IC Blog: VLog is dead but the blog is not!

[Wobbles]

Hey guys, I decided to rip off / pay homage to Forward's smash blog and I've begun doing my own. http://eskimosister.blogspot.com

Any time I think about/discover/explore/feel like talking about something Smash or ICs related, it goes there. And sometimes other random things about other random things. Check it out, if you like

 

[Dogysamich]

Arent you supposed to be working on a guide on how to make Ice Kids better players?

Jokes aside, I like the idea. I kinda thought about ripping that idea myself.

But it's not about me, it's about you. Good luck with it.

 

[Wobbles]

That guide became a massive endeavor. I have no idea where to start with it, truthfully. Hopefully this little project will give me time to organize my thoughts and... stuff.

 

[Dogysamich]

Lol, I looked at your post twice, and started to respond, but didnt because I was lazy/didnt like my answer. In all actuality, that answer pretty much is THE answer.

Realistically, you'd probably want to start with the macro level and just break down to micro. Start with the big picture and go down to nit picky details.

I.e. This is a jab. S*** hits twice as long as nana's there. You can do it twice for 4x. If you hit somebody with it, you can do mixups, mixups being sdklfjsdklfuilsdufiosdjfiosduadiljfoasufosajfo.

But yeah, I see where that looks like a big problem. I thought about doing that for doc a while ago and said "Pfft, who the f*** would actually read this? Especially from me."

__

The second answer I had for you was to go with what the people actually wanted to know about. But that becomes a problem when like, you have one person who asks for something that would actually be useful (i.e. "How the **** do I stop falco shield pressure), but that could overshadowed by like, 20 people asking some ******** question like "Teach me how to do the W and nana moonwalk so I can be kool."

__

In reality, I think the blog is really the best idea you got. You do it when you feel like it whenever something comes to mind. It wouldnt hurt to take suggestions, but in the end, it's you focused.

That's the main thing you're looking for (or atleast what I've gathered from reading everything leadin up to this).

 

[ChivalRuse]

Wobbles: Random Thoughts and Musings.

Sounds like it could be a good read.

 

[Fly_Amanita]

I plan on checking this semi-regularly.

 

[choknater]

lately i think ic's have been falling behind in the metagame (hence my heavy falco usage lately) so i hope u can help out with some new things wobbles

 

[Wobbles]

New post It's more generalized and it's going to be in three parts, first part is up now. Post comments and share it if you like, more discussion means a better product in the future

 

[#HBC | Mac]

Everyone should read that newest article.

 

[schoin]

Everyone should read that newest article.

I second that! Wobbles you crazy philosophical madman your creative writing is coming along extremely nicely. ^^

 

[KirbyKaze]

I feel very strongly every Sheik should do that with tech chasing.

 

[maXXXpower]

Even though I do not play IC's, this is very relevant and useful. AZ too good.

 

[Vts]

Good read so far but many people have questions about the wall of say someone who reads you and knows ur playing style.

then comes in the part where u have to try something new that u haven't practice or something that u practiced but they have to do exactly what u think they are going to do to make it work.

but maybe thats just me.

did like how the points were done pretty cool way of breaking it down

maybe i'll come visit u and we can chill if ur cool with that some time, but wont be until like springish when i can.

 

[Wobbles]

Vts: A good point, and a problem I plan on addressing in part 2 in the problems and solutions section ^_^

 

[joeplicate]

i love these things

they make me want to go and practice
then i usually do, and then i feel great basking in my smash knowledge

good **** wobbles

 

[Finch]

Everyone in the smash community should read this. Really interesting stuff that I've never heard or thought of before.

 

[Wobbles]

Part 2 of it is up:

http://eskimosister.blogspot.com/2009/08/subtractive-playstyles-part-2-problems.html

I also won an AZ tournament against Forward and Axe, both playing primarily spacies. I'll post some stuff about that too, though I don't know how useful it will really be.

 

[Wobbles]

Minor update, also tournament videos

http://www.smashboards.com/showthread.php?t=245475

 

[*P*L*U*R*]

Like the update, I like facing away from falcons too

 

[choknater]

good stuff wobbles, i always learn a little bit

but my mindset when playing ic's is completely different from yours xD

 

[PB&J]

wobbles ..stop think of everything..lol..good stuff

 

[*P*L*U*R*]

Wobbles, I tend to spam Ice blocks against Falcos when they laser. It usually makes them try to full-jump over the blocks, where we can then wavedash under with an Uptilt or smash. IS this a good tactic?

 

[choknater]

i like to sh blizzard through falco's lasers if he is far away cuz nana goes through a laser while popo gets hit by it, popo can grab off the blizz if i get lucky

ice blocks are good as well simply to deter lasers, but do not nullify falco's laser game

 

[Lixivium]

Wobbles, I tend to spam Ice blocks against Falcos when they laser. It usually makes them try to full-jump over the blocks, where we can then wavedash under with an Uptilt or smash. IS this a good tactic?

I try to do that but Falcos just D-air right through anything I try from below.

 

[Fly_Amanita]

^ If you're having a hard time stopping dair with utilt/usmash, try sh uair.

 

[KirbyKaze]

I wonder if you could somehow have Nana lightshield while Popo U-smashes / U-tilts, or vice versa, so you could have Falco hitlag and waste some time while you get your slower hitbox out to meet him.

I doubt there's a practical way to do this, but it was a thought.

 

[Wobbles]

KirbyKaze: I thought of that awhile ago too, but I think it takes too long to conveniently set up. It *would* work, for the same reason that when you trade hits with somebody Nana seems to magically escape harm. You get stuck in hit lag and Nana reaches in to hit the other person. It's also why she'll clink with attacks after you get hit by them :/

Plur: That's what I try to do. You really don't want to use them at close-mid range though, because he can easily take advantage of the lag and apply pressure when you're not ready to deal with it.

Choknater: I remember posting that idea a long time ago and nobody liked it It turns out to be kind of hard to execute (for me anyhow) but if it's working for you then I say hooray.

 

[Fly_Amanita]

I think sh blizzard is only reliable against Falco if you run forward and do it, since that puts enough distance between Nana and Popo for the laser to only hit Popo. You also need to be really confident that Falco is going to shoot a laser, because otherwise both ICs will be stuck in the blizzard animation, which is really unsafe. At the range at which this works, it's probably safer to use synched ice blocks to throw Falco off a bit.

Belay OoS -> blizzard is still my favorite anti-laser gimmick.

 

[PB&J]

i spam ice blocks when they lasre to force them to full jump and then wave dash fair or up air..its ****..and i also up tilt to up smash alot against him to rack damage quick

 

[*P*L*U*R*]

Plur: That's what I try to do. You really don't want to use them at close-mid range though, because he can easily take advantage of the lag and apply pressure when you're not ready to deal with it.

That's what I meant. You'd do it at Long- mid range. I always do a long jump into ice block because at the very least, Nana will throw an ice block and you'll be desynched. Popo can then throw his own block and when the Falco full-jumps, you can make Nana full jump nanapult into a wavedash follow-up. In theory, i don't think Falco will have any options against it because getting hit by the blizzard with drag falco down into a Utilt/smash/Grab. I haven't played against Dr. Peepee in monthes though so I dunno if it works on good Falcos and honestly PP would probably rock me anyways because he's so much better than me.

I see the long jump blizzard thing being used best at mid-range.

 

[Wobbles]

Blog updated

http://eskimosister.blogspot.com/2009/08/subtractive-playstyles-part-3-case.html

 

[choknater]

good blog, yeah sometimes i do think too much, but when i just make it simple in my head, i play much better

it is difficult to do in those matchups where there are MANY options that HAVE to be used for both characters in order to adapt, like falco vs peach, but there are still definitely ways to simplify it in your mind especially if you are technically sound.

but keep in mind wobs, the TOP TOP players never really had playstyles like that. i know it's very effective, but mango ken armada kdj pc tend to have rather random and adaptive styles that don't really focus on anything in particular. they were all aggressive and mixed up their approaches, which allowed them to set the pace rather than relying on adaptation or strategy. i understand how far a husband-like playstyle can get someone, and it can go far, but i'd imagine that it takes much more than that to reach the top.

 

[Wobbles]

Well, remember what I said, if you stagnate your game and settle for just being good at one or two things, you don't reach that level. Plus, the players you mentioned are also the players who (except for PC and I don't know about Armada) just became good, seemingly out of nowhere. Mango told me that he never really practiced Smash, he just got good at it by playing with people. Ken's first tournament was an MLG event that he won, and KDJ just kind of ascended to power out of the blue as well.

Hungrybox started out doing almost nothing but b-airs and steadily added more elements to his game, now he's ridiculously good as well. I agree that you need to keep adding skills, but it's far better IMO to just pick one and cement it thoroughly before moving on rather than trying to do it all at once.

 

[choknater]

hm, yeah, i getcha

as an ic's i just focused on my grab game, realized that everyone avoids grabs, so i mixed in dash attacks :D

 

[PB&J]

well hbox also played really good people..fl has like some of the top people in the nation and alot of other players people dont know about ..the people u play effect how good u are sometimes, but not all the time..sometimes playing better players..like top players will bring a side of u out that u never thought of doing and thats what i think is happening to alot of players recently

 

[Wobbles]

Good competition helps I made a big jump in skill after moving to AZ and getting to play Taj and Forward.

 

[Wobbles]

Played in another Melee tournament today. Lost to Axe's Falco in winner's bracket, then beat Forward, followed by Axe twice in loser's to take it home.

Forward played Falcon and Peach, Axe played Falco, Pikachu, Jigglypuff and Fox. There should be videos @ some point.

I don't know what happened, but right around game 3 with Forward in loser's finals my mind kicked into overdrive. I turned into a beast, good calls, fewer technical errors, I didn't let anything get to me.

I'll give a write-up about it, it was a very interesting experience.

Oh yeah, Saturday was a Brawl tourney and I took first in singles and doubles. Then I won the Brawl low-tier tournament today ^_^ I swept all 4 tournaments XD

 

[choknater]

LMAO wow

what char do u play in brawl?

 

[Wobbles]

Wario. Jigglypuff with an air grab, seriously.

Edit:

A *heavy* Jigglypuff with an air-grab.

 

[Smasher89]

I just started reading the post and read everything except the whole sirlin article you linked too(which often is great "insight words").
I agree that practicing one thing at a time might be like the best thing to get alot better. This explains alot why certain wierd playstyles like I think it was makenshis fox who did nothing more then nair and bair did so well in a big european tournament last year.

I remember that I once mentioned to Armada that peach fair is her best and most unpunishable move against IC's(after reading about that in the matchup thread and experience), which he started using alot(and have done the same thing with other characters moves, like CFs knee that alot of CF players like to use as much as possible for some reason), and just watch how scary he's fair is now(check like every match from genesis)...