old either, 9 years or so at best. I define nostalgia as a good feeling I get when thinking back on an awesome experience, and I sure as hell get that. As a matter of fact, Melee is pretty nostalgic too.

And, in any case, retro doesn't mean they have a "rich history" with Nintendo. It means their game wasn't good enough, and didn't have enough of a fanbase to warrant a sequel. Or maybe it was, and the developers just never felt it needed a sequel. Either way, Sakurai just took whichever characters struck his fancy and he felt had good moveset potential.

I really think that whole "Retro and current-gen characters have better chances" argument is BS, mostly because it's -really- ambiguous what defines current and retro. Golden Sun 2 was made in 2003, Pikmin 2 in 2004. That's not really that long ago. They both took place in that limbo between Melee and Brawl, and thus they are "recent".

Likewise, what's the cutoff point for retro? Is Geno retro? Because if he isn't, and he is definitely not recent, his chances would be really low. But we both know they aren't, because he has a fanbase, although you said yourself that fanbase doesn't matter. Plus, a sequel is definitely coming for Golden Sun. It's not a dead franchise just because it hasn't had a game in 4 years. Hell, there were like 12 years or something between Mother 2 and 3(which, by the way, IS a dead franchise, since the creator himself said he would never make a Mother 4). Your argument just uses arbitrary definitions for retro and current, and then you say that Isaac's doesn't have that large a fanbase, even though you're posting in a 1400 post thread.

Oh yeah, Captain Falcon wasn't retro either when Smash 64 came out, he sure as HELL didn't have a large fanbase, and he wasn't necessarily relevant either, so how do you explain Sakurai putting him in? If I remember correctly, the only reason anyone knows Captain Falcon or Ness is -because- of Smash.

Anyways, I don't mean to come off as hostile, my main point is that Sakurai can pick whoever the hell he wants. Video Games have been around for 25 or so years, which isn't -that- long, so "retro" and "current" are relative terms.

EDIT: Oh yeah, bassoonist, how's that new thread coming along? Haven't seen Thirdkoopa around lately...

 

[A Link to the Snitch]

Um, hello? F-Zero X came out a year before SSB. No duh it's not retro, it was a current franchise, which has had several games since F-Zero (X, GX, AX, Maximum Velocity, GP Legend, etc.

And, like I said, stop comparing Isaac to Captain Falcon and Ness. Both of them have more connections to Sakurai than Isaac, and that is why you cannot compare them. What about that don't you understand?

 

[Magically Enhanced Hobo]

All right, but I still don't know how you define retro, because Game and Watch and Kid Icarus/Ice Climbers were quite a few years apart. And uh, I don't think Kid Icarus was that crucial to Nintendo. I was playing it on the Virtual Console, and it kind of sucked, to be honest.

 

[SmashBro99]

If not playable he will be an assist trophy atleast. Cause some kind of earthquake or something.

<3 Golden Sun.

 

[Bassoonist]

You still can't escape the fact that in terms of the SSB series, Golden Sun is a "current" franchise. It's unfair that a character can't be considered because they had game releases between the release of Melee and Brawl but don't have one planned right now.

I'm still working on the thread.

 

[Magically Enhanced Hobo]

You still can't escape the fact that in terms of the SSB series, Golden Sun is a "current" franchise. It's unfair that a character can't be considered because they had game releases between the release of Melee and Brawl but don't have one planned right now.

Right, that's exactly what I mean. It's not Golden Sun's fault that Brawl came 7 years after Melee. Besides, Sakurai considered everyone, and I can guarantee you that in terms of what he can bring to this game, Isaac is -leagues- ahead of crap suggestions like Ashley.

 

[Arteen]

Seriously, that "retro or relevancy" argument is ridiculous. There has been no statement ever alluding to such a guideline, and it has not at all been shown to apply to important, currently unrepresented series. Sure, it might apply to series that are already represented, but there's been no indication that important lead characters from "outdated" series cannot make it in. Snitch, you seem to think that "outdated yet not retro" characters can only make it in if Sakurai happens to be buddies with the creator. I don't believe that.

3. Isaac was made by a developer with no ties to Nintendo besides their relationship, Olimar was made by someone who Sakurai knows pretty well.

Except for Camelot's relation to Nintendo, they have no ties to Nintendo? What are you trying to say?

I think Piers is pwnage, but he's not a main character. I could see a GS spot(s) going to either Isaac, Isaac and Felix, or else the main for a possible GS3 (Roy clause). Felix and Isaac are different enough to have semi-different B movesets and different physicals.

Isaac, Isaac, and Felix?

Well, considering that they're essentially clones in their own games, nearly every difference between them would be arbitrary and forced. I'd prefer someone completely different.

There is no Golden Sun 3.

There will be, and Nintendo knows it.

 

[A Link to the Snitch]

1. What advantage does a last gen character have? The lack of a continuing franchise has adversely harmed his chances.

2. Camelot is a third party which works with Nintendo. Nintendo has literally no control over their actions. They are just a friendly third party.

3. If Camelot doesn't make it, we probably won't see GS3, simply because Nintendo seems to care about getting Camelot on GS3.

 

[Bassoonist]

2. Camelot is a third party which works with Nintendo. Nintendo has literally no control over their actions. They are just a friendly third party.

Except Isaac and the Golden Sun characters are owned by Nintendo.

 

[Rubydragon]

Not to mention music.

 

[LukeFonFabre]

I'm fairly certain that Camelot is 2nd party anyway.

 

[Rubydragon]

I don't know if they finally became third party, I think they were planning to.

And by the way, I remember reading somewhere that Sakurai only added Pit, not to please the fans, but because the GBA game sold well (or something like that...) I don't know hoe creditable that article was but, I'd just like to point that out.

 

[SuichimoTheDragoon]

I don't know if they finally became third party, I think they were planning to.

And by the way, I remember reading somewhere that Sakurai only added Pit, not to please the fans, but because the GBA game sold well (or something like that...) I don't know hoe creditable that article was but, I'd just like to point that out.

Camelot is still a second party company. The entire thing where people said they were leaving was a mistranslation.

I don't think its credible seeing as Kid Icarus has only had two games in the series, one for the NES and one for the Gameboy.

 

[Mini Mic]

Nintendo owns all rights to Golden Sun, I looked it up in the manual yesterday.

 

[Mini Mic]

Oh, don't take it as an insult. I mean, you're still a teenager, you're not that disconnected from your kid years.

Didn't you say you were 20? So that extra year or so is the end of innocence then

Sorry for the double.

 

[Arteen]

1. What advantage does a last gen character have? The lack of a continuing franchise has adversely harmed his chances.

It doesn't help them, sure, but I don't see why it would hurt a worthy character's chances so significantly. Also, the franchise is continuing. It's just on hiatus. "First of all, I love that game and I love the world of Golden Sun. We think we have to make another one. We have to do it! Not just that we have to do it, but we want to do it. Nintendo has asked us to please make it." That makes it pretty clear that there will be another one.

2. Camelot is a third party which works with Nintendo. Nintendo has literally no control over their actions. They are just a friendly third party.

As someone already said, Nintendo owns the rights to the Golden Sun characters and music, so Camelot did create a Nintendo franchise.

3. If Camelot doesn't make it, we probably won't see GS3, simply because Nintendo seems to care about getting Camelot on GS3.

I'm not sure what point you're trying to make. Nintendo can't and won't force Camelot to make another Golden Sun, but they have asked Camelot to make another, and Camelot feels that they must make another.

 

[Rubydragon]

In the end, I still can't see what A Link to the Snitch is trying to say...

 

[A Link to the Snitch]

1. 20 is a big step in one's life. On average, it means that 1/4 of your life is done, and you're like "when did that even happen?"

2. That's an expression of interest, and my only point was "will it go into development stages before Brawl character selection is done"?

3. But the creators of everything GS-related are at Camelot, so it's far different from putting in characters from Nintendo employees.

 

[RandomGuy42]

Well, I investigated as to what the 2 comments were that mentioned Isaac on the old Dojo site. The results are actually quite interesting.

Now, for those who aren't quite clear on what this is, the old Dojo site had a submissions feature in the Japanese language only. The form that people filled out had three spaces: A place to put the suggesters name, a drop-down menu where you selected the type of submission you were making (either character, music, or other), and a place to write out your suggestions as you pleased.

290 of these suggestions were placed on the site, 10 on each page, for 29 pages. Sakurai also gave a response to the 10th suggestion on each page. That's what SamuraiPanda's translation thread is on this site, a translation of the responses only. That doesn't make Sakurai ignored all the other responses, though. And there were certainly more suggestions then the 290 he choose to make public.

Anyway, as for the suggestions which contain Isaac, there are two of them, as we know from the list (which is so frequently mistaken for the official polls, it's ridiculous >_>). Sakurai didn't respond to either of these particular suggestions, explaining why we don't see them in the translation thread.

Here are the two suggestions which contain Isaac. This next part is a summary of the two suggestions which contained Isaac, not a word-for-word translation. The summary however is the exact same response I got from the person who translated for me. Keep in mind that in Japanese his name is Robin, and he's referenced as such here.

1) One person suggested him for playable and had that as their whole suggestion, saying that they still have fun playing GS even though 4 years have passed since its release. They say they very much like all 8 party members, but that Robin is the best and the most special to them. They also asked for GS music. They sound very sincere in their asking.

2) One person asked for both Robin and Garcia (Felix) as playable. They make the comment that the only character from a "true RPG" so far has been Ness. They then go on talking about the Nokonoko (Koopa Troopas) from Mario, reminiscing about them and saying they'd be interesting.

So there we are. It's rather interesting both mentions where character requests, given that the form wasn't specifically for that use. Also, props to the guy who requested GS music, it's highly necessary. :bigthumbu

 

[Magically Enhanced Hobo]

Good find, Randomguy!

That's a little more encouragement, and I do agree about the "true RPG" thing. Nintendo hasn't had very many, so I think those few deserve representation.

 

[Deleted member]

Yes! Isaac and Felix!

My dual adept dream is that much closer to fruition.

 

[Hyper_Ridley]

I've never played Golden Sun, but Isaac seesm like a decent character. At least his B moves would be original, unlike the "I can swing my sword even HARDER" moves that the other swordsman have.

 

[Rubydragon]

Indeed.

What about Warluigi though, is he owned by Camelot or what?

 

[Bassoonist]

Indeed.

What about Warluigi though, is he owned by Camelot or what?

I doubt it. He may have started in a Camelot game (Mario Tennis), but he's been in several Mario Party games and other sports games, which to my knowledge have no relation to Camelot.

 

[Arteen]

Indeed.

What about Warluigi though, is he owned by Camelot or what?

I'm sure that Nintendo owns him too. If Nintendo owns Isaac, then they would certainly own Waluigi.