Grab release -> edgeguard

[thesage]

I haven't seen a lot of people doing this even though they are put in situations where they can.

This is shown in the community combo vid done vs. a Lucas. Against Ness and Lucas, it leads to an almost guaranteed dair. Against other characaters it leads to other edgeguarding options (since they have the option of using an aerial or up-b).

Ness' running grab is especially good at setting situations like this up since he tends to slide after grabbing somebody with it.

Remember to pummel so that they don't air release.

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=vvgyX0J1usc

@7:32 instead of a bat, Kennypu could've done a running grab to grab release to dair which would've totally screwed over toon link.

I've been doing this for awhile but I haven't seen other people do it that much. It is a pretty reliable option Ness has. Just be careful against people like Marth, gaw, or MK and their gay up-bs.

 

[xoxokev]

yeah i've known about this for a while also. basically any of ness' aerials can be used to edgeguard, most notably bair, nair, and dair. another thing that i believe COULD work is a footstool. it's not guaranteed, but totally worth a shot (i've been trying to do it but haven't been able to get the footstool to connect on any human players) ehhhh :/ good job posting these helpful threads sage

 

[thesage]

I'll try one a week... I'm not as active as I used to be. I'm kinda glad we actually have a mod now...

 

[Xebenkeck]

Ya but our board has been pretty dead recently.

On topic, ya i use this every now and then but the reason i don't do it alot is because if your holding someone right there i usually fthrow rather then just let them go. I think it would depend on who your facing to determine how useful it is, say you do that to a marth, you'll get a dolphin slash in the face the moment you chase them, whereas against a lucas you can probably gimp him relativly easily when you follow him down.

 

[Meian]

I, on occasion, use this with Ike since sometimes they try to fair/nair right after and plummet to their doom under the stage (after a while they double jump back to be followed by Bat but I try to use this rarely)

Haven't tried it much else with other chars but I think there was something interesting to use it with Meda Knight but don't remember anymore. But yea, I tend to f-throw most of the time then just PK Thunder them which adds up nice damage total if they survive being off stage with me.

 

[PMKNG]

I believe I was the one who did it in the combo video, and it is a pretty good setup.

However as an edge gaurd, I havent tried it that much vs other opponents. But I'm sure if you add this into your game it'll throw your opponent off, since they're gonna be expecting a throw and may already be DIing.

 

[Earthbound360]

If they're at a very high percent and you end up pummeling for a very long time, they may see it coming. Then they may back up and airdodge+DJ to safety. Just dont b too obvious.

One quick dtilt can eat up DJs sometimes if they are too hasty DJing back on. PKF works if they back up with their jump.

 

[CarVac]

I think I once fthrew and PK jumped against a computer Ike. The PK Fire was enough to make sure It didn't come back. No recording, though.

 

[M]

I started doing this ever since I 3 stocked someone via release grabs at the edge on Jungle Japes...

 

[thesage]

Don't rely on pummeling too much at high percents. Candy taught me how to break out really quickly. He can break out after two pummels at like 110%

 

[PKSkyler]

Is that true, thesage? i find I can pummel my opponents numerous times at high percents.

 

[thesage]

Yea it is. Works for me too. Not that many people know about it though...

 

[PMKNG]

I've heard of some people talking about it, wont say anything here but I have seen it in action

 

[MrEh]

Haha, you posted a Hawaii Smash vid. ^^

Kenny and Yasha a nice guys.

 

[thesage]

Just used it as an example... That one certain time wasn't the only place I saw it. Plus there's some weird thing with DDD being released off the ledge or something... It may only work with mk though...

 

[Dajayman]

I going to start using this more than just simply fthrowing them off, or I'll mix it up abit.

 

[neomadgic]

The only thing that sucks about grab releasing is not being able to do damage. I say Fthrowing would be more efficient because it also leads to edge guarding. And if you don't get a successful edgeguard off, you at least piled up some damage.

 

[thesage]

I'm just saying it's another mixup or works very well against certain characters. Snake/Fox/Zelda are good examples of these characters.

 

[FuPoo]

Yeah usually people are too busy mashing buttons to realize where theyre body is going.

 

[thesage]

They also could accidentally do a move when they are grab released which gives you even more time to dair them.

 

[mobilisq]

Plus there's some weird thing with DDD being released off the ledge or something... It may only work with mk though...

it does work with ness

 

[thesage]

Since it does then nair would be the best option. I forgot what are the conditions to set it up, but I think you have to slide off the left side of the stage.

 

[mobilisq]

dedede needs to be near or off of the stage, and the grab has to be a dash grab

pummel immediately when the grab connects, this is what sets it off

 

[thesage]

Does it work on either side of the stage?

 

[Man of Popsicle]

Yes it does.

 

[PK-ow!]

Ya but our board has been pretty dead recently.

IM BUSY OKAY??!!?

But seriously, I think we ought to have a push to gather our most recent findings for Ness, such as this one, and make our guides more pretty. We have so much technical stuff we really ought to try to make it arranged and pretty. We should do it for newcomers but also for ourselves. To put it down on paper is to show what we have learned.

I think a tier system of advanced techs would work... there's a Ness guide, a PK tech guide (talking about all the weird physics **** that Ness has ), and then a tactical or strategy discussion thread.

Possibly more categories.


PK Cross just got.... bloated. I don't think I know half the stuff in there, likely forgot a third of it, and I just don't want to look that hard. What does that say? (No, really, what does that say? I want to know what you think. )

 

[ViceGrip]

Yea, I wish there was a list of characters you should pummel off the edge every time you are in that situation. Some characters you should just throw, like gaw/meta. I'm usually at a loss when I'm in that situation because i can't decide whether I should throw (and get dmg) or pummel and hope for a gimp/edgeguard. A technique you guys should use that's VERY effective (works irl almost everytime) is when you pummel a snake off the edge, he's going to try and jump back up almost guaranteed. Since you anticipate this, fall off w/ a fair. It'll force him to get hit during his second jump and to then use his cypher and that is as easy of a spike setup as you are going to get. If I had a video I'd put it up but I hope that describes it well enough.

 

[thesage]

This is recent for you guys? lololol

I'll try to post some more random stuff I do lol. But I mean come on, nobody has ever thought of this? Stop looking for crazy things involving some weird glitch and instead focus on stuff that we know about and applying it to different situations. Everybody here looks for things that are extremely situational and hard to do. Look for something obvious is what I'm trying to say.

 

[Ref]

No No No No No No No NOOOOOOOOOOOO!!!!!!!!!!!!!!

Sorry bad memories... Umm I one time tried this got footstooled to daired by Marth Tippered... Or did I try to grab the edge either way it was one or the other that ended in me losing the game....

Umm yeah... Bad memories...

 

[PMKNG]

well I know personally I wouldn't do that on a marth player, fair> forced stage spike seems like a likely outcome.

 

[Masky]

..........

 

[CarVac]

A c-sticked dair might do the trick, or a feather's touch on the analog stick. I should try this.

 

[Masky]

..........

 

[PMKNG]

don't you automatically fast fall when you use the c-stick? If so then thats not what you were aiming for masky so that makes sense why it never worked.

 

[Man of Popsicle]

I tried to start doing this, and grabbed my cousin (yoshi main)
released him, edgehogged him, bair stage spiked him.
It's fun. I still should do it more often though.

 

[PMKNG]

haha well its something everyone should mix up into their game, depending on the character you're vs.
I think its comparable to how DK can cargo toss you off the stage, it can lead to similar setups imo

 

[FireKirby7]

I think a nair would be better after a grab release, most likely they'll double jump to get back up, nair would push 'em away (or stagespike) and they'd lose thier double jump and have to recover with Up-B only. Edgegaurd 'em and their deeeeeeeaaaaaddd
It's best for quick recoveries like Marth, Falcon, Wolf.....

 

[PKNintendo]

Heidy hoe everyone! I used to do this all of time.
Loving new avatar Masky.