General Pit Discussion Thread

[FlamingForce]

That tap jump thing...
No wonder it felt so terrible and rigid lol, world of difference when you have it on.
Hope that gets fixed, don't want to get used to playing with tap jump off tbh.

 

[zen-bz-]

No, it doesn't.
The entry in that patch note is wrong, and if it isn't, then someone please tell me what I'm doing wrong that is preventing me from reflecting with Up-B, because Pit only ever gets hit by the projectile anyway, or it just makes the projectile disappear.

Whaaaaaaat
I could've sworn it did, though I may just be wrong and the patch notes are as well. I could do some testing tonight.

 

[zen-bz-]

Tap jump off is a help and hindrance in many ways for Pit. If off, you can control arrows a lot better in the air. I personally have it off because I also play GnW a ton, who practically requires tap jump off for up b strings. The only downside for me is for Lucas, which is harder DJC'ing. But with Pit I have no issues.

 

[Kipcom]

I just have two control setups. One for Pit (and I guess GnW when I'm messing around in friendlies) with Tap Jump off, one for basically everyone else that has Tap Jump on.

 

[zen-bz-]

I should probably get control setups like that as well for Lucas.

 

[zen-bz-]

Anyway, glide attack seriously needs to be changed. It's useless at this point.

 

[Skelterai]

I was actually messing with it last night, and discovered some small semblance of usefulness. Though, it's not enough to make it satisfying. Glide Attack is for all accounts and purposes, only useful at high percents, as a pop up attack. This does not setup for anything, unless you read your opponents DI and manage to seal the deal with any of Pit's kill moves, which are laughably out of range.

I would like the Glide Attack much more if it gave a special hitstun, or popped people up like Roy's dtilt.

I made a thread for ideas, hoping that someone from PMDT would consider developing advanced Pit tech from it.

Also, the usefulness in it, is simply that if you glide offstage, you can retain your jumps by canceling glide with b, or using the Glide Attack. I guess only useful for a Pit that mess up and glides the wrong way for some input error.

 

[Kipcom]

So I found Pit's old Up-Smash

Bruh

 

[Skelterai]

Oh god, that's terrible.

 

[Kipcom]

Well, it's "terrible" in the sense that the hitboxes don't accurately represent the blade swings like the current up-smash hitboxes do.

But as far as how it hits, I bet it feels f***ing amazing. I would take that over the current Up-Smash any day, because I know that it'd actually hit.

 

[Skelterai]

I just hope it gets fixed by the next update, for now, we'll just have to grind it out and wait for any buffs coming our way. There's not much going on in the Pit meta, so it's up to us to bring attention to the character.

 

[Player -0]

I wouldn't wait on buffs lol.

Just git gud

 

[Taytertot]

i think pit will be buffed next update.

 

[Skelterai]

Lol getting good is fine, I just wish this character had as much going for it as other characters did haha. It'll be a while until anything what happens haha

 

[Kipcom]

I wouldn't wait on buffs lol.

Just git gud

I played 3.5 Pit. Nothing is out of my reach.

Plus I already understand that buffs aren't what make a player good with a specific character.
Won't stop me wanting a more functional character anyway.

 

[zen-bz-]

A problem some people have in PM and Sm4sh is that they rely too much on patches instead of dealing with the current state of the character

 

[Player -0]

I'm pretty sure 3.5 Pit is objectively better as a character than 3.6 Pit.

 

[Kipcom]

I'm pretty sure 3.5 Pit is objectively better as a character than 3.6 Pit.

Ehhhhh, that's debatable.


They both have certain things over the other.

3.5 Pit has:

• Infinite Glide
• Better Fsmash 1 IASA frames (I really enjoyed this one)
• First hit of Dsmash had a much better angle (This honestly needs to return. It was a good way to punish failed sweetspots)
• Dthrow that pretty much always led to tech chases on good DI (Not sure if this applies to floaties, though)
• Slightly longer lasting bair
• I'm guessing a better up-smash as well, going by the 3.6 changelog.

3.6 Pit has:

• Usable grounded arrows
• Faster Aerial Arrows then both 3.5 and 3.02.
• The ability to aim arrows upward without it feeling clunky and janky (Feels awful to do in 3.5, tbh)
• Slightly faster dtilt (which makes it as least usable in some situations)
• Down Throw that still leads to chain grabs, tech chases, and followups, all depending on DI, of course. (The biggest downside is that once light/floaty characters get to a certain percent, you get nothing from down throwing anymore).
• Better Down-B IASA frames (This right here is actually secretly good. More people should make use of the shield.)

I don't think it's objective at all. Most of the important stuff got buffed in 3.6. I think it comes down to preference and how you play the character, honestly. I personally think 3.6 Pit is better, but not by a significant amount. I'm not sure how many people would actually say that 3.5 Pit is objectively better, but if that's what you think...

 

[Skelterai]

I think 3.6 Pit definitely feels a lot better than 3.5

The things I miss most involve recovering under the stage and ftilt.

I'd say they made his approach and harass options much easier with the faster grounded aerial.

Before when recovering, you had several options.

1 expend jumps and attempt sweetspot up B without getting punished

2 Glide back to stage and attempt to sweetspot without getting hit

3 glide over opponent and attempt to recover high without getting punished

4 glide into opponent and interrupt whatever punish they may be setting up.

5 curve an arrow to hit opponent, then recover (THIS, became a much easier option)

I'll say it now, 3.6 Pit is definitely better than 3.5
At least he has arrows that reward accuracy with a better chance of surviving a punish


I recently played against Filthy Casual's Lucario in a series of friendlies. Not only is he the best player in our scene, he's also eons above me. But I did really well with my Pit against him, especially when he went for an offstage Aura Bomb, which I usually interrupted with an arrow right before he got it out. I saved myself several times with heavy moments like that, and I hope to see more play with arrows in the Pit meta.

 

[Player -0]

Going to list things buffed/nerfed in 3.6. Bigger font means more important.
- F-Tilt nerfed quite a bit, got people off stage/gained stage earlier which is important.
- Up Tilt buffs: Not important like, at all.
- D-Tilt buffed by 2 frames: Semi-important, still really slow but now it's usable.
- F-Smash eh: Buffed to link more but F-Smash 1's IASA is now bleh and F-Smash 2 nerfed. New F-Smash doesn't work with Pit's stuff as much anymore (F-Smash in general not that useful. F-Smash 1 can still be SDI'ed out of. 3.5 F-Smash allowed baits).
- Up-Smash NERFED!: One of Pit's most important moves nerfed to no longer work.
- D-Smash NERFED!: Another one of Pit's important moves nerfed.
- Nair: Really doesn't feel much different, still SDI'able af.
- Bair: Nerfs. So-so, you don't really hit with late Bair much anyway.
- Up Air: Buffs kinda.
- Dair: Ehhh? Frame data is eh. I think juggles with the back hit were better before. Damage buffs are cool but to get sourspot it's really hard now.
- D-Throw: Feels same to me. Could put it as a buff I suppose.
- Grab: Less royzones. Yay.
- Arrows pewpew buff?: Arrow shooting moved up quite a bit but no IASA shaved? No combo utility now? so-so, more of a buff I suppose.
- Side B NERFED!: Hurts ability to go high a lot, therefore kinda destroying part of Down-B's no juggle zone's goodness. Just hurts recovery in general. Pretty big.
- GET OUT OF JUGGLES FOR FREE: IASA made a bunch earlier, not THAT big of a buff. Just makes something that's already good even better (diminishing return on IASA buffs for this along with Side B nerfs makes this eh).

_____________________________________
Arrows when recovering was already pretty good before depending on opponent's option. Arrow buffs don't help a LOT for this. Especially with proper counter play from opponent (if done right you're wasting jumps for 3% or so on opponent. Makes their edgeguard to KILL easier).

I've preached about Down B being easy anti juggle tool since 3.5. It's still good, better even. But times it's used has been reduced (Side B nerf) and reducing IASA more didn't really help escape juggle if you didn't escape it after doing shenanigans.

Why not just jump -> shield aura bomb? At lowish percents it's a ton more threatening than arrow -> hopefully not get faired/if I Fair him we recover at the same time.

Grounded arrows are pretty bad in like every situation. Buffs to them didn't really help.

 

[Skelterai]

Lol jumping would've been nice, but considering after the first jump or two, when they start diminishing in height, it's a little scary for comfort and didn't want to leave it to chance. He plays a pretty good Lucario, and when I say offstage, I mean both of us, in the air, near one of the horizontal blast zones. Shielding was another possibility, but I didn't want to allow room for input error and fastfall my down b like an idiot. I was far enough that I was basically off-screen, so I shot him and forced a recovery. Just felt smarter. Especially since I would take advantage to wreck his recovery with a bair.


And yeah grounded arrows aren't nearly as useful. I kinda just use them when I can't easily reach with an attack, and just build damage

 

[zen-bz-]

No, it doesn't.
The entry in that patch note is wrong, and if it isn't, then someone please tell me what I'm doing wrong that is preventing me from reflecting with Up-B, because Pit only ever gets hit by the projectile anyway, or it just makes the projectile disappear.

Just now got around to testing the up-b shield reflect. And you were right :/
Two separate gfys of me using two controllers (Pit's arrows vs Pit's Shield):
First one: (ground vs ground) http://gfycat.com/HappygoluckyWellwornAmericancrocodile
Leaves Pit stuck in the up b animation a while longer (like hitting a person)

Second one: (ground vs platform) http://gfycat.com/BonyTediousArcticseal
Same as the above except it was pretty hard to angle Pit's arrow right AND do an up b on a different controller. But it had the same result as the above.

So hitting Pit's arrows w/ up-b still has the hitlag of hitting a person but not the reflect effect of down b.

PMDT pls, I want my reflects

 

[Player -0]

Probably due to either reflect hitboxes overlapping the normal hitboxes and the normal hitboxes having priority over the reflect ones or the PMDT forgot to add it in.

I think I remember seeing this in 3.5 when messing around but I figured it was just me. Then I thought about it a little and figured it might be better for Pit not to have it. Thinking about it again all the spots that being hit out of Up-B would be beneficial (Bombs, nades, turnips) because wall techs/being blown upwards an airdodge in place would pretty much do the same thing.

I don't even remember if bombs blow up on Pit's Up B currently (I think they do though) so meh.

 

[Orange Chris]

the PMDT forgot to add it in.

They have forgotten to add a lot of stuff in before. ROB's weight/fallspeed change in the 3.6 beta, Pit's Usmash SDI multipliers in 3.5, and arrow staling in 3.5 just off the top of my head.

 

[Player -0]

Arrows staled in 3.5 afaik.

Edit - PMDT works through many different versions from different dev members so compiling ALL of the changes into one version is difficult, especially if people don't label what they had in each version correctly and stuff.

So yeah, it's hard lyf for PMDT.

 

[Kulty]

Hi guys,

Is Pit a solo viable character in PM v3.6?

 

[Player -0]

Solo viable? I guess technically.

You'll have to climb some tough character matchups but it's do-able. Off the top of my head.

 

[Kulty]

Solo viable? I guess technically.

You'll have to climb some tough character matchups but it's do-able. Off the top of my head.

Ok thanks. I'm just trying to find a solo viable main character that feels different in his PM incarnation compared to his main appearances in the Smash series. I'm struggling bet . I know Ganondorf is not solo viable, but do you know if Sonic is solo viable? I tried to ask this question in the Sonic boards, but it seems so silent. No one replies.

 

[Player -0]

At the level you'll probably be playing any characters are solo viable. If you're playing and know the game you'll understand when a match up feels unwinnable.

 

[eideeiit]

Ok thanks. I'm just trying to find a solo viable main character that feels different in his PM incarnation compared to his main appearances in the Smash series. I'm struggling bet . I know Ganondorf is not solo viable, but do you know if Sonic is solo viable? I tried to ask this question in the Sonic boards, but it seems so silent. No one replies.

Sonic definitely is. He probably does have some bad MUs but his speed will always let him interact or avoid interacting with his opponent, therefore making it (IMO) extremely unlikely for him to have a MU where he couldn't win by playing better. On the same note Ganon is too on the level most people are at.

And since this is the Pit boards I guess I'll throw this out for discussions sake?

ESAM vs Sharkz Tipped Off 11 PM pools winners side

Some things I noticed about game 3 after watching it a few times (now that I'm done it grew to like 10 lol), note that I'm bad and have never got to play the MU:

-Esam loved to put pressure on platforms/above with uair

-I'm not sure if Ice mode was the correct thing to do, even if in the end he got 2 of his kills with fairs and the 3rd with a missile. His missile spam edgeguards didn't really do that much after Sharkz made the adaptation of going high in game 1. He also landed a lot of dtilts that only got him stage positioning. I wonder if he could've converted off of them? He didn't land a single one in game 1 and idk how it'd go as I've never really played this MU. Someone? Anyhow, the reason he went ice was most likely the fair. It was his main kill tool and the few fire fairs he landed in game 1 didn't really net him anything. He only landed a single usmash, which was at low % and got him as little as 21% with the follow-up uair and then got him punished, in the game even if he threw it out pretty often to pressure platforms and such when Sharkz's % was high. These may have been good though, with the pretty high reward and low risk, as he never really lost anything except some frame advantage and positioning.

-Stage may have been the wrong option too. Esam didn't really get that much from edgeguards because Sharkz was going high and had pretty free top/far platform to land on thanks to glide. Apparently the available stages were GHZ, YS, FoD, YI, DS, FD and SV. He probably wanted the platform cancel missiles and that's why he went there, but I wonder if something like SV or YI would have been the better picks as they would've made recovery so much harder for Pit. Though, the same applies to Samus. Would not having a top platform have made juggles too easy for Sharkz? Esam also died quicker than he would've on other stages, though this also applies to Sharkz too. Would Samus have even been able to force the high glide recoveries on other stages?

-Feels like Esam didn't respect uair's disjoint enough. It's what took his last stock. Though had he tried to get back down more sideways he'd have fallen prey to the fairs like in game 1. I guess he just got the wrong end of the 50-50, idk. Good thing that Pit's so good at something at least.

-Esam started DIing the dthrow usmash.

-To me it looked like Esam was the more proactive and offensive player. A lot of the time in neutral he got the ball rolling by throwing out some missiles and then going in with the fair. Sharkz was shielding a lot and did some great rolls when Esam started grabbing more.

-Sharkz's DI was good.

-What won Sharkz the game were the few great punishes he got and his great shielding.

done.

Feel free to give me a piece of your mind folks.

 

[Sharkz]

Id like to study the match as well and give some if my thoughts. Keep in mind this was actually one of the first times I'd ever played the mu, so there was a lot of stuff that we were obviously trying to figure out together. The only other time I've really played it was against Plup at BH5, but he massacred me.
I am glad that I was the first Pit to beat Esam iirc. He had beaten ZeRo and Armada in 3.03. Of all people I thought he would be one I could never beat, so it felt really good to win. I'd been waiting forever to get a good win with my Pit.

I also got to meet Tip at TO11. Awesome guy. Didn't get to meet Kip though . But the fact that there were 3 Pit players was sweet.

 

[Kipcom]

Didn't get to meet Kip though . But the fact that there were 3 Pit players was sweet.

We talked but I don't think we formally introduced ourselves to each other lol

You were pretty cool/nice from what I saw.

I also didn't even know you were THAT good with both Pit and ICs but holy s*** I was impressed with you every time I saw you playing on the stream setup.

 

[Life]

Guys

I won my weekly

With Wolf :[

Shoutouts to Pit for learning me the game tho

I'll still stick around here because Pit is cool and the world is beautiful

 

[Kipcom]

buff pit

ez pz

 

[Infinite]

Hey guys, new to pit and the Boards but have been having a lot of fun with the character. Just wondering what you guys think of his current tilts?

 

[Player -0]

Up tilt is really situational. F Tilt is slightly less situational. D-Tilt is pretty cool, a bit slow but cool.

Yeah.

 

[Life]

Utilt you basically use after dash attack at certain percent-DI combinations.

Ftilt you use like any other ftilt: you smack people with it and they move away from you.

Dtilt is a combo tool and fairly good in a CC war, though it does feel a little slow.

 

[Infinite]

Ya I guess that's what I was getting at. He seems like such a fast character and flows really well but his tilts feel slow compared to the rest of his movement/moveset

 

[Skelterai]

His utilt is useful against the cast at nearly any percent, but you kinda have to snipe with it. It's not a wide arch like Marth's or Link's utilt, and it's not long, Like Ike's utilt.

That being said I do like using it for mixups

 

[Skelterai]

Double post(sorry guys)
So are any of you Pit players going to Final Boss in January?

Santa Clara, CA.


I want to meet up and get some friendlies in