Data Hero-King's Council: Video Analysis

[GroundZero996]

Have another vid of me, this time vs slush, a pretty good yoshi main back from brawl

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=HcudIDx1Ink&index=5&list=PL-ZZxiBKUOzh1g8juyzEpgTB9Ffb0X83k

please critique to your hearts content!(:

edit:yeah I realize I got pretty desperate for the kill at times...also would get a lead then lose it randomly ;/ need to work on being more consistent and better defense. Also I swear that fsmash shouldve tipped in game 1 on my last stock, and game 2 I didn't think the last move was going to connect so I didn't bother doing anything..;/
Rewatching it seems like I have periods of dominant performance followed by periods of...bleh were I get opened up. Not sure if that's a Marth thing or a me thing...

Maybe it's weird to say, but I think I see too many people using Shield Breaker as a read instead of as a mind game. You can really screw with someone if you b reverse Shield Breaker, and also mix in non-b reversed shield breakers too. I feel like just pulling it out and hoping someone rolls into it isn't going to yield much. It's a pretty telegraphed move.

 

[Crawfish]

Denti came to the first Austin monthly, I wasn't able to play him sadly. Anyways, from that first match three things stood out:

1. Your spacing was off, most of your attacks where almost hitting with half of the sword inwards towards Marth at the first half of the match. Denti capitalized on this significantly.
2. You where throwing out attacks without knowing if they would hit or not. Due to Marth's end lag these may be a liability, which again Denti was able to capitalize on.
   
3. Your rolls where predictable, after getting back on stage you rolled towards Denti, you also liked to roll behind him and usually a Pikmin would be coming at you.

Anyways, that's what I was able to observe from quickly seeing the first match. I hope that helps.

what do i do about the first two. someone told me the same thing about fairs, they said i should outpatient them in the neutral. i don't understand. do i just stand there and wait? do i walk? what do i do?

 

[Locuan]

what do i do about the first two. someone told me the same thing about fairs, they said i should outpatient them in the neutral. i don't understand. do i just stand there and wait? do i walk? what do i do?

As for the first, practicing spacing is basically that. Try to practice hitting with the tip of Marth's sword when you want tippers and practice hitting just a little bit inside of that range when you want sour-spots.

For the second, it's not that you can't throw out attacks here and there, but doing it constantly makes you predictable and as I mentioned before it's punishable. Try to mix it up. Bait your opponent to take the actions you want him to make. Novaseer's trap guide can help you out in that. By patience, it means observe your opponents reactions. You can use d-tilt to poke in the neutral as well instead of using a lot of Fairs. If I recall correctly your Fairs where hitting your opponents shield a lot. This post should give you a better idea as to why hitting opponents shields can be a liability in this game.

 

[Ffamran]

TKBreezy used Marth a lot in a recent Xanadu, TKBreezy's Marth and Dr. Mario vs. TheLightLeavesThee's Mario: https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=z3ABzjwYvwY.

TKBreezy's Marth vs. Pink Fresh's Pit: https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=UpEvTFInf08.

TK Breezy's Marth vs. GimR's Mr. Game & Watch: https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=bXWWp4550Vs.

Edit: From showdowngg, Rice's Marth and Fox vs. nitro's Pikachu and Luigi: https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=iGNcKCm8dYg.

 

[Link24a]

every tournament match i see with marth has marth getting destroyed, marth dying a slow agonizing death, or the opponent dying a slow agonizing death. usually the slow agonizing deaths on either end (this also is in the case with me online). I just want to see marth possibly "dominate" for a stock or a match or a set. Any links?

 

[Locuan]

every tournament match i see with marth has marth getting destroyed, marth dying a slow agonizing death, or the opponent dying a slow agonizing death. usually the slow agonizing deaths on either end (this also is in the case with me online). I just want to see marth possibly "dominate" for a stock or a match or a set. Any links?

I moved your post to the Marth Video Thread. Here you can find links for a lot of Marth matches and/or sets.

 

[Leojm]

Wow that was a tight match I'm having some problems against a friend's yoshi myself. I am nobody to comment on matches cause Im really new to the competitive scene...but I'll say that nice use of dancing blade almost everytime you use it you hit the way is suppose to be; maybe using more tilt moves is a good thing to try after all the second stock of the first match was done by a F-tilt (and after a long time) also I noticed that you sometimes move just to put your shield on when you had the opportunity to hit with a tilt or dancing blade. Great Marth dude. I hope we can play some dittos sometime. BTW that yoshi was good too.

 

[kj22]

Got some more vids of my marth!

League of Shadows 1 Weekly 8 | Winners Round 2 | …: http://youtu.be/gdWMbAF9WP4 KJ vs OUO (Marth vs Link)

League of Shadows 1 Weekly 8 | Winners Round 3 | …: http://youtu.be/8UBl3Jk21nI KJ vs Kev (Marth vs Donkey Kong)

League of Shadows 1 Weekly 8 | Losers Round 7 | K…: http://youtu.be/qjPdVCif5wA KJ vs Valdens (Marth/Megaman vs Luigi)

http://youtu.be/ytN4h5hpsno KJ vs KPrime (very good pikachu, ranked 3rd/4th in San Antonio) Marth/Sonic vs Pikachu

Critique away(:

@ Shaya @ Locuan @ Emblem Lord @themarthboards

 

[Emblem Lord]

every tournament match i see with marth has marth getting destroyed, marth dying a slow agonizing death, or the opponent dying a slow agonizing death. usually the slow agonizing deaths on either end (this also is in the case with me online). I just want to see marth possibly "dominate" for a stock or a match or a set. Any links?

You will only see a Marth do that if he is just straight up the better player.

 

[Nike.]

KJ, did you get any matches in with Megafox?

 

[kj22]

KJ, did you get any matches in with Megafox?

I did not. We've yet to play at all, actually even in brawl history we only played one and a half matches (offline)

 

[Link24a]

You will only see a Marth do that if he is just straight up the better player.

That rarely happens in tournaments, unfortunately

 

[kj22]

That rarely happens in tournaments, unfortunately

My match above vs the link was like that

 

[koken]

Hi guys, kind of a noob here with Marth.

I'm an Olimar main and decided to give it a try with Marth. After a lot of people leaving matches and saying me that I can only play with 1 character (which was true, until some days ago).
I don't have the time (job, wife, son, etc) to practice with more than 1 character, but I wanted to try Marth because it seems very difficult (for me) to be decent with.

Thanks a lot for your help, advices and critiques =).
Vs Shulk. Does that count as a Combo for Marth?
Vs Lucina

 

[GREGORE]

Just a few new Matches of my Marth (Google Chrome for 60 FPS)

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=tjtl5kH598I

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=RITDwsEuMGM

 

[Locuan]

First time mass editing on Twitch and exporting to Youtube, so if there are errors please excuse my noobness. Anyways, a bunch of matches coming your way. I played @ Emblem Lord for around an hour and twenty minutes on wi-fi and we have some good footage. There's also some matches where lag gets the best of us both.Some of them where also corrupted You'll notice by the skipped numbers.

Playlist:

Individual Video Links:

Index | Video
1 | https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=6XcHxm331xo
2 | https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=E1M5JRpabNw
4 | https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=fDA5xvFukcs
5 | https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=2owCqwgtbY8
6 | https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=Ddjf_IGhNuk
8 | https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=i2EGpadXmRg
9 | https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=C0V8X19cWiQ
10 | https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=I7BV3cwkA6A
11 | https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=QxdceWKUuHM
12 | https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=iZm44rPsXDQ
14 | https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=ys7wFz9QORQ
15 | https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=lpOVi4sVvcQ
16 | https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=ZNEK5YbF2l8
17 | https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=EBK2fCtqeMI
18 | https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=s-6UT3bD-Vo
19 | https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=dLrbu9fZOaM
20 | https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=6rk7GH0ndxs
21 | https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=uydDyTDJrnk
22 | https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=ebUUCAjpv6g
Final | https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=adodOtAB-ZM
End | Formatting

 

[kj22]

definitely gonna watch asap

edit: just watched first match. tippers doe. oh snap customs! did yall use same customs throught? emblem lord why no dash assault?

edit 2: OH SNAP. crescent slash looking like the truth out there. lmao at EL getting 3 grabs to crescent slash, looking like a smash 4 top tier out there (; good patience at locuan to get that upsmash kill. more of that, more often. from both of you. if someones gonna keep doing the same thing, punish em for it.

also if someones running at you as marth (2:38) and you're standing still...think dtilt couldve worked if you were a little faster, but sh retreating fair or dash grab if you read the shield or maybe even sb if you're feeling ballsy works good there too. I see that situation a lot playing as marth and it makes me wish his moves had more pushback :/

edit "4": tragedy.

edit 5: mmmmmmm that sexy af pivot grab at 0:46 yesss locuan YES. at 1:23 should've sb EL, much range, much strength. @1:28, my reaction to people who say Lucina can't kill...wut 0.0. Nice upsmash at 2:07 EL!


okay enough for tonight kj 2:39 you've got class tomorrow...

in general, nice play you two! not sure if it was lag/adapting to new marth, but you both seemed a little hesitant to go in and force a reaction. didn't see much aggressive play (not saying its bad, but definitely has its merits) or offstage play. In a tourny set I could understand, but these are friendlies!(:
Also at low percent juggling upwards seems ideal, feel like marth/lucina is stronger at juggling then edgeguarding each other, Locuan was doing an excellent job of that (kills off juggles) while I'd rarely see kills from edgeguard situations from both sides.

Saw EL trying to incorporate the airdoge+aerial tech, interested in how that works out in future matches.


I'll watch the rest tomorrow hopefully!

 

[Locuan]

@ kj22 (League of Shadows Stuff)

Your link matches where pretty straight forward, you where forced in some instances to airdodge into the ground and got punished for it more often than not. Other than that, I didn't see much to criticize.

DK Match 1:
You went incredibly aggressive at the start of those matches. You pushed for hit confirms harder than you should have after getting DK of stage and got hit with DK's up-b multiple times because of it. After that your spacing was spot on and you got off stocks well. However, there where some questionable full hops on your part that where always punished by OoS up-b from DK.

DK Match 2:
Lylat, it seems to me you should have banned that jaja. Anyways, it was a great counter-pick for DK. The angles made Marth's recovery difficult. You would land on the stage and DK would rack up a bunch of damage or a back throw kill in one case because of it. Also, that first stock you kept running/dashing and you where usually punished in one form or another. Most of the times it was a down-b from DK. I suggest walking more and slowing your game down a bit in those instances. Shaya told me the same thing after we played a few matches this week. Anyways, that first stock kill? How did it feel? So good. Anyways, after both DK's and your first stocks you slowed down and started forcing him to approach more instead of to react to you. This is your area of strength from what I have seen. Anyways, on that last stock I think you might have gotten a bit impatient. There where a few times where you could have gotten the kill and didn't. For example, you had a chance to OoS an u-smash after DK hit your shield and was in recovery but inputted grab instead. Overall a good match, and a difficult one as well since it was on Lylat.

I'll get to the Pika matches later. Also, reading your reactions to the games EL and I played are great and some hilarious as well ja. Anyways, after I played EL yesterday I really want to practice Crescent Slash sets now.

 

[kj22]

@ kj22 (League of Shadows Stuff)

Your link matches where pretty straight forward, you where forced in some instances to airdodge into the ground and got punished for it more often than not. Other than that, I didn't see much to criticize.

DK Match 1:
You went incredibly aggressive at the start of those matches. You pushed for hit confirms harder than you should have after getting DK of stage and got hit with DK's up-b multiple times because of it. After that your spacing was spot on and you got off stocks well. However, there where some questionable full hops on your part that where always punished by OoS up-b from DK.

DK Match 2:
Lylat, it seems to me you should have banned that jaja. Anyways, it was a great counter-pick for DK. The angles made Marth's recovery difficult. You would land on the stage and DK would rack up a bunch of damage or a back throw kill in one case because of it. Also, that first stock you kept running/dashing and you where usually punished in one form or another. Most of the times it was a down-b from DK. I suggest walking more and slowing your game down a bit in those instances. Shaya told me the same thing after we played a few matches this week. Anyways, that first stock kill? How did it feel? So good. Anyways, after both DK's and your first stocks you slowed down and started forcing him to approach more instead of to react to you. This is your area of strength from what I have seen. Anyways, on that last stock I think you might have gotten a bit impatient. There where a few times where you could have gotten the kill and didn't. For example, you had a chance to OoS an u-smash after DK hit your shield and was in recovery but inputted grab instead. Overall a good match, and a difficult one as well since it was on Lylat.

I'll get to the Pika matches later. Also, reading your reactions to the games EL and I played are great and some hilarious as well ja. Anyways, after I played EL yesterday I really want to practice Crescent Slash sets now.

I totally agree with the slowing things down, part of me is still trying to play brawl marth, forcing reactions but unable to punish in this game. DK's upb definitely took me by surprise, I've learned how it works and will be expecting it next time I fight a dk!

Yes fsmash tipper kills feel greaaaat! On regards to that OoS grab, that was an input error. (around) I play with tap jump off, so to upsmash out of shield I have to hold R while hitting X+Up+A, and if I mess up a grab comes out ); I actually immediately did it the correct way right after the misinput in frustration and as a "this is what I was trying to do".

Always banning lylat now >.>

haha thanks, expect more today! and yeah I didn't realize Crescent Slash was so good....

 

[OmegaSorin]

So recently, I've begun playing Marth cause I've noticed I'm actually pretty good with him, so I want to start getting better with him, as such I will be placing my videos here involving him. Starting with my training against my Amiibo, and my training with my friend @WillLi

Marth (OmegaSorin) vs Amiibo Marth (Jivol) Training

Marth (OmegaSorin) vs Shiek (WillLi) Round 1

Marth (OmegaSorin) vs Shiek (WillLi) Round 2

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=7yui06Y-PoM&feature=youtu.be - Marth (OmegaSorin) vs Link (WillLi) Round 1
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=u84YLoVEHL8&feature=youtu.be - Marth (OmegaSorin) vs Link (WillLi) Round 2

I have other videos uploading right now, and will update this post with more if its not responded to by the time I have them uploaded.

 

[Icebound]

What's the easiest way to get a video from my phone to here? Youtube?

 

[Link24a]

What's the easiest way to get a video from my phone to here? Youtube?

Yeah probably

 

[Icebound]

Is down air to up tilt guaranteed at certain percentages?

 

[Shaya]

kj22

from now on, when you finish a match (friendly or tournament) you're going to have to look at your ground to air time ratios.
Your ground game with Marth leaves a lot to be desired, and in games where that was the primary focus, you were getting outpaced/boxed/footsied while committing to poor aerials that you were also punished for.
For that reason you need to be looking at staying grounded more and being confident in it.

Your DK set is a really good example of your first game being relatively easy to win with a significant emphasis on being in the air, but on lylat while DK generally kept stationary (previous game he spammed spot/air dodges instead) you struggled to deal with down-b and your ground game consisted of down tilts only (relatively well spaced down tilts mind you), but that same "ground game skillset" you had was so inadequate against Valden's Luigi. After losing your second stock you transitioned into playing grounded more, but would give up too much pressure (or showed a lack of comfort) by the dash aways (there's a long and short dash length, you always did the long dash) or rolls that seemed more "habit" than reactive or anticipated.

Against Pikachu you need perfect pivots. Shielding against Pika is generally pretty good but it needs to be in the right positions, otherwise it's too easy for a cross over or flat landing in a blind spot. Crouching can be helpful against aerial antics too. Don't forget about pivot grabs.

 

[kj22]

kj22

from now on, when you finish a match (friendly or tournament) you're going to have to look at your ground to air time ratios.
Your ground game with Marth leaves a lot to be desired, and in games where that was the primary focus, you were getting outpaced/boxed/footsied while committing to poor aerials that you were also punished for.
For that reason you need to be looking at staying grounded more and being confident in it.

Your DK set is a really good example of your first game being relatively easy to win with a significant emphasis on being in the air, but on lylat while DK generally kept stationary (previous game he spammed spot/air dodges instead) you struggled to deal with down-b and your ground game consisted of down tilts only (relatively well spaced down tilts mind you), but that same "ground game skillset" you had was so inadequate against Valden's Luigi. After losing your second stock you transitioned into playing grounded more, but would give up too much pressure (or showed a lack of comfort) by the dash aways (there's a long and short dash length, you always did the long dash) or rolls that seemed more "habit" than reactive or anticipated.

Against Pikachu you need perfect pivots. Shielding against Pika is generally pretty good but it needs to be in the right positions, otherwise it's too easy for a cross over or flat landing in a blind spot. Crouching can be helpful against aerial antics too. Don't forget about pivot grabs.

Thanks for the write up!

I'll definitely work on my ground game from now. I did feel uncomfortable in the luigi mu, and in general not sure what to do vs dash to shield which he definitely did often. On the ground I feel like anything I throw out can get rolled around/dash up shielded and punished...

"After losing your second stock you transitioned into playing grounded more, but would give up too much pressure (or showed a lack of comfort) by the dash aways (there's a long and short dash length, you always did the long dash) or rolls that seemed more "habit" than reactive or anticipated."
Can you explain what you mean? I would dash away? and whose rolls mine or his?

Pika didn't feel to bad until I lost my stock first, then it became infinitely harder (furthered by the fact that I didnt play patient)
Do you think that perfect pivotings going to be necessary for marth?

speaking of pivot grabs I finally got the range/timing down in my sets vs gnes/trela/dao in the tourny this past saturday. I felt I played the best I have in a long while.

 

[Shaya]

Your latest sets I'm now watching have improvements that I kinda covered in my two other posts, which is good
You forgot about aerial db1 against Falco off stageeeeeeeeeeee.

Against Pikachu your only means of dealing with his pressure is PP away. His immediate aerial mobility from a dash jump is really good and Marth has no moves that hit from above his head first while on the ground so you lose to aerials. PP away shield or jab, you have to compensate for that blind spot in this match up.

I guess in anticipation for dash to shields from Luigi, or heck some fireballs being shot towards you, you would just dash away (full length) and then Luigi would take more ground control (you'd do this while he's backed to a ledge :[). I was talking about your rolls. They didn't really work out against him at all.

Not too much to say about your latest tournament sets otherwise. Maybe too much shieldbreaker? Working on your movements otherwise seems to be the only noticeable area.

 

[kj22]

Your latest sets I'm now watching have improvements that I kinda covered in my two other posts, which is good
You forgot about aerial db1 against Falco off stageeeeeeeeeeee.

Against Pikachu your only means of dealing with his pressure is PP away. His immediate aerial mobility from a dash jump is really good and Marth has no moves that hit from above his head first while on the ground so you lose to aerials. PP away shield or jab, you have to compensate for that blind spot in this match up.

I guess in anticipation for dash to shields from Luigi, or heck some fireballs being shot towards you, you would just dash away (full length) and then Luigi would take more ground control (you'd do this while he's backed to a ledge :[). I was talking about your rolls. They didn't really work out against him at all.

Not too much to say about your latest tournament sets otherwise. Maybe too much shieldbreaker? Working on your movements otherwise seems to be the only noticeable area.

It felt so weird trying to hit him offstage o_O Like in brawl it was free but on town and city all the moves I was thinking about would hit him up, plus no ledgehogging so I was a little lost.

Haha its like I went back in time and played them with your new advice(;

Ew...prolly gonna go shulk vs pika then.

Hmm what should I do then? Can't shield or try to fair him, that leads to a grab/his advantage or a shield grab if I hit his shield.

Yeah probably too much sb. Marth still feels awk af, esp in close combat situations when things are tense, I tend to throw out aerials/miss punishes/straight up choke. Need more practiceee.

SH airdodge to upair was so good. Also does upair autocancel??? Felt like I had no long when I did it at times, even ledgehopped upaired a shield and was able to shield when I landed o.o

Gonna try to do more sh airdodge mixups, esp to grab. Can also see using it when I'm ledgeguarding and they do a neutral getup. Stand a rolls distance away, they do neutral getup, you SH airdodge and watch their reaction. If they roll should be able continue drifting forward then fsmash where they were or drift back and grab them, if they continue to shield either drift forward, land and grab or drift back and dtilt or drift back and sb.
^that paragraph make any sense? I say at the ledge cuz their options are so limited vs in neutral.

 

[Phoenon]

Been a long while since I last posted, but I've been putting in a lot of work at least.

Had a looong set of matches with Mr.E, I'd love any advice and "tips" on my Marth play.

 

[Foodies]

@ Phoenon Just some observations:

- Your use of usmash is very liberal and it seems like you are trying to hard read your opponent too much, especially in the early stages of the match.
- You counter often in high risk/low reward situations (usually falling in front of your opponent), I'd recommend just drifting away or even going toward the ledge in juggle situations. Marth's landing options are not that great. If you really want to land with a move use uair or the first hit of nair (assuming your opponent is in front of you of course).
- There were quite a number of times where you just double jumped straight back towards the stage after getting hit off, which is incredibly unsafe and got you killed a few times.
- Charged SB recoveries are telegraphed and I'd honestly say don't even use them at all.
- Work on your stage positioning when ledgeguarding. It felt like you took a lot of unnecessary damage from being too close to the edge.
- Work on your punishes/reacting to when your opponent whiffs. A noticeable amount of free damage opportunities were missed.

Hope this helped.

 

[kj22]

First time mass editing on Twitch and exporting to Youtube....

game 6: EL that upair kill was beautiful. Marth needs to juggle efficiently and you did it! The ending made me lol

game 8: EL there was a moment at 2:10 where you had lucina in a knockdown situation. You fsmashed hoping she'd do nothing I guess, but the better option to do there was hold shieldbreaker, since it covered 3 options instead of fsmash which got hit by her getup attack. Locuan I'd say be a little more patient/smarter on your approaches, as EL would literally stand still in place, watch you whiff attacks, the punish. Make yourself threatening by invading//threatening his personal space so he's forced to do something besides watch you. You had really nice movement and strings, while I saw more fundamentals from EL.

game 9:...omg locuan, 2 sexy pivot grabs in a row <3 I wish getting pivot grabs did more damage or something cuz man...they look great. One thing you're missing though is pummels!!! Pummel that helpless fool, every hit as marth counts and refreshing moves is sooo good for him since he relies alot on single strikes.
Aside--does db still refresh stale move que anybody know?
Also around 55 was the weirdest trade/clash I've ever seen. ftilt vs upsmash, and upsmash won? Reminds me of something similar when I upsmashed when trela's robin tried to fsmash me and upsmash won somehow...>.>
WTF HE DIED from fmsash AT 86??...does lucina trade stats with marth when she double pivot grabs or something df?
For landing traps don't forget up upsmash OoS...really good, hits both sides and hard/can kill, punishes almost anything that touches your shield.
Locuan...what is this? these landing traps...these juggles...thesebaits...so good (especially turnaround downsmash, that's my favorite tipper)
I guess Marth/lucina really does have all the tools to wreck him/herself.
You both missed upsmash punishes however, yall chose to do non-killing uptilts instead

game 10: lmao these games have me in stitches. Like what are yall thinking to each other??
Locuan: "I'm just gonna walk up slowly and ftilt"
EL: "I'm just gonna walk up REALLY slowly and jab."
*ftilt wins*

in EL and locuan's heads: ";D #marth4mains"

EL: great punishes after lucina hit your shield! definitely on point with them, in my head I had those exact same thoughts #brawlmarthmains
Don't forget about the low ceilings when delfino's transforming. You couldve gotten an upsmash kill instead of a dash grab punish if you'd remembered that.
-______-...lucina kills at 50. ohhhhhkayyyy
OOOOOOOOOOOOO great upsmash OoS emblem lord thats the kind of punishes i'm talking about >;D
I can see you think very methodically....did you play SF by any chance?

Main Ryu?;p

game 11: great opening combo EL!! :mmm good match...both of you watch your empty hops, both got punished with dashing assault as you descended. aww an sd...I liked this match alot though

game 12:...that ending combo was disgusting. AND HE MADE IT BACK

game 14: great zoning and ledge game el. got a lot of free percent off that. locuan was able to almost come back though because you were trying to force the kill. oh and for the fsmash after you ledgetrump them, you have to walk up pretty close to the edge. its better to hit with the middle of the blade then whiff going for the tipper, better to overshoot in that situation.
Don't forget marth's main punish options, upsmash, db, and grab, and the benefits and cons of using them. felt like you could've db'd/upsmash instead of grabbed for more percent and similar juggle potential

game 15: dat counter doe

16: EL...i saw that nair to fsmash setup coming...and I cried when it got PS ;/ maybe if you'd FF the nair....maybe...
nice ftilt to cover the ledge locuan
then you basked in your glory and got stage spiked -.- smh marth mains I swear..


woooooo dtilt clashes with downsmash IN WHAT UNIVERSE

nice coverage locuan! covering EL's options like a boss as you techchased him across bf.

17: okay this was one of the few game were i was like wow if that was marth it wouldve killed
lmao the beam betrayed you locuan ;p

omgawd...marth died

18: emblem lord stop being impatient when returning on stage/from being hit...you take a lot of unnecessary damage that way I noticed. actually even got killed for it.
locuan after that upair connected @1:37, shouldve sh baired instead of uptilted to continue the combo
anticlimatic ending though...

19: yaaay you finally got the ledge trump fsmash EL...got too greedy locuan

20: even nicer ledge trumps EL. dont forget you have them too locuan ahaha(;
andddd lucina kills again >.>...

AND KILLED AGAIN AT 69% WHAT IS THIS

21:....-______-...why'd lucina die at 35 from crescent slash....marth please...

22: the slow walks at the beginning of each game slay me xD
nice edgeguard EL!
and locuan turns up the heat! it's even again~that above head fsmash was beautiful, and as a marth player you would've been rewarded handsomely v.v
andddd lucina kills again

FINAL: excellent play by locuan, you're really doing well with the patience and wait and see aspect of marth, along with chaining hits fantastically! EL you had excellent ledgetrapping and guarding, try to force your opponent there more that seems to be a big strength of yours.

Finally finished watching all the videos...definitely learned some stuff. I could see da helping in some mu, but I still like have regular shieldbreaker to actually break shields...a few times I kept thinking why don't they SH sb to punish the other for shielding too much then I remembered oooo customs...

good stuff guys! sure you've only improved since then!(:

Edit: @ Emblem Lord @ Locuan get over here

 

[Foodies]

I enjoyed reading that commentary lol.

To answer your question, yes, each individual hit of DB still unstales other moves. Also Lucina's fsmash is quite strong (especially with rage) and does get kills under 100% near the edge of the stage, though some of the exhibited DI wasn't as good as it could've been (probably could've survived 2/3 of those that I saw).

 

[kj22]

More marth videos to critiqueeee

http://www.twitch.tv/dairtoshine/b/637013926 31:35 KJ vs Dao (marth vs falco), then immediately vs Trela!! (marth/sonic vs swordfighter) (haha i like how he literally jumps when I surprise him)
KJ vs Gnes (marth/sonic vs shulk) http://www.twitch.tv/dairtoshine/b/637013926 2:57:58

And thanks foodies! I shall get to your videos next(:

 

[Locuan]

Sorry @ kj22 , long day of work and then groceries. Just got back. In many of the situations I died that you pointed out I had implemented incorrect DI. Especially during that Crescent Slash at 35%. Additionally, reading your commentary was great. I'm starting to think that watching you on stream commentary would be amazing .

 

[kj22]

Sorry @ kj22 , long day of work and then groceries. Just got back. In many of the situations I died that you pointed out I had implemented incorrect DI. Especially during that Crescent Slash at 35%. Additionally, reading your commentary was great. I'm starting to think that watching you on stream commentary would be amazing .

Don't apologize for living your life ;p

Yeah I attributed a lot of the janky stuff to bad di, but wasn't 100% sure.

Commentary hmm...if I had a good partner, I wouldn't mind trying it. I think I'd get too nervous though x)

 

[Locuan]

Commentary hmm...if I had a good partner, I wouldn't mind trying it. I think I'd get too nervous though x)

I love commentary but I'm too technical so I think I get boring from time to time

 

[kj22]

Gotta find the right balance...thats why you have a partner!

 

[Vipermoon]

"Aside--does db still refresh stale move que anybody know?"

"woooooo dtilt clashes with downsmash IN WHAT UNIVERSE"

It does refresh which I don't like. Because by the time you're on the 4th hit of the combo you're doing a lot less damage than you would if the 4th hit were fresh. This affects killing, not to mention racking up damage. You do dancing blade in training mode and it deals 15 to almost 30% depending on stuff but in a real match you'll do much less. It's annoying. He's how you should have done it Sakurai: treat dancing blade where each combo number is a separate move. So 1 > 2 > 3 > 4 can all be fresh hits doing the most damage and killing at the earliest possible %. It would still refresh other moves the same way. Oh well

http://supersmashbros.wikia.com/wiki/Priority
Down tilt will easily clash with down smash. Most of Marth's ground moves will clash with most of his other ground moves because of this article. Only his specials are transcendent priority. By the way, does anyone know if Transcendental priority attacks do less shield stun? I might have heard that from somewhere and I feel like dancing blade and shield breaker would normally have more shield stun (not shield damage, that stays the same).

 

[Ffamran]

From Team Ragnarok, Charls's Lucario and Marth vs. Manny Manito's Falco: https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=4LbSQ7ZY3lA.

@ Locuan , are the Marth and Lucina boards aware of Team Ragnarok?

 

[Locuan]

From Team Ragnarok, Charl's Lucario and Marth vs. Manny Manito's Falco: https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=4LbSQ7ZY3lA.

@ Locuan , are the Marth and Lucina boards aware of Team Ragnarok?

Not that I'm aware of. Also @Charls got one of your matches linked by Ffamran. By the way, how did you place? I also saw @Excel_Zero went Shiek instead of Peach in the matches on the channel. Did he use Peach at any point?

 

[Ffamran]

Not that I'm aware of. Also @Charls got one of your matches linked by Ffamran. By the way, how did you place? I also saw @Excel_Zero went Shiek instead of Peach in the matches on the channel. Did he use Peach at any point?

I went on a linking spree... I couldn't help myself... They must be known, especially Xeon whose Yoshi almost won the recent and uploaded tournament!