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Official General Post-DLC Discussion [Closed]

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Cutie Gwen

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HAAAAAAA! WE GOT A FIRE EMBLEM CHARACTER THAT LOOKS COOL AS **** AND A CHARACTER I THOUGHT WOULD BE IMPOSSIBLE! I GOT WHAT I WANTED DESPITE NOT GETTING WHAT I WANTED MORE!
I'm not even mad one of my old mains, Wolf, is gone for good, these 2 newcomers are fresh and exciting! Anyone getting salty about Bayo is just proving how small this part of the Smash community is
 

Lady Byakugan

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I supported Medusa and Im a KI fanboy so I loved all of the KI things. Didn't you notice the Sakurai said Climax and the Bayonetta moon in the background of Battlefield?
I guess my mind was just still dazed from Corrin's ridiculous inclusion, plus my internet isn't that great, so the video buffered a bit when pit first showed up.
 

TaRtOoN-Hand94

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I laugh at people who claim Bayonetta ruined smashes "All Stars" status. lol like for real?

I mean, just look at all these no-names

Pichu
Rob
Sheik
Roy
Falcon
Ness
Pit
Dr. Mario
Dark Pit
Lucas

Characters like Wii Fit Trainier and Duck Hunt at least sold their respective consoles VERY well, but what have any of these achives.

Jack ****. That's what!
I'm gonna have to disagree there:
ROB helped Get the NES Into the Western market after the Video Game Crash of 1981(which interestingly enough PacMan was part of) and made it possible for Nintendo to blossom into waht it is today
Pit and Dark Pit, especially Dark Pit in this case represent Kid Icarus Uprising, one of The if not The best game on the Nintendo 3DS. Better than Super Mario 3D Land I can testify.

I don't have to tell you what Ness and Earthbound have done for the SNES
and Captain Falcon was to be the mascot of the SNES and it's new graphics software that made games like Starfox and Marioo Kart possible
 

FancySmash

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Well... I'm honestly underwhelmed.

None of the characters I wanted, or at least would have appreciated, got in. And I was fairly certain I was casting a wide net too. I mean, between Isaac, K. Rool, B. Dee, Karate Joe, Wolf, etc. I though I had a wide enough blanket. And yet Sakurai threw curve balls.


Corrin really just doesn't do anything for me, at all. I guess that makes me slighly hypocritical seeing how I thought Roy was a good inclusion, but I figured it wouldn't have been as development intensive as Corrin. That, and we really could go for another series at this point. Here's looking at you, DK and Metroid.

Bayo, on the other hand, eurgh. Honestly, I think she and Ryu are over-designed. Especially considering their 3rd party status means they are much more likely to be cut, it's going to be wasted development down the line. Meanwhile, they detract from the "jump in and play" sentiment that I really find attractive in Smash, while these folks go crazy in the tier lists because of how much extra they pumped in.


The biggest blow though would be declaring Bayonetta the winner of the ballot. Now, I don't doubt that she was popular... if we exclude certain charters. Just what exactly were Sakurai's criteria? I honestly have to wonder how many characters were excluded from the ballot once the votes started to pour in. I really have to wonder if K. Rool, Wolf , etc. actually did beat Bayoneeta but were denied due to not meeting some standard.


I guess I can try and be happy for their fans, but I guess this is it for this segment of Smash for me.
This really captures how about this too. Out of all the third parties we have in Smash currently, the only one I think has that great a chance at coming back is :4sonic:. A shame really, because Mega-Man and Pac-Man were great additions to me.It really feels that they've over-saturated the game with third party inclusions. Where I started seeing problems was with Ryu. Don't get me wrong, he's a great addition, it's just his inclusion struck a chord in me as a omen of the future in DLC.

I mean, I'm happy for those Bayonetta folks out there, but she doesn't really do much for me. Heck, Sakurai backed up how she was chosen himself, but is it bad that I don't know if I believe him. This direct... it's definitely given me something to think about.

Meanwhile, I guess we can add King K. Rool and Isaac to the party bus with Ridely and Chrom, unless the NX get's a DK game with King K. Rool as the main antagonist (or even a playable character working alongside DK begrudgingly to combat a bigger threat, that'd be cool), and if Golden Sun get's picked back up. Enjoy the party K. Rool and Isaac, Ridely and Chrom are your friends... :(
 

Amberloo

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Can't say I'm thrilled. I really dislike that we got yet another FE DLC character (and purely as marketing to boot, ugh), and I dunno, just not a huge fan of Bayonetta. All in all, I really hope the next game gives us a lot more in the DK, Zelda, and Metroid departments to compensate for Sakurai's obsession with Fire Emblem. I mean, frick, I think the Fire Emblem series is really fun, but I really don't understand how it got a bunch of new reps and yet how a lot of other Nintendo's big series got nothing this time around. Anyway, off to freeze myself until Smash 5 about to come out, so I'll maybe see some of y'all in several years.

(Also apparently Midgar only got two songs, which is a ****ing shame considering how amazing a lot of the Final Fantasy soundtracks are. Really does Uematsu a disservice.)
 

Andinus

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It is easy to see "there's always next game" but it needs to be remembered that that will be a long time and a lot of us will have moved on by then. I doubt I will still be around to see in Smash 5 and I am nowhere near the oldest user on these forums.
Dude I am probably one of the oldest on this forum (37), and I am in it for the long haul I'm sure. Been a fan of this series since melee, and with the advent of online, which i hope continues to get better, I was able to revive my affection for playing it on a regular basis, because you know life and family does take over at some point, but with online there is no need to coordinate with friends etc, to at least have an exciting and challenging experience.
 

Lady Byakugan

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I'm gonna have to disagree there:
ROB helped Get the NES Into the Western market after the Video Game Crash of 1981(which interestingly enough PacMan was part of) and made it possible for Nintendo to blossom into waht it is today
Pit and Dark Pit, especially Dark Pit in this case represent Kid Icarus Uprising, one of The if not The best game on the Nintendo 3DS. Better than Super Mario 3D Land I can testify.

I don't have to tell you what Ness and Earthbound have done for the SNES
and Captain Falcon was to be the mascot of the SNES and it's new graphics software that made games like Starfox and Marioo Kart possible
I'll agree with Rob.
Pit and Dark PIt? Not at all. If anyone in smash could represent KIU it'd be Palutena.
Yeah, you kinda do, since I don't know anything about them. However, I do know the games were mostly not released outside of Japan and that the sales were nothing to write home about.
Um.. what? How is Falcon the mascot of SNES? That's Mario, just like every other console and hand held Nintendo has.
 

Alice Margatroid

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Pretty much. The reality is that Sakurai has the final word. Whatever he thought was viable, would sell, promotes a game etc.. I feel really bad for wolf supporters right now. I got my Lucas back.. and now.. I just feel guilty. I would have thought Wolf would have been picked over Lucas in the first place. I'd like to say that there is still hope, I mean the game has a long life span.. but the were pretty clear that this is the end of DLC. RIP Wolf...until next game maybe..
Nah don't feel guilty dude. If you got what you wanted enjoy it. Myself and others will get over it eventually, heck I hated Cloud to death when he first got revealed. Now I can't wait to play him. Sometimes you just gotta' take what you're given.
 

Cutie Gwen

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Lemme get this straight: When Melee had a FE character strictly for marketing, it's 'OH COOL FIRE SWORD :D ' and had enough fandemand to bring him back
Now: 'HOW DARE THEY ADD THIS 90% UNIQUE CHARACTER WHO TURNS INTO A ****ING DRAGON?!'
Am I the only one who thinks it's very hypocritical? I do understand the salt for Corrin, but it doesn't mean I can't question it
 

Lady Byakugan

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Speaking of DLC, am I the only one who finds the 64 stages wastes of cash? Seriously, you can faithfully recreate those stages 95% in stage builder. They come of as even more unecassary than Mii cosumes and Corrin.
 
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I am content with what has happend *Hugs King K. Rool and Isaac before they get on bus.* You two will be in my heart forever, one day I shall main you both in Smash or see you appear in future installments of your games that is my hope! Farewell *They leave.* Listen I'm happy about the final characters its good enough for me. Their great additions I welcome them all to Smash and hopefully I can try them!
 

GreenKirby

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You know what the worst part is:

You know how Ridley fans and Chrom fans were basically scared into silence thanks to idiotshanging onto Sakurai's word as permanent law?

Now those same idiots are gonna be the same way towards K.Rool/Issac/Wolf fans. And since Smash dictates the Nintendo franchises, that could mean K.Rool isn't going to be in the next DK game, Golden Sun is as good as dead, and Wolf's fate in Star Fox is now uncertain.

And if they really wanted an advertisement character, they could have used Elma since Xenoblade needs all the help it can get.

But no, Sakurai's post-Awakening bias was too strong it seems.
 

ErenJager

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I can't believe Namco's last Mii costume was Gil from Tower of Druaga and not Klonoa.

SHAME!!

No moogle hat or black mage mii costume?

Dat relationship sakurai was bragging about with Square aint that good obviously.
 
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SuperNintendoDisney

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I want to see how folks justify Fire Emblem now, I can't even take it seriously anymore. Its literally not fair to any other fans of any other series. There were so many good choices for the Nintendo newcomer, but they gave it to a series who already got a newcomer in the game and DLC. If they chose a Nintendo newcomer from the ballot, I know for a fact there were hundreds higher than Kamui. Im just not going to comment further on it, it's absurd

Bayonetta was awesome. I don't buy that she won the Ballot though, no matter what he says. Where was that silent majority when it came to actually buying her game? Shovel Knight had to be higher, and was negotiable. I'm not upset with her inclusion, it's great, she just didn't win the ballot

I do want to point out that Wolf still has a chance, or any veteran for that matter. Sakurai said Bayonetta was the final new challenger not that she is the last DLC fighter. I still feel they are saving Wolf for Star Fox Zero, among other things that can still be announced for DLC in future normal Directs
 

Lady Byakugan

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Lemme get this straight: When Melee had a FE character strictly for marketing, it's 'OH COOL FIRE SWORD :D ' and had enough fandemand to bring him back
Now: 'HOW DARE THEY ADD THIS 90% UNIQUE CHARACTER WHO TURNS INTO A ****ING DRAGON?!'
Am I the only one who thinks it's very hypocritical? I do understand the salt for Corrin, but it doesn't mean I can't question it
It's not his play style people hate, it's the fact that FE know has the same amount of chars as Pokemon, which deserves for more than FE, and FE ALREADY had more chars than much more noteworthy yet GROSSLY underrepresented series, such as DK, Metroid, Kirby, and Zelda, the latter of the four having no new chars since bloody Melee despite being in Nintendo's Top 5.
 

Cutie Gwen

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You know what the worst part is:

You know how Ridley fans and Chrom fans were basically scared into silence thanks to idiotshanging onto Sakurai's word as permanent law?

Now those same idiots are gonna be the same way towards K.Rool/Issac/Wolf fans. And since Smash dictates the Nintendo franchises, that could mean K.Rool isn't going to be in the next DK game, Golden Sun is as good as dead, and Wolf's fate in Star Fox is now uncertain.

And if they really wanted an advertisement character, they could have used Elma since Xenoblade needs all the help it can get.

But no, Sakurai's post-Awakening bias was too strong it seems.
Smash dictates Nintendo Franchises? Captain Falcon, one of Smash's most popular characters, hasn't had a game in over a decade
 

FancySmash

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Lemme get this straight: When Melee had a FE character strictly for marketing, it's 'OH COOL FIRE SWORD :D ' and had enough fandemand to bring him back
Now: 'HOW DARE THEY ADD THIS 90% UNIQUE CHARACTER WHO TURNS INTO A ****ING DRAGON?!'
Am I the only one who thinks it's very hypocritical? I do understand the salt for Corrin, but it doesn't mean I can't question it
I believe it might be more so that we already got a Fire Emblem DLC character (ironically, THE one added to Melee for marketing at that), and FE has 5 characters already not counting Corrin. That's what has people the most upset (and using a character to promote a game, even though he said future DLC is to please fans is backwards logic).

Anyways, thinking about it now, K. Rool and Isaac's own fandom is what killed them. Think about it this way. Bayonetta had moderate support, no where near the vocal support K. Rool/Isaac had. People were almost expecting one of the two, not Bayonetta. So, Sakurai, always wanting to 1-Up the crowd, chose a character that no one expected. I mean, way to keep the audience surprised, but going to the trouble of setting up a ballot and ignoring two top contenders isn't a good business strategy. Well, at least K. Rool got a very detailed Mii Costume (even if it was a slap to the face). Isaac though... poor guy.
 

Cutie Gwen

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It's not his play style people hate, it's the fact that FE know has the same amount of chars as Pokemon, which deserves for more than FE, and FE ALREADY had more chars than much more noteworthy yet GROSSLY underrepresented series, such as DK, Metroid, Kirby, and Zelda, the latter of the four having no new chars since bloody Melee despite being in Nintendo's Top 5.
I know. And I kinda agree despite FE being one of my favourite franchises and my immense hype for Corrin, I just think it's funny Roy got enough fandemand to get brought back, but when it happens again, only with something never before seen, and optional, people whine
 

Bluefilm257

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You guys actually need to calm down about Bayonetta. Th second they let us vote was the second you allowed yourself to be disappointed. She won the ballot, and there's no reason Nintendo would lie to us just to put in Bayonetta. We got an AMAZING game with some AMAZING characters, and if you're so ungrateful that TWO out of 57 CHARACTERS ruin the ENTIRE GAME for you, then there was no meeting your expectations to begin with.
 
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Gimmick

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Honestly? I don't know how to feel. I honestly went into the direct with my expectations set to zero, and I still left underwhelmed somehow. It just didn't sit well with me. King K. Rool, Issac, Inklings, Shantae, Snake, etc... Didn't really care for these characters, but seeing Corrin and Bayonetta over them made me cringe (and this is coming from a guy who strictly owns a Wii U just to play Smash and Woolly World). This was suppose to be the final smash direct and this is what we got? Like, it just feels underwhelming in so many ways...

Corrin: as some who thoroughly enjoys the FE games this just came off as sort of, "meh" to me. He/she definitely looks unique, but did we really need a character from a franchise that already has enough reps (including a DLC character)? Plus the game he/she originates from hasn't even released internationally.

Bayonetta: this one honestly killed me (overly exaggerating, I know). I really do find this hard to believe. It almost seems like bots had something to do with this. Her games haven't achieved half a million in sells. This is suppose to be a game that celebrates both this history of Nintendo, and on occasion, video games in general. Bayonetta just comes off as a marketing ploy. Plus the way Sakurai described some of the elements that went into making her made me cringe. When he said the clock stage was from an iconic opening scene I was like, "WTF?" I don't know... To me she honest seems like one of the worst additions in the game. Though I'm still happy for her fans and she definitely looks unique.

I can honestly see why so many people are depressed. Four plus months and all we get is one character? Plus maybe it's just me, but am I the only person who finds Bayonetta's inclusion to be very suspicious? The Ballot end two motns ago and you were able to obtain the rights to the characters, create a stage, gather music, create a full fledged move set and a model for her? And this isn't even taking taking into account that they were also working Cloud, Midgard, mii costumes, and Corrin. To me this just felt like a step back more than anythining. We went from Cloud, one of the most iconic video game characters of all time, to a character barely anyone knows (Corrin) and another that just feels... I don't even know.

I also don't know why people are comparing first party Nintendo characters to third party DLC characters. At least in regards to popularity. If that was the case the roster would be all Mario characters with a sprinkle of Zelda and DK.
 

ErenJager

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Can we take a moment to appreciate the nightmare fuel that is Knuckles.



And how about a round of applause for the QR codes for mii faces.

YAH! Official Nintendo made mii costumes faces!

No more guessing!
 

Andinus

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I want to see how folks justify Fire Emblem now, I can't even take it seriously anymore. Its literally not fair to any other fans of any other series. There were so many good choices for the Nintendo newcomer, but they gave it to a series who already got a newcomer in the game and DLC. If they chose a Nintendo newcomer from the ballot, I know for a fact there were hundreds higher than Kamui. Im just not going to comment further on it, it's absurd
It is weird because I am fan of FE, or more specifically Strategy RPG, but I could really care less about their inclusion in smash, albeit I did first learn of the series because of smash, but now.. its just not necessary to use for promotion, to be sure there was most certainly better fan service to be made out there, considering most of the world has not even played the new game yet in order to even become a fan.. but it does not really matter Sakurai saw something in the character, (or maybe he was told to make a promotion character..who knows), and here we are..
 

FancySmash

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You guys actually need to calm down about Bayonetta. Th second they let us vote was the second you allowed yourself to be disappointed. She won the ballot, and there's no reason Nintendo would lie to us just to put in Bayonetta. We got an AMAZING game with some AMAZING characters, and if you're so ungrateful that TWO out of 57 CHARACTERS ruin the ENTIRE GAME for you, the there was no meeting your expectations to begin with.
To some extent, I agree, but with most people's predictions and polls trying to follow what characters would come out on top, it just seems that Bayonetta didn't have that much support compared to the predicted higher ups. I don't doubt Bayonetta had a lot of support, but as much as Sakurai said, to beat out Wolf, Isaac, and King K. Rool feels off.
 

ErenJager

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Speaking of DLC, am I the only one who finds the 64 stages wastes of cash? Seriously, you can faithfully recreate those stages 95% in stage builder. They come of as even more unecassary than Mii cosumes and Corrin.
But Tornadoes in Hyrule Castle
 

Bowserlick

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I think Nintendo characters were pretty much saved for Smash 5. Nintendo has to save some heavy-hitters for future hype. The ballot is a nice measure of popularity for the Nintendo team.

So, it does make sense that the only Nintendo characters to be included in DLC were cut veterans and a marketing-opportunity. (Although I love the design of the dragon-hybrid).
 

ErenJager

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I'm still surprised Sonic wasn't featured in Bay's trailer or art, given that they'e both Sega characters.
Uhh isn't she a platinum games character?

Smash website doesn't have a copy right on her character yet though, most others do though... we shall know thoon
 
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Lady Byakugan

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I think Nintendo characters were pretty much saved for Smash 5. Nintendo has to save some heavy-hitters for future hype. The ballot is a nice measure of popularity for the Nintendo team.

So, it does make sense that the only Nintendo characters to be included in DLC were cut veterans and a marketing-opportunity. (Although I love the design of the dragon-hybrid).
Yeah, All Star Ninties really are better off for the next game
 

GreenKirby

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Anyways, thinking about it now, K. Rool and Isaac's own fandom is what killed them. Think about it this way. Bayonetta had moderate support, no where near the vocal support K. Rool/Isaac had. People were almost expecting one of the two, not Bayonetta. So, Sakurai, always wanting to 1-Up the crowd, chose a character that no one expected. I mean, way to keep the audience surprised, but going to the trouble of setting up a ballot and ignoring two top contenders isn't a good business strategy. Well, at least K. Rool got a very detailed Mii Costume (even if it was a slap to the face). Isaac though... poor guy.
If that's true then Sakurai really should stop being a director of Smash ASAP.
 

FancySmash

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I think Nintendo characters were pretty much saved for Smash 5. Nintendo has to save some heavy-hitters for future hype. The ballot is a nice measure of popularity for the Nintendo team.

So, it does make sense that the only Nintendo characters to be included in DLC were cut veterans and a marketing-opportunity. (Although I love the design of the dragon-hybrid).
...I've never thought about it like this. It does make sense to include characters that would be easier to cut by next game, mainly third parties that would be hard to get rights to again. If introduced in a base game, a Nintendo IP character has better chances at staying. Plus, if we get a Smash 5 trailer with the Inklings, Isaac, and King K. Rool, how many people would go crazy?
 

Lady Kuki

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Wow, that was one heck of a direct...

I remember when I first saw Corrin's trailer, I was in shock. "What? We're getting another FE character?" It's funny because I thought Corrin had absolutely no chance getting in this game. I felt his game was too new for him to be included, and I thought that Sakurai didn't want to over saturate the roster with FE. I had no clue how they were going to make him unique either, I mean I saw much more move set promise with Azura, since she uses lances and all. I have mixed feelings about Corrin; he looks very cool, and it's amazing that we finally managed to get some type of manakete lore represented here. On the other hand, I wanted other FE characters over him. I wanted a FE7 character or something, but I guess due to lack of relevance they couldn't get in. And to be honest: I feel bad. I like FE a lot, but I think it would have been better if we had other heavy hitter characters too, like KKR and Wolf as well. That would have balanced the DLC a lot better. Corrin was admittedly a weird choice for DLC. I feel that many people may downright refuse to try FE now after this, due to the salt and all.

Bayonetta is pretty awesome too, not gonna lie. I'm so happy for the people who asked for her, but I find it hard to believe that she was the ballot winner. Well, they did say she was the most REALIZABLE choice for DLC, so it's possible that Sakurai and crew either couldn't come up with interesting enough move sets for other characters, or had legal issues trying to bring the character in.
I'm surprised at how she came out. I thought she wasn't going to get in due to how sexualized she was, but they managed to make her work and it's incredible. However, as awesome of an inclusion she was, I honestly have little to no interest in her. I'm not into Bayonetta, and Smash wise, her move set looks way too complex for me. I'll still buy her for completion reasons, but I'm not too hyped for her.

Last but not least: No Wolf? No Nintendo newcomer aside from one whose series is already deemed "overrepped" by the hardcore Smash community? I like Corrin and Bayonetta, but I can't help but to feel really badly for those who asked for characters like Wolf or Isaac, only to be left deeply disappointed. I'm also shocked that we couldn't even get Dixie Kong, I mean that's crazy. DK has been in desperate need for characters. DLC was the only chance the series had, and they got nothing but a Mii suit instead. I still think that representation is not all that important to Smash, but I can't help but to feel that representation was done very poorly here. We ended up getting more characters from series that already has reps, instead of adding characters in portions. FE has a whopping 2 characters for DLC, while some series got one, or nothing at all. New characters from "overrepped" franchises are fine, but remember that other series need characters too. The only reason why I think they didn't add new DK or other new franchises here was because they couldn't find a decent enough move set for certain characters in time. DLC is limited after all.

I just have mixed feelings all abroad, but like with every other feeling I have, it's only temporary. Sometimes you just have to take what you can get.
 

3D Dillon

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OK, this is my final post in a while (I didn't want to make this a thread)

The final presentation was kinda dissapointing for me.

While I still think Sm4sh is a great game, I'm disappointed with the DLC lineup.

Don't get me wrong, I think those two looked powerful and super cool. It's just...

None of the last 3 I predicted would be in the Sm4sh roster.

I thought 3 more DLC fighters is too few to finish it off.

I thought characters I did predict like King K. Rool and Banjo Kazooie would be able to look exciting and cool too.

So I got something in my mind...

By what I saw in some websites, M. Sakurai was unsure about the future of Smash, and Sm4sh may have been thought to be his last one.

Honestly, after the direct, I've thought he should call it his last one and the NX version if there'll be one would have a new director.

Perhaps Sakurai is the reason we haven't gotten some characters like King K. Rool and Ridley.

I think he needs a break after all the hard work and have someone else take the director's seat.

Also, the end of that video was disappointingly dull.

Sakrai should've ended by saying "Until then, (In English) Show me your moves!" (salutes like Captain Falcon)

That would've been a great finish! At least TRY to say something in English, sir!

Anyway, I'm thinking a new director would be a decent idea based on how Sakurai's feeling.

If there will be, I hope the new director is a professional worker at Smash and knows how the directing would work.

Right now, I've run out of ideas to say about this. Who do you think should be an excellent new director and feels like it and...

would be happy to bring in characters like Ridley and King K. Rool (and Dixie Kong too).

Like always, there should also be both new and returning modes both Smash fans and newcomers would love like Adventure Mode.

Finally, I'd like the new director should Sakurai retire from Smash to keep Smash alive, keep Smash the quality Sakurai intended it to be in the previous 4 games,

but include original ideas and most importantly make Sm5sh on NX in a way that made the other 4 so great.

Things change, people, but look on the bright side, a lot of times people have done things better than their predecessors, not always but this shouldn't be an exception to the "better than the predecessor" thing.

I could do better than that about having a new director, but there are still opportunities that have yet to be executed into the official Smash Bros. and a lot of them deserve to be, and a succeeding director who has truthfully proven a great successor to Sakurai should care just as much as the fans as they care about them and bring those future opportunities to life to make Smash 5 a masterpiece in the franchise like it should always have.
So until then, SHOW ME YOUR MOVES!!! :4falcon:
 
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