Geno (♥♪!?): Return of the Starsend Savior

[MissingGlitch]

Keeping with the theme, all matches with Hero are turn-based

How would this affect the meta???

 

[Glitch-EGamer]

How would this affect the meta???

Many pros would die off, leaving a gaping hole to be filled.

 

[KirbyWorshipper2465]

I've been thinking about this a while now and I'm wondering if this might be their plan after all. we have exactly 3 passes of space and each one could be themed like has been brought up tangentially for a while now. the first for 3rd party characters were on now, then one for 1st/2nd party characters and finally one for echos. I mean there's no hard evidence to support that but if they really were going all the way I think this is what would happen.

Seems fair. Especially that last one, since moveset clones are always left for last, in regards to roster dev priority, and they provide extra characters for less work.

 

[MattX20]

Thing is from what I've learned is that any time a DQ game is released in Japan, it's almost like a national holiday. Even though DQ is massive in Japan, keep in mind it's DLC for Smash Ultimate and not a full fledged RPG game like 11 is. Plus, Fire Emblem is not going to be cannibalized sales wise by the DQ heroes. Unless if they buy the full pass, the characters are about $6, and I'm pretty sure they can afford them and Three Houses without issue.

 

[Morgana J. Cat]

I'll have one Geno for Smash DLC, please!!!

 

[Rohanx17]

Seems fair. Especially that last one, since moveset clones are always left for last, in regards to roster dev priority, and they provide extra characters for less work.

agreed, it makes sense to do the second one for requests that were big but not 3rd party, and then the third for characters that were popular but not really that different from an existing fighter like dixie or shadow to justify being along side fully original ones to their consumers. hell they could pull a melee gannondorf and just pick stuff we never even thought of as potential echoes but would make sense after it was shown off.

 

[Shado-will]

I feel like over 10 extra fighters is kinda pushing the limit for the DLC as far as playable characters go. Smash 4 DLC is just around the number of fighters I would think they would add, and I still think that was a bit too much. I get they're probably gonna try to milk Smash Ultimate, but they'll probably do that with Mii Costumes, maybe more stages, etc.

EDIT: I definitely do NOT see them going for the 100 fighter mark. That's 20+ extra DLC fighters, and that is without a doubt way too much, even if Echos are included. At most, I see them doing for a second Fighter Pass, but I think the most likely scenario is where they just have 1-3 bonus DLC fighters after the pass.

 

[PokéfreakofBACON]

I feel like over 10 extra fighters is kinda pushing the limit for the DLC as far as playable characters go. Smash 4 DLC is just around the number of fighters I would think they would add, and I still think that was a bit too much. I get they're probably gonna try to milk Smash Ultimate, but they'll probably do that with Mii Costumes, maybe more stages, etc.

EDIT: I definitely do NOT see them going for the 100 fighter mark. That's 20+ extra DLC fighters, and that is without a doubt way too much, even if Echos are included. At most, I see them doing for a second Fighter Pass, but I think the most likely scenario is where they just have 1-3 bonus DLC fighters after the pass.

The reason why people are saying 10 extra fighters isn't just coming out of nowhere, it comes from actual datamined information currently in Smash Ultimate, as in 16 total slots for DLC characters in WoL (piranha plant + fighters pass taking up 6) and 29 total IDs for skins of dlc characters. Smash 4 had the same thing happen, and all of them got filled. Plus, Smash 4 only got as few DLC fighters as it did because the Wii U was dying, Smash Ultimate is likely going to keep getting fighters for the whole switch's lifespan if you ask me. The first 16 are just the only ones they have planned currently.

 

[Ze Diglett]

Bear in mind that if Nintendo decides to go for the ludicrous 100 fighter mark, that would mean that at least a QUARTER of the game's roster would be DLC. That's absurd.

 

[Nicnac]

The reason why people are saying 10 extra fighters isn't just coming out of nowhere, it comes from actual datamined information currently in Smash Ultimate, as in 16 total slots for DLC characters in WoL (piranha plant + fighters pass taking up 6) and 29 total IDs for skins of dlc characters. Smash 4 had the same thing happen, and all of them got filled. Plus, Smash 4 only got as few DLC fighters as it did because the Wii U was dying, Smash Ultimate is likely going to keep getting fighters for the whole switch's lifespan if you ask me. The first 16 are just the only ones they have planned currently.

Honestly that would be ****ing insane. It would also mean that there are close to 3 times the amount of DLC newcomers as there are base newcomers. I don't think they all will be filled, and I think they may just be placeholders, though I'm happy to be wrong.

 

[Rie Sonomura]

If I may, wasn’t Splatoon 2 supported with new content for TWO WHOLE YEARS and they’re capping it off with Splatocalypse this weekend? I can see them supporting Smash for at least two years

 

[CannonStreak]

If I may, wasn’t Splatoon 2 supported with new content for TWO WHOLE YEARS and they’re capping it off with Splatocalypse this weekend? I can see them supporting Smash for at least two years

Poor Sakurai isn’t getting a break until then if this turned out true, is he?

 

[Nicnac]

Poor Sakurai isn’t getting a break until then if this turned out true, is he?

Nintendo will invent a TF2-style life extender to squeeze Smash out of Sakurai until they run out of Australium.

 

[Glitch-EGamer]

I feel like over 10 extra fighters is kinda pushing the limit for the DLC as far as playable characters go. Smash 4 DLC is just around the number of fighters I would think they would add, and I still think that was a bit too much. I get they're probably gonna try to milk Smash Ultimate, but they'll probably do that with Mii Costumes, maybe more stages, etc.

EDIT: I definitely do NOT see them going for the 100 fighter mark. That's 20+ extra DLC fighters, and that is without a doubt way too much, even if Echos are included. At most, I see them doing for a second Fighter Pass, but I think the most likely scenario is where they just have 1-3 bonus DLC fighters after the pass.

Echoes are so easy to make though. Besides, including echoes and the PKMN Trainer as 3 fighters, as he should, that's already 82 fighters. 18 is not that many, especially with echoes.

 

[FalconFire93]

Bear in mind that if Nintendo decides to go for the ludicrous 100 fighter mark, that would mean that at least a QUARTER of the game's roster would be DLC. That's absurd.

Exactly, but imagine if it was to get to the point of Mugen levels with the roster, though I know it won’t, that would definitely be insane.

 

[Ze Diglett]

If I may, wasn’t Splatoon 2 supported with new content for TWO WHOLE YEARS and they’re capping it off with Splatocalypse this weekend? I can see them supporting Smash for at least two years

That's also been the exception in terms of Nintendo games, not the rule. Outside of the Splatoon series, Nintendo basically never supports its games longer than a year or so.

 

[Nicnac]

That's also been the exception in terms of Nintendo games, not the rule. Outside of the Splatoon series, Nintendo basically never supports its games longer than a year or so.

Nintendo have only really just started to get into the DLC market relatively recently. BOTW 2 is just DLC that got too big, so they made it a new game. This obviously implies they were working on further DLC post-Champion's Ballad, which itself was nine months after launch. They're doing a little more now, apparently.

 

[EricTheGamerman]

well we'll just have to agree to disagree on that, I don't count the bonus features because they weren't promised, were cut from 4, or were largely inconsequential from a programming perspective like new music or spirits., same with joker's stuff I bundle that all in when I brought it up. plant was shown with about as much work done as we saw with hero and banjo about a month before base even released so I frankly don't count it equally to the others.

Regardless of if “you count them” or not, they still took time, money, licensing, and developmental resources to happen. Even small things that may seem inconsequential to you probably took several man hours of development and work given the scope of Ultimate and ensuring that everything works as correctly as possible. It doesn’t matter if they were promised or cut features, that literally doesn’t matter in the least bit because they are being developed in the context of this game. And while Piranha Plant might have been ready for footage in November, there are still tons of work to do with balance, glitch fixing, and value tweaking. A character in a showable state still will take time and energy to finish and properly release in the game.

You don’t just get to discredit all of the hard work and effort of the development team just because you feel like it. It’s fine if you don’t like it or don’t think it’s enough, but I will ask you at least acknowledge what they’ve been doing so far and don’t trivialize the likely much more complex work of even minor things.

If I may, wasn’t Splatoon 2 supported with new content for TWO WHOLE YEARS and they’re capping it off with Splatocalypse this weekend? I can see them supporting Smash for at least two years

Splatoon 2 hasn’t actually had a content update since like September-October of last year though. It’s just been the usual Splat Fests and minor tweaks since then. I’ve always suspected Smash would mirror this, but to the same degree as content updates will end sooner rather than later and the remaining support will come in the form of continued balance patches and minor Spirit events.

Splatoon 2 only really got supported in a content way for a year and about a quarter, which is how long Smash will have been supported by the end of the Fighter’s Pass.

 

[YsDisciple]

Say YsDisciple , can this online maintenance fit your theory?

https://www.nintendo.com/consumer/network/en_na/network_status.jsp

From the looks of it, the 22th-26th could be likely.

Hmm, actually, the schedule before that one caught my attention. There's a scheduled maintenance for today at 11:00 PM. Hmm... that one could hopefully make it in time. After that however, I guess Hero will just be happening sometime around the last week of July, but will have missed the EVO 2019 patch deadline.

 

[MissingGlitch]

Imagine Hero dropping a minute after the EVO deadline.

 

[xpnc]

Here's your daily almost certainly fake leak:

Spoiler: Image

 

[Glitch-EGamer]

Here's your daily almost certainly fake leak:

Spoiler: Image

View attachment 231737

Very cool, Kanye.

 

[MissingGlitch]

Here's your daily almost certainly fake leak:

Spoiler: Image

View attachment 231737

So SE doesn't get one. Not two. But three bloody reps as Smash DLC. Sure I believe this one alright. lol

 

[Ovaltine]

I'll have one Geno for Smash DLC, please!!!

Listen, if Morgana (yes, THE Morgana from Persona 5) supports Geno, then everyone should.

Now, uh, if the Phantom Thieves could steal Square Enix's collective heart and allow them to give Nintendo the SMRPG rights, that'd... be pretty cool... Just saying, y'know, in case they're listening... cough...

 

[SpiritOfRuin]

Put me down as a supporter. I of course have tempered any excitement about Geno possibly making it in with an understanding that it's highly unlikely. At the same time, if it's going to happen, it seems it would happen in Ultimate considering all the fan service so far with the DLC characters. Geno is the last character that I would go absolutely bonkers for if he made it in. Rayman is close for me too but not on the same level as Geno. Geno belongs in Smash in the sense that his moveset would be so fun and unique. This whole thread proves how much potential he has and how popular he is. Plus smrpg has tons of potential for stages and music. If Geno doesn't make into smash I wish Nintendo would at least but the rights or work with square to make more Mario rpg games because there's really nothing quite like smrpg.

 

[Glitch-EGamer]

Question: How would you feel if Super Mario RPG was handled in the artistic style of the Mario and Luigi series? I don't mean changing gameplay but just visual choice.

Also, I feel like this has to be the game we get Geno because Sakurai has already basically apologized twice for his lack of inclusion and after throwing the bone with the Mii costume last game, he's almost certainly going to go big or go home.

 

[Megadoomer]

Here's your daily almost certainly fake leak:

Spoiler: Image

View attachment 231737

It seems 120% fake, but I'd have no problems with that line-up. (the only one that I'd want who'd be missing would be Dante)

 

[EarlTamm]

Listen, if Morgana (yes, THE Morgana from Persona 5) supports Geno, then everyone should.

Now, uh, if the Phantom Thieves could steal Square Enix's collective heart and allow them to give Nintendo the SMRPG rights, that'd... be pretty cool... Just saying, y'know, in case they're listening... cough...

May I please have a side of context with this info? Because icon and such.

 

[Ovaltine]

If Geno doesn't make into smash I wish Nintendo would at least but the rights or work with square to make more Mario rpg games because there's really nothing quite like smrpg.

I wish I could hit a like button more than once.

For me, this isn't just about Smash. I just want to see my boy return period. That's how it was for me for Banjo and Kazooie, and that's how it still is for Geno.

May I please have a side of context with this info? Because icon and such.

Square Enix, bank, keyword 'ca$h money'.

Get on it, Phantom Thieves.

 

[Glitch-EGamer]

May I please have a side of context with this info? Because icon and such.

Voice actor maybe?

 

[Ovaltine]

Voice actor maybe?

Oh, no, I was joking because of their username + icon. It's nothing like that, haha.

 

[EarlTamm]

Voice actor maybe?

Morgana's voice actor does tend to do things with the Morgana voice from time to time, so I imagine that is the case. Still would be cool to hear.

Edit:
Nevermind.

 

[bardbowman]

I still hate those days. Made the board devolve into Lord of the Flies tribalism.

At least the Lupin leak came and left without doing any real damage.

I didn’t see that kind of thing really start to happen in this thread until DQ was more seriously discussed (which was post-release)

I’m just talking about when people were really upbeat about Geno’s chances, and there was such a fun positive vibe in general. Remember those weeks following the reveal of Simon, Richter, and K Rool? That was an awesome time in my book.

And who could forget the Sassy Geno “leak”?

 

[Icewolff92]

Sylux,

Mother 3 confirmed

Poor Sakurai isn’t getting a break until then if this turned out true, is he?

#¤
If we are getting a second fighters pass, I sure hope that he gets a vacation first. I know that he is a workaholic to say the least, but please give him at least one month vacation...

Question: How would you feel if Super Mario RPG was handled in the artistic style of the Mario and Luigi series? I don't mean changing gameplay but just visual choice.

I wouldn¨t mind that one bit. Heck, I would be okay with Paper Mario art style tbh

 

[PokéfreakofBACON]

No one asked but I wanted to say it anyway. Here's my current theory on how the rest of the datamined slots are going to be filled.

(Note: the following assumes Geno is going to be a mii costume. If he's NOT a mii costume, then he's 100% going to be a DLC fighter, and would go up to #2 for the second pass.)
(Note 2: This also assumes Banjo only takes up one character ID, because I don't see him getting an alt costume with dragon kazooie or something.)

Spoiler: long post is long

Currently: 2 Fighter pass slots + 10 (WoL slots), 21 IDs left
FP 4: ??? (Likely Capcom Rep, mii costume theory)
FP 5: ??? (Likely Namco Rep, mii costume theory)

After the fighter pass, a second one is revealed. Because the stage list is full, they're bundled with echo fighters instead of stages. This way, we get 10 fighters in one pass, making the planning ahead of 15 fighters from 2018 be reasonable.

Because they can't have stages, these must be from series that don't need a stage to come with them. While there have been characters in Smash that didn't come with a stage, they were all 1st party. This means fighter pass two MUST be first party, and will likely be almost entirely dedicated to series already represented.

In order of what I believe is most likely, Fighter Pass 2 most likely options:
1. Bandana Dee + Kirby echo
-Bandana Dee is THE most requested 1st party character, aside from maybe Isaac, who is an assist trophy. There are plenty of options for Kirby echos as well. Bonkers/any hammer user over D3, Galacta Knight/Morpho Knight/DMK/etc over Meta Knight, Gooey/Keeby/Dark Kirby over Kirby, etc etc. None of the choices for echoes are particularly interesting when you have characters like Adeleine or Magolor or Dark Matter or Marx, but if they came with same-series echos (which would make the most sense) there are plenty of options.
2. Dixie Kong + DKC echo (Funky?)
-Dixie Kong is also pretty highly requested, though the hype for her has mildly dropped after K. Rool got in. With how much people loved K. Rool and Banjo's inclusions, another Rare character would certainly seem like a good choice. It would also fit with Sakurai's plan in Brawl, where he had to cut Dixie. Funky Kong makes the most sense for a DKC echo, because his body type is exactly the same as DK's. Other than him, they could potentially use Kaptain K as an echo of King K? Or perhaps something I'm not thinking of right now.
3. Pokemon Rep + Pokemon Echo
-Pokemon is pokemon. Some people think there's too many pokemon in smash, but I don't think Nintendo cares. With how hard people requested Decidueye and Sceptile, a grass type starter seems like a good choice to round out the roster. Perhaps Grookey's final evolution? Or really any gen 8 pokemon. As for echo fighters, I'm sure you don't need me to tell you there's plenty of options. (My personal favorite would be Zeraora over Lucario, though.)
4. Rhythm Heaven Rep + ???
-Rhythm Heaven is pretty long overdue to be in Smash, if you ask me. It's unquestionably Nintendo's largest franchise that doesn't already have a fighter. While it might be weird to get them without a stage, depending on which RH rep they pick, they could add another variant to Boxing Ring for them. (Karate Joe cough cough.) The problem with this series, though, is that an echo fighter wouldn't really make sense. No matter who they picked, there's not really a good choice for an echo fighter. (Unless they did Karate Joe + his dad?) This would likely have to be the only one without a same-series echo.
5. Zelda Rep + Zelda Echo
-I don't think I need to explain this one. Zelda is enormous, but we really only have 4 unique fighters for the series. BotW 2 could get a rep, or any number of other things. I just don't think it's super likely with how Sakurai seems to ignore everyone but the Triforce holders. (Beast Ganon when)
6. Geno + Mario Echo OR Mario RPG echo?
-Geno isn't very likely if they add his mii costume, but he still has a chance, as I'm sure we can all agree. As for an echo fighter to go with him, it could either be some random Mario echo (like Doctor Luigi or Dry Bowser or whoever else) or more interestingly, a Mario RPG echo like Boshi. I feel like Waluigi WOULD be the most likely, if not for him having no real choice for an echo.
7. fire emblem
-I don't think Sakurai wants to put in more FE, because he said himself he thought there were too many BEFORE corrin got added. I wouldn't rule it out though. There's plenty of options too, obviously.

So, with that out of the way, here's what I think will actually happen.

End of Fighter Pass-
FP 4: Phoenix Wright
-I don't have a ton of attachment to any Capcom characters (aside from mega man, who's already in) but I think Phoenix is the most consistently asked for from Smash fans. At least as far as I can tell. Also his moveset would be cool as hell, whether it was stolen from MvC3 or not.
~Takes up 2 or 3 IDs, using his "retired" outfit, and perhaps the pink alt from MvC3. Could potentially take more, I'm not super familiar with the character.

FP 5: Lloyd OR Heihachi
-I personally think both are equally likely. I have no idea which way to tilt this scale. Either way, they're both a Namco rep that doesn't particularly need a bonus alt skin, but could have one.
~1 or 2 IDs.

Nintendo Pass (NP)-
NP1: Bandana Dee
~Almost assuredly would take up at least 2 IDs, possibly up to four. Sailor Dee, Bandana-less Dee, perhaps some alternate waddle dee enemies from other planets/dimensions?
NP1e: ???
~No matter who it is, I can't think of any Kirby echo fighter that would take up more than 1 ID.

NP2: Dixie Kong
~She could possibly take up 2 IDs with a more classic design (those pink kneepads) but will likely just take 1.
NP2e: Funky Kong
~Likely one, but potentially up to 4. His classic design had no shirt/shorts, and he had unique desigigns in DKC3 and DK64.

NP3: Grookey Evo
~Obviously, like every pokemon, just 1 ID would be taken up.
NP3e: Zeraora
~Ditto to the above.

NP4: Beast/Mage Ganon
~1-2 IDs. I think another form of Ganon is more likely than any one-off character, personally. Depending on what his design is, he could take up 2 IDs. Beast ganon could have a design based on LttP, and have an alt skin based on Yuga Ganon.
NP4e: Impa
~1-2 IDs. Like with Ganon, her main design could be based on one game, but have an alt skin based on another.

NP5: Karate Joe
~Karate Joe could (and should, if you ask me) take up 4 IDs. Boxing glove outfit, (from the arcade game) an outfit with hair, (remix 6 DS) futuristic shades + purple outfit, (remix 7 wii) karate man senior, (megamix) and the honeybee outfit (remix bees megamix) all work perfectly as alt skins.
NP5e: Mach Rider
~1-2, perhaps could have a male and female form based on the ambiguity and arcade stuff. Or the new/old design, etc.

With all these taken into account, that would mean a grand total of 17-24 IDs. Considering there's 21 IDs in the code once you account for Hero/Banjo, it fits pretty well.

If you read this whole thing, I like you. You're cool.

 

[Ovaltine]

I didn’t see that kind of thing really start to happen in this thread until DQ was more seriously discussed (which was post-release)

I’m just talking about when people were really upbeat about Geno’s chances, and there was such a fun positive vibe in general. Remember those weeks following the reveal of Simon, Richter, and K Rool? That was an awesome time in my book.

And who could forget the Sassy Geno “leak”?

Yeah, I wasn't there for those days in terms of my account being made, but I was a lurker. Things looked so good for him back then. Hopefully, all the emotional whiplash of looking extremely likely to extremely unlikely to impossible to maybe somehow still likely (and so on and so forth) will eventually have the payoff we've been waiting for.

 

[Glitch-EGamer]

Mother 3 confirmed
#¤
If we are getting a second fighters pass, I sure hope that he gets a vacation first. I know that he is a workaholic to say the least, but please give him at least one month vacation...

I wouldn¨t mind that one bit. Heck, I would be okay with Paper Mario art style tbh

I ask because I find M&L to have this charm to it visually and I feel like Smithy and his boss theme would be AMAZING with that series's style of music.

 

[Ovaltine]

I ask because I find M&L to have this charm to it visually and I feel like Smithy and his boss theme would be AMAZING with that series's style of music.

If it never happens from Nintendo and Square officially, this has GOT to become a ROM hack project for one of the M&L games (probably SSS). It'd be KILLER.

 

[Rohanx17]

Regardless of if “you count them” or not, they still took time, money, licensing, and developmental resources to happen. Even small things that may seem inconsequential to you probably took several man hours of development and work given the scope of Ultimate and ensuring that everything works as correctly as possible. It doesn’t matter if they were promised or cut features, that literally doesn’t matter in the least bit because they are being developed in the context of this game. And while Piranha Plant might have been ready for footage in November, there are still tons of work to do with balance, glitch fixing, and value tweaking. A character in a showable state still will take time and energy to finish and properly release in the game.

You don’t just get to discredit all of the hard work and effort of the development team just because you feel like it. It’s fine if you don’t like it or don’t think it’s enough, but I will ask you at least acknowledge what they’ve been doing so far and don’t trivialize the likely much more complex work of even minor things.

dude just let it go, your not going to change my opinion by just continuing to tell me yours, this has nothing to do with the original point I was making anyway. I never even said I didn't like it or thought it was bad so I have no idea how you got there in the first place. all I cared about for the point I was trying to make was the described project plan, plant and the FP. anything else was irrelevant to that conversation and why I said I don't count it.

 

[Icewolff92]

I ask because I find M&L to have this charm to it visually and I feel like Smithy and his boss theme would be AMAZING with that series's style of music.

As a big fan of the M&L franchise, I¨m with ya 3000