Isaac (Golden Sun) in SSBB thread

[SuichimoTheDragoon]

Please tell me the third one is Sheba and not Ivan...

That would be Ivan. It's the original group.

 

[RandomGuy42]

Because Isaac is on the top 20 of the Brawl poll.

Erm, the Brawl polls haven't been released yet...

 

[Boofer]

Erm, the Brawl polls haven't been released yet...

Huh??? I thought Sakurai's poll was the Brawl poll.

 

[Zevox]

Huh??? I thought Sakurai's poll was the Brawl poll.

Sakurai's "poll" is the number of times characters were mentioned in his journal. I can't recall whether it was from him talking about them or him posting fan mail that talked about them, but it was one of the two (I'm leaning towards the latter). There was an official poll on some Japanese website a long time ago - shortly after the game was announced I think - that I recall being linked to on the old NSider forums, and the results of that haven't been released yet.

Zevox

 

[Rubydragon]

Hmmm...

Now that you mention it, it does look a little like Ivan. I was confused because it sort of looked female to me.

 

[Boofer]

Sakurai's "poll" is the number of times characters were mentioned in his journal. I can't recall whether it was from him talking about them or him posting fan mail that talked about them, but it was one of the two (I'm leaning towards the latter). There was an official poll on some Japanese website a long time ago - shortly after the game was announced I think - that I recall being linked to on the old NSider forums, and the results of that haven't been released yet.

Zevox

Hmm...When were the results for the melee poll released? Hopefully it wasn't after the game was released...

 

[raphtmarqui]

Hmm...When were the results for the melee poll released? Hopefully it wasn't after the game was released...

Yeah, it was after the game was released. If they released it before then people could tell who was going to be in the game.

 

[Rubydragon]

That's horrible...

 

[Mini Mic]

Yeah I think if they released the poll results now the roster would be kinda obvious.

Did anyone actually see what the two comments on Isaac were?

 

[RandomGuy42]

What Zevox said is basically correct. Besides, did you really think the highest vote character had 5 when in the Melee polls, Bowser got 169 requests? =P

And now that Mic mentions it... it would be nice to find out what those 2 Isaac comments were. I might look into this.

 

[Mini Mic]

What Zevox said is basically correct. Besides, did you really think the highest vote character had 5 when in the Melee polls, Bowser got 169 requests? =P

And now that Mic mentions it... it would be nice to find out what those 2 Isaac comments were. I might look into this.

Please do, strangely enough none of the comments on any of the characters seem to be anywhere, only his blog updates seen in the samurai panda thread.

By the way did anyone else notice how this thread always seems to live in harmony? No one ever bothers us... Maybe because Isaac (and GS in general) are so awesome nobody has any real feelings against him?

 

[Magically Enhanced Hobo]

Because everyone knows he deserves it. It's as simple as that. Not representing one of the few -NEW- Nintendo-owned franchises made between Melee and Brawl(and this goes for Pikmin and Animal Crossing too) would be a sin. It's not like there were that many of them, and all are deserving, just like AC is already being repped.

And it's not like Golden Sun was a bad game, lawl. You can't argue with awesome.

 

[Deleted member]

Please do, strangely enough none of the comments on any of the characters seem to be anywhere, only his blog updates seen in the samurai panda thread.

By the way did anyone else notice how this thread always seems to live in harmony? No one ever bothers us... Maybe because Isaac (and GS in general) are so awesome nobody has any real feelings against him?

Nobody seems to hate Isaac, which is good. 'Cept maybe some of the more rabbid Felix supporters, but I see no reason why Golden Sun can't have two playables.

 

[Magically Enhanced Hobo]

Nobody seems to hate Isaac, which is good. 'Cept maybe some of the more rabbid Felix supporters, but I see no reason why Golden Sun can't have two playables.

Me either, but I don't think they should both be Earth Adepts. If there's a second character, it should be a different element. Period. I'm sorry Felix supporters, I don't think it will happen.

 

[Rubydragon]

Either that, or no one knows who the heck he is.

 

[Magically Enhanced Hobo]

Either that, or no one knows who the heck he is.

That didn't stop Geno, lol.

 

[A Link to the Snitch]

I still say that Isaac's entrance into Brawl first requires that a third game is announced.

 

[Bassoonist]

I still say that Isaac's entrance into Brawl first requires that a third game is announced.

I think that's ridiculous. There's so much more reason for Isaac to be in Brawl aside from advertisement.

 

[A Link to the Snitch]

Workability and usability yes, but many characters have that in spades.

And what does advertisement have to do with this? I'm talking about relevancy. Isaac hasn't been relevant for a whole generation.

 

[Rubydragon]

Has that rumor been proven false or something? The one about Golden Sun 3?

Arrg! Don't even talk to me about Geno, the amount of luck that doll has is ethereal.

Isaac does indeed deserve to be in other than advertisement reasons, but if there will be a Golden Sun 3, then his inclusion will indeed advertise the game.

 

[A Link to the Snitch]

There is no Golden Sun 3.

 

[raphtmarqui]

Camelot more or less said they are working on a Golden Sun 3.

 

[Your Hero]

OMG, the first anti-Isaac I've ever seen in my life :]

Link, try the games out. They are actually really fun. To tell the truth I'd rather see someone else than Isaac to represent golden sun, but Isaac is the most possible rep for it.

Ivan, Mia, Menardi or Alex for brawl!
(Menardi's Scythe *drools*)

 

[A Link to the Snitch]

Dude, how does "we're not working on GSIII, but we'd love to be" mean "we are working on GSIII"?

And I've played and beaten them both. I don't have to play them to understand that relevancy is a requirement, except in cases of "retrocity".

 

[Your Hero]

then I don't understand why you don't want him in.

The fact that you said you've played both means you liked the first one (or the second one, whichever you played first). Why don;t you want him in brawl?

 

[EPX2]

What I don't understand is why you seem to think that if a character isn't currently relevant, they can't get into the game. Are you basing this solely off the types of characters we've seen in previous installments and those that have been announced for Brawl? Because we've already seen Brawl set several precedents (previously nonplayable characters becoming playable [Charizard], third party characters, and so on). Why is it unreasonable to expect that Brawl may also be the first SSB game to include characters that aren't quite yet retro and have yet to make any modern appearances in video games?

Your Hero: Not thinking someone will make it in it =/= not wanting someone in.

 

[Rubydragon]

I can't find the page where the rumor began - remember? The Super Mario RPG 2 with Final Fantasy characters, Ogre Battle for the Wii, and another Golden Sun in which you use the numchuk to battle? No one remembers?

And coughcaptinolimarcough!

Sorry, just had to say it.

 

[A Link to the Snitch]

Because he's not relevant anymore.

And I never said I didn't want him, don't jump to conclusions. I just said he's not likely anymore. He's kind of like Fawful, who was a popular choice for SSB3 way back when but his popularity died down. The only difference is that he's lasted better over time because of his main character status.

 

[Your Hero]

Ahh sorry, I was mislead that you didn;t want him in lol. My bad.

Either way, Lucario, Geno, Krystal, Ashley.. Basically anyone who people want in this thread are over hyped already.

I mean come on, I've seen miis, AC character, Sora, Cloud. I've even seen a chillidog :\. You do have to admit that Golden Sun deserves rep over those five at minimum (Mii's will be included in the background of a stage I'm assuming

Spoiler

[and yes i do know the ***.u.me thing]

)

 

[A Link to the Snitch]

Er, I don't actually think that the AC character has worse chances than Isaac. We've seen a stage, item, two musics, an Assist Trophy, and a series icon for them to go in. The Animal Crossing series is insanely popular, with more than 10 million copies sold and only three games (N64 game sold less than 500k, GameCube game sold about 2 million, and DS game sold about 8 million, and actually sold better than DQVII, the best-selling DQ game ever made in Japan).

 

[raphtmarqui]

Dude, how does "we're not working on GSIII, but we'd love to be" mean "we are working on GSIII"?

You mean like how Nintendo said there was no new DS revision in the works and then 2 weeks later they announce DSLite. >_>
You obviously know nothing about public relations.

 

[EPX2]

Because he's not relevant anymore.

Point? Since when has the SSB series been advertised as a video game franchise featuring only currently relevant and retro characters? It's always been sold as a game series featuring popular and iconic characters from all eras of Nintendo's history. Ness was hardly relevant at the time of the release of the original SSB and he most certainly was not retro - he still managed to show up. Ness was even less relevant at the time of Melee's release and it was still a stretch to consider him a retro character, yet he returned.

Isaac is a fairly popular character, as well as extremely significant in the Golden Sun franchise for obvious reasons. The lack of any modern appearances from him most certainly should not prevent him from being playable - the same goes for Captain Olimar.

And I never said I didn't want him, don't jump to conclusions. I just said he's not likely anymore. He's kind of like Fawful, who was a popular choice for SSB3 way back when but his popularity died down. The only difference is that he's lasted better over time because of his main character status.

You say that as if that's not a significant difference. That'd be a much more accurate comparison if this thread were made to support Alex or any other characters from GS other than Isaac and Felix.

 

[A Link to the Snitch]

You mean like how Nintendo said there was no new DS revision in the works and then 2 weeks later they announce DSLite. >_>
You obviously know nothing about public relations.

Nintendo of UK said that. A subdivision of their European division. NoE itself would have limited knowledge of this, so why in the world would their UK division know this?

Point? Since when has the SSB series been advertised as a video game franchise featuring only currently relevant and retro characters? It's always been sold as a game series featuring popular and iconic characters from all eras of Nintendo's history. Ness was hardly relevant at the time of the release of the original SSB and he most certainly was not retro - he still managed to show up. Ness was even less relevant at the time of Melee's release and it was still a stretch to consider him a retro character, yet he returned.

Isaac is a fairly popular character, as well as extremely significant in the Golden Sun franchise for obvious reasons. The lack of any modern appearances from him most certainly should not prevent him from being playable - the same goes for Captain Olimar.



You say that as if that's not a significant difference. That'd be a much more accurate comparison if this thread were made to support Alex or any other characters from GS other than Isaac and Felix.

Retro and current are the two most important eras for a character to be in. If you're considered retro, you're an important fixture in Nintendo's history. If you're current, you help promote your material and have a fanbase most likely. But if you're just "out-dated", you don't have a major impact on Nintendo's history and aren't current enough to have an ever strengthening fanbase.

Ness was put in because Sakurai worked for Hal Labs. He knew Ness, and he knew the creator of Ness quite well, and he liked EarthBound. The only reason Ness returned was because Lucas couldn't replace him. They needed an EB rep, and he was the only good choice.

Pikmin 3 is actually suggested to be in development, and him being created by Miyamoto is more significant than what Isaac has going for him.

 

[raphtmarqui]

Nintendo of UK said that. A subdivision of their European division. NoE itself would have limited knowledge of this, so why in the world would their UK division know this?



Retro and current are the two most important eras for a character to be in. If you're considered retro, you're an important fixture in Nintendo's history. If you're current, you help promote your material and have a fanbase most likely. But if you're just "out-dated", you don't have a major impact on Nintendo's history and aren't current enough to have an ever strengthening fanbase.

Ness was put in because Sakurai worked for Hal Labs. He knew Ness, and he knew the creator of Ness quite well, and he liked EarthBound. The only reason Ness returned was because Lucas couldn't replace him. They needed an EB rep, and he was the only good choice.

Pikmin 3 is actually suggested to be in development, and him being created by Miyamoto is more significant than what Isaac has going for him.

So if Golden Sun has no fanbase and no importance then why did people write letters to Sakurai about its characters and why did Sakurai reply to those letters multiple times (4) more than most franchises.

 

[A Link to the Snitch]

Having a large fanbase doesn't establish that he's as important as Ice Climbers are to Nintendo (which they are).

 

[raphtmarqui]

It doesn't establish that he isn't either.

 

[EPX2]

Retro and current are the two most important eras for a character to be in. If you're considered retro, you're an important fixture in Nintendo's history. If you're current, you help promote your material and have a fanbase most likely. But if you're just "out-dated", you don't have a major impact on Nintendo's history and aren't current enough to have an ever strengthening fanbase.

Okay... that still doesn't address how "outdated" characters are somehow barred from appearing in Brawl. You can make as many arguments as you desire as to why retro and currently relevant characters are more important than... non-retro and irrelevant characters, but that doesn't change the fact that there are many characters - such as Isaac - who happen to fall into the second category and actually have several things in their favor, such as significance to their respective franchises and popularity.

Ness was put in because Sakurai worked for Hal Labs. He knew Ness, and he knew the creator of Ness quite well, and he liked EarthBound. The only reason Ness returned was because Lucas couldn't replace him. They needed an EB rep, and he was the only good choice.

So, basically, Ness made it into the SSB franchise because Sakurai wanted him in. ... Okay? Who's to say Sakurai doesn't have a special liking for the GS franchise as well?

Pikmin 3 is actually suggested to be in development, and him being created by Miyamoto is more significant than what Isaac has going for him.

Fair enough, though I must say that you've got me a bit confused here. Reading through your posts I get the impression that you feel that if a character is not retro or currently-relevant, they can't (or won't) make it into Brawl, regardless of any other factors such as popularity or significance to their franchise. However, it seems like here you're trying to suggest an exception can be made depending on who created the character, which seems pretty silly as we've haven't seen anything that even implies that.

Having a large fanbase doesn't establish that he's as important as Ice Climbers are to Nintendo (which they are).

No... but it most certainly establishes that character's popularity, which shouldn't be overlooked just because said character may not have had as huge an impact on Nintendo's history as another character.

 

[A Link to the Snitch]

Okay... that still doesn't address how "outdated" characters are somehow barred from appearing in Brawl. You can make as many arguments as you desire as to why retro and currently relevant characters are more important than... non-retro and irrelevant characters, but that doesn't change the fact that there are many characters - such as Isaac - who happen to fall into the second category and actually have several things in their favor, such as significance to their respective franchises and popularity.



So, basically, Ness made it into the SSB franchise because Sakurai wanted him in. ... Okay? Who's to say Sakurai doesn't have a special liking for the GS franchise as well?



Fair enough, though I must say that you've got me a bit confused here. Reading through your posts I get the impression that you feel that if a character is not retro or currently-relevant, they can't (or won't) make it into Brawl, regardless of any other factors such as popularity or significance to their franchise. However, it seems like here you're trying to suggest an exception can be made depending on who created the character, which seems pretty silly as we've haven't seen anything that even implies that.



No... but it most certainly establishes that character's popularity, which shouldn't be overlooked just because said character may not have had as huge an impact on Nintendo's history as another character.

1. Outdated characters have less chance than retro or current characters.

2. Sakurai isn't friends with the creator of GS, he never worked for Camelot, and we've not seen anything to suggest he's played GS. How is Ness getting in because Sakurai worked for EB's developer, is friends with the character's creator, and likes EB?

3. Isaac was made by a developer with no ties to Nintendo besides their relationship, Olimar was made by someone who Sakurai knows pretty well.

 

[raphtmarqui]

1. Outdated characters have less chance than retro or current characters.

And where again did the Brawl development team state this? I can think of plenty of retro and "current" characters that have been deconfirmed and never had a chance in the first place. (Drill Dozer, Sothe, Tingle, Stafy, Little Mac, SamuraiGoroh, ect.)

 

[A Link to the Snitch]

Current characters are currently recognizable and have an increased chance of inclusion.

Retro characters have a "rich history" with Nintendo.

But out-dated characters have less chance because they neither have a rich history or are nostalgic, but they aren't as known as current characters. They lack the advantages of both.

And just because those characters were deconfirmed doesn't mean that being retro or current doesn't matter. No one ever suggested that being retro or current means you are playable.