Impressions on sonic and his useability.

[Sonic The Hedgedawg]

I've been trying my best to make sonic tournament worthy... and I can come up wih nothing really. I mean, he's not as bad as mewtwo was in melee, but he's certainly one of the worse characters on the game.

this is for several reasons, but mainly, he dies quickly and can't kill his oponent quickly. You could probably run away for a while with him, but that's really not that useful because, with no projectile, he'll need to be up close to do damage. I realize that, with his speed, if he had a really good killing move, then he'd be broken, but the problem is that he doesn't even poses a reliable killing move... even at 150% he'll have trouble with a KO because his paltry few killing moves are difficult to connect with... his bair is your most likely killer, but it's still slower than it should be.

His awkward hitboxes make him miss a lot, often times you'l find yourself attacking right above your enemy's head. Sonic partialy likes stages with walk off edges so that he can KO easily with well placed aerial walls and back throws... however, it is then possible to accidentally dash attack off the edge or be killed off the close edge yourself.

His Down tilt is nice because, like some other characters, he inches forwards when he uses it, letting him crawl under projectiles. Just don't use it near and edge because, if you are bumped, you may dair to your death.

His dash-grab and dash Usmash are both awkward because of how much speed he's got so you need to initiate them early.

As for his B button moves:

-Homing attack = horrible it's more like a general zip-code finder in many cases and if no one is in range (and they have plenty of time to move out of range) he fires himself anyway, aimed at nothing, and can possibly kill himself if you can't recover in time. not like the small damage and knockback caused by the attack were worth the risk to begin with.

- Spin Dash = Also bad... it can kill sonic on icy stages because he goes flying so NEVER EVER uses it on icicle glacier unless you have tried it before and you know you'l be able to recover in time with it. Also, it can only be used as a recovery technique from way close... jumping oput of it into an aerial has some nice prospects, but he moves so fast just running anyway that using a spin dash for conveyance seems superfluous at best. And it's not like it does the damage or knockback you want for the amount of time you charge it sometimes.

-Spin Charge = Absolutely awful, despite the ammount you can charge it, it's weak, it's not fast and it does nothing really that forward B doesn't, except sucks harder at recovering. You will never likely use this move... he would be SO much better off trading one of his redundant spins for a golden-ring projectile ore something.

-Spring Jump = Easily his best specil attack. It has a few nifty tricks assoiated with it that I discovered inclusing zigzagging with Up+B followed by Down Air, followed by up B followed by down air, etc. Also, it gets you out of bad situations quickly, and on stages with low ceilings, like lluigi's mansion, you can get stuck between the ceiling and the spring and spam a high cool-down lag aerial. The spring will cancel your aerial and let you do it again and again. it's a nifty trick. The final techniqe with it may be the most useful. Sonic players will definitly need to chose stages with lips that can eat chracters such as FD or luigi's mansion. Any solid stage with a jutting edge will work fine... even smashville has a shot with it's angled edges, but the more lip-like, the better. Anyway, dropping a spring on a revovering enemy has a good chance of knocking them into the bottom of the stage and causing a ricochet spike down. It's not always easy and it often fails, but it's definitely worth a shot and it's been one of the few ways I've been able to kill omni or pyro while playing sonic before they took ridiculous damage.

Sonic plays well against campers and projectile spammers because of his speed, as such, he does pretty well against pit, especially since pit doesn't get back his up+B after being hit... a spring drop can often end him prematurely... even so, a good pit should still beat sonic. He's simply not great.

HOWEVER, and this is a big however, if you play brawl the way the creators want you to (at least, the way they show it on all their vids and commercials), with items and ffas, then sonic becomes almost completely balanced. His speed and the ease of item pickup means that he'll be grabbing most of the items, and he needs their power to ko enemies... besides that, he easily has the best FS in the game, since, when well contrlled, it normally KOs every enemy at least once and can be activated from anywhere with no ill-results. This awesomeness was probably meant to balance out his lack of killing power, but without smashballs, he loses a lot of bang for his buck.


I love sonic to death, but, unfortunately, I don't think he's seriously capable of being mained... it just is too hard to kill an enemy, thouch he has some great potential in teams, especially with spring tricks

 

[Dragonbreath]

Looks like Sonic requires a very specific mindset. I've seen him used very effectively in tournament situations more than once.

 

[Sonic The Hedgedawg]

it's not even like sonic seems that bad until you try to KO someone with him... it's a slow and arduous process... sonic isn't one who likes slow and arduous things

 

[AtomicBucket]

Nice impressions, but considering that the game has been out for a little over a week, I doubt you've mastered him.

 

[Doomgaze]

I think Sonic sucks.
Especially his B-moves.

Very disappointing, really.

 

[Sonic The Hedgedawg]

[/QUOTE]

Nice impressions, but considering that the game has been out for a little over a week, I doubt you've mastered him.

never said I did... just that after 1 week these were my thoughts.

@ doomgaze... he doesn't suck... but you are right... very dissapointing and boring

 

[Knight-errant]

We just need some time to get used to his speed and develop his game. Sonic will probably be one of the better characters (especially with all that speed!) we just have to give it some time.

 

[LuCKy]

ok my friend went to apply for a job yesterday so i didnt get to play too much yesterday.
now as for changes from the demo it seems like his u air was toned down.i remember it killing at around 110 percent maybe a lil bit more but i do remember it being a kill move.now it dosnt really seem to kill til you get more near the 200 percent area which isnt that good.ofcourse thats probably since i was missing the sweet spot because in the video link at the bottom of my post i kill bowser at a pretty low percent.although i did hit him pretty high and up b into it, and i remember being able to land like 3 in a row but i was only able to land one at a time. so i guess im gonna have to play around with the u air alil bit to see what it can really do.his bair still kills beautifully and at low percents you can land 2 in a row.his fair seems to be the most useful of his aerials just like the demo it has good priority and is fast enough to land when ever you want it to,plus it has just enough knock back to get them out of your face.his nair i still kinda hate but it seems the same if you hit within the first frame or so it can kill at decent percents but its a slow move with like no priority at all.the only time i found my self using that move was falling after a fair.

His d tilt still seems very useful,it reminds me of shieks d tilt since you can land like 3 in a row.his u tilt had decent priority once it started up but it did have some start up lag.his forward tilt was pretty good i dont remember using it to much but i dont remember to much start up lag and it had decent knock back.his jab combo was great it was pretty fast and the last hit had ok knock back to give you room to breath and re group.now not all of sonics moves had the best priority a lot of times i would get mad at how easy people were getting through my attacks.also sonic's "running speed" is very fast,but his attacks are not which means he will not play the same as fox in melee since i seen a lot of people say that he will.ok now sometimes it was hard to get in with sonic with his lack of priority.then i found that his dash attack worked wonders.it might be his fastest attack,at low percents it leads into a grab,at mid percents it leads into tilts and at higher percents it can lead into aerial.its a great move with from what i could tell no start up lag and it was so fast they never had time to use there attacks so im not sure about the priority.

his grabs have some decent combo possibilities like his forward throw would lead to a fair almost every time at mid and even low percents.his d throw really has no knock back since they always kind just go like a inch off the floor then just land on there backs.which is kinda good since you can tech chase with a shield cancel grab or u smash great.his u throw might be able to lead into a u smash at very low percents ill be sure to try that out today.b throw was just normal it would send them flying to far to attack but not enough to kill.

his u smash was great for tech chasing and even better if the missed a tech.although its really hard to get used to,since sonic runs so fast when you try to cancel it with a u smash he goes sliding pretty far so to hit someone with it you gotta do it pretty far a head.his forward smash still seems to be his main move to kill with it has a lil bit start up lag which gets annoying when people with 0 start up lag smashes just start c sticking like crazy,but it has really good knock back for sonic and after the start up lag its really fast.even though it lacks in range.his down smash is really fast,but it does have a lil bit start up lag which is annoyingand the range of it is supprisingly little.however it has good knock back and is very fast after the start up lag-_-.now i know im making a bug deal about the start up lag on his smashes,but they all have it and its really annoying how people can jut walk up and c stick me when i have to like mind game them into sonics smashes*sigh* i just really think sonic the fastest character like ever would have a good 0 lag strong smash.compared to toon link sonics smashes are pretty weak*sigh* you all would know what i mean if you try out toon links and sonics smashes.

hmm i didnt see too much change in sonics b moves,his down b still seems to be not needed.his forward b is still really fun to do and really useful,although i couldnt seem to tell where sonic was gonna be at after it connected.sometimes i would be in front of them which was perfect for a bair,sometimes i would be behind them which works great for a fair.once in a while i would be under them too so im gonna have to experiment with that move more.his neutral b was great for coming back to the stage when you were really close.like the start up lag would always throw of my friends and get hit by it.his up b i love lol i was able to kill people with the bumper,especially diddy king.when he charges his up b if he gets hit at all his jet pack goes flying off of him now when ever he would be directly under the ledge i would just grab the edge then let go and up b fast,and it killed him every time haha.

i didnt compare to much to the demo since i dont remember it too well and i dont feel like reading FightingGameGuy's report right now to compare.this is just like a small report on his moves,now i didnt get to play as much as i wanted but i will be playing a lot of sonic so im sure ill be learning a lot more.

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=8N5LwAGsv7s here is one match from yesterday....theres more but i cant watch them for some reason

this was my last impression on him and i have played him a lil bit more.........right now the only character ive been ***** by was zero suite samus.......now i could john about this or the match up,but i wont im sure other sonic users could or will experience the gayness of sonics low priority vs a very campy zss.all i can say is sonic is no where near as bad as mew2 and from what i read your giving up on him very fast.i could provide a better impression,but im gonna wait until the english version comes out until eventually i make a guide on sonic.i know it is hard to ko but it can be done and there are a lot of ways to use his b moves.i do have a lot of sonic matches put up on youtube and even better ones coming showing there are many ways to kill with sonic.

 

[Kr3w]

Lucky you are my hero.
I hope that one day everyones bad impressions about sonic will be proved wrong and he could turn out to be a great character. I'm not giving up on him that easily

 

[Dragonbreath]

^^Truth FTW. You know what they say, 'don't believe everything you read'. No offense to the OP, of course, or to any of the posters around here, but this is a subject that comes with a ****load of bias, both positive and negative. And like I theorized earlier in this thread, this kind of moveset probably needs a specific kind of mindset. It's important to reserve final judgment until firsthand experience.

 

[LuCKy]

Lucky you are my hero.

you **** lol

 

[Kr3w]

i ****, oohh yeaah :] lol

 

[Sonic The Hedgedawg]

well, I don't wish to sound rude, but I've been playing almost a week solid... triple digits worth of hours have already been logged and omnigamer (my friend with the game) thinks that Sonic may well be the game's worst character in the teir list.

I'm holding out hope that e's at least better than Yoshi or power suit samus, but he simply can't kill easily. I love sonic, but plain and simple, he ain't very good. Sure you can tech chase with his Usmash, sure you can rack up damage with him, but he can't KO easily until the enemy is AT LEAST over 150% damage... generally he'll take them to 200% before he can KO them, and at that damage, the up smash no longer catches them so even racking up damage becomes difficult... fair is about the only remaining good choice.

Besides that, his Up+B is his only viable special attack... and his kill moves are few and easily avoidable. he's in the botom 3rd of the characters to be sure. I'm just trying to help people know how to use sonic so he doesn't suck utterly, but you'll need to be playing at a significantly higher level thank an oponent using one of the ha;fway decent characters to win.

Out of all my Sonic Vs. Dedede matches against Pyro, I won only one of them. When he tried playing Sonic, and I chose bowser, he was on his last life and I had 350% damage before he could KO me.

 

[Mushroomring]

Lucky, we're counting on you to make Sonic broken

 

[Milln]

I haven't played the game, so it's possible to ignore everything I say (I guess, if you wanna).

Sonic's uair, bair, and the last hit of fair all seem like that have killing potential if you haven't spammed one of them to the point that the knockback has seen diminishing returns by the time you need it to kill.
As do his Dsmash and Fsmash. Usmash is for comboing into aerials.
Homing Attack can be used to combo into and out of, and his spin dashes set up for aerials, too.
Hyphensmashing(Is that what we're calling it?) works great with Sonic.

Pretty much, with Sonic, my impression is that you have to be all over them and confuse them as to which attack you're doing since all of them are the same "Ball up and charge a spin" move. to build up percent and then make them take a hike, follow them off and prevent their recovery.

*shrug* =x Dunno, i'll have to experiment, myself.

 

[LuCKy]

if i have to ill be the new taj with his mew2...........but i will try Mushroomring........i will try

maybe i am in denial because its sonic.....but i do play him a lot and i understand very well that he isnt as easy to learn as dedede,marth and other possible high tier characters.however in melee a lot of characters were considered really bad until some pro came and made the character really good.now if sonic is as bad as you say*which i dont think at all* me or somebody else will make him good.....i mean your making a big deal out of how to kill people,but in time im sure someone will figure out easy ways to do it....just give it time

 

[Espy Rose]

Nice impressions, but considering that the game has been out for a little over a week, I doubt you've mastered him.

Ditto and QFT.

 

[J18]

reading all these responses of how sonic sucks makes me depressed. =[

 

[TheMagicalKuja]

I've pretty much never seen anyone who chases their foes off the stage with Sonic yet. Until then everyone's gonna rely on his less than perfect smashes.

 

[Gimpyfish62]

sonic isn't that good, but he's not one of the worst i dont think, he just has trouble killing. but wait, the only reason he has trouble killing is because nobody controls him well enough to land his kill moves such as back air and his fsmash reliably often. You can get the damage with him, he has survivability, you cant tell what he is doin half the time as his opponent because his moves all look so similar so he can be really tricky. just wait for somebody to be able to control that speed before we go running off to label him low tier.

Lucky has got this, everyone calm down.

 

[InterimOfZeal]

Lulz, Lucky is becoming a g-reg for sonic, or something. Guess Imma hafta be the SS/Isai, mmhmmmmm.

Sonic's kill moves are weird to land, but not entirely hard. Just have to predict. He's ridiculously fast, to the point where when I'm doing a running usmash, I charge it right after the dash input. When I mess up, I end up just usmashing without the dash (sometimes dash attacking, but that's because I've been too lazy to reach for the c-stick).

As mentioned before, springboard spiking can set up some decent edgeguarding. I have some matches up on YouTube, but they're from like... my 2nd night playing. Just google Izzy Sonic, and you should find 'em.

He'll be a little higher than CF was on the tier list, but he'll have pretty limited usage, especially early on. Sonic's good, but he's difficult. I've thought about switching back to ZSS or Ike (don't laugh, predict right, and they're dead. Those unflinchables and his range are killer), but Sonic is just too much fun.

 

[RedrappeR]

Well I'm not gonna try to come in here and part the red sea or anything, but here's my $.02:

I think Lucky and Gimpy have the problem pretty much pegged. One other thing I see is that people aren't USING his Speed, they're trying to get OVER IT. Which really doesn't make me feel all too supportive about them after they come back yelling about how much the character sucks.

For every Sonic player who you SEE has potential, when you see him get a kill, it's when he's actually using his running speed, and not playing conservatively. It's like using Ken in 3rd strike as a turtle, or Storm MvC2 for closer range(Yeah I know, I use too many SF analogies. Sue me.)

It's getting to the point where it's just frustrating trying to find impressions for this character. Because you'll get threads like this, where people swear off the character, POSITIVE he's so low on the tier list as if he's like some four year old, crying because he's not tall enough to get into the ride. Or threads where people are giving him praise, but just throwing it on him, letting their personal feelings get in the way with the characters shortcomings.

This is all fine an dandy if you take into account everybody has an opinion, and that's understood, but here's my problem... it's NOT helping.

We're not getting anywhere with determining what the character can do, and regardless of what you think his place on the tier list is, there are videos where he's seen as a viable character, NOT OMG HE'S SO TOP TIER THAT YOUR FACE GETS MELTED BY EVEN LOOKING AT HIM... but he's viable. It's just stupid people are taking things to such extremes, which the Sonic community ALWAYS ****ING does.

We need to find out HOW to play him, instead of calling him the Worst character in the game, because I think a lot of people will agree, that's about the stupidest statment we've heard since someone called him the Best character in existence.

He's Sonic. He's fast, he can rack up damage, he has trouble with kill moves, he's hard to control, he has good recovery, he's a bit floaty. That's what we know. The only thing even close to an over the top stat on this character is speed... now let's try and find ways to MAKE HIM BETTER, instead of just complaining.

(And to the OP: This isn't really meant as a slight against you, it's just in general.)

Lucky, balls in your court sir.

 

[Sonic The Hedgedawg]

First, I must say that many of you are probably agreeing with lucky over me because you WANT sonic to be good. If you haven't played, then I doubt you know. First week Omni got this, we were averaging 14 hours per person per day (which is truly sad, I know.. it was a long weekend that brought that average that high) Regardless, I'd be willing to bet that few people on the american shore have logged more hours than we have. (and omni is of the mind that sonic could be, quite possibly the WORST on the teir list)
BUT I'm determined to try and make him better. And I'm telling you that, when he was created, hew seems to be balanced in that he can reach items quickly and has a godly final smash. But with items off, he suffers substantially.

Now in response to this:

I haven't played the game, so it's possible to ignore everything I say (I guess, if you wanna).

Sonic's uair, bair, and the last hit of fair all seem like that have killing potential if you haven't spammed one of them to the point that the knockback has seen diminishing returns by the time you need it to kill.
As do his Dsmash and Fsmash. Usmash is for comboing into aerials.
Homing Attack can be used to combo into and out of, and his spin dashes set up for aerials, too.
Hyphensmashing(Is that what we're calling it?) works great with Sonic.

Pretty much, with Sonic, my impression is that you have to be all over them and confuse them as to which attack you're doing since all of them are the same "Ball up and charge a spin" move. to build up percent and then make them take a hike, follow them off and prevent their recovery.

*shrug* =x Dunno, i'll have to experiment, myself.

Quite true, Sonic has few kill moves so he's going to have to pretty much NEVER use his back throw, Back air or Fsmash until the enemy has reached over 150% damage... and then, only when the oportunity presents itself.

Spring Drops and edgeguard fairs don't suffer much from diminishing returns so those methods of killing can be tried earlier... but are much more difficult to pull off.
His Dsmash is srong, but not as strong as his Fsmash or at least is much harder to connect with... not like his Fsmash is particularly good anyway.

And for those of you interested, I HAVE been using sonic's speed, it's the only way to have a chance with him. Relentless assaults are really the only chance he's got.

Some characters are, quite frankly, impossible to edgeguard. Meaning sonic HAS to rely on his "power moves" to kill... and that's not a good position to be in. Most of my wins with sonic can be attributed to items, if they are on, or simply being more skilled than my oponent... but in matches of equals... sonic is rarely, if ever the favoured combatant.

BTW, sonic can do quite well on his stage:
-Checkpoint markers give him the ability to KO
-walk off sides make his Back Throw = death

 

[InterimOfZeal]

Lawl@Omni being good.

jkjk, I'm kidding. Sonic's not going to be popular to use, even if we end up finding stuff that makes him really good. He's not the worst character in the game by any means, but he is kinda frustrating as of right now. I have to work for my kills, and really outthink my opponents. Because of Sonic's speed, I find myself thinking really far ahead, and looking for tendencies of their's I can abuse.

Has anyone else been employing the uair, springboard, uair combo for killing? It's really situational (at least for now), but I find myself killing at obscenely low percents (for Sonic) with it.

 

[Sonic The Hedgedawg]

Lawl@Omni being good.

jkjk, I'm kidding. Sonic's not going to be popular to use, even if we end up finding stuff that makes him really good. He's not the worst character in the game by any means, but he is kinda frustrating as of right now. I have to work for my kills, and really outthink my opponents. Because of Sonic's speed, I find myself thinking really far ahead, and looking for tendencies of their's I can abuse.

Has anyone else been employing the uair, springboard, uair combo for killing? It's really situational (at least for now), but I find myself killing at obscenely low percents (for Sonic) with it.

not saying that he's the best, but he's certainly capable of assesing characters better than a lot of the rabble on these boards, so I'll hold his opinion above most others here... especially when my personal experience coincides with his.

Using springboard fair works practically the same

 

[RedrappeR]

First, I must say that many of you are probably agreeing with lucky over me because you WANT sonic to be good. If you haven't played, then I doubt you know. First week Omni got this, we were averaging 14 hours per person per day (which is truly sad, I know.. it was a long weekend that brought that average that high) Regardless, I'd be willing to bet that few people on the american shore have logged more hours than we have. (and omni is of the mind that sonic could be, quite possibly the WORST on the teir list)
BUT I'm determined to try and make him better. And I'm telling you that, when he was created, hew seems to be balanced in that he can reach items quickly and has a godly final smash. But with items off, he suffers substantially.

Now you're pissing me off.

First off, read my post. I'm not agreeing with Lucky because "oh! SONIC NEEDS TO BE GOOD! CAUSE... HE'S MY FAV CHAR AND LIEK, WITHOUT HIM, I'LL CRY, LIKE ALL THE METROID FANBOYS WHEN RIDLEY WASN'T IN". I'm agreeing because he made valuable points.

Secondly, I've played it. So you're whole "WELL HOW WOULD YOU KNOW?" doesn't work.

Thirdly, and I mean this in all sincerity within any fighting game you play, JUST because you LOG IN HOURS, DOESN'T make you smarter than anyone else. "Guys, I played 36 hours of this game, so I'm automatically more knowledgable". Bull. Play any other fighting game, it's not the same. Some people will find different tricks and different feels for each character either sooner, or later, regardless of playtime. People play games differently.

And you're just ignoring everything we say on top of that. There's SOMETHING wrong when we hear you say one thing, and many other people who HAVE logged in hours(sometimes more than you) say another. It's a problem.



It is the most ****ing ANNOYING thing when you say crap like "Well, if you agree with him, THEN YOU OBVIOUSLY HAVEN'T PLAYED THE GAME! BLEH!" or "You're not thinking competitively". That's called being judgmental and idiotic. A good amount of the Shoryuken forum disagrees with you, and they host the biggest fighting game tournament in the world.(Melee was only excluded till last year because of a contract with the MLG).

Get out of here with this BS about "I logged in 36 hours, so I automatically get more mileage out of an opinion than you", and if that's not what you meant, rephrase it because that's how your past 3 friggen posts have come across, and it's annoying the hell out of me.

And for those of you interested, I HAVE been using sonic's speed, it's the only way to have a chance with him. Relentless assaults are really the only chance he's got.

Some characters are, quite frankly, impossible to edgeguard. Meaning sonic HAS to rely on his "power moves" to kill... and that's not a good position to be in. Most of my wins with sonic can be attributed to items, if they are on, or simply being more skilled than my oponent... but in matches of equals... sonic is rarely, if ever the favoured combatant.

BTW, sonic can do quite well on his stage:
-Checkpoint markers give him the ability to KO
-walk off sides make his Back Throw = death

And I'll just restate a point here for good measure. I'm hearing something different from Lucky, and from Gimpyfish. Both who are known fairly well in the competitive scene. And I've witnessed things differentiating from your post myself. I agree on some points, like the fact his KO moves need a tweek, but there's STILL a problem when you're acting like everything you say is ONE AND ONLY truth, when the rest of us have experienced something different. Regardless of how long you play.

EDIT: Thought I'd clarify one more thing, in case you didn't get the direct meaning of the post. My problem, is you're throwing away our opinions left and right as if we don't have the right "credibility" or anything on the subject, just because we disagree with you. You say it's because you've logged in more hours, but see above for what I think about that. It's great you're trying to "make Sonic great", but don't scoff at us just because we're in disagreement.

 

[Sonic The Hedgedawg]

Now you're pissing me off.

First off, read my ****ing post. I'm not agreeing with Lucky because "oh! SONIC NEEDS TO BE GOOD! CAUSE... HE'S MY FAV CHAR AND LIEK, WITHOUT HIM, I'LL CRY, LIKE ALL THE METROID FANBOYS WHEN RIDLEY WASN'T IN". I'm agreeing because he made valuable points.

Secondly, I've played it. So you're whole "WELL HOW WOULD YOU KNOW?" doesn't work.

Thirdly, and I mean this in all sincerity within any fighting game you play, JUST because you LOG IN HOURS, DOESN'T make you smarter than anyone else. "Guys, I played 36 hours of this game, so I'm automatically more knowledgable". Bull****. Play any other fighting game, it's not the same. Some people will find different tricks and different feels for each character either sooner, or later, regardless of playtime. People play games differently.

And you're just ignoring everything we say on top of that. There's SOMETHING wrong when we hear you say one thing, and many other people who HAVE logged in hours(sometimes more than you) say another. It's a problem.



It is the most fecking ANNOYING thing when you say **** like "Well, if you agree with him, THEN YOU OBVIOUSLY HAVEN'T PLAYED THE GAME! BLEH!" or "You're not thinking competitively". That's called being judgmental and idiotic. A good amount of the Shoryuken forum disagrees with you, and they host the biggest fighting game tournament in the world.(Melee was only excluded till last year because of a contract with the MLG).

Get out of here with this BS about "I logged in 36 hours, so I automatically get more mileage out of an opinion than you", and if that's not what you meant, rephrase it because that's how your past 3 ****ing posts have come across, and it's annoying the hell out of me.




And I'll just restate a point here for good measure. I'm hearing something different from Lucky, and from Gimpyfish. Both who are known fairly well in the competitive scene. And I've witnessed things differentiating from your post myself. I agree on some points, like the fact his KO moves need a tweek, but there's STILL a problem when you're acting like everything you say is ONE AND ONLY truth, when the rest of us have experienced something different. Regardless of how long you play.

The problem is when, whenever I say something, 10 sonic fans jump on me saying "that's not what lucky says" like he's the alpha and the omega. Different playstyles certainly lead to different outcomes. So if you are saying that the people you are trusting are really good smashers, then it stands to reason that they'll win more often because they are more likely to outskill their competitors... and while YOU may have played the game, most of those who contradict me have not so it's not like evry word I said pertained to you. It means that, since I HAVE logged the hours, I certainly have a better feel for the charcter than those whose only experience is youtbue videos, and when every one on topic post meets 10 saying that they've heards that sonic is better than I'm giving him credit for, I'd say I'm perfectly within my reason to post what I did, and if you have a problem with it, then prove that YOU can use sonic better yourself. Anything else would be heresay.

MY honest opinion of sonic from MY experience is that he's just not great. if YOU have anything to the contrary then by all means state what YOU have found different about sonic. Otherwise just shut it.

 

[InterimOfZeal]

I actually think the Sonic stage is going to be a possible counterpick against Sonic. You can camp the checkpoints, and in general, the stage is set up to allow for projectile spamming.

He may be better than assessing character better than "SonicFan123", but Lucky isn't exactly a scrub, nor am I. Pretty sure both of us went to OC3. Granted, I don't think your posts are directed at either of us, but honestly, claiming x character's position on the tier list currently is just stupid. That and Brawl=/=Melee, which seems to be a problem with a lot of people, since they're still trying to play Melee instead of Brawl.

Personally, I think that those that play Sonic should talk him over, try to figure stuff out, and those that don't have the game should go to the support thread or something crappy like that. We really need a backroom for Character Specific, especially when the US release happens. There are going to be too many scrubs thinking they know what's going on spamming the boards. D:

EDIT: When you come in to a character specific before the game comes out in the US, and claim said character is the worst in the game, people tend to get grumpeh.

 

[TheMagicalKuja]

RedrappeR and Gimpyfish are the most correct in this thread. Sonic is NOT easy to control period. Thusly getting good with him is a steep, steep, uphill climb and until then he's pretty much Metaknight with less annoyance. And yes, I have played the game, and played him. Good god I hate his poor priority.

 

[LuCKy]

^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^i feel your pain on the priority :/

10 sonic fans jump on me saying "that's not what lucky says" like he's the alpha and the omega.

lol this made me proud and laugh at the same time

but eh im just gonna let this thread go i cant prove that sonic isnt low tier......nor do i think he is, but eh only time will tell the fate of sonic lol im still gonna try to make him as good as possible and push my sonic to the limit

 

[RedrappeR]

The problem is when, whenever I say something, 10 sonic fans jump on me saying "that's not what lucky says" like he's the alpha and the omega. Different playstyles certainly lead to different outcomes. So if you are saying that the people you are trusting are really good smashers, then it stands to reason that they'll win more often because they are more likely to outskill their competitors... and while YOU may have played the game, most of those who contradict me have not so it's not like evry word I said pertained to you. It means that, since I HAVE logged the hours, I certainly have a better feel for the charcter than those whose only experience is youtbue videos, and when every one on topic post meets 10 saying that they've heards that sonic is better than I'm giving him credit for, I'd say I'm perfectly within my reason to post what I did, and if you have a problem with it, then prove that YOU can use sonic better yourself. Anything else would be heresay.

MY honest opinion of sonic from MY experience is that he's just not great. if YOU have anything to the contrary then by all means state what YOU have found different about sonic. Otherwise just shut it.

So you know what's AWESOME?! When You write like A TON of stuff in reference to this post, and then when you click reply, you get a white screen saying

"THERE ARE NO NODES TO DISPLAY

Thanks smash boards... =/

Well, I really don't feel like typing all that out again. So... I'm just gonna quickly brush on it. Don't listen to annoying Sonic nuts. Misunderstood post, thought you were talking to me since your post was under mine, my bad. Agree with Lucky because of what I've witnessed not just because I want Sonic to be good. "Pressure game". Look at 3rd Strike Yun and Makoto, tactics wise. Try Sonic more tactical. An elaboration on the playstyle thing, but now I'm too tired to retype that.

I had a lot more, and it was a really good post, and it wasn't angry either.

Maybe I'll come back and retype. Whatever. For now, I think we've all learned a valuable lesson. "****ING COPY ALL YOUR **** BEFORE YOU POST JUST IN CASE."

I gotta get back to writing my play. Oh well, nice debating with you pal. No hard feelings.

 

[Sonic The Hedgedawg]

So you know what's AWESOME?! When You write like A TON of stuff in reference to this post, and then when you click reply, you get a white screen saying

"THERE ARE NO NODES TO DISPLAY

Thanks smash boards... =/

Well, I really don't feel like typing all that out again. So... I'm just gonna quickly brush on it. Don't listen to annoying Sonic nuts. Misunderstood post, thought you were talking to me since your post was under mine, my bad. Agree with Lucky because of what I've witnessed not just because I want Sonic to be good. "Pressure game". Look at 3rd Strike Yun and Makoto, tactics wise. Try Sonic more tactical. An elaboration on the playstyle thing, but now I'm too tired to retype that.

I had a lot more, and it was a really good post, and it wasn't angry either.

Maybe I'll come back and retype. Whatever. For now, I think we've all learned a valuable lesson. "****ING COPY ALL YOUR **** BEFORE YOU POST JUST IN CASE."

I gotta get back to writing my play. Oh well, nice debating with you pal. No hard feelings.

good.. okay. I guess we're all Kosher now.

and Iknow what you mean.. I wrote a 45 min long post yesterday when the boards got hacked... so much sadness.

As for new sonic things I've noticed.


His homing attack isn't as useless as I thought, it seems to be nice for air stalling and thereby being one of his decent spacing moves.

Also, sonics USmash has EXCELLENT priority... evenif most of his moves do not.


But I think we can all agree, his Final Smash is the best in the game, Bar none

 

[LuCKy]

So you know what's AWESOME?! When You write like A TON of stuff in reference to this post, and then when you click reply, you get a white screen saying

"THERE ARE NO NODES TO DISPLAY

Thanks smash boards... =/

Well, I really don't feel like typing all that out again. So... I'm just gonna quickly brush on it. Don't listen to annoying Sonic nuts. Misunderstood post, thought you were talking to me since your post was under mine, my bad. Agree with Lucky because of what I've witnessed not just because I want Sonic to be good. "Pressure game". Look at 3rd Strike Yun and Makoto, tactics wise. Try Sonic more tactical. An elaboration on the playstyle thing, but now I'm too tired to retype that.

I had a lot more, and it was a really good post, and it wasn't angry either.

Maybe I'll come back and retype. Whatever. For now, I think we've all learned a valuable lesson. "****ING COPY ALL YOUR **** BEFORE YOU POST JUST IN CASE."

I gotta get back to writing my play. Oh well, nice debating with you pal. No hard feelings.

lol i feel your pain this happened to me yesterday with my sonic impression......lol the original one i wrote was a lot bigger but oh well

 

[InterimOfZeal]

Should I post a Sonic impression thread? Would that make me cool?

Also, the matches of me on Youtube are BS. They only posted the ones where I lost. D:<

 

[Black/Light]

Humm. . . this thread's reactions seem to mirror the time where the TC (Sonic the HH) swore up and down that Char's Rock Smash (B>) was worth less well mostly everyone else who played him said other wise. STHH seemed to dissagree alot on the PT area. . . from how heavy Char is to how useful rock smash is and so on.

Im inclined to go with what Lucky and Gimpy say for the time being. Im not some Sonic fan-boy but they both have a good, reliable history if cred and STHH seems to have alot of these "I played it so my opinion is more accurate" themed post on not only this thread but the PT forums.

Really, it's just silly to even think of a tier list at this point. . . .even more so with this character seeing as Sonic is most popular state side ( His fans will load him up with w/e meta-games they can find when we get brawl. Of the 100s of 10000s of people who are going to main him Im sure some can take his game to a higher level and guild others to the same road).

People simply have different play-styles. Hell, some guy that does vids showing off character's move-sets some what ust pi***ed away Falco in a vid, saying he was slow and because of his new attacks he played really akward (sp). . . .than he ends in saying none of them (his friends) where Falco players in melee. . .pretty much saying he didn't really care about Falco which explains the poor vid showing his move-set and comments that go against what most people say.

We all have different opinions and it's important that we all accept that. You can play 165 or w/e amount of hours of brawl and you would still not factually be any less of a nOOb to Sonic's style than others who have played less at this point seeing how the flood gates have yet to left.


And Lucky, I look forward to your new vids showing even more Sonic badassness.

 

[LuCKy]

And Lucky, I look forward to your new vids showing even more Sonic badassness.

lol a couple tourney matches came out from last week but i pretty much ***** 2 pits.....neither got recorded T-T but there is my set with a marth that i kinda ***** lol

 

[Milln]

As soon as I get the game, i'll be up there with you trying to decipher Sonic, Lucky. Whatever i'm worth, since i'm a nobody as of yet. XD

 

[LuCKy]

As soon as I get the game, i'll be up there with you trying to decipher Sonic, Lucky. Whatever i'm worth, since i'm a nobody as of yet. XD

you got this

 

[Gimpyfish62]

i'd just like to throw out another point on the whole character misconception thing (based on my post earlier)

the UNDERRATING of a character like sonic is similar to say the OVERRATING of a character like Ike.

While we lack control over our characters Ike is going to be breaking some skulls, his kill moves are massive and powerful and there are many many of them, he can do well enough for now, but once we learn how to control our own characters on the whole ike's effectiveness falls wayyyyyy down

same thing seems to be true with sonic, but the inverse.

"randomly doing moves" or even attempting to be strategic isn't necessarily effective until you have full control over your character, i'm not saying he will be great by any means, he seems to be lacking the potential to make him a truly great character, but I think a lot of people are shrugging him off due to both initial difficulty to use and an apparent lack of kill moves.

Just sayin' keep in mind that the game will change drastically these upcoming months. Don't write Sonic off before looking at hte big picture.

 

[Sonic The Hedgedawg]

i'd just like to throw out another point on the whole character misconception thing (based on my post earlier)

the UNDERRATING of a character like sonic is similar to say the OVERRATING of a character like Ike.

While we lack control over our characters Ike is going to be breaking some skulls, his kill moves are massive and powerful and there are many many of them, he can do well enough for now, but once we learn how to control our own characters on the whole ike's effectiveness falls wayyyyyy down

same thing seems to be true with sonic, but the inverse.

"randomly doing moves" or even attempting to be strategic isn't necessarily effective until you have full control over your character, i'm not saying he will be great by any means, he seems to be lacking the potential to make him a truly great character, but I think a lot of people are shrugging him off due to both initial difficulty to use and an apparent lack of kill moves.

Just sayin' keep in mind that the game will change drastically these upcoming months. Don't write Sonic off before looking at hte big picture.

even if we DO find new ways of playing as sonic, moves that don't kill will stay that way... right? So, unless you back your oponent onto an edge, you are looking at, what, 3 kill moves?


All the same, speaking of Ike, I think that bot he and sonic woud likely have great utility on teams. And if, by some miracle, smashballs are on, then sonic will own all