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Golden Gate Suicide Net : OMG Pie

mountain_tiger

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But either way, it's well documented that many suicides are done on impulse. Removing opportunities to act on those impulses is only logical and there isn't any evidence to support the claim that such people will kill themselves anyway if you stop them jumping. I think the second study does state that less people killed themselves by jumping overall (though it is a small sample size). It doesn't matter if it only reduces male or female deaths - less people killed themselves.
[COLOR="#FFCBA"]Suicide attempts are rarely done on impulse. Those people have almost certainly had such feelings for a considerable amount of time, and come to the conclusion that they don't want to live any longer. If somebody does do that sort of thing on impulse, then they're unlikely to be able to cope with stresses and changes in life, thus meaning that suicide is a wise choice anyway, because life is full of stress and change.[/COLOR]

Have you ever noticed there's a limit to the amount of paracetamol/aspirin you can but over the counter? The reason is to prevent people buying overdoses to kill themselves. People also claimed back then that a determined individual would just go to another shop to get themselves the lethal dose; you are just inconveniencing everybody else! But the statistics didn't lie - suicide rate most certainly did go down because killing yourself by overdose was no longer easy.
[COLOR="#FFCBA"]Hasn't overdosing been proven to be not as effective as other methods? I remember seeing this study somewhere which stated that more women attempt suicide, but more men do so successfully. This is because women generally choose to overdose (ineffective due to vomiting and other body mechanisms), whereas men choose more violent methods such as shooting themselves (which is basically a 100% chance of death if you shoot the right place).

Your argument seems to be based on the idea that suicide is always wrong, regardless of circumstances. But few people would say that matters such as abortion are always wrong. Many people say that it should be available on demand (pro-choice), whereas others would say that, while not necessarily on demand, it should be allowed if the circumstances justify it. Obviously you do get people who claim abortion is always wrong, but those people are generally in the minority in the developed world.

The same applies to suicide. Like abortion, I believe that it should be the choice of the person regarding what they do with their life. Should that involve killing themselves, then so be it. [/COLOR]
 

SuperBowser

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jolly old england. hohoho.
I've made no such argument so I'm not going to respond to it. People originally said the net will not reduce deaths. I disagreed. You are putting words in my mouth to make an easier argument for yourself.

And I don't really know what you are talking about with the women/men thing. It's a fact that limiting the amount of paracetamol and aspirin that one can buy over the counter reduces the number of overdose related deaths, and overall deaths due to suicide.


http://cat.inist.fr/?aModele=afficheN&cpsidt=1898580
75% of attempted suicide patients are still alive after 10 years and only 25% had a repeat attempt. So obviously many can cope with ''stresses and changes in life''. You are just stating your opinions as fact.
 

Veril

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A physical wall can't stop a mental missile.

Wrong. Walls are extremely effective at deterring suicide attempts. If people are forced to spend the time getting around the wall, they are also forced to think. A 10-second pause is huge considering how impulsive the majority of suicides are. Reading this blog has really frustrated me since you all clearly know very little on how suicide prevention actually works. Personally I don't think you can put a price-tag on someone's life either.

Suicide attempts are rarely done on impulse.
BS statement is BS.
 

SuperBowser

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jolly old england. hohoho.
Well at least somebody agrees with me :D

Suicide and depression is one of those topics that everyone has an opinion on, but I think surprisingly few actually understand or are aware of the true details behind it all. (I do think El Nino knows it well).
 

mountain_tiger

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BS statement is BS.
[COLOR="#FFCBA"]It's rare for someone to randomly decide 'I know, I'm going to kill myself today'. Often, such thoughts are held in for months, sometimes years, during which time they would be able to decide which suicide method would be the best. If someone's been depressed for three years or so, an extra ten seconds isn't going to make a huge difference.

Of course, there are occasions where someone is driven to suicide on the spur of the moment (e.g. grief over a recently deceased relative), but such suicides aren't as common.[/COLOR]
 

X1-12

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Southampton, UK
[COLOR="#FFCBA"]It's rare for someone to randomly decide 'I know, I'm going to kill myself today'. Often, such thoughts are held in for months, sometimes years, during which time they would be able to decide which suicide method would be the best.
.[/COLOR]

there is normally this, and then a specific event that pushes them over the edge which does kinda make it on impulse


oh and also the net is just silly
 

El Nino

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Perhaps I'm biased because I've met and spoken with patients that attempted suicide. There was one woman who was diagnosed with HIV a long time ago. The day it happenned, she left the doctor's office in tears and took it as a death sentence. On her way home she waited at a train station. There was no barrier at that station. She didn't plan to kill herself that day, but when she saw the trains coming and going she seriously considered it. Luckily for her, another man saw her and noticed something was wrong. The simple act of asking ''Are you ok?'' stopped her and she honestly doesn't know what would have happenned otherwise that day.

Of course, the next few years were very difficult for her as you can imagine but she's alive. Now she's living a full life with a family and her own children.
Yeah, I'm biased too. A friend of mine snorted heroin.

A physical wall can't stop a mental missile.

Wrong. Walls are extremely effective at deterring suicide attempts. If people are forced to spend the time getting around the wall, they are also forced to think. A 10-second pause is huge considering how impulsive the majority of suicides are. Reading this blog has really frustrated me since you all clearly know very little on how suicide prevention actually works. Personally I don't think you can put a price-tag on someone's life either.
I know it's hard to put a price tag on someone's life, but if the state goes bankrupt on construction projects, then a lot of people are going to suffer for it.

I am aware of two main types of suicidal tendencies that come from: 1) people who have hit rock-bottom emotionally, and 2) people with clinical depression. I think we're stepping all over each other's toes because some of us learn towards one over the other when we think about "suicide." This is complicated by the fact that those in the first category are not considered as those who really want to die because it includes people who may declare that they want to kill themselves but not do it. It includes people who have just gone through a traumatic event, and not knowing how to deal with it, may behave irrationally. If they were on a bridge at the moment, they may throw themselves off of it out of impulse. It's like "temporary insanity," a moment of extreme anger or sadness. But if they hold out for a few moments longer, they'll most likely reconsider, and maybe they'll never do it again. This group is more easily deterred than the second.

The second group suffers from a neurological condition. That is what people mean when they talk about physical barriers vs. mental drive.

The two groups get lumped together, and it makes any discussion on suicide difficult because both groups have different root causes for their behavior, yet we try to discuss them in one breath, under one label. When the word "suicide" enters the conversation, I think of the second group. That's my personal bias. And I think it's because, for the first group, the suicide attempt is not the main issue. The events leading up to it are, though preventing the suicide remains of obvious interest to the patient.

For the second group, there are very few events to analyze. The problem is rooted in the neurology leading to the suicidal tendencies themselves.

Regardless of my bias, I would guess that physical barriers are somewhat effective on the first group. I'm just discouraged that more can't be done for the second group, that's all.
 

peeup

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Heartless as it sounds, if somebody wants to commit suicide, why stop them? Because of the economic recession, more people are afflicted with suicidal depression (lack of job, no money, etc.). If I was going to commit suicide because my government wasn't able to maintain the economy of the nation, I'd be pretty ticked off if they thought it would be a good idea to waste millions(?) of dollars on a net that probably won't even prevent most suicides in the first place. If someone commits suicide, it is the result of lots of premeditation and thought, and if they know that they can't kill themselves in one place, they'll just do it in another. If whoever is funding this net really wants to lower the suicide rate, they should either try to help the economy (hell, I don't know how they would) or have people walk up and down the bridge and TALK PEOPLE OUT OF IT. There's a guy in that place in japan that saves hundreds of lives a year because he acts as a friend to people who want to kill themselves.
 
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