Golden Sun: The Lost Age (of) Mafia -Game Over! Indy Alex wins!

[#HBC | Laundry]

Yeah it's early D1 and I'm throwing my vote on a popular wagon.

Key point is it's a popular wagon I like.

That's how you play this game RR, I'm not just gonna hold my vote if there's a good wagon forming. More votes = more pressure on KevinM = better reaction from him = easier to catch his scum ***

Like honestly this is newbie game material

sigh

 

[Kantrip]

@Swiss/adumb hydra: Is WashedLaundry changing me to town and now displaying doubt on that again a sign that he is looking from a townie perspective? I want to say it is, but what do you think?

 

[rid****ulous]

I'm lazy and I'm openly admitting to it. It's called honesty and RR annoys me. It's not scummy to ignore people, I'm not even lying about it ffs

This post gives me icky feelings. I feel like you're just making excuses for poor play, and then trying to justify it as actually being townie by pointing out how honest you're being.

 

[Kantrip]

And I have no way to convince you that that feel you're getting is wrong.

Do you have other scum picks besides me? What are your thoughts on the KevMo wagon (ignore the fact that I'm on it if that helps you)

 

[rid****ulous]

I think it's a valid wagon, though I'm less convinced of it than my other head. I think Kevin's choice to crumb miller as opposed to claiming it is most definitely an unusual choice, but I don't know if it's telling to his alignment or not. Whether he was town or scum, Kevin thought we were all dumb enough to not see that crumb and thought it'd be hilarious to try and slip it by us. Was he wrong? Yep. Is he scum? Maybe. I intend to continue trying to read him. The crumb itself doesn't bother me as much as the idea of a miller in general.

 

[Kantrip]

How about the first half of that post? Any other scumpicks?

 

[rid****ulous]

As of this moment, no. You and Kevin are on my short list of people to keep an eye on.

 

[rid****ulous]

By which I mean, I find both of you suspicious. I suppose you could label that a "scum pick"

 

[Kantrip]

Could we be aligned?

 

[rid****ulous]

It's possible? I haven't seen anything that would lead me to believe that you couldn't be. Evidence of that nature is typically rare.

 

[#HBC | Red Ryu]

Can we just QL Kantrip and call it a day?

I would very much like to take a Marshy approach with this.

 

[#HBC | Red Ryu]

Honesty is not a town tell.

mfw.

 

[Shun Goku Satsu Rake]

Gheb is overdoing it, everyone else is wrong but it's understandable. People are perfectly justified for seeing my pre-game shenanigans as scummy. I have no way to prove to them that my intentions are what I say they are, so I'm trying to focus on other things, like voting for Kevscum.

*Everyone but Rake

fixed that for you

 

[Kantrip]

It's possible? I haven't seen anything that would lead me to believe that you couldn't be. Evidence of that nature is typically rare.

I tend to strongly disagree with this, and disconnects are one of the easiest things for me to see.

RR you're really bad, just want you to know you're tunneling

 

[Shun Goku Satsu Rake]

If one of Kantrip or Kevmo were to flip scum right now, the other one would be town I think.

Or at least they are not on the same scum team.

The same scum alignment don't try distract the thread from each other by doing equally odd/ arguably scummy things

Is it wifom ? Yes
Is it terribly unclear ? Yes
And yet, someone will understand

 

[#HBC | Red Ryu]

Nah you are my main focus ATM, please die <3

 

[#HBC | Laundry]

Can we just QL Kantrip and call it a day?

I would very much like to take a Marshy approach with this.

Nah, change that to Kevin, I haven't seen that hard of a scrumble in awhile.

 

[#HBC | Laundry]

Honesty is not a town tell.

mfw.

Heh .

 

[rid****ulous]

but Kantrip was not under the assumption that he was doing anything odd in the slightest. In fact, he was under the assumption that he was playing to his own meta.

 

[rid****ulous]

^ @Rake

 

[Shun Goku Satsu Rake]

odd to the rest of us. Not himself.

 

[Kantrip]

RR will you reassess the way you play in post-game when you find out I'm town, or are you going to continue to be this bull-headedly bad?

 

[rid****ulous]

odd to the rest of us. Not himself.

That's my point though. Your assertion that they wouldn't both do stuff that could be construed as odd, if they were aligned, does not apply. He doesn't think he was being odd, though. Therefore, they could potentially be aligned. Like I said, there's no evidence one way or the other.

 

[KevinM]

Yikes this Kantplay Pg 8 is so fkn gross I almost want to get off Laundry for it.

"Why is it bad that I threw my vote on without giving my reasoning right away? I mean ****, it should be pretty obvious: I agree with points already laid against him, it's not like the vote came out of left field. It's a good wagon."

Is there a puking my entire brains out smily?

 

[#HBC | Red Ryu]

Please tell me Kantrip is implying he hasn't been scummy.

 

[KevinM]

I think it's a valid wagon, though I'm less convinced of it than my other head. I think Kevin's choice to crumb miller as opposed to claiming it is most definitely an unusual choice, but I don't know if it's telling to his alignment or not. Whether he was town or scum, Kevin thought we were all dumb enough to not see that crumb and thought it'd be hilarious to try and slip it by us. Was he wrong? Yep. Is he scum? Maybe. I intend to continue trying to read him. The crumb itself doesn't bother me as much as the idea of a miller in general.

You must seriously doubt me if you think a blatant crumb such as that would be something I would try to "slip by" when I've Hydra'd with Ryker twice.

Once again I'll let him vouch for how many posts we scoured over together just for crumbs in the first two days on WTT but it was more so I was hoping the better players would see it and let it play out.

By calling it to light he has now allowed people to piggyback an incorrect wagon using reasoning such as Kantplay's "Oh it's a good wagon I agree with it" and allow people like WL to say "I TOO SAW THE CRUMB AND WAS TOTALLY GOING TO DO SOMETHING ABOUT IT HAD RYKER NOT ALREADY DONE SO". He has allowed players that normally would give themselves away blend in and ride on the coat tails of others

I will not stand for this filth that reeks in my towns streets

Vote Kantplay

Lets Dance kid, tell me your reasonings on my vote that you're holding so close to your chest. I don't care if you're feeling lazy and I don't care if you want to just say oh well what Swiss and Ryker said, why don't you show us you ACTUALLY have a reason to be on this wagon besides ring ring the opportunity hide myself from town scrutiny bus is here.

 

[KevinM]

Ebwop Hydra'd with Ryker and been Scum with him once.

Sorry should be more clear

 

[#HBC | Laundry]

You must seriously doubt me if you think a blatant crumb such as that would be something I would try to "slip by" when I've Hydra'd with Ryker twice.

Once again I'll let him vouch for how many posts we scoured over together just for crumbs in the first two days on WTT but it was more so I was hoping the better players would see it and let it play out.

By calling it to light he has now allowed people to piggyback an incorrect wagon using reasoning such as Kantplay's "Oh it's a good wagon I agree with it" and allow people like WL to say "I TOO SAW THE CRUMB AND WAS TOTALLY GOING TO DO SOMETHING ABOUT IT HAD RYKER NOT ALREADY DONE SO". He has allowed players that normally would give themselves away blend in and ride on the coat tails of others.

No, **** that, this isn't attacking the argument itself, it's attacking the player for his actions. It compounded the fact that you so blatantly crumbed Miller in pregame and then completely avoided it in the first few posts of the game and made it worse than it was. When you and Swiss were talking, I failed to see a legitimate counterpoint, I just saw "but i'm town doe look at ryker throw the game again." Out of like 5 or 6 posts where you were responding to Swiss/Ryker, you had one where you explained the advantages of crumbing it but not claiming it and half of it was "but i'm town doe." Referencing your play in a hydra means jack **** to me and you're not persuading me otherwise.

It took you this long to post something that wasn't bull****. Please die.

 

[#HBC | Laundry]

Lemme finish editing this paper, then I'm going hard on that Kevin/Swiss exchange.

 

[rid****ulous]

As much as I hate it, Kevin's play makes perfect sense to me. This is something he would do.

 

[rid****ulous]

In fact, I think this is similar to something Swiss did in a recent game.

 

[#HBC | Red Ryu]

Nah, change that to Kevin, I haven't seen that hard of a scrumble in awhile.

Maybe, I'm, not sold on Jim being scum while doing that. I don't like what he did either, but I'm not sure it is a scum tell for Kevin, me joining has benefits, tells me about a lot of players including Kantrip.


My head is thinking about how he handles millers and if past games are influencing his Swiss and Ryker interactions that much.

 

[#HBC | Laundry]

As much as I hate it, Kevin's play makes perfect sense to me. This is something he would do.

DOES IT MAKE IT RIGHT ?

 

[KevinM]

No, **** that, this isn't attacking the argument itself, it's attacking the player for his actions. It compounded the fact that you so blatantly crumbed Miller in pregame and then completely avoided it in the first few posts of the game and made it worse than it was. When you and Swiss were talking, I failed to see a legitimate counterpoint, I just saw "but i'm town doe look at ryker throw the game again." Out of like 5 or 6 posts where you were responding to Swiss/Ryker, you had one where you explained the advantages of crumbing it but not claiming it and half of it was "but i'm town doe." Referencing your play in a hydra means jack **** to me and you're not persuading me otherwise.

It took you this long to post something that wasn't bull****. Please die.

Do us a favor and stop posting, you're literally dumbing up the thread. If you're saying that it's taken me this long to post something that wasn't bull**** you clearly haven't been reading.

You're emotional playing has been noted though and I'm curious as to why you have to throw a tampon fit for the last two pages... are you upset you were an early lynch candidate and now want to make absolutely sure not to swing back into the spotlight.

You've had multiple posts from me on my actions, you're literally trying to create a circular argument where you can become more and more theatrical with your PASSIONATE arguing and PLEASE DIE, and WAH WAH WAH but you're not accomplishing any legitimate things right now. Hell even PJB is taking a solid stance and he hasn't been at the forefront of the argument

What exactly are you even doing?

"Going hard on the me vs Swiss exchange"

Don't give yourself such a tough homework assignment my dude, I think there's a total of five posts that might contain less then 200 words, you go HARD on those and come back and spit the some thing you've said the last two pages.

 

[#HBC | Laundry]

I get that Kevin's likely to do this as town or scum and it's typical of Kevin's play, that's not the part that really set my flags off. It's how he responded to the pressure.

Kevin's immediate reaction was to start ****talking Ryker and Swiss, saying how they'll throw the game again. To most players, that's just ****talking. To me, seeing a skilled and intelligent player, like Kevin, resort to baseless mudslinging like that reeks of defensiveness. Calling someone out for the Miller crumb is hard to come back to, but I agree with Swiss' response that it comes off as salvaging town points. Worse yet, a simple explanation without the namecalling might've been the right choice. Had he posted this first and foremost:

Two reasons

Everytime I outright claim miller I'm scum just trying to outplay town from D1 and think it fun.

And two had it not been pointed out I could bait a fake cop or track claim later if scum tried to get cute and use my crumb from earlier as a point.

More so reason one, in fact Ryker can attest to reason one because he's been scum with me and the first question I asked him on the phone (after dropping hella money baller swag style) was if I should just claim miller. There are also I believe two games where I've just claimed miller in my first post TMNT being one of them I'm sure.

Without referencing ****ty self-meta reliant upon another player who happens to be calling him scum at he time, things would be totally different. Instead, we get this:

Hey look it's going to be the Swiss/Ryker continue to throw games show.

I didn't want to have to ignore both of you, I really thought better of you this game Swiss.. thought you could be somebody.. thought you could be a contender. BUT you're a nobody.

And it just looks terrible, because it's not directly dealing with the argument, but insulting the members on it simply because they're opposing him.
Which is why I find lines like these ironic:

Flipping at Swiss? Hardly, I don't flip in a mafia game, I don't react out of emotion, it's a shame he's on a wrong path but I'm not going to flip at him for it.

because his response comes off as very emotional and aggressive, even if he doesn't ultimately vote Swiss

 

[#HBC | Laundry]

Do us a favor and stop posting, you're literally dumbing up the thread. If you're saying that it's taken me this long to post something that wasn't bull**** you clearly haven't been reading.

You're emotional playing has been noted though and I'm curious as to why you have to throw a tampon fit for the last two pages... are you upset you were an early lynch candidate and now want to make absolutely sure not to swing back into the spotlight.

You've had multiple posts from me on my actions, you're literally trying to create a circular argument where you can become more and more theatrical with your PASSIONATE arguing and PLEASE DIE, and WAH WAH WAH but you're not accomplishing any legitimate things right now. Hell even PJB is taking a solid stance and he hasn't been at the forefront of the argument

What exactly are you even doing?

"Going hard on the me vs Swiss exchange"

Don't give yourself such a tough homework assignment my dude, I think there's a total of five posts that might contain less then 200 words, you go HARD on those and come back and spit the some thing you've said the last two pages.

 

[rid****ulous]

DOES IT MAKE IT RIGHT?

What do you mean by "right"?

You mean, do I think it's actually what he did, and not that he's trying to backtrack?
Yes, I think it was a real gambit, not an elaborate backtrack.

Do I think it makes him town?
Again, maybe. I'm still reading him, but my previous concerns about him are mostly alleviated. I was wondering why Kevin would do something to draw so much negative attention to himself as either alignment. Now I know why.

 

[#HBC | Laundry]

For real Kevin, go back to bed until you call the tantrum off.

 

[#HBC | Laundry]

What do you mean by "right"?

You mean, do I think it's actually what he did, and not that he's trying to backtrack?
Yes, I think it was a real gambit, not an elaborate backtrack.

Do I think it makes him town?
Again, maybe. I'm still reading him, but my previous concerns about him are mostly alleviated. I was wondering why Kevin would do something to draw so much negative attention to himself as either alignment. Now I know why.

I'm still confused as to why you believe it was an attempt to call attention to himself. Usually crumbs are the exact opposite of that.

 

[#HBC | Laundry]

Maybe, I'm, not sold on Jim being scum while doing that. I don't like what he did either, but I'm not sure it is a scum tell for Kevin, me joining has benefits, tells me about a lot of players including Kantrip.


My head is thinking about how he handles millers and if past games are influencing his Swiss and Ryker interactions that much.

Jim being Kevin, right?

I'm failing to see the way to play it though. Regardless of how he's handled miller claims in the past, I still think he should've or needed to claim it instead of just posting a stupid crumb about it that multiple people caught anyway. It seems pointless when going about it that way and even more sneaky/underhanded to do it like that.

My metadata is **** right now, which sucks because I'm not privy to the same type of "would this player do this in this alignment" questions because I simply won't be able to answer them. Would Kevin do this as town or scum? I don't ****ing know, I haven't really played with the guy in over a year.