I think Sakurai directly lied about this game's characters being remade from scratch.

[StarLight42]

http://www.gonintendo.com/s/236145-...rs-making-smash-bros-wii-u-3ds-more-appealing

In fact, we recreated all characters almost from scratch

I'm sorry, what? All of the characters being remade from scratch?

So that means ol' Falcondorf here got an entirely new moveset? No. He didn't, he's still Falcondorf after all. If Sakurai remade the characters from scratch, it's only natural logic to give Ganondorf some moves that actually make sense with the Zelda series.

You can even use confirmed characters, for example. Mario is almost exactly the same aside from some speed changes, right down to every single frame of his idle animation being the same. This is why i'm glad we are getting Dr. Mario back.

---

Sorry to people who like to stay optimistic about Smash 4, I want to stay optimistic about it as well, but I don't like it when the creator outright lies about something probably just to draw in $ales.

 

[Violenceman]

I don't think you are understanding what he means.

He is not saying that he didn't use previous characters as blueprints for this game, just that no elements have been directly moved from a previous game.

So he did not take data from Mario in Brawl and move it over to the Smash 4 to tweak and re-balance; he was completely built from the ground up for Smash 4, even if they modeled him after the Brawl incarnation.

 

[Zango]

Who's to say they didn't completely remake from scratch the same moves?

 

[StarLight42]

I don't think you are understanding what he means.

He is not saying that he didn't use previous characters as blueprints for this game, just that no elements have been directly moved from a previous game.

So he did not take data from Mario in Brawl and move it over to the Smash 4 to tweak and re-balance; he was completely built from the ground up for Smash 4, even if they modeled him after the Brawl incarnation.

I'm sorry but I find it impossible that someone could recreate Mario's idle animation from Brawl FRAME BY FRAME from scratch.

 

[Mighty_Guy100]

I'm sorry but I find it impossible that someone could recreate Mario's idle animation from Brawl FRAME BY FRAME from scratch.

"Almost from scratch"

 

[Mysteltainn]

Not going to lie, I'm annoyed at FalconDorf being back too, but meh. He overhauled the rest of the characters big time (see Link, ZSS, Pit, Bowser, Olimar, Samus to name just a few off the top of my head) in terms of speed / physics changes. Not to mention the newcomers being made from scratch.

 

[Fire Tactician]

Well, considering that Sakurai apparently is a Ganondorf main, I'm not too sure that he's as caught up on this whole "Falcondorf" thing as others are.

 

[ferioku]

For the love of god, a thread like this again? This thread is going no where seriously. You also need to know the flipping difference between remaking a character into a clone and copying it from brawl because if that's what you think, you're honestly wrong! You don't know if he's lying or not.

As for Ganondorf, I wasn't expecting a change in his movesets anyway.

 

[Doomstar]

I'm sorry but I find it impossible that someone could recreate Mario's idle animation from Brawl FRAME BY FRAME from scratch.

PM did that with Mewtwo's entire Moveset. They couldn't use Melee files so they they had to go from scratch.

 

[Xermo]

I'm sorry but I find it impossible that someone could recreate Mario's idle animation from Brawl FRAME BY FRAME from scratch.

they made it in the first place, they can do it again.

 

[StarLight42]

they made it in the first place, they can do it again.

Not frame by frame.

Unless something was copied, and hey, I don't even mind if something was copied, but I don't like it when people lie.

PM did that with Mewtwo's entire Moveset. They couldn't use Melee files so they they had to go from scratch.

I don't know much about Project M or it's development, but I bet they used some assets from Melee, and hey, that's fine, at least they are honest.

 

[R0Y]

Some things are re-used from Brawl yeah, they didn't actually start from scratch.

 

[~ Valkyrie ~]

I find it so funny how everyone hates Falcondorf, considering he has that damn Triforce of Power and is basically even more brutal version of memetic Captain. I mean, everyone finds Falcon already way too badass.
It is then most fitting that he'll use his fists instead of relying on magic (Zelda's thing) or swords (Link's thing) in variety-filled game like Smash.

Hell, if we never had Dorf being based of Falcon, we wouldn't have had Dorf at all since...ever.

On Smash-characters being same, it runs about here and there. Some characters got reworked, after all. I guess Dorf got overlooked, but what can you do.

 

[Raijinken]

It's an expression (he also said almost all characters, not all characters). It means that when it was relevant or needed, they were redesigned and adjusted. Major seen examples include Bowser and Pit. However, we've yet to see every move by every character, there is plenty of room for characters to have been changed. And "from the ground up" doesn't necessarily mean completely from scratch, nor necessarily that it would change between games. Some animations are basically iconic now, like how Mario throws fireballs.

 

[praline]

Did anyone really expect Ganondorf to get a major overhaul?

Some moves is likely, but he was never gonna give him a completely new moveset.

 

[Chimera]

I'm sorry but I find it impossible that someone could recreate Mario's idle animation from Brawl FRAME BY FRAME from scratch.

Do you develop games?

 

[ToothiestAura]

...Your quote says "almost." Really?

 

[Cap'nChreest]

Well, considering that Sakurai apparently is a Ganondorf main, I'm not too sure that he's as caught up on this whole "Falcondorf" thing as others are.

Pretty sure that's misinformation.

I think Sakurai just plays as anybody.

 

[MasterOfKnees]

He's talking from a data perspective. They basically recoded all characters from scratch to match their previous gameplay styles, likely because the old data system was outdated. I'm sure models have been reused though.

 

[StaffofSmashing]

Triforce of Power;
Power is usually associated w/ fists.

Falcondorf will remain for a while.

 

[Pazzo.]

I find it so funny how everyone hates Falcondorf when he has that damn Triforce of Power and is basically even more brutal version of memetic Captain. (And everyone finds Falcon already too badass...)
It is definitely fitting that he'll use his fists instead of relying on magic (Zelda's thing) or swords (Link's thing). At least in Smash.

Hell, if we never had Dorf being based of Falcon, we wouldn't have had Dorf at all since...ever.

On Smash-characters being same, it runs about here and there. Some characters got reworked, after all. I guess Dorf got overlooked, but what can you do.

Thank you. While not ideal, Ganondorf's moveset does reflect a powerful, brutal villain. With that said, Ol' 'dorf could still have a few tricks... especially if he was created from 'the ground up.'

 

[Reila]

Fun thread!

...wait, is the OP serious?

I find it so funny how everyone hates Falcondorf when he has that damn Triforce of Power and is basically even more brutal version of memetic Captain. (And everyone finds Falcon already too badass...)
It is definitely fitting that he'll use his fists instead of relying on magic (Zelda's thing) or swords (Link's thing). At least in Smash.

Hell, if we never had Dorf being based of Falcon, we wouldn't have had Dorf at all since...ever.

On Smash-characters being same, it runs about here and there. Some characters got reworked, after all. I guess Dorf got overlooked, but what can you do.

Agreed! I think Ganondorf's moveset in Smash fits him well. I find baffling the people wanting him to be yet another sword user (an Ike clone?).

 

[mario123007]

We can not say Ganondorf is really the same from this video, it is too hard to tell. But I hope Sakurai is putting his effort on many things than just characters.

 

[warionumbah2]

Well this thread backfired the OP.

 

[Niala]

I'm sorry but I find it impossible that someone could recreate Mario's idle animation from Brawl FRAME BY FRAME from scratch.

Why?

If anybody could create a frame perfect replica of something, it's likely the person who created it in the first place.

Also, I would really like to see the frame data comparisons that you source here. It seems to me your assessment is based on information we don't even have.

 

[Hayzie]

*Creates animation Mario is universally known for*

* "Impossible to make again, I say!" *

It's Mario! How many games, how many moves? In the same type of game, let alone same franchise being a direct sequel with his moveset we all know and love... it's about getting them back into fray ironing them out/making them flashy or whatever.

As for Ganondorf... I like his moveset/weight. He's a beast. I still welcome a change, though.




............................................impossible

 

[JV5Chris]

Off topic, but holy cow does Lucina/Marth's grab range look terrible. Pichu's got some competition.

 

[Gameboi834]

As for Ganondorf... I like his moveset/weight. He's a beast. I still welcome a change, though.

If Ganondorf gets the Bowser treatment...

 

[Renji64]

I think he just meant making characters from strach meaning the smash 4 engine. I hope ganon has some type of buffs lawd knows he needs it.

 

[~ Valkyrie ~]

Thank you. While not ideal, Ganondorf's moveset does reflect a powerful, brutal villain. With that said, Ol' 'dorf could still have a few tricks... especially if he was created from 'the ground up.'

The closest we could hope for is the customized moves, but I kinda doubt that, since most moves we have seen on some characters hasn't really changed the moves themselves, only their attributes. But who knows, we'll see.

 

[Kaye Cruiser]

Off topic, but holy cow does Lucina/Marth's grab range look terrible. Move over Pichu.

Actually, it's cause Shulk and Lucina were on the same team and Team Attack is off, so it didn't work.

 

[JV5Chris]

Actually, it's cause Shulk and Lucina were on the same team and Team Attack is off, so it didn't work.

Yeah, you're definitely right. Maybe Shulk doesn't have a blue alt yet or something.

 

[Kaye Cruiser]

Yeah, you're definitely right. Maybe Shulk doesn't have a blue alt yet or something.

Did you forget? Teams don't have colored outfits anymore on the 3DS version. They have outlines.

Shulk and Lucina are the Red Team which is why Lucina has a red outline in the gif that you can see if you look closely. That, and later in the vid that showcases this match, it shows the two of them winning as the Red Team.

 

[JV5Chris]

Did you forget? Teams don't have colored outfits anymore on the 3DS version. They have outlines.

Shulk and Lucina are the Red Team which is why Lucina has a red outline in the gif that you can see if you look closely. That, and later in the vid that showcases this match, it shows the two of them winning as the Red Team.

Never knew that. Funny how the Lucina player still tried to grab him. Perhaps the colored outline is not obvious enough in general.

 

[Ryuutakeshi]

I think the OP is taking this too literally and possibly even too seriously. Your evidemce that Sakurai lied is based on circumstancial evidence taken from your own assumptions and a blurry clip of an unfinished build. Do you even have experience or understanding regarding the subject?

Also, let's assume Sakurai did lie about it. What are you going to do about it?

 

[Khao]

Not frame by frame.

Sorry, but yes you can.

Ever heard of working with references?

Because they're especially useful in 3D modeling and animating, in every 3D animation software that's even slightly competent when it comes to professional use (and even in ones that aren't) you can literally put images in the background as blueprints and move things around until they match, so yes, recreating an animation frame by frame is not only possible, but easy, and completely logical.

And in any case, how do you even know the animations match frame by frame?

 

[Bladeviper]

if you want proof it can be done look at kingdom hearts 1.5, square had to recreate the game from the ground up since they lost the game assets and it looks the same frame by frame. its not impossible

 

[Rhubarbo]

This sentiment is stupid from a couple angles.

1) Sakurai may want Ganondorf to be similar to Falcon now that he's been playable that way for 13 years.

2) I don't see why creating a character from scratch should be considered noble. I'd rather them port all of the characters and use their resources for other game play improvements.

 

[Wintropy]

I understand that he may have lost something in translation or been speaking figuratively, but decrying him as a liar because of that is a tad harsh. The man's doing his best for us and a lot of us choose to respect that.

 

[Deleted member 245254]

Not frame by frame.

Unless something was copied, and hey, I don't even mind if something was copied, but I don't like it when people lie.

He's not lying...

Look at Marth, many people were complaining about how Marth felt and it's as a complete result of his rebuilding. His movements are utterly more realistic now. His sword feels like it cuts through the wind and his movements feel so...substantial.

I don't know much about Project M or it's development, but I bet they used some assets from Melee, and hey, that's fine, at least they are honest.

I would stop talking if I had no idea what I was talking about, just some advice.