How are we Going to Deal with the Casuals?

[Xigger]

Wow, what an elitist thread.

Ugh, why do threads like these have to exist? Really, just look at the title: How are we going to deal with the casuals? Really? Don't act so high and mighty just because some people may not play competitively.

I'm of the opinion that the conversation that this thread promotes holds no merit and shouldn't even be a thing.

But to be more... tolerable... since this is about online gameplay and not wanting to fight "noob 7 year olds," then have faith in Bandai Namco's knowledge of skill-based matchmaking, or don't play online with strangers. Play with friends,choose who you fight instead of letting the game do it for you.

 

[DevaAshera]

I still don't see why anyone has to 'deal' with casuals...just played the damned game and have fun..how hard is that?
There's no (announced) voice chat.
The Wii U has no Non-Friends Message System.
The only way you'd hear complaints is if you happened to see the posts on MiiVerse, in which case you could just report for Harassment.
This is legitimately a Non-Issue.

Elitist kids on a party game LOL

Super Smash Bros. is officially classified as a Fighting Game, not a Party Game.
I consider it as the creator of its own Sub-Genre, which I refer to as 'Platform Fighter' since, like '2D Fighter' and '3D Fighter' being named for what makes then different, its the similarities to old-school platformers that makes Smash Unique..as well as platforms in general.

 

[SmashBro99]

kk but it's a party game

It's not a real fighting game at all, which is why the actual fighting game community sees competitive smash as a joke.

 

[SS-bros14]

kk but it's a party game

It's not a real fighting game at all, which is why the actual fighting game community sees competitive smash as a joke.

How on earth is Smash Bros a 'party game'?
Also, get your facts straight. The fighting game community sees the FANBASE as a joke.

 

[Reila]

How on earth is Smash Bros a 'party game'?
Also, get your facts straight. The fighting game community sees the fanbase as a joke.

That is because this is exactly what the fanbase is. :/

 

[SmashBro99]

How on earth is Smash Bros a 'party game'?
Also, get your facts straight. The fighting game community sees the FANBASE as a joke.

Because it's not a fighting game. :D

Sorry but people who play real fighting games laugh at a party game trying to be played competitively. Get your facts straight

 

[SS-bros14]

Because it's not a fighting game. :D

Sorry but people who play real fighting games laugh at a party game trying to be played competitively. Get your facts straight

TROLL ALERT, TROLL ALERT!
But seriously though, you're obviously just kidding.

 

[SmashBro99]

TROLL ALERT, TROLL ALERT!
But seriously though, you're obviously just kidding.

An unpopular opinion is always automatically a "troll" on here xD

Nah I'm srs.

 

[SS-bros14]

An unpopular opinion is always automatically a "troll" on here xD

Nah I'm srs.

You're on a site ABOUT smash and you're bashing it by calling it a party game.
Difference between 'unpopular opinion' and 'troll'.

 

[DakotaBonez]

How to deal with the casuals?

Burn em at the stake I say!

Nah but seriously, when you're playing online, I think you will be grouped with people who have a similar "Smash Power" as you, I'm still not exactly sure how this will work, as it seems you can increase your smash power just from playing the home run contest minigame. With Namco Bandai workin on this and no doubt puttin input into the online mode, it'll probably be similar to Tekken Tag 2, which pitted you against people of a similar rank. Has any other fighting game had an online system as great as Tekken Tag 2's?
Even if your rank isn't officially displayed, it'll probably be like a hidden stat kept on your record.

So, for the first few matches, you'll be fighting some noobs, but as you progress you'll be fighting opponents of an equal skill level...I hope.

If not you can always just play with friends.

Please don't mess this up Sakurai.

 

[SmashBro99]

You're on a site ABOUT smash and you're bashing it by calling it a party game.
Difference between 'unpopular opinion' and 'troll'.

I'm not bashing it, I'm saying it's not a real fighting game. I love the game for what it is.

Calling it what it is, a party game, isnt bashing it, I love the game!

I dunno why people like you think it can only be played one way

 

[SS-bros14]

I'm not bashing it, I'm saying it's not a real fighting game. I love the game for what it is.

Calling it what it is, a party game, isnt bashing it, I love the game!

I dunno why people like you think it can only be played one way

Give me some reasons of why it's a 'party game'.

 

[Xigger]

@ SmashBro99 , @ SS-bros14

I like to think of Smash as a four-player battle royal action game. You'll notice that's a lot longer than saying it's a fighting game, because 'fighting game' is a completely different label.

http://www.gamespot.com/articles/smashing-the-definition-of-smash-bros/1100-6410475/

 

[SS-bros14]

@ SmashBro99 , @ SS-bros14




http://www.gamespot.com/articles/smashing-the-definition-of-smash-bros/1100-6410475/

It's still not a party game, though.

 

[SmashBro99]

Give me some reasons of why it's a 'party game'.

Fighting games don't feature four players fighting eachother at once.

Fighting games don't include randomness such as items, smash balls, tripping, random stage hazards

Fighting games have a health bar

Fighting games have matches decided by dropping that health bar to 0, not using invincibility to ledgehog or knocking eachother off the stage (sometimes with little to no damage on them)

Fighting games have actual combos and inputs.

Explain to me why Smash IS a fighting game again? Turning off items and choosing only stages with no randomness? Sure that makes it more skill based, and I mostly play that way. Doesn't make it a fighting game at all. Makes it a party game with all the random junk turned off.

Make a stage with walls and a bottom, put it on stamina mode with no items on, that's the closest smash gets to a fighting game.

I love smash, all of em. I'm not bashing it.

 

[SS-bros14]

Fighting games don't feature four players fighting eachother at once.

Fighting games don't include randomness such as items, smash balls, tripping, random stage hazards

Fighting games have a health bar

Fighting games have matches decided by dropping that health bar to 0, not using invincibility to ledgehog or knocking eachother off the stage (sometimes with little to no damage on them)

Fighting games have actual combos and inputs.

Explain to me why Smash IS a fighting game again? Turning off items and choosing only stages with no randomness? Sure that makes it more skill based, and I mostly play that way. Doesn't make it a fighting game at all. Makes it a party game with all the random junk turned off.

Make a stage with walls and a bottom, put it on stamina mode with no items on, that's the closest smash gets to a fighting game.

I love smash, all of em. I'm not bashing it.

So with your logic, game genres can't introduce anything new to it.

 

[SmashBro99]

So with your logic, game genres can't introduce anything new to it.

So you couldn't come up with anything? and you accused me of being a troll :D

Ofc genres can have new mechanics, but smash is in no way a real fighting game.

 

[SS-bros14]

So you couldn't come up with anything? and you accused me of being a troll :D

Ofc genres can have new mechanics, but smash is in no way a real fighting game.

Really?
I just came up with something. Smash is very much still a fighting game, just because it has some differences doesn't make it a party game.

 

[Narpas_sword]

Dear OP,

7 year olds to you are what 18 year olds are to me.


Regards,

Adults everywhere

 

[SmashBro99]

Really?
I just came up with something. Smash is very much still a fighting game, just because it has some differences doesn't make it a party game.

It's completely different is the entire point.

 

[SS-bros14]

It's completely different is the entire point.

It's still not a party game.

 

[SmashBro99]

It's still not a party game.

How so? Still waiting for some valid points from you...

 

[SS-bros14]

How so? Still waiting for some valid points from you...

If anything I'm waiting for some valid points from you. All you've stated is some stuff that makes it different from usual fighting games. It's still a fighting game.

 

[Narpas_sword]

oh drop it, next we'll be arguing about what is and what isnt punk rock.

 

[staindgrey]

kk but it's a party game

It's not a real fighting game at all, which is why the actual fighting game community sees competitive smash as a joke.

Repeating the same unfounded claim in response to an actual analysis of the subject with no counter evidence but "that's why people think it's a joke" has got to be one of the worst arguments to possibly make.

Smash is a competitive fighter that has the unique trait of being played as a party game if one so chooses to do so, through items, stage choice, custom rules, etc. If I can't change your mind on the matter, that's not really a concern of mine, seeing as to how your misguided perception and odd fixation on informing people of it on a site dedicated to the Smash Bros. competitive fighting scene can't change what it is or how the community treats it.

 

[SmashBro99]

If anything I'm waiting for some valid points from you. All you've stated is some stuff that makes it different from usual fighting games. It's still a fighting game.

You just ignore everything I said because you don't have anything good enough to say back, done with trying to debate with you thanks for the attempt.

Repeating the same unfounded claim in response to an actual analysis of the subject with no counter evidence but "that's why people think it's a joke" has got to be one of the worst arguments to possibly make.

Smash is a competitive fighter that has the unique trait of being played as a party game if one so chooses to do so, through items, stage choice, custom rules, etc. If I can't change your mind on the matter, that's not really a concern of mine, seeing as to how your misguided perception and odd fixation on informing people of it on a site dedicated to the Smash Bros. competitive fighting scene can't change what it is or how the community treats it.

You don't seem to be able to read or you missed all my posts...and no, it's a party game first, and people decide to ban items/stages to make it more skill based, it's still not a fighting game sorry.

You guys thinking smash was developed to be a fighting game amuses me...

 

[SS-bros14]

You just ignore everything I said because you don't have anything good enough to say back, done with trying to debate with you thanks for the attempt.



You don't seem to be able to read or you missed all my posts...and no, it's a party game first, and people decide to ban items/stages to make it more skill based, it's still not a fighting game sorry.

You guys thinking smash was developed to be a fighting game amuses me...

So, in other words you're surrendering? Ok, it was nice to hear you're illogical arguments.
Have fun being denial of smash being a fighting game besides the fact just about everyone says it is.

 

[SmashBro99]

So, in other words you're surrendering? Ok, it was nice to hear you're illogical arguments.
Have fun being denial of smash being a fighting game besides the fact just about everyone says it is.

How old are you, 5? You never counter argued me at all, its like talking to a rock. What a troll :D

"everyone" lol

 

[SS-bros14]

How old are you, 5? You never counter argued me at all, its like talking to a rock. What a troll :D

"everyone" lol

I'm pretty sure you're the 5 year old, seeing how I said 'Just because it has some small differences from some other fighting games doesn't make it a party game.' like 5 times it feels like.
And you even said 'everyone lol' even though no one here agrees with you.

 

[Da Black Rabbit]

*In My Pit Vioce* Here we go!

Fighting games don't feature four players fighting eachother at once.

Power Stone, Tekken Tag 1 and 2, Street Fighter x Tekken, Guitly Gear Isuka/Dust Strikers, Bleach, Naruto, Wu-Tang: Shaolin Style, Def Jam: Vendetta, Thrill Kills, Rave Master, etc... Point is, there are plenty of fighting games that allow four player combat.

Fighting games don't include randomness such as items, smash balls, tripping, random stage hazards

Injustice: God's Among Us, Jo Jo's Bizarre Adventure, Mortal Kombat Deception, Armagedon, Dead or Alive 4 and 5 all have stage hazards. Tekken has items you can equip and use in battle.

Fighting games have a health bar

Smash Bros can be played with a health bar

Fighting games have matches decided by dropping that health bar to 0, not using invincibility to ledgehog or knocking eachother off the stage (sometimes with little to no damage on them)

Again, Smash can be one by reducing health to Zero.

Fighting games have actual combos and inputs.

Z ---> A -> A -> A is a real combo input as much as Ibuki's SF3/4 Lp Mp Hp is a real combo input.
In fact, define "real combos" for me. I know Tekken has combos that only work on certain characters of a certain weight. I know street fighter has combos that only work with characters in a certain mode or set up. And I know Smash has combos that only work at a certain percent. So how are these variations so different that one is not "real"?

Explain to me why Smash IS a fighting game again? Turning off items and choosing only stages with no randomness? Sure that makes it more skill based, and I mostly play that way. Doesn't make it a fighting game at all. Makes it a party game with all the random junk turned off.

Explain to me what makes it a party game? I don't remember Mario Party requiring frame execution prowess and mind games to knock out your opponents enough times to win a match/reduce his stocks to Zero. If Smash was a "Party Game" then there would be no "Party Game" like it. I don't remember Jepordy or Wheel of Fortune require matchup knowledge or frame data.

Make a stage with walls and a bottom, put it on stamina mode with no items on, that's the closest smash gets to a fighting game.

And I can play Tekken 6 with a baseball bat equiped to my character and play the Moonlight Meadow stage. Does that make Tekken a party game because I can use items on an infinite stage?

I love smash, all of em. I'm not bashing it.

But whatever... I guess being the only party game to appear in Evo multiple time and beating out other fighting games for spots as a main tournament game is something to be proud of, right? LoL

 

[SS-bros14]

*In My Pit Vioce* Here we go!



Power Stone, Tekken Tag 1 and 2, Street Fighter x Tekken, Guitly Gear Isuka/Dust Strikers, Bleach, Naruto, Wu-Tang: Shaolin Style, Def Jam: Vendetta, Thrill Kills, Rave Master, etc... Point is, there are plenty of fighting games that allow four player combat.



Injustice: God's Among Us, Jo Jo's Bizarre Adventure, Mortal Kombat Deception, Armagedon, Dead or Alive 4 and 5 all have stage hazards. Tekken has items you can equip and use in battle.



Smash Bros can be played with a health bar



Again, Smash can be one by reducing health to Zero.


Z ---> A -> A -> A is a real combo input as muck as Ibuki's SF3/4 Lp Mp Hp is a real combo input.



Explain to me what makes it a party game? I don't remember Mario Party requiring frame execution prowess and mind games to knock out your opponents enough times to win a match/reduce his stocks to Zero. If Smash was a "Party Game" then there would be no "Party Game" like it. I don't remember Jepordy or Wheel of Fortune require matchup knowledge or frame data.



And I can play Tekken 6 with a baseball bat equiped to my character and play the Moonlight Meadow stage. Does that make Tekken a party game because I can use items on an infinite stage?



But whatever... I guess being the only party game to appear in Evo multiple time and beating out other fighting games for spots as a main tournament game is something to be proud of, right? LoL

Now let's see what dumb logic he'll use to avoid this.

 

[Narpas_sword]

this reeks of a bunch of schoolkids having an argument at lunchtime over which is better between the ps1 and n64...

 

[SmashBro99]

stuff

Smash was developed as a party game, it is a party game that people have modified with settings to make it more skill based, I even feel like I sound like a broken record at this point, but that's just how it is.

Now let's see what dumb logic he'll use to avoid this.

Another good counter argument from the peanut gallery

 

[Da Black Rabbit]

Now let's see what dumb logic he'll use to avoid this.

Just the fact that Smash Melee was a main game in Evo twice while some "legitimate" fighting games had only side tournaments should be enough...

But who cares, right? It's just a label...

 

[SS-bros14]

Smash was developed as a party game, it is a party game that people have modified with settings to make it more skill based, I even feel like I sound like a broken record at this point, but that's just how it is.



Another good counter argument from the peanut gallery

It was meant as a party game? Source?
Also, nice job dodging my other post and replying to the one that wasn't meant for you.

 

[Da Black Rabbit]

Smash was developed as a party game, it is a party game that people have modified with settings to make it more skill based, I even feel like I sound like a broken record at this point, but that's just how it is.

No, it's a four player action battle royale game. Said so by the developer in charge himself, Sakurai. Did you not click @ Xigger 's link/read his quote?

 

[DakotaBonez]

Smash Bros is developed as a party game for casuals, face it. Its a fact repeated by Sakurai time and time again. It just so happens to have more depth and a higher skill ceiling than any other fighting game and the smash community exploits the hell out of it. And really, its the community that decides what games are played competitively and the rulesets for the game, that isn't up to the developer of the game. However, it feels like they are taking the game in a more competitive direction this time around by supporting the community with the GC controllers and For Glory mode, even if it isn't exactly what they hoped for.

Why is this thread still open, it was argument fuel from the start. I mean, seriously. The title is "how are we going to deal with the casuals"
Where the mods at?

 

[SS-bros14]

Smash Bros is developed as a party game for casuals, face it. Its a fact repeated by Sakurai time and time again. It just so happens to have more depth and a higher skill ceiling than any other fighting game and the smash community exploits the hell out of it. And really, its the community that decides what games are played competitively and the rulesets for the game, that isn't up to the developer of the game.

Seriously, someone give me a link of when Sakurai said smash was meant as a party game, then I might believe you guys.

 

[Narpas_sword]

Seriously, stop arguing semantics about labelling the game.

It doesn't matter which of your pathetic arguments is 'right'.

This is like competing in the special Olympics, even if you win you're still...

 

[SS-bros14]

Seriously, stop arguing semantics about labelling the game.

It doesn't matter which of your pathetic arguments is 'right'.

This is like competing in the special Olympics, even if you win you're still...

Yeah, whatever. This argument is pointless anyway.