I Quit The Puff (On-Topic For Marth Thread, Need Help For Marth)

[illinialex24]

After vacation, Jigglypuff stopped feeling natural and Marth did, so I am likely going to be maining Marth and Wario (essentially a better Jigglypuff). Here's where it becomes on-topic: Anyone got any tips after viewing some of these videos besides shorthopping (I'm working on it, I can do it perfectly in training but I hold buttons longer in a match for some reason):

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=QWEns4j8qP4
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=6k8YxpL90RA
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=PFbHPO-CDuI
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=hK7iNOXVqHw
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=Qf8r46Tf_UM
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=KAIKHz01TsQ
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=li6f2Z3yh9g
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=WYI1jCxgD6E
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=0HOC9Eef32M
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=EeDZMwFQ7aE
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=f9csSceT-xg

I know I am not a great Marth, so I could definitely use help but I know I will get a lot better when I start focusing attention on him and get help by the good users here.

 

[mosesrko24]

First off, welcome to the marth boards. Now before you do anything else, you need to be able to short

hop consistently in real matches. For marth it's a necessity. I saw the first 2 matches, and there are

some things you could work on.



Don't dair as you land on stage. Actually, don't dair on stage period. It's only good for spiking, and even

then you should just chase off stage with you're other aerials.


Chase offstage with aerials. smashes aren't that great for edge-guarding.


Smash less in general. Smashes are good to use when your opp. is wide open.


Abuse d-tilt and dancing blade. Dancing blade is your all-purpose punisher, and well-spaced d-tilts are

hard to punish.


Hope this helps.

 

[illinialex24]

Thanks, I'm currently just forcing myself to tap lighter so I should be getting better at that. Also, I'm learning how to spike well with dair and how to use it effectively if you think your opponent is going to push away from the ledge and come back on. And I edgeguard with fairs pretty well now because I used to use Jigglypuff and somehow I got better at using Marth as an edgeguarder than Jigglypuff. I just have one more question... Is there a way that you can fair and the bair as a kill move during edgeguarding without ever touching the stage or edge? Is it the same as Jigglypuff where you press the opposite direction during the jump or what (it would be the other way with the puff but whatever) and can it be done?

 

[ZHMT]

First off, like said above, you need to be able to shorthop in a real game, and you need to master it.

Now, Marth is NOT a easy character to learn, matter of fact he is one of the hardest. No matter what anyone says, "Marth is a noob char", "Marth is all fair and fsmash tippers", "counter is cheap"...exc... That is complete bs. Many people that lose to Marths and make johns like that are losing to the player controlling Marth. You get satisfaction with your wins, and Marth is extremely fun to play.

With Marth, you cant spam smashes...period. Marth does not have a safe kill move that he can throw out at any given time. This means you have to play careful and stay alert at all times. Marths worst move is probably his fsmash. Use dtilts and dancing blade to rack damage and help punish. Marths fair can use used to wall. DONT approach with double fairs, it simply fails.

Play slow, be patient, use tilts. EVERY smash that Marth has is unsafe when blocked and you will be punished if you dont connect. Think of it like jigglys rest, if you miss it, your dead. That is how ALL of marths smashes are.

My favorite way to KO is to get the opponent to 100%, knock them off the ledge, and dolphin slash them as they do their weak ledge attack. Its almost a guarenteed KO, and its easy to pull off, and its flashy.

Marths ftilt blocks all short hop run-ins and is relatively safe, Marth can also use his throws to position his opponents simply because they have low knockback.

Basically, watch videos, and learn the basics first and youll do fine. Enjoy using the most fun char in the game imo.

 

[illinialex24]

I used to second Marth so I know the basics, but since I got rid, of Jigglypuff, he's now my main so I need to take him to a new level.

 

[3xSwords]

Hi Illinalex!!! :D I'm sure you know me by now and whether you hate my guts by now or not let's be friends XD

Now let's see. For one, no you can not do a midair turnaround unless you are a character with more than two jumps. If you could with Marth he would be absolutely broken since things like fair>turnaround 2nd jump>dair spike would be possible.

Yes SH'ing is critical skill for Marth, a must learn if you want to get anywhere. Now I watched tidbits of a couple of your matches. First thing I realized immediately, you are always the one to be approaching. I think this may have spawned from maining Jiggz b/c with her you can never really "camp" and you are forced to be the aggressor.

However, with Marth you can abuse your range to camp. So first advice slow down. Use tilts, don't always go to aerials, stay grounded, mix it up. With Marth you don't want to be too aggressive unless after playing awhile you decide being aggressive is most suitable. Also remember Marth can do more than just f-smash when he is on the ground. That being said learn spacing.

Let me tell you right now dair is overrated. It looks cool, fantastic when you hit with it, but EXTREMELY RISKY as such don't rely on it too much. So this leads me to tell you sometimes it is important to gtfo of a certain situation and not trying to attack back. The best example is when Marth is directly above his opponent. In that situation is best if you just jump away from your opponent instead of trying to hit him with a dair. Why? B/c if they shield your attack you are ********** (multiple asterisks = **** beyond words)

A lot of this comes to playing more, so just give it some time. Post new vids 1-2 weeks later to show your improvement.

Also when posting vids post maybe 3? 6 tops, unless you are showcasing all the tourney matches you had at a tourney, but even then try to get rid of the bad ones. Too many vids are very annoying, and label your matches with some general info too (who and what character you versed and date should be enough).

One last thing don't counter too much. Unless you are absolutely reading your opponent 100% with god like reflexes, but if you aren't, use counter sparingly.

So have fun and post vids of yourself in a week or two.

 

[ZHMT]

Marths only options when above his opponent is a dair, meaning stay to the front of them.

If you have had used Marth before and are going to main him, thats good.

Also, I suggest you check this thread if you havent already.

http://smashboards.com/showthread.php?t=172497

 

[Darxmarth23]

sup

hello. I did watch your vids.as stated by the others you do need to work on short hopping. Just

tap the button gently.also,fast fall.since people can now escape marths double f-airs you should

short hop, land an f-air, fastfall , and repeat. always use dancing blade as a punisher.and dont

be afraid to jump off edge. Marth has a great DI so it is easy to recover.

its always good to see another marth learning the ropes.

 

[IDK]

well bair turns you around in midair. you could jump off stage backwards and bair>fair or bair> jump> fair, or ledgehop>bair fair. (ledgehop is where you were talking about "pushing away from the stage then coming back.")

 

[∫unk]

hmph. g is not happy to here one of his apprentices has left.

 

[3xSwords]

well bair turns you around in midair. you could jump off stage backwards and bair>fair or bair> jump> fair, or ledgehop>bair fair. (ledgehop is where you were talking about "pushing away from the stage then coming back.")

Well that's just a move specific property. Normally you can't do that.

 

[illinialex24]

Yeah, I think I know how to go off the ledge and edgeguard because lets face it, thats one of Jigglypuff's KO options so I really had to learn it. The main problem I am having now is getting edgehogged when I fail at an edgeguard for some reason, and so I die. I've tried using a dancing blade to stall but I haven;t had huge success on spikers, because they will spike me if I dancing blade stall and edgehog me if I don't. Anyway I could overcome this.

And 3x, that is great advice about camping. I was so used to punishing campy opponents and being an aggressor (and I'm sorry G) so I think that will help my gameplay a lot. And I think I try to push the double fair too much so I'll try to control that and start to short hop, fair, fast fall. And I gotta get my spacing down for Marth, because that is really hurting me right now against tougher opponents.

 

[3xSwords]

Hmmmmm
well like i said most of your problems are just that you haven't played Marth seriously for an extended period of time. Like failing to recover safely after failing an edge guard is simply not being used to the character. With Jiggz since you had multiple jumps a failed edge guard wasn't risky, but with Marth there is more risk.

By playing with him more, you will realize as I've stated before that in some situations you will have to just back of. In an edgeguarding case say you already used your double jump off the stage, but your opponent was within fair range. In this situation, its better to just get back to the stage instead of trying to get in that extra hit.

Also when doing off stage edge guarding you need to be more precise with when you jump after them, because if you jump too early or too late then you will most likely fail hitting them at all. DB stalling is only effective if say your opponent is edge hogging you and you only have your DS left. DB stalling lets you run the opponent out of invincibility frames so you can recover safely. That and just a timing mixup here and there.

Like I said post more vids a week or two later so we can see ur progress

 

[¯\_S.(ツ).L.I.D._/¯]

Dair is not for on the stage. Dtilt is your friend.

 

[cman]

First, Marth boards are the best! Flame anyone who says differently.

Second, tilts+spacing=win. Spacing is critical to marth's game and you need to become very consistant with tipping. Also uptilt is a surprisingly good killer and its a very quick attack with hitboxes on all sides of his body.

 

[PotatoTube]

Marth boards are better than the best, I like his upsmash