Q&A How to Wreck *****es with Ganon?- Linguini Q&A Thread

[X WaNtEd X]

https://www.reddit.com/r/SSBM/comments/3x1ohl/ganons_invincible_ledge_options/

Just wanted to drop this by. Useful knowledge for anyone that doesnt know already.
N-air is a cool ledge trick but almost definitely useless, imo. I am curious if the ledgehop u-air regrab is possible if you actually hit an opponent?

It is. I've been practicing it and doing it a lot lately. It legit destroys Marth's recovery. Been having a lot of success against Marths on netplay because of it.

 

[-ACE-]

One other thing. Why do you guys think Linguini is so good on pokemon and FD? Do you think he knows something about the way Ganon plays that we've been ignoring? It's hard to ignore the success he continues to have on stages that are traditionally considered trash for Ganon, especially vs. Falco.

Other than linguini knowing exactly how much space to give each character in neutral, his grab game and techchasing game are top notch. And then his consistent edgeguarding... Second to no one there. It takes a lot of effort mentally but having those aspects of your game finely tuned really masks FD's disadvantageous attributes. And also, I honestly think linguini has a small gift for maintaining a high level of focus or something like that. The mental awareness factor is there.

He honestly just tends to make fewer mistakes than (virtually) all of us. Look at how he works OoS options. When he should grab, he grabs. When he should fh dair OoS, he does so. When he should buffer a roll, he does so, and in the most optimal direction almost every time. His bair is nearly fp every time, consistently hitting fox when he crosses you up with early nair (difficult to hit every time). He very rarely bairs OoS if it can be punished by spacey utilt.

He makes these decisions based the on micro-spacing of each situation when Falco attacks his shield. Paying attention to Falco's position, what part of his shield Falco hits, and whether it's a late or early aerial, where and when he will land, etc.... All important.

 

[X WaNtEd X]

But wouldn't those traits serve him better on Yoshi's, BF, and the other stages that are traditionally considered better for Ganon? You have more options in neutral with the platforms, the same oos options, the ability to use the platforms to edgeguard more efficiently, and platforms to tech chase with.

Although he masks those stages weaknesses well, he does more than that. He is literally performing better on those stages than he does on the platform stages. I don't think it's as simple as "he just makes fewer mistakes", because making fewer mistakes on the other stages should be better for you.

My theory is he has a distinctly different platystyle on those stages that works. Maybe they are better for Ganon. Maybe they are not. But something tells me they aren't nearly as bad as we think they are. Maybe they just require you to change the way you play drastically.

 

[-ACE-]

Emilio does not do better on FD than yoshi's/BF looool. Don't go off one or two sets. He's had that matchup down on PS for like 6 years too. He adjusts accordingly to the changes of the stage, usually better than his opponent does.

 

[Waldoring]

I haven't seen this used anywhere; ledgehop pivot jab is a thing. Not sure how useful it is.

 

[-ACE-]

I haven't seen this used anywhere; ledgehop pivot jab is a thing. Not sure how useful it is.

VERY USEFUL. obviously fully invincible, but also simple options like this, invincible or not, become much more viable out of ledgehop. People just aren't expecting it until you abuse it. Ledgehop turnaround ftilt or uair surprise them too.

 

[RedmanSSBM]

More Linguini vids Kreygasm.

Also Ace, I saw your Ganon dittos a little earlier and I really liked it when you did wavelands into SH bairs and dairs using the momentum. Do that **** more it's soo underused.

 

[-ACE-]

@Locke Robster yeah I love doing that. Makes the disjoint massive too lol

 

[X WaNtEd X]

Emilio does not do better on FD than yoshi's/BF looool. Don't go off one or two sets. He's had that matchup down on PS for like 6 years too. He adjusts accordingly to the changes of the stage, usually better than his opponent does.

I meant just pokemon, not FD. I should've been more clear. I take those sets more seriously than past sets because those are actually indicative of what current Falcos are like.

 

[-ACE-]

True, it just sucks only 1% of what happens is recorded.

 

[Bwmat]

Get your vids here
https://youtu.be/hhbxAENzeSM
https://youtu.be/N_mjiPaIYO4 Dat third stock first game.
https://youtu.be/oPeSMuHp7uI only went Ganon first game, got wrecked (and salty)

 

[X WaNtEd X]

True, it just sucks only 1% of what happens is recorded.

Become a ganon paparazzi and do some cell phone recordings!

 

[-ACE-]

Become a ganon paparazzi and do some cell phone recordings!

I'll try lol. Others should too!

 

[Diosama]

Somewhat unrelated

You know how Falcon has the sacred combo, what's it called for Ganon when he gets his fair > punch? More importantly, is it even possible.

 

[-ACE-]

Lol you have to basically jump and start it right before they WF recover.

 

[Diosama]

Lol you have to basically jump and start it right before they WF recover.

So you're telling me there's a chance

 

[-ACE-]

Too bad I can only like that once lmao

 

[RedmanSSBM]

TFW you have mad insomnia but you dream of playing Ganon anyway:

 

[PseudoTurtle]

Somewhat unrelated

You know how Falcon has the sacred combo, what's it called for Ganon when he gets his fair > punch? More importantly, is it even possible.

I somehow doubt its possible lol. Knee is electric, so does 1.5x hitstun, knee has less landing lag, falcon has a faster jump squat, travels through the air faster (and farther), and falcon punch is significantly faster than warlock punch.

Sorry

 

[Diosama]

I somehow doubt its possible lol. Knee is electric, so does 1.5x hitstun, knee has less landing lag, falcon has a faster jump squat, travels through the air faster (and farther), and falcon punch is significantly faster than warlock punch.

Sorry

So basically you need a hard read to make it work.

What's the name for it though? If there isn't one, it should be the opposite of sacred, so the Secular Combo?

 

[Swagic]

The unholy combo.

 

[-ACE-]

The unholy combo.

Unholy combo is already a thing. Stomp (they don't DI) to wizkick spike at ledge.

 

[Swagic]

So basically you need a hard read to make it work.

What's the name for it though? If there isn't one, it should be the opposite of sacred, so the Secular Combo?

Unholy combo is already a thing. Stomp (they don't DI) to wizkick spike at ledge.

Okay, in that case, how about... The profane combo? Nothing really has the same ring to it. This one seems more disrespectful than the other one, maybe we rename the old unholy combo.

 

[-ACE-]

No way, the unholy combo has been around since before @Renth was good. If you can imagine how long ago that was. He and The Cape, a very old school player, were the originators of it. Can't rename history!

 

[Swagic]

No way, the unholy combo has been around since before @Renth was good. If you can imagine how long ago that was. He and The Cape, a very old school player, were the originators of it. Can't rename history!

Holy crap. That is ANCIENT.

Is there a jab-punch combo? Because we can name that Shock-and-Awe

 

[-ACE-]

Holy crap. That is ANCIENT.

Is there a jab-punch combo? Because we can name that Shock-and-Awe

Rofl linguini was the king of that back in the day. Hilarious name lol

 

[Swagic]

Rofl linguini was the king of that back in the day. Hilarious name lol

I just thought of a name for the U-tilt edgeguard- The Wrath of God.

Strongest uncharged move in the game, right? You think you're about to survive, then NOPE

 

[spider_sense]

I'll work on reviving the Ganon video archive thread tomorrow whenever I get the chance, so it should be updated very shortly.

 

[-ACE-]

spider_sense we need to record more dittos

 

[-ACE-]

Controller question: for dash sensitivity, ability to smash-turn dash backwards, and shield drops, do you guys prefer the Japanese white controller that's been out for like 5 years or the new sm4sh ones? spider_sense uses a black sm4sh controller and it works wonderfully. The damn things are so cheap too. I already like the JP white and have owned a few... Any advice on sm4sh controllers? Looking to buy soon. Dash sensitivity is most important.

 

[Diosama]

Controller question: for dash sensitivity, ability to smash-turn dash backwards, and shield drops, do you guys prefer the Japanese white controller that's been out for like 5 years or the new sm4sh ones? spider_sense uses a black sm4sh controller and it works wonderfully. The damn things are so cheap too. I already like the JP white and have owned a few... Any advice on sm4sh controllers? Looking to buy soon. Dash sensitivity is most important.

Sm4sh sticks are pretty stiff, so as a result they're less sensitive to dashing until you break them in, and even then I sometimes don't dash when I want to. However, I don't have any experience with the white ones.

 

[-ACE-]

Sm4sh sticks are pretty stiff, so as a result they're less sensitive to dashing until you break them in, and even then I sometimes don't dash when I want to. However, I don't have any experience with the white ones.

Even if the stick is stiff, is the input threshold sensitive? I don't mind a little extra resistance. Some sticks will start a dash with less of a tilt than others. I want one of the ones that dash quickly.

I think this is mandatory for the sheik mu and all chaingrabs.

 

[tm]

Study time.

Only thing I wanted to say is...HOW COME ALL YOU GUYS GET TO TO PLAY SHEIKS THAT DON'T MASH OUT OF CHAINGRAB!? Almost every remotely decent Sheik player I play will immediately mash like their life depends on it if I as so pummel more than once or even once sometimes...smh

Some of the sheiks I play mash really well, and some don't even try. If they do mash well, just pummel once every time. Pummel -> buffer dthrow

yay more guini vids

 

[Diosama]

Even if the stick is stiff, is the input threshold sensitive? I don't mind a little extra resistance. Some sticks will start a dash with less of a tilt than others. I want one of the ones that dash quickly.

I think this is mandatory for the sheik mu and all chaingrabs.

In my experience, you need a stronger tilt to start a dash

 

[X WaNtEd X]

Some of the sheiks I play mash really well, and some don't even try. If they do mash well, just pummel once every time. Pummel -> buffer dthrow

yay more guini vids

yeah that's what i do. but when i watch people get away with three pummels, it boils my blood lol.

 

[tm]

if your opponent doesn't mash, go ham lol. tho for the sheik CG it really doesn't matter much

 

[X WaNtEd X]

Yeah but if they mash out of a cg that would've meant death, you could potentially lose your stock lol. If they don't suck, I'm not taking chances. Sheik....

 

[-ACE-]

tm knows the deal, no one gets by one pummel +buffer

 

[Pyrostormer]

In my experience, you need a stronger tilt to start a dash

I'd like to think of it as a faster tilt.

 

[-ACE-]

Well Jason told me tonight he has occasional problems dashing backwards now, although it was fine when the controller was brand new.

Price difference is ridiculous, but the price of Japanese whites changes all the time, often hitting $30-35. There's just no telling when lol.

Edit: I'll probably end up getting two sm4sh controllers and using the best one, keeping both, selling one, or returning one. $44 for 2 controllers after shipping is a steal. I'm sick of dropping chaingrabs lol.