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Geno (♥♪!?): Return of the Starsend Savior

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Megadoomer

Megadoomer

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riggsbass said:
Wrong place, wrong time. Nobody asked for you to rain on their parade. This is a positive support group, not a negative speculation ****show. Hit up GameFAQs if you're trying to ruin someone's day. These people are entitled to come up with their conclusions, they're a lot less insane than others and you don't have any position to be some kind of devil's advocate trashbag. You must be a really warm and welcome guy off the internet, too.

I'm excited at the possibility of the character. If I wanted to trash those who felt the way I do, I would find another outlet.
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Like I said earlier, it's possible to disagree with someone while still being civil about it. You can point out that wynn has a history of being unnecessarily negative (to put it mildly), or point out flaws in his arguments, but calling someone a "devil's advocate trashbag" crosses the line into flaming territory. Try to avoid personal insults when discussing this sort of thing.
 
Franco Geno

Franco Geno

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Mastadoom88 said:
Just want to say I adore that Galileo quote so thank you for sharing. I so agree with this post. There's a lot of vitriol, and particularly with this BTFO culture that is not just confined to video games unfortunately.

One look at Gamefaqs and I told my gf and was literally crying just because I couldn't believe the sincere malice people have because they dont want us to get our boy (and its unfortunately not only Geno).

I was here for all the things that have gone down and I also want to say I'm so sorry @Fatmanonice for the grief this all has caused you. Just conversing with you here, regardless of Geno bias, you seem like another Eric I'd have beer with irl. Glad you're sticking it out here with us. I'm a 31 year old man myself.

Also so the mods dont thought police me for off topic/punishing good people, I must say I'm very confident about Geno. And I think he will still have a mushroom icon, but he'll have the SMRPG victory song for his win screen.

Um also, sorry for the length, I have no idea how to condense via spoiler tags. Bless you all.
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I'm so glad that we have people like you on this thread pal

ActualGarbage said:
>Female Geno
I'm sickened, but curious.
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Oh no what have i done, those artists are gonna have a hell of a good time

EarlTamm said:
If I was good at drawing, I would try.

Don't know why it would happen like that. In the case of Seth, I think it's because he is now using a doll body and has a certain view on Juri due to her canonically beating him. Geno would probably only ever have a female looking body if it was the strongest body he could get. I mean, he did originally select the Geno doll because it was the strongest amongst the Mario, Bowser, and Peach dolls, not for some other preference.

Can you imagine if he did select one of the other dolls though? That would be awkward down the line.
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It's alright, i suck at drawing too ^^

Yeah for Seth it makes sense but not that much for Geno unless he was more quick or strong in that form, and i think that if he picked a different doll he would be less powerful but interesting to see how the other characters would react to him having that appearance in the story
 
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Franco Geno said:
1. Geno gets in Smash but instead of an alternate costume we get this, Bass Cloak Geno. (can anyone here drawn that? that would be great)

2. Interesting, instead of turning into a cannon he can change into a female version of himself just like Seth
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In case you couldn't tell by my name, Mega Man Battle Network is my favorite Mega Man. I might be a lame artist who draws with a mouse in his free time, but I have what it takes to handle this.
genoexe.png


fabric is hard to draw, lads.
 
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ForsakenM

ForsakenM

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So guys, it's theory time, and I grabbed my previous quotes about my theory about how Sakurai and Co. were WAY too ahead of schedule for them not to be planning something else (a stance I had taken since July) as well as my most recent theory of how I believe that there is a metric crap-ton of evidence that support the second wave of DLC being dropped into Sakurai's lap in early 2019 (as early as January) and thus they have been being negotiated for and worked on for a while now. Here are those posts for you to enjoy and use to catch up in case you want to have an idea of where I'm coming from as I'm not going into big details about them here.
ForsakenM said:
Fun fact: Joker was likely mostly done before the February Direct. In fact, he was likely mostly done before January. This is why the DQ Crew and B&K are in such finished states to have reveal trailers: most of the wait time between Joker's announcement and his release was likely spent on making DQ Crew and Banjo to have them presentable for E3. This mean that those characters are now in Joker's boat back in Dec/Jan: they are mostly done, meaning that time can now be spent on #4 and #5.

Think about it: development on Joker started early November once the game went gold. It was early Dec when he was announced, close to a full month of development time with a team focusing on mainly just the Fighter's Pass. Come January it had been two months, Joker was likely in a polishing state at this point. The reason we only got an idle stance is likely because that was the most polished portion and it didn't reveal any gameplay, not that he was barely worked on. This means March and April were likely just some small touches and moving on to DQ Crew and B&K to have them ready for E3 reveals. This would give them between 3-4 months to make a character, which makes complete sense since they have lots of cash and a team dedicated to just them instead of an entire game. Remember, this is Sora Ltd and Sakurai, not GameFreak who can't be efficient and is incompetent.

It is totally possible to see more character reveals for the Fighter Pass this soon. If it follows a similar pattern as what I described above, then Fighter #4 could have started work in Late April/Early May. However, it could also mean we will have a another gap before another reveal because they were working on two at once, but since Hero comes out soon and Banjo & Kazooie look very much mostly done, we could get a definitive release date on B&K at EVO (probably not, since Nintendo is enjoying their Shadow Drops) or Fighter #4.

I mean, look at Piranha Plant. It was essentially finished in that Nov Direct, right? So they had to polish it up and test it and make small tweaks. That takes about a month or so of time, and then we got it late Jan. Just because a character is mostly done or completely done doesn't mean it has to release immediately afterwards. DQ Crew and B&K can be mostly done or completely done by now, and we are just waiting for the scheduled release date, and meanwhile Sora Ltd is working on Fighter #4. This means that they could mostly done with Fighter #4 even as we are typing here wondering when Hero will drop.

EDIT: Another Fun fact, mostly Fun Theory though: if they are planning more content like modes and maybe bonus characters, working at this kind of a pace makes even more sense. You would have most of the crew working on characters to have them mostly complete before their scheduled reveal, then have some working on Stage Builder or Home Run Contest or Mii Costumes or what-have-ya which can be finished much more quickly. They can move people around as needed, but if enough people are available and are working on mostly characters (since Sakurai is very particular about giving us the absolute best presentation of the characters possible), it wouldn't be too far fetched to say that they could maintain this kind of pace. It also wouldn't be too far fetched to say that if they are aiming to have characters done this quickly, it could be because there is more coming than we even have any idea of.

Nintendo dropped the DLC on them, they could be seeing early sales predictions and pre-orders and already thinking of dropping more on them.
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ForsakenM said:
Don't get me wrong, that could absolutely be it, but...

Sakurai likes his little surprises. He doesn't troll us very often or for very long, but he does like to hit us with surprises because he's proud of his work and his game. I feel like them simply being 'ahead of schedule' is the least likely thing because, to have been THIS ahead of schedule, they would have had to work CRAZY hard. I mean, Plant was mostly done in Nov. Joker was announced with no gameplay at all in Dec, and then released in April which means my older posts saying that he was likely done somewhere in Jan-March is likely correct. Thus that wait time was to work on having both Hero and Banjo done enough to reveal both for E3, which was June 11th. Suddenly, we get Hero at the end of July and now Banjo in early Sept? This would mean that not only Hero but also Banjo was mostly done and that what we can presume to be a SNK/KoF character has been worked on since...June? Maybe May? We will know for sure if we get #4 revealed in the Sept Direct but jesus lord almighty, THAT is an INSANE pace just to be 'ahead of schedule'.

This is why I feel like there is more of some sort.

Also remember that we still have 6 more modes coming to Ultimate, and that each mode thus far has been released alongside the character...but we only have three more characters left...

Really makes ya thonk!
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ForsakenM said:
Hey guys, what normally takes my time this evening has been cancelled. Thus, it's speculation time!

So a buddy of mine and I were shooting the **** and we starting talking about Smash speculations and how crazy things have been for Ultimate. We started talking about things we were confident in and I spoke up about when I was saying that DLC was too ahead of schedule for nothing to be happening. For those of you who weren't around for that, here's the proof.
I find it funny that I had this stance since July and earlier, but two days later after I argued for my position again, Banjo & Kazooie were released and their gameplay breakdown confirmed my theory into fact.
Anyway, to sum up that theory as it's integral to this one, I basically argued that :ultpiranha: was done roughly around the time we knew about it and was just being polished and that :ultjoker: was more than likely completed in January or February. This allowed enough time to finish :ulthero: and :ultbanjokazooie: by E3 and that both were in the polishing stages or fully completed by that time.

So it was at this point that this friend and I started thinking about how crazy ahead they were and then I thought...wait a minute! This would explain a lot about future DLC! So, allow me to explain my theory.
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So now that we know for a fact that the DLC characters are very much completed over a month in advance before being released and that the time between completion and release is dedicated to small things like finishing touches and making sure all the other content that comes with them is finished but that MOST of that in-between times is dedicated to the next character to have them ready and keep up this breakneck pace...let us apply this to the post-pass DLC.

So we've all heard that the Fighter's Pass sold mind-gasmingly well, right? Enough to make the decision to have more of it before the pass was even done, right? So, let's apply some logic real quick to see when the decision for more DLC would have been made...

Now some people may argue that most of the Fighter's Pass sales came from the :ulthero:/:ultbanjokazooie: announcement, but I beg to differ. Think about it for a moment: the E3 Direct was on June 11th and the announcement of more DLC was on September 4th. Yet the information we got about the success of the Fighter's Pass was just recently in November, right? When you consider that and how ahead of schedule Sakurai and Co have been all year, wouldn't it make more sense for the decision for more DLC to have taken place even earlier than June or July? Also, as some people have suggested, many people bought the pass before the first announce at the VGAs. So, my theory is that the decision for more DLC was made as early as January or February, around the time Joker would have been finished.

So we all know for a fact that a crapton of people went out and pre-ordered the Fighter's Pass with their copy of Ultimate the minute the November Direct ended, right? That's just obvious, but also Joker's reveal at the VGAs most CERTAINLY made people grab the pass in droves when they went to pick up the game. That surge of pass pre-orders and then pass purchases made Nintendo A LOT OF CASH! Enough for Nintendo to tell Sakurai to be like King of Skill and 'DO IT AGAIN!' and I believe this happened in January after we got numbers on how stupidly well the game sold. This would mean that Nintendo stopped by the office and told Sakurai that they wanted more DLC characters in January or early February and thus this is where the breakneck pace for the DLC came from. If you think about it, being done RIGHT at Feb 2020 would be a perfect pace to make sure nothing is rushed, right? Getting five characters done in a little over a year is a pretty fair pace...but when you need to make even more characters after that?

This means that more negotiations are in order and meetings must be had and terms must be agreed to and companies need to have their input put in...that takes a LOT of work and a LOT of time...and so far, Sakurai hasn't promised us any content or made any announcements until it's been either mostly decided and being worked on or has been decided and is being worked on. So, negotiating and planning meetings and talking with other companies and accepting terms and making the basic designs for new characters while also making the ones you already agreed to? That explains a breakneck pace as there is no longer time to take things easy or you won't be able to meet your Feb 2020 deadline.

Now, think about this. With my theory suggesting that more DLC was approved by Nintendo in January, this means that negotiations started earlier this year. That would mean that at some point this year, it's likely that characters were agreed upon and starting being worked on, right? Well, when did we get the announcement of more characters? September 4th. This means that at least one single characters was negotiated for prior to September by Sakurai's standards, right? Now when you consider all the names being tossed around that no one has been able to say they aren't in the game but rather they aren't the fifth Fighter's Pass character and insiders are saying they've heard more than one character's name being tossed about...it would seem that more than one character has been successfully negotiated by this point and time. When you ALSO consider that many of these names have been tossed around since earlier in the year, it supports both multiple characters being successfully negotiated for as well as the decision being made earlier in the year.
Now, for the bold claims: I believe that at least two characters were successfully negotiated for or very nearly so as early as E3. So we've already established that the talks for more DLC happened very early in the year, possibly before even Joker was finished in February. With that in mind, you remember during E3 when the website glitched and showed those two extra character slots?


What if it wasn't just a website glitch that could be dismissed, but it was that those two slots were purposely added at that time because two more characters were in the works but when they updated the website for :ulthero:/:ultbanjokazooie: there was a temporary mishap and we saw something they weren't ready for us to see? Sure, this is speculation, but think about the accidental Bloody Tears leak and how Nintendo leaked their own new modes in their commercials on their YT channel and how Nintendo of Spain leaked that we were getting an SNK character. Nintendo isn't perfect and makes mistakes, so it could be just as likely that these extra spots were put in for more characters but that we were never suppose to see it until they were ready to announce it.
Now, here are some more things that supports these claims of post-pass characters being negotiated for and worked on earlier in the year: :ultjoker:'s gameplay breakdown, the large gap in time between :ultjoker:'s reveal and Joker's release, the recording time-frame of the gameplay breakdowns for :ulthero: and :ultbanjokazooie: as well as the teaser footage for :ult_terry:, and lastly Sakurai's own statement that it takes a lot of time to do translation for the gameplay breakdown videos.

You ever noticed how odd it is that :ultjoker:'s gameplay breakdown was so over-the-top, had all the voice actors involved, and was generally just better production value overall and how that was completely lost for the rest of the Fighter's Pass? Sure, Sakurai said there were budget constraints and I believe him, but what if it was also because Joker's was done in advance and was being created before Sakurai was told to do more DLC characters? What if it was less about budget and more about time constraints because now more characters need to be negotiated for and it was just easier to manage Sakurai doing a gameplay breakdown himself and sending it in to be translated rather than pulling all the stops for big budget breakdowns? Doesn't that make a lot of sense? This also plays into Joker being revealed at the VGAs but not being released until April. Imagine that you have to get two character reveals ready for E3 but you also need to head to a couple of meetings to negotiate these other characters and you have to make sure you hit that Feb 2020 deadline or even earlier. Wouldn't it make sense to take the extra time to make those negotiations and get them done and out of the way earlier in the year? Wouldn't it make sense to cut the extra production of the character gameplay breakdowns to be able to negotiate for more characters?

Now think about :ulthero: and :ultbanjokazooie:. They were both revealed in June and they had both of their videos recorded within the same week. That sounds like trying to maximize time to me to keep up with the scheduled deadline but also to afford more time for more negotiations. :ult_terry: fits this too: remember how completed he was with just his teaser footage, but how we never got the gameplay portion of his reveal because it wasn't ready in time, so instead the put in that cute timeline reflection for home consoles that ended on the Neo Geo? Doesn't that sound like a combinations of Terry not being fully ready for his reveal as well as trying to afford more time for more character negotiations? "Oh, well every other character other than Joker who wasn't even remotely close to being done had a gameplay reveal trailer...but Terry isn't ready enough for that extensive of a reveal and I have meetings scheduled for #8 throughout the month...how about we change up Terry's reveal but let them see the full trailer later when we go over his gameplay breakdown?" Once again, speculation, but it seems VERY plausible.

Lastly, Sakurai informed us that the Terry video was made a month in advance because of editing and translation, which sounds fair to me...but we all know that a good editor could have that video ready in a week or less and I think a translator could dub over it in probably two weeks? Regardless, having gameplay breakdowns done well enough in advance would be a way to afford more time for more character talks.
So now I've implied that both the decision for more DLC was made early on in the year and that negotiations could have easily already been completed for some character by the middle of this year. Now, why is specifically the middle of this year important? Well, it's in regards to a certain blue puppet boi...

:ulthero: and :ultbanjokazooie: likely had both of their gameplay breakdowns recorded sometime in late May to early July. We would know this because they were essentially 100% complete in their reveals as well as Sakurai stating that the longer :ult_terry: breakdown took about a month to prep for us. This means that the teaser footage of Terry was at that level of completion around the same time, and Terry's reveal didn't have any gameplay. Right after that announcement of Terry, we got the announcement of more DLC characters. This to me is more proof that the decision for more DLC and the negotiations for more characters happened very early on, but what I find interesting is what this means about Hero.

So, as we all know, Geno's costume didn't come with :ulthero:. We all worried it easily could, but it didn't. Now, knowing that Hero was recorded only a mere couple days before :ultbanjokazooie: and that :ult_terry:'s sneak preview footage and his reveal before that ties him into that time-frame while also suggesting possible changes to the process to make room for more negotiations...what if Geno was intended to come with Hero originally, but these early negotiations came into play and one of the characters Sakurai managed to nab was Geno? What if one of the reasons everything got so breakneck pace was that Sakurai went back to Square to get Geno and dealing with Square tends to have it's issues (though apparently, not nearly as bad as we thought, according to information about how the development process went with Hero) and it was a rush to see if Sakurai could get him or not because Hero was #2 and Geno's Mii costume was going to return with him, so it was a race to see if Sakurai could get him or not before Hero's gameplay breakdown? This would also match up with there being more than one character negotiated for by E3 and therefore matching up with that website glitch.

Here is some more interesting timing for you. :ulthero: had their gameplay breakdown in July and was recorded around the time-frame of May through July. What else happened in roughly in this time period? Apparently, the copyright claims that took down Beware The Forest's Mushrooms and Fight Against and Armed Boss happened around this time. The whole Starling thing that has yet to amount to anything came out around this time, and remember, this ended up being something we maybe shouldn't had known about just yet. Do you guys remember how insiders and then also us knew about Dragon Quest in Smash for so many months before it was revealed? You remember how :ultbanjokazooie: was known for a decent amount of time before their reveal? What about all the information that was said that ended up coming true between both the 'Everyone Is Here' reveal and the August Direct, but that was leaked so many months before hand? When inside information is known, it's often known well in advance before anything official comes out, or at least the trend tends to be for Smash. Either than, or it's known shortly after a leak done by Nintendo themselves. What if the Starling image was actually a hint to Geno like we all hoped in assumed, but the reason we saw nothing for so long and even still about it is because it IS for our boy Geno, but he's not coming until sometime next year, but Sabi's NoA source found out about him being successfully negotiated for shortly after it happened and for the sake of his position and the position of others (because Geno is KINDA a big deal of a reveal for the Smash community and for Sakurai, I'm sure) and thus gave is the vaguest image hint ever with no clarification?

Now, toss in the the CacoMallow video that STILL hasn't been debunked at all. You remember how the Ken debug leak kind just fell away to the wayside until Ken was revealed? How it was lost in the shuffle of other fake leaks but turned out to be the real leak? Suddenly, this is happening to the CacoMallow leak: a ton of people tried to point out why it was fake, couldn't 100% prove it, then gave up and moved to the next big leak. We've been given proof that content is completed well in advance and the Mallow hat also falls in line with another reliable leak...and when was that leak information received? In July, around the same time-frame as everything mentioned before...hmm...

There may have been more on my mind, but I will end this with saying that Geno has never truly left insider circle talk and has gained more steam as we've gone on. On top of that, people like @Fatmanonice who has been involved with these circles to a certain degree have such amazing confidence in Geno's chances that he's about to drop the biggest bombshell of 2019 around the time of the VGAs. Also, the Mallow hat in that CacoMallow image looks pretty finished, so not only would I tell you to expect Geno unless something much bigger comes out to completely rule him out, but I would expect him sooner rather than later. Not FP#5, but definitely soon after.

This took some time to type out but I really wanted to get it to you guys sooner rather than later. Tell me, what do you think about all this?

EDIT: This is a huge-ass post and I'm working on making it more sectioned off with spoilers but I'm tired and I REALLY wanted to get this out now, so forgive me as I work on sectioning it off.
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So with that all that in mind, today's theory is that Geno is going to be an early reveal. Not Fighter #5 early, but either next in line after #5 or just after that (so, #6 or #7), and it's not just based on cute numbered timing.

Going off of the idea that the 2nd DLC was dropped on Sakurai very early on this year and thus there was a bit of a scramble to both negotiate for characters as well as finish designing the ones they already negotiated for, one thing REALLY sticks out: the lack of Geno's Mii Costume with Hero. It's been mentioned a lot by many of us that there was nothing stopping them from dropping Geno's costume as a returning right there and yet they still didn't and, for some reason, Hero is the only Fighter's Pass character with no returning costumes. Very strange, as even Banjo & Kazooie who got no other Rare or Microsoft costumes with them got both new and old costumes. I believe this is because originally they had plans to have Geno's costume return (maybe also with the Chocobo hat, but the hat really doesn't matter all that much) with Hero but that was scrapped at some time before the Mii Costume video was recorded and edited. Well, why would a need for his costume to be pulled last minute come up other than Sakurai managed to negotiate around that time for Geno himself to become playable!

Now remember, much of the footage that is used for reveals and breakdowns has to be recorded, translated when needed, and edited. This is why I don't think DLC was dropped in Sakurai's lap around May or June because there would not be enough time go over with Nintendo what specifics they are looking for AND negotiate with a company for their character successfully AND start development on that character AND still work on the five characters you need to have done by February. It makes much more sense for Nintendo to see the crazy sales of Ultimate and also see all the pre-orders/sales of the Fighter's Pass after the Joker reveal and say "Damn, if it sold this well already with just Joker and we have all these bombs of characters coming through? THIS PRINTS MONEY! Quick, someone send word to Sakurai...more, we WANT MORE~!" which would give much more time for Sakurai to play ball with other companies. It also explains the big gap between Joker's reveal in December and Joker's drop in April with barely any news and no other reveals in between: that whole time was focused on bother developing the DQ Crew and B&K while ALSO negotiating new characters! Damn, Sakurai and Co. always busting ass, man. :/

Thus, if Sakurai hadn't negotiated successfully for Geno to be playable before making all that final footage for the Mii Costume Reveal #2, there would be no point in not including the costume that they would most likely have rights to since Geno was already a Spirit and and Icon in the base game. Likely, it would have been negotiated for with his Spirit and Icon because Hero would have been negotiated for roughly around the same time. Honestly, what I think may have happened is that Sakurai got the rights for Geno as playable and then pulled either his costume alone or with the Chocobo hat and it was too late to negotiate for more Mii Costumes for DQ so Sakurai decided to let DQ shine on it's own with less costumes than the other characters and that he will bring back the Geno costume with Geno's reveal.

Also, think about how Geno could work as #6 or #7 very well. If he's #6, not only is he TECHNICALLY the 7th DLC character due to Piranha Plant not making the base roster but he would also be the first reveal post-Fighter's Pass and I have to say...Smash always hits hard with their first couple reveals, so what better way to hit hard for Season 2 but to reveal the last of the Trifecta and one of the biggest fan requests of ALL TIME while also simultaneously showing that just about anyone can get in? He also works as #7 because Smash tends to have hard-hitting reveals up until the end when they tend to whimper more and then he would also be the legitimate 7th DLC character for those who don't include the plant.

What's crazier is, this matches up with my timeline theory: if Geno is #6/#7, he is either the first or second character to be negotiated for after Wave 2 was dropped into Sakurai's lap, meaning he would have been negotiated for before E3 likely and had things changed around for his Mii Costume to be pulled from the #2 Mii Costume Wave. Here is the thing thought...it's gets better!

You guys remember the CacoMallow leak? You know, the one that has an image and two gameplay vids of Mii Costumes that look very credible and still hasn't been debunked but rather forgotten about much like the Ken debug leak? Barring the easy call that the Mallow hat would come with Geno, think about when we saw this: this was early last month in November. Remember how finished they looked? Like, those costumes looked ready to be launched that day, right? Well we know that characters and content that comes with them all tends to be done well in advance, right? Well if Geno was either the first or second character to be negotiated for, wouldn't it make sense of the Mii Costumes to come with him to be done or mostly done already by November? To be ready to revealed early next year? It makes so much sense because they still had five characters to make, yet they clearly were ahead of schedule enough to start working on other content, and having the simpler costumes be basically ready to pay for and download by November makes SO MUCH SENSE!

Guys, I'm losing the ability to be coherent because my hype is flooding. I'm SO confident that I would say Geno is basically a lock. I'm like 99.999~ that he's coming next year. I also have my thoughts about a certain sneaky individual and a couple of spiky-haired boys and a warrior, but none of them are Geno so I can't post about that here. If you want more on them, head over to the Star Road Discord server!

GUYS I'M SO PUMPED! GAAAAAAHHHALALALALALALAL~!
 
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Sour Supreme

Sour Supreme

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ActualGarbage

ActualGarbage

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EarlTamm said:
No matter the opinion on the whole Super Crown phenomena, I think it's safe to say that this is a pretty great SMRPG themed art piece.
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Good pixel art? Good girls? Genoette's wooden ass? Mallowette t-pose? What more could I possibly ask for!?
Who knew Geno would be such a good waifu!
 
Franco Geno

Franco Geno

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ForsakenM said:
So guys, it's theory time, and I grabbed my previous quotes about my theory about how Sakurai and Co. were WAY too ahead of schedule for them not to be planning something else (a stance I had taken since July) as well as my most recent theory of how I believe that there is a metric crap-ton of evidence that support the second wave of DLC being dropped into Sakurai's lap in early 2019 (as early as January) and thus they have been being negotiated for and worked on for a while now. Here are those posts for you to enjoy and use to catch up in case you want to have an idea of where I'm coming from as I'm not going into big details about them here.
So with that all that in mind, today's theory is that Geno is going to be an early reveal. Not Fighter #5 early, but either next in line after #5 or just after that (so, #6 or #7), and it's not just based on cute numbered timing.

Going off of the idea that the 2nd DLC was dropped on Sakurai very early on this year and thus there was a bit of a scramble to both negotiate for characters as well as finish designing the ones they already negotiated for, one thing REALLY sticks out: the lack of Geno's Mii Costume with Hero. It's been mentioned a lot by many of us that there was nothing stopping them from dropping Geno's costume as a returning right there and yet they still didn't and, for some reason, Hero is the only Fighter's Pass character with no returning costumes. Very strange, as even Banjo & Kazooie who got no other Rare or Microsoft costumes with them got both new and old costumes. I believe this is because originally they had plans to have Geno's costume return (maybe also with the Chocobo hat, but the hat really doesn't matter all that much) with Hero but that was scrapped at some time before the Mii Costume video was recorded and edited. Well, why would a need for his costume to be pulled last minute come up other than Sakurai managed to negotiate around that time for Geno himself to become playable!

Now remember, much of the footage that is used for reveals and breakdowns has to be recorded, translated when needed, and edited. This is why I don't think DLC was dropped in Sakurai's lap around May or June because there would not be enough time go over with Nintendo what specifics they are looking for AND negotiate with a company for their character successfully AND start development on that character AND still work on the five characters you need to have done by February. It makes much more sense for Nintendo to see the crazy sales of Ultimate and also see all the pre-orders/sales of the Fighter's Pass after the Joker reveal and say "Damn, if it sold this well already with just Joker and we have all these bombs of characters coming through? THIS PRINTS MONEY! Quick, someone send word to Sakurai...more, we WANT MORE~!" which would give much more time for Sakurai to play ball with other companies. It also explains the big gap between Joker's reveal in December and Joker's drop in April with barely any news and no other reveals in between: that whole time was focused on bother developing the DQ Crew and B&K while ALSO negotiating new characters! Damn, Sakurai and Co. always busting ass, man. :/

Thus, if Sakurai hadn't negotiated successfully for Geno to be playable before making all that final footage for the Mii Costume Reveal #2, there would be no point in not including the costume that they would most likely have rights to since Geno was already a Spirit and and Icon in the base game. Likely, it would have been negotiated for with his Spirit and Icon because Hero would have been negotiated for roughly around the same time. Honestly, what I think may have happened is that Sakurai got the rights for Geno as playable and then pulled either his costume alone or with the Chocobo hat and it was too late to negotiate for more Mii Costumes for DQ so Sakurai decided to let DQ shine on it's own with less costumes than the other characters and that he will bring back the Geno costume with Geno's reveal.

Also, think about how Geno could work as #6 or #7 very well. If he's #6, not only is he TECHNICALLY the 7th DLC character due to Piranha Plant not making the base roster but he would also be the first reveal post-Fighter's Pass and I have to say...Smash always hits hard with their first couple reveals, so what better way to hit hard for Season 2 but to reveal the last of the Trifecta and one of the biggest fan requests of ALL TIME while also simultaneously showing that just about anyone can get in? He also works as #7 because Smash tends to have hard-hitting reveals up until the end when they tend to whimper more and then he would also be the legitimate 7th DLC character for those who don't include the plant.

What's crazier is, this matches up with my timeline theory: if Geno is #6/#7, he is either the first or second character to be negotiated for after Wave 2 was dropped into Sakurai's lap, meaning he would have been negotiated for before E3 likely and had things changed around for his Mii Costume to be pulled from the #2 Mii Costume Wave. Here is the thing thought...it's gets better!

You guys remember the CacoMallow leak? You know, the one that has an image and two gameplay vids of Mii Costumes that look very credible and still hasn't been debunked but rather forgotten about much like the Ken debug leak? Barring the easy call that the Mallow hat would come with Geno, think about when we saw this: this was early last month in November. Remember how finished they looked? Like, those costumes looked ready to be launched that day, right? Well we know that characters and content that comes with them all tends to be done well in advance, right? Well if Geno was either the first or second character to be negotiated for, wouldn't it make sense of the Mii Costumes to come with him to be done or mostly done already by November? To be ready to revealed early next year? It makes so much sense because they still had five characters to make, yet they clearly were ahead of schedule enough to start working on other content, and having the simpler costumes be basically ready to pay for and download by November makes SO MUCH SENSE!

Guys, I'm losing the ability to be coherent because my hype is flooding. I'm SO confident that I would say Geno is basically a lock. I'm like 99.999~ that he's coming next year. I also have my thoughts about a certain sneaky individual and a couple of spiky-haired boys and a warrior, but none of them are Geno so I can't post about that here. If you want more on them, head over to the Star Road Discord server!

GUYS I'M SO PUMPED! GAAAAAAHHHALALALALALALAL~!
Click to expand...
LET'S CELEBRATE!!!
(ngl i really agree with your theories and i enjoy reading them, they're awesome man)
 
OffBi

OffBi

Smash Ace
Joined
Aug 30, 2019
Messages
877
Franco Geno said:
1. Geno gets in Smash but instead of an alternate costume we get this, Bass Cloak Geno. (can anyone here drawn that? that would be great)

2. Interesting, instead of turning into a cannon he can change into a female version of himself just like Seth
Click to expand...
Here's cloak Geno
IMG_20191219_214525.jpg
 
Mastadoom88

Mastadoom88

Smash Apprentice
Joined
Feb 13, 2019
Messages
149
Franco Geno said:
I'm so glad that we have people like you on this thread pal


I humbly accept your compliment. The feeling is mutual 1000%. Doesn't hurt that you're a primo meme machine. Thank you for giving me and my girl tons of laughs.

I'm not a very social person, but times like these make me happy I joined and stopped lurking after all these years
Click to expand...
EDIT: AMAZING art OffBi OffBi ! Makes me want to try my hand at drawing him sometime
 
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Franco Geno

Franco Geno

Smash Lord
Joined
Oct 26, 2019
Messages
1,445
Location
Argentina
Mastadoom88 Mastadoom88 Aww, i'm glad that i'm able to make you and your girl laugh with my memes, i understand since i'm not very social either but joining this thread this year was a great decision, i wish you both the best ^^
 
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D

domriver

Smash Lord
Joined
Dec 24, 2007
Messages
1,383
Location
Stockton, California
ForsakenM said:
So guys, it's theory time, and I grabbed my previous quotes about my theory about how Sakurai and Co. were WAY too ahead of schedule for them not to be planning something else (a stance I had taken since July) as well as my most recent theory of how I believe that there is a metric crap-ton of evidence that support the second wave of DLC being dropped into Sakurai's lap in early 2019 (as early as January) and thus they have been being negotiated for and worked on for a while now. Here are those posts for you to enjoy and use to catch up in case you want to have an idea of where I'm coming from as I'm not going into big details about them here.
So with that all that in mind, today's theory is that Geno is going to be an early reveal. Not Fighter #5 early, but either next in line after #5 or just after that (so, #6 or #7), and it's not just based on cute numbered timing.

Going off of the idea that the 2nd DLC was dropped on Sakurai very early on this year and thus there was a bit of a scramble to both negotiate for characters as well as finish designing the ones they already negotiated for, one thing REALLY sticks out: the lack of Geno's Mii Costume with Hero. It's been mentioned a lot by many of us that there was nothing stopping them from dropping Geno's costume as a returning right there and yet they still didn't and, for some reason, Hero is the only Fighter's Pass character with no returning costumes. Very strange, as even Banjo & Kazooie who got no other Rare or Microsoft costumes with them got both new and old costumes. I believe this is because originally they had plans to have Geno's costume return (maybe also with the Chocobo hat, but the hat really doesn't matter all that much) with Hero but that was scrapped at some time before the Mii Costume video was recorded and edited. Well, why would a need for his costume to be pulled last minute come up other than Sakurai managed to negotiate around that time for Geno himself to become playable!

Now remember, much of the footage that is used for reveals and breakdowns has to be recorded, translated when needed, and edited. This is why I don't think DLC was dropped in Sakurai's lap around May or June because there would not be enough time go over with Nintendo what specifics they are looking for AND negotiate with a company for their character successfully AND start development on that character AND still work on the five characters you need to have done by February. It makes much more sense for Nintendo to see the crazy sales of Ultimate and also see all the pre-orders/sales of the Fighter's Pass after the Joker reveal and say "Damn, if it sold this well already with just Joker and we have all these bombs of characters coming through? THIS PRINTS MONEY! Quick, someone send word to Sakurai...more, we WANT MORE~!" which would give much more time for Sakurai to play ball with other companies. It also explains the big gap between Joker's reveal in December and Joker's drop in April with barely any news and no other reveals in between: that whole time was focused on bother developing the DQ Crew and B&K while ALSO negotiating new characters! Damn, Sakurai and Co. always busting ass, man. :/

Thus, if Sakurai hadn't negotiated successfully for Geno to be playable before making all that final footage for the Mii Costume Reveal #2, there would be no point in not including the costume that they would most likely have rights to since Geno was already a Spirit and and Icon in the base game. Likely, it would have been negotiated for with his Spirit and Icon because Hero would have been negotiated for roughly around the same time. Honestly, what I think may have happened is that Sakurai got the rights for Geno as playable and then pulled either his costume alone or with the Chocobo hat and it was too late to negotiate for more Mii Costumes for DQ so Sakurai decided to let DQ shine on it's own with less costumes than the other characters and that he will bring back the Geno costume with Geno's reveal.

Also, think about how Geno could work as #6 or #7 very well. If he's #6, not only is he TECHNICALLY the 7th DLC character due to Piranha Plant not making the base roster but he would also be the first reveal post-Fighter's Pass and I have to say...Smash always hits hard with their first couple reveals, so what better way to hit hard for Season 2 but to reveal the last of the Trifecta and one of the biggest fan requests of ALL TIME while also simultaneously showing that just about anyone can get in? He also works as #7 because Smash tends to have hard-hitting reveals up until the end when they tend to whimper more and then he would also be the legitimate 7th DLC character for those who don't include the plant.

What's crazier is, this matches up with my timeline theory: if Geno is #6/#7, he is either the first or second character to be negotiated for after Wave 2 was dropped into Sakurai's lap, meaning he would have been negotiated for before E3 likely and had things changed around for his Mii Costume to be pulled from the #2 Mii Costume Wave. Here is the thing thought...it's gets better!

You guys remember the CacoMallow leak? You know, the one that has an image and two gameplay vids of Mii Costumes that look very credible and still hasn't been debunked but rather forgotten about much like the Ken debug leak? Barring the easy call that the Mallow hat would come with Geno, think about when we saw this: this was early last month in November. Remember how finished they looked? Like, those costumes looked ready to be launched that day, right? Well we know that characters and content that comes with them all tends to be done well in advance, right? Well if Geno was either the first or second character to be negotiated for, wouldn't it make sense of the Mii Costumes to come with him to be done or mostly done already by November? To be ready to revealed early next year? It makes so much sense because they still had five characters to make, yet they clearly were ahead of schedule enough to start working on other content, and having the simpler costumes be basically ready to pay for and download by November makes SO MUCH SENSE!

Guys, I'm losing the ability to be coherent because my hype is flooding. I'm SO confident that I would say Geno is basically a lock. I'm like 99.999~ that he's coming next year. I also have my thoughts about a certain sneaky individual and a couple of spiky-haired boys and a warrior, but none of them are Geno so I can't post about that here. If you want more on them, head over to the Star Road Discord server!

GUYS I'M SO PUMPED! GAAAAAAHHHALALALALALALAL~!
Click to expand...
It all makes sense - it really does. I do believe that Geno was going to be a costume and thats it BUT after Nintendo saw the sales + FP sales they said hmmm.... more pl0x. Sakurai then said all right maybe we can put Geno in after all. Let me just go talk to them again. I do believe that Geno's hurdles were Cloud and DQ. They got their wish. Im sure Nintendo said yes those two characters first and if we can Geno but not now. I truly believe that the cards are all in Geno's favor. Just like all of you - i am waiting for this moment to happen. Happy or sad. I would like Sakurai to put the final nail in the coffin for Geno speculation. With FAN Mega requests coming in King K Rool , Ridley, Banjo. It just makes sense. Maybe we have an end of the year direct? There is still technically a 6 business days left in the year. lol :p
Also why did you fill my glass yet again with this thing called HOPE. lol :p
 
Griselda

Griselda

Smash Lord
Joined
Nov 4, 2019
Messages
1,077
..So wait, you're telling me after I dealt with that horribly cheap boss fight, Seth just got into another body like it didn't even matter?

On the topic of bodies, I always wondered what would happen if another star spirit came down after Geno and found another doll to inhabit. ..Except maybe they'd be disillusioned with the concept of wish-granting and would fight on Smithy's side and have a showdown with Geno.
 
Franco Geno

Franco Geno

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Joined
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Messages
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Location
Argentina
Griselda said:
..So wait, you're telling me after I dealt with that horribly cheap boss fight, Seth just got into another body like it didn't even matter?

On the topic of bodies, I always wondered what would happen if another star spirit came down after Geno and found another doll to inhabit. ..Except maybe they'd be disillusioned with the concept of wish-granting and would fight on Smithy's side and have a showdown with Geno.
Click to expand...
Yes...but at least we have the fanart right?
 
Spatulo

Spatulo

Smash Lord
Joined
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Planet Bomber
NNID
Spatulo
Switch FC
SW 6433 1491 0045
Griselda said:
..So wait, you're telling me after I dealt with that horribly cheap boss fight, Seth just got into another body like it didn't even matter?

On the topic of bodies, I always wondered what would happen if another star spirit came down after Geno and found another doll to inhabit. ..Except maybe they'd be disillusioned with the concept of wish-granting and would fight on Smithy's side and have a showdown with Geno.
Click to expand...
So like a Nega-Geno? Anti Geno? Wageno? Oneg?
 
MaddaD

MaddaD

Smash Journeyman
Writing Team
Joined
Apr 25, 2019
Messages
215
I can't believe Seth is my waifu now.

Edit: 6 likes and I'll start posting Fem Seth lewds
 
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Firox

Firox

Smash Master
Joined
Jan 7, 2019
Messages
3,336
Griselda said:
..So wait, you're telling me after I dealt with that horribly cheap boss fight, Seth just got into another body like it didn't even matter?

On the topic of bodies, I always wondered what would happen if another star spirit came down after Geno and found another doll to inhabit. ..Except maybe they'd be disillusioned with the concept of wish-granting and would fight on Smithy's side and have a showdown with Geno.
Click to expand...
I think you just came up with an incredibly edgy sequel to SMRPG. Another spirit defects from star road, tired of granting wishes to the selfish creatures of the world below. They inhabit a sword-wielding doll (Xeno) and begin crusading to reopen the portal to Smithy's dimension. Meanwhile, Geno reappears and finds Mario to begin another quest to save the world. Count me in.
 
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